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43 minutes ago, Tamlinn said:

I looked up flu cases in Canada. Mysteriously they dipped to "exceptionally" low levels on the weeks that Covid cases started being reported. My own province stopped recording flu cases completely. Pretty suspicious.

 

 

Thanks for the info. Which province would that be?

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https://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/

 

HaHaHa - Yours Truly - Velma - got photographed at the demonstration in Edinburgh.

 

Scroll down to 'Opinion' to see my picture (not very flattering) but hey-ho, that's me!

Protect the elderly, but let’s see life back to normal for those at low risk

Prof David Livermore is a microbiologist from the University of East Anglia and signatory of the Great Barrington Declaration

 
It's a crap article, but I can't read it anyway, because I don't subscribe to the Telegraph.
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19 minutes ago, Velma said:

It's a crap article, but I can't read it anyway, because I don't subscribe to the Telegraph.

 

Covid-19 is the worst pandemic I’ve seen in 40 years as a microbiologist. It is not a hoax. It fills ICUs faster than seasonal flu. It is implicated in a million deaths already. So, if it is that bad, why have I signed the Great Barrington Declaration?

 

I am partly retired and have a comfortable life; I can write, edit photos, take long walks and, selfishly, sit it out. The answer is that, in conscience, I can no longer do so, professionally or as a citizen.

In March, we knew little. A brief lockdown was proportionate, to ready the NHS. Now, though, we know that much infection is very mild and inconsequential.

Among 750 Northumbria University students who were PCR-positive, just 78 had symptoms; in the US, 70,000 students were PCR positive and three hospitalised. The median age of those who have succumbed is 82 years, while life expectancy is 81 years. Fewer than 400 UK residents under 60 without comorbidities have died. For this, we have restricted human interactions and stifled the economy.

A trip to Leicester Square finds closed theatres and empty chairs at empty tables. A 10-day Scottish coastal trek in August found little hotels and pubs trying to restart. Now, their owners and staff are crushed again.

There is something nastier, too. The goodwill of March, when 700,000 volunteered, is replaced by masks that hide smiles or hostility and by posters threatening £6,400 fines. I don’t condone anti-lockdown demonstrations, but I am more disturbed by baton-wielding police deployed against them. It is not the England I love, and I doubt the atmosphere helps anyone’s mental health.

A psychiatrist pal is admitting patients ‘‘tipped over the edge’’; Prof Dalgleish, my co-signatory, has two suicides among collaborators. Further lockdowns might be worth it, if a good vaccine was very close... That’s the bet. But even the furthest advanced vaccine trials extend into next spring and tell little about the longevity of immunity.

Whether vaccines will protect the “immune senescent” frail elderly will remain uncertain. And I have served on enough vaccine-development advisory boards to know the frequent taste of failure. The Government’s ‘‘suppression then vaccine’’ approach is a colossal punt.

Meantime, the damage accumulates. There is no good way out, but the declaration outlines a route that we believe is better, and more humane. So far as possible, life should return to normal for those at low risk and for anyone older who accepts the hazard, which will include me.

The virus will circulate among us, generating herd immunity. As we recover, it will run out of hosts and lose traction. Sweden’s approach resembles this, and the societal damage is far less than here, while the time curve of deaths per million differs little. Hospitals were not overwhelmed and hopefully ours won’t be either; if things get tight, the Nightingale sites can be used.

Effort should then be directed to protecting the vulnerable, principally the elderly. Support could include well-paid live-in staff, rotating at care homes, food deliveries to those alone and the option (not compulsion) of hotels for those living in multi-generational families.

All this is better use of money than recently: the NAO reports £26  billion of Bounce Back loans lost to fraud and failures – that’s £65,000 per care home resident.

Never in history have we handled a pandemic like this. Not the 1889-94 “Russian Flu” (maybe a coronavirus), which killed 135,000 from a population half of today’s; nor in 1918, when we defeated the German army as a far worse epidemic peaked. Future generations will look back aghast.

Some colleagues are cross I have spoken. To them, in conscience and surveying the wreckage, I can only quote Martin Luther: “Here I stand; I can do no other.” That’s why I signed.

Prof David Livermore is a microbiologist from the University of East Anglia. He writes in a personal capacity.

 

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It will certainly be interesting to see how this pans out. As someone cannot die of Covid and Flu, this will be the proof. If this years flu season disappears then we know they're classing the flu deaths as covid!

 

I have heard that one excuse they will use is there hasn't been much flu because of social distancing, which is just bollox isn't it really.

Edited by FrankVitali
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2 hours ago, lake said:

 

Covid-19 is the worst pandemic I’ve seen in 40 years as a microbiologist. It is not a hoax. It fills ICUs faster than seasonal flu. It is implicated in a million deaths already. So, if it is that bad, why have I signed the Great Barrington Declaration?

 

I am partly retired and have a comfortable life; I can write, edit photos, take long walks and, selfishly, sit it out. The answer is that, in conscience, I can no longer do so, professionally or as a citizen.

In March, we knew little. A brief lockdown was proportionate, to ready the NHS. Now, though, we know that much infection is very mild and inconsequential.

Among 750 Northumbria University students who were PCR-positive, just 78 had symptoms; in the US, 70,000 students were PCR positive and three hospitalised. The median age of those who have succumbed is 82 years, while life expectancy is 81 years. Fewer than 400 UK residents under 60 without comorbidities have died. For this, we have restricted human interactions and stifled the economy.

A trip to Leicester Square finds closed theatres and empty chairs at empty tables. A 10-day Scottish coastal trek in August found little hotels and pubs trying to restart. Now, their owners and staff are crushed again.

There is something nastier, too. The goodwill of March, when 700,000 volunteered, is replaced by masks that hide smiles or hostility and by posters threatening £6,400 fines. I don’t condone anti-lockdown demonstrations, but I am more disturbed by baton-wielding police deployed against them. It is not the England I love, and I doubt the atmosphere helps anyone’s mental health.

A psychiatrist pal is admitting patients ‘‘tipped over the edge’’; Prof Dalgleish, my co-signatory, has two suicides among collaborators. Further lockdowns might be worth it, if a good vaccine was very close... That’s the bet. But even the furthest advanced vaccine trials extend into next spring and tell little about the longevity of immunity.

Whether vaccines will protect the “immune senescent” frail elderly will remain uncertain. And I have served on enough vaccine-development advisory boards to know the frequent taste of failure. The Government’s ‘‘suppression then vaccine’’ approach is a colossal punt.

Meantime, the damage accumulates. There is no good way out, but the declaration outlines a route that we believe is better, and more humane. So far as possible, life should return to normal for those at low risk and for anyone older who accepts the hazard, which will include me.

The virus will circulate among us, generating herd immunity. As we recover, it will run out of hosts and lose traction. Sweden’s approach resembles this, and the societal damage is far less than here, while the time curve of deaths per million differs little. Hospitals were not overwhelmed and hopefully ours won’t be either; if things get tight, the Nightingale sites can be used.

Effort should then be directed to protecting the vulnerable, principally the elderly. Support could include well-paid live-in staff, rotating at care homes, food deliveries to those alone and the option (not compulsion) of hotels for those living in multi-generational families.

All this is better use of money than recently: the NAO reports £26  billion of Bounce Back loans lost to fraud and failures – that’s £65,000 per care home resident.

Never in history have we handled a pandemic like this. Not the 1889-94 “Russian Flu” (maybe a coronavirus), which killed 135,000 from a population half of today’s; nor in 1918, when we defeated the German army as a far worse epidemic peaked. Future generations will look back aghast.

Some colleagues are cross I have spoken. To them, in conscience and surveying the wreckage, I can only quote Martin Luther: “Here I stand; I can do no other.” That’s why I signed.

Prof David Livermore is a microbiologist from the University of East Anglia. He writes in a personal capacity.

 

 

There is no virus.

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Well I never.

Coronavirus: WHO backflips on virus stance by condemning lockdowns

Lockdowns have been used to control the coronavirus around the world, plunging millions of lives into chaos. Now the WHO has changed its mind.

https://www.news.com.au/world/coronavirus/global/coronavirus-who-backflips-on-virus-stance-by-condemning-lockdowns/news-story/f2188f2aebff1b7b291b297731c3da74

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Just now, Fifth element said:

Well I never.

 

lol Here's what he said ...

 

Dr. David Nabarro from the WHO appealed to world leaders yesterday, telling them to stop “using lockdowns as your primary control method” of the coronavirus.

He also claimed that the only thing lockdowns achieved was poverty – with no mention of the potential lives saved.

“Lockdowns just have one consequence that you must never ever belittle, and that is making poor people an awful lot poorer,” he said.

Imagining large numbers of people are consciously conspiring together to enslave humanity does not hold water ... Very very few understand the scam .. the royals , rothschilds , Gates and a few others ... I don't believe Boris knows , or those in the WHO , they are just people blundering around mostly trying to do the right thing 

Edited by oz93666
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I attended the Querdenken protest in Berlin today, a great experience despite not understanding a word of German.

 

Sadly there was a ridiculous police presence, almost more police than potestors (a bit of a disappointing turnout, I'd guess around 200 people), and we were forced into social distancing and masks as they were looking for any excuse to break up the protest right from the off.

 

I was told I needed to wear a mask as I would probably be asked for my medical exemption papers if I didn't have one. Sure enough, as soon as there was any hint of chanting or anti-police talk the files moved in and several people without were asked for their papers by large numbers of police.

 

This culminated in an unprovoked police attack on a middle-aged gentleman who obviously didn't have the right documentation or was taking too long in the eyes of the police. He was jumped on by 5 officers, one of whom had him in a headlock. 2 more potestors were bundled into a van for no real reason that I could see.

 

The helmets came on and for a few minutes things looked like getting a bit ugly. Luckily it calmed down and there was an emotional moment as the entire protest sat down and sang together.

 

Not a single neo-Nazi or violent protester in sight, meanwhile on Friday night I witnessed Antifa throwing smoke bombs and trashing public property to "bash the fash". This stuff really is evil, it needs to be resisted at any cost.

 

 

Edited by Illmatic
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Stuck LBC on this morning. A caller called John rang in. Said anyone not wearing a mask in public should be rounded up by the army and detained because they are a danger to society. He was serious. The presenter agreed, although said using the army was a bit over the top.

 

It's getting absurd now.

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15 minutes ago, truther79 said:

Stuck LBC on this morning. A caller called John rang in. Said anyone not wearing a mask in public should be rounded up by the army and detained because they are a danger to society. He was serious. The presenter agreed, although said using the army was a bit over the top.

 

It's getting absurd now.

The next war will be between the face masks and the non face masks (never mind my profile pic lol).

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7 hours ago, Velma said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/

 

HaHaHa - Yours Truly - Velma - got photographed at the demonstration in Edinburgh.

 

Scroll down to 'Opinion' to see my picture (not very flattering) but hey-ho, that's me!

Protect the elderly, but let’s see life back to normal for those at low risk

Prof David Livermore is a microbiologist from the University of East Anglia and signatory of the Great Barrington Declaration

 
It's a crap article, but I can't read it anyway, because I don't subscribe to the Telegraph.

i can see a face on your neck

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25 minutes ago, Sit down, Waldo said:

It's being spread by cash now...

 

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-54500673

 

More fear propaganda, now people are going to think the virus can remain on surfaces for 28 days when that is not true. No doubt causing mass hysteria about disinfecting all surfaces everywhere. These people have gone nuts. 

Edited by SimonTV
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1 hour ago, truther79 said:

Stuck LBC on this morning. A caller called John rang in. Said anyone not wearing a mask in public should be rounded up by the army and detained because they are a danger to society. He was serious. The presenter agreed, although said using the army was a bit over the top.

 

It's getting absurd now.

 

Trust me......we're fucked.

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9 hours ago, Velma said:

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/opinion/

 

HaHaHa - Yours Truly - Velma - got photographed at the demonstration in Edinburgh.

 

Scroll down to 'Opinion' to see my picture (not very flattering) but hey-ho, that's me!

Protect the elderly, but let’s see life back to normal for those at low risk

Prof David Livermore is a microbiologist from the University of East Anglia and signatory of the Great Barrington Declaration

 
It's a crap article, but I can't read it anyway, because I don't subscribe to the Telegraph.

Cool shades, nice scarf Velma. :classic_cool:

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