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Old 18-07-2012, 07:11 PM   #41
kadosh
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Freemasonry is not for everyone. So why bother to understand or criticise if it is of no interest in the first place.
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Old 19-07-2012, 10:41 AM   #42
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I'm not sure why people join, I know about the questions you have to ask yourself before you ask them.

Personally I'm not for or against Freemasons/freemasonry because I don't play dress up or respond well to hierarchies of most types in any way, shape or form. Even if the degrees are in a T shape, like a tree to me it doesn't matter. I'm more interested in the history and esoterics of it.
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Old 25-07-2012, 12:04 AM   #43
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Originally Posted by welling View Post
None of you anti-mason, conspiracy theorists want to become masons, to find out about what it is actually is all about. Instead you all seem to prefer to hide behind your keyboards and attack it.
A person just has asked you about the freemasonry. Saying that someone is hiding behind his keyboard is less hidden than masons’ hiding behind their secrets.
The better question would be also - why or why not to enter masonry?

I will tell you why I wouldn’t.
1. Speaking about the “secrets” – I can say: there aren’t any secrets. They are actually stories taken from the past and from that stories is made a salad of truth and non-truth. In the masonry you will start to believe that you know some secrets, but they are just fair tales. I have read so many books of freemasons and I can say it is the most boring literature. The biggest secret of freemasonry is the secrets of networking. So, you will get punished if you reveal the secret of a lodge member name. Well, people enter a society giving an oath to be killed if..? Great society.
2. People in Masonry feel “special”. That feeling is made by brainwashing technique from the step One. I can compare it with, let us say, “the society of beautiful women”. Think you are a woman and you enter that society. You will feel better and more beautiful. You will start to believe in it, but nothing happened. It is just a placebo effect on your brain. Since there are not any secrets, with their brainwashing techniques, which is mostly a fear-technique, your mental concept will change and you will start to believe you know more than other, since you are delighted. So please, tell me what is that delighted state of a high-ranking mason? There is no any secret and not any light. People on the LSD get lighter. You are the same person, and you live as before, you sleep, you eat, you drink and go to toilet. So please, if the secrets of being the God is achieved, so why do you need it? Next life? Please...
3. It is not only non-Christian, but anti-Christian movement. It is directly dealing with Lucifer, and we know what is Lucifer, Luce, Light. It is not the Christian light of the Holy Trinity, but the Christian light of Lucifer. It is the promised light of being as God. As I said before, it is not possible to achieve the Truth if you make a mixture of truth and non-truth. If you see what is included in Masonry you will get a headache. It is a terrible hardcore ego-trip. I believe in the conception of The Holy Trinity, the very hard philosophy. You can inform you by reading for instance Philokalia. It is the concept of the world which is only possible sustainable as such.
4. Masonry is an entrance to the higher occultist movements such OTO or Illuminati. On this forum you can maybe find an OTO member but you will never find an Illuminate. They don’t sit here. But OTO is openly dealing with dark powers trough some advanced brainwashing techniques with fear and sex. The people get completely crazy there having a sex with a demon – a temporary schizophrenic state of one’s personality. That is “the secret”. Nothing is illuminated or hidden. But question if OTO is under the law!
5. The power of Masonry is not in their “secret doctrine” or some “occult powers”. Their power is in networking which is going against the state. It is truth if your brother mason is in danger you have to help him despite the law! Far enough about honesty. All power of Masonry is in their network of powerful people. The most politician, banksters and other capitalists are masons. The power of NWO is not in their knowing of the “illuminated truth” or “mystical powers” or whatever. The power of NWO is a pure, physical power of media, industry, military, technique and money. Anyone can be powerful as such. Even my granny if she gets all this. I would shame to have such power.
6. One can be delighted without masonry. You can search the truth and give help to poor not being in any secret society. You can achieve a deep knowledge by yourself. But when you give a critique to a mason about masonry he replies: “you don’t know anything about that, inform yourself, you hate to much” or so. They are two different kinds of masons. The first are people not interested in making a fast progression in the grades. They are involved usually as simple Christian people. For them it is a kind of pat-position. You have stepped on a mine and can’t lift your foot. You just do what is necessary – you go to the lodge, discuss some “delights”, play chess, eat good food and pay a monthly fee.

Last edited by icxc; 25-07-2012 at 08:43 AM.
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Old 25-07-2012, 11:19 AM   #44
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Originally Posted by icxc View Post
A person just has asked you about the freemasonry. Saying that someone is hiding behind his keyboard is less hidden than masons’ hiding behind their secrets.
The better question would be also - why or why not to enter masonry?

I will tell you why I wouldn’t.
1. Speaking about the “secrets” – I can say: there aren’t any secrets. They are actually stories taken from the past and from that stories is made a salad of truth and non-truth. In the masonry you will start to believe that you know some secrets, but they are just fair tales. I have read so many books of freemasons and I can say it is the most boring literature. The biggest secret of freemasonry is the secrets of networking. So, you will get punished if you reveal the secret of a lodge member name. Well, people enter a society giving an oath to be killed if..? Great society.
2. People in Masonry feel “special”. That feeling is made by brainwashing technique from the step One. I can compare it with, let us say, “the society of beautiful women”. Think you are a woman and you enter that society. You will feel better and more beautiful. You will start to believe in it, but nothing happened. It is just a placebo effect on your brain. Since there are not any secrets, with their brainwashing techniques, which is mostly a fear-technique, your mental concept will change and you will start to believe you know more than other, since you are delighted. So please, tell me what is that delighted state of a high-ranking mason? There is no any secret and not any light. People on the LSD get lighter. You are the same person, and you live as before, you sleep, you eat, you drink and go to toilet. So please, if the secrets of being the God is achieved, so why do you need it? Next life? Please...
3. It is not only non-Christian, but anti-Christian movement. It is directly dealing with Lucifer, and we know what is Lucifer, Luce, Light. It is not the Christian light of the Holy Trinity, but the Christian light of Lucifer. It is the promised light of being as God. As I said before, it is not possible to achieve the Truth if you make a mixture of truth and non-truth. If you see what is included in Masonry you will get a headache. It is a terrible hardcore ego-trip. I believe in the conception of The Holy Trinity, the very hard philosophy. You can inform you by reading for instance Philokalia. It is the concept of the world which is only possible sustainable as such.
4. Masonry is an entrance to the higher occultist movements such OTO or Illuminati. On this forum you can maybe find an OTO member but you will never find an Illuminate. They don’t sit here. But OTO is openly dealing with dark powers trough some advanced brainwashing techniques with fear and sex. The people get completely crazy there having a sex with a demon – a temporary schizophrenic state of one’s personality. That is “the secret”. Nothing is illuminated or hidden. But question if OTO is under the law!
5. The power of Masonry is not in their “secret doctrine” or some “occult powers”. Their power is in networking which is going against the state. It is truth if your brother mason is in danger you have to help him despite the law! Far enough about honesty. All power of Masonry is in their network of powerful people. The most politician, banksters and other capitalists are masons. The power of NWO is not in their knowing of the “illuminated truth” or “mystical powers” or whatever. The power of NWO is a pure, physical power of media, industry, military, technique and money. Anyone can be powerful as such. Even my granny if she gets all this. I would shame to have such power.
6. One can be delighted without masonry. You can search the truth and give help to poor not being in any secret society. You can achieve a deep knowledge by yourself. But when you give a critique to a mason about masonry he replies: “you don’t know anything about that, inform yourself, you hate to much” or so. They are two different kinds of masons. The first are people not interested in making a fast progression in the grades. They are involved usually as simple Christian people. For them it is a kind of pat-position. You have stepped on a mine and can’t lift your foot. You just do what is necessary – you go to the lodge, discuss some “delights”, play chess, eat good food and pay a monthly fee.
Interesting response. Except, when one starts looking at who all of the 'high ups' in freemasonry are, it turns out that they are Presidents, Prime Ministers and the heads of the I.M.F, World Bank, European Bank, Sporting Brands, Music Record Labels, Hollywood production houses etc.

Coincidence?

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Old 25-07-2012, 11:22 AM   #45
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Originally Posted by icxc View Post
I will tell you why I wouldn’t.
1. Speaking about the “secrets” – I can say: there aren’t any secrets. They are actually stories taken from the past and from that stories is made a salad of truth and non-truth. In the masonry you will start to believe that you know some secrets, but they are just fair tales. I have read so many books of freemasons and I can say it is the most boring literature. The biggest secret of freemasonry is the secrets of networking. So, you will get punished if you reveal the secret of a lodge member name. Well, people enter a society giving an oath to be killed if..? Great society.
2. People in Masonry feel “special”. That feeling is made by brainwashing technique from the step One. I can compare it with, let us say, “the society of beautiful women”. Think you are a woman and you enter that society. You will feel better and more beautiful. You will start to believe in it, but nothing happened. It is just a placebo effect on your brain. Since there are not any secrets, with their brainwashing techniques, which is mostly a fear-technique, your mental concept will change and you will start to believe you know more than other, since you are delighted. So please, tell me what is that delighted state of a high-ranking mason? There is no any secret and not any light. People on the LSD get lighter. You are the same person, and you live as before, you sleep, you eat, you drink and go to toilet. So please, if the secrets of being the God is achieved, so why do you need it? Next life? Please...
3. It is not only non-Christian, but anti-Christian movement. It is directly dealing with Lucifer, and we know what is Lucifer, Luce, Light. It is not the Christian light of the Holy Trinity, but the Christian light of Lucifer. It is the promised light of being as God. As I said before, it is not possible to achieve the Truth if you make a mixture of truth and non-truth. If you see what is included in Masonry you will get a headache. It is a terrible hardcore ego-trip. I believe in the conception of The Holy Trinity, the very hard philosophy. You can inform you by reading for instance Philokalia. It is the concept of the world which is only possible sustainable as such.
4. Masonry is an entrance to the higher occultist movements such OTO or Illuminati. On this forum you can maybe find an OTO member but you will never find an Illuminate. They don’t sit here. But OTO is openly dealing with dark powers trough some advanced brainwashing techniques with fear and sex. The people get completely crazy there having a sex with a demon – a temporary schizophrenic state of one’s personality. That is “the secret”. Nothing is illuminated or hidden. But question if OTO is under the law!
5. The power of Masonry is not in their “secret doctrine” or some “occult powers”. Their power is in networking which is going against the state. It is truth if your brother mason is in danger you have to help him despite the law! Far enough about honesty. All power of Masonry is in their network of powerful people. The most politician, banksters and other capitalists are masons. The power of NWO is not in their knowing of the “illuminated truth” or “mystical powers” or whatever. The power of NWO is a pure, physical power of media, industry, military, technique and money. Anyone can be powerful as such. Even my granny if she gets all this. I would shame to have such power.
6. One can be delighted without masonry. You can search the truth and give help to poor not being in any secret society. You can achieve a deep knowledge by yourself. But when you give a critique to a mason about masonry he replies: “you don’t know anything about that, inform yourself, you hate to much” or so. They are two different kinds of masons. The first are people not interested in making a fast progression in the grades. They are involved usually as simple Christian people. For them it is a kind of pat-position. You have stepped on a mine and can’t lift your foot. You just do what is necessary – you go to the lodge, discuss some “delights”, play chess, eat good food and pay a monthly fee.
You are certainly free to your opinion.
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Old 25-07-2012, 09:21 PM   #46
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Originally Posted by icxc View Post
A person just has asked you about the freemasonry. Saying that someone is hiding behind his keyboard is less hidden than masons’ hiding behind their secrets.
The better question would be also - why or why not to enter masonry?

I will tell you why I wouldn’t.
1. Speaking about the “secrets” – I can say: there aren’t any secrets. They are actually stories taken from the past and from that stories is made a salad of truth and non-truth. In the masonry you will start to believe that you know some secrets, but they are just fair tales. I have read so many books of freemasons and I can say it is the most boring literature. The biggest secret of freemasonry is the secrets of networking. So, you will get punished if you reveal the secret of a lodge member name. Well, people enter a society giving an oath to be killed if..? Great society.
2. People in Masonry feel “special”. That feeling is made by brainwashing technique from the step One. I can compare it with, let us say, “the society of beautiful women”. Think you are a woman and you enter that society. You will feel better and more beautiful. You will start to believe in it, but nothing happened. It is just a placebo effect on your brain. Since there are not any secrets, with their brainwashing techniques, which is mostly a fear-technique, your mental concept will change and you will start to believe you know more than other, since you are delighted. So please, tell me what is that delighted state of a high-ranking mason? There is no any secret and not any light. People on the LSD get lighter. You are the same person, and you live as before, you sleep, you eat, you drink and go to toilet. So please, if the secrets of being the God is achieved, so why do you need it? Next life? Please...
3. It is not only non-Christian, but anti-Christian movement. It is directly dealing with Lucifer, and we know what is Lucifer, Luce, Light. It is not the Christian light of the Holy Trinity, but the Christian light of Lucifer. It is the promised light of being as God. As I said before, it is not possible to achieve the Truth if you make a mixture of truth and non-truth. If you see what is included in Masonry you will get a headache. It is a terrible hardcore ego-trip. I believe in the conception of The Holy Trinity, the very hard philosophy. You can inform you by reading for instance Philokalia. It is the concept of the world which is only possible sustainable as such.
4. Masonry is an entrance to the higher occultist movements such OTO or Illuminati. On this forum you can maybe find an OTO member but you will never find an Illuminate. They don’t sit here. But OTO is openly dealing with dark powers trough some advanced brainwashing techniques with fear and sex. The people get completely crazy there having a sex with a demon – a temporary schizophrenic state of one’s personality. That is “the secret”. Nothing is illuminated or hidden. But question if OTO is under the law!
5. The power of Masonry is not in their “secret doctrine” or some “occult powers”. Their power is in networking which is going against the state. It is truth if your brother mason is in danger you have to help him despite the law! Far enough about honesty. All power of Masonry is in their network of powerful people. The most politician, banksters and other capitalists are masons. The power of NWO is not in their knowing of the “illuminated truth” or “mystical powers” or whatever. The power of NWO is a pure, physical power of media, industry, military, technique and money. Anyone can be powerful as such. Even my granny if she gets all this. I would shame to have such power.
6. One can be delighted without masonry. You can search the truth and give help to poor not being in any secret society. You can achieve a deep knowledge by yourself. But when you give a critique to a mason about masonry he replies: “you don’t know anything about that, inform yourself, you hate to much” or so. They are two different kinds of masons. The first are people not interested in making a fast progression in the grades. They are involved usually as simple Christian people. For them it is a kind of pat-position. You have stepped on a mine and can’t lift your foot. You just do what is necessary – you go to the lodge, discuss some “delights”, play chess, eat good food and pay a monthly fee.
Fair comments and nothing revolutionary in terms of our understanding of the genre. Thank you for your clarity.

It is also not possible to achieve the truth without knowing about and accepting the ongoing contact with and manipulation of our race by other far more intelligent and powerful species. Some of those species cohabit in spirit form inside of humans. Or "demons" in religous terms, although I believe religion clouds the issues of alien presence and interaction with our species.

I don't doubt the upper echelons of the Masons hold the knowledge of alien (demon) spirit cohabitation (possession) as one of their secrets.

Demons or aliens ? Its already a well versed debate, but exactly the same agenda.
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Old 25-07-2012, 09:31 PM   #47
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I have read so many books of freemasons and I can say it is the most boring literature.
Depends on what you've read.

Quote:
Originally Posted by icxc View Post
The biggest secret of freemasonry is the secrets of networking. So, you will get punished if you reveal the secret of a lodge member name.
LOL...oh you're serious?! BWAHAHAHAHAHA

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Originally Posted by icxc View Post
2. People in Masonry feel “special”.
We do? I mean, my mom says I'm special.

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Originally Posted by icxc View Post
Since there are not any secrets, with their brainwashing techniques, which is mostly a fear-technique, your mental concept will change and you will start to believe you know more than other, since you are delighted.
There is no induction of fear.

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Originally Posted by icxc View Post
3. It is not only non-Christian, but anti-Christian movement.
No its not.

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Originally Posted by icxc View Post
It is directly dealing with Lucifer, and we know what is Lucifer, Luce, Light. It is not the Christian light of the Holy Trinity, but the Christian light of Lucifer.
But who is Lucifer? Lucifer was the translated name Helal (root of Hallelujah), a Babylonian king, but in St. Jerome's he mistranslated it as Lucifer as the day or morning star of his time was referred to as Lucifer.

The York Rite is pro-Christian. The Scottish Rite in some areas requires you to be Christian (like the Chivalric Orders of the York Rite). And in a few places you have to be Christian to join the Blue Lodge.

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4. Masonry is an entrance to the higher occultist movements such OTO or Illuminati.
Neither of these groups deal with Freemasonry.

Quote:
Originally Posted by icxc View Post
Their power is in networking which is going against the state.
How so?

Quote:
Originally Posted by icxc View Post
It is truth if your brother mason is in danger you have to help him despite the law!
Incorrect buddy.

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Originally Posted by icxc View Post
The most politician, banksters and other capitalists are masons.
So what politicians are Masons? Can you name them? What "banksters"? Are you against capitalism?

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Originally Posted by icxc View Post
6. One can be delighted without masonry.
Sure. Nowhere do we say Freemasonry is for everyone or that we are exclusively the only way to any kind of enlightenment. Freemasonry is but one pathway.

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But when you give a critique to a mason about masonry he replies: “you don’t know anything about that, inform yourself, you hate to much” or so.
I only object to the lies and slander.

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They are two different kinds of masons. The first are people not interested in making a fast progression in the grades. They are involved usually as simple Christian people.
And the others are not Christians or progress? Are you saying Christians are incapable of progressing through the lines and through the various bodies?
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Old 25-07-2012, 10:17 PM   #48
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That was interesting, thank you. Do you know what lodges on the Isle of Wight permit women?
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Old 26-07-2012, 09:19 AM   #49
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I don't doubt the upper echelons of the Masons hold the knowledge of alien (demon) spirit cohabitation (possession) as one of their secrets.
I don't believe. You can debate as much as you want. But some questions are very opposing you.
Where is that knowledge? Any proof? Can they levitate? Live forever?
Why is that power "secret", but power used is not secret?
Why masons generally can't be non educated people from the villiges?
Also, why do they organize them in the manner of being on power?

I will jump to Illuminati. By media, (movies, commercials, music, etc) they INDOCTRINATE AND HYPNOTIZE people to believe that they have power of some secret doctrine. No no. Don't believe! There is not a doctrine. They brainwash the population. Try to forget all THEIR instructions given by media to be free. They have money and military industry. So is their power. A pure agressive power.
Illuminati, and the high ranking masons are not in possession of any high knowledge or power.

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....
As usually from people loving masonry - only one big zero in the response.
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Old 26-07-2012, 02:46 PM   #50
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Where is that knowledge? Any proof? Can they levitate? Live forever?
Why is that power "secret", but power used is not secret?
Why masons generally can't be non educated people from the villiges?
Also, why do they organize them in the manner of being on power?

I will jump to Illuminati. By media, (movies, commercials, music, etc) they INDOCTRINATE AND HYPNOTIZE people to believe that they have power of some secret doctrine. No no. Don't believe! There is not a doctrine. They brainwash the population. Try to forget all THEIR instructions given by media to be free. They have money and military industry. So is their power. A pure agressive power.
Illuminati, and the high ranking masons are not in possession of any high knowledge or power.

We cannot levitate, we do not live forever...far too many dead Masons for that to be true.

I don't posses any "power" other than the power that education and learning provide any other man.

In my lodge we have quite a few men who are not "educated" at the same level of other in terms of Schooling. We have plenty who haven't attended college. I have attended College and don't have the education that some who haven't have. For example, I have no idea how to build a house, but one of my non college educated brothers does know how. Education is more than schooling as I have met plenty who are intelligent beyond their education and plenty who are educated beyond their intelligence.

Power is a relative term. So I am not sure how to explain your question.

As for your second paragraph about the "illuminati"..i agree.
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Old 26-07-2012, 02:54 PM   #51
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We cannot levitate, we do not live forever...far too many dead Masons for that to be true.

I don't posses any "power" other than the power that education and learning provide any other man.

In my lodge we have quite a few men who are not "educated" at the same level of other in terms of Schooling. We have plenty who haven't attended college. I have attended College and don't have the education that some who haven't have. For example, I have no idea how to build a house, but one of my non college educated brothers does know how. Education is more than schooling as I have met plenty who are intelligent beyond their education and plenty who are educated beyond their intelligence.

Power is a relative term. So I am not sure how to explain your question.

As for your second paragraph about the "illuminati"..i agree.
One of the best lines I've read in a while.
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Old 26-07-2012, 05:11 PM   #52
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Why do you all think that Freemasonry and the Illuminati are synonymous?!
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Old 26-07-2012, 07:48 PM   #53
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Interesting response. Except, when one starts looking at who all of the 'high ups' in freemasonry are, it turns out that they are Presidents, Prime Ministers and the heads of the I.M.F, World Bank, European Bank, Sporting Brands, Music Record Labels, Hollywood production houses etc.

Coincidence?

“Chance. Stupid, dumb, blind chance. Just a part of the strange mechanism of the world, with its fits and coughs and starts and random collisions.” ~ Lauren Oliver, Before I Fall
Well he answered that by network. The Lucifer shit is blown out of proportion I reckon they have tried everything then back to pagan shit and back around again. And that is only their members who are seeking esoteric identity over the years and may have added to their rituals which are probably just metaphors and lessons on life and relationships maybe some dark stuff on the power differential in situations.

Order

It is about a hierarchy and a pecking order. To say it is anti establishment is so far up the left it does not make sense.....The intrinsic value of the whole thing is order and that is because the aristocracy hijacked the whole thing at some point in it's infancy.

No esoteric powers, got well established enough so that movers and shakers may even feel they need to join to get ahead.....Once again onto network but that is ludicrous many will join and never ascend ranks the movers and shakers who join are already on their path. What they do not realise is that they can then be used by this group once group conditioning occurs.

If I was to join I'd probably be gravely disappointed in the esoteric stuff which been ripped off other ancient cultures from western christianity to eastern mysticism which can all be found on the internet with a little digging. Unfortunately people like rituals and dogma that's what their past intellectual smart cookies worked on....But yea if I was mason I'd probably want to work on bringing it into the 21st century and somehow reconciling some shit with science.
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Old 26-07-2012, 07:53 PM   #54
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I don't believe. You can debate as much as you want. But some questions are very opposing you.
Where is that knowledge? Any proof? Can they levitate? Live forever?
Why is that power "secret", but power used is not secret?
Why masons generally can't be non educated people from the villiges?
Also, why do they organize them in the manner of being on power?

I will jump to Illuminati. By media, (movies, commercials, music, etc) they INDOCTRINATE AND HYPNOTIZE people to believe that they have power of some secret doctrine. No no. Don't believe! There is not a doctrine. They brainwash the population. Try to forget all THEIR instructions given by media to be free. They have money and military industry. So is their power. A pure agressive power.
Illuminati, and the high ranking masons are not in possession of any high knowledge or power.
Another spirit entering the body does not give the human any power.
The co-habiting entity might take control or influence the human.
The human gains nothing from accepting another spirit in the body.

I think most humans believe their hidden interaction with other species gives them some kind of power or rights above poeple on the matrix side of the fence.

It is not so much about having knowledge it is who you deny that knowledge to. Hence covertness and secrecy : denial of knowledge.

Coming at this knowledge from a religous stance will not provide all the answers. Religion = filter lense spectacles. Religion decides which bits are filtered in our out when people wear their brand of lenses.

I owe no allegance to any cult, group or religion. Man is a total fuckwit and thinks he can play ball or even compete with entities that have been in control here for hundreds of thousands of years. We are there engineered creation. Its a concept that man's ego is too pathetic to enter into his head or accept.

Those other species give these stupid humans glass beads in return for gold.

Man's biggest crime is his crass and utter stupidity in dealing with these entities and believing he can be in control. What a fucking bunch of idiots !
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Old 26-07-2012, 07:57 PM   #55
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Well he answered that by network. The Lucifer shit is blown out of proportion I reckon they have tried everything then back to pagan shit and back around again. And that is only their members who are seeking esoteric identity over the years and may have added to their rituals which are probably just metaphors and lessons on life and relationships maybe some dark stuff on the power differential in situations.

Order

It is about a hierarchy and a pecking order. To say it is anti establishment is so far up the left it does not make sense.....The intrinsic value of the whole thing is order and that is because the aristocracy hijacked the whole thing at some point in it's infancy.

No esoteric powers, got well established enough so that movers and shakers may even feel they need to join to get ahead.....Once again onto network but that is ludicrous many will join and never ascend ranks the movers and shakers who join are already on their path. What they do not realise is that they can then be used by this group once group conditioning occurs.

If I was to join I'd probably be gravely disappointed in the esoteric stuff which been ripped off other ancient cultures from western christianity to eastern mysticism which can all be found on the internet with a little digging. Unfortunately people like rituals and dogma that's what their past intellectual smart cookies worked on....But yea if I was mason I'd probably want to work on bringing it into the 21st century and somehow reconciling some shit with science.
Hundreds of years ago the foundations of our whole society which spread around (infected) the world were made from: the crown, the church, government and the Masons.

There was no hijacking it was made that way.
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Old 26-07-2012, 08:05 PM   #56
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Hundreds of years ago the foundations of our whole society which spread around (infected) the world were made from: the crown, the church, government and the Masons.

There was no hijacking it was made that way.
No you would be wrong. It started from the merchant class and obviously builders as in tradesmen and architects. All this samuel shit or great architect of the universe was the added flairs later. Nope lad sorry but it had more humble beginnings then the aristocrats followed by the intellectual classes moved in that's then when it became groovy.

Some other states hated it and some religion hated it for example the catholic church because with its universal message of brotherhood and transcending of the social classes it was quite a serious threat to their power base. Really man this isn't conspiracy its plain common sense 101.

Once it was well established though it went on to contribute greatly to western society especially in america where they got masonic buildings and shit and I ain't on about the temple or meeting hall.
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Old 26-07-2012, 08:11 PM   #57
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Nothing happens from the grass roots. But the status quo lovers don't like change and they are reactive. Once they perceive something useful they will adapt and hijack it. I will admit that it really didn't get it's shit together or would have had the capability to spread across the globe like it did without the aristocrats.

They turned it into a organization of order and hierarchy naturally. Where before it was just a social club and perhaps a means of networking for contracts etc. It is in no way anti establishment nor has it ever been well not anti WASP establishment.
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Old 26-07-2012, 08:17 PM   #58
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No you would be wrong. It started from the merchant class and obviously builders as in tradesmen and architects. All this samuel shit or great architect of the universe was the added flairs later. Nope lad sorry but it had more humble beginnings then the aristocrats followed by the intellectual classes moved in that's then when it became groovy.

Some other states hated it and some religion hated it for example the catholic church because with its universal message of brotherhood and transcending of the social classes it was quite a serious threat to their power base. Really man this isn't conspiracy its plain common sense 101.

Once it was well established though it went on to contribute greatly to western society especially in america where they got masonic buildings and shit and I ain't on about the temple or meeting hall.
Humble beginings in this country ?? WTF are you talking about?
This country has the most violent, bloody and barbaric past imaginable.
I don't subscribe to the liberal, pc, intellectual nonsense, I'm a realist.
There was nothing intellectual in the creation of the foundations of our society. It was an unholly and poisonous alliance between Royalty, the church and the government/ tax system.

That unholly alliance still exists and controls the serfs today.
Throughout history the royal family have been a poisonous and murderous evil bunch of sycho's. That is their bloodline !
Nothing changed.
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Old 26-07-2012, 08:22 PM   #59
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Nothing happens from the grass roots. But the status quo lovers don't like change and they are reactive. Once they perceive something useful they will adapt and hijack it. I will admit that it really didn't get it's shit together or would have had the capability to spread across the globe like it did without the aristocrats.

They turned it into a organization of order and hierarchy naturally. Where before it was just a social club and perhaps a means of networking for contracts etc. It is in no way anti establishment nor has it ever been well not anti WASP establishment.


I agree with you that everything in recent years gets hijacked by the system.
They infiltrate, corrupt or destroy any group from within. Whether the BNP, EDL, the Greens, or any other non establishment group who might just rock the boat. They will always infiltrate and hijack. Or they tolerate as long as the groups tow the line and don't get reactionary. aka The Green Party.
Any new trend or new culture or sign of something that might be popular that they don't control, they will take over.
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Old 26-07-2012, 08:25 PM   #60
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Don't tell me they were all Guardian readers in those days?

I love the way the system rewritres history to suit its own purposes.
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