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Old 05-04-2014, 08:48 AM   #1
doobyferkin
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Default "Classical” Music was Conceived as Elitist Music

“Classical” music was conceived as elitist music and popularised/promoted into society as music representing history and agendas of royalty/politics/religion and did not represent music of the masses and “true” histories and current values.

Modern pop music is equivalent to the function of classical music.

Folk music represented history and values of the masses, folk music is dangerous to the elite and is the reason in modern times why Bob Dylan was recruited by tptb to divert and change its path.

This subject goes very deep and plays an important part of culture manipulation and hidden historic truths.
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Old 05-04-2014, 09:14 AM   #2
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No. Classical music is the natural expression of European-derived high culture. Folk music is exactly the same expression but it naturally grew from the masses.

Modernism tried to reject anything that was traditional and which was a natural expression of a given group's culture that thrived over generations. Once we arrived at the post-modern era classical music and especially folk music had lost most of their influence over the masses. This influence was given to pop culture's discordant tones which is based on gratifying the senses for global consumption.

Max Keiser astutely observed recently that the West plays "Pussy Riot" while Russia plays Tchaikovsky. That is very telling.

Last edited by soleil; 05-04-2014 at 09:16 AM.
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Old 05-04-2014, 09:19 AM   #3
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secular and religious.....

who commissioned the composers?

who provided the platform for classical music to be performed?

who paid for the orchestras?

who printed the music?

etc.....
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Old 05-04-2014, 11:13 AM   #4
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The first cave paintings were also elitist created
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Old 05-04-2014, 03:54 PM   #5
decode reality
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doobyferkin View Post
“Classical” music was conceived as elitist music and popularised/promoted into society as music representing history and agendas of royalty/politics/religion and did not represent music of the masses and “true” histories and current values.

Modern pop music is equivalent to the function of classical music.

Folk music represented history and values of the masses, folk music is dangerous to the elite and is the reason in modern times why Bob Dylan was recruited by tptb to divert and change its path.

This subject goes very deep and plays an important part of culture manipulation and hidden historic truths.
Pop music and classical music are two different worlds. And having said that, Italian opera was seen as popular in the 19th century. Classical music still has the aura of elitism, despite their attempts to make it sexy and populist. The classical world over the past 20 years has been striving to get their music across to 'the kids' and in general, it hasn't worked.


Bob Dylan recruited by 'tptb'? You lost me there. Not sure how Cheryl Cole, Rihanna and Gary Barlow can be perceived as classical.

Last edited by decode reality; 05-04-2014 at 03:56 PM.
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Old 05-04-2014, 04:00 PM   #6
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Originally Posted by decode reality View Post
Pop music and classical music are two different worlds...
Quote:
Not sure how Cheryl Cole, Rihanna and Gary Barlow can be perceived as classical.
"Modern pop music is equivalent to the function of classical music."



Quote:
Bob Dylan recruited by 'tptb'? You lost me there.

Uploaded on Oct 15, 2009
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IqvvOD4bdRs

"I made a bargain with it, you know, long time ago, I'm holding up my end"

"Who did you make the bargain with? "

"with the chief commanda.... on this earth and then a world we can't see"

Last edited by doobyferkin; 05-04-2014 at 04:05 PM.
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Old 05-04-2014, 04:09 PM   #7
decode reality
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Quote:
Originally Posted by doobyferkin View Post
"Modern pop music is equivalent to the function of classical music."






Uploaded on Oct 15, 2009
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IqvvOD4bdRs

"I made a bargain with it, you know, long time ago, I'm holding up my end"

"Who did you make the bargain with? "

"with the chief commanda.... on this earth and then a world we can't see"
Classical music concerts aren't even about the audience responding and showing they like the music - until the very end.

As for the Dylan clip it's pure inuendo, superstition. And even if he did cut a deal with the devil, I'd rather listen to him than some interminable new age mantra made at 434 hz. More entertainment value for a start.

Last edited by decode reality; 05-04-2014 at 04:09 PM.
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Old 05-04-2014, 04:17 PM   #8
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Originally Posted by decode reality View Post
Classical music concerts aren't even about the audience responding and showing they like the music - until the very end.
imo not true....this is irrelevant to the op and my comment.


Quote:
As for the Dylan clip it's pure inuendo, superstition..
the elite hide behind innuendo and superstition.


Quote:
And even if he did cut a deal with the devil, I'd rather listen to him than some interminable new age mantra made at 434 hz. More entertainment value for a start
taste or music preference is irrelevant to the op and my comment.
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Old 05-04-2014, 04:25 PM   #9
decode reality
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Originally Posted by doobyferkin View Post
imo not true....this is irrelevant to the op and my comment.




the elite hide behind innuendo and superstition.




taste or music preference is irrelevant to the op and my comment.
Sorry but I've listened to most of the artists past and present who are accused of being in league with the devil. I've never had the slightest interest in satanism. Some "researcher" says that any artist that ever had a record deal has spells cast into their master tapes. To paraphrase Bill Hicks, if you believe that then you ARE Satan.

Anyway that's all I'm saying on this topic.
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Old 05-04-2014, 04:28 PM   #10
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All art is elitist.
Artists are an elite in any society.
If not, they starve.
The church commissioned much early music.
Simon Cowell commissions some of today's offerings.
CBS commissioned Bob Dylan and the 60s 'protest' songsters.
That's never gonna change.

" Who pays the piper calls the tune."

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Old 05-04-2014, 04:35 PM   #11
doobyferkin
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Originally Posted by decode reality View Post
Sorry
no need for an apology.


Quote:
but I've listened to most of the artists past and present who are accused of being in league with the devil. I've never had the slightest interest in satanism..
this is a contradiction.


Quote:
Some "researcher" says that any artist that ever had a record deal has spells cast into their master tapes.
irrelevant to my post or comment.


Quote:
Anyway that's all I'm saying on this topic.
thanks for your contribution.....doubts, questions and "arguments" help gain a better understanding of a topic/subject.
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Old 05-04-2014, 04:39 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by grandmasterp View Post
All art is elitist.
Artists are an elite in any society.
If not, they starve.......
I create art and have no association with the elites.
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Old 08-04-2014, 12:44 PM   #13
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Default The evidence of Beethoven

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Originally Posted by doobyferkin View Post
“Classical” music was conceived as elitist music and popularised/promoted into society as music representing history and agendas of royalty/politics/religion and did not represent music of the masses and “true” histories and current values.

Modern pop music is equivalent to the function of classical music.

Folk music represented history and values of the masses, folk music is dangerous to the elite and is the reason in modern times why Bob Dylan was recruited by tptb to divert and change its path.

This subject goes very deep and plays an important part of culture manipulation and hidden historic truths.
Beethoven's biography confirms your view. He was feted by the aristocrats but his heart was with the people.

The elite of Vienna supported him because of his stature in the musical world. Their motives were political. Not artistic (there were exceptions).

Here is some evidence. He was invited to a dinner party by a patron. He grew annoyed when he was made to feel that his function was to serve his patron and amuse the guests by performing at the piano. Beethoven walked out. He told them their claim to high society was by their birth and not by any otherwise native merit. Whereas he had himself earned his place.

The elite showed their ignorance by laughing when Beethoven broke new ground and presented unexpected sounds. This is in reference to the 2nd movement of the first Razomuffski Quartet where it opens not with an expected melody but with a rhythm on a single note presented by the cello.

It seems that Beethoven is having the last laugh.
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Old 08-04-2014, 02:26 PM   #14
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thanks leostokes for your post, and yes this is a good example.....

Mozart story is also interesting and is also a good example, including music eras well before his time. Art, ballet, poetry and opera etc are all also good examples. I am not saying everyone and all, how could i know, although it runs deep and all is not how we have been generally taught. Religious music was very much controlled and influential.

this subject is underestimated in my opinion and had/has an affect on society/culture and historical understanding and the "gov" control system.

Last edited by doobyferkin; 08-04-2014 at 02:33 PM.
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Old 25-04-2014, 05:52 PM   #15
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Default Beethoven

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Originally Posted by leostokes View Post
Beethoven's biography confirms your view. He was feted by the aristocrats but his heart was with the people.

The elite of Vienna supported him because of his stature in the musical world. Their motives were political. Not artistic (there were exceptions).

Here is some evidence. He was invited to a dinner party by a patron. He grew annoyed when he was made to feel that his function was to serve his patron and amuse the guests by performing at the piano. Beethoven walked out. He told them their claim to high society was by their birth and not by any otherwise native merit. Whereas he had himself earned his place.

The elite showed their ignorance by laughing when Beethoven broke new ground and presented unexpected sounds. This is in reference to the 2nd movement of the first Razomuffski Quartet where it opens not with an expected melody but with a rhythm on a single note presented by the cello.

It seems that Beethoven is having the last laugh.
Indeed! I admire him greatly and love his music- his music is amazing and uplifting. I need his music!
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