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Old 07-07-2007, 03:13 AM   #21
titurel
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Originally Posted by tinmenace View Post
It's different for each person. I'm still trying to figure out exactly what it means to you...
Please bear in mind that in my original post, I deliberately began by stating "if...", as in "If we take religion to mean... then..."

The defintion I gave for religion is dictionary bonafide:

Religion

from Latin re (again) + ligare (to connect)

Re-connection to the divine–from Latin re (again) + ligare (to connect, as in English ).
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Old 07-07-2007, 03:18 AM   #22
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The whole green/spiritual/john lennon/etc. movement is a farce. These type of people only create the illusion that because there is "evil" there MUST be an opposing "good" force that will come to the rescue if we just "BELIEVE".

We are facing an enemy that is beyond anything we can imagine and it doesnt just stop with the illuminati.

Take Alex Jones for what he is worth, some of his news, documentaries, etc. spreading the 'truth out', reject his religious crap, althought he isnt fanatical about it.

There is no such thing as an absolute answer or solution anywhere to be found. We can only move on and adapt because we are at the mercy of reality and until we can control it, not fake illumintai 'reality' using LSD/propaganda we can never stop.
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Old 07-07-2007, 03:30 AM   #23
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But we're also talking about other dimensional beings who are against us and that's the crux of the matter.

There are malevolent other dimensional beings but there are also more powerful higher dimensional beings that are for us... mankind will be totally in bondage to the Reptilian Elite if it would not be for God. However, that doesn't mean we shouldn't play our own part in exposing lies and corruption, when they do all finally come out, and there is still plenty more to come, it's going to cause an unheavenly stink that is going to suffocate a lot of people who are already up to their necks in shit and human sacrificed blood.

This is a very serious business.

But it's also important to maintain a good sense of humour.
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Old 07-07-2007, 03:55 AM   #24
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Originally Posted by titurel View Post
Please bear in mind that in my original post, I deliberately began by stating "if...", as in "If we take religion to mean... then..."

The defintion I gave for religion is dictionary bonafide:

Religion

from Latin re (again) + ligare (to connect)

Re-connection to the divine–from Latin re (again) + ligare (to connect, as in English ligament).
Sorry, still having a problem with your translation, because when I looked up LIGARE, this is what I found:

Quote:



Source
Most other translators didn't even recognize LIGARE as a Latin word.

But you know, I have to agree because religion, according to your choice of Latin word, really does mean IMPRISONMENT, BONDAGE, CAPTIVITY and SERVITUDE.

So, do we go forward with this definition, or do you want to fine tune it any further?
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Old 07-07-2007, 03:55 AM   #25
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I'm still amazed by how delusional people are that they fail to recognize this very simple issue. Religion defined by dictionary (emphasis mine)

a set of beliefs concerning the cause, nature, and purpose of the universe, esp. when considered as the creation of a superhuman agency or agencies, usually involving devotional and ritual observances, and often containing a moral code governing the conduct of human affairs.


According to this definition... EVERYBODY is a religious person. No exceptions.

If you believe that there is no God, you have to naturally believe that we originated by something else that was extra-human cause. If you logically believe that every cause should have an effect and vice versa, then there's some original cause to anything that exists outside of our concieved notion of Time (cause and effect is a time issue). That cause I call God, you call Universal contiousness, evolutionists call chance, and etc.

If you believe that killing humans is wrong as opposed to killing bugs or plants... where do you get that belief? Animals don't think in terms of right and wrong. So you see, you are a moral person guided by moral principles that you ritually abserve. Why do you celebrate your birthday every year... ritually...? If not, why do you not celebrate your birthday every year? (like JWs) Also ritually.

People have this delusion that everything outside of concept of "Church" and "God" is somehow outside of scope of religion. People go to Church because they assume pastors know more than they are, people go to Icke's gatherings because they assume that Icke knows more than they are. Whether you go to church, or go to Icke's gatherings ... you accept the ideas religiously. No-one to this day presented solid evidence of reptilian shape-shifting. I can probably safely assume that you have not seen one. But that does not stop people believing the theory. The except is as a fact. That's what we call faith, bud. Exceptiong things that you can't experience as a fact based on logical assumtions.

So for you to say that religious people are "behind the stone wall", or ignorant... is an ignorant statement in itself. Why? First of all, as I have showed you already, according to definition... you are a religious believer. Secondly, you ignore the evidence presented to you simply because you have a prejudice against anything connected to "Christian God" or "God" for that matter. So to clarify some assumptions for you.

1) Whatever you believe, you believe religiously

2) I happen to believe that there is an intelligent being who exists outside of time, and he chooses not to reveal itself because he wants us to have choice in the matter. Trully loving somebody means that you let them make decisions they want. I respect that. It's a complex issues I would love to completely understand, but this is as closely I can approach and logically explain it. IF God treated you like your parents do ( i.e. you have very little choice in any matter until you are 18 and sometimes way later), then this world would all be " Must love God, or else he will zap me" types.

3) The "rules" are not to keep you from haning fun and enjoying your life. Al contre. It is to bring order in a world. You don't have to be a genious to see that this world, no matter how screwed up it may seem (mainly because of us), is pretty darn well organized. Any attempt to enterfere with this built... and you will have a disaster on your hands. Example... Try not to eat or drink for 5 days. Oh, you can't? Why? Your body functions a certain way. You would not go against rules that your body sets forward. So for everything that you do to go against the natural laws of this world ... I'm not talking about not pissing on the fence (unless it is a fence of an angry neighbour), there are consequences. So jumping from top of the high building does not make much sence. It does not matter how much of an illusion you believe this world it... you will not do it. Why? You have a certain set of rules that you deduce in your mind. Sometimes by observing others, sometimes by observing yourself. So we can assume that there is some kind of moral law, if humans are in fact moral beings. You would not have sex with your mother... like animals do. Why? Why is it when siblings merry each other, their offsprings turn out to be dibelitated? Just few of the questions for you to think about.

4) Bible, compared to any other literature... is written over several thousand of years... and is one of the oldest literature and historical sources we have. It has tremendous insights and wisdom on how this world works, and historical events that preceeded or time, and that will happen in the future. Icke himself is quoting from the book, yet he believes it to be a pile of crap. For those of you who think that it was somehow mistranslated and over the years has been changed... the accidentally discovered Dead Sea scrolls are almost 100% identical to what you find on the shelf in the hotel room (I don't know if they do that kind of thing in Britain or other countries).

5) Bible does not promote the Idea of soul surviving the bodily death, believe it or not. If you pick up and read it and make your own conclusions outside of doctines of Churches... you will find very interesting discreptancies to what the Churches teach today, and what the authors are communicating.
To this day we still don't know what makes us age and die. There's essentially no difference between a dead cell and living cell. We can't make life. Viruses are not living organisms... these are simply shells with DNA strand. So to this day we can not bring living back from the dead. No matter what it is. So the promice of eternal life... is simply put ... a promice that God, who created this world will resurect you if you let him to. He would not want you have something you don't want. And no, he will not let you suffer in "hell" for eternity for simply refusing to believe.


6) Bible authors do not teach Jewish or Christian superiority. Al contre. They teach that you have to treat others how you would expect to be treated. They even go as far as promoting serving others just to set an example. The authors have never expected change of belief system by means of force (unlike Catholic church interperetation).

7) The authors have accuratly predicted, and gave insight on future events (or past, their future) and the events that are going on right now and about to take place. But you have to understand that you can't just pick up Revelation and take it literaly. It uses past events as keys to what will happen in the future. It's pretty complex, and pretty shocking how right on it is. Saying that the Mark of the beast is a microchip is simply trying to conform the allegory to your worldview. Microchip mark of the beast is a diversion IMO. I can elaborate on this more if you would like me to.

8) ALL of the churches of the world do not teach what authors or Jesus taught. They peddle tradition and conformity. In fact, the authors urge you to leave these and engage in meaningful discussions in small groups to find truth. Kind of what we are doing right now. Church is not a building or organisation, Ironically the word that is translated to be church is "Ecclesia".. and it means "Those who has been called out of". So ironically enough, Church are those people who have left the "Chruch" according to the Bible. It is not hard to believe when you see something along these lines : http://www.godhatesfags.com/ . These people take the truth and twist it for control and fear mongering.

9) The authors teach transformation of mind as a key to salvation. Not simply believing... but breaking free from the way this world is controlled and operated by forces behind the scenes. But transformation can begin only when you want it to. It is unlearning process in a way, and then relearning to think differently. God acted in lives of people in past, which was recorded by writers of Old Testament not for the purpoces of creating dogmas... BUT AS EXAMPLES TO US TO LEARN FROM. So transforming the way you think will eventually lead to true freedom. And this is what Christianity is all about IMO. True freedom. Freedom from the bullshit that this world is in right now knee high.

You see, people view God as some parole officer who will lock you up the moment you screw up. God gives you plenty of room for mistakes, because this is the way you learn. BUT... you have to learn from mistakes, and not embrace those. If you embrace those, and think... "Well, I know that what we are doing in Iraq is pretty horrible, but I'm a decider and I will decide what is better. I will find a text in the Bible out of context to back my decision up"... then you don't really want to change, in which case you will ultimately destroy yourself. This is punishment enough.

If you find anything I say illogical or untrue, let me know. I want to seek truth just as any of you here.

Last edited by fccool; 07-07-2007 at 04:08 AM.
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Old 07-07-2007, 04:13 AM   #26
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Sorry, still having a problem with your translation, because when I looked up LIGARE, this is what I found:



Most other translators didn't even recognize LIGARE as a Latin word.

But you know, I have to agree because religion, according to your choice of Latin word, really does mean IMPRISONMENT, BONDAGE, CAPTIVITY and SERVITUDE.

So, do we go forward with this definition, or do you want to fine tune it any further?
I'll fine tune it further...

But in my original post, I did say "if we take religion to mean reconnecting to source"... ... ... "if" being the operative word because I'm familiar with this argument about the Latin meaning of "religion". Different scholars take opposing views about the translation, which is why I used the word "if".

I'm not religious about proving what religion means either way, in respect to it's Latin. I could easily have said, "if we take religion to mean to be passionate about something", and that is the spirit I meant it in.

Of course no one wants to be tied in bondage to something and it's not that kind of religion I was referring to. Any kind of belief can be a religion, so it's important that we examine our beliefs carefully to ensure we have the right religion and one doesn't have to belong to a church or formal organisation and one doesn't even have to label it Christian because that's only a label and the message isn't about labels but having substance and the right beliefs, which of course should always be tested and adjusted if necessary.

Without beliefs there can be no dreams and without dreams and hopes the world is lifeless. Every aspect of the world about us, every part of it, is made up of the dreams and hopes of mankind.

Because people have begun to lose their hopes and forget their dreams, so the Nothing grows stronger. The Nothing is the emptiness that's left; it is like a despair, destroying this world and the Reptilians have been trying to help it because people who have no hopes are easy to control and whoever has the control has the POWER!
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Old 07-07-2007, 04:21 AM   #27
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Without beliefs there can be no dreams and without dreams and hopes the world is lifeless. Every aspect of the world about us, every part of it, is made up of the dreams and hopes of mankind.


Agreed! Belief is something different to religion, however.

What you have described above, is a mild form of quantum thinking, and this is what I believe in. I have the power to change my reality, and I don't need a god to "grant" it to me.

I'm getting tired now, maybe we can pick this up tomorrow.

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Old 07-07-2007, 04:25 AM   #28
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religion
c.1200, "state of life bound by monastic vows," also "conduct indicating a belief in a divine power," from Anglo-Fr. religiun (11c.), from O.Fr. religion "religious community," from L. religionem (nom. religio) "respect for what is sacred, reverence for the gods," in L.L. "monastic life" (5c.); according to Cicero, derived from relegare "go through again, read again," from re- "again" + legere "read" (see lecture). However, popular etymology among the later ancients (and many modern writers) connects it with religare "to bind fast" (see rely), via notion of "place an obligation on," or "bond between humans and gods." Another possible origin is religiens "careful," opposite of negligens. Meaning "particular system of faith" is recorded from c.1300.

"To hold, therefore, that there is no difference in matters of religion between forms that are unlike each other, and even contrary to each other, most clearly leads in the end to the rejection of all religion in both theory and practice. And this is the same thing as atheism, however it may differ from it in name." [Pope Leo XIII, Immortale Dei, 1885]

Modern sense of "recognition of, obedience to, and worship of a higher, unseen power" is from 1535. Religious is first recorded c.1225. Transfered sense of "scrupulous, exact" is recorded from 1599.
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Old 07-07-2007, 04:32 AM   #29
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Belief is something different to religion, however.

According to the OED, even football can be a religion. You seem to want to narrow down the dictionary defintion and block out all other defintions as if they don't exist.

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I have the power to change my reality, and I don't need a god to "grant" it to me.
That's up to you if you want to have that belief... it just happens to coincide with the illuminati's beliefs too...
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Old 07-07-2007, 05:15 AM   #30
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[QUOTE=titurel;71504][/SIZE][/FONT]
According to the OED, even football can be a religion. You seem to want to narrow down the dictionary defintion and block out all other defintions as if they don't exist.

Belief that you yourself can not veriy firsthand can not exist outside of realm of religion. You are unknowingly practicing it without realizing what you are doing. If you live in a country that is run by a form of government... you are practicing a religion. Whether it is by force or voluntarily... does not matter. The only thing that matters is diferentiating between good practices that free you and other ones that enslave you. If higher God indeed exists, and there is much evidence that it does, then he is interested in us being free (you don't see it controlling you every move). So stay free, and appreciate God for creating whatver is around you. That's the way to go for me.
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Old 07-07-2007, 05:27 AM   #31
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That's up to you if you want to have that belief... it just happens to coincide with the illuminati's beliefs too...
And on what do you base that statement?
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Old 07-07-2007, 05:31 AM   #32
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And on what do you base that statement?
The illuminati do not accept God either... do you want evidence of that? Just look at the fruit they bear!
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Old 07-07-2007, 06:04 AM   #33
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The illuminati do not accept God either...

What do you mean? The loomies are the ones pushing religion.

...do you want evidence of that? Just look at the fruit they bear!

Can you be more specific please?
.
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Old 07-07-2007, 06:16 AM   #34
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.
The loomies are pushing a lie. They are prepared to sacrifice human blood on the atlar of their political NWO, and they are enslaving the rest bit by bit in pigeon steps which will culminate in horrid bondage to Mammon, all for their NWO One World False Relgion. They reject God.
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Old 07-07-2007, 06:59 AM   #35
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Absolutely fantastic job everyone, at turning what could have been an excellent thread about David Mayer de Rothschild and the AJ interview into another redundant, irrelevant, egoistic and conclusionless argument about religion and AJ himself. If I weren't any wiser, I would conclude that you all had masters degrees in originality.

You guys are sheep, easily devided by the slightest thing.

WAY TO GO AT PROVING YOURSELVES HYPOCRITES!

Fucking n00bs. If you didn't notice, a Red Shield was on the AJ show. <-------See here. Frankly I don't even know where to start regarding the whole thing, but luckly I don't need to since no one is interested any way.

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Old 07-07-2007, 07:03 AM   #36
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Absolutely fantastic job everyone, at turning what could have been an excellent thread about David Mayer de Rothschild and the AJ interview into another redundant, irrelevant, egoistic and conclusionless argument about religion and AJ himself.
I was thinking the same thing.

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Old 07-07-2007, 07:18 AM   #37
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I want to add one thing: David Mayer de Rothschild is either the very definition of naive, or (most likely) he's a fantastic actor/liar. Either way, this guy is an impenetrable fortress against facts.

This whole thing is weird. I mean if you read the below bio you get the impression that he loves nature and helping the environment--I mean New Zealand for God's sake, that's a great place to live if you're a nature lover. And he's always laughing, shrugging off everything like supermain against bullets. Now to me it's obvious that he can't be naive, and he knows what it's all really about, yet he seems so genuine. My alternative theory is that when he was born, they already had plans for him NOT to turn him cold blooded, and rather they supported him and painted a false picture of the family and the secrets, so that one day he will be 'nature boy' at the forefront of the man-made global warming and taxation thing. In other words, he's being used and doesn't know it. An enemy that everyone likes is very powerful.

I don't know.

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Old 07-07-2007, 07:20 AM   #38
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Absolutely fantastic job everyone, at turning what could have been an excellent thread about David Mayer de Rothschild and the AJ interview into another redundant, irrelevant, egoistic and conclusionless argument about religion and AJ himself. If I weren't any wiser, I would conclude that you all had masters degrees in originality.

You guys are sheep, easily devided by the slightest thing.

WAY TO GO AT PROVING YOURSELVES HYPOCRITES!

Fucking n00bs. If you didn't notice, a Red Shield was on the AJ show. <-------See here. Frankly I don't even know where to start regarding the whole thing, but luckly I don't need to since no one is interested any way.
And you're comments weren't designed to divide further? How ironic! Talk about hypocrits!
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Old 07-07-2007, 07:22 AM   #39
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David Mayer "NWO scum" Rothschild (born 25 August 1978) is a British adventurer and environmentalist who is head of Adventure Ecology, an expedition group raising awareness about climate change. He is the youngest of the three children of Victoria Schott (b. 1949) and Sir Evelyn de Rothschild (b. 1931) of the Rothschild banking family of England.


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Old 07-07-2007, 07:44 AM   #40
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And you're comments weren't designed to divide further? How ironic! Talk about hypocrits!
Nope, they were a punch in the face to wake you up. But hey, I've got an idea, let's argue about it.
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