Mr H Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 3 minutes ago, pi3141 said: Taliban issues 37 stoning orders since takeover of Afghanistan by Amu TV July 25, 2024 Link - https://amu.tv/112543/ Let me find the Saudi numbers and the Isis numbers. Afghanistan is a rogue, lawless state. And the folks running it were set up and supported by the west....... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi3141 Posted June 21 Author Share Posted June 21 (edited) Isis executes more than 4,000 people in less than two years Monitors say people were beheaded and shot for 'offences' including apostasy and sodomy Lizzie Dearden Saturday 30 April 2016 09:58 BST Isis is believed to have executed more than 4,000 people in less than two years for 'offences' including sodomy and apostasy in Syria. Monitors compiled the list of atrocities dating back to the declaration of the so-called Islamic State in June 2014, showing regular beheadings, shootings, stonings and other methods of murder, including throwing people off buildings and setting them on fire. The UK-based Syrian Observatory for Human Rights (SOHR) said that by the end of the 22nd month of the caliphate, 4,144 people had been executed. Civilians including women and children were among those killed, as are hundreds of Isis’s own members and enemy fighters from Syrian President Bashar al-Assad’s army and opposition rebel groups. Link - https://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/middle-east/isis-has-executed-more-than-4-000-people-in-under-two-years-of-the-islamic-state-in-syria-a7007876.html Edited June 21 by pi3141 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr H Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 (edited) https://www.nationmaster.com/country-info/compare/Saudi-Arabia/United-States/Crime/Violent-crime Bastian of liberal democracy has x50 higher murder rate than the bastion state of Islam Not many robberies there either I'm guessing..... Edited June 21 by Mr H Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi3141 Posted June 21 Author Share Posted June 21 3 minutes ago, Mr H said: Afghanistan is a rogue, lawless state. And the folks running it were set up and supported by the west....... What about Saudi Arabia? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr H Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 Just now, pi3141 said: What about Saudi Arabia? 50x lower murder rate than us. I don't know how many stonings. How many electricuted ETC by the state in the US? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr H Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 @pi3141 So I don't know nos for Saudi. But Iran the other "extremist" state had 6 state stonings since 2006 according to amnesty https://www.google.com/url?sa=t&source=web&rct=j&opi=89978449&url=https://www.amnesty.org/es/wp-content/uploads/2021/07/act500082010en.pdf&ved=2ahUKEwiArKSBnIKOAxVwT0EAHXshBqkQFnoECCgQAQ&usg=AOvVaw1u7xklgfzxjxxnSh_DNp7r The US does about 25 state execution per year! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi3141 Posted June 21 Author Share Posted June 21 Just now, Mr H said: don't know how many stonings. How many electricuted ETC by the state in the US? So your trying to justify it because US has death penalty also? Amputation, stoning to death and public lashing are ok for adulterers and theives because the US still has death penalty, for the worst offenders, usually murderers, after due legal process. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi3141 Posted June 21 Author Share Posted June 21 2 minutes ago, Mr H said: @pi3141 The US does about 25 state execution per year! Isis executes more than 4,000 people in less than two years Monitors say people were beheaded and shot for 'offences' including apostasy and sodomy Lizzie Dearden Saturday 30 April 2016 09:58 BST Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr H Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 @pi3141 and I'm not supporting Islam or Sharia law. I just think justifying thousands of deaths because one is barbaric, is silly. When the west is equally or could be argued much more barbaric if you include all the wars death , destruction and economic strangulation it causes. I think what it shows, is that no matter your religion color or creed, you gunna get crazy evil folks. But majority of folks no matter religion color or creed are normal decent people. So using barbarism as justification doesn't wash Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi3141 Posted June 21 Author Share Posted June 21 3 minutes ago, Mr H said: @pi3141 and I'm not supporting Islam or Sharia law. I just think justifying thousands of deaths because one is barbaric, is silly. When the west is equally or could be argued much more barbaric if you include all the wars death , destruction and economic strangulation it causes. I think what it shows, is that no matter your religion color or creed, you gunna get crazy evil folks. But majority of folks no matter religion color or creed are normal decent people. So using barbarism as justification doesn't wash I accuse Hamas of barbarism, not the Palestinian people. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi3141 Posted June 21 Author Share Posted June 21 @Mr H Do you think the Oct 7th attack was carried out by Palestinians? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr H Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 4 minutes ago, pi3141 said: @Mr H Do you think the Oct 7th attack was carried out by Palestinians? I could be wrong as far as I know it was committed by Hamas who were probably from Palestine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr H Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 7 minutes ago, pi3141 said: I accuse Hamas of barbarism, not the Palestinian people. Yeah, so not really justified to kill tens of thousands, starve hundreds of thousands of them then, is it? Again as I said before. It's the normal people who I personally support not Hamas or Israel. In my book both as bad as each other. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr H Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 Anyway. The question here was do I support Israel killing tens of thousands of innocents, my answer is a clear no. The justifications you bring that these are barbaric people, doesn't wash when you look at the barbarian conducted by the west, state murder, economic strangulation and mass wars. I consider them both equally barbaric and unnecessary. Does that mean I support Sharia law or Hammas, the answer is no. Summary really of my position fwiw Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi3141 Posted June 21 Author Share Posted June 21 3 minutes ago, Mr H said: Anyway. The question here was do I support Israel killing tens of thousands of innocents, my answer is a clear no. The justifications you bring that these are barbaric people, doesn't wash when you look at the barbarian conducted by the west, state murder, economic strangulation and mass wars. I consider them both equally barbaric and unnecessary. Does that mean I support Sharia law or Hammas, the answer is no. Summary really of my position fwiw Understood. I don't like it either. I wish it would stop, they talk and find peace. Reality is, Hamas will not let that happen, and if they do, it will be temporary until they rearm and start it again. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr H Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 10 minutes ago, pi3141 said: Understood. I don't like it either. I wish it would stop, they talk and find peace. Reality is, Hamas will not let that happen, and if they do, it will be temporary until they rearm and start it again. Would it stop if international law was upheld and we had two state solution? I don't know the answer. Just putting it out there. Killing thousands will %100 not stop it and just create more crazies... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi3141 Posted June 21 Author Share Posted June 21 6 minutes ago, Mr H said: Would it stop if international law was upheld and we had two state solution? I don't know the answer. Just putting it out there. Killing thousands will %100 not stop it and just create more crazies... Yep, hate breeds hate. Don't know about international law, Israel doesn't recognize ICJ. I don't know if it's possible to go that route. As the man in the Facebook post stated, Muslim Brotherhood will use democracy until they can seize total control, Hamas will do the same. They have stated - no integration, it's total control they want, worldwide caliphate under sharia law. They will do anything to make it happen - because the west has betrayed them so many times they won't trust anything else. I don't blame them, our policies have driven this extremism. But look at what they do. We can't allow the world to be controlled by extremists. Our lot are bad enough,but Isis, Hamas and Muslim Brotherhood are whole different world of pain. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Campion Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 (edited) Just to say. Hamas only rules over Gaza, the West Bank is ruled by the PA (Palestinian Authority) which is linked to the PLO. The PA have made peace agreements with Israel and despite huge provocation with the Israeli settlements on their land, have not yet broken the peace agreements. So the political situation is more complex and the Palestinian people are divided between Gaza and the West Bank. The issue of the settlements is huge because it shows up the peace accords in a bad light. Look what happens when they make peace with Israel, the land is still taken anyway. Not all Israelis support the settlements of course, Israel is divided between moderates and extremists too, but they have a proportional voting system which gives power to the hard liners. Some of the other Muslim countries like Egypt, Jordan and UAE have peace treaties with Israel, although it's an uneasy peace. Saudi doesn't have a treaty yet but are pro US so generally keep out of it (apart from funding the Wahhabi propaganda in the West as the video shows). It shows how the Muslims have a mixed approach and it's complicated. Ironically it is the Iranian Shia Muslims who are supporting the Sunni Hamas, but then they are opposed to the US since the 1979 revolution. Edited June 21 by Campion 2 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shabbirss Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 Just now, Campion said: Just to say. Hamas only rules over Gaza, the West Bank is ruled by the PA (Palestinian Authority) which is linked to the PLO. The PA have made peace agreements with Israel and despite huge provocation with the Israeli settlements on their land, have not yet broken the peace agreements. So the political situation is more complex and the Palestinian people are divided between Gaza and the West Bank. The issue of the settlements is huge because it shows up the peace accords in a bad light. Look what happens when they make peace with Israel, the land is still taken anyway. Not all Israelis support the settlements of course, Israel is divided between moderates and extremists too, but they have a proportional voting system which gives power to the hard liners. Some of the other Muslim countries like Egypt, Jordan and UAE have peace treaties with Israel, although it's an uneasy peace. Saudi doesn't have a treaty yet but are pro US so generally keep out of it. It shows how the Muslims have a mixed approach and it's complicated. Ironically it is the Iranian Shia Muslims who are supporting the Sunni Hamas, but then they are opposed to the US since the 1979 revolution. and yet, the west bank was attacked by israel too. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Talorgan Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 I like to put it simply for the hard of thinking like myself IE The real problem is we are run by nincompoops following hidden agendas which leads to wars but we the people Everywhere just want peace given the chance as always would get along fine despite cultural differences if not stirred up by propaganda by hidden hands and would much rather spend our money on better standard of living than the military industrial complex. 3 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi3141 Posted June 21 Author Share Posted June 21 Syriana I know it's fiction but read the reviews - Movie Review An old adage asserts, “Money makes the world go round.” Syriana adds to that with the convincing claim that oil accelerates the spin. In an unnamed, oil-rich Persian Gulf country, a young prince named Nasir Al-Subaai has disrupted the status quo by granting new natural gas drilling rights to a Chinese company—instead of the American one, Connex, which had previously held those rights. To make up for lost revenue, Connex seeks to merge with another Texas company, Killen, that has recently (and most probably shadily) acquired drilling rights in Kazakhstan. When the deal attracts the attention of the United States Justice Department, Connex secures the services of the Washington law firm Sloan Whiting to pave the way for its approval. (Little does Sloan Whiting lawyer Bennett Holiday know what will be required of him to make the deal happen.) Meanwhile, career CIA field operative Bob Barnes is under pressure to make up for a botched mission in Iran, and he agrees to assassinate Prince Nasir in Lebanon, no questions asked. When that mission also goes disastrously awry, his superiors unjustly make him the scapegoat—but in doing so they unleash the fury of a man suddenly determined to know the truth about what’s really going on. Add in ambitious energy analyst Bryan Woodman who’s determined to make his mark helping Nasir, an Egyptian terrorist devoted to recruiting impressionable young Pakistanis working in the oilfields, Nasir’s scheming younger brother, and a manipulative U.S. politician. Now you’ve got a volatile mix of men determined to shape the destiny of Middle Eastern oil production—and a movie that’s determinedly pointed in its message but more than a little hard to follow. Conclusion Syriana offers a bleak yet eye-opening look (albeit from one director’s perspective) at how countries and corporations are determined to protect their oil interests. At its core, it is a scathing indictment of how oil and the money and influence it generates corrupts everyone who seeks to control it. Almost every character experiences erosion of his integrity at some point—even those who are trying, on some level, to do the right thing. So it’s a profoundly pessimistic moral picture that’s painted onscreen, as it suggests that much of what we depend upon in government and business isn’t just eaten away at the edges, it’s thoroughly rotten. That tone is encapsulated in the response Killen oilman Danny Dalton gives Bennett after being accused of corruption. Danny vents, “Corruption charges? Corruption? Corruption is government intrusion into market efficiencies in the form of regulation. … We have laws precisely so we can get away with it. Corruption is our protection. Corruption keeps us safe and warm. Corruption is why you and I are prancing around in here instead of fighting over scraps of meat out in the streets. Corruption is why we win.” Like other recent films that implicate government and business in ruthless, unethical and illegal behavior (The Constant Gardner, Lord of War), Syriana will cause those who see it to ask, “Is it really that bad?” I can’t answer that question. But I can tell you it’s a question worth wrestling with—though I’m not sure any of us need to see a film as violently despairing as Syriana in order to begin grappling with it. Its a good film. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi3141 Posted June 21 Author Share Posted June 21 How George W. Bush Helped Hamas Come to Power In Bush’s naïveté about the magic of elections, he ignored a crucial point about democracy. By Fred Kaplan Oct 24, 20233:32 PM It was in January 2006 that the Palestinian territories held what turned out to be their last parliamentary elections. Hamas won a bare plurality of votes (44 percent to the more moderate Fatah party’s 41 percent) but, given the electoral system, a strong majority of seats (74 to 45). Neither party was keen on sharing power. Fighting broke out between the two. When a unity government was finally formed in June 2007, Hamas broke the deal, started murdering Fatah members, and, in the end, took total control of the Gaza Strip. Those who weren’t killed fled to the West Bank, and the territories have remained split ever since. In other words, Hamas’ absolute rule of Gaza is not what the Palestinians voted for back in 2006. In fact, since the median age of Gazans is 18, half of Hamas’ subjects weren’t even born when the election took place. Since they have known no alternative, have absorbed little information but Hamas propaganda, and have witnessed periodic outbursts of violent conflict with Israel throughout their lives, it is impossible to know what they really think about their rulers. Link - https://slate.com/news-and-politics/2023/10/was-hamas-elected-to-govern-gaza-george-w-bush-2006-palestinian-election.html 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JONJAY79 Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 The Palestinians are protesting against Hamas and Israelis are protesting against the zionists. These two groups Hamas and zionists both have political aims that do not benefit their own people. Hamas wants to kill all Jews and the zionists want their greater Israel project dragging us all into WW3. 2 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pi3141 Posted June 21 Author Share Posted June 21 35 minutes ago, JONJAY79 said: The Palestinians are protesting against Hamas and Israelis are protesting against the zionists. These two groups Hamas and zionists both have political aims that do not benefit their own people. Hamas wants to kill all Jews and the zionists want their greater Israel project dragging us all into WW3. Once again Zionism arose from an extreme situation, most Jewish people rejected it, Israel was an idea not to be realised, but out of the persecution in Russia some Jews started calling for it, then there was the Balfour treaty, obviously it gained traction in WW2 with Hitler deporting Jews there and the continued persecution. An extreme reaction from extremists to an extreme situation. It hasn't stopped, those extremist voices have an audience now, just like extreme Islam has an audience. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shabbirss Posted June 21 Share Posted June 21 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.jpg.8081a54a3b74a5d1823dfac966666137.jpg)
.jpg.594f0ef23288ec5ab04539b2f8a8dbd4.jpg)
Recommended Posts
Join the conversation
You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.