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Old 06-07-2010, 05:37 PM   #1
lightgiver
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Default Many 9-11 "hijackers" are still alive.

Abdul Aziz Al-Omari (Flight 11) (Trained Pilot)

The identities of two men with the same name have been cobbled together to create an FBI "terrorist". Both are Alive!

The first has the same name, the same birth date as one of the FBI "terrorists" but has no idea how to fly.

The second has the name Abdul Rahman Al-Omari and a different birth date, but is the person pictured by the FBI and is a pilot for Saudi Arabian Airlines.

Here are some quotes from the world's media concerning them.

Omari Number 1

"A Saudi man has reported to authorities that he is the real Abdul Aziz Al-Omari, and claims his passport was stolen in 1995 while he studied electrical engineering at the University of Denver. Al-Omari says he informed police of the theft." - ABCNews

"I couldn't believe it when the FBI put me on their list. They gave my name and my date of birth, but I am not a suicide bomber. I am here. I am alive. I have no idea how to fly a plane. I had nothing to do with this." - Telegraph 23rd September 2001

"The name (listed by the FBI) is my name and the birth date is the same as mine, but I am not the one who bombed the World Trade Center in New York," Abdul Aziz Al-Omari told the London-based Asharq Al-Awsat newspaper.

"Al-Omari has since been found in Saudi Arabia and is apparently cleared in the case" - New York Times

"Saudi Embassy officials in Washington have challenged his identity. They say a Saudi electrical engineer named Abdul Aziz Al-Omari had his passport and other papers stolen in 1996 in Denver when he was a student and reported the theft to police there at the time." - BBC

"Abdel Aziz Al-Omari and Saïd Hussein Gharamallah Al-Ghamdi, are well in life, the first in Saudi Arabia and the second in Tunisia for nine months." - Wal Fadjri 21st September 2001 (translate)

Omari Number 2

Mr. Al-Omari, a pilot with Saudi Airlines, walked into the US embassy in Jeddah to demand why he was being reported as a dead hijacker in the American media.

"Abdul Aziz Al-Omari is a pilot for Saudi Arabian Airlines" - BBC 23rd September 2001

"A pilot with Saudi Airlines, was astonished to find himself accused of hijacking ­ as well as being dead ­ and has visited the US consulate in Jeddah to demand an explanation." - Independent 17th September 2001

This Al-Omari lives with his wife and four children in Jeddah, Saudi Arabia.


Saeed Al-Ghamdi (Flight 93) (Trained Pilot)

"Saeed Al-Ghamdi is one of three hijackers that US officials have said are linked to Osama bin Laden's al-Qaida network." - BBC

No BBC! Mr. Al-Ghamdi is still alive and well and at his job for Tunis Air.

"I was completely shocked. For the past 10 months I have been based in Tunis with 22 other pilots learning to fly an Airbus 320. The FBI provided no evidence of my presumed involvement in the attacks." - Telegraph 23rd September 2001

"Asharq Al Awsat newspaper, a London-based Arabic daily, says it has interviewed Saeed Al-Ghamdi." - BBC 23rd September 2001

"Abdel Aziz Al-Omari and Saïd Hussein Gharamallah Al-Ghamdi, are well in life, the first in Saudi Arabia and the second in Tunisia for nine months." - Wal Fadjri 21st September 2001 (translate)

"..... not dead and had nothing to do with the heinous terror attacks in New York and Washington." - Saudi embassy


Waleed Al-Shehri (Flight 11) (Trained Pilot)

"A sixth person on the FBI's list, Saudi national Waleed Al-Shehri, is living in Casablanca, according to an official with the Royal Air Moroc, the Moroccan commercial airline. According to the unnamed official, Al-Shehri lived in Dayton Beach, Fla., where he took flight training at Embry-Riddle Aeronautical University. Now he works for a Moroccan airline." On Sept. 22, Associated Press reported that Alshehri had spoken to the U.S. embassy in Morocco.

"His photograph was released by the FBI, and has been shown in newspapers and on television around the world. That same Mr Al-Shehri has turned up in Morocco, proving clearly that he was not a member of the suicide attack." - Daily Trust 24th September 2001.

"He was reported to have been in Hollywood, Florida, for a month earlier this year but his father, Ahmed, said that Waleed was alive and well and living in Morocco." - Telegraph

"Another of the men named by the FBI as a hijacker in the suicide attacks on Washington and New York has turned up alive and well." - BBC 23rd September 2001.


Ahmed Al-Nami (Flight 93)

"I'm still alive, as you can see. I was shocked to see my name mentioned by the American Justice Department. I had never even heard of Pennsylvania where the plane I was supposed to have hijacked." He had never lost his passport and found it "very worrying" that his identity appeared to have been "stolen" and published by the FBI without any checks. The FBI had said his "possible residence" was Delray Beach in Florida." - Telegraph 23rd September 2001


Salem Al-Hazmi (Flight 77)

"Mr Al-Hamzi is 26 and had just returned to work at a petrochemical complex in the industrial eastern city of Yanbou after a holiday in Saudi Arabia when the hijackers struck. He was accused of hijacking the American Airlines Flight 77 that hit the Pentagon." - Telegraph 23rd September 2001.


Khalid Al-Mihdhar (Flight 77)

"Saudi officials at the embassy were unable to verify the whereabouts of the fifth accused hijacker, Khalid Al-Mihdhar. However, Arab newspapers say Al-Mihdhar is still alive.

"..... there are suggestions that another suspect, Khalid Al Midhar may also be alive." - BBC 23rd September 2001


Others accused of being involved:

Ameer Bukhari

"Ameer Bukhari died in a small plane crash last year." - CNN Correction

Adnan Bukhari

"Adnan Bukhari is still in Florida" - CNN Correction

Amer Kamfar

".... that a suspect sought by the FBI, Amer Kamfar, was in fact an alive pilot in Arabia. " - Wal Fadjri 21st September 2001




THE ARABS ARE NOT TO BLAME FOR THE WTC ATTACK.


The evidence is such that the only people we can be sure DID NOT carry out the WTC bombing are the Arabs.

The trouble with the case against bin Laden and the Arabs, so far, is that it is laughable. It is a joke.

1) The WTC attack, described as brilliantly planned and executed by professionals, who some how forget to acquire (easily obtainable) false driver's licenses for identification and, if you can believe it (and most people can not) used their real names when boarding the aircraft. The FBI suspect list was comprised using the assumption that those on the passenger lists had used their real names (real smart,.. these guys really earn their money eh?).

2) These same professionals, leave a car at an airport (which is found within hours of the attack,.. what a surprise!) with incriminating documents (a flight training manual in Arabic). Professionals, (actually any sane persons) not wanting their "ground support" to be compromised, would take taxis to the airports.

3) When it is established that many, if not all the hi-jackers were using false identities the FBI suspect list did not change (yeah, morons run the FBI).

4) One of the accused carries a passport on an internal flight (in case he wants to travel overseas after the attack).

5) This passport, originally in the accuseds luggage or on his person, rips through the suitcase or jacket, survives the fireball, punches a hole through the WTC and then flutters to the ground a few blocks away. Fortunately, the passport had the name of the accused on it and is generally in great condition, although apparently somewhat muddy.

6) One of the accused (Mohammed Atta) packs a suitcase (in case he wants to visit relatives for a few days after the attack) with a "how to be a terrorist in the US" document (just part of the professionalism, mentioned above) that just happens not to be loaded on the plane (so that the incriminating document survives,.. what a surprise!).

7) Mohammed Atta travels to Portland Maine to fly to Boston (why not drive straight to Boston) and transfer to the suicide flight. This is utterly unbelievable. This introduces a huge potential problem. What happens if his flight is delayed. How embarrassing for the so called leader of the terrorists, if he can't make his connection. That would throw a spanner in the works. Transferring flights like this offers no upside but huge downside, and is considerable evidence that Atta has been framed.

8) And do not forget that phone calls were made from the planes blamed the hijacking on Israelis (actually, they used the words "middle eastern looking" but we all know that many Israelis are very middle eastern looking).

These laughable "facts" which all point to the Arabs can be viewed as strong evidence that the WTC attack was not carried out by the Arabs. These nonsense "facts" all point to an event where someone is being framed.


http://guardian.150m.com/september-e...kers-alive.htm
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Old 06-07-2010, 09:36 PM   #2
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The status of the following 32 hijackers is ALIVE.

http://www.trackingthethreat.com/zse...jsp?entId=1078
Majed Moqed
Entity Type: Person
Entity Status: Alive
Start Date:
End Date:
Date Created: 22 Sep 2003
Date Modified: 06 Jun 2007

http://www.trackingthethreat.com/zse...jsp?entId=1017
Ahmed Alnami
Entity Type: Person
Entity Status: Alive
Start Date:
End Date:
Date Created: 22 Sep 2003
Date Modified: 06 Jun 2007
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Old 07-07-2010, 04:36 AM   #3
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Wow, you can find someone else with the same name as (fill in the blank) if you bother to look. What a momentous discovery.
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Old 07-07-2010, 05:14 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ultima1 View Post
The status of the following 32 hijackers is ALIVE.

http://www.trackingthethreat.com/zse...jsp?entId=1078
Majed Moqed
Entity Type: Person
Entity Status: Alive
Start Date:
End Date:
Date Created: 22 Sep 2003
Date Modified: 06 Jun 2007

http://www.trackingthethreat.com/zse...jsp?entId=1017
Ahmed Alnami
Entity Type: Person
Entity Status: Alive
Start Date:
End Date:
Date Created: 22 Sep 2003
Date Modified: 06 Jun 2007
im not denying 911 inside job, but what you put there does not prove anything


http://www.911myths.com/html/abdulaz...ill_alive.html
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Old 07-07-2010, 05:28 AM   #5
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http://www.welfarestate.com/911/atta.txt

this is not evidence but t gives an idea of what happened to some of the hijackers

mohammed atta

http://www.welfarestate.com/911/atta.txt

http://911research.wtc7.net/cache/pl...jackers.html#9
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Old 07-07-2010, 05:34 AM   #6
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and what about this one?

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/world/mid...st/1559151.stm


i would love to see a video or a photo of one of the hijackers after 9 11
that i would call evidence.
i still believe 911 is an inside job, but im looking for solid evidence because i really want to show to a friend of mine so i can wake him up!
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Old 07-07-2010, 07:04 AM   #7
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Many "victims" are not listed as dead either.
Funny how it went from 20,000 deaths , down to 10,000 withinin the first hours. On Sept. 23, 2001, Retard Giuliani Made the blatant claim of 6,333 deaths.(nice number) Even to this day , one cannot get a clear, exact, consistent number of actual victims.And furthermore an unusual percent of listed "victims" names are not listed in the SSDI(Social Security Death Index).
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Old 07-07-2010, 07:44 AM   #8
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Originally Posted by dusan View Post
im not denying 911 inside job, but what you put there does not prove anything
Well it proves that at leaast 2 of the hijackers that were supposed to be on the planes are alive.
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Old 07-07-2010, 03:38 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ultima1 View Post
The status of the following 32 hijackers is ALIVE.

http://www.trackingthethreat.com/zse...jsp?entId=1078
Majed Moqed
Entity Type: Person
Entity Status: Alive
Start Date:
End Date:
Date Created: 22 Sep 2003
Date Modified: 06 Jun 2007

http://www.trackingthethreat.com/zse...jsp?entId=1017
Ahmed Alnami
Entity Type: Person
Entity Status: Alive
Start Date:
End Date:
Date Created: 22 Sep 2003
Date Modified: 06 Jun 2007

Why do you continue to spread this crap, Roger? You have been told time and time again that this is not reliable.

From the website:

Quote:
While we have attempted to assign some degree of credibility to its accuracy, no representation is made or implied that all data contained herein is completely reliable. Users of any TrackingTheThreat.com content are cautioned and advised that they should do their own independent verification of any information.
http://www.trackingthethreat.com/about/

So Roger, what steps if any, have to taken to verify this information?
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Old 07-07-2010, 04:04 PM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ultima1 View Post
The status of the following 32 hijackers is ALIVE.

http://www.trackingthethreat.com/zse...jsp?entId=1078
Majed Moqed
Entity Type: Person
Entity Status: Alive
Start Date:
End Date:
Date Created: 22 Sep 2003
Date Modified: 06 Jun 2007
"Miracle" Majed

Majed Moqed, A Saudi Law student, has not been seen by his family since he left for America in 2001; unlike some of the other hijackers who "can" be proven to be still alive, the same proof does not exist for Majed.

Majed according to US state terrorist propaganda, was on flight 77, which flew into the Pentagon; the aircraft then dissapeared into a tiny hole a few feet wide which squashed the entire aircraft including wings, engines, landing gear and all the passengers.

By some miracle, despite the entire craft being squashed through a tiny hole, "Miracle" Majed also had a "miracle" student ID card which probably flew out of his pocket and miraculously survived the crash.

".....the U.S. announced it had found a "Kingdom of Saudi Arabia Student Identity Card" bearing Moqed's name in the rubble surrounding the Pentagon. They also stated that it appeared to have been a forgery (source: 911 Commission Report)"
Thankfully, although the entire Boeing aircraft manage to squash itself through a hole a few feet wide, the survival of his plastic ID card assures us that this miracle undertaken by a Saudi Muslim, proves once again that miracles are possible to those who have faith in Allah, the CIA created Al Queda and the assistance of US state terrorist propaganda.











Whereas at the WTC:



Quote:

http://www.trackingthethreat.com/zse...jsp?entId=1017
Ahmed Alnami
Entity Type: Person
Entity Status: Alive
Start Date:
End Date:
Date Created: 22 Sep 2003
Date Modified: 06 Jun 2007
Amazing Ahmed

There are a number of Saudi's called Ahmed Alnami, who were alarmed at their name being used to identify a hijacker, however the Ahmed Alnami described by the US state terrorists also a Saudi Law student, does not appear to be alive.

Ahmed Alnami also perfomed a great miracle with the assistance of US state terrorist propaganda, he apparently managed to be one of those who crashed flight 77 into a field in Shanksville without leaving a trail of debis.

Dissapearing aircraft and plastic ID cards which leap out of exploding aircraft appear to be the kind of miracles possible for those who have faith in Allah and in US state terrorist propaganda. "Allah Achkba" - God may be "great," but She just seems to have lousy staff, who despite billions of dollars of advanced military technology, don't seem to be able to properly fake missile attacks to make them look like aircraft crashes.



Lux

Last edited by luciferhorus; 07-07-2010 at 05:43 PM.
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Old 07-07-2010, 09:31 PM   #11
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Originally Posted by luciferhorus View Post
"Miracle" Majed
unlike some of the other hijackers who "can" be proven to be still alive, the same proof does not exist for Majed.
Really? You can prove this? Please, start by showing me the proof here... THEN make sure you get this amazing information to the media so they can report it. I predict a Pulitzer for you, amazing Lucifer!
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Old 07-07-2010, 09:41 PM   #12
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Originally Posted by luciferhorus View Post
"Miracle" Majed
By some miracle, despite the entire craft being squashed through a tiny hole, "Miracle" Majed also had a "miracle" student ID card which probably flew out of his pocket and miraculously survived the crash.
Can you please supply us with the measurements of this tiny hole and the source for this information.

Thank you in advance Lucifer!
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Old 07-07-2010, 09:44 PM   #13
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Old 07-07-2010, 09:46 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by throatyogurt View Post
Really? You can prove this? Please, start by showing me the proof here... THEN make sure you get this amazing information to the media so they can report it. I predict a Pulitzer for you, amazing Lucifer!
Well let us consider the statement.

"Miracle" Majed
unlike some of the other hijackers who "can" be proven to be still alive, the same proof does not exist for Majed."


Yes well perhaps the term "proof" is too definite a term and I should have used the term "evidence" rather than absolute proof.

What I am stating here is that

1: There is no evidence which would appear to establish any form of "proof" that Majed is still alive. In the absence of such proof or "evidence" that he is still alive, I would ask you to offer evidence that he is still alive.

2: With regards to other hijackers who have been shown to be still alive, this has been discussed on other threads. However the term "proof" is perhaps too strong; with regards to the BBC article below, there would appear to be "evidence" that, for example Waleed Al Shehri is still alive, but unfortunately; I cannot "prove" that any more than I can disprove that there is a tea pot circumnavigating the sun, since the BBC may simply be lying or Waleed Al Shehri may be lying; perhaps he really was a hijacker but was miraculously blown free of the wreckage when his aircraft collided with the Twin Towers and managed to secretly make his way back to Morocco.


For example.


Quote:
Originally Posted by luciferhorus View Post

The following article is from the BBC:

Waleed Al Shehri (Wail M. Alshehri's brother)


http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/1559151.stm

"Another of the men named by the FBI as a hijacker in the suicide attacks on Washington and New York has turned up alive and well.

.....

Saudi Arabian pilot Waleed Al Shehri was one of five men that the FBI said had deliberately crashed American Airlines flight 11 into the World Trade Centre on 11 September.

His photograph was released, and has since appeared in newspapers and on television around the world.

Hijacking suspects
...................
Now he is protesting his innocence from Casablanca, Morocco.

He told journalists there that he had nothing to do with the attacks on New York and Washington, and had been in Morocco when they happened. He has contacted both the Saudi and American authorities, according to Saudi press reports.

He acknowledges that he attended flight training school at Daytona Beach in the United States, and is indeed the same Waleed Al Shehri to whom the FBI has been referring.

But, he says, he left the United States in September last year, became a pilot with Saudi Arabian airlines and is currently on a further training course in Morocco.
"




Salem Al-Hazmi

The real Salem Al-Hazmi, however, is alive and indignant in Saudi Arabia, and not one of the people who perished in the American Airlines flight that crashed on the Pentagon. He works at a government-owned petroleum and chemical plant in the city of Yanbu. He said yesterday he had not left Saudi Arabia for two years, but that his passport had been stolen by a pickpocket in Cairo three years ago. http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHART...rs_flt_77.html

.................
Lux
Quote:
Originally Posted by throatyogurt View Post
Can you please supply us with the measurements of this tiny hole and the source for this information.

Thank you in advance Lucifer!
Well I don't have the ability to measure the hole; I am merely referring to the hole in the photographs prior to the collapse in the wall which the Boeing aircraft dissapeared into; perhaps you could supply the size of the hole yourself.









Quote:
Originally Posted by coco View Post
Compare with:




Well Coco that is not the "entry hole" at the front of the building; that one is the exit hole at the other side.

Of course apart from a Boeing Aircraft disappearing through a tiny hole, the hijackers would have had to crawl across the fuselage while the plane was in flight to get into the cockpit through the windows at the front of the craft, and hacked their way through aluminim or toughened glass with boxcutters, since the cockpit door allegedly remained closed for the entire flight.

9/11: PENTAGON AIRCRAFT HIJACK IMPOSSIBLE
FLIGHT DECK DOOR CLOSED FOR ENTIRE FLIGHT


http://pilotsfor911truth.org/america...mpossible.html

(PilotsFor911Truth.org) - Newly decoded data provided by an independent researcher and computer programmer from Australia exposes alarming evidence that the reported hijacking aboard American Airlines Flight 77 was impossible to have existed. A data parameter labeled "FLT DECK DOOR", cross checks with previously decoded data obtained by Pilots For 9/11 Truth from the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) through the Freedom Of Information Act..................according to Flight Data provided by the NTSB, the Flight Deck Door was never opened in flight. How were the hijackers able to gain access to the cockpit, remove the pilots, and navigate the aircraft to the Pentagon if the Flight Deck Door remained closed

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Old 07-07-2010, 10:01 PM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luciferhorus View Post


What I am stating here is that

1: There is no evidence which would appear to establish any form of "proof" that Majed is still alive. In the absence of such proof or "evidence" that he is still alive, I would ask you to offer evidence that he is still alive.
I can't, he is dead.

Quote:
2: with regards to the BBC article below, there would appear to be "evidence" that, for example Waleed Al Shehri is still alive
Did you happen to read the bottom of the article from the BBC that was written on 9/23/01?

Quote:
Originally Posted by BBC
(Note: An update on this story was published in October 2006 in the BBC News editors' blog)
I suggest you read it:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/theeditor..._theory_1.html



Quote:
Well I don't have the ability to measure the hole; I am merely referring to the hole in the photographs prior to the collapse in the wall which the Boeing aircraft dissapeared into; perhaps you could supply the size of the hole yourself.
Sir, you are stating that the hole was tiny. Are you implying that it was to small to have been caused by flight 77?
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Old 07-07-2010, 10:55 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by throatyogurt View Post
I can't, he is dead.

Well I suggest that you either read what you are responding to or perhaps you may consider taking a literacy skills class.

I stated "unlike some of the other hijackers who "can" be proven to be still alive, the same proof does not exist for Majed."

In other words I was stating that there is no proof that he is still alive. You asked me to prove this and I replied that I cannot prove that he is dead; I then asked you to prove that he is dead, and you reply "I can't, he is dead."

I do understand that most Americans are barely literate enough to read a cornflake's packet, but very minimal literacy skills are required to understand the stupidity of this.

Quote:
Did you happen to read the bottom of the article from the BBC that was written on 9/23/01?

I suggest you read it:

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/theeditor..._theory_1.html
Well that hyperlink refers to an update to the article in 2006 which concludes:

"In an effort to make this clearer, we have made one small change to the original story. Under the FBI picture of Waleed al Shehri we have added the words "A man called Waleed Al Shehri..." to make it as clear as possible that there was confusion over the identity. The rest of the story remains as it was in the archive as a record of the situation at the time. "

So let us examine the orginal claims by the BBC:

"He acknowledges that he attended flight training school at Daytona Beach in the United States, and is indeed the same Waleed Al Shehri to whom the FBI has been referring.

But, he says, he left the United States in September last year, became a pilot with Saudi Arabian airlines and is currently on a further training course in Morocco."


So two Saudi Pilots with the same name who were both in the United States. Yes I suppose it may well be a coincidence or it just may be the BBC covering it's tracks; the BBC is after all a state terrorist propaganda front for the British military; I concede that they are terrorist collaborators and not a reliable source. I suppose that it would be better simply to state that the evidence on Waleed being alive or dead is inconclusive as this point and that it is disputed.

Quote:
Sir, you are stating that the hole was tiny. Are you implying that it was to small to have been caused by flight 77?
Well that is the judgement of "Pilots for 9/11 Truth" and Scholars for 9/11 Truth.

I am not a "Sir" by the way; I have not been knighted by the Queen and since I seek the overthrow of her government and the annihilation of her kingdom and her state terrorist / narco-terrorist military, I thus think that a knighthood is as unlikely as Elizabeth Windsor (Jesus' representative on earth to all Anglicans) donating all her wealth to the poor or of camels passing through the eyes of needles, etc.

With regards to myself, I do not claim to be an expert in flight aviation, nor in aircraft engineering, nor in the specialist academic sciences of civil (structural) engineering or physics. This is probably true for most people here and thus, just like any judge and jury, we are reliant on the testimony of "credible" expert witnesses; however as the judge of this matter, it is quite reasonable to discount the testimony of all US state terrorist collaborators since the US state terrorists have a long history of deception, black military operations, genocide, war, imperalism and assorted terrorism & narco-terrorism in general.

Perhaps you might also state your professional qualifications in this matter, or are you just another terrorist collaborator who blindly and unquestioningly accepts whatever the current position of the American state terrorists is?

If you have some expertise in this matter and are willing to state that, I would suggest you respond to the "Scholars for 911 truth" and "Pilots for 911 Truth" statements on the Pentagon attack, after you have taken a few basic literacy classes, of course.

Lux

"New study from Pilots for 9/11 Truth

No Boeing 757 hit the Pentagon


http://twilightpines.com//index.php?...=110&Itemid=67

ABSTRACT: Pilots for 9/11 Truth obtained black box data from the government under the Freedom of Information Act for AA Flight 77, which The 9/11 Report claims hit the Pentagon. Analysis of the data contradicts the official account in direction, approach, and altitude. The plane was too high to hit lamp posts and would have flown over the Pentagon, not impacted with its ground floor. This result confirms and strengthens the previous findings of Scholars for 9/11 Truth that no Boeing 757 hit the building.


Madison, WI (PRWEB) June 21, 2007 - A study of the black box data provided by the government to Pilots for 9/11 Truth has confirmed the previous findings of Scholars for 9/11 Truth that no Boeing 757 hit the Pentagon on 9/11. "We have had four lines of proof that no Boeing 757 hit the building," said James Fetzer, founder of Scholars for 9/11 Truth. "This new study by Pilots drives another nail into a coffin of lies told the American people by The 9/11 Commission":

The new society, an international organization of pilots and aviation professionals, petitioned the National Transportation Safety Board (NTSB) under the Freedom of Information Act and obtained its 2002 report on American Airlines Flight 77, a Boeing 757 that, according to the official account, hit the ground floor of the Pentagon after it skimmed over the lawn at 500 mph plus, taking out a series of lamp posts in the process. The pilots not only obtained the flight data but created a computer animation to demonstrate what it told them.

According to the report issued by Pilots for 9/11 Truth (http://pilotsfor911truth.org/), there are major differences between the official account and the flight data:

a. The NTSB Flight Path Animation approach path and altitude does not support official events.
b. All altitude data shows the aircraft at least 300 feet too high to have struck the light poles.
c. The rate of descent data is in direct conflict with the aircraft being able to impact the light poles and be captured in the Dept of Defense "5 Frames" video of an object traveling nearly parallel with the Pentagon lawn.
d. The record of data stops at least one second prior to official impact time.
e. If data trends are continued, the aircraft altitude would have been at least 100 feet too high to have hit the Pentagon.

As Robert Balsamo, co-founder of Pilots for 9/11 Truth, observes, "The information in the NSTB documents does not support, and in some instances factually contradicts, the official government position that American Airlines Flight 77 struck the Pentagon on the morning of September 11, 2001." The study was signed by fifteen professional pilots with extensive military and commercial carrier experience. They have made their animation, "Pandora's Box: Chapter 2," available to the public at http://video.google.com/videosearch?...x%3A+Chapter+2 .

According to James H. Fetzer, founder of Scholars for 9/11 Truth (http://911scholars.org), this result fits into the broader picture of what happened at the Pentagon that day. "We have developed four lines of argument that prove--conclusively, in my judgment--that no Boeing 757 hit the building. The most important evidence to the contrary has been the numerous eyewitness reports of a large commercial carrier coming toward the building. If the NTSB data is correct, then the Pilot's study shows that a large aircraft headed toward the building but did not impact with it. It swerved off and flew above the Pentagon."

Fetzer, who retired last June after 35 years of teaching courses in logic, critical thinking, and scientific reasoning, expressed pleasure over the Pilot's results, which, he said, has neatly resolved the most pressing issue that remained about the Pentagon. He added, "We have previously developed several lines of argument, each of which proves that no Boeing 757 hit the building," including these four:

(1) The hit point at the Pentagon was too small to accommodate a 100-ton airliner with a 125-foot wingspan and a tail that stands 44 feet above the ground; the kind and quantity of debris was wrong for a Boeing 757: there were no wings, no fuselage, no seats, no bodies, no luggage, no tail! Not even the engines were recovered, and they are practically indestructible.

(2) Of an estimate 84 videotapes of the crash, the three that have been released by the Pentagon do not show a Boeing 757 hitting the building, as even Bill O'Reilly admitted when one was shown on "The Factor". At 155 feet, the plane was more than twice as long as the 77-foot Pentagon is high and should have been visible. There are indications of a much smaller plane, but not a Boeing 757.

(3) Indeed, the aerodynamics of flight would have made the official trajectory--flying more than 500 mph barely above ground level--physically impossible, because of the accumulation of a massive pocket of compressed gas (air) beneath the fuselage; and if it had come it at an angle instead, it would have created a massive crater; but there is no crater and the official trajectory is impossible.

(4) Flying low enough to impact with the ground floor would have meant that the enormous engines were plowing the ground and creating massive furrows; but there are no massive furrows. The smooth, unblemished surface of the Pentagon lawn thus stands as a "smoking gun" proving the official trajectory cannot be sustained.

Members of Scholars have contributed to a new book that analyses the government's official account, according to which 19 Islamic fundamentalists hijacked four commercial airliners, outfoxed the most sophisticated air-defense system in the world, and committed these atrocities under the control of a man in a cave in Afghanistan. Entitled, THE 9/11 CONSPIRACY (2007), it includes photographs of the hit point before and after the upper floors collapsed, the crucial frame from the released videos, and views of the clear, smooth, and unblemished lawn.

"Don't be taken in by photos showing damage to the second floor or those taken after the upper floors collapsed, which happened 20-30 minutes later," Fetzer said. "In fact, debris begins to show up on the completely clean lawn in short order, which might have been dropped from a C-130 that was circling above the Pentagon or placed there by men in suits who were photographed carrying debris with them." The most striking is a piece from the fuselage of a commercial airliner, which is frequently adduced as evidence.

James Hanson, a newspaper reporter who earned his law degree from the University of Michigan College of Law, has traced that debris to an American Airlines 757 that crashed in a rain forest above Cali, Columbia in 1995. "It was the kind of slow-speed crash that would have torn off paneling in this fashion, with no fires, leaving them largely intact." Fetzer has been so impressed with his research he has invited Hanson to submit his study to Scholars for consideration for publication on its web site, 911scholars.org.

"The Pentagon has become a kind of litmus test for rationality in the study of 9/11," Fetzer said. "Those who persist in maintaining that a Boeing 757 hit the building are either unfamiliar with the evidence or cognitively impaired. Unless," he added, "they want to mislead the American people. The evidence is beyond clear and compelling. It places this issue 'beyond a reasonable doubt'. No Boeing 757 hit the Pentagon."

James H. Fetzer
Founder
Scholars for 9/11 Truth"


http://twilightpines.com//index.php?...=110&Itemid=67

Last edited by luciferhorus; 07-07-2010 at 11:47 PM.
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Old 08-07-2010, 12:06 AM   #17
throatyogurt
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Quote:
Originally Posted by luciferhorus View Post
Well I suggest that you either read what you are responding to or perhaps you may consider taking a literary class.
Perhaps you can read the text from you that I quoted. I was asking for the proof you claimed to have had for the alive hijackers. (as you posted here)-

Quote:
I stated "unlike some of the other hijackers who "can" be proven to be still alive, the same proof does not exist for Majed."

You have since conceded the fact that this statement by you is erroneous and you can not prove ANY of the hijackers are still alive. Apparently there was some miss-communication in my post, I regret that. Be that as it may, my point stands. No one can prove any of the 19 hijackers were alive post 9-11.



Quote:
I do understand that most Americans are barely literate enough to read a cornflake's packet, but very minimal literacy skills are required to understand the stupidity of this.
Playground antics do nothing to phase me. Keep em coming, you are only digging a deeper ditch. I will be forced to add (sic) to all your spelling errors. (there are many)


Quote:
Well that hyperlink refers to an update to the article in 2006 which concludes:

"In an effort to make this clearer, we have made one small change to the original story. Under the FBI picture of Waleed al Shehri we have added the words "A man called Waleed Al Shehri..." to make it as clear as possible that there was confusion over the identity. The rest of the story remains as it was in the archive as a record of the situation at the time. "
Typical Truther antics. You skipped over the entire article and only posted the conclusion. Why?

Perhaps because the article states this:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Steve Herrmann BBC

The story, written in the immediate aftermath of the 9/11 attacks, was about confusion at the time surrounding the names and identities of some of the hijackers.

We later reported on the list of hijackers, thereby superseding the earlier report.

The confusion over names and identities we reported back in 2001 may have arisen because these were common Arabic and Islamic names.
So, your "evidence" from the BBC article is moot. Please feel free to post what further evidence you have that shows any of the 19 still alive.





Quote:
Well that is the judgement of "Pilots for 9/11 Truth" and Scholars for 9/11 Truth.

With regards to myself, I do not claim to be an expert in flight aviation, nor in aircraft engineering, nor in the specialist sciences of civil (structural) engineering or physics. This is probably probably true for most people here and thus, just like any judge and jury, we are reliant on the testimony of "credible" expert witnesses; however as the judge of this matter, it is quite reasonable to discount the testimony of all US state terrorist collaborators since the US state terrorists have a long history of deception, black military operations, genocide, war, imperalism and terrorism in general.
So, you listen only to conspiracy theorists? Rob Balsamo? Why would you listen to him? Because he has a website? The man is unemployed and admittedly had to live in one of his members basement because he got kicked out of another friends house that was putting him up. He has been proven wrong on so many occasions it isn't funny. Then you site the "Scholars" for 9/11 truth. Is this the site that "peer reviews" their own articles?

Your obvious paranoia with the American Government means you are unable to accept any agency that agrees with the findings of the NIST, 911 Commission, or any other investigative entity that does not support the fantasy of the Truth Movement.

Since you brought up the Pentagon, and the "tiny" hole, simple math will show you that the hole was not too small.

You posted a picture from Purdue's Computing Research Institute. Have you examined this information, or did you hand wave it away? It was accepted by many REAL Engineering firms and considered factual. Not one... I repeat not ONE paper has been submitted for peer reviews that refutes the work of Mete A. Sozen, Sami A. Kilic and Christoph M. Hoffmann.

In addition to the Purdue research, have you read the Pentagon Building Performance Report? If so, did you understand it? If not, do you contact a licensed engineer to answer the questions you had?


Quote:
Perhaps you might also state your professional qualifications in this matter, or are you just another terrorist collaborator who blindly and unquestioningly accepts whatever the current position of the American state terrorists is?
Terrorist Collaborator. That's a new one I have to admit. I am usually a shill or a government loyalist.

Back to Mr. Balsamo. If you read his forum, you will find that there is/was a member named Warren Stutt. (spelling) He in fact, decrypted the FDR and found that the last few seconds that were in question by pilots 4 911 truth were in fact favorable for the plane colliding with the Pentagon. The thing about Balsamo is, when proven wrong he still leaves his garbage on his site. (you may want to look into the "no seat back phones were available on 9/11") He was laughed out of several sites when confronted with that line of BS.

Your extensive post regarding Mr. James "no-Planer" Fetzer is a joke. This includes the extremely laughable "Fly Over" at the Pentagon.

(1) The hit point - Where are his calculations? Does he know the circumference of a Boeing 757? Does he know the size of the entrance hole? How did he get to this conclusion that it was too small?

(2)There were NOT 84 videos confiscated that show the impact. This was concluded by a Truther VIA FOIA. Regarding the witnesses to flight 77, as Fetzer states in (1) and contradicts in (2) that it was a large plane.

(3)Fetzer states: "flying more than 500 mph barely above ground level--physically impossible, because of the accumulation of a massive pocket of compressed gas (air) beneath the fuselage;" This is an outright lie. Go on youtube and search for airshows where there are VERY large jets doing exactly what he states is impossible.

(4) Fetzer hasn't a CLUE as to the height of the engines of a 757. Think about it.

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Old 08-07-2010, 02:00 AM   #18
luciferhorus
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Originally Posted by throatyogurt View Post
Terrorist Collaborator. That's a new one I have to admit. I am usually a shill or a government loyalist.
Thank your for that admission of terrorist collaboration. A “government loyalist” is a terrorist collaborator in my judgement, a person of no moral worth, a useless eater, etc. Please allow me to introduce myself I am a long term evangelical, genocidal, militant, apocalyptic Communist Internet activists. With the introductions out of the way, we can at least identify each other as “terrorists.” Ultimately of course I can assure you that with regards to “terror” on my part, I have “ultimately” no wish to simply“scare” the Anglo-American terrorist collaborators; I merely seek nothing less than their apocalyptic annihilation, so that they can happily fly up to their Capitalist Jesus in Capitalist Heaven and bother humanity no more.

Quote:
You have since conceded the fact that this statement by you is erroneous and you can not prove ANY of the hijackers are still alive. Apparently there was some miss-communication in my post, I regret that. Be that as it may, my point stands. No one can prove any of the 19 hijackers were alive post 9-11.
OK Fair enough. The matter of the hijackers being alive is subject to some dispute and is inconclusive; thus, this may just end up as a "red herring ( distraction)" with regards to 911 being carried out by the world's leading terrorist organisation (The US government), so I will set this point aside; it is hardly the main issue with regards to the decades long history of U.S. State terrorist deception, genocide, black operations, narco-terrorism (narcotics trafficking), war and the manifestation of human evil in general; I generally discuss much wider topics that the specifics of some alleged Al Queda member (i.e. a US military asset, pawn, employee or whatever).

Quote:
Playground antics do nothing to phase me. Keep em coming, you are only digging a deeper ditch. I will be forced to add (sic) to all your spelling errors. (there are many)
My spelling, grammar and punctuation suffer from my 70 wpm typing speed and the effects of alcohol and other substances; I also exist on numerous parts of the Internet and this forum only gets part of my attention; I am too busy to bother too much with form and tend to concentrate on content. I readily admit to not using a spell checker but it is not due to a lack of education; I am perfectly literate, however you don't appear to be able to comprehend statements which you are responding to; that is a lack of basic literacy skills; I don't suffer from that.

Quote:
So, you listen only to conspiracy theorists? Rob Balsamo?
Well you can throw ad hominem attacks at Rob all day long and criticise his personal situation as much as you wish, but he is certainly indisputably a qualified pilot.

What exactly are your aviation qualifications?

Quote:
Your obvious paranoia with the American Government means you are unable to accept any agency that agrees with the findings of the NIST, 911 Commission, or any other investigative entity that does not support the fantasy of the Truth Movement.
Paranoia is defined as a "false fear." I have already stated my position that the US state terrorists have a long history of provable deception, black military operations, false flag operations, state terrorism, narco-terrorism, war, genocide, Capitalist imperialism etc., and that any evidence presented by US state terrorist collaborators is thus to be treated as dubious "terrorist propaganda" in my judgement and not as "evidence;" this is only fair, just a judge would point out to a jury that a witness in a court who is a known collaborator with an organisation with a similar history of deception, torture, murder, genocide, drugs trafficking etc., would direct the jury to consider such testimony as unreliable.


Quote:
Since you brought up the Pentagon, and the "tiny" hole, simple math will show you that the hole was not too small.
What exactly are you qualifications in mathematics, physics and structural engineering?

Quote:
You posted a picture from Purdue's Computing Research Institute. Have you examined this information, or did you hand wave it away? It was accepted by many REAL Engineering firms and considered factual. Not one... I repeat not ONE paper has been submitted for peer reviews that refutes the work of Mete A. Sozen, Sami A. Kilic and Christoph M. Hoffmann. In addition to the Purdue research, have you read the Pentagon Building Performance Report? If so, did you understand it? If not, do you contact a licensed engineer to answer the questions you had?
OK so before we go any further and you waste any more of my time, since you have already admitted that you are an overtly declared terrorist collaborator, rather than you just continuing to spout terrorist propaganda and the testimony of other state terrorist collaborators such as yourself, what exactly are your aeronautical, scientific, engineering, mathematical, physicist, (etc.) qualifications and areas of professional or academic expertise?

Lux
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Old 08-07-2010, 03:22 AM   #19
ultima1
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[QUOTE=throatyogurt;1059031429]Why do you continue to spread this crap, Roger? You have been told time and time again that this is not reliable.
[\QUOTE]

Its not crap if you cannot prove it wrong.

If its not reliable why hasn't anyone been able to prove it wrong?

I will be waiting for your evidence to prove it wrong.

Last edited by ultima1; 08-07-2010 at 03:24 AM.
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Old 08-07-2010, 03:36 AM   #20
dusan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ultima1 View Post
Well it proves that at leaast 2 of the hijackers that were supposed to be on the planes are alive.
i have tried to find evidence of hijackers still alive and sadly there is none
could be is supressed or not.
but ther isnt solid evidence of hijackers being still alive at the moment.
that doesnt mean that there is many questions unanswer relating all 911.
specially the pentagon, building 7 etc. etc
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