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4 hours ago, Campion said:

 

Do we? You make a good point that thoughts and feelings just appear in our consciousness without our control, but maybe we can say the same for actions? Thoughts happen followed by actions which are in alignment. It doesn't prove the thoughts cause the actions, perhaps there are unseen processes in the subconscious which cause both, and possess the freedom and responsibility which we can't consciously see. 

Yes you're right they do not cause actions, but usually preceded them.

 

I'm not sure anyone has found a subconscious mind. If one does exist, humans do not control it, and it operates similarly to conscious mind.

 

There is indeed only one source of causation and that is what we cannot name, god, consciousness, universe etc...

 

Everything else that occurs, such as it seemingly appear all in linear fashion, cause and effect, and the illusion of free will and personal responsibility - is so apparent human limited entity can make sense of the experience 

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On 9/21/2023 at 8:36 PM, Mr H said:

Yes you're right they do not cause actions, but usually preceded them.

 

I'm not sure anyone has found a subconscious mind. If one does exist, humans do not control it, and it operates similarly to conscious mind.

 

There is indeed only one source of causation and that is what we cannot name, god, consciousness, universe etc...

 

Everything else that occurs, such as it seemingly appear all in linear fashion, cause and effect, and the illusion of free will and personal responsibility - is so apparent human limited entity can make sense of the experience 

 

This reminds me of David Hume when I used to read about philosophy, he questioned the existence of cause and effect, and the nature of mind. 

 

I suppose if we could experience the subconscious it'd become conscious which kinda negates the premise. 

 

Has anyone convincingly found God either? Seems to me that searching for the source of control is like searching for myself which is like a dog chasing its tail, or Oroborous swallowing his tail.  The searcher is the sought, which is the Whole. 

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6 hours ago, Campion said:

 

This reminds me of David Hume when I used to read about philosophy, he questioned the existence of cause and effect, and the nature of mind. 

 

I suppose if we could experience the subconscious it'd become conscious which kinda negates the premise. 

 

Has anyone convincingly found God either? Seems to me that searching for the source of control is like searching for myself which is like a dog chasing its tail, or Oroborous swallowing his tail.  The searcher is the sought, which is the Whole. 

For me, cause and effect imply time. A before and after. When I explore time, there is no experience of time. Therefore, cause and effect are an appearance necessary for us to create a coherent, linear story/ character. It is a property of the limited human mind.

 

I don't think there is a subconscious brain. I think it is another way to describe what I am saying in different words. It highlights that we are not a separate entity with control, but our experience is an activity of what we could call consciousness or god.

 

Yes. Every moment you find and experience god.

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On 9/23/2023 at 10:54 PM, Mr H said:

For me, cause and effect imply time. A before and after. When I explore time, there is no experience of time. Therefore, cause and effect are an appearance necessary for us to create a coherent, linear story/ character. It is a property of the limited human mind.

 

I don't think there is a subconscious brain. I think it is another way to describe what I am saying in different words. It highlights that we are not a separate entity with control, but our experience is an activity of what we could call consciousness or god.

 

Yes. Every moment you find and experience god.

 

I don't think time is a thing itself, it's more like an abstract idea to describe the process of change. Using regular cycles to measure it like the Earth's spin, or atomic vibrations. Yeah, we can't 'experience' those either, but by that stage it's all got very derivative. We do experience day and night though. 

 

Subconscious is an interesting word, somewhere between conscious and unconscious. I currently go for the idea of panpsychism, where everything is conscious to the degree of its form. Human brains are more complex than rocks so the degree of consciousness is greater. But basically I think the whole universe is subconscious, and what we call 'conscious' is the part of our body which has more awareness than the rest. But it's only a tiny fraction, tho with various spiritual techniques we can expand it. 

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22 hours ago, Campion said:

 

I don't think time is a thing itself, it's more like an abstract idea to describe the process of change. Using regular cycles to measure it like the Earth's spin, or atomic vibrations. Yeah, we can't 'experience' those either, but by that stage it's all got very derivative. We do experience day and night though. 

 

Subconscious is an interesting word, somewhere between conscious and unconscious. I currently go for the idea of panpsychism, where everything is conscious to the degree of its form. Human brains are more complex than rocks so the degree of consciousness is greater. But basically I think the whole universe is subconscious, and what we call 'conscious' is the part of our body which has more awareness than the rest. But it's only a tiny fraction, tho with various spiritual techniques we can expand it. 

Interesting...

 

Just something to.consider....

 

The rock may only appear as a rock, through the filters of limitation of the finite human mind. 

 

My personal experience is that objects don't have consciousness, consciousness knows objects and gives them existence 

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2 minutes ago, Mr H said:

Interesting...

 

Just something to.consider....

 

The rock may only appear as a rock, through the filters of limitation of the finite human mind. 

 

My personal experience is that objects don't have consciousness, consciousness knows objects and gives them existence 

To elaborate. Objects having consciousness implies object here first. Then consciousness magically appears out of it at some point in time. But no one has ever observed such a flowering. And no one has ever experienced objects without consciousness, but you can experience consciousness without objects, if we can even call it an experience 

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Certainly a different way of self enquiry. The headless way.

 

https://psyche.co/ideas/to-experience-zen-like-awakening-try-going-the-headless-way

 

Little bit long, will just put main points.

 

The key to his method is noticing that you cannot see your own head. Rather than looking out of a head, visually speaking, there is just a gap here. Indeed, early Chinese Zen masters referred to the need to ‘chop off one’s head’. Hui Hai claimed that he could teach nothing as he had no tongue to teach with. The heart sutra, which distils the essence of Zen teaching, states that ‘in emptiness there is no form, no eye, no ear, no nose, no tongue, no body, no mind.’ Zen masters also urge practitioners to recognise their ‘original face’ – another name for one’s true nature.

 

 

mind or true nature? Harding’s ‘pointing experiment’ assists in turning one’s attention within, starting with the exercise of pointing a finger literally to the spot from which you are looking. Note that if these exercises are not carried out, or if they are merely thought about, this article will make no sense. So please do the following:

Point at a distant thing, such as a wall. Notice its shape and colour. It is a thing that is extended in space. It is also opaque. You cannot see through it. Point to the floor. Again, notice the coloured expanse and its textures. Point to your foot. Again, it is a shaped and coloured thing. Point to your chest and notice its colours and shape and the movement from your breathing. Now point to where you are looking from. In your present experience, is there any colour here? Any shape? Any texture? Any movement? Are there any eyes, mouth or cheeks here? Are there any features of a person? Notice that this spot is totally lacking in any personally identifying characteristics. Is there anything at all here? Or is it just a transparent opening?

 

 

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the ‘mirror experiment’:

 

Look into a mirror. You can now see your human face. Notice where it is. In my experience, it is over there, a couple of feet away, not on my shoulders. Is this true for you? It is also facing the wrong way. It is looking in, rather than outwards. How many faces do you see? Two, or just one? Notice the shapes, textures and colours of that little face trapped behind the glass. By contrast, notice the lack of shapes, textures, colours and indeed boundaries to the spot you are looking from.

 

That face over there is your acquired face. When you were an infant, you did not recognise it as your own. It was just a baby behind some glass. It took many months to learn to identify with that face. You learnt to marry that visual thing over there with the ‘facial’ sensations you feel here, and hence you became boxed in (at least apparently so). Isn’t how you are for yourself – that is, your ‘original face’ – in total contrast to that little face in the mirror? In fact, as lacking any characteristics of its own, isn’t this ‘gap’ seamlessly united with the world? Couldn’t you equally say that your ‘original face’ is the given world itself?

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19 hours ago, Mr H said:

The key to his method is noticing that you cannot see your own head. Rather than looking out of a head, visually speaking, there is just a gap here. Indeed, early Chinese Zen masters referred to the need to ‘chop off one’s head’. Hui Hai claimed that he could teach nothing as he had no tongue to teach with. The heart sutra, which distils the essence of Zen teaching, states that ‘in emptiness there is no form, no eye, no ear, no nose, no tongue, no body, no mind.’ Zen masters also urge practitioners to recognise their ‘original face’ – another name for one’s true nature.

 

I read the Douglas Harding book years ago and it left quite an impression. Later, I realised that this is true the other way round too, as in my own head is all I can see. When I open my eyes, I'm looking directly at the inside of my own brain; same with the other senses and everything in awareness. What these have in common is they're pointing to the unity consciousness where there isn't anyone looking, there's just looking. It's emptiness appearing as visual forms. There's no mind thinking thoughts, just nothing appearing as thoughts. 

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  • 2 weeks later...
On 9/29/2023 at 2:25 PM, Mr H said:

the ‘mirror experiment’:

 

Look into a mirror. You can now see your human face. Notice where it is. In my experience, it is over there, a couple of feet away, not on my shoulders. Is this true for you? It is also facing the wrong way. It is looking in, rather than outwards. How many faces do you see? Two, or just one? Notice the shapes, textures and colours of that little face trapped behind the glass. By contrast, notice the lack of shapes, textures, colours and indeed boundaries to the spot you are looking from.

 

That face over there is your acquired face. When you were an infant, you did not recognise it as your own. It was just a baby behind some glass. It took many months to learn to identify with that face. You learnt to marry that visual thing over there with the ‘facial’ sensations you feel here, and hence you became boxed in (at least apparently so). Isn’t how you are for yourself – that is, your ‘original face’ – in total contrast to that little face in the mirror? In fact, as lacking any characteristics of its own, isn’t this ‘gap’ seamlessly united with the world? Couldn’t you equally say that your ‘original face’ is the given world itself?

 

For you Mr H. other mirror testing videos are doubtless available, but before the one below (in another video)  << ie, after seeing this Steve Mould present a "Spintronics electricity testing system" - without need for actual electric, well you can guess I was impressed by that, and so I further will probably condone all and any of his videos.... He is a really good teacher of physics n stuff... Now here is a "saddle mirror" video which attempts to defy or better said marry convex and concave into one sheet of reflective mirror, so we can see more closely where one becomes the other, or AKA where the shape contours meet between one type of surface area compared to another, we can then view how the image is behaving more accurately (like a face) so with object looking into the mirror placed at varying focal positions in order to ascertain where curvature changes the image in either concave or convex or someway inbetween.  🙂🙃🫠

 

O

Edited by Certified Green of Heart
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  • 3 weeks later...

So I was watching David Icke on the latest vid, the one on YouTube.

 

He mentioned one of his theories was that we're all walking around with VR headsets on and it only comes off when we die.

 

I had a similar experiences when I did Ayahuasca which I wanted to share.

 

I also had the experience that we are wearing some kind of headset. And when I was "done" playing the game of life

 I died. Then Instantly appeared behind a stage. And everyone started applauding me. I was like wtf is going on? I just died.

 

They were like well played, you did really well. Then all the characters from my life were there behind the stage and congratulating me for my performance. And even the people I hated and caused me harm. Really weird. Seemed so real. 

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1 hour ago, Mr H said:

So I was watching David Icke on the latest vid, the one on YouTube.

 

He mentioned one of his theories was that we're all walking around with VR headsets on and it only comes off when we die.

 

I had a similar experiences when I did Ayahuasca which I wanted to share.

 

I also had the experience that we are wearing some kind of headset. And when I was "done" playing the game of life

 I died. Then Instantly appeared behind a stage. And everyone started applauding me. I was like wtf is going on? I just died.

 

They were like well played, you did really well. Then all the characters from my life were there behind the stage and congratulating me for my performance. And even the people I hated and caused me harm. Really weird. Seemed so real. 

 

Interesting, thanks for sharing. By a coincidence I had a thought this morning (before I read this), how do we know that the afterlife isn't another simulation? Just because there appears to be people there congratulating or judging us, it could be just another roll of film in the projector. 

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2 hours ago, Campion said:

 

Interesting, thanks for sharing. By a coincidence I had a thought this morning (before I read this), how do we know that the afterlife isn't another simulation? Just because there appears to be people there congratulating or judging us, it could be just another roll of film in the projector. 

Lol yes indeed. My personal conviction is that is kind of the case. In state 0 we are all God. There is no thing. All experience is an extension of that one - with an endless amount of modulations and simulations. If there is an afterlife, that would be just another modulation I guess.....

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I had a strange thought today after seeing the sentencing of SBF

 

Technology regarding aging is advancing rapidly.

 

I wonder what happens to prisoners in jail when tech is common enough to allow a human to live 2-3 hundred years, and they had like a 150 year sentence......

Edited by Mr H
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So today I was feeling a little bit sorry myself. And then I looked back on my life and thought about all the great achievements I have done. It was really powerful.

 

I think sometimes we forget what we've done and don't recognise our personal achievements.

 

So I'm writing this message as a reminder to all. Give yourself credit for what you have achieved in your life. You are the dog's danglies as they say, and don't let anyone tell you otherwise.😁

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or not Aldi... Aldi or YouTube providing an image of Aldi *advert presumably* is not available. hehe. To be honest good, I hate most all adverts. 😉

 

----------------- moving on with another find, good job THIS NEXT is not implying conspiracists have mental health problems I first must just say... and I can build a whole narrative around this kind of thing, and in fact I have (no, not adverts), but beyond that in remembering WE ARE NOT by our own will SLAVES TO ADVERTS or social programming/ or by cheaply composited commonalities deliberately applied by those working in advertizing corporation marketing teams to make us emotionally attached TO THEM in slave form, or emotionally attached to what they sell 

 

>> SO ANYWAY BEYOND THAT >>

 

Here's one that tells the truth about the "up vibration" of life as it tries to portray (pretentious/ precocious, etc) typically inside pubs (ie, notorious superficiality exists there like a prerequisite for social engagement, and in other fumbling & awkward social meeting places). where all you really wanna say is, "I'M NOT GOOD, But here we meet anyway"... OR alternatively progressing the situation, at least any newbie conspiracist will come away knowing this is how a conspiracist or secret knowledge person feels in a regular society setting, where everyone just seems to be on another 'plane', where to explain, how, how to even begin....Inner turmoil at first can ruin and feel as pain, fall like rain, but no one in attendance could lean far enough over in the arena of the social hyena... So do as they do until the penny drops and lean back...TAKE YOUR TIME MY FRIENDS (mental health issues or not)...

So noone would hear the pitter patter of mental shards drop like stalactites or one big chandelier~ like the glass that shatters, but that we experience as that is the price for being different, or by having a different view, but it matters because we are still human on in the inside, and even if we alone tell our story, then it is not alone we shall be sat listening when you consider our minds are like a universe expanding, (*only imploding when we give up*), and the TRUTH BEING SO DEMANDING, SO BE IT and yet it will appear finally, and in a multitude of ways reaching far & wide!...as long as we persist, then truth will out!...Just be smart when in doubt.

 

And realistically (depending on the company perhaps, snap! ~we can't expect everyone to be onboard and this is what I mean) so, this means WE MAY sometimes have to play smart in some situations by staying largely silent (but only on occasions) as one choice and as one way, BUT FURTHERSTILL at other times make known more fully how deep is the gully, then either way we encompass the mass audience, neither less wise or less bold as each method still holds the key, with more when needs be to be told.. to let the rumination unfold to illuminate or dissipate, passing by the ears and eyes of your fellow men and women...

 

Help Dispense with mere rumor and Help Disperse the festering stew, obligated on us by fear or self doubt (*& so on*...), and
which that fear, remember is in turn MUCHLY caused by confusion/discomfort of social exclusion/ illusion & social engineering manipulation.

Summoned by the devious chicanery of the Powerful and imposing on gullible types to exude a social hypocrisy (**& mediocrity**),

 

.... In RESPONSE to this WE need to be replacing THAT with redefining why there is confusion and so much ignorance in the world one person at a time....It is not a time for social ricochet exactly, but however you just know sometimes that is what being sociable in some settings will showcase anyhow *and dare I say often* (stupidness knows no bounds in some people out there) as a part of the arrogance of your Average Jo, but let's not be perturbed by that.... Just be informative, (*not patronizing*) & speak as plainly as possible if someone appears willing to listen and isn't acting all stupid.

 

https://youtube.com/ij7RyWMVF-k

 

Edited by Certified Green of Heart
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