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Old 28-05-2009, 07:07 PM   #1
entrangermercenary
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Smile Crossbows

Crossbows are not a good weapon if you have other choices of firearms. Granted they are better than nothing. If you think you are going to fire one off and kill somebody instantly forgett it !! If you think they are silent and there is no noise , there is noise. Then there is the pissing about reloading it while matey is closing on you frothing at the mouth screaming his head off because u just shot him with a crossbow. Dont think you will be shooting at 200ms either unless you are william tell Ive used them, they dont work as a reliable killing weapon with one bolt !!Ive Nicked this from another site below


OldRecon08-12-2005, 05:05 AM
The French Special Force 1er RPIMa use some crossbows.

The French Foreign legion also have played around with crossbows. At least during the 1980's. There's a photo from that period of one legionnaire with green beret aiming a crossbow in the book on the Foreign legion by Canadian John Robert Young. The bowpiece of the weapon appears to be made of blackened steel.
Pic appears to have been taken at a "commando course" run in the Pyrenees.
As for the weapon itself, with what percentage of possibility can one produce a head shot at distances of 4 meters, 10 meters and 20 meters?
Can effects of dart/bolt be enhanced with poison?
One disadvantage with crossbows not mentioned so far is reload time.
If target consists of more than one person in close proximity of each other, I thus guess a silenced smg, carabine or pistol would work better?


Or

don't know why they would. Maybe due to the lack of military buget in their country they had to resort to something. Thinking "outside of the box" is part of special operations. I would think every spec ops type unit in the world has thought of using a crossbow, I know I did.


Here are the facts;

Crossbows are not nearly as silent as you may think. When your life is completely reliant on stelth, this is a poor choice of weaponry. Even a suppressed .22 with subsonic ammo shot through a pillow sounds like a howitzer in the dead of night when you don't want anyone to hear you.

Even proffessionaly built crossbow bolts will lack any kind of consitancy in shot grouping not to mention the relitivly short range.

An arrow/bolt kills it's victim through bleed out and shock. This can take a long time, and the victim is usually aware, and making a lot of noise. A crossbow that would be able to penetrate a human skull would be very powerfull, thus, very noisy.

Reload time is slow, and again, makes more noise than you may think.

The bulk of this weapon in relation to it's effectivness compared to that of a suppressed firearm just doesn't add up.

If you have ever done any kind of patrol in the jungle, you'll know that every once counts, every piece of gear that is not completely nessesary is soon ditched.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but this is just the way it is.

Do any research you like it all comes up negative.

Any thoughts tracker or anybody ??
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Old 28-05-2009, 10:18 PM   #2
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Don't be so negative man.

Crossbows still fcking hurt and kill, especially if you use barbed hunting bolts

The Chinese still use them. One reason they state is that the bolts hitting a suicide bomber will not detonate where a hot, fast bullet would.

I know for defensive positions xbows rock. You can reuse bolts and make 'em much easier than bullets too

Firearms work too but not everyone has one

Last edited by rydeon; 28-05-2009 at 10:33 PM.
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Old 28-05-2009, 10:25 PM   #3
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In a land where all the guns have been taken away, the man with a crossbow is king...

I'd be using such things for hunting, personally, but there you go.
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Old 28-05-2009, 10:49 PM   #4
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I remember my instuctor telling me once that in a man to man contest, the winner will be the one that go's in close to the other.

Crossbows are misunderstood by the great unwashed which is a good thing. If they can see you with it they will know that it can hurt like hell. But if someone was on the warpath then I would put down the crossbow and go for a hand to hand tool instead. A pistle or knife or billhook or axe. Let them come in close and give it to them.

I think that they are better for hunting due to the sound a gun can make copaired with a crossbow. Sounds atract people. I would later use a gun when folk are more sparten. I dont need to eat a dear a day, and a crossbow to hunt for small game at night is better for me.

I have just ordered a colapsable 150lb type for close quarter work. It fits snug on my back.

I will add for referance that it is iliegle to hunt with a crossbow in the uk. So dont tell the copper that you are hunting if he asks. You can carry it around in the open as it is perfectly legal to. But have a place that you are going to all thought out in advance. I see myself as a freeman, so my answers may differ from your own, but by having a cover story and being happy to give your name and a false address you can carry it in the open. Or put it in a bag.


Nelly.
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Old 28-05-2009, 10:50 PM   #5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamweaver View Post
In a land where all the guns have been taken away, the man with a crossbow is king...

I'd be using such things for hunting, personally, but there you go.
But guns are still available to the lawfull. So I say get one if you can.


Nelly.
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Old 28-05-2009, 10:57 PM   #6
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But guns are still available to the lawfull. So I say get one if you can.
I've considered getting a shotgun licence - but it occurred to me that the very first thing the policy enforcement officers will do when TSHTF is round up all the guns off the legal owners. A shotgun is a fine weapon for defending against burglars and the like - but no real match for an Armed Response Unit.

So I dunno. If I was going to get one, I'd probably acquire it by "other" means.
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Old 28-05-2009, 11:08 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamweaver View Post
I've considered getting a shotgun licence - but it occurred to me that the very first thing the policy enforcement officers will do when TSHTF is round up all the guns off the legal owners. A shotgun is a fine weapon for defending against burglars and the like - but no real match for an Armed Response Unit.

So I dunno. If I was going to get one, I'd probably acquire it by "other" means.
Get one now and then lose it tomorrow. Get ammo too first. or the means to make it.

First however, ask a mate that understands if you can use his address.


Nelly.
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Old 29-05-2009, 04:02 AM   #8
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In a land where all the guns have been taken away, the man with a crossbow is king

Yes, and they are damned scary when facing one.
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Old 29-05-2009, 04:04 AM   #9
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Originally Posted by entrangermercenary View Post
Crossbows are not a good weapon if you have other choices of firearms.

Crossbows arn't firearms, just like dogs arn't Cats !

Even a suppressed .22 with subsonic ammo shot through a pillow sounds like a howitzer in the dead of night when you don't want anyone to hear you.

Thats funny all the ones I've used were so silent you could hear the firing pin strike the rim, but only if you were right next to it.From two feet away no noise at all.


If you have ever done any kind of patrol in the jungle, you'll know that every once counts, every piece of gear that is not completely nessesary is soon ditched.
I have, but what has this got to do with crossbows
No offence mate, but you come across as a Walt who's spent a bit of time in the TA. Trying to pass himself off as special forces

Every Britsh Legion has one.

Quote:
Originally Posted by tom bombadil View Post
But guns are still available to the lawfull. So I say get one if you can.


Nelly.
Well said that man!

Waylander
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Old 29-05-2009, 05:03 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by waylander View Post
No offence mate, but you come across as a Walt who's spent a bit of time in the TA. Trying to pass himself off as special forces

Every Britsh Legion has one.



Well said that man!

Waylander

Oh shit rumbled
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Old 29-05-2009, 06:57 AM   #11
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Even proffessionaly built crossbow bolts will lack any kind of consitancy in shot grouping not to mention the relitivly short range.
That statement is not true!

I am an archer that uses bows with all the sights weights and balances on
and can shoot into a spot of 25mm at 70 metres consistently. 40lb Hoyt recurve.

I also shoot bare bow - no sights, balances or shock absorbers etc,
and can shoot into a 50mm spot consistently at between 18 and 50 metres.
70lb Grozier Scythian bow and 50lb Korean bow. The 50lb is for visitors to try!

I also shoot crossbow, and consistently shoot groups of bolts into
a 50mm spot between 18 and 50 metres. 150lb draw weight.

The crossbow is easy to shoot accurately compared to a bow.
A bow takes weeks of practice to shoot very accurately,
a crossbow takes about 30 minutes - certainly less than an hour.

As to its lethality - using a target bolt or arrow - these will pass straight through a human at short ranges,
and unless a head shot will not kill instantly - indeed thay may not even realise thay had been shot at all for a while, depending on adrenaline levels.
The wound being about 6mm for carbon arrows, 8mm for crossbow bolt, 10mm for wooden arrows.
However my broad-head bolts leave a wound of 25mm, and that would induce death by blood loss within a few seconds (in the right place of course).

Because I was practicing for something I did not touch my crossbow for 3 months,
but the first three shots were all placed into a 50x50mm square piece of card at 30 metres.
That was after not even looking at the crossbow for 90 days! The accuracy was still good.
If I laid off the bows for 90 days, I probably would not be able to draw the 70lb,
and the grouping would be about dinner plate size instead of egg cup size at say 20 metres.

Crossbows are slower to load than bows, and care has to be taken to draw the string back evenly, or it will shoot off to one side.
There is some noise from both the bows and crossbow, but nothing like an air rifle or fire arm,
and on a windy day I doubt you would hear them at say 20 metres.

I am quite prepared to back up my claims.
Pop along to your local archery club and find out for yourselves.
Learn to shoot and then you will know, instead of speculating - usually wrongly!
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Old 29-05-2009, 09:37 AM   #12
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What you say is as I have read it too.

I had to choose between the two and got the crossbow as a result of staments like your own.

Bullets (rounds) travel at a far greater rate than a bolt (from bow or cr.bow) which is why when one is hit by a bullet, more damage internaly is evident.

The slower speed of the bolts wont deform either on entry, so keeping the target hole small. So by having a cutting edge (hunting head) on the bolt or arrow, one can cause more damage from this relitivly slow unit.



Nelly with more of the same
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Old 29-05-2009, 02:39 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dreamweaver View Post
I've considered getting a shotgun licence - but it occurred to me that the very first thing the policy enforcement officers will do when TSHTF is round up all the guns off the legal owners. A shotgun is a fine weapon for defending against burglars and the like - but no real match for an Armed Response Unit.

So I dunno. If I was going to get one, I'd probably acquire it by "other" means.
The trick is to of got your INCH bag prepped and packed and be away before the PTB roll up for arms collections.
In WW2 the PTB actually had to ask the USA to send them rifles due to the arms bans on machine guns in the civilian sector
Just got my provisional membership at the gunclub and the gun safe is in place...

Last edited by rydeon; 29-05-2009 at 02:41 PM.
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Old 29-05-2009, 03:11 PM   #14
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Consider the intimidation factor of pointing a crossbow at an intruder. I think most people would shit their pants at the prospect of taking a crossbow bolt.
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Old 29-05-2009, 04:23 PM   #15
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I'm interested in learning to shoot a crossbow, but can't find anyone offering training in the NW. Has anyone any suggestions?
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Old 29-05-2009, 04:34 PM   #16
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Originally Posted by gilly View Post
I'm interested in learning to shoot a crossbow, but can't find anyone offering training in the NW. Has anyone any suggestions?
Maybe they can help?

http://www.lancashire-archery.org.uk/

http://www.sudden-impact.co.uk/archery.html

Last edited by brainfreeze; 29-05-2009 at 04:35 PM.
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Old 29-05-2009, 05:12 PM   #17
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Originally Posted by brainfreeze View Post
Cheers Brainfreeze. I did a bit of googling earlier, but was having problems with the internet crashing every few minutes. I'll give these a try.

{edit** No, it's all long bow archery - can't seem to get any sense out of anybody on the subject!

Last edited by gilly; 29-05-2009 at 05:28 PM.
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Old 29-05-2009, 10:07 PM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gilly View Post
I'm interested in learning to shoot a crossbow, but can't find anyone offering training in the NW. Has anyone any suggestions?

http://www.archeryworld.co.uk/acatalog/Crossbows.html

Click on the 'Home' link and you'll find their 'phone number.
Ask if they have an indoor range to try archery products,
a lot of big shops do. If they don't ask if they know anyone
who uses crossbow in their area - I'll bet they do.

Don't be put off by the 150lb draw weight.
Most blokes can't cock one of these without some effort,
so make/buy one of these. Make from wire coat hanger and strong string/paracord. On that youtube link there are some other crossbow vids that may
or may not be useful to you - I haven't watched them.

If all else fails, PM me and I'll see what I can do to help.
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Old 29-05-2009, 10:14 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by entrangermercenary View Post
Crossbows are not a good weapon if you have other choices of firearms. Granted they are better than nothing. If you think you are going to fire one off and kill somebody instantly forgett it !! If you think they are silent and there is no noise , there is noise. Then there is the pissing about reloading it while matey is closing on you frothing at the mouth screaming his head off because u just shot him with a crossbow.
Sounds to me that you have the wrong cross bow .

try something with 80bls of power , it would ( although not condoned in anyway ) fire through a car door and pin the person sitting their to that seat .

if fired in the air ------------you DONT get it back and it will dissapear out of sight way before it ever lands .

make no mistake , cross bows are deadly , they can throw a bolt through the head of a cow .
they can cut through a shead pannel 1cm thick no probs and stick into and pearce the rears wall behind it .

as for the acuracy ---------you need practice .

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Old 29-05-2009, 10:35 PM   #20
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Talking Mossberg VS Predator Crossbow

http://www.crossbowchannel.com/Revie...rAVi_page1.htm

I had One Of These a while ago, but I gave it away Crap




But I prefer One Of These, But I Sold it, More Fun i regret it big Time
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