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Jiddu Krishnamurti a different story


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Excellent Article Mr H .... Old lead-beater the pedo  went out to India , looking for boys to molest and turn into Gurus ....

 

"Leadbeater ran a sort of Messiah factory, comparable to a Hollywood star studio or a pop hit factory. He would identify a young man as a possible ‘vehicle’ for the World Teacher’s spirit, take over his education and groom him for the role. Groom in all senses of the word.

One Theosophist noted:

In six months he would transform even an ignorant street boy into a charming well-mannered gentleman. One could see the change almost daily, making the face of an ordinary boy into that of an angel.

The parents were  happy to go along with this ...."

 

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I notice the author of this article also takes a swipe at Alan Watts .....

 

"And so, rather like Alan Watts, he had to keep on performing, keep on talking and talking. Trapped in a public role, dissociated from his own loneliness and pain, he chose the worship of fans over the genuine love of friends and family."

 

I agree ...Alan Watts is a transparent idiot , but  many do like him , including DI ...

Not to be confused with Alan Watt ... who is quiet brilliant IMHO 

 

Alan Watt 

Alan_Watt_-_How_Television_Sports_Are_Us

 

 

Edited by oz93666
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On 8/22/2020 at 10:01 AM, Mr H said:

Maybe of interest of others.

 Thanks for posting this, doesn't happen often that I am blown away. 🙂  I feel he did had a positive impact on the world, but this does explain some questions I had about Jiddu over the years. Personally I still feel he was a good person despite the abuse and manpulation we was victim of and to a certain extend, guilty of. Good wake up call for myself to always research what I research. It shows that we always have to be viligant in what we assume to be real and considered as facts. 

 

"It is not wrong to question things...The fact that you're asking questions shows that you're

five levels of wisdom above the idiot who is objecting to you asking the questions." - Josh Tolley -

 

 

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He taught that ‘truth is a pathless land’ — that we could all attain a state of enlightenment he had attained, free from all beliefs and conditioning. But one couldn’t get there through any guru or teaching or practice. In which case, why bang on about it for six decades, giving enough talks to fill 200 books?

 

Yes it's a good question.  And one which has a single answer.

You see this in many spiritual circles, people say ... "I am Brahman", or "I am thusness", or "I am emptiness" ... and so on.

But what's the point of teaching anything then?

 

And the answer is this ... those teachers are in a different state from you.

And if you meditate on these concepts in the presence of a teacher then you change, you receive a transmission.

So for instance in India the Advaita sages are expected to reflect on these ideas and study the sayings of teachers for hours every day, and the expectation is that after several years a transformation will occur ... at the end of that transformation, you are not just saying those words as words ... but due to the changes ... they are in fact now true for you.

 

That's the answer.

 

But someone who maybe is insincere and a bit dumb might stand at the gate ... and hear "I am Brahman" and he might waltz down the road saying oh great I  am god ... ha ha ha.  Well that's nothing.

 

JK did fulfill some sort of guru role but also had quite a modest life.  And he founded various schools around the world for children, which are good schools .. and he left several very good books.

 

He was highly trained through the Theosophical Society and for many years and although he renounced their idea of him as a Messiah, nevertheless he had been highly trained and that training transformed him.

 

This article that the OP posted is from someone who has made no attempt to comprehend JK.

 

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  • 3 months later...
Silence grew and became intense, wider and deeper. The brain which had listened to the silence of the hills, fields and groves was itself now silent. It had become quiet, naturally, without any enforcement. It was still, deep within itself; like a bird that folds its wings, it had folded upon itself; it had entered into depths which were beyond itself. It was a dimension which the brain could not capture or understand. And there was no observer, witnessing this depth. Every part of one's whole being was alert, sensitive but intensely still. This new, this depth was expanding, exploding, going away, developing in its own explosions; out of time and beyond space.

 

 

 

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7 hours ago, Traveller said:
Silence grew and became intense, wider and deeper. The brain which had listened to the silence of the hills, fields and groves was itself now silent. It had become quiet, naturally, without any enforcement. It was still, deep within itself; like a bird that folds its wings, .....

 

This is the  sort of southing pap Leadbeater would have trained Krishnamurti to spout to his followers , just like Osho and Watts  Leadbeater understood it's what people love to hear , it it does contain some wisdom ...Some.

 

The Extraterrestrial controllers of this planet will promote and support such movements , the material is reassuring and sidelines those on a spiritual path , and never addresses the real problem we have , or offers a solution to that problem ... that problem is the continuing  covert enslavement of humanity by dark forces.  

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35 minutes ago, oz93666 said:

 

This is the  sort of southing pap Leadbeater would have trained Krishnamurti to spout to his followers , just like Osho and Watts  Leadbeater understood it's what people love to hear , it it does contain some wisdom ...Some.

 

The Extraterrestrial controllers of this planet will promote and support such movements , the material is reassuring and sidelines those on a spiritual path , and never addresses the real problem we have , or offers a solution to that problem ... that problem is the continuing  covert enslavement of humanity by dark forces.  

 

It's the introduction on the video. I thought I'd post it so folk could decide for themselves. The article above contains truths, half truth and too many faklsehoods to mention. The quote is also edited. The Notebook which it's from was a different book in that it contained the mystical side of his life. Better really, and more constructive, to point out exactly what is wrong with the words.

 

Leadbeater was indeed a man of questionable character though K claimed, contrary to the article, that no funny sexual buisness ever occurred with him. Also, it states there numerous "trained" messiahs. There was one other. CWL and Besant had been told to look for a vehicle so they did. The first boy was set aside when K was seen. Regardless of character, Leadbeater likely was able to view auras and selfishness has colours. K had none unlike anyone else he'd ever seen so it became obvious to him that he was the vehicle. Also stated in the video and portrayed differently in the article.

 

From what I can tell, it was not possible to train or influence K in any way. Vacancy was something that remained his whole life. He says in the video that Theosophy and all that jargon never touched him. Critique his words by all means. I think that's fair

 

 

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3 hours ago, Traveller said:

 

 

From what I can tell, it was not possible to train or influence K in any way. Vacancy was something that remained his whole life. He says in the video that Theosophy and all that jargon never touched him. Critique his words by all means. I think that's fair

 

 

 

I'd echo this. Well said.

 

 

4 hours ago, oz93666 said:

 

the material is reassuring and sidelines those on a spiritual path , and never addresses the real problem we have , or offers a solution to that problem ... that problem is the continuing  covert enslavement of humanity by dark forces.  

 

Are you actually familar with Jiddu Krishnamurtis message beyond a surface superficial level or other peoples opinions? causei i'd suspect you wouldnt make such a misinformed statement if you were.

 

The majority of his message revovled around solutions - mostly ones of self inquiry/observation/introspection in regards to fear ( & never to take his word or follow him for anyfucking thing but actually find out for yourself) - which is the very thing this entire trap is based off of.

 

No man who tells you to inquire into matters for yourself, to have no external authority whatsoever, can rightfully be accused of sidelining anybody spiritually. & I gotta LOL @ "reassuring" - Krishnamurti's entire essence is the furthest thing from "reassuring". On the contrary - he is easily one of the most frustrating people i have ever listened to.

 

You can externalize the "dark forces" all you want, & i do not discount them, but its the darkness/ignorance within man that is actually responsible for this shit.

Edited by ThunderFace
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Just now, ThunderFace said:

the majority of his message revovled arounds solutions - mostly ones of self inquiry/observation/introspection in regards to fear ...

 

Exactly ...His "solutions" are no solutions .... How is "self enquiry" going to get people out of the covid trap most are in ??   ...I suppose the goal is to over come fear ? No! Fear is a sensible response to the prospect of being forcibly injected with nanochips which will turn you into a cyborg! Fear is your biology's way of getting your attention ... Telling you urgent action is required to stay alive . 

 

Just now, ThunderFace said:

you can externalize the "dark forces" all you want, but its the darkness/ignorance within mann that is actually responsible for this shit.

 

Man is a divine being , pure ..... External influence from the dark spirit realm is the cause of problems , along with ET/Cabal electronic mind control....

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6 minutes ago, oz93666 said:

Exactly ...His "solutions" are no solutions .... How is "self enquiry" going to get people out of the covid trap most are in ?? 

 

Agreed.

 

“The worst pain a man can suffer: to have insight into much and power over nothing.” - Herodotus

 

We need will to power. We should be reading up on propaganda and subversion to learn how to use them to our advantage. I know many think propaganda is a dirty word, but truthful propaganda is very powerful.

 

That being said, if people learn the art of memetics and propaganda so they can start waking normies up en masse, they will likely just shut the internet off. So we need IRL activism too.

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Take three people, two are injected with "something". One of those people believes they have been injected with a chemical. One of those people believe they have been injected with nanochips. A third person has never been injected.

 

At some point all three begin hearing voices. The first person thinks they are mentally ill. The second person things the nanochips have been switched on. The third person thinks that the things that can be believed by people in a world filled with such superstitions are so incredible and dangerous to a mans soul that it is better to question everything.

 

 

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But what is truth and how do we get it?

How bothered are you really by living in this world, are you willing to do something?

It's not for free.

 

Human beings are not so great as you might believe, from what I understand ... the reason that spirituality is difficult to understand is because most people involved in it including the great sages didn't really understand what had happened.   They recognized a change but couldn't say exactly how.  Often they didn't even have a formal path, so then they couldn't even give a student a path.

Desperate men, who lucked it out.

Also note that the most intelligent people tend to be most brainewashed, and to be spiritual you are normally not smart enough to get a job ... therefore the unintelligent get enlightened.

Very weird situation.

 

You can fight this world ... the media and powers ... 

But you will never win.

 

If you are able to become enlightened you will emanate very high energy as a unified being, which is very rare and this will pour into this world.  Not only that but you will survive death.

Of course from monkey man to enlightened being is a big journey.

Do you want it ?
You have to be half saint half bastard half warrior half lover ... 

Anyway, it is there it is all there.

But who believes that they are made of the Light and that God has made a path for you, if you want it.

 

The whole thing is that we are quite low creatures, so the light is hard to find ... we need to work to get there, through any available means.

Forget about this world, it's chaos, do what you can but it can't be your whole effort.

Everyone, if they leave, leaves on their own.

 

Anyway JK did enter a high state, and he sat there speaking from it to other people ... for decades, even had some kids.  But at the end he said nobody understood.
Why not?
Why not is because he entered the state through the usual way, studying ancient books, handing around with very intelligent people, doing esoteric practices, meditations, yoga, chakras, many things.
And eventually bang it happened ... and threw everything away ... all those things are like a bridge.
He tried to speak to people directly, but it failed after decades of trying.
People need to go the long way round and go into the paths.

Edited by rideforever
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5 hours ago, oz93666 said:

Exactly ...His "solutions" are no solutions .... How is "self enquiry" going to get people out of the covid trap most are in ??   ...I suppose the goal is to over come fear ? No! Fear is a sensible response to the prospect of being forcibly injected with nanochips which will turn you into a cyborg! Fear is your biology's way of getting your attention ... Telling you urgent action is required to stay alive . 

 

Find a paragraph or speech he gave and point out it's falsehoods. Otherwise it's ad hominem isn't it?

 

As I see it the goal is not to overcome physical fear, which as you say is necessary, but psychological fear. You could almost be quoting him.

 

5 hours ago, oz93666 said:

 

Man is a divine being , pure ..... External influence from the dark spirit realm is the cause of problems , along with ET/Cabal electronic mind control....

 

If he were pure, he could not be touched by any outside influence that is of a lower nature. If so, then all heaven, or whatever one likes to call it, is up for grabs.

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1 hour ago, Traveller said:

As I see it the goal is not to overcome physical fear, which as you say is necessary, but psychological fear. You could almost be quoting him.

 

Physical Fear ?? Psychological Fear?? ... No such thing (except in Murtie's distorted world view ) ....

 

Fear is Fear ... a perceived threat to survival !! 

 

The thing about fear is it should not be an ongoing condition ... It only exists as long as you are in danger because you have not taken the necessary action to get safe...

 

I would imagine most people on this forum are existing in low level fear because they see the covid trap they are in  , vaccination danger on the horizon and worse. They think there is nothing they can do .. There is always something you can do ...

 

There is  danger just in living  , but everyone can reduce  risks to their survival.     

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2 hours ago, screamingeagle said:

(Self enquiry is the) same as your prayers, wouldn't you say

(no, of course you wouldn't)😎

 

I am on record as saying that the solution is first to get somewhere remote and safe , self sufficient , with everything you need to survive ...

 

And then Pray for Divine intervention ...

 

I can understand that some would see prayer as passive , similar to Murtie's "introspection/ self inquiry"... In reality it's not ....

 

A clear  understanding of our predicament is first required ... That the ET's and dark spits behind all this have been doing control and domination for literally Billions of years to other civilizations... They are masters at it , have unimaginable technology , and we cannot hope to defeat them by ourselves ...

 

Only the Divine realm can resolve this situation , and they will only take action if we invite them ...

 

So Prayer is not passive , it's an active reaching out for a partnership with Creator /Divine realm to join forces with humanity in healing and forgiving the Evil ones so they move on and leave us.

 

 https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCg18_LahHDHQZi7LYGbkS3Q/videos

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Just now, Traveller said:

 

Quote his distorted worldview otherwise it's just gossip

 

 

The distortion is in the example you gave ..YOU implied Murtie  said there is psychological fear and physical fear ... 

 

I say that's a distorted world view ....

 

Fear is fear .... A perceived threat 

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9 minutes ago, oz93666 said:

The distortion is in the example you gave ..YOU implied Murtie  said there is psychological fear and physical fear ... 

 

Let's be clear, I don't represent his words in any way. I may have a view on them but I may be distorting it. To use my words to prove someone else is wrong is stretching it, to say the least. You seem to be deflecting as, I guess, you don't want to quote K.

 

I'll try and explain as I see it though don't assume this is how K would present it.

 

Regarding physical fear, look at the animal kingdom. Animals live with the possibility of being eaten at any point so there is physical fear and it's healthy and keeps them alive. But they do not translate this into hating their predator or going back to the den depressed and morose because some gits trying to eat them.

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3 hours ago, Traveller said:

As I see it the goal is not to overcome physical fear, which as you say is necessary, but psychological fear.

nonsense, fear should be subdued as much as possible, its ok to act in the face of danger but not in fear

 

all fear starts as psychological, then it moves through the body by causing the production of various hormones and compounds, you can physically feel fear, usually in the "pit of the stomach"

 

through the control of the mind and breath, pranayama, it is possible to halt the fear reaction, at first you simply realize the fear process following its development through the mind and into the body, then you learn to still the breath which helps control the muscles, then you begin to "reabsorb" the hormones and compounds before they effect the muscles, then when you no longer "feel" fear you can begin to address the source of fear in your mind, turning re-action into willful action

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13 minutes ago, killing raven sun said:

nonsense, fear should be subdued as much as possible, its ok to act in the face of danger but not in fear

 

Subdued? I prefer understood. It is OK to act in the face of danger. Problem is that we psychologise that fear. Fear of falling off a cliff won't be psychologised. But fear of being beat up and reacting can turn into kicking someone in the head even though you've already fended them off. Psychological fear means that defense becomes attack via anger or hatred. Physical fear of the precipice or rattle snake does not produce psychological aberations but rather a healthy desire to survive.

 

We can calm those psychological fears as you say. The human has taken the natural animal fear and made it psychological. So war, as means to protect territory, goes from defense to attack.

 

To quote "if you have lived peacefully your whole lives, you will do the right thing when attacked". But we don't and so the end result is not peaceful intelligent defense but further brutal attack. Therefore we are responsible for the outcome even if we are attacked first.

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1 hour ago, Traveller said:

Subdued? I prefer understood. It is OK to act in the face of danger. Problem is that we psychologise that fear. Fear of falling off a cliff won't be psychologised. But fear of being beat up and reacting can turn into kicking someone in the head even though you've already fended them off. Psychological fear means that defense becomes attack via anger or hatred. Physical fear of the precipice or rattle snake does not produce psychological aberations but rather a healthy desire to survive.

ok, i call that trauma, a dis-ease, originally fear based but is now grown to become part of the self, quite literally a charged body that resides within your charged body and interferes with your energy flow, yes, these are the worst affliction and cause much suffering from depression to cancer, these are the most important fears to get rid of, enlightenment cannot happen to the dis eased

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@killing raven sun I'm not anti Tolle but I don't find his words work for me but i think he would call what you're suggesting, the pain body. I'm a believer in the gut/brain axis and hence the gut's affect on the mind. The body must be healthy because it takes harmonious physical energy, a healthy pineal etc to free the mind of it's conditioning. Mercury fillings affect the mind in a big way. I feel we must come at this from the physical angle as well as the mind. No amount of reading or learning will get around a body not in vibrant health. No amount of physical health will get around a mind stuck in the word, eh?

Edited by Traveller
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1 hour ago, Traveller said:

I'm a believer in the gut/brain axis and hence the gut's affect on the mind.

indeed, although energy flows down not up, it is important to be aware of what you eat, there is information in every energy input, now realize how much more information is in the light than what comes from eating an apple

 

1 hour ago, Traveller said:

The body must be healthy because it takes harmonious physical energy, a healthy pineal etc to free the mind of it's conditioning. Mercury fillings affect the mind in a big way. I feel we must come at this from the physical angle as well as the mind. No amount of reading or learning will get around a body not in vibrant health. No amount of physical health will get around a mind stuck in the word, eh?

once again you are making the mind a slave of the flesh, the human awareness of radiation, mostly light, does not arise from the material, the mind interprets the sense input through consciousness, a damaged mind has connection problems with the consciousness and appears erratic regardless of physical health

 

much of what is said to hold men back is excuses for not trying, but the one real problem with life is expectations, they are always wrong and will suck the life right out of you

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