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Old 05-06-2014, 09:43 AM   #181
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This is a picture taken from the story i found online, and read this afternoon. A bunch of toys come to life on Christmas night, and get up to mischief. It's a delightful story. Of it's time, of course. I've got collection of old 40's comics and cartoon, that have to have disclaimers pointing out the racism (even in bugs bunnies.) the usual line is, it would be worst to cut this sort of racism out, because it would be like the racism never existed. That would be just as bad.
Aww, it's so charming, look at the caricatured black 'doll'. Awwwwww. Can I have one? So, can we have a storybook about Jimmy Savile? He can be dressed as Santa.

You're trying very hard to rewrite history. Feel free to enjoy your racism relics; but please don't try to pretend that they were never racist. Anyone would think that black slavery and the past/present racism against them never existed.
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Old 05-06-2014, 09:46 AM   #182
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Golliwog and accurately depicted native black people. Golliwog is therefore a Minstrel Doll, and not just Miss Upton's caricature of all black people.

What is the context of the picture? What website is it from?
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Old 05-06-2014, 09:46 AM   #183
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Even the natives aren't that racist, alowing for time, obviously.....
What do you mean?
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Old 05-06-2014, 09:47 AM   #184
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Yes. He quite clearly a black (the colour, not the skin type.) gnome....
Yes, caricatures of blacks, modelled on minstrels, who enacted and depicted blacks negatively.
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Old 05-06-2014, 09:48 AM   #185
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I know this is derailing the thread somewhat, but what is going on in that picture!?

I looks like an axe of the left and a severed head by a pool of blood on the right!

And is that on old pistol in the middle?
Well, until zephiloyd says where he got the picture from i.e. what website, and what the context of the pic is, we will not know.

I've seen some fucked up drawings and 'art' in my time, so information about its context is everything.
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Old 05-06-2014, 09:54 AM   #186
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The Golliwog was created during a racist era. He was drawn as a caricature of a minstrel -- which itself represented a demeaning image of blacks. There is racial stereotyping of black people in Florence Upton's books, including The Adventures of Two Dutch Dolls -- such as the black minstrel playing a banjo on page 45. It appears that the Golliwog was another expression of Upton's racial insensitivity. Certainly later Golliwogs often reflected negative beliefs about blacks -- thieves, miscreants, incompetents. There is little doubt that the words associated with Golliwog -- Golly, Golli, Wog, and Golliwog, itself -- are often used as racial slurs. Finally, the resurgence of interest in the Golliwog is not found primarily among children, but instead is found among adults, some nostalgic, others with financial interests.
http://www.ferris.edu/jimcrow/golliwog/
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Old 05-06-2014, 09:57 AM   #187
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Well, until zephiloyd says where he got the picture from i.e. what website, and what the context of the pic is, we will not know.

I've seen some fucked up drawings and 'art' in my time, so information about its context is everything.
Tineye found one match for that image and the page that came up has the same image url as the one posted here; so it's either this site or one where someone is linking to the image from this blog.

http://usslave.blogspot.ca/2011/04/s...-golliwog.html
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Old 05-06-2014, 10:56 AM   #188
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Tineye found one match for that image and the page that came up has the same image url as the one posted here; so it's either this site or one where someone is linking to the image from this blog.

http://usslave.blogspot.ca/2011/04/s...-golliwog.html
I can't tell what the scribble on the bottom of the pic says. I don't know who drew it. There is no information given on that website/blog about the pic. Another website, the one in my last post, has the same info, but minus the ghastly images.

None of these drawings are accurate, or even logical. They're drawing minstrel-inspired freak 'dolls', and the minstrels themselves mocked blacks. At the time of this all coming about (Florence Upton's racist shite books/drawings), there was intense racism. It was the time of empire.

Not sure why these pics have a place, other than to try to pretend that because they're a drawing, they're therefore 'art' and therefore have great meaning or significance. People can have them, post them, look at them, try to figure out some magical, deep, mystical meaning. LOL, it's not there. Some people have the old "Whites only" signs....is there a deep meaning in it? Some kind of poignance or art about them?

It says in the blog/article:

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For the next fourteen years, Bertha and Florence Upton created twelve more books featuring the Golliwogg and his adventures, traveling to such "exotic" places as Africa and the North Pole, accompanied by his friends, the Dutch Dolls.
Is it possible that the stupid pic is an image of the ugly 'doll' and the two Dutch dolls in Africa? I don't know who drew them, and where they come from. I'll assume they were drawn by the talentless racist Florence Upton. The 'natives' had an axe? They had multi-coloured skirts? They resemble the ugly golliwog, who was modelled on the racist minstrels-phenomenon - see the exaggerated lips, goggle-eyes, big hair. It's not like black people have proportionate faces; they're just all big, fat lips, big goggle eyes, big hair. Yup, that's blacks for you.
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Old 05-06-2014, 11:05 AM   #189
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This looks great, 2 political incorrect concepts in one


Last edited by zephiloyd; 05-06-2014 at 11:06 AM.
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Old 05-06-2014, 11:10 AM   #190
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This looks great, 2 political incorrect concepts in one

How does it look great?
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Old 05-06-2014, 11:12 AM   #191
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She was obviously anti-vegetable too

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Old 05-06-2014, 11:13 AM   #192
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How does it look great?
because it upsets the politically correct
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Old 05-06-2014, 11:19 AM   #193
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Apparently the golliwogg preceded the goliwog. A golliwogg was first some kind of wogg it seems, a gnome, with a good character, who nonetheless seemed to exist and dress in a way that could be construed as erm cotton pickin'!

We connect with good brands and we connected with Robertsons' golliwog later branding in a good way. Unless some racist irony was intended that I missed? I suppose Robertson's interpretation did relegate golli from magical gnome to African American minimum wage cook, and Enid's version, well Enid went a tad BNP possibly.

He was as cool as a Mash makes Smash alien robot.

Last edited by Mr Happy; 05-06-2014 at 11:27 AM.
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Old 05-06-2014, 11:22 AM   #194
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I know this is derailing the thread somewhat, but what is going on in that picture!?

I looks like an axe of the left and a severed head by a pool of blood on the right!

And is that on old pistol in the middle?
"Golliwogg in the African Jungle" is the thirteenth and final of Florence Upton's Golliwogg books.

The story, told in rhyme and beautifully illustrated, follows the the adventures of Golliwogg and the Dutch Dolls as they go on safari in East Africa.

Their quest to obtain animals for their "Wonder Zoo" finds them taking the train, setting up their tent in the jungle helped by their black attendants (Kooloo and Kamba), meeting up with a lion, and then politely asking the other wild animals (giraffe, baboon, elephant, rhinoceros, etc.) if they would join their zoo.

As they stop to refresh themselves at a pond they are attacked by a tribe of African cannibals! The famous Russian-American author Vladimir Nabokov recalled reading this particular scene by saying, “Over the shoulder of my past I admire again the crucial picture: the Golliwogg, still on his knees by the pool but no longer drinking; his hair stands on end and the normal black of his face has changed to a weird ashen hue.”

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Old 05-06-2014, 11:31 AM   #195
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It would appear that racist people, and people who want to hold onto or promote racist relics, are not willing to study or learn about past history. It appears that it is more important to rebel for the sake of rebellion, rather than to consider how or why it is that the actions of the elites, the citizens who benefited from them, and the ghastly colonial missions, are a real pain for the majority of the world's population. It would appear that any criticism of barbaric past and present behaviours designed to incite racism, hatred, division and ugliness in society, is dismissed as more nonsense from "pc brigades, do gooders, lefties" and so on.

Slaves, blacks, immigrants, disabled, unemployed, sick.....they're the "others" of our time, and history. They're the ones who aren't even human. They were and are nothing more than inconveniences in our history, but oddly the first three groups were very important in the creation of the mega-empire. Someone had to actually do the work, and get paid zero, right? Or did the plantations plant themselves? The factories worked themselves? The ships loaded and unloaded themselves? The shite produced by the empire was bought by themselves, or the colonies? And so on. There's this delusion that Britain was 'great'. Yes it had a glorious few super rich cunts, who taught their underlings to be racist, mean, and to love war. They've been teaching the population that they make the rules and that people must sit back and accept it, for ages. But even within the great underclass, the delusion persists for some, that they're better than others. And that others do not matter.

http://www.britishempire.co.uk/article/liverpool.htm

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That the legacies of empire are far reaching can be seen only too clearly in places like Ireland, Africa, India and much of the Middle East at this present time. It is when racism and prejudice are broached, that the Empire seems to come into its own; Ireland was the first serious attempt by the British Crown and Parliament, to begin a process of English colonisation, whose colonists would then take over the 'wilderness' of Ireland and use the land more profitably. The Irish were treated like the native 'Indians' a little later in America, as being 'in the way', nomads who were uncivilised, and, more importantly, who did not utilise, and particularly, did not 'own' the land they wandered. This is an important point to understand, and much rests on this 'belief', both in Ireland, America and much later Africa and other nations. The inference being, in English and British mindsets, that because nobody 'owned' the land, it was up for grabs. A simple point, but much laboured, and was the intellectual argument for such colonialism. The Englishman was a gentleman, the Irishman, and henceforth many other nationalities, was an uncivilised and uncultured brute. This 'excuse', compounded with other often faulty reasoning and intellectualising, was the reason why Englishmen sought to establish colonies that would make them enormous profits, buy themselves into the gentry, win fame and glory, and establish their names. Such ideas of civilisation and 'gentlemanliness' being used to excuse ethnic cleansing, land grabbing, slavery and untold injustices have their reflections in most if not all empires, and are seen clearest in the 'nazification' of early 20th century Germany; when notions of superior and inferior excused the most barbarous and evil of practises.

Africa only really became a serious issue to the Empire at the end of the 19th century, but for centuries prior to this, was a source of wealth for Britain and Europe, primarily because of the slave trade, but also as a market for European goods, and as another outpost of European colonialism from the early 1600's. According to Iggy Kim and Peter Boyle, in their article How the rich invented racism, racism has its historical roots in the development of capitalism. Slaves could be purchased cheaply and brought in unlimited numbers from Africa. In the racist mode of reasoning, the next logical step was to conclude that, somehow, blacks must have been "naturally" inferior to whites. Two other factors assisted the advance of racist ideas in the 19th century: the expansion of European capitalism to include huge colonial empires in Asia and Africa, and the development of early theories of human evolution. Gross manipulation of the latter helped justify the new global oppressive relations of imperialism.

Ports like Liverpool, Bristol, Cardiff and Glasgow, amongst no doubt many others, grew rich and powerful as a result of this trade, allowing merchants to expand, bankers to grow wealthy, companies to prosper, and many individuals to make more money than they knew what to do with; it was indeed a profitable trade, and also, more and more, a trade that is hidden from history. It is no exaggeration to say that the slave trade, and the profits it created, helped cement the emergence of Capitalism, Britain's pre-eminence as a world empire, the beginnings of Britain's industrialisation, and the creation of a class of capitalists with untold wealth and power at their fingertips. Such unequal relations of wealth and power, creating vast divisions in Britain and around the world, would become uncomfortable realities for many people, and sooner or later would be justified or explained away in high-blown intellectual and scientific terms.

Desmond Kuah, of the National University of Singapore, writes that by the middle of the nineteenth century, the British Empire was the largest and richest empire in the world. This naturally gave rise to the belief that the British themselves were the chosen race chosen to bring the benefits of western civilization to the backward areas of the world. With India's conquest, in ways militarily, economic, social, ethnic and even religious, came then, as with other dominions, justifications and intellectual reasoning about British, and White European, 'natural' superiority and the 'natural' inferiority of conquered people's around the world.

In understanding and accepting the real reasons for empire, then a better understanding can be made of seeing the inherent divisions within the imperial system, and how racist and classist propaganda, to name but two, was heaped on top of centuries of brutal, merciless and systematic injustice for one real purpose, to make capital gain.

Anthony S. Wohl, Professor of History at Vassar College writes that during the nineteenth century theories of race were advanced both by the scientific community and in the popular daily and periodical press. In his article The Function of Racism in Victorian England Professor Wohl goes on to argue that "to denigrate or point up the bestial, brute, savage nature of an outside group is to point up our own advanced state and protect ourselves against inner fears or tensions. Racism and class prejudice, in other words, not only serve as agents of political power, but also serve as buffers between a community and a nature that seems to be getting too close to it for psychological comfort."

Social Class ideas in Britain followed many of the arguments that racist classifications did, and were equally pored over by scientists and social theorists. In Britain, class became an issue by the early 19th century. These classes were identifiable groups, and were most notably understood in terms of inequalities in wealth, social power, political power, life expectancy, living conditions, types of job and so on. Race and Class often overlapped, as the Irish would be seen as inferior both racially and in terms of their low-social status. David Cody, Associate Professor of English, Hartwick College argues that early in the nineteenth century the labels "working classes" and "middle classes" were already coming into common usage. The old hereditary aristocracy, reinforced by the new gentry who owed their success to commerce, industry, and the professions, evolved into an "upper class". Beneath the industrial workers was a submerged "under class" which lived in poverty. It could be argued that in some cases, this structure is still viable even today.
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Old 05-06-2014, 11:31 AM   #196
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"Golliwogg in the African Jungle" is the thirteenth and final of Florence Upton's Golliwogg books.

The story, told in rhyme and beautifully illustrated, follows the the adventures of Golliwogg and the Dutch Dolls as they go on safari in East Africa.

Their quest to obtain animals for their "Wonder Zoo" finds them taking the train, setting up their tent in the jungle helped by their black attendants (Kooloo and Kamba), meeting up with a lion, and then politely asking the other wild animals (giraffe, baboon, elephant, rhinoceros, etc.) if they would join their zoo.

As they stop to refresh themselves at a pond they are attacked by a tribe of African cannibals! The famous Russian-American author Vladimir Nabokov recalled reading this particular scene by saying, “Over the shoulder of my past I admire again the crucial picture: the Golliwogg, still on his knees by the pool but no longer drinking; his hair stands on end and the normal black of his face has changed to a weird ashen hue.”

Ahh, thanks for that.

While I also find the content questionable it is well illustrated. We can only guess at Upton's motives, and I'd side with naivety rather than malice. That said I don't think it has a place in the modern world outside of an historical interest.
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Old 05-06-2014, 11:32 AM   #197
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Originally Posted by zephiloyd View Post
"Golliwogg in the African Jungle" is the thirteenth and final of Florence Upton's Golliwogg books.

The story, told in rhyme and beautifully illustrated, follows the the adventures of Golliwogg and the Dutch Dolls as they go on safari in East Africa.

Their quest to obtain animals for their "Wonder Zoo" finds them taking the train, setting up their tent in the jungle helped by their black attendants (Kooloo and Kamba), meeting up with a lion, and then politely asking the other wild animals (giraffe, baboon, elephant, rhinoceros, etc.) if they would join their zoo.

As they stop to refresh themselves at a pond they are attacked by a tribe of African cannibals! The famous Russian-American author Vladimir Nabokov recalled reading this particular scene by saying, “Over the shoulder of my past I admire again the crucial picture: the Golliwogg, still on his knees by the pool but no longer drinking; his hair stands on end and the normal black of his face has changed to a weird ashen hue.”

That's is racist. But the gollywogs the least racist part of that.....
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Old 05-06-2014, 11:34 AM   #198
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yes it is a gun

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Old 05-06-2014, 11:35 AM   #199
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because it upsets the politically correct
Why I can't seem to get across to tildatod, context is everything. It's a product of it's time. An whilst it looks a bit dodgy now, that wasn't it's intent.....
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Old 05-06-2014, 11:36 AM   #200
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That's is racist. But the gollywogs the least racist part of that.....
It is not racist, African tribes looked like that
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