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Old 20-11-2009, 06:24 PM   #1
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Angry PayPal .....Bastards!

Amendments to the PayPal User Agreement and Privacy Policy
Effective Date: Jan 21, 2010
•Amendment to the PayPal User Agreement
1. Fees

Section 8 is being amended to update the fees for cross border personal transactions.

Where the country of the recipient’s registered PayPal Account is Poland, the fee charged for cross border personal payments fully funded by PayPal Balance or Bank is 1% + 0.55 PLN (Polish Zlotych). The relevant part of the fee table for cross border personal payments fully funded by PayPal Balance or Bank now reads as follows:

Transaction Type Activity Fee for payment fully funded by:
- PayPal Balance
- Bank
Cross border personal transactions Sending or Receiving Important: this fee is based on the country of the recipient’s registered PayPal Account.

Either the sender or the recipient pays the fee. Not both.

In most cases, the sender decides who pays the fee. In some cases the sender will not be able to decide and the sender or the recipient will be required to pay the fee.

Recipient’s Country:

UK: 0.5%

Poland 1% + 0.55 PLN

*Other European Countries: 0.5%

Australia 1%

Canada 1%

China 0%

Germany 2%

Hong Kong 0%

Singapore 0%

Taiwan 0%

U.S. 1%

Elsewhere 0.5%

Note: This fee will not be charged if a Euro payment is made between Accounts registered in the European Union or EEA.


2. Temporary Holds for Disputed Transactions

A new Section 10.1.d is being added to consolidate and clarify the position on temporary holds for disputed transactions as already described in Section 11.4 (and in relation to the eBay resolution process). Section 10.1.d will read as follows:

“10.1.d Temporary Holds for Disputed Transactions. If a buyer files a Claim, Chargeback or Reversal on a payment you received, PayPal will place a temporary hold on the funds in your Account to cover the full amount of the Claim, Chargeback or Reversal. In placing such a hold, we will not restrict your use of the Account with regard to funds other than those disputed or at risk under the Claim, Chargeback or Reversal, unless we have another reason for doing so. If you win the dispute or if the payment is eligible for a payment under the terms of PayPal Seller Protection, we will release the hold and restore your access to the applicable funds. If you lose the dispute, PayPal will remove the funds from your Account. This process also applies to claims that a buyer files with eBay through the eBay resolution process if your PayPal Account is your reimbursement method for buyer claims and eBay has notified us of the claim. Claims filed directly with eBay are governed by eBay policy and are not covered by the terms of the PayPal Seller Protection programme.”

Section 11.4 will now read as follows:

“11.4 What happens when a buyer files a Claim, Chargeback, or Reversal?

PayPal will place a temporary hold on the funds in your Account to cover the full amount of the Claim, Chargeback, or Reversal. See section 10.1.d for further details about the temporary hold process.”


3. Third party rights

Section 14.8 is being updated to clarify that eBay, as a third party, may rely on its rights as specified in the PayPal User Agreement. Section 14.8 will now read as follows:

“14.8 Complete Agreement and third party rights. This Agreement sets forth the entire understanding between you and PayPal with respect to the Service. Sections 1, 7, 8, 10, 14 and 15, as well as any other terms which by their nature should survive, will survive the termination of this Agreement. If any provision of this Agreement is held to be invalid or unenforceable, such provision shall be struck out and the remaining provisions shall be enforced. A person who is not a party to this Agreement has no rights under the Contracts (Rights of Third Parties) Act 1999 to rely upon or enforce any term of this Agreement (except for eBay in respect of its rights as specified in this Agreement) but this does not affect any right or remedy of third parties which exists or is available apart from that Act.”

•Amendment to the PayPal Privacy Policy
1. Disclosure to Third Parties other than PayPal Customers


The Privacy Policy is being amended such that PayPal may disclose certain PayPal customer information to the following additional third parties (if applicable) for the following purposes:


Payment Processors

HSBC Merchant Services LLP (UK), Discover Financial Services (USA) To allow payment processing settlement services, fraud checking. Name, address, details of user funding instruments, details of payment transactions.
Deutsche Bank AG (Germany, Netherlands, France, Spain) To allow the processing of direct debits in Germany, Netherlands, France and Spain. Name, date of transaction, amount, currency and user’s bank account information.
Credit Reference and Fraud Agencies Experian Netherlands BV (Netherlands), Experian Bureau de Credito SA (Spain), Informa D&B SA (Spain) To verify identity, make decisions concerning a customer's credit worthiness, carry out checks for the prevention and detection of crime including fraud and/or money laundering, assist in debt recovery, manage PayPal accounts and undertake statistical analysis, undertake research as to appropriateness of new products and services and system checking. Data disclosed may be retained by the applicable credit reference and fraud agency for audit and fraud prevention purposes. Name, address, date of birth, time at address, telephone number, proof of identity, legal form, time in business, company registration number, VAT number, relevant transaction information (if appropriate)
ID Checker.nl BV (Netherlands) To verify identity. All account information and proof of identity
Operational Services KSP Kanzlei Dr. Seegers, Dr. Frankenheim & Partner Lawyers (Austria), Transcom Worldwide S.A. (UK), Clarity Credit Management Solutions Limited (UK), Infoscore Iberia (Spain). To collect debt Name, address, telephone number, account number, e-mail, account type, account status, last four digits of financial instruments account, account balance, details of account transactions and liabilities, name of funding source provider.




The y can fuck off...i'm closing my account
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Old 20-11-2009, 07:06 PM   #2
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Can you explain what your exact problem is. I dont see much difference.
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Old 20-11-2009, 07:42 PM   #3
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yeh lol they have always been robbing bastards, I mean they make up there own exchange rates.
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Old 20-11-2009, 07:57 PM   #4
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They swindled me out of 112 quid for a wrong valuation and I have totally given up on them, trying to get a responce is nigh on impossible, there is a web-site where 1000's of people have huge amounts frozen etc, the good old Swis illuminati at work I bet
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Old 20-11-2009, 08:43 PM   #5
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Originally Posted by rollotomaz1 View Post
They swindled me out of 112 quid for a wrong valuation and I have totally given up on them, trying to get a responce is nigh on impossible, there is a web-site where 1000's of people have huge amounts frozen etc, the good old Swis illuminati at work I bet
Well I work for Paypal so I will try and help you with the decisions they make. There is alot of logic to the situations and decisions they make. Its not all black and white. Remember Paypal is a BANK. I work for a bank.

Tracking info is important.

Last edited by diggers_1; 20-11-2009 at 08:47 PM.
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Old 20-11-2009, 09:31 PM   #6
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Never ever leave money in a Paypal account i recently sold over £300 of stuff on ebay as soon as the money was payed i withdrew it.
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Old 20-11-2009, 09:51 PM   #7
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yeh lol they have always been robbing bastards, I mean they make up there own exchange rates.
Yep. They add 2-3c or subtract 2-3c depending on which way around, so they collect a bit more 'tax'

I just put up with it because we get so ripped off in Australia anyway, and i buy many things from the UK and USA, they still end up cheaper even after adding postage and paypal and the rest.

Most recent example, i got a $1500 quote to rebuild a diesel injection pump, and i found a brand new one from the USA for $850 delivered...new...not my shitty old one rebuilt with $100 bucks worth of parts...so ebay/paypal can have their cut.

Funny thing is, when you set it to pay for stuff with a Credit Card, they can only pull from the card, which is owned by the bank, so they cant manipulate the exchange rate, the exchange rate is set by the bank..and if you find a bank that doesnt rip you off as much with the exchange, and have a 55 days interest free card like i do, it ends up cheaper than using your paypal balance or bank account debit.

So i always set international transactions to pull from my nominated credit card, but you have to change it every time you pay, as paypal tries its best to get you to pull from your accounts.

Funny how when the shoe is on the other foot and they have to soak up the card merchant fee, they cant handle it.
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Old 21-11-2009, 12:16 AM   #8
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I work for Paypal


alot
If this represents the level of intelligence of a typical Paypal employee, fuck knows how they've managed to make so much money.
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Old 21-11-2009, 12:26 AM   #9
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Pretty much the only way I can get paid, since I work online and get paid in dollars, despite being in the UK.

It's a pain in the ass doing tax returns having to add up and find all the stupid fees they apply.
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Old 21-11-2009, 01:28 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by diggers_1 View Post
Well I work for Paypal so I will try and help you with the decisions they make. There is alot of logic to the situations and decisions they make. Its not all black and white. Remember Paypal is a BANK. I work for a bank.

Tracking info is important.
Well I work for Paypal so I will try and help you with the decisions they make

Hi diggers_1, would you mind helping me with the decision your company made with me?

My account was suspended, my money was held - 180 days - in your 'BANK' making interest in your 'BANK'.

Your reason given was 'Suspicious account activity'

My question - what is suspicious?

PayPal: We cannot disclose such information.

End of 180 days PayPal say: We would like to part ways in business with you


Now, did it take you 180 days to reach the decision - or did you just want the interest on my money?

There is alot of logic to the situations and decisions they make

OK - Can you tell me the logic in this:

Asking me for proof of posting and tracking numbers for items that have been sold & sent over 8 months ago.

Items that were sent 1st class - ie, no tracking.

EVERY SINGLE ITEM YOU REQUESTED PROOF OF POSTAGE FOR - I HAD RECEIVED POSITIVE FEEDBACK - DOES THIS NOT CONFIRM THE BUYER IS HAPPY - AND HAS SURELY NOT RECEIVED HIS/HER ITEM?
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Old 21-11-2009, 01:34 AM   #11
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I got ripped off on ebay once for 117 bucks, ebay nor paypal didn't want to know. Said if the other customer doesn't agree to debate the issue then there is nothing they can do.

So the other person would have to agree to debate an issue that would implicate them as haveing ripped me off, or they could just say, no thanks bye. I was pisssssssed.

You will never see a penny of that money.

PayPal is making an absolute fortune, apparently last I heard 100 Million dollars go through PayPal/Ebay an hour, and they are right there with the cheese skimmer as it passes them. It will only get worse the more people keep using it.
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Old 21-11-2009, 03:56 AM   #12
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I got ripped off on ebay once for 117 bucks, ebay nor paypal didn't want to know. Said if the other customer doesn't agree to debate the issue then there is nothing they can do.

So the other person would have to agree to debate an issue that would implicate them as haveing ripped me off, or they could just say, no thanks bye. I was pisssssssed.

You will never see a penny of that money.

PayPal is making an absolute fortune, apparently last I heard 100 Million dollars go through PayPal/Ebay an hour, and they are right there with the cheese skimmer as it passes them. It will only get worse the more people keep using it.


ebay being there biggest operation has sealed them for life with the curds and whey :P
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Old 21-11-2009, 04:08 AM   #13
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ebay being there biggest operation has sealed them for life with the curds and whey :P
Exactly!
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Old 21-11-2009, 04:11 AM   #14
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There is an old English saying,.... "They are fucking minted".
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Old 21-11-2009, 05:10 AM   #15
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The biggest con yet is forcing Ebay sellers to accept Paypal. They said it was to ensure buyers had a choice. However, if that were the case they would order sellers to accept all payment methods, not just Paypal with the other payment methods being optional. I have had concerns about Paypal since first getting ripped off in 2002. I didn't lose out at the time, as I had withdrawn the funds. Now I can't take Paypal though, even thought my auctions automatically say that I do, it seems that people are reluctant to pay anything over £100 without Paypal at the end of the auction. I am losing out. The government is in collusion with Ebay/Paypal because of the massive revenues it brings in. Ordinary people will have to fight this beast.

Last edited by illuminumnuts; 21-11-2009 at 05:11 AM.
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Old 21-11-2009, 05:28 AM   #16
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Angry I totally agree...

Quote:
Originally Posted by illuminumnuts View Post
The biggest con yet is forcing Ebay sellers to accept Paypal. They said it was to ensure buyers had a choice. However, if that were the case they would order sellers to accept all payment methods, not just Paypal with the other payment methods being optional. I have had concerns about Paypal since first getting ripped off in 2002. I didn't lose out at the time, as I had withdrawn the funds. Now I can't take Paypal though, even thought my auctions automatically say that I do, it seems that people are reluctant to pay anything over £100 without Paypal at the end of the auction. I am losing out. The government is in collusion with Ebay/Paypal because of the massive revenues it brings in. Ordinary people will have to fight this beast.
I bought an Ipod a few years ago through paypal on ebay. I didn't check the reputation of the seller, which I normally do. The thing worked for about 1 day, then died. So I went through all the proper channels, contacted the seller who refused to refund (he was Chinese I have nothing against them but I watch out with the electronics now). Anyway, back then Ebay was touting their supposed "total protection for purchases using pay pal". I ended up in a long written dispute process, having to recontact ebay as they let the deadlines lapse, then finally I was told that I'd have to ship the item back to the seller in a trackable form (which was express mail, about $30 something) in order for them to supposedly get my refund made to me. Well I'm sure you know the punch line. He got his crappy piece of equipment back, free, probably sold it to someone else. (He was kicked off ebay shortly afterward). I was out my original money plus time, plus a huge shipping fee. So I googled "problems with Pay Pal". Wow. I found out that numerous ebay sellers had their entire checking accounts frozen indefinitely due to "disputes" by buyers. Pay Pal may be a bank, but it is not subject to banking laws and regulations. I did not use Pay Pal for a long time, but now almost everything on there is Pay Pal only. And I live in the U.S., I'm relatively lucky compared to you who live in other countries! What a bunch of greedy pigs, charging you extra in other countries. Unbelievable. Yes, like ownoiz, if you are a seller or even a buyer, never use Pay Pal if you keep money in the attached checking account; you could lose it. Good thread. From the employee of Pay Pal, that seems nice to offer to help. Love, angel
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Old 21-11-2009, 05:39 AM   #17
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Wow. I found out that numerous ebay sellers had their entire checking accounts frozen indefinitely due to "disputes" by buyers.
Any government worth their salt would have dealt with this by now. Paypal can shit out all the small print they like, but at the end of the day the sheer numbers of decent citizens having their lives ruined - ***LITERALLY*** - by Paypal is mind boggling. Something is very, very wrong and there needs to be fair regulation introduced. Moreover, Ebay, and Paypal in the context of Ebay at the very least, are monopoly markets and need to be investigated by the Competition Commission.

Last edited by illuminumnuts; 21-11-2009 at 05:40 AM.
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Old 21-11-2009, 08:22 AM   #18
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I had another 'stop me in my tracks' moment a few weeks ago when I realised that 'they' could quite well be laughing at us once again as 'Paypal' is quite probably 'Papal'. . .aka The Rothschilds as they are the 'Keepers of the Vatican Purse'.
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Old 21-11-2009, 08:30 AM   #19
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I had another 'stop me in my tracks' moment a few weeks ago when I realised that 'they' could quite well be laughing at us once again as 'Paypal' is quite probably 'Papal'. . .aka The Rothschilds as they are the 'Keepers of the Vatican Purse'.
There might just be some truth to what you've just said!
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Old 21-11-2009, 08:34 AM   #20
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The worse thing is that a Paypal Account is mandatory for any Ebay sale.

You have to have a Paypal option on the sale - you can list other payment methods as well but you can't not list Paypal (and it's always listed first).

It never used to be like that.

So ebay get 7% and paypal get another 3%.

Known as double dipping.

It's outrageous.

If anything, both should be flat fees - it makes no difference to them in terms of processing.

Last edited by amaralsright; 21-11-2009 at 08:34 AM.
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