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1 minute ago, RobinJ said:

Indeed, I dont disagree with you at all. However, all these things/ ideas etc bring separation which is the ultimate agenda. The more separated we are in every aspect, the more we are conquered and controlled.

We have to move past that and come together somehow as one clan, otherwise, we carry on the same hamster wheel of programming. 


We need to work out what will wake people up to this as gently as possible whilst arming them with enough information to fight back. What ultimately unites all of humanity? Crimes being committed against us by the very people the general public trust the most. How to go about that I do not know. 

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On 7/4/2023 at 3:07 PM, TheConsultant said:

We need to work out what will wake people up to this as gently as possible whilst arming them with enough information to fight back. What ultimately unites all of humanity? Crimes being committed against us by the very people the general public trust the most. How to go about that I do not know. 

 

 

Education.

 

A single truth can topple a mountain of lies.

 

We just have to be sure we're speaking the truth. I won't list all the conspiracy theories I think are bullshit but theres a lot of them and it seriously infects our reality.

I was not there, but one week members of my spiritual church were all talking about a medium from the previous meeting, a channeler, who told the church the Queen was a shapeshifting lizard and there were reptilian overlords controlling society.

 

Even the mediums can be deceived in this matter, they are only human, the gift isn't exactly that once your tuned in you know the whole truth about everything. It doesn't work like that.

 

I agree you have to look at groups involved, but only up to a point - you have to step back and see that all these groups are playing their part, however small, in the whole scheme, which makes focussing on any group pointless and leads exactly to where RobinJ states and that is division, and divided we are ruled.

 

The human race is under a spell of some sort, we just lumber on from one calamity to the next never fixing problems or really changing anything.

 

The only thing that can change it is individual choice and people only have a choice if the know the options, they will only know those by education.

 

 

 

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9 minutes ago, pi3141 said:

 

 

Education.

 

A single truth can topple a mountain of lies.

 

We just have to be sure we're speaking the truth. I won't list all the conspiracy theories I think are bullshit but theres a lot of them and it seriously infects our reality.

I was not there, but one week members of my spiritual church were all talking about a medium from the previous meeting, a channeler, who told the church the Queen was a shapeshifting lizard and there were reptilian overlords controlling society.

 

Even the mediums can be deceived in this matter, they are only human, the gift isn't exactly that once your tuned in you know the whole truth about everything. It doesn't work like that.

 

I agree you have to look at groups involved, but only up to a point - you have to step back and see that all these groups are playing their part, however small, in the whole scheme, which makes focussing on any group pointless and leads exactly to where RobinJ states and that is division, and divided we are ruled.

 

The human race is under a spell of some sort, we just lumber on from one calamity to the next never fixing problems or really changing anything.

 

The only thing that can change it is individual choice and people only have a choice if the know the options, they will only know those by education.

 

 

 


Education, I assume you do not mean state education?

Would love a small list of the conspiracies you perceive to be bullshit, just out of my own interest. Of course many are bollocks that require very little digging, if at all to dismiss.

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19 minutes ago, TheConsultant said:

Education, I assume you do not mean state education?

 

 

Certainly not. 

 

I've just been writing this with your comment of compartmentalization in mind - 

 

Take the Freemasons as an example, most Masons only do the first 3 degrees to become 'Master Masons' and from there they don't bother. To the outside world, this person is a 'Master Mason' which means he must be high up in the Masons, but the truth is, he's at the bottom, there are 29 more degree's ahead of him, but he'll never know what they entail and anyone knowing the fellow is a Master Mason will be impressed.   

 

But one or two do get to the top, it takes years of dedication. holding certain posts for a period, hosting charity events, dinners etc, all the way up to the 32nd degree where they are told the truth, that there is no great secret in Freemasonry. They find out the whole thing is sham, a scam, a fake. But what now, they are bound by terrible oaths not reveal anything - not even to their Brethren.

 

So they must take their place in the Pantomime, keeping up the charade for the good of it. Why? well partly because they invested so much into it they can't bear to accept the truth, partly because they would rather be in it than on the outside - there are many reasons why a human chooses self delusion over reality - look at the churches, used to be full every week. Look art society, its not the best it can be but millions of people accept it and go along with it. Its the same thing. People at the bottom don't know and people at the top know but can't think how to change it or even if they should because everyone else is going along with it and they made it to the top so they got comfort, power and security etc.

 

Self delusion, the most powerful weapon of them all and it can be achieved by influence rather than force, covertly not overtly and its mostly self perpetuating once its in place, mass hypnosis/delusion/conformity/herd mentality etc 

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58 minutes ago, TheConsultant said:

Would love a small list of the conspiracies you perceive to be bullshit, just out of my own interest. Of course many are bollocks that require very little digging, if at all to dismiss.

 

Ok I'll indulge -

 

I don't believe - 

 

The Queen was a shapeshifting lizard
reptilian overlords replacing powerful people with clones
Michelle Obama or Jenifer Aniston are men
Nano tech utilizing 5g in Covid vaccines to be activated by 5G in an event known as 'Red October' killing everybody.
That Lady Dianna faked her death and has been spotted working as a helicopter pilot for JFK Jr who also faked his death and will be returning to run as president.
That Sandy Hook was a staged event using 'crisis actors' - even AJ had to go to court and admit that was fake, yet still people believe - self delusion again.
That the Earth is Flat or that it is 'Super Large' and contains, land of mars, land of angels, Andromeda and Fairy land etc

 

May I just say, my sister believes in ALL the above, and then some. So I have experience in these matters, watching someone radicalize themselves into a fantasy world that just as real to them as our world is to us.  And it is radicalization, she's reading extremist propaganda and its twisted her mind into someone I don't recognize anymore and she's wasting her life over it. Its very sad and it won't end well. She's already spoken of suicide, but I can't reach her.

 

My sister believes the world is 'super large' and may be concave but she's not really sure, I've questioned her on it, she can't explain it, I pointed out basic facts, sunrises, eclipses, but she tells me she would rather believe something she doesn't understand than that we're on a globe. Thats serious self delusion, brainwashing, programming, call it what you will.

 

She's staking her whole life on these conspiracies and if she's wrong - it'll be suicide (she tells me).

 

 

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1 hour ago, pi3141 said:

 

 

Education.

 

A single truth can topple a mountain of lies.

 

We just have to be sure we're speaking the truth. I won't list all the conspiracy theories I think are bullshit but theres a lot of them and it seriously infects our reality.

I was not there, but one week members of my spiritual church were all talking about a medium from the previous meeting, a channeler, who told the church the Queen was a shapeshifting lizard and there were reptilian overlords controlling society.

 

Even the mediums can be deceived in this matter, they are only human, the gift isn't exactly that once your tuned in you know the whole truth about everything. It doesn't work like that.

 

I agree you have to look at groups involved, but only up to a point - you have to step back and see that all these groups are playing their part, however small, in the whole scheme, which makes focussing on any group pointless and leads exactly to where RobinJ states and that is division, and divided we are ruled.

 

The human race is under a spell of some sort, we just lumber on from one calamity to the next never fixing problems or really changing anything.

 

The only thing that can change it is individual choice and people only have a choice if the know the options, they will only know those by education.

 

 

 

I honestly think that we have to encourage people to question about metaphysical things rather than politics or covid stuff etc. If they cant or wont see the things that are right in front of their face in those matters, then no amount of trying to give them info re proof or facts will change it.

Once you open the door to what you /we are, especially now,  it seems you are pushed through it and get a crash course in spiritual matters.

Ince that starts it leads to all kinds of other questioning.

Having said all that, I do also think there are many who are not meant to awaken and will remain in stasis while ago I started a thread with the question" what made you wake up"

If more people add to that maybe we can get a consensus of what works best? Then we can use that as a wedge to pry them open 😆 its largely fear keeping people ignorant, particularly fear of loss in any format.

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48 minutes ago, pi3141 said:

 

Ok I'll indulge -

 

I don't believe - 

 

The Queen was a shapeshifting lizard
reptilian overlords replacing powerful people with clones
Michelle Obama or Jenifer Aniston are men
Nano tech utilizing 5g in Covid vaccines to be activated by 5G in an event known as 'Red October' killing everybody.
That Lady Dianna faked her death and has been spotted working as a helicopter pilot for JFK Jr who also faked his death and will be returning to run as president.
That Sandy Hook was a staged event using 'crisis actors' - even AJ had to go to court and admit that was fake, yet still people believe - self delusion again.
That the Earth is Flat or that it is 'Super Large' and contains, land of mars, land of angels, Andromeda and Fairy land etc

 

May I just say, my sister believes in ALL the above, and then some. So I have experience in these matters, watching someone radicalize themselves into a fantasy world that just as real to them as our world is to us.  And it is radicalization, she's reading extremist propaganda and its twisted her mind into someone I don't recognize anymore and she's wasting her life over it. Its very sad and it won't end well. She's already spoken of suicide, but I can't reach her.

 

My sister believes the world is 'super large' and may be concave but she's not really sure, I've questioned her on it, she can't explain it, I pointed out basic facts, sunrises, eclipses, but she tells me she would rather believe something she doesn't understand than that we're on a globe. Thats serious self delusion, brainwashing, programming, call it what you will.

 

She's staking her whole life on these conspiracies and if she's wrong - it'll be suicide (she tells me).

 

 

Wow! I've never heard of some of those theories. But then I dont watch too much alternative media or regular news. I only dip into headlines once in a while to see where we are at in the process.

There sure is a massive disinformation campaign going on to make us look nuts. I guess it counter balances the madness of politics etc.

I suspect that when you realise you are in a sinking ship you will cling on to anything, even if it doesn't float 😝

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2 hours ago, pi3141 said:

 

Ok I'll indulge -

 

I don't believe - 

 

The Queen was a shapeshifting lizard
reptilian overlords replacing powerful people with clones
Michelle Obama or Jenifer Aniston are men
Nano tech utilizing 5g in Covid vaccines to be activated by 5G in an event known as 'Red October' killing everybody.
That Lady Dianna faked her death and has been spotted working as a helicopter pilot for JFK Jr who also faked his death and will be returning to run as president.
That Sandy Hook was a staged event using 'crisis actors' - even AJ had to go to court and admit that was fake, yet still people believe - self delusion again.
That the Earth is Flat or that it is 'Super Large' and contains, land of mars, land of angels, Andromeda and Fairy land etc

 

May I just say, my sister believes in ALL the above, and then some. So I have experience in these matters, watching someone radicalize themselves into a fantasy world that just as real to them as our world is to us.  And it is radicalization, she's reading extremist propaganda and its twisted her mind into someone I don't recognize anymore and she's wasting her life over it. Its very sad and it won't end well. She's already spoken of suicide, but I can't reach her.

 

My sister believes the world is 'super large' and may be concave but she's not really sure, I've questioned her on it, she can't explain it, I pointed out basic facts, sunrises, eclipses, but she tells me she would rather believe something she doesn't understand than that we're on a globe. Thats serious self delusion, brainwashing, programming, call it what you will.

 

She's staking her whole life on these conspiracies and if she's wrong - it'll be suicide (she tells me).

 

 


Thanks for indulging, sorry to hear about your sister.

 

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11 hours ago, RobinJ said:

I suspect that when you realise you are in a sinking ship you will cling on to anything, even if it doesn't float 😝

 

Yes this is the crux of it.

 

In my sister's case, she dropped out of school at 14 and lived and worked in a Hotel. (we had abusive childhood, that was her escape, I had to stay 5 more years until I was 19) By her 20's she was working in shops until about mid 20's when she turned to 'cash in hand' jobs. She did that until she was 30 when she decided she wanted a child and that she would 'do it all herself' which meant applying for a council flat and claiming benefits. She raised her child on benefits while dealing drugs for extra cash. My nephew has grown up and is ready to leave home. My sister is 55 and never really worked and has no education to speak of.

 

But she's 'researched' conspiracy theories for 20 years, she's 'knows' this whole world is a lie, which, if she's correct, makes her the smartest person in the room. Dropping out of school meant she didn't accept the brainwashing and working cash in hand meant she did'nt fund the system so she's been in the 'resistance' all her life and if this whole charade would just fall apart and we have the Utopia thats coming, then my sister made all the smart plays.

 

However, if reality is actually mostly real, and society lumbers on the way is has for the next 20 years then my sister is approaching retirement without state or private pension, property, savings or even a partner nothing. Its to late for her to start working, she can't change her choices. Which means there is only one way out, in her mind, (and to my mind too)

 

So, she will cling to that sinking ship because she has absolutely no other choice which means one day there will only be 1 stark choice.

 

I think its the same with the Freemasons for instance. You join, work diligently, pay your dues, do all thats asked and if you ever get to the top and find out its a scam, what do you do? You've invested 20 years into it, you have friends in the society, they're all going along with it, some know some don't. You might reason that on the whole its a good institution and accept it or you have to confront reality and walk away from your lifes work. Given your financial wellbeing and comfortable life for you and your family is all resting on you, then probably, you just accept the ugly truth and carry on as normal.

 

Its the same forces at work in Christianity and the same in our society, once people are invested, they cannot change even if they see the truth.

 

I call it a spell, a psychological spell that programmes people into a mindset, and as you have pointed out - its an either / or mindset. Its dualism, us and them, believer or atheist, communist or democracy, freedom fighter or terrorist, God or Satan, good or bad, part of society or drop out. They set the game so it causes conflict by only offering one extreme or the other while maintaining that both choices are valid even if undesirable - Communism works but democracy is better, your free to choose it but we'd rather do the other. So it appears that we have choice, that we could do anything we want, but we just 'choose' more of the same because thats what everyone else is doing so we go along with it especially if we're comfortable. I say we don't really 'choose' because we don't have all the options to choose from, its just whatever they present to us as choice and its always dualistic so it always causes division.

 

 

 

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13 hours ago, RobinJ said:

Wow! I've never heard of some of those theories.

 

Here - this is where the 'Flat Earth' people have ended up. First it was Flat, then it was Concave, then it was so complicated that normies like me couldn't understand, but now they know its actually 'Super Massive' and they have maps of the entire lands! But even though its 'Super Massive' it may still be Concave. That they are not sure about but they can still map all the lands.

 

See screen grab. (Can't embed video)

 

 

Lands3.jpg

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20 minutes ago, TheConsultant said:

Any citations or real world experience regarding your statement about learning Freemasonry above 32nd degree is a scam?

 

Yep, 'The Deadly Deception by Jim Shaw' I have extracted the 32nd degree lecture somewhere, it gives the lecture in the book.

 

When you get to the 32nd degree, they tell you - 'you are now at the top of the mountain ready to receive more light, but alas, the top of the mountain is misty and we cannot see the light. But you my brother, working on your own, you may discover the truth for yourself. So a hint, because thats all the great mystics give, the hint is, the secret is in the Royal Arch degree. Now, whats the most important thing in a Lodge - Harmony, harmony brothers. Let us conclude.'

 

So in other words, you get to the top to get the inner most secret but nobody knows it cos its shrouded in mist so your on your own - no better off than the day you walked in the door. And none of the lower Mason's will ever find out and your bound by solemn oaths never to tell them. So you go on with the charade no doubt. Or leave and become Catholic like Tony Blair..

 

So the great secret of Freemasonry is ---- there is no secret.

 

Bear with me, I'll dig the lecture out.

 

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9 minutes ago, pi3141 said:

 

Yep, 'The Deadly Deception by Jim Shaw' I have extracted the 32nd degree lecture somewhere, it gives the lecture in the book.

 

When you get to the 32nd degree, they tell you - 'you are now at the top of the mountain ready to receive more light, but alas, the top of the mountain is misty and we cannot see the light. But you my brother, working on your own, you may discover the truth for yourself. So a hint, because thats all the great mystics give, the hint is, the secret is in the Royal Arch degree. Now, whats the most important thing in a Lodge - Harmony, harmony brothers. Let us conclude.'

 

So in other words, you get to the top to get the inner most secret but nobody knows it cos its shrouded in mist so your on your own - no better off than the day you walked in the door. And none of the lower Mason's will ever find out and your bound by solemn oaths never to tell them. So you go on with the charade no doubt. Or leave and become Catholic like Tony Blair..

 

So the great secret of Freemasonry is ---- there is no secret.

 

Bear with me, I'll dig the lecture out.

 


Looking forward to it. 

 

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26 minutes ago, TheConsultant said:

Any citations or real world experience regarding your statement about learning Freemasonry above 32nd degree is a scam?

 

Here's the lecture - 

 

The Lecture Of The 32nd Degree

 

'You are here to learn, if you can learn, and remember what you have been taught.


In the Scottish Rite you will be taught that our ancient ancestors who knew all the Mysteries left enough traces so that we today with dilligent labor and teaching may renew them and bring them to light for your enlightenment. We now come to the great symbol of Pythagoras. Our symbols have descended to us from the Aryans, and many were invented by Pythagoras, who studied in Egypt and Babylon. In order to preserve the great truths learned from the profane, there were invented some of our symbols that represent the profoundest of truths descended to us from our white ancestors. Many have been lost, lost as was the true word at the death of our Grand Master Hiram Abiff.

 

The ancient Masters invented some of these symbols to express their reverence by describing him as Ahura-Mazda, spirit of light. They conceived the idea that Ahura had seven potencies or emenations, four of these they thought of as Male and three Female. The four male potencies of Ahura by which he governed the universe were: the divine might; the divine wisdom; the divine word; and the divine sovereignty. The three Female potencies were: productiveness; health; and vitality.

Look to the East, my brothers..and behold the seven-pointed star, the great symbol of this degree, with the seven colours of the rainbow. The seven colours and the seven points represent the potencies of Ahura.

 

Observe now the great Delta of Pythagoras consisting of 36 lights arranged in eight rows to form an equilateral triangle. The light at the apex of the Delta represents Ahura-Mazda, source of all light. This represents the seven remaining potencies of Ahura.

 

The right angle triangle of three lights around the altar represents the famous 47th propostition of Euclid, or the Pythagorian theorum, which is used to conceal and reveal philosophical truths. The real significance of the cross is that of Ahura and his four male emanations, emenating form him. The four animals of the prophet Eziekel represent these same four male emenations. Man, the divine word, the Eagle, divine wisdom, the Bull, divine might, and the Lion, divine sovereignty.

 

Every equilateral triangle is a symbol of trinity, as are all the groups of three in the Lodge, as the Sun, Moon and Worshipful Master, in the sacred and mystic symbol AUM of the Hindus, whose origin and meaning no one here knows, the great trinity of the Aryans was symbolized by the Adepts. Among the Hindus it symbolized the supreme god of gods. The Brahmins, because of its awfuland sacred meaning, hesitated to pronounce it aloud, and when doing so placed a hand in front of the mouth to deaden the sound. This triliteral name of god is composed of Sanscrit letters.

 

The first letter stands for the creator (Brahma); the second letter U for (Vishnu) the preserver; the third letter M for (Siva) the destroyer. AUM it is, ineffable, not becaused it cannot be pronounced, but because it is pronounced A-A-A-U-U-U-M-M-M. All these things which you can learn by study, concentration, and contemplation, have come down to us from our ancient ancestors through Zaranthustra and Pythagoras.

 

You have reached the mountain peak of Masonic instruction, a peak covered by a mist, which YOU in search for further light can penetrate only by your own efforts. Now we hope you will study dilligently the lessons of all our degrees so that there will be nutured within you a consuming desire to peirce the pure white light of Masonic wisdom. And before we let you go, let me give you a hint and that is all the greatest mystics ever give. The hint is in the Royal Secret, it is there that you may learn to find that light. Yes, brothers, the hint is in the Royal Secret. The true word-man, born of a double nature (of what we call Good and what we call Evil; spiritual and eartly; mortal and immortal) finds the purpose of his being ONLY WHEN THESE TWO NATURES ARE IN PERFECT HARMONY.

 

Harmony, my bretheren, Harmony, is the true word and the Royal Secret which makes possible the empire of True Masonic Brotherhood.'

 

 

 

So you see, they reference Pagan deities and tell you they have no secret - it was the same deal with all the Mystery Schools of old going back to Egypt where they also called themselves 'the sons of light'. You must know, the Egyptians were all about the stars, planets and the sun, believing they turned into 'light bodies' at death to reside amongst the stars - in heaven.  Freemasonry is another spiritual scam along the lines of Greek Mystery schools, which were probably learnt in Egypt, where they unknowingly used mind altering substances and theatrical effects to induce a belief, indeed the 'Gods' appeared on the stage right before your very eyes. Of course your bound by oaths but having seen this spectacle you will be convinced that that particular Mystery School has power. If your behind the scenes working the scam your on the inside and if you can convince yourself your doing it all for 'the greater good' then you can go along with it with a clear conscience. 

 

I see exactly the same tricks at work in Christianity. Freemasons use secrecy and 'shock of enlightenment' to induce psychological changes, Christianity uses Churches and displays of wealth, organs, hymns and prayers to achieve a psychological changes in the congregation.

 

Brainwashing, is not that hard.

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58 minutes ago, pi3141 said:

So the great secret of Freemasonry is ---- there is no secret.

 

This is more or less where I've reached in my spiritual search (from other places not freemasonry) that we don't need to change ourselves to become enlightened, just become more aware of what we already are, of the here and now. But the world is full of seekers asking and bowing down to gurus and mystery cults to save them, enlighten them, remove their sadness and make them happy, free and powerful. Most people aren't satisfied with the here and now. Therefore lots of gurus and cults like the freemasons appear and say they've got the answers if you follow, obey and pay them. 
  
“All of humanity's problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone.”
― Blaise Pascal, Pensées 

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2 minutes ago, Campion said:

This is more or less where I've reached in my spiritual search (from other places not freemasonry) that we don't need to change ourselves to become enlightened, just become more aware of what we already are, of the here and now. But the world is full of seekers asking and bowing down to gurus and mystery cults to save them, enlighten them, remove their sadness and make them happy, free and powerful. Most people aren't satisfied with the here and now. Therefore lots of gurus and cults like the freemasons appear and say they've got the answers if you follow, obey and pay them. 
  
“All of humanity's problems stem from man's inability to sit quietly in a room alone.”
― Blaise Pascal, Pensées 

 

Brilliant.

 

I agree. As I sorted of mentioned, I had an abusive childhood - many hours spent alone, thinking. I am very comfortable within myself and as you said - we do not need to change ourselves, we already have that spiritual connection, we already have that promise of eternal life. Those that attempt to sell you an ideology along the way are fakes.

 

Someone giving away spiritual information - very different. Worth listening to and seeing if it resonates.

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Here's a big hint to those with ears.

 

From 'The Devils Pulpit - Rev Taylor'

 

the presence of these wise men of the east, the first worshippers of the infant Yes — these Magi — with their "gifts, gold, frankincense, and myrrh," which were from eternal ages the first tributary offerings consecrated to the Sun, is, as it were, the clencher to the nail driven in a sure place — a  demonstration never to be withdrawn — that the whole story of the gospel, from first to last, was derived from these Magi, and never was, nor is, any other than that ancient occult or hidden science, which the Apostle Paul calls the Theosophy, or Wisdom of God in a mystery ; but which, in plain English, is the Black art, or magic. " We speak wisdom,^'* says he, '* to them that are perfect (i. e., to the initiated, to them that are up to the' trick on't), yet not the wisdom of this world (i. e., not a science of anything historical, or that ever really happened), but the Theosophy, or Astronomy in disguise, even the hidden wisdom :" — that is, the magic, the black art, in honor of which, its priests and preachers, to this day, wear black gowns and black dresses, the very livery itself of their Divine Master, the Black Prince, as you may see, by dissecting the word gospel into its radicals — that is, God's spell, the spell, charm, or magical incantation, by the repetition of certain words, of which, with your eyes shut, and putting your body in the shape of the constellation Orion (one knee up, the other thrust from you, and the hands clasped together — thus!) it was believed that the power of Omnipotence would be bound to attend the conjuration. 
 

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19 minutes ago, pi3141 said:

Brilliant.

 

I agree. As I sorted of mentioned, I had an abusive childhood - many hours spent alone, thinking. I am very comfortable within myself and as you said - we do not need to change ourselves, we already have that spiritual connection, we already have that promise of eternal life. Those that attempt to sell you an ideology along the way are fakes.

 

Someone giving away spiritual information - very different. Worth listening to and seeing if it resonates.

 

Yes, I should add that this is my spiritual philosophy, in other areas we do need help sometimes like from good health professionals and teachers. We need armies and police to protect us, politically too things need to change so I'm not some kind of pacifist who believes we should let others walk over us, or just accept the evil in the world. 

  

Sorry to hear about your childhood, but it sounds like you've moved on and made your own life now. I heard that's the best revenge for bullies and abusers is to make yourself an awesome life and be happy now. 

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Don't want to derail but this is a fitting example --

 

Lets talk about Purgatory.

 

I'm translating an old manuscript called 'On the State of the Dead and of the Resurrection'

 

I have found this admission - 

 

'It is well known that the Papal Purgatory is a human invention, adapted to the understanding of the people and for the use of the priesthood. And the doctrine of the Ancients regarding the incomplete happiness or misery of souls before the Day of Judgment should not be discarded due to the fear of this illusion. '

 


From Wiki -

 

Catholicism


The Catholic Church holds that "all who die in God's grace and friendship but still imperfectly purified" undergo a process of purification, which the church calls purgatory, "so as to achieve the holiness necessary to enter the joy of heaven". Catholicism bases its teaching also on the practice of praying for the dead, in use within the church ever since the church began, and mentioned in the deuterocanonical book 2 Maccabees 12:46.[31]

 

The Catholic Church gives the name "purgatory" to what it calls the after-death purification of "all who die in God's grace and friendship, but still imperfectly purified.” [32] Though in popular imagination purgatory is pictured as a place rather than a process of purification, the idea of purgatory as a physical place with time is not part of the church's doctrine.[11] Fire, another important element of the purgatory of popular imagination, is also absent in the Catholic Church's doctrine.

 

The purgatory of Catholic doctrine
At the Second Council of Lyon in 1274, the Catholic Church defined, for the first time, its teaching on purgatory, in two points:

some souls are purified after death;
such souls benefit from the prayers and pious duties that the living do for them.

 

Link - https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Purgatory

 


The last bit is what I want to highlight - Souls of your loved ones who may be in Purgatory benefit from Prayer and Pious Duties. That is to say, you can go to the Church and buy special candles and prayer books and maybe make donations to the church to help your loved one ascend to heaven and find favour with God.

So lets analyse this scam a little bit.

 

How do the priests know if YOUR loved one is in Purgatory or has ascended? Can they speak to the dead? We are told let none be found among you who engages in such things so it stands to reason that the church don't talk to dead souls. 

 

So I expect if you go to a priest and say your worried about a deceased, the priest will pass some sort of judgement on that persons life with the information he's told and decide that either Yes that person is in Purgatory and you should buy 3 candles a day and say a particular prayer, maybe volunteer for some church duties and that will surely help the trapped soul.

 

But how do they know?

 

So you see, a poor believers fear for a relative can result in the quick exchange of money to the church to alleviate those fears and it seems to be accepted among the church that the doctrine is fake but its a useful tool for the Priesthood - to make money and gain control over their congregation. I wonder how long they could drag that one out for? Depends on the fears of the believer. Its a spiritual scam that uses psychology to extract power and money.

 

Has anyone read Robert Anton Wilson? He tells a story, his background is Catholic and as a child he suffered Polio, his mother consulted the church and was told God was unhappy with her but if she bought certain candles, made certain prayers and donations then a miracle cure might happen to cure her son. She tried to cure Polio through Faith by paying MONEY to the church!! This is a scam preying on peoples insecurities.

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1 hour ago, pi3141 said:

 

Here - this is where the 'Flat Earth' people have ended up. First it was Flat, then it was Concave, then it was so complicated that normies like me couldn't understand, but now they know its actually 'Super Massive' and they have maps of the entire lands! But even though its 'Super Massive' it may still be Concave. That they are not sure about but they can still map all the lands.

 

See screen grab. (Can't embed video)

 

 

Lands3.jpg

The internet has made many into I formation junkies too. Flitting from one idea to another.

 

These days it's much easier for me to decifer truth from fiction because now I no longer fight against the spiritual aspects of life and started listening and going with gut instinct, a whole new level of understanding opened up. Now I get a big emotional response to a truth revelation, especially when it pertains to those close to me or when its relevant for me to move forward in my own understanding of my purpose etc.

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You can get these candles from Lourdes if anyone has relatives in Purgatory - 24hr shipping.

 

Remember - the power of prayer is proportional to currency. If you just want to make a daily devotion you can buy the cheaper Sacramental candle but if your praying for souls in Purgatory you need to cough up a bit more. Best thing to do is keep buying loads of them, if you don't buy enough, God won't answer your prayers and you won't get a refund. So better to be safe than sorry and buy all you can afford.

 

 

Purgatory.jpg

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Here - the church say it better than me, again from the manuscript, fresh out of the translator, call it coincidence or synchronicity, I literally just translated this piece , it was the next page in the book to start translating today  - 

 

De statu mortuorum & resurgentium tractatus. Of the state of the dead, and of those that are to rise.

 

P54 Chapter 4

 

We have already mentioned that the power of the Resurrection is weakened by this supposed supreme beatitude before the Resurrection. Saint Augustine rightly asks, "What need is there for spirits to receive their bodies in the Resurrection if, even without bodies, they can attain that highest blessedness?" Therefore, among the ancients and especially in the early centuries of the Church, as we will show below, the heretics who denied the resurrection of the body either defended this premature glorification of souls alone or, more precisely, relied on it. However, in recent centuries, who does not see how this article of new faith was introduced into the Roman Church through the counsel of the wise and the politicians, in order to provide a more convenient occasion for invoking the saints and for other similar institutions, as well as for the profitable defense of dogmas? Bellarmine rightly noted that this doctrine is the foundation of all other matters related to the saints, namely, those concerning the veneration of the saints, the canonization of saints, the images of saints, the relics of saints, and, finally, pilgrimages and vows made to them. You see what a heavy chain, laden with gold and silver, this dogma carries with it. And if you add Purgatory to these matters, which is the state of souls that do not go directly to heaven but are elevated sooner or later by the prayers and suffrages of the living and the saints, you have a treasure trove richer than any Indian gold mine. But woe to those who trade in the Word of God.
 

 

I made the assertion that this was the case and then a few hours later I translate a document stating the same thing.

 

It seems my questions are being answered.

 

 

 

From the books introduction page - 

 

We will treat this matter to the best of our abilities in the following work, and we shall discuss, as much as is allowed, the clear and hidden things, the mysteries from the common people. 

 

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4 hours ago, pi3141 said:

Has anyone read Robert Anton Wilson? He tells a story, his background is Catholic and as a child he suffered Polio, his mother consulted the church and was told God was unhappy with her but if she bought certain candles, made certain prayers and donations then a miracle cure might happen to cure her son. She tried to cure Polio through Faith by paying MONEY to the church!! This is a scam preying on peoples insecurities.

 

I'm currently reading The Illuminatus Trilogy which he co-authored. I didn't know anything about him before this, clearly he's travelled a long way from Catholicism to Illuminatus!

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2 hours ago, Campion said:

 

I'm currently reading The Illuminatus Trilogy which he co-authored. I didn't know anything about him before this, clearly he's travelled a long way from Catholicism to Illuminatus!

 

Yes, great book that - try his 'The Cosmic Trigger' series, all great books.

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