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Old 11-05-2016, 11:11 AM   #41
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I agree a little with blythe, because it's true that we live in complex societis and at the same time humans are not social animals, at least not completly. So sofisticated systems of coercition, conditionating, corruption are necessary. This is the realty of complex societies, wich risk always to implode however, in fact ruling classes are searching to be free from human factor through high technology.
So, in conclusion, to manage a society even small, some manipolations, both "good" and "bad", are necessary; the problem is when it become a totalitarian invasive system, or when it is used to achieve selfish goals disadvantaging to the other persons.
Where does this fallacy come from? Just because there are some in society who consider themselves to be loners (probably as a direct result of the false construct in which we live), it does not mean that humans are generally not social. A human animal will start to suffer mentally after a month or less of isolation from other humans, why do you think isolation is used as a form of punishment/torture? Humans ARE social animals, like it or not.
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Old 11-05-2016, 11:20 AM   #42
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If humans were not highly social animals we would still be going "ook ook grr" and hitting each other with sticks as we fought over a dead rat for lunch.

It is the ability to work and think cooperatively that allowed for technical advancements to happen.

What humans are not so good at is cooperating in large groups - We are instinctively tribal.
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Old 11-05-2016, 11:23 AM   #43
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TPTB did not create those improvements in society, the people did through trade unionism and protests. TPTB gave people concessions because they were scared of them; after the war a generation of men came back to britain who had been hardened in battle and had the clout and organised structure to overthrow the government if they chose to. So TPTB gave them 'homes for heroes', a free national health service and cheap credit

But over the ensuing decades they made the public weak, fat, isolated and complacent so that they could start taking back all the concession they gave out. They chemtrailed them, flouridated them, autismed them with vaccines, poisoned them with food additives and they put endocrine disruptors into the food and water to feminise men and masculinise women

This makes men less likely to stand up to the abuses of authority and it makes women more militant and aggressive towards men thereby forcing men to fight a war on two fronts
Well yes, TPTB enabled these social changes to save their own skins. I was going to touch upon a similar point but decided not to. Regardless of who drove that change it was still TPTB that accomodated it. So while I agree with you, my point still stands.

One of the drivers behind social and political change in the U.K for example, was the French revolution. TPTB that resided over us at the time saw what could happen should they push the people too hard and get on the wrong side of us and as a result they sought to change the structure of society to decrease the likely hood of a British revolution. TPTB are in it for themselves but increasingly it seems that the more they're in it for themselves the more they'll have to be in it for us all and if they aren't then they'll miss the train and we'll have our revolution. It's first up to them, and then it's up to us.

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Old 11-05-2016, 11:36 AM   #44
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Well yes, TPTB enabled these social changes to save their own skins. I was going to touch upon a similar point but decided not to. Regardless of who drove that change it was still TPTB that accomodated it. So while I agree with you, my point still stands.

One of the drivers behind social and political change in the U.K for example, was the French revolution. TPTB that resided over us at the time saw what could happen should they push the people too hard and get on the wrong side of us and as a result they sought to change the structure of society to decrease the likely hood of a British revolution. TPTB are in it for themselves but increasingly it seems that the more they're in it for themselves the more they'll have to be in it for us all and if they aren't then they'll miss the train and we'll have our revolution. It's first up to them, and then it's up to us.
the french revolution was part of an old plan to remove all monarchies in order to create a one world government. The el-ite know that the public are becoming more aware and they know that society MUST change, but they believe that if they can control the change they can steer us into a new society that would enable them to remain in control. This is why they wish to transition us from state-capitalism to state-socialism

They believe that a more centralised, command and control system where the populace can be tightly controlled and all activity heavily regulated by them will enable them to maintain control of society in the face of technological advancements. Machines are replacing people and this means that workers are becoming surplus to requirements...we are losing our political leverage. As this occurs the el-ites will increasingly see us as 'useless eaters' and will seek ways to remove us

This is why it is vital that the workers do not allow the el-ites to decide the change that is going to occur. The workers must decentralise power and then themselves choose to create a new society where all are provided for but which does not enslave people in a coercive environment

It's a tough challenge but achievable. However the el-ites will use all their media power to keep people buying into and agreeing to top down systems of control
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Old 11-05-2016, 01:11 PM   #45
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So some people adopt the elites indoctrination that most humans are worthless. Nice, yeah thats enlightened

Loads of potential NWO employees on the Icke forum.
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Old 11-05-2016, 01:24 PM   #46
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So some people adopt the elites indoctrination that most humans are worthless. Nice, yeah thats enlightened

Loads of potential NWO employees on the Icke forum.
they like to try and drown people in their cynicism

this forum can at its best be a fountain of knowledge but there are those that want to poison the well
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Old 11-05-2016, 01:37 PM   #47
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they like to try and drown people in their cynicism

this forum can at its best be a fountain of knowledge but there are those that want to poison the well
Well yeah, I have my off days too.


You can see the corruption of people's minds cant you?
Elite programming:
"You will accept you are worthless scum !"
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Old 11-05-2016, 01:38 PM   #48
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You can see the corruption of people's minds cant you?

Elite programming:
"You will accept you are worthless scum !"
''and you will see everyone else as worthless scum too''

''you will do nothing as we oppress you and others because ultimately you are just scum and deserve it''

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Old 11-05-2016, 01:40 PM   #49
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''you will see everyone else as worthless scum too''
The ABC of programming: Get the people to self program.
Self perpetuating programming/ conditioning. Its been around for a while.
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Old 11-05-2016, 01:42 PM   #50
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they like to try and drown people in their cynicism

this forum can at its best be a fountain of knowledge but there are those that want to poison the well

Beat the people down with belief in their worthlessness !!
Yeah that works.... easy.
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Old 11-05-2016, 01:48 PM   #51
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The ABC of programming: Get the people to self program.
Self perpetuating programming/ conditioning. Its been around for a while.
ah yes...the self policers!

let them learn to love their slavery!

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Old 11-05-2016, 01:51 PM   #52
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ah yes...thye self policers!

let them learn to love their slavery!


The society program or matrix if you like is a work of genius and doesn't require much maintenance for it to run itself.
The people run the program.
They just booted it up and it runs itself with minimal maintenance.
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Old 11-05-2016, 01:53 PM   #53
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Addicted to fakery so it appears.
How dare we threaten their fake world !!!!
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Old 11-05-2016, 04:57 PM   #54
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If humanity had put the same amount of resources and effort that they have into making war, spying on us, trying to keep everybody under control, if all this time, money and effort were put into an intelligent education system, healthcare and housing, infrastructure etc, then we'd all be living the high life in an absolute paradise..

So, to side with those who have been pulling the strings, who have enslaved us through the private central banking system, to actually try to make excuses for these mass murders is beyond my ken.

Understand them to be able to over-come them, but do not make excuses for them.. (not you Busa btw).
There is so much hopeful thinking in the "conspiracy community" that it actually hinders progress more than it helps. "We could be living in a perfect society where everyone gets everything!"... And then what? Who will do the sewage work, who will work on the roads, who will maintain water treatment, who will create the devices you use every day?

Society would crumble under your "heaven", everyone in a dirty job would move to a job they enjoy more, there would no longer be slaves to efficiently create the technology you use on a daily basis (you're using a computer aren't you?).

You're not thinking of the big picture, and judging by the "likes" on this forum on some of these posts, a lot of people are blind to reality and have so much invested into "love and light" fixing everything that they've lost touch of reality. Jesus (or the new Jesus called "Love and Light") is not coming to save you, you are to save yourself, whether you like it or not, and a lot of you will fail...hard.

You think I enjoy having to work IT (yes, I went to college and am an IT making pretty good money now) under a boss that is a complete d-bag? No, but it is what must be done to support the lifestyle I envisioned for myself, and I recognize that.

Reality is not a video game, the infrastructure requires upkeep and the upkeep is hard and dirty work, and most of you don't even realize how much hard and dirty work goes on in the world for the things you are using right now that you probably couldn't live without. You say you could, but I doubt you could. 5 years ago I wanted to "live in nature", well I tried, for a week, it was boring and I wanted to go back, it gave me perspective and made me learn the hard way that not everything can be fixed by "giving up everything, creating communities of wooden houses and holding hands while singing kumbaya".

There's medicine that must be made (yes, vaccinations are harmful, but that's another discussion, I'll just say I believe it's necessary, and if you're smart you won't get them, end of discussion) in order to fend off a lot of diseases that you've never even heard of because we've had the medicine to cure/prevent them for a long time.

You have to THINK ABOUT EVERYTHING in the world. People here say "question everything", but your idea of "questioning everything" is questioning those in power because you feel wronged, it is not actually questioning and thinking about everything, you're just as close minded as some of the "asleep" people.

Rid yourself of your victim's complex and look at the world in a rational way rather than a "spiritual/religious" way.

Humanity has come a LONG way under TPTB. TPTB came into power around the Napolean era, I promise you none of you would have wanted to live at ANY point before the Napolean era compared to now. To say otherwise is absurd, because there was constant war, world hunger, rampant diseases, unhealthy and filthy lifestyles, unclean water, etc...

Is war terrible? Yes, but we need a way to keep the population down. The only people that join the military are complete morons, so them dying is good for the human race, and best of all they volunteered for it, but it's tragic that they have to kill innocent people. The actual population count isn't that big of a deal, but humans leave a massive footprint on the world due to our technologies, so even though you can say there are a LOT more animals, every human makes a massive impact on the planet. I strongly disagree in the way they are handling it, and believe depopulation/sterilization should be left to food/water/air means, and have it be MOSTLY sterilization so the people don't have to suffer, but it's likely VERY difficult to try to sterilize 7 billion people.

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''and you will see everyone else as worthless scum too''

''you will do nothing as we oppress you and others because ultimately you are just scum and deserve it''
You put this in quotes as if someone actually said this.

Source?

If you made this up, I would suggest to stop thinking so lowly about yourself and others. You think people in power think of you this way, but they don't, they are just doing what they need to do and your victim's mentality makes you think they are insulting you at every turn.

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Old 11-05-2016, 05:08 PM   #55
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There is so much hopeful thinking in the "conspiracy community" that it actually hinders progress more than it helps. "We could be living in a perfect society where everyone gets everything!"... And then what? Who will do the sewage work, who will work on the roads, who will maintain water treatment, who will create the devices you use every day?

Society would crumble under your "heaven", everyone in a dirty job would move to a job they enjoy more, there would no longer be slaves to efficiently create the technology you use on a daily basis (you're using a computer aren't you?).

You're not thinking of the big picture, and judging by the "likes" on this forum on some of these posts, a lot of people are blind to reality and have so much invested into "love and light" fixing everything that they've lost touch of reality. Jesus (or the new Jesus called "Love and Light") is not coming to save you, you are to save yourself, whether you like it or not, and a lot of you will fail...hard.

You think I enjoy having to work IT (yes, I went to college and am an IT making pretty good money now) under a boss that is a complete d-bag? No, but it is what must be done to support the lifestyle I envisioned for myself, and I recognize that.

Reality is not a video game, the infrastructure requires upkeep and the upkeep is hard and dirty work, and most of you don't even realize how much hard and dirty work goes on in the world for the things you are using right now that you probably couldn't live without. You say you could, but I doubt you could. 5 years ago I wanted to "live in nature", well I tried, for a week, it was boring and I wanted to go back, it gave me perspective and made me learn the hard way that not everything can be fixed by "giving up everything, creating communities of wooden houses and holding hands while singing kumbaya".

There's medicine that must be made (yes, vaccinations are harmful, but that's another discussion, I'll just say I believe it's necessary, and if you're smart you won't get them, end of discussion) in order to fend off a lot of diseases that you've never even heard of because we've had the medicine to cure/prevent them for a long time.

You have to THINK ABOUT EVERYTHING in the world. People here say "question everything", but your idea of "questioning everything" is questioning those in power because you feel wronged, it is not actually questioning and thinking about everything, you're just as close minded as some of the "asleep" people.

Rid yourself of your victim's complex and look at the world in a rational way rather than a "spiritual/religious" way.

Humanity has come a LONG way under TPTB. TPTB came into power around the Napolean era, I promise you none of you would have wanted to live at ANY point before the Napolean era compared to now. To say otherwise is absurd, because there was constant war, world hunger, rampant diseases, unhealthy and filthy lifestyles, unclean water, etc...
here's some reality for you: human workers are being replaced by computers and machines

This new society will mean large numbers of unemployed people and a technological caste of people who programme, repair and build the machines that do everything. In the world view of the el-ites that means that all those people who aren't administering the machines are now surplus to requirements and should be removed. So those people need to ask themselves what kind of society moving forward into this technological age can accomodate them?

Do we let the el-ite cull us or do we fashion a new society in which we all still have a place? There could be a split with some people becoming more high tech and administering the machines and robots whilst some people go in the other direction and become low tech and start moving towards sustainable permaculture and offgrid living where they exist in a subsistence way. How to balance the best of what technology offers with the best of the past to ensure that as technology enroaches we don't lose our essential humanity?
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Old 11-05-2016, 05:14 PM   #56
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TPTB came into power around the Napolean era,
Please elaborate
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Old 11-05-2016, 05:19 PM   #57
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here's some reality for you: human workers are being replaced by computers and machines

This new society will mean large numbers of unemployed people and a technological caste of people who programme, repair and build the machines that do everything. In the world view of the el-ites that means that all those people who aren't administering the machines are now surplus to requirements and should be removed. So those people need to ask themselves what kind of society moving forward into this technological age can accomodate them?

Do we let the el-ite cull us or do we fashion a new society in which we all still have a place? There could be a split with some people becoming more high tech and administering the machines and robots whilst some people go in the other direction and become low tech and start moving towards sustainable permaculture and offgrid living where they exist in a subsistence way. How to balance the best of what technology offers with the best of the past to ensure that as technology enroaches we don't lose our essential humanity?
Let me ask you something, do you think at the rate the world population is increasing, that the population is sustainable while leaving room for nature?

We could likely grow to 100 billion, but nature would be almost entirely destroyed in the more populated areas (EU/States/Brazil/India/China), and mostly destroyed in other areas (except maybe low pop areas like canada/russia).

How many burgers have you eaten in your lifetime? Steaks? Drank milk? Ate eggs? Yeah, all those come from animals. Imagine all the animals we slaughter on a daily basis to feed our population, now imagine that x10, x100. You think animal farms are bad now? Just wait until we have 10x the population, we'll have to be a lot more efficient, that means a lot more killing and it will have to be a lot more brutal to the animals, if they even survive, most will likely go extinct without forced controlled breeding, and that is pretty evil. I don't want that to happen. I love animals, it would be tragic if that were to happen.

Do you care more about human lives than animal/plant lives? If so that is pure ignorance.

I believe we've already massacred more animals than need be, and our population could be dropped to ~1 billion (or less) through sterilization over a term of 200 years without too much of an uproar.

You people preach love of nature at every turn, but then want to destroy it because you have an egotistical grandiose view of your own species.

Although, I do believe you speak purely out of fear because of "FEMA camps" and whatnot. You shouldn't let fear control you, because if you do it's a sign of weakness, the fear being spread is designed to cripple the weak. Here's a hint, "FEMA camps" won't happen, it is just a ruse to kick in your survival instincts and expose you.

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Old 11-05-2016, 05:29 PM   #58
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Let me ask you something, do you think at the rate the world population is increasing, that the population is sustainable while leaving room for nature?

We could likely grow to 100 billion, but nature would be almost entirely destroyed in the more populated areas (EU/States/Brazil/India/China), and mostly destroyed in other areas (except maybe low pop areas like canada/russia).

Do you care more about human lives than animal/plant lives? If so that is pure ignorance.

I believe we've already massacred more animals than need be, and our population could be dropped to ~1 billion (or less) through sterilization over a term of 200 years without too much of an uproar.

You people preach love of nature at every turn, but then want to destroy it because you have an egotistical grandiose view of your own species.
I think the title of the OP is misleading......judging from the above post, you're fully onboard with them....cut the 'may be' claptrap
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Old 11-05-2016, 05:37 PM   #59
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People would still do the jobs that needed doing.. I didn't wipe kids and old people's arses and puke up for the money, I did it becaurse I wanted to.

My ex used to work on sewers, road works loads of things.. he loved that type of work and the banter that goes with it.

When you are doing it to be a bigger part of something then its even better.
you build my sewer and I will fit your kitchen.. You fix my car I will look after your old mum..

People will still want to help others, people will still want things to do.. Trades will be re-learnt and passed on. old ways of medicine will mix with the new ways.

Trouble with you lot, is you just dont understand that the world can run perfectly fine with out whipping us to death or scaring us to death.. Many people would feel happier and contended just to not have to worry about the next meal or latest bill.
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Old 11-05-2016, 05:39 PM   #60
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I think the title of the OP is misleading......judging from the above post, you're fully onboard with them....cut the 'may be' claptrap
Exactly!

its always a "I used to be like you" ( Or I used to really like David) and ending with "You lot" or "you people" as in I am nothing like you

tis all BS and no one (other than the normal suspects) fell for it.
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