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Old 30-11-2012, 09:21 PM   #4241
anders lindman
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And very soon you will know what dying before death means.
I mean conquering actual physical death of the body. Some kind of spiritual dying of the ego isn't good enough for me.
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Old 01-12-2012, 04:22 AM   #4242
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Openly hateful and bitter spiritual teachers like Nisargadatta Maharaj and U. G. Krishnamurti are in one sense more honest than other teachers who try to hide their inner mind-body conflict.

Nonetheless, that bitterness is caused by the root of the ego still remaining in the person. The conflict is caused by the mind inescapably resenting having a body that ages, deteriorates and dies. That inner conflict IS the root of the ego.

In a video with Eckhart Tolle and Marianne Williamson, Tolle talked about how many of the Advaita teachers were fake in the sense that they only had an intellectual understanding, Tolle said, and not a real spiritual realisation. Williamson then said that Tolle had a genuine realisation. It sounded to me like two caterpillars trying to convince themselves they are butterflies. The truth of course is that the root of ego still remains in both of them as a severe inner conflict between body and mind. Because that's why their bodies age biologically.

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Old 01-12-2012, 05:11 AM   #4243
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The nonduality teachers are correct in saying that nothing happens to you, because you ARE what happens. No separation. Nonduality. But then in the next step the nonduality teachers become completely delusional and talk about how your physical body will inevitably deteriorate and die. Excuse me, but if you are the universe, then why would you want to bury yourself in yourself? That would be a completely stupid thing to do.

Some say that the physical world is only an illusion and that consciousness is the only thing that's real. I don't agree with that, but just for the sake of argument let's say that that is true, it's still completely stupid! Because why would you want to have an illusion where you experience yourself being trapped in a separate physical body that deteriorates and dies?
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Old 01-12-2012, 05:28 AM   #4244
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A third cop out idea the nonduality teachers come up with is the belief in reincarnation. That too is stupid, because as the One consciousness, why would you want to live a very short lifespan of say 90 years in a body that deteriorates into disease and death? And then repeat that nightmare umpteenth times? What horror! What utter stupidity.
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Old 01-12-2012, 06:32 AM   #4245
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I think I have already mentioned this before - but it's good to repeat things a lot to hammer in the information into the subconscious - about how unity consciousness may need technology in order to emerge. Even our most advanced technology today is crude compared to what we will have in just two decades from now. This is because information technology has an accelerating progress.

Here is Ray Kurzweil explaining it in more detail: http://bigthink.com/raykurzweil

Will some kind of singularity happen already in December 21, 2012? I doubt that. However, Richard Dolan said that black op technology within what he calls the breakaway civilisation is some 30 years ahead of what we have in the public markets. Even if it may not sound much, since the progress is exponential, 30 years means technology that is close to, or having reached, a technological singularity! And that does not include possible extraterrestrial technology that is millions of years ahead of us. So things may soon change very quickly!
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Old 01-12-2012, 11:17 AM   #4246
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The reason I rant so much about aging and death is that it seems to me to be the root cause of the ego. So for example, if you meditate for 30 years, and still have the belief in inevitable aging and death, then that is like putting a lid on a boiling kettle without recognising the true heat source, which is this inner conflict.

Then why hasn't mainstream society already discovered this? Because the public society is a big lie basically. Mainstream science is a joke, a deliberate diversion from the real knowledge. The same with eduction, media and yes spiritual teachings.
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Old 01-12-2012, 02:41 PM   #4247
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The reason I rant so much about aging and death is that it seems to me to be the root cause of the ego.
Fear of death, or fear of any kind for that matter,
perpetuates illusions, ego is just one of them.

Death is death, it's not the cause of anything.
It's how this world is.
First up, than down.

And why do you think that this little part of the flux called Anders or Lighthouse,
should stay in the same form "forever"?
Why is that important?
To whom?
All manifested things come from the same field,
rising in Awareness, Spirit, or in God's dream,
whatever you like to call it.
That essence is true in it's core, it's not illusionary as that dream we experience and are apart of.
High tech aliens or humans, it doesn't matter.
It's all a dream, it's just a game.

Not to bullshit about abstract things any longer,
one very real question persists...
Why bother with death while you are alive?
Bother with life, right now, this moment.
Dead or alive, it is not in your control anyways.
You can't control much smaller things than will you or how and when you gonna die.
It's useless.
Now is all you have, and it's wasted in all the thinking about future.

The more I talk with people I am coming to conclusion that life is a real mystery.
If you put aside all the things you believe in, all the thoughts arising,
you would have so much on your hands just in this moment,
death would never come to your attention.

It's not ignoring it, it's embracing the present moment.
No one knows what will happen next.
Now is what is, no yesterday, no tomorrow. Life. Now.

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"Einsicht – dass jeder seine Fehler hat,
und Weitsicht – das Leben findet nicht nur heute statt,
und Vorsicht – dass man den andern nicht zerbricht."
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Old 01-12-2012, 03:00 PM   #4248
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Fear of death, or fear of any kind for that matter,
perpetuates illusions, ego is just one of them.
Yes! You are correct. I should have written fear of death and resentment of death. That's the root ego conflict, not death itself.
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Old 01-12-2012, 04:37 PM   #4249
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Anders, most of your information is wrong. I don't know where you get it from, but it's wrong. You just make it up as you imagine it to be.

Read the book Who Dies? by Stephen Levine. Learn something for once.
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Old 01-12-2012, 05:34 PM   #4250
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Anders, most of your information is wrong. I don't know where you get it from, but it's wrong. You just make it up as you imagine it to be.

Read the book Who Dies? by Stephen Levine. Learn something for once.
You sound like one of the people Morpheus described in the Matrix movie:

"The Matrix is a system, Neo. That system is our enemy. But when you're inside, you look around, what do you see? Businessmen, teachers, lawyers, carpenters. The very minds of the people we are trying to save. But until we do, these people are still a part of that system and that makes them our enemy. You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system, that they will fight to protect it."
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Old 01-12-2012, 11:46 PM   #4251
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You sound like one of the people Morpheus described in the Matrix movie:

"The Matrix is a system, Neo. That system is our enemy. But when you're inside, you look around, what do you see? Businessmen, teachers, lawyers, carpenters. The very minds of the people we are trying to save. But until we do, these people are still a part of that system and that makes them our enemy. You have to understand, most of these people are not ready to be unplugged. And many of them are so inured, so hopelessly dependent on the system, that they will fight to protect it."
That sounds more like you than me. lol.
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Old 02-12-2012, 03:35 PM   #4252
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One simple trick used by the ruling powers is to dumb our emotions down and then use emotions to manipulate and control us. And an obvious yet often overlooked fact is that our ordinary thinking, with our ego mind, is moving up and down to incredible emotional highs and lows. Seldom do we question the emotional content itself.

The difference between a negative thought and a positive thought, is small intellectually and monstrously huge emotionally. We have been trained, like Pavlovian dogs, to follow our own emotions unquestionably. What the ruling powers don't want us to learn is how to control our own emotions. Just like how we can learn to play the piano, we can train our minds to moderate the emotional content that goes along with our thoughts.

In practice the learning can be done by observing one's own thoughts and the emotions that go along with them. And when the emotions start to run amuck to let the thoughts become peaceful. It will take some time to master this, just like how a person just starting to learn to play the piano cannot become a professional pianist in one day.
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Old 02-12-2012, 06:26 PM   #4253
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I guess it's ok to keep the ego and still go into a state of unity consciousness. Because the ego is simply a part of the mind content.

Ego consciousness, then, is to be identifying oneself ONLY with the ego! Pretty cool, eh?
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Old 02-12-2012, 08:13 PM   #4254
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When we are trapped in identifying ourselves as only our individual egos, then those egos are experienced as huge. And the collective ego of the entire world is experienced as enormous.

That's only a relative view. From Oneness, which includes the entire universe, even the collective ego of the entire world becomes puny in comparison!

When shifting identification from the ego to oneness, the ego melts and merges with all of existence like a teardrop falling into an ocean of tranquility. <-- Lame poetry.
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Old 02-12-2012, 10:19 PM   #4255
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The ego needs to be transformed in two ways: 1) it needs to lose its grip on the person as acting as the sole personal identity, and 2) it has to be recognised as being a part of the one oneness rather than the belief of being completely separate from everything else.
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Old 03-12-2012, 12:09 AM   #4256
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I personally have been hitting the brick wall that is conditioned consciousness, I find it really frustrating and feel like shaking people.

But in a calm and collective manner, I realize that the generations of social conditioning may have the problem Marx described, which is that any system needs a hierarchy which creates the divisions leading to the masters and the herd, this is what I am focusing on as the way to change things.

If it is leadership and hierarchy and ranks that can keep people in their bubbles, then surely it can get them out.

I would be interested in any groups that are active on this forum, or anywhere for that matter that I could join.

I am not the brightest tool in the box and I can see that we only suffering because of the elaborate fiction that is money, debt and interest.

I recently joined the Venus Project and want us to move towards a Resource Based Economy.
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Old 03-12-2012, 05:59 AM   #4257
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Interesting show today about longevity on Coast to Coast today. Unfortunately I missed most of it but here is a presentation by the guest from last year:

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Old 03-12-2012, 06:10 AM   #4258
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Originally Posted by nemus_amaranthi View Post
I personally have been hitting the brick wall that is conditioned consciousness, I find it really frustrating and feel like shaking people.

But in a calm and collective manner, I realize that the generations of social conditioning may have the problem Marx described, which is that any system needs a hierarchy which creates the divisions leading to the masters and the herd, this is what I am focusing on as the way to change things.

If it is leadership and hierarchy and ranks that can keep people in their bubbles, then surely it can get them out.

I would be interested in any groups that are active on this forum, or anywhere for that matter that I could join.

I am not the brightest tool in the box and I can see that we only suffering because of the elaborate fiction that is money, debt and interest.

I recently joined the Venus Project and want us to move towards a Resource Based Economy.
Hierarchies in power structures will be needed even in the future but they will be far less important for us humans as I see it. Artificial intelligence will become thousands of times more intelligent than humans when it comes to intellectual tasks, so it can, and I believe will, replace the human power structure. We humans will still remain in control with the difference that we then don't have to fit into archaic power pyramids with other people having more power than others. We will still be able to have jobs if we want to though, even in things like politics, and have super AI as a tool.

Even today computers can beat the best human players in Jeopardy:


Two decades from now the power of computers will be a million times more! The reason is the exponential progress of information technology.
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Old 03-12-2012, 07:25 AM   #4259
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Originally Posted by nemus_amaranthi View Post
I personally have been hitting the brick wall that is conditioned consciousness, I find it really frustrating and feel like shaking people.

But in a calm and collective manner, I realize that the generations of social conditioning may have the problem Marx described, which is that any system needs a hierarchy which creates the divisions leading to the masters and the herd, this is what I am focusing on as the way to change things.

If it is leadership and hierarchy and ranks that can keep people in their bubbles, then surely it can get them out.

I would be interested in any groups that are active on this forum, or anywhere for that matter that I could join.

I am not the brightest tool in the box and I can see that we only suffering because of the elaborate fiction that is money, debt and interest.

I recently joined the Venus Project and want us to move towards a Resource Based Economy.
The minds idea of unconditioned consciousness is also conditioned. Do you understand this
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Old 03-12-2012, 12:10 PM   #4260
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Peter Russell suggested that humanity may soon form a global brain. Our human brains then become like individual 'neurons' in the brain of planet Earth.

Carl Jung talked about a collective unconscious. Why unconscious? Because the collective mind hasn't formed yet! As a neuroscientist pointed out in a video, when we are in deep dreamless sleep the brain has much less integration than when in a wakened state.

So what is needed for the global brain to form then is more integration between our individual human nervous systems. Is technology needed to make such integration actual? Maybe. Another option is non-local mind-to-mind connections without the need for new technology.

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