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Old 26-07-2009, 06:23 PM   #121
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Why don't you tell us how they created these religions?

It's impossible, I mean impossible for them, or any human being to create the religions as we know them, they used them, they mislead people in a certain way by using corrupt priests and Imams, Rabbis, yes, but them creating them.

It is impossible, why don't you tell us how did you come to this conclusion then?
how much do you know about these religions, and what's in them?

You can't just state something you have to have real irrefutable evidence that it's been created by men, there are some religions were created by man or men, but not the 3 Abrahimic religions, sorry.

there are things that no human being could know, there are tons of evidence, people nowdays follow what they think it's the cause of all problems.

Let me ask you a question then.

We know people fight for land, oil, money, gold and so on..
should we stop using them then?
because the truth is that is the real motivation of these evil doers, it's all about money, power, control, and wealth.
you're still using money
if you have enough money I am sure you will buy land and gold
if someone offers you an oil well you wouldn't say no, would you?

So why when it's religion it's easy to just reject it and think it's the source of all our problems?
Not very wise my friend.
Why is this impossible? Granted not once did I use the word human beings or homo sapien, but I'll entertain the argument at least. How is it impossible for the Abrahamic religions to have been created by human beings?

You make very large assumptions concerning my personal motivations and beliefs. I would have no issue at all with us completely removing the concept of money or economics from this planet, accross all cultures.

Do you think that wars are truely fought for land, oil, money and gold? I have some real estate I'll sell to you at an amazing price. If you truely believe that I have to ask if you also believe: US presidents are elected by the poeple, and Muslim terrorist flew planes into the twin towers.

Wars are fought to regulate populations (this is a very small part of it), to create certain thought patterns in both those in the region and humanity as a whole, to create post-war political changes, and to create a violent blood sacrifice ritual to harvest the energy of those slain in war. War is a religious sacrificial ritual my friend. All wars are.
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Old 26-07-2009, 06:31 PM   #122
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No you're wrong mate I have no interest in turning it into a racial issue, that doesn't mean other true Jews are not init either.
I am talking about this family.

Now we need to make one thing clear, anyone who converts to Judaism is a Jew.
Jewry is not a race, yes they come from a Jewish family.
But if you're saying that these guys are Hebrews you're definitely wrong mate.

the Hebrews have a different look, middle eastern look or even black, but not white caucasian look.

These guys are definitely from the Khazar empire originally and originated from Germany in the 16th century.

They are bavarian Jews.
And they only believe in power, Satan, lucifer and so on, they couldn't give a monkeys about other religions, as they know those religions are against them.

That's all I had to say, not turning anything into a racial debate at all.
i think they're descended from a greek jew who was recognized as the messiah in the 17th century.

there is a striking physical resemblance, and they're acting exactly as if they were the messianic bloodline.

---

Sabbatai Zevi was born in Smyrna on (supposedly) 9th Av 1626 (a Sabbath), and died, according to some, on Yom Kippur, September 30, 1676, in Dulcigno, a small town in the coastal region of Montenegro, now called Ulcinj. Zevi's family were Romaniotes from Patras; his father, Mordecai, was a poor poultry dealer in the Morea. Later, when in consequence of the war between Turkey and Venice under the Sultan Ibrahim I, Smyrna became the center of Levantine trade, Mordecai became the Smyrnan agent of an English house. As a consequence, he acquired considerable wealth.


The Romaniotes or Romaniots (Greek: Ρωμανιῶτες, Rōmaniōtes) are a Jewish population who have lived in the territory of today's Greece and neighboring areas with large Greek populations for more than 2,000 years. Their language is Greek and they derive their name from the old name for the people of the Byzantine Empire, Rhomaioi. Large communities were located in Thebes, Ioannina, Chalcis, Corfu, Arta, Corinth and on the islands of Lesbos, Chios, Samos, Rhodes and Cyprus, among others. The Romaniotes are historically distinct from the Sephardim, who settled in Greece after the 1492 expulsion of the Jews from Spain.

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Old 26-07-2009, 06:32 PM   #123
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This may well be the case, I'm really not sure as I haven't thoroughly studied Judaism and I don't personally know anyone who is Jewish. I'd be interested to read more about that. Do you have any references you can cite for that claim?

Here's another passage I found on the subject:
In Orthodox Judaism, the Oral Torah [Talmud] is accepted as equally sacred, inspired, and authoritative as the Written Torah [Tanakh]. One of the aims of Orthodox Judaism in Israel is to establish Talmudic law as the state law of Israel. Elsewhere in the world, Orthodox Jews submit themselves voluntarily to Talmudic law and the rabbinic court system, especially in matters of dietary and ritual law, marriage and divorce, and social work.

The Talmud also plays an important role in Conservative Judaism, although it is viewed as an evolutionary process that changes with the times. Both professional and lay Talmudic scholarship is dedicated to determining the proper response to modern issues by intensive study of the Talmud. Reform Judaism officially rejects the Talmud as an entirely human invention reflecting medieval thought and values.
http://www.religionfacts.com/judaism/texts/talmud.htm
I'm not sure about other nations but Reform Judaism is the largest sect in the US and make up 42% of American Jews, while Orthodox are 7%. So the largest sect of American Jews rejects the Talmud. Other groups have various views on it, but only the Orthodox fully embrace it. It most definately is not the primary religious text of Judaism. The Torah is considered by most Jews to be the primary religious text.
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Old 26-07-2009, 06:36 PM   #124
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I'm not sure about other nations but Reform Judaism is the largest sect in the US and make up 42% of American Jews, while Orthodox are 7%. So the largest sect of American Jews rejects the Talmud. Other groups have various views on it, but only the Orthodox fully embrace it. It most definately is not the primary religious text of Judaism. The Torah is considered by most Jews to be the primary religious text.
so there are many religious jews that don't read the talmud, but still think they are god's chosen people.

if your claims are correct, of course.

what does it mean to be "god's chosen"? what does the old testament say about non-jews?
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Old 26-07-2009, 06:47 PM   #125
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i took a look at the wiki page on reform judaism: many words but little substance.

yes, they want to mantain their jewish identity, but i don't understand on what basis.
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Old 26-07-2009, 06:48 PM   #126
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so there are many religious jews that don't read the talmud, but still think they are god's chosen people.

if your claims are correct, of course.

what does it mean to be "god's chosen"? what does the old testament say about non-jews?
That is another argument entirely. My arguement was that Zionism is not based on the Talmud and the Talmud is not the primary religious work of Judaism. I was simply correcting gross factual errors commonly spouted as truth in the conspiracy world. Not once have I said Judaism, or any religion, is kind and benevolent, good to join, or that any god should be worshipped. Anyone who knows me knows better.

I spend very little of my time worrying about who YHVH's chosen people might or might not be. He is just another ascended old one to me, like every other being seeking the worship of humans pretending to be a god. If I had my way, all of the "gods" would fall under my blade.

Honestly those who take all of these text literally do not understand them anyways. They have entirely different interpretations of the religious text within the inner circles of the bloodlines, than what is fed to the masses. I've explained a little bit of this in other threads in the past, of the encoding means in some of the works, which only angered the religious members here. They are all allegorical stories with encoded history for the initiated to read and pass down.
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Old 26-07-2009, 06:50 PM   #127
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i took a look at the wiki page on reform judaism: many words but little substance.

yes, they want to mantain their jewish identity, but i don't understand on what basis.
Inter- marriage same as many Muslims keeping the bloodlines "race" pure (true geneticists/eugenicists) like the Hindus. Been at it for thousands of years.
Orthodox Jews in particular (in London)
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Old 26-07-2009, 07:02 PM   #128
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That is another argument entirely. My arguement was that Zionism is not based on the Talmud and the Talmud is not the primary religious work of Judaism. I was simply correcting gross factual errors commonly spouted as truth in the conspiracy world. Not once have I said Judaism, or any religion, is kind and benevolent, good to join, or that any god should be worshipped. Anyone who knows me knows better.

I spend very little of my time worrying about who YHVH's chosen people might or might not be. He is just another ascended old one to me, like every other being seeking the worship of humans pretending to be a god. If I had my way, all of the "gods" would fall under my blade.

Honestly those who take all of these text literally do not understand them anyways. They have entirely different interpretations of the religious text within the inner circles of the bloodlines, than what is fed to the masses. I've explained a little bit of this in other threads in the past, of the encoding means in some of the works, which only angered the religious members here. They are all allegorical stories with encoded history for the initiated to read and pass down.
are you sure that reform judaism has a wider diffusion than talmudic judaism?

what are the religious texts and principles of "reform judaism"? are there any, really?

is there a relevant difference between the supremacist doctrine of the talmud and zionism?

orthodox judaism is perfectly integrated in israel, and plays a crucial role.

wiki says that reform judaism in the u.s. has strong ties with israel, this is an important information.
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Old 26-07-2009, 07:04 PM   #129
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i think they're descended from a greek jew who was recognized as the messiah in the 17th century.

there is a striking physical resemblance, and they're acting exactly as if they were the messianic bloodline.

---

Sabbatai Zevi was born in Smyrna on (supposedly) 9th Av 1626 (a Sabbath), and died, according to some, on Yom Kippur, September 30, 1676, in Dulcigno, a small town in the coastal region of Montenegro, now called Ulcinj. Zevi's family were Romaniotes from Patras; his father, Mordecai, was a poor poultry dealer in the Morea. Later, when in consequence of the war between Turkey and Venice under the Sultan Ibrahim I, Smyrna became the center of Levantine trade, Mordecai became the Smyrnan agent of an English house. As a consequence, he acquired considerable wealth.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sabbatai_Zevi

The Romaniotes or Romaniots (Greek: Ρωμανιῶτες, Rōmaniōtes) are a Jewish population who have lived in the territory of today's Greece and neighboring areas with large Greek populations for more than 2,000 years. Their language is Greek and they derive their name from the old name for the people of the Byzantine Empire, Rhomaioi. Large communities were located in Thebes, Ioannina, Chalcis, Corfu, Arta, Corinth and on the islands of Lesbos, Chios, Samos, Rhodes and Cyprus, among others. The Romaniotes are historically distinct from the Sephardim, who settled in Greece after the 1492 expulsion of the Jews from Spain.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romaniotes
great post.
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Old 26-07-2009, 07:06 PM   #130
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I'm not sure about other nations but Reform Judaism is the largest sect in the US and make up 42% of American Jews, while Orthodox are 7%. So the largest sect of American Jews rejects the Talmud. Other groups have various views on it, but only the Orthodox fully embrace it. It most definately is not the primary religious text of Judaism. The Torah is considered by most Jews to be the primary religious text.
It is true that Reform Judaism does not view the Talmud as normative (it was my misunderstanding that this position was limited to the Karaites):
Working through the , German reformers were deeply engaged in the historical-critical study of the Bible and . They argued that the and often contradicts the literal meaning of the , and that these texts also contained outdated ritual practices and values that were contrary to Enlightenment ideals of reason. Based on these and other arguments, early Reformers felt that (traditional Jewish law), which they regarded as merely exegetical interpretation of the Torah by the rabbis of the Mishna and the later Talmudic Rabbis, as well as the aforementioned parts of the Torah, were never normative and should not be taken as such. (Source)
With the rise of Reform Judaism, during the nineteenth century, the authority of the Talmud was again questioned. The Talmud was seen by Reform Jews as a product of late antiquity having relevance merely as a historical document. In some cases a similar view was taken of the written law as well, while others appeared to adopt a neo- "back to the Bible" approach, though often with greater emphasis on the prophetic than on the legal books... does not emphasize the study of Talmud to the same degree in their Hebrew schools, but they do teach it in their rabbinical seminaries; the world view of liberal Judaism rejects the idea of binding , and uses the Talmud as a source of inspiration and moral instruction. Ownership and reading of the Talmud is not widespread among Reform and Jews, who usually place more emphasis on the study of the Hebrew Bible or . (Source)
However, is and for the last 1500 years has been the dominant form of Judaism, and the Talmud is viewed by Rabbinic Judaism as being on a par with the Torah.

Furthermore, the acceptance or rejection of the Talmud appears to have no bearing on whether a particular Jewish movement is pro- or anti-Zionism, as both Reform and Orthodox Jews are mostly pro-Zionist:
Reform, Liberal and Progressive Judaism hold strong beliefs in Israel and much of its . As a result of these beliefs, the movement has developed a range of practices that reflect both religious and political interest in Israel.

Historically, however, the reform movement did not support Zionism, a nationalist movement which emerged around the same time that German reform and liberal Judaism grew institutionally. In the 19th century and the first half of the 20th century, Reform Judaism rejected the idea that Jews would re-create a Jewish state in their ancestral homeland. They rejected the idea that there would ever be a personal , and that the would ever be rebuilt, or that one day animal sacrifices would be re-established in a rebuilt Temple, in accord with a traditional, literal interpretation of the ...

Since and the establishment of the modern , Reform Judaism has largely repudiated Anti-Zionism, and the official platform of Reform Judaism is . There are now many Reform Jews who have chosen to make aliyah (move to Israel), and there are several kibbutzim affiliated with the Israeli Reform movement. The Reform movement also sends hundreds of its youth and college-age students to Israel every year on summer and year-long programs.
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_...el_and_Zionism

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Old 26-07-2009, 07:29 PM   #131
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Why is this impossible? Granted not once did I use the word human beings or homo sapien, but I'll entertain the argument at least. How is it impossible for the Abrahamic religions to have been created by human beings?
Of course I will assume it's human beings, you said the PTB created the religions, didn't you?
It is impossible because of the content, what's in the sprituality, wisdom, and scientif evidence too.

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You make very large assumptions concerning my personal motivations and beliefs. I would have no issue at all with us completely removing the concept of money or economics from this planet, accross all cultures.
Yes but you didn't refrain from using it like you refrained from rejecting religion, that was my point, whether you agree with the monetary system or not that's an entirely different issue
I wasn't making any assumption, only because I know in order to exist and live you need to use the money and so on. and also I haven't heard anyone wanting to boycott the money, gold, oil and so on.

btw it was not personal, just in general people are very quick to blame everything on religion, but they are quite happy to continue with their lives as usual.

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Do you think that wars are truely fought for land, oil, money and gold? I have some real estate I'll sell to you at an amazing price. If you truely believe that I have to ask if you also believe: US presidents are elected by the poeple, and Muslim terrorist flew planes into the twin towers.
No I do not believe that wars are fought for oil and land, I believe wars are fought for domination and power, but wars are financed by gold, money and oil.

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Wars are fought to regulate populations (this is a very small part of it), to create certain thought patterns in both those in the region and humanity as a whole, to create post-war political changes, and to create a violent blood sacrifice ritual to harvest the energy of those slain in war. War is a religious sacrificial ritual my friend. All wars are.
in two words it's for domination of humanity, I never thought wars were fought for anything I mentioned above, what I was referring to was what most people believe and the hypocrisy behind it. not my personal beliefs of why wars have been fought.
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Old 26-07-2009, 07:34 PM   #132
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Of course I will assume it's human beings, you said the PTB created the religions, didn't you?
It is impossible because if the content, what's in the sprituality, wisdom, and scientif evidence too.


Yes but you didn't refrain from using it like you refrained from rejecting religion, that was my point, whether you agree with the monetary system or not that's an entirely different issue
I wasn't making any assumption, only because I know in order to exist and live you need to use the money and so on. and also I haven't heard anyone wanting to boycott the money, gold, oil and so on.

btw it was not personal, just in general people are very quick to blame everything on religion, but they are quite happy to continue with their lives as usual.



No I do not believe that wars are fought for oil and land, I believe wars are fought for domination and power, but wars are financed by gold, money and oil.



in two words it's for domination of humanity, I never thought wars were fought for anything I mentioned above, what I was referring to was what most people believe and the hypocrisy behind it. not my personal beliefs of why wars have been fought.
good points
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Old 26-07-2009, 07:36 PM   #133
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Inter- marriage same as many Muslims keeping the bloodlines "race" pure (true geneticists/eugenicists) like the Hindus. Been at it for thousands of years.
Orthodox Jews in particular (in London)
You are the biggest bullshitter on the planet you talk from your backside, you have no idea what you're talking about.

How can Muslims keep a bloodline you ignorant??
Is it a race?
since when Islam is a race in order to keep the bloodline?

so a white British Muslim marrying an Asian Muslim girl is to keep bloodline?

Do you actually happen to think before typing anything or do you let your finger 10 secondes ahead of your brains?

Stop the BS please educate yourself a little.
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Old 26-07-2009, 07:46 PM   #134
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Of course I will assume it's human beings, you said the PTB created the religions, didn't you?
It is impossible because if the content, what's in the sprituality, wisdom, and scientif evidence too.


Yes but you didn't refrain from using it like you refrained from rejecting religion, that was my point, whether you agree with the monetary system or not that's an entirely different issue
I wasn't making any assumption, only because I know in order to exist and live you need to use the money and so on. and also I haven't heard anyone wanting to boycott the money, gold, oil and so on.

btw it was not personal, just in general people are very quick to blame everything on religion, but they are quite happy to continue with their lives as usual.



No I do not believe that wars are fought for oil and land, I believe wars are fought for domination and power, but wars are financed by gold, money and oil.



in two words it's for domination of humanity, I never thought wars were fought for anything I mentioned above, what I was referring to was what most people believe and the hypocrisy behind it. not my personal beliefs of why wars have been fought.
Oh no I do not blame religion per se. I blame those behind the religions. Likewise though I don't see any merit or beneft aligning myself with something that I know the history of, how it is used and can see on the "grid" (a phrase I use for the background program and energy field here) the connections and energy transfers it forms. It is not a case of throwing out the baby with the bathwater, but rather a case of the two being so merged that is it impossible to completely sperate them through any means available. Due to the connections it forms with specific entities it is an all or nothing affair on some levels. That is the unfortunate aspect of trying to explain some of these things with people on forums. The greater majority lack both the genetics and the formal training to see certain things or into the grid, so for me something is as obvious as the tree you see in your front yard when you look outside the window. How do you explain the evidence that the leaves on that tree are green to someone who is blind and has never seen a tree let alone the color green, in this incarnation? Anyone who is capable of seeing the connections can quite plainly see the harnessing of energy and the transaction that takes place as a result of religious worship. No explination needed. If they cannot see this, there is no way in which to explain it. Let's just say, do as you will, but me I know better and wash my hands of it. ;-)

Domination of humanity is only one aspect of war. The harnessing of energy is equally important to the motivations behind it.
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Old 26-07-2009, 07:56 PM   #135
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You are the biggest bullshitter on the planet you talk from your backside, you have no idea what you're talking about.

How can Muslims keep a bloodline you ignorant??
Is it a race?
since when Islam is a race in order to keep the bloodline?

so a white British Muslim marrying an Asian Muslim girl is to keep bloodline?

Do you actually happen to think before typing anything or do you let your finger 10 secondes ahead of your brains?

Stop the BS please educate yourself a little.

I just told you the truth and as usual you can't handle it, so have to resort to name calling (as usual)
Are you denying that arranged marriages take place based on status in society? (blood lines) Who has the most money?

Elite bloodlines, that's one reason they interbreed, to keep the bloodlines pure. That's why Islamic society you got the same goons running the show and nothing changes.

Some Muslims marry their own cousins - fact,
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Old 26-07-2009, 08:10 PM   #136
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I just told you the truth and as usual you can't handle it, so have to resort to name calling (as usual)
Are you denying that arranged marriages take place based on status in society? (blood lines) Who has the most money?

Elite bloodlines, that's one reason they interbreed, to keep the bloodlines pure. That's why Islamic society you got the same goons running the show and nothing changes.

Some Muslims marry their own cousins - fact,
Is this your truth?

Some Asians marry their own, has nothing to do with Islam, nothing, if anything it's against Islam's teachings, then next time use your words appropriately, don't mix Asians, or cultural dogma.

I have two friends who wanted to marry two Muslim Asians, and my two friends are Muslims too, and their families didn't want to.
One was a black Muslim and the other was a white English Muslim.

It has nothing whatsoever to do with Islam, it's some idiots who want to keep marriage between them.
End of story, so your truth is actually half truth.
And arranged marriage has nothing to do with religion at all, it has to do with culture
try and make a clear distinction between the two and my advice to you, don't judge religion by what people do.

I will give you this example again:

Highway code is there to protect all of us, it's not the highway code's fault if some morons drive like lunatics and cause accidents.
So the highway code is Islam, and the drivers are Muslims.
end of story.
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Old 26-07-2009, 11:18 PM   #137
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Do you really think after WWI Germany was able to create such a vast and immense war machine without some serious money injections? .
Because they kicked out the International bankers they did not need any external money injections, they created the war machine with their own labour and ingenuity. Don't forget the world was in recession from 1933, by 1936 while other major economies were still struggling Germany had fully recovered and was in full employment due to the simple fact that they were free from the international finance system.

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Old 26-07-2009, 11:20 PM   #138
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The Talmud gets mentioned commonly in association with Judaism and Zionism by those in the conspiracy world. Have those making this association actually researched to find out which branches of Judaism actually use the Talmud? .
The Talmud is Judaism. Some will deny knowledge of it but they are lying.

Quote:
The Torah is the holy book of Judaism
The Torah is the First 5 books of the bible, the Talmud and the Midrash.

So by definition if they follow the Torah then they follow the Talmud.

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Old 27-07-2009, 06:50 AM   #139
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The Talmud is Judaism. Some will deny knowledge of it but they are lying.



The Torah is the First 5 books of the bible, the Talmud and the Midrash.

So by definition if they follow the Torah then they follow the Talmud.
correct, as far as i know.

"reform judaism" looks like a secular organization disguised a religious sect.

no definite religious ideas, strong ties with the zionist entity.

israeli policies are deeply influenced by orthodox judaism.
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Old 27-07-2009, 06:55 AM   #140
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great post.
check out this link, it still works sometimes:

http://www.geocities.com/cliff_shack...othschild.html

i'm going to save all those pictures, and upload them somewhere.

shack's discovery is too important, if he's correct it would explain many things.
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