Go Back   David Icke's Official Forums > Main Forums > Electronic Harassment / Mind Control / Subliminal Programing > The Nature of Matrix Religions and what they mean.

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 05-09-2017, 12:34 AM   #1
greatestiam
Senior Member
 
greatestiam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 4,269
Likes: 231 (195 Posts)
Default Can you accept that Man is greater than God?

Can you accept that Man is greater than God?
We can reproduce true. God cannot.
We can have many children. God cannot.
We place the lives of our wives and families above our own. God does not.
We would cure instead of kill. God kills.
We do not torture babies. God does.
We believe in freedom. God does not.
Jesus does which is why he took the judgement seat from His Father.

You can continue to adore a God inferior to you, both intellectually and morally, or become a Gnostic Christian or Karaite Jew like Jesus was. Jesus the Good as the Chrestians used to call him before Christianity reared it’s ugly head by reading their myths literally and embrace their God of War.

Islam would be a better religion today if that had not forced Mohammad to change from a loving God to a God or War so as to fight fire with fire. Thanks Christians for Islam. Pardon the digression.

Jesus shows the way with his advice to seek God by closeting yourself. Are you ready to follow Jesus or will you stick with your lying priests, preachers, Rabbi’s and Imams?

Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.
John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRN...layer_embedded

Regards
DL
greatestiam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2017, 03:59 AM   #2
cosmicpurpose1.618
Senior Member
 
cosmicpurpose1.618's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2016
Location: Everywhere/nowhere
Posts: 2,178
Likes: 1,839 (943 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by greatestiam View Post
Can you accept that Man is greater than God?
We can reproduce true. God cannot.
We can have many children. God cannot.
We place the lives of our wives and families above our own. God does not.
We would cure instead of kill. God kills.
We do not torture babies. God does.
We believe in freedom. God does not.
Oooh, you're talking about YHWH .

I'm afraid that's not God my friend, that's a lesser archontic entity, who stole part of the holy spirit and trapped it in flesh to do it's bidding as slaves, and to feed it energy.
Likes: (1)
cosmicpurpose1.618 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2017, 06:38 PM   #3
greatestiam
Senior Member
 
greatestiam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 4,269
Likes: 231 (195 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by cosmicpurpose1.618 View Post
Oooh, you're talking about YHWH .

I'm afraid that's not God my friend, that's a lesser archontic entity, who stole part of the holy spirit and trapped it in flesh to do it's bidding as slaves, and to feed it energy.
I agree that Yahweh is not a God. If as written, he is more of a genocidal son murdering prick.

You express the Gnostic Christian myth almost as if we do not know that Christianity is all about believing a myth to be real. and that our fantasy myths were written to just put against theirs when all knew that all the Gods were human constructs.

I always try to indicate that Gnostic Christianity does hold any supernatural beliefs.

I think that most accentuate our myths while not talking of our core beliefs.

Regards
DL
Likes: (1)
greatestiam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2017, 06:57 PM   #4
Daisy101
Senior Member
 
Daisy101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 632
Likes: 495 (293 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by greatestiam View Post
Can you accept that Man is greater than God?
We can reproduce true. God cannot.
We can have many children. God cannot.
We place the lives of our wives and families above our own. God does not.
We would cure instead of kill. God kills.
We do not torture babies. God does.
We believe in freedom. God does not.
Jesus does which is why he took the judgement seat from His Father.

You can continue to adore a God inferior to you, both intellectually and morally, or become a Gnostic Christian or Karaite Jew like Jesus was. Jesus the Good as the Chrestians used to call him before Christianity reared it’s ugly head by reading their myths literally and embrace their God of War.

Islam would be a better religion today if that had not forced Mohammad to change from a loving God to a God or War so as to fight fire with fire. Thanks Christians for Islam. Pardon the digression.

Jesus shows the way with his advice to seek God by closeting yourself. Are you ready to follow Jesus or will you stick with your lying priests, preachers, Rabbi’s and Imams?

Matthew 6:22 The light of the body is the eye: if therefore thine eye be single, thy whole body shall be full of light.
John 14:23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.
Romans 8:29 For whom he did foreknow, he also did predestinate to be conformed to the image of his Son, that he might be the firstborn among many brethren.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRN...layer_embedded

Regards
DL
If you are quoting Christian scripture as your source you don't understand it very well.

It says:
God had a son called Jesus and created Adam and Eve.
God is the father of everyone.
God sacrificed his only son's life to prove to us there is an afterlife. (Man killed him)
Many people do not place others above themselves not even their own families.
We have cures given to us by God in plants yet we hide it and make people pay extortionate amounts to obtain it. Man kills man as he has free will.
Man tortures babies. God saves them and takes them back home.
We are not free as man has enslaved us. God gave us free will to choose a paradise on Earth or a Hell - we seem to be creating Hell for ourselves with our free will as others free will has an effect on ours so if we allow them to enslave us we are no longer free.
Jesus was given a seat at the right hand of his father.

What Bible did you read? lol

And I thought this forum had a rule not to try to talk people into joining a religion -
making up lies about Christianity to con people into your 'Jesus hating God religion' is just religious nonsense.
A slithering snake? lol ...nice avatar to choose

No seriously what religion are you advocating? Because I remember someone coming to my door 20 years ago saying God was evil
and I assumed they were from the Church of Satan across the road next door to the Nunnery (I kid you not)
but maybe it's another religion if you believe in Jesus but hate God his father lol
- so what is it? Thanks.

Oh and I thought Mohammed went up a mountain into a cave and came back pretending he'd spoken to God like Moses did but as he was talking about war and killing the people should have recognised the false prophet as it was obvious - he just wanted power for himself - then he married a child etc...
if only Gengis Khan had realised how easy it was to fool people by pretending to have chatted with God he could have been even more powerful...
we enslave ourselves by following fools and liars.

Last edited by Daisy101; 05-09-2017 at 07:09 PM.
Daisy101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2017, 07:15 PM   #5
greatestiam
Senior Member
 
greatestiam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 4,269
Likes: 231 (195 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daisy101 View Post
Quote:
If you are quoting Christian scripture as your source you don't understand it very well.
Neither do Christians, but I like to think I have thought about them more than the average Christian. That is why I can say it is wrong to adore a genocidal son murdering God.
Quote:
God had a son called Jesus and created Adam and Eve.
That is the myth, yes. That has nothing to do with reality.

Quote:
God is the father of everyone.
Then he is quite the prick of a father given what he fathered in this link which he could have fathered in a better way.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G_-n...layer_embedded

Quote:
God placed our lives above his only son's to prove to us there is an afterlife.
Show the proof of an afterlife based on reality and not your fantasy.

Quote:
Many people do not place others above themselves not even their own families.
True, but that applies to your own Yahweh which is one of my pet peeves.

Tell us please, if you were God and decided that justice could only be done by having a barbaric sacrifice, would you step up as most parents would, or would you send your child to die?

Quote:
We have cures given to us by God in plants yet we hide it and make people pay extortionate amounts to obtain it.
Why did God create the disease in the first place?

Quote:
Man kills man as he has free will.
God had his son murdered and does a lot of man killing and you are supposed to emulate your God. Are you ready to kill for a genocidal son murdering God?

Quote:
Man tortures babies. God saves them and takes them back home.
You ignore the great flood and the story of King David's baby.

If you do, it is no wonder that you adore an immoral genocidal God.

Quote:
WE are not free as man has enslaved us. God gave us free will to choose a paradise on Earth or a Hell - we seem to be creating Hell for ourselves with our free will as others free will has an effect on ours so if we allow them to enslave us we are no longer free.
Yet being a slave to God is what Christianity preaches. You can only serve one master, etc.

Quote:
Jesus was given a seat at the right hand of his father.
Eh, no. The story says he took it. Have you even read your bible?

Quote:
What Bible did you read? lol
The one that showed God torturing babies. Which one did you read that omitted those stories?

Quote:
And I thought this forum had a rule not to try to talk people into joining a religion -
making up lies to con people into your 'Jesus hating God religion' is just religious nonsense.
Slither back under the rock lol
This from someone who has swallowed so many lies as given by priests and preachers.

Shame on you.

Regards
DL
greatestiam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2017, 07:25 PM   #6
Daisy101
Senior Member
 
Daisy101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 632
Likes: 495 (293 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by greatestiam View Post
This from someone who has swallowed so many lies as given by priests and preachers.

Shame on you.

Regards
DL

I'm just saying that the stuff you are saying isn't in The Bible - at least quote it correctly to diss it.

Yes I was taught The Bible - and I went on to teach myself everyone elses Bible - and they have a lot of mysterious things in common - and a lot of stuff in them obviously written by power hungry men too.

But before you diss God -If you wanted to create a world of Free Will how could you do that without allowing people to be free to kill and do bad stuff as well as create good stuff?

If we were created to only be able to do good maybe that isn't free will?

And other peoples free will has an effect on our lives.

Sickness and cancer - how do you know people don't already have a cure here?

What caused it in the first place? Cancer is often linked to excess not moderation.

Stress is the biggest cause of illness - what causes stress? Other people's free will usually.

Is there actually free will here at all? There may have been in the beginning but there are way too many people here now to allow us to have any free will.

And why blame God for everything? That means you believe in God.
How do you know we weren't created then left here....
as we are thinking of dropping off people on Mars - what if we did that then got wiped out on Earth so the Mars people can't remember where they came from?

There's all sorts of reasons why we might be here.
But if God created us and stuck us here...
then if he meddled we would surely be ok and happy.
So is the answer to happiness to give up your free will - isn't that what Satan and God both say will free us? Yet no one seems happy
that has dealings with Satan but they are when they follow God - aren't they? Not religion though that seems to create misery.

Instead of assuming he meddled and made this place bad maybe think about Eden
and how we can get that back - we messed it up - we can get it back.

Stop blaming and start creating

Last edited by Daisy101; 05-09-2017 at 07:32 PM.
Daisy101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2017, 07:57 PM   #7
greatestiam
Senior Member
 
greatestiam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 4,269
Likes: 231 (195 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daisy101 View Post
Quote:
I'm just saying that the stuff you are saying isn't in The Bible - at least quote it correctly to diss it.
I do and if you see anything inaccurate, point it out.

I do not make up verses as they can all be verified.

Quote:
Yes I was taught The Bible - and I went on to teach myself everyone elses Bible - and they have a lot of mysterious things in common - and a lot of stuff in them obviously written by power hungry men too.
The mystery is the hook that gets the gullible.

Quote:
But before you diss God -If you wanted to create a world of Free Will how could you do that without allowing people to be free to kill and do bad stuff as well as create good stuff?
We do not have the free will to cooperate all the time. Person to person evil only happens when we compete. Take competition out of our evolution and we will go extinct.

Quote:
If we were created to only be able to do good maybe that isn't free will?
See just above.

Quote:
And other peoples free will has an effect on our lives.
Of course. We have to compete against them when they are in competition mode.

Quote:
Sickness and cancer - how do you know people don't already have a cure here?
Grant money and greed insure that our medical progress against diseases will continue in an honest way.

Quote:
What caused it in the first place? Cancer is often linked to excess not moderation.
Cancer is caused by DNA impurities or damage. Some of that damage can be man made.

Quote:
Stress is the biggest cause of illness - what causes stress? Other people's free will usually.
I can agree with this.

Quote:
Is there actually free will here at all?
Of course. If you did not have or create the will to respond with this last post of yours, whose will did?

Quote:
There may have been in the beginning but there are way too many people here now to allow us to have any free will.
Hogwash.

Free will is always limited by nature and physics but is demonstrably real.

Quote:
And why blame God for everything? That means you believe in God.
No. I blame God because, in these forums that discuss God, believers have to try to recognize how much evil their homophobic and misogynous religions are causing.

Quote:
How do you know we weren't created then left here....
We are. By nature.

Quote:
as we are thinking of dropping off people on Mars - what if we did that then got wiped out on Earth so the Mars people can't remember where they came from?
Why not? Rhetorical that as we could talk forever about this fantasy. Please set it aside.

Quote:
There's all sorts of reasons why we might be here.
But if God created us and stuck us here...
then if he meddled we would surely be ok and happy.
If Noah's flood were true, which it isn't, God meddling on earth is not what most would want.

Quote:
So is the answer to happiness to give up your free will - isn't that what Satan and God both say will free us?
That is what Christianity and Islam try to sell with the obedience and submission to God.

The answer to Gnostic Christian is to accept that you have a free will and are free to reject the immoral mainstream Gods.

Quote:
Yet no one seems happy that has dealings with Satan but they are when they follow God - aren't they? Not religion though that seems to create misery.
Eh, neither can be followed as they are both fictional characters. You might have noted that God is certainly not followed by most as the religions are the main cause of war.

Both Christianity and Islam have basically developed into intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religions. Both religions have grown themselves by the sword instead of good deeds and continue with their immoral ways in spite of secular law showing them the moral ways.

Jesus said we would know his people by their works and deeds. That means Jesus would not recognize Christians and Muslims as his people, and neither do I. Jesus would call Christianity and Islam abominations.

Gnostic Christians did in the past, and I am proudly continuing that tradition and honest irrefutable evaluation based on morality.

Quote:
Instead of assuming he meddled and made this place bad maybe think about Eden
and how we can get that back - we messed it up - we can get it back.

Stop blaming and start creating

Making this place bad is a Christian view as Gen 3 has God cursing the earth.

Gnostic Christians just see a bit or trash in the streets of Eden/paradise.

Gnostic Christian Jesus said, "If those who attract you say, 'See, the Kingdom is in the sky,' then the birds of the sky will precede you.
If they say to you, 'It is under the earth,' then the fish of the sea will precede you.
Rather, the Kingdom of God is inside of you, and it is outside of you.
[Those who] become acquainted with [themselves] will find it; [and when you] become acquainted with yourselves, [you will understand that] it is you who are the sons of the living Father.
But if you will not know yourselves, you dwell in poverty and it is you who are that poverty."

You say we messed up in Eden.

I guess that you do not know that Jews saw Eden as our place of elevation and not our fall.

Why would you take the newer illogical Christian view and ignore the more intelligent Jewish view of their Jewish myth?

http://dish.andrewsullivan.com/2013/...tive-theodicy/

Regards
DL
greatestiam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2017, 07:59 PM   #8
Truthisaperson
Restricted Profile
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 122
Likes: 24 (21 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daisy101 View Post

Stop blaming and start creating
Very true, I see many people today blaming God for all the wrongs in the world. In the beginning we were commanded by God when he created us to go forth and multiply, bear much fruit and have dominion. So we have been given all authority to rule and reign on this earth, it is our responsibility to look after all creation on earth.

Bearing much fruit refers to:

Galatians 5:22-23New King James Version (NKJV)

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.
Likes: (2)
Truthisaperson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2017, 08:03 PM   #9
greatestiam
Senior Member
 
greatestiam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 4,269
Likes: 231 (195 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Truthisaperson View Post
Very true, I see many people today blaming God for all the wrongs in the world. In the beginning we were commanded by God when he created us to go forth and multiply, bear much fruit and have dominion. So we have been given all authority to rule and reign on this earth, it is our responsibility to look after all creation on earth.

Bearing much fruit refers to:

Galatians 5:22-23New King James Version (NKJV)

22 But the fruit of the Spirit is love, joy, peace, longsuffering, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, 23 gentleness, self-control. Against such there is no law.
Good old God love. How is it expressed in the bible?

Jesus said, "Perhaps people think that I have come to cast peace upon the world. They do not know that I have come to cast conflicts upon the earth: fire, sword, war.

Luke 19:27 But those enemies of mine who did not want me to be king over them—bring them here and kill them in front of me.

Regards
DL
greatestiam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2017, 09:01 PM   #10
andy1033
Senior Member
 
andy1033's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2013
Posts: 8,227
Likes: 1,212 (700 Posts)
Default

For me our god is the sun, and the sun to us, is everything. Without our sun, nothing would be here on earth.

All the things you bring up op, comes from the sun being here. I always believe jesus really is the sun, and what we worship.

So humans are not greater then god.

So not for me. People are entitled to believe what they want, but the sun is more important than any human, and that is humankinds pathway to god. Its gods son(sun), as it were.

I would be pretty sure, if aliens exist and i am sure they do, they also worship there sun in there solar system too. Any thinking being, would come to similar conclusions, about what there sun does and why its important.
__________________
"You put 10 tonnes of proof in front of people, if they are not ready to accept an idea, they will not accept the proof. No amount of evidence will suffice to prove anything, it is the jury that will decide, and you are the jury."
William Cooper - behold a pale horse video
^^
So true

Last edited by andy1033; 05-09-2017 at 09:02 PM.
Likes: (1)
andy1033 is online now   Reply With Quote
Old 05-09-2017, 09:14 PM   #11
greatestiam
Senior Member
 
greatestiam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 4,269
Likes: 231 (195 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by andy1033 View Post
For me our god is the sun, and the sun to us, is everything. Without our sun, nothing would be here on earth.

All the things you bring up op, comes from the sun being here. I always believe jesus really is the sun, and what we worship.

So humans are not greater then god.

So not for me. People are entitled to believe what they want, but the sun is more important than any human, and that is humankinds pathway to god. Its gods son(sun), as it were.

I would be pretty sure, if aliens exist and i am sure they do, they also worship there sun in there solar system too. Any thinking being, would come to similar conclusions, about what there sun does and why its important.
That is certainly a more intelligent view than what Christianity did with their son.

It also negates you having to go into intellectual and moral dissonance by adoring a genocidal son murdering God.

It is not quite how a Gnostic Christian sees things but it is close enough to perfect for me as your God is not hurting society, gays and women, the way the mainstream religions are doing.

Regards
DL
greatestiam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2017, 08:42 AM   #12
Daisy101
Senior Member
 
Daisy101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 632
Likes: 495 (293 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by greatestiam View Post
That is certainly a more intelligent view than what Christianity did with their son.

It also negates you having to go into intellectual and moral dissonance by adoring a genocidal son murdering God.

It is not quite how a Gnostic Christian sees things but it is close enough to perfect for me as your God is not hurting society, gays and women, the way the mainstream religions are doing.

Regards
DL
You say you think Jesus' words are truth yet you take his words out of context and make him sound like a violent person.

As for Christian Gnosticism - they are not Christians at all I agree.

Personally I read the words of Jesus and Buddha as they make sense and have proved themselves time and again to create happiness.
I think reading the Bible , repeating prayers and singing songs and going to church doesn't make you a better person and it turns children away from the religion all by itself.
I started talking directly to God after giving up on religion and think of it like a Godverse with Angel bots (Siri type help bots) - something made this place
there are too many coincidences that happen so many I don't believe they are coincidences anymore - if I follow the advice of Jesus and Buddha and ask for help from these bots my life changes for the better - I have no idea why but Jesus and Buddha figured something out that's all I know.
It's a pity the message was so distorted in time by other men.

I agree with you that Jesus would turn the tables on the Religions of today but there are some good people out there within those religions that help others maybe working for church charities, helping the homeless etc...- it is the leaders that are deluded and they that Jesus would dislike.

I don't think you will get people to steer away from religion unless you offer them something else to follow
so what are you selling?

Last edited by Daisy101; 06-09-2017 at 08:49 AM.
Daisy101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2017, 04:27 PM   #13
greatestiam
Senior Member
 
greatestiam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 4,269
Likes: 231 (195 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daisy101 View Post
Quote:
You say you think Jesus' words are truth yet you take his words out of context and make him sound like a violent person.
Thanks for showing where I do so. That makes it easy to defend my position. Not.

Quote:
As for Christian Gnosticism - they are not Christians at all I agree.
That depends on your perspective. As John Lennon said, from my perspective as well, "the only good Christian is a Gnostic Christian.

Quote:
Personally I read the words of Jesus and Buddha as they make sense and have proved themselves time and again to create happiness.
Ditto as long as I cherry pick the Gnostic Jesus I see in scriptures and ignore the Rome created Jesus ass kisser.

Quote:
I think reading the Bible , repeating prayers and singing songs and going to church doesn't make you a better person and it turns children away from the religion all by itself.
The less gullible children for sure. Unfortunately not those children who are brain washed too early. I see that conditioning as child abuse. Here is an example of that abuse.

Jesus Camp 1of 3
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LACyLTsH4ac

Quote:
I started talking directly to God after giving up on religion and think of it like a Godverse with Angel bots (Siri type help bots) - something made this place
there are too many coincidences that happen so many I don't believe they are coincidences anymore - if I follow the advice of Jesus and Buddha and ask for help from these bots my life changes for the better - I have no idea why but Jesus and Buddha figured something out that's all I know.
It's a pity the message was so distorted in time by other men.
Direct is the best way to go but you might consider that who you are talking to is yourself, in terms of you seeking and perhaps finding what Jung and Freud called your Father Complex.

Quote:
I agree with you that Jesus would turn the tables on the Religions of today but there are some good people out there within those religions that help others maybe working for church charities, helping the homeless etc...- it is the leaders that are deluded and they that Jesus would dislike.
I agree to a point.

If a Christian recognizes why Jesus would not recognize his church, then a moral man would leave it and stop supporting an evil religion that promotes slavery over freedom.

Quote:
I don't think you will get people to steer away from religion unless you offer them something else to follow
so what are you selling?
As john Lennon said, the only good Christian is a Gnostic Christian.

That is the most honorable and moral religion on offer these days.

In a nutshell, this is the main Gnostic Christian ideology.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRN...layer_embedded

Regards
DL
greatestiam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2017, 10:23 PM   #14
Truthisaperson
Restricted Profile
 
Join Date: Jun 2017
Posts: 122
Likes: 24 (21 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by greatestiam View Post
As john Lennon said, the only good Christian is a Gnostic Christian.

That is the most honorable and moral religion on offer these days.

In a nutshell, this is the main Gnostic Christian ideology.

[url]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRNbesfXXw&feature=player_embedded[/url
https://www.gotquestions.org/Christian-gnosticism.html

Question: "What is Christian Gnosticism?"

Answer: There is actually no such thing as Christian Gnosticism, because true Christianity and Gnosticism are mutually exclusive systems of belief. The principles of Gnosticism contradict what it means to be a Christian. Therefore, while some forms of Gnosticism may claim to be Christian, they are in fact decidedly non-Christian.

Gnosticism was perhaps the most dangerous heresy that threatened the early church during the first three centuries. Influenced by such philosophers as Plato, Gnosticism is based on two false premises. First, it espouses a dualism regarding spirit and matter. Gnostics assert that matter is inherently evil and spirit is good. As a result of this presupposition, Gnostics believe anything done in the body, even the grossest sin, has no meaning because real life exists in the spirit realm only.

Second, Gnostics claim to possess an elevated knowledge, a “higher truth” known only to a certain few. Gnosticism comes from the Greek word gnosis which means “to know.” Gnostics claim to possess a higher knowledge, not from the Bible, but acquired on some mystical higher plane of existence. Gnostics see themselves as a privileged class elevated above everybody else by their higher, deeper knowledge of God.

To discredit the idea of any compatibility between Christianity and Gnosticism, one has only to compare their teachings on the main doctrines of the faith. On the matter of salvation, Gnosticism teaches that salvation is gained through the acquisition of divine knowledge which frees one from the illusions of darkness. Although they claim to follow Jesus Christ and His original teachings, Gnostics contradict Him at every turn. Jesus said nothing about salvation through knowledge, but by faith in Him as Savior from sin. “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast” (Ephesians 2:8-9). Furthermore, the salvation Christ offers is free and available to everyone (John 3:16), not just a select few who have acquired a special revelation.

Christianity asserts that there is one source of Truth and that is the Bible, the inspired, inerrant Word of the living God, the only infallible rule of faith and practice (John 17:17; 2 Timothy 3:15-17; Hebrews 4:12). It is God’s written revelation to mankind and is never superseded by man’s thoughts, ideas, writings, or visions. The Gnostics, on the other hand, use a variety of early heretical writings known as the Gnostic gospels, a collection of forgeries claiming to be “lost books of the Bible.” Thankfully, the early church fathers were nearly unanimous in recognizing these Gnostic scrolls as fraudulent forgeries that espouse false doctrines about Jesus Christ, salvation, God, and every other crucial Christian truth. There are countless contradictions between the Gnostic “gospels” and the Bible. Even when the so-called Christian Gnostics quote from the Bible, they rewrite verses and parts of verses to harmonize with their philosophy, a practice that is strictly forbidden and warned against by Scripture (Deuteronomy 4:2; 12:32; Proverbs 30:6; Revelation 22:18-19).

The Person of Jesus Christ is another area where Christianity and Gnosticism drastically differ. The Gnostics believe that Jesus’ physical body was not real, but only “seemed” to be physical, and that His spirit descended upon Him at His baptism, but left Him just before His crucifixion. Such views destroy not only the true humanity of Jesus, but also the atonement, for Jesus must not only have been truly God, but also the truly human (and physically real) man who actually suffered and died upon the cross in order to be the acceptable substitutionary sacrifice for sin (Hebrews 2:14-17). The biblical view of Jesus affirms His complete humanity as well as His full deity.

Gnosticism is based on a mystical, intuitive, subjective, inward, emotional approach to truth which is not new at all. It is very old, going back in some form to the Garden of Eden, where Satan questioned God and the words He spoke and convinced Adam and Eve to reject them and accept a lie. He does the same thing today as he “prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour” (1 Peter 5:8). He still calls God and the Bible into question and catches in his web those who are either naïve and scripturally uninformed or who are seeking some personal revelation to make them feel special, unique, and superior to others. Let us follow the Apostle Paul who said to “test everything. Hold on to the good” (1 Thessalonians 5:21), and this we do by comparing everything to the Word of God, the only Truth.
Likes: (1)
Truthisaperson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2017, 11:18 PM   #15
greatestiam
Senior Member
 
greatestiam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 4,269
Likes: 231 (195 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Truthisaperson View Post
https://www.gotquestions.org/Christian-gnosticism.html

Question: "What is Christian Gnosticism?"

Answer: There is actually no such thing as Christian Gnosticism, because true Christianity and Gnosticism are mutually exclusive systems of belief. The principles of Gnosticism contradict what it means to be a Christian. Therefore, while some forms of Gnosticism may claim to be Christian, they are in fact decidedly non-Christian.

Gnosticism was perhaps the most dangerous heresy that threatened the early church during the first three centuries. Influenced by such philosophers as Plato, Gnosticism is based on two false premises. First, it espouses a dualism regarding spirit and matter. Gnostics assert that matter is inherently evil and spirit is good. As a result of this presupposition, Gnostics believe anything done in the body, even the grossest sin, has no meaning because real life exists in the spirit realm only.

Second, Gnostics claim to possess an elevated knowledge, a “higher truth” known only to a certain few. Gnosticism comes from the Greek word gnosis which means “to know.” Gnostics claim to possess a higher knowledge, not from the Bible, but acquired on some mystical higher plane of existence. Gnostics see themselves as a privileged class elevated above everybody else by their higher, deeper knowledge of God.

To discredit the idea of any compatibility between Christianity and Gnosticism, one has only to compare their teachings on the main doctrines of the faith. On the matter of salvation, Gnosticism teaches that salvation is gained through the acquisition of divine knowledge which frees one from the illusions of darkness. Although they claim to follow Jesus Christ and His original teachings, Gnostics contradict Him at every turn. Jesus said nothing about salvation through knowledge, but by faith in Him as Savior from sin. “For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast” (Ephesians 2:8-9). Furthermore, the salvation Christ offers is free and available to everyone (John 3:16), not just a select few who have acquired a special revelation.

Christianity asserts that there is one source of Truth and that is the Bible, the inspired, inerrant Word of the living God, the only infallible rule of faith and practice (John 17:17; 2 Timothy 3:15-17; Hebrews 4:12). It is God’s written revelation to mankind and is never superseded by man’s thoughts, ideas, writings, or visions. The Gnostics, on the other hand, use a variety of early heretical writings known as the Gnostic gospels, a collection of forgeries claiming to be “lost books of the Bible.” Thankfully, the early church fathers were nearly unanimous in recognizing these Gnostic scrolls as fraudulent forgeries that espouse false doctrines about Jesus Christ, salvation, God, and every other crucial Christian truth. There are countless contradictions between the Gnostic “gospels” and the Bible. Even when the so-called Christian Gnostics quote from the Bible, they rewrite verses and parts of verses to harmonize with their philosophy, a practice that is strictly forbidden and warned against by Scripture (Deuteronomy 4:2; 12:32; Proverbs 30:6; Revelation 22:18-19).

The Person of Jesus Christ is another area where Christianity and Gnosticism drastically differ. The Gnostics believe that Jesus’ physical body was not real, but only “seemed” to be physical, and that His spirit descended upon Him at His baptism, but left Him just before His crucifixion. Such views destroy not only the true humanity of Jesus, but also the atonement, for Jesus must not only have been truly God, but also the truly human (and physically real) man who actually suffered and died upon the cross in order to be the acceptable substitutionary sacrifice for sin (Hebrews 2:14-17). The biblical view of Jesus affirms His complete humanity as well as His full deity.

Gnosticism is based on a mystical, intuitive, subjective, inward, emotional approach to truth which is not new at all. It is very old, going back in some form to the Garden of Eden, where Satan questioned God and the words He spoke and convinced Adam and Eve to reject them and accept a lie. He does the same thing today as he “prowls around like a roaring lion looking for someone to devour” (1 Peter 5:8). He still calls God and the Bible into question and catches in his web those who are either naïve and scripturally uninformed or who are seeking some personal revelation to make them feel special, unique, and superior to others. Let us follow the Apostle Paul who said to “test everything. Hold on to the good” (1 Thessalonians 5:21), and this we do by comparing everything to the Word of God, the only Truth.


You are getting your definition from those who decimated us with Inquisitions.



Do you expect that that will impress me?

As to your God, if you think a genocidal son murderer is whose Word you should trust, then go ahead and believe your satanic God.

Both Christianity and Islam have basically developed into intolerant, homophobic and misogynous religions. Both religions have grown themselves by the sword instead of good deeds and continue with their immoral ways in spite of secular law showing them the moral ways.

Jesus said we would know his people by their works and deeds. That means Jesus would not recognize Christians and Muslims as his people, and neither do I. Jesus would call Christianity and Islam abominations.

Gnostic Christians did in the past, and I am proudly continuing that tradition and honest irrefutable evaluation based on morality.

Regards
DL
greatestiam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 06-09-2017, 11:23 PM   #16
greatestiam
Senior Member
 
greatestiam's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2010
Posts: 4,269
Likes: 231 (195 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Truthisaperson View Post

To discredit the idea of any compatibility between Christianity and Gnosticism, one has only to compare their teachings on the main doctrines of the faith. .
The main doctrine of the faith is you having another innocent person suffer for the wrongs you have done, --- so that you might escape responsibility for having done them, --- is immoral.

Do you agree?

If not, read your own bible and you will.

Start here.

Ezekiel 18:20 The soul that sinneth, it shall die. The son shall not bear the iniquity of the father, neither shall the father bear the iniquity of the son: the righteousness of the righteous shall be upon him, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon him.

Deuteronomy 24:16 (ESV) "Fathers shall not be put to death because of their children, nor shall children be put to death because of their fathers. Each one shall be put to death for his own sin.

Ezekiel 18:20 (ESV) The soul who sins shall die. The son shall not suffer for the iniquity of the father, nor the father suffer for the iniquity of the son. The righteousness of the righteous shall be upon himself, and the wickedness of the wicked shall be upon himself.

Note how those wise and just words annul your immoral view.

Don't take my word for that. Either think in a moral way or listen to this Bishop set you straight.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jKNup9gEBdg

Regards
DL
greatestiam is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2017, 02:32 AM   #17
raburgeson
Senior Member
 
raburgeson's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2015
Posts: 1,226
Likes: 380 (255 Posts)
Default

It would be best to wait until man can create man spirit and all from scratch and make a universe before he can even claim equality.
raburgeson is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2017, 07:45 AM   #18
rooey
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 3,607
Likes: 546 (386 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Daisy101 View Post
If you are quoting Christian scripture as your source you don't understand it very well.

It says:
God had a son called Jesus and created Adam and Eve.
God is the father of everyone.
God sacrificed his only son's life to prove to us there is an afterlife. (Man killed him)
Many people do not place others above themselves not even their own families.
We have cures given to us by God in plants yet we hide it and make people pay extortionate amounts to obtain it. Man kills man as he has free will.
Man tortures babies. God saves them and takes them back home.
We are not free as man has enslaved us. God gave us free will to choose a paradise on Earth or a Hell - we seem to be creating Hell for ourselves with our free will as others free will has an effect on ours so if we allow them to enslave us we are no longer free.
Jesus was given a seat at the right hand of his father.

What Bible did you read? lol

And I thought this forum had a rule not to try to talk people into joining a religion -
making up lies about Christianity to con people into your 'Jesus hating God religion' is just religious nonsense.
A slithering snake? lol ...nice avatar to choose

No seriously what religion are you advocating? Because I remember someone coming to my door 20 years ago saying God was evil
and I assumed they were from the Church of Satan across the road next door to the Nunnery (I kid you not)
but maybe it's another religion if you believe in Jesus but hate God his father lol
- so what is it? Thanks.

Oh and I thought Mohammed went up a mountain into a cave and came back pretending he'd spoken to God like Moses did but as he was talking about war and killing the people should have recognised the false prophet as it was obvious - he just wanted power for himself - then he married a child etc...
if only Gengis Khan had realised how easy it was to fool people by pretending to have chatted with God he could have been even more powerful...
we enslave ourselves by following fools and liars.


__________________
rooey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2017, 07:50 AM   #19
rooey
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2014
Posts: 3,607
Likes: 546 (386 Posts)
Default

wps. I think the linear simplistic version of god presented by man is a reflection of the thinking dominating. Ie. why did god create cures, as well as making disease's? I think the answers become more apparent when realising that you were given free will.

which is probably why the Satanists or whomever they are, throw everything in peoples faces, hence the subversion of their free will over life times



but honestly, planning to subvert peoples free will at such a sheer scale is beyond dodgy.
__________________

Last edited by rooey; 07-09-2017 at 07:52 AM.
Likes: (1)
rooey is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 07-09-2017, 08:47 AM   #20
Daisy101
Senior Member
 
Daisy101's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2017
Posts: 632
Likes: 495 (293 Posts)
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by greatestiam View Post
As john Lennon said, the only good Christian is a Gnostic Christian.

That is the most honorable and moral religion on offer these days.

In a nutshell, this is the main Gnostic Christian ideology.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=alRN...layer_embedded

Regards
DL
So you are promoting a religion.... Gnostic Christianity?
That is against the forum rules so how are you allowed to do this?
Daisy101 is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Bookmarks

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 12:18 PM.


Shoutbox provided by vBShout (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2017 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.