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Old 07-09-2008, 04:17 PM   #161
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I'm really not sure how an artist would prove to be an expert witness in this particular case.

An artist is educated and trained in representing a 3D object in a 2D format. I think they are qualified to speak to this matter.

I have read "Turn Me On, Dead Man" by Andru J. Reeve. I don't agree w/ his conclusion, but there are some interesting things in it.

Up to this point, I have observed that those of us espousing the PID/PWR theory have very patiently presented all sorts of information, evidence, provided plausible theories, etc, to bolster our argument. All I see coming from the other side are insults to our intelligence, sanity, & powers of observation. Those claiming that our theory is without merit should provide evidence to support their claims other than the mainstream media has presented Paul & Faul to be the same person, so it must be true. The ball is in your court now.
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Old 07-09-2008, 04:30 PM   #162
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Let the naysayers prove Paul & Faul are the same.

Please explain to the rest of us here just HOW this is the same person in those photos on page 15 of this thread. I can NOT see the similarities.

Seems that only desperate people resort to insults.
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Old 07-09-2008, 04:36 PM   #163
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Anna, I could not agree with you more. I am open to the possibility that Paul & Faul are the same person. I mean, I can have an open mind about it & objectively look at the evidence. At this point, it seems the weight of the evidence tips strongly in favor of the PID/PWR theory, though.

I am looking forward to seeing proof that Paul is Faul.
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Old 07-09-2008, 04:39 PM   #164
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Quote:
Originally Posted by anna View Post

Seems that only desperate people resort to insults.


you mean like this?
this?

Paul McCartney Youtube channel

Last edited by miss_splitfoot; 07-09-2008 at 04:42 PM. Reason: img didn't show
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Old 07-09-2008, 04:41 PM   #165
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miss_splitfoot, so glad to have you join the conversation again. Do you have anything to contribute by means of proof?
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Old 07-09-2008, 04:44 PM   #166
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Originally Posted by faulconandsnowjob View Post

All I see coming from the other side are insults to our intelligence, sanity, ...


I WONDER WHYfrom Paul's myspace channel (again)
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Old 07-09-2008, 04:46 PM   #167
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Originally Posted by faulconandsnowjob View Post
miss_splitfoot, so glad to have you join the conversation again. Do you have anything to contribute by means of proof?

proof that you're insane? yes. it's the link above this post

john was hotter anyway.

Last edited by miss_splitfoot; 07-09-2008 at 04:47 PM. Reason: wording
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Old 07-09-2008, 04:51 PM   #168
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An insult to my sanity... Hmmm... it seems *someone* is getting desperate.

We know you'd think John was hotter.

By the way, thanks for plugging my YouTube channel, but I think you entered the link incorrectly. It's actually at

http://www.youtube.com/user/faulconandsnowjob

It's already been getting an "insane" amount of traffic, so maybe this will make it even more in the public eye ;-)

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Old 07-09-2008, 05:16 PM   #169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by faulconandsnowjob View Post
I'm really not sure how an artist would prove to be an expert witness in this particular case.

An artist is educated and trained in representing a 3D object in a 2D format. I think they are qualified to speak to this matter.

I have read "Turn Me On, Dead Man" by Andru J. Reeve. I don't agree w/ his conclusion, but there are some interesting things in it.
But I didn't ask whether you've read that particular book. I asked whether you've read the forensics book that is being used as a scientific benchmark by some pro-Paul Is Dead theorists. Have you?

Quote:
Up to this point, I have observed that those of us espousing the PID/PWR theory have very patiently presented all sorts of information, evidence, provided plausible theories, etc, to bolster our argument. All I see coming from the other side are insults to our intelligence, sanity, & powers of observation.
Firstly, I'd like to point out that I've been civil, polite and equally patient. I'm not even 'coming from the other side of the fence' in this argument. As I've stated several time, I've no reason to not want to believe this, and as such am fairly neutral and open-minded. I'd like to believe this as, whilst somewhat implausible, the theory itself is so attractive: the biggest scam in popular culture ever.

Regarding your accusations, "all I see" is a series of 'one-up-manship' ploys. Firstly, the idea you have a 'power' and others don't. Secondly, you've been seeding the thread(s) with suggestions that you might be more academically inclined than other people in the thread (and therefore have a superior grasp of the situation). Thirdly, it's been pointed out several times that you have an artistic insight that you assume others don't have, which, again, gives you superior grasp of the situation.

Seriously, who exactly is questioning whose intelligence and powers of observation here? If it's anyone, it's you.

Throughout all my posts, my focus has been on questioning the alleged 'evidence' that's been given so far on these threads whilst I've been here. It's not been on yourself or other supporters of the theory.

This is a summation of what I've written about:
  • The Tavistock link has many, many holes in the theory. The atonality theory doesn't hold as there is very little about the Beatles music that could be described as being atonal, if anything. The ideas about linguistics being used to seed rebellion is idiotic as all the words proffered were already in popular use prior to the Beatles going to America. The general idea that the Beatles were written by Tavistock prompts more difficult questions than it actually answers. I notice that none of these questions I raised in that post have even been addressed by the Paul Is Dead theorists. Again, the support for a Tavistock connection is as flimsy as "I can tell":

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by faulconandsnowjob[/QUOTE
    I do think the Tavistock Institute was involved, but I'm not sure exactly how...
  • The 'Doctor's report' about IBS reeks something fierce. It doesn't read like any doctor's writing I've ever come across and I hope no one here has a doctor that writes like that! Also, the contact details seem very suspect - as you confirmed - as does the use of the professional qualification, which doesn't appear to be typical of British usage. Also, it contravenes laws about patient confidentiality. even after death. Lastly, it's based on an assumption that IBS can't be managed. Rather, it suggests that it's a condition that won't change as it can't be cured whereas the opposite is true: a change in diet makes a major difference.

  • The other 'Doctor's report', that of Doctor Truby, is equally suspicious. Whilst voice matching in itself has merit - although I'm a little concerned about how accurate it was forty years ago - there seems to be no reference to this at all anywhere other than has been quoted here and comes from a sole source, the 'Turn Me on Dead Man'. The Beatles are probably the most wrote about, most collected, most analysed band ever and yet there's no other reference to this anywhere, not even amongst the contemporary 'Paul Is Dead' resources? Very dubious.

  • The so-called 'forensic evidence' about skull physiology is on very shaky ground as all the images given for comparison are only superficially similar in pose. Some of them aren't similar at all to the extent they're looking in opposite directions. The comparisons offered don't actually move the theory any forward at all. If anything, I think they sometimes dent the credibility of the theory itself as well as the supporters.
Quote:
Those claiming that our theory is without merit should provide evidence to support their claims other than the mainstream media has presented Paul & Faul to be the same person, so it must be true. The ball is in your court now.
What's the saying about extraordinary claims and extraordinary evidence? I don't have to positively prove anything as I'm not the one making a claim. You end with a bit of a strawman argument here with an undertone of 'conspiracy one-up-manship where you're insinuating that I'm duped by mainstream media and you're not. I've not personally said this at all, can you point to where I did? Or are you making this up? I hope not.
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Old 07-09-2008, 05:21 PM   #170
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hedgepiglet, I don't remember "calling you out" as one of the people resorting to insults, etc, to refute this theory. It seems you are the one who thinks the shoe fits in this case, not I.

Most people on this forum are wise to how the mainstream media works. If not, I recommend seeing the movie, "V for Vendetta." I have considered the possibility that people will have to have a certain base education & knowledge before they can entertain this theory. That doubles are used & people replaced is pretty commonplace, actually.

Still waiting for evidence/proof that Paul & Faul are the same guy...

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Old 07-09-2008, 06:45 PM   #171
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Quote:
Originally Posted by faulconandsnowjob View Post
hedgepiglet, I don't remember "calling you out" as one of the people resorting to insults, etc, to refute this theory. It seems you are the one who thinks the shoe fits in this case, not I.
I beg to differ. You talk in absolutes such as:

Quote:
Originally Posted by faulconandsnowjob
All I see coming from the other side are insults to our intelligence, sanity, & powers of observation.
in a response to my previous post and then write the following:

Quote:
The ball is in your court now.
I not a proponent of your theory of your theory, so I'm not on 'your side' and you actually say this in a response to my post: of course you're including me in all this.

Quote:
Most people on this forum are wise to how the mainstream media works. If not, I recommend seeing the movie, "V for Vendetta." I have considered the possibility that people will have to have a certain base education & knowledge before they can entertain this theory.
No offence, but I actually read Moore's work when it first came out; V for Vendetta, either in print or on screen, is hardly new to me. For good and bad, comics have been a large part of reading life since the early/mid-1970s and I'm a big fan of Moore generally. Also, as I mentioned before, I have a background in communication media/graphic design (this has encompassed everything from communication modelling to advertising). For a few years, I even worked for my local government propaganda/publicity department, so it's not as if I don't know how 'it' all works. For the record, I'm not offering this in a 'I know better than you' sense, more a case of 'yes, I do know how these things work; you're not the only one'.

Quote:
That doubles are used & people replaced is pretty commonplace, actually.
Yes, I agree, doubles are probably more common than the general public would believe. However, a 'looky-likey' where someone might 'stand in' and act as a decoy for a brief period &c is one thing. Whereas, replacing someone for the rest of their lives - particularly when that person was one of the biggest celebrities on the planet at the time, continuously in the public eye, and with very unique and specific talents which would have been ludicrously difficult to mimic, particularly in a short space of time - is another thing entirely. It's so different that it perhaps shouldn't really be compared to the former as it relies on a whole different logistical paradigm.

Quote:
[Still waiting for evidence/proof that Paul & Faul are the same guy...
Me, I'm still waiting for proof that you understand the point that it's the people that make extraordinary claims who need to provide the extraordinary evidence. What's more, what is being offered isn't tangible, solid evidence at all. It appears to rest on something as flimsy as "I can tell".
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Old 07-09-2008, 06:46 PM   #172
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We have offered lots of proof & evidence. The ball is in your court now. Convince me. I'm open-minded
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Old 07-09-2008, 06:58 PM   #173
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Originally Posted by faulconandsnowjob View Post
We have offered lots of proof & evidence. The ball is in your court now. Convince me. I'm open-minded
As I said in my previous post, when looked at, the evidence offered so far doesn't really stand-up: the Doctor's report about IBS, the strange elusiveness about the Dr Truby's report, the flawed comparison samples for photographs as well as the Tavistock Institute theory. None of it stands up to any scrutiny at all. If you disagree with this, that any of these pieces of evidence still stands, let's go back to them and talk them through. From what I remember, you seem to admit that the doctor's report was a little suspect, that the lack of secondary support for Truby's claim was also suspect and the Tavistock Institution idea was also suspect but you believed it was connected but didn't know how.

To me, that's not really evidence holding up very well. All that's left is the photographs which seem to be based on: "I Can Tell". What's more, I've asked quite a few questions in this thread that have yet to be answered by either you or anyone perpetuating this theory.

This post, sadly, confirms a point made in my last post. You really don't understand the very basic premise that it's the person making the claim that has to supply the evidence.

The idea that you're "open-minded" is astonishing. You've admitted in several posts that your believing of this theory is based on something as flimsy as "I Can Tell". That's not being open-minded at all. Not only are you coming to this debate from a fixed position - you already believe McCartney was replaced - but you're clinging to this position with the scantiest of reasoning: "I can just tell". How is that "open-minded"?
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Old 07-09-2008, 07:04 PM   #174
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meant to edit not quote! sorry!
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Old 07-09-2008, 07:04 PM   #175
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I'm giving you every opportunity to present evidence that Paul & Faul are the same. If you cannot do so, then I must assume you have none. Therefore, I will stand by my argument that PID/PWR, unless you can come up w/ something convincing.

What about some facial measurements? Or vocal analyses?

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Old 07-09-2008, 07:15 PM   #176
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Originally Posted by faulconandsnowjob View Post
I'm giving you every opportunity to present evidence that Paul & Faul are the same. If you cannot do so, then I must assume you have none. Therefore, I will stand by my argument that PID/PWR, unless you can come up w/ something convincing.
I'm trying to be polite as possible here and won't be goaded into being uncivil so you can use that as a brick-bat against me.

Do you really not understand the basic premise of it's the person making the extraordinary claim that has to provide the extraordinary evidence? It's you and other proponents of the theory that need to be supplying evidence not anyone else. And to pre-empt "we are supplying evidence" type replies, as I've stated in several posts now, you're not.

I've edited one of my recent posts so you might not have seen it, so I'll repeat here. If you think that 'evidence' you've supplied still stands, let's go over it again: from what I remember, you seem to admit that the doctor's report was a little suspect, that the lack of secondary support for Truby's claim was also suspect and the Tavistock Institution idea was also suspect but you believed it was connected but didn't know how.

To me, this 'evidence' isn't really holding up too well. All that's left is support the photographs which seem to be based on: "I Can Tell" and "I have a power".

What's more, I've asked quite a few questions in this thread that have yet to be answered by either you or anyone perpetuating this theory.
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Old 07-09-2008, 07:22 PM   #177
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I think you are not presenting any evidence to support your theory at all. I don't find your argumentation very persuasive that Paul & Faul are the same person b/c the mainstream media says so. However, our side has offered plenty of evidence to the contrary. i suggest you go read (or re-read) all 4 PID threads on the David Icke Forum, & check out the Nothing is Real, & PID Miss Him forums for more information. Maybe those will help fill in the gaps for you.

PID Miss Him
http://only1rad.proboards62.com/index.cgi

NIR
http://invanddis.proboards29.com/index.cgi

My YT channel also has info, videos, & links to other information.
http://www.youtube.com/user/faulconandsnowjob
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Old 07-09-2008, 07:29 PM   #178
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Default there's a fine line between fandom & obsession

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Old 07-09-2008, 07:39 PM   #179
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Isn't that the oldest strategy in the book to discredit somebody? Say that they are "crazy"? [yawn] Sorry, but most people on this forum are going to recognize that tactic as an act of desperation. If you had a solid argument or any evidence, you would present it.
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Old 07-09-2008, 07:41 PM   #180
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yes you're right & im wrong

have you ever written to Faul about this? i'm sure he'd appreciate some support from someone who knows he's been used as a puppet for all these years. it must be a lonely life
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