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Old 04-07-2010, 08:23 PM   #21
scorpio
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in other words , dont you dare challenge the masonic created version of history.

Just like those awful masonic authors Benet and Pagent writing their falsehoods on the life of christ

Everything is a perversion of truth when dealing with you lot
In what way do Freemasons pevert the truth? and can you provide sources please
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Old 04-07-2010, 08:26 PM   #22
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History cannot be changed by God, macneil, the Masons, or me. If you do not want to be educated then that is your problem not mine. If that is the situation, then I must tell you that I care not.
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Old 04-07-2010, 08:44 PM   #23
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History cannot be changed by God
This is where you are detrimentally wrong

The true God has no love for what is occurring on this earth and the constant perversion of truth by those only concerned with ritual... things WILL change you can bet on it
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Old 04-07-2010, 08:46 PM   #24
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This is where you are detrimentally wrong

The true God has no love for what is occurring on this earth and things WILL change you can bet on it
Can you please tell me the name of the 'true God' and why things will change?
regards
Gerard
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Old 04-07-2010, 08:57 PM   #25
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Can you please tell me the name of the 'true God' and why things will change?
regards
Gerard
The fact that you think God needs a 'name' is symptomatic of your sickness. Those focused on ritual are in a state of disease. You will all be healed by the true God.
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EVERYTHING!!! is a state of mind

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Old 04-07-2010, 09:15 PM   #26
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The fact that you think God needs a 'name' is symptomatic of your sickness. Those focused on ritual are in a state of disease. You will all be healed by the true God.
Please tell me why a need for God having a name is " symptomatic of sickness and in a state of disease and how and why we will be healed by the true God
regards
Gerard
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Old 04-07-2010, 09:23 PM   #27
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Who controls history, controls the future. Who controls the present, controls history.

Mr Orwell
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Old 04-07-2010, 09:52 PM   #28
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Who controls history, controls the future. Who controls the present, controls history.

Mr Orwell
If I might be allowed to pick a nit...

"He who controls the past controls the future. He who controls the present controls the past."

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Old 04-07-2010, 10:06 PM   #29
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If I might be allowed to pick a nit...

"He who controls the past controls the future. He who controls the present controls the past."

You just copy and pasted that, come on... I was changing history
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Old 04-07-2010, 10:16 PM   #30
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You just copy and pasted that, come on... I was changing history
We were told that Freemasons change history, are you a Freemason?
Brother/Frater Gerard
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Old 04-07-2010, 10:30 PM   #31
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We were told that Freemasons change history, are you a Freemason?
Brother/Frater Gerard
Better, G_D...
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Old 04-07-2010, 10:33 PM   #32
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Better, G_D...
I had my Red Bull today As a Freemason we are told that we drink the blood of the first born That is not easy to do these days.
Brother/Frater Gerard
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Old 04-07-2010, 10:42 PM   #33
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I had my Red Bull today As a Freemason we are told that we drink the blood of the first born That is not easy to do these days.
Brother/Frater Gerard

I was baptised Catholic, I used to eat dead bodies on Sundays as a child to fit in... the things people do, I dunno. Stick to blood, Red Bull will kill you...
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Old 05-07-2010, 04:44 PM   #34
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Default 2 bee or not 2 bee

The beehive, though a significant symbol of the Craft, lies outside the mainstream of Masonic icons.

The beehive is a rather curious symbol, and it has always posed a problem for the Craft. The problem does not lie in what the beehive symbolizes, industry and cooperation, two perfectly good Masonic virtues. The thing setting the beehive apart is its variance with the main categories of Craft symbology.

The first of these categories is a group of architectural objects: the square, compasses, level, etc. They come from the age of Gothic cathedrals and illustrate man’s place in the universe by the working tools of operative masons.

The other is a group of Biblical symbols: Jacob’s Ladder, King Solomon’s Temple, etc. They tap more directly into the world’s spiritual heritage and bring the fruits of ancient wisdom to the Craft.

Curiously, the beehive does not fit either category. Although it promotes cooperative labor, it is not really an architectural symbol; and while the Bible occasionally mentions milk and honey, that scarcely qualifies the beehive as a Biblical symbol. This places it among a small group of Masonic icons that lie outside the mainstream. So where did this peculiar item originate, and what does it have to do with Freemasonry? The answer may lie in an obscure piece of church symbology: the beehive has long been associated with St. Bernard of Clairvaux, representing the sweet eloquence for which he was justly famous.

At first glance, St. Bernard seems far removed from the modern Masonic Lodge, but they are connected, albeit by a tenuous thread, and that thread extends all the way back to the early years of the Crusades.

Shortly after the start of the twelfth century, a FRENCH knight named Hugh de Payens approached Bernard, then serving as Abbot of Clairvaux, France, for help in promoting an order of knights he had just organized. The project grew from de Payens’s grand vision of leading an armed force to patrol the road from Joppa to Jerusalem.

In those days, many pilgrims made a heroic effort traveling to the Holy Land, only to die of thirst or fall prey to bandits on the last 50 kilometers of the journey. Hugh de Payens saw the need for protection on that final, short leg of the pilgrimage, but he had only a handful of followers and no financial resources. To make his plan work, he needed official recognition from the church, money for munitions and supplies, and new recruits. To secure all these, he needed help from high places.

That’s where Abbot Bernard came in. When the issue was presented to him, he welcomed its challenge. He had always longed to be a crusading knight and might have been, had it not been for his chronically poor health. While that aspiration still eluded him, as one of the most influential men in the church, he could now have the vicarious pleasure of sponsoring a band of knights. So he gave de Payens his complete support, using his eloquence to its fullest in arguing the knight’s case to the church hierarchy. They naturally gave weight to Bernard’s words. The cause that he brought to their attention was certainly a righteous one, and his eloquent presentation spurred them to act quickly.

The new Order, now universally known as the Knights Templar, became one of the most famous organizations in the world. It held sway in both church and military circles for nearly 200 years. Even now, centuries after its demise, it remains a centerpiece in the romance of the Crusades.

The details of the Templars’ story, their heroism, and piety, later tainted by pride and corruption; their glorious rise and tragic fall; and the epic struggles that spanned their career—dramatically combine the best and worst of the human condition. Vignettes of Templar history depict virtues to which everyone can aspire and lessons everyone should heed.

The Templar heritage has been claimed by more than one fraternity. However, none of that would have happened if they had not got off to a good start. Surely it is no coincidence that the beehive, the emblem of Bernard’s eloquence, the very key to the Templars’ initial success, entered the symbology of the Masonic Fraternity that, centuries later, would claim descent from the Order.

Of course this is far from proof that Freemasonry descended from the Templars. At most it shows that some long-forgotten Mason introduced the symbol to commemorate a legendary connection, which he himself might not have thought historically sound. But as the beehive is neither architectural nor Biblical, we must look elsewhere for the basis of its association with the Craft. In that regard, its subtle connection with St. Bernard provides a satisfying answer. It explains why the beehive belongs among the Fraternity’s symbols. And his connection with the Templars shows what this curious symbol has to do with virtues that Masons have always held dear.

Illustrious Ralph A. Herbold, 33°, member of the Valley of Long Beach, California, and Editor of the Southern California Research Lodge F.&A.M., appended the following note to Brother Hunter’s essay: In an interesting addition to the above article, there is a Degree within the Holy Royal Arch Knight Templar Priests known as the Master of the Blue or Knight of Solomon. The main symbol of this Degree is the beehive, and it contains a legend woven around the Queen of Sheba, King Solomon, and a beehive. The fact that it is a chivalric Degree is, in my opinion, significant.

http://www.srmason-sj.org/council/jo...n99/HUNTER.HTM
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Old 05-07-2010, 05:21 PM   #35
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Default History

"Even God cannot change the past." Agathon (448 BC - 400 BC)
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Old 05-07-2010, 06:23 PM   #36
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Default Spin Priests

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Ah now there is a lot of material been written about such possibilities over the last couple of decades. There is certainly plenty of evidince to suggest that parts of the bible were lifted pretty much stratight from ancient Egyptian religion, though sometimes with different words.

Interesting thought.

Dont forget the spin that history has placed on Akenaton though. But it would have to be said that there is a strong case for arguing that his father and him did start the first single god above all philosophy in the western world at least. And as noted above, when you compare modern day religions with it you can see distinct, and sometimes pretty near word for word similarities. Makes you think.


Good to see UGLE formally address an issue raised by lightgiver

Not forgetting the spin of the historical past we have been spoon fed,

I wonder how many people know the real historical facts?


“Not only were many of the founders of the United States government Masons, but they received aid from a secret and august body existing in Europe which helped them to establish this country for a peculiar and particular purpose known only to the initiated few.”

33rd Degree Mason Manly P. Hall, “The Secret Teachings of All Ages” (XC and XCI)

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"Even God cannot change the past." Agathon (448 BC - 400 BC)
http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=123787


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What has Robert Lomas got to do with me?

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Yes, Bob Lomas is a friend of mine

Unquote.

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showt...119931&page=14




Large parts of the New Testament are adapted from Egyptian texts. A truth Christians would vehemently deny but as we have shown after delving deeper into the Bible this is a fact stranger than fiction and as we have discovered by comparing the gospel in conjunction with the Book of the Dead it is now self-evident. These Egyptian texts that date back to the earliest dynasties of Egypt found on the walls of tombs and on coffins and copied onto papyrus have been introduced into the Tanach by scribes taking what was not theirs in contravention of the law of Jehovah' Neither shall you steal' (Deut 5:19)and now used by Christians who swore by a 'man god' to make a gospel. The question to be asked is why did Matthew use an Egyptian magic list to write his gospel? Why did he make Jesus follow every spell in the Book of the Dead? Anti-Jewish writings. Findings echoed in the Jewish Babylonian Talmud which describes Jesus as an 'Egyptian sorcerer' who was 'to be stoned because he practiced magic and incited Jews to worship alien gods and as a false prophet, led Israel astray'. (Morton Smith, Jesus the Magician, New York, 1978, p.49.). In many respects the good news should be called the Book of Osiris. In order to conquer the pagan world of Rome a cult enlisted the help and support of Egypt, which theologically means an act of apostasy and in the eyes of G-D faith in any one apart from him, cannot save. The question must arise and be asked, did Jesus exist at all? Does the similarity of the gospels to the Egyptian Book of the Dead imply that Christianity is a fabrication based upon Egyptian writings? If so the whole of Christiandom would be in contravention of the law of Jehovah 'Thou shalt not bear false witness' (Deut 5:20) since the gospel is based upon the writings of Egypt. We are reminded of the statement of Saul 'All scripture is given by inspiration of G-d.' No it is not it is manufactured in Egypt's gods!
So here we shall deal with Matthew, the gospel based on the Book of the Dead, a book that contains over 188 spells, all these magic spells are found in the gospel and are the reason for the great contrast from that of the Tanach (Old Testament). Most of these spells are given an introduction. From my observations it is clear that the gospel writer has taken the spell title and its rendition to form the basis for the New Testament.

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showt...86662&page=160

Last edited by lightgiver; 05-07-2010 at 06:44 PM.
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Old 05-07-2010, 06:33 PM   #37
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Default Usama

is the Spanish word for bee.

Additionally, the NZ seat of govt is "The Beehive".



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Old 05-07-2010, 07:38 PM   #38
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Originally Posted by grandsecretary View Post

What has Robert Lomas got to do with me?

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Yes, Bob Lomas is a friend of mine

Unquote.
So what? His views are his and mine are mine. We disagree, but remain friends although I have not seen him for about 2 years. Please do not superimpose his fictional books upon the historical world. He is NOT a historian and does not claim to be so.
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Old 05-07-2010, 07:52 PM   #39
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Default Golden Bees

Childeric I (c. 440– c. 481) was the Merovingian king of the Salian Franks from 457 until his death, and the father of Clovis.



Golden bees discovered in the tomb of Childeric,


Childeric's tomb was discovered in 1653 (May 27) by a mason doing repairs in the church of Saint-Brice in Tournai, a city in modern Belgium. Numerous precious objects were found, including a richly ornamented sword, a torse-like bracelet, jewels of gold and garnet cloisonné, gold coins, a gold bull's head and a ring with the inscription CHILDERICI REGIS ("of Childeric the king"), which identified the tomb. Some 300 golden bees were also found. Archduke Leopold William, governor of the Southern Netherlands (today's Belgium), had the find published in Latin. The treasure went first to the Habsburgs in Vienna, then as a gift to Louis XIV, who was not impressed with the treasure and stored it in the royal library, which became the Bibliothèque Nationale de France during the Revolution. Napoleon was more impressed with Childeric's bees and when he was looking for a heraldic symbol to trump the Bourbon fleur-de-lys. he settled on Childeric's bees as symbols of the French Empire.

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Old 05-07-2010, 08:06 PM   #40
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This



Elba Island


Napoleon

Napoleone Villa's


VILLA SAN MARTINO



Beginning on the outskirts, the most famous villa is the Villa di S. Martino situated between woods and vineyards approximately 6 km from the center. Adapted by the emperor as a summer residence, the two-story manor is decorated with frescoes by Pietro Ravelli commissioned by Napoleon.

Rooms of interest: Napoleon's bedroom, La Sala di Consiglio (board-room), General Bertrand's apartment and the Egyptian room.
In 1851, the Prince Anatolio Demidoff, a distant relative of Napoleon, bought the house and enlarged it with a neoclassical structure that now serves as a museum-shrine and is a prestigious center for cultural events and exhibitions.
VILLA DEI MULINI



Returning to the center of the city we climb from the large parking lot at the foot of the Medicean bastions, through the arch of the Porta a Terra, via Sebastiano Lambardi e via del Carmine where stands the ex –Carmine church of the hospital by the same name built in 1617 by the Marchese Corbello.
Continuing up Via V. Hugo, through the 16th century archway you arrive at the Palazzo dei Mulini (the Mill Palace) named for the former windmills that once occupied the site. This was the official residence of Napoleon and his court.

Rooms of interest: the office, the reception hall, the cloak-room (with the Napoleonic flag of Elba: white and red with three gold bees)

THE SYMBOLS OF EMPIRE

The Bee

Symbol of immortality and resurrection, the bee was chosen so as to link the new dynasty to the very origins of France. Golden bees (in fact, cicadas) were discovered in 1653 in Tournai in the tomb of Childeric I, founder in 457 of the Merovingian dynasty and father of Clovis. They were considered as the oldest emblem of the sovereigns of France.

Napoleon I in Coronation Robes





The Masonic Trophonius of Ledadia, which commemorates two famous architects.

From a civic perspective the Bee was a popular emblem of Napoleon’s rule, and more than 60 cities throughout France and Europe selected an officially approved heraldic shield that included three Bees as part of its template.


Two examples of French heraldry Bee shields: Mazamet and La Meilleraye de Bretagne.

http://www.andrewgough.co.uk/bee3_1.html




Logo of the secret Sufi society with a Bee near the flame of a candle. (Lamp of Thoth?)


Logo of Cercle Saint Dagobert II; A Bee in a Hexagon


France – believed to be in the shape of a natural Hexagon.


Roslyn Chapel and the entrance to the stone Beehive.
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