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Flat Earth: the last thread about this subject on this forum


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i get you wish to discuss 'thought experiments' but i wish to stick to the 'lack of curve' at the moment.

in a previous thread i was happy to discuss the American Solar Eclipse 2017 and am not adverse to other discussions but right here , right now, at the start of this thread my focus is upon the planet being flat

what the firmament is made of or its shape or the motion of the sun and moon or the size of the sun or the size of the moon is not of interest to myself at the moment. Also i am not interested in discussing the stars and planets at the moment

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What you see here is called Zoom Into The Veil. Normally this would not be noticed when zooming into these huge images of astronomers. I have taken out some frames because it is not possible to post them all. The last frames are directly in the square sector and as it is zoomed in further and further. And here, too, something remarkable is visible. And it should be noticeable even on small monitors. At least I hope so. I see something like this with a 2560x1440 resolution or higher. As I said, it is only meant for reflection... 

 

1665443835_ZoomIntoVeilNebula.mp4_20210809_164034_332.jpg.45f71d7e141d3eea85513f5b1bb9ab3e.jpg

 

1376154270_ZoomIntoVeilNebula.mp4_20210809_164117_653.jpg.9f4ad4a0bf3710ed6a01ccae7e8f35b7.jpg

 

1254215248_ZoomIntoVeilNebula.mp4_20210809_164407_685.jpg.505eaa3a83941d6f991b20527ace657a.jpg

 

582095958_ZoomIntoVeilNebula.mp4_20210809_164641_997.jpg.31c374f16ff54694d797615fca7ba4a3.jpg

 

2014561363_ZoomIntoVeilNebula.mp4_20210809_164845_333.jpg.11881b8ffa85b32888b650db6a85c184.jpg

 

200368818_ZoomIntoVeilNebula.mp4_20210809_170421_011.jpg.5c1dc719b7c7d0ee72dbd5120a0fd025.jpg

 

445744154_ZoomIntoVeilNebula.mp4_20210809_170555_762.jpg.17f54957192fba53bcb4e4923df362b4.jpg

 

1754361517_ZoomIntoVeilNebula.mp4_20210809_170706_435.jpg.d5a0b13003c97582a3a4e936e75a02a0.jpg

 

1492608363_ZoomIntoVeilNebula.mp4_20210809_170724_020.jpg.585a17effb08a2e13b3d236c71a9919f.jpg

Zoom Into Veil Nebula.mp4_20210809_164138.110.jpg

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Here are a few frames of the beautiful universe/firmament/matrix/non-human fabric of reality/creator..Nothing special to see here. NGC 2516-the 500 parsec Long open Star Cluster. Astronomers know that nobody cares, everything is natural.

 

851045862_NGC2516the500-Parsec-LongOpenStarCluster.mp4_20210809_161940_766.jpg.a360023c96130f3f4a891ee60ba05725.jpg

 

1200715735_NGC2516the500-Parsec-LongOpenStarCluster.mp4_20210809_161940.766(2).jpg.31a48d8f1bf02b7f04cefedf2bd78824.jpg

 

1609573185_NGC2516the500-Parsec-LongOpenStarCluster.mp4_20210809_162058.688(2).jpg.b84c559e7f72153a3857217f9b9f8629.jpg

 

 

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7 hours ago, bamboozooka said:

peter wheres your evidence. thought not.

when u lose u get the thread locked

 

 

It's 28 minutes long, but if you just watch from 3 minutes to 5 minutes, it's more than enough. Can anyone who thinks the planet is flat explain this?

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8 hours ago, zArk said:

 

?????

 

Which part do you want addressing? Because almost immediately they give the most obvious solution, the laser skips off the surface. In their example they pointed the laser down significantly enough to make it obvious, but if it just aims at the horizon, it won't be visible where it skips off the water. Dead sample.

 

The other very simple explanation was covered in a video posted a couple of months back where it was demonstrated that a laser will gently curve with air density, just like light. There is no magic properties associated with lasers compared to normal light in terms of it being deviated by a denser medium. The video can be found here -

 

 

In terms of curvature at sea level. By eye, your eye scans only a narrow band and the brain assembles the image.

 

  • With a camera an SLR with angle of 45 degrees you have a distance to horizon at 2m high equal to 3.2 miles.
  • The span of view distance for 45 degrees is 2 times the edge of a 90 degree triangle
  • 3.2 on longest side and angle A 22.5 degrees.
  • That gives short side of 1.33 miles - so a span of 2.66 miles for the image taken.
  • At 8 inches x miles squared - that is 8 x 7 inches - 4ft 8 inches drop across your SLR 45 degree image.

 

So basically you have a visual distance of 2.66 miles with a variance between them of 4ft 8 inches. Tell me why you would be able to detect any curvature on that image?

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2 hours ago, Gav said:

 

Which part do you want addressing? Because almost immediately they give the most obvious solution, the laser skips off the surface. In their example they pointed the laser down significantly enough to make it obvious, but if it just aims at the horizon, it won't be visible where it skips off the water. Dead sample.

 

The other very simple explanation was covered in a video posted a couple of months back where it was demonstrated that a laser will gently curve with air density, just like light. There is no magic properties associated with lasers compared to normal light in terms of it being deviated by a denser medium. The video can be found here -

 

 

In terms of curvature at sea level. By eye, your eye scans only a narrow band and the brain assembles the image.

 

  • With a camera an SLR with angle of 45 degrees you have a distance to horizon at 2m high equal to 3.2 miles.
  • The span of view distance for 45 degrees is 2 times the edge of a 90 degree triangle
  • 3.2 on longest side and angle A 22.5 degrees.
  • That gives short side of 1.33 miles - so a span of 2.66 miles for the image taken.
  • At 8 inches x miles squared - that is 8 x 7 inches - 4ft 8 inches drop across your SLR 45 degree image.

 

So basically you have a visual distance of 2.66 miles with a variance between them of 4ft 8 inches. Tell me why you would be able to detect any curvature on that image?

1st .. you think i am looking for a solution after the obvious conclusion that there is no curve.

2nd .. you didnt watch the entire video  lasermeasurementpoints.jpg.70dfbfbefd7522035c0c3b79c6da5ed3.jpg

those  are levelling points where the laser was identified above the water.

 

3rd that video screenshot is massively deceiving, further it was using sugar and it was refraction through a liquid so not at all relatable to the 'over the water' experiment.

4th .. the videod experiment was documented with all environmental factors included.

 

tbh @Gav if that video of sugar is the reply, it is a baseless 'solution'

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9 minutes ago, zArk said:

1st .. you think i am looking for a solution after the obvious conclusion that there is no curve.

 

The obvious conclusion from what? The solution if you are referring to the video, is that the two listed reasons are how a laser can get across big distances. 

  

9 minutes ago, zArk said:

2nd .. you didnt watch the entire video  

 

I did watch it all. I said this - Which part do you want addressing? 

  

9 minutes ago, zArk said:

lasermeasurementpoints.jpg.70dfbfbefd7522035c0c3b79c6da5ed3.jpg

those  are levelling points where the laser was identified above the water.

 

Yes and of course the way light bends with varying density is exactly how this works. Why do you keep denying refraction?

  

9 minutes ago, zArk said:

 

3rd that video screenshot is massively deceiving, further it was using sugar and it was refraction through a liquid so not at all relatable to the 'over the water' experiment.

 

Ignore the screenshot it is not deceiving though. Sugar alters the density of the water by depth. Refraction through a liquid is not a dismissal for refraction through air. The only difference is the distance at which it curves. I do find it significant that even when presented with video showing how variable density bends a laser, you still stick to your claim that the laser is travelling dead straight.   

 

  

9 minutes ago, zArk said:

4th .. the videod experiment was documented with all environmental factors included.

 

Incorrect. The one environmental factor deliberately and always ignored by flat Earth businessmen is the way light will bend from variable heat and density.

  

9 minutes ago, zArk said:

tbh @Gav if that video of sugar is the reply, it is a baseless 'solution'

 

To be honest? It seems the opposite to dismiss obvious evidence that demonstrates how density affects laser light.

 

Can you tell me your comments on the Minnewanka curvature video just above @Jikwanmade a silly laugh comment at it, but failed to address it. Seems to be a total game over observation.

 

Can any flat earth claimant also address the post above showing the zooming lens picking up a ship obviously over the curve.

 

 

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Question: Flat earth claimants often refer to the 'Flat Earth Model'. Can anyone categorically tell me how far away the Sun is?

  

On 8/3/2021 at 12:47 AM, theo102 said:

The numbers used in the flat earth wiki for sun height and earth diameter mean that that sun can't get any closer to the horizon than about 22 degrees in their model.

 

12500 miles diameter, 5000 miles high -> minimum angle = arctan (5000/12500) = 21.8 degrees.

 

https://www.rapidtables.com/calc/math/Arctan_Calculator.html

 

 Nobody replied to this, yet it is another game over observation. Go to an online 90 degree triangle calculator. Put in distance across the Earth 12,500 miles. When it must be 5000 miles above part of the Earth the absolute lowest elevation the Sun can achieve is as stated - 21.8 degrees.

 

Anyone care to comment on this?

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27 minutes ago, Gav said:

 

What do flat earthers say is the reason why you can't see the bottom of the city? 

its not the bottom of the city, its the bottom up to 1800ft should not be visible based on  the curvature calculation..

 

The tallest building in the city is the 110-story Willis Tower (formerly the Sears Tower), which rises 1,451 feet (442 m) in the Chicago Loop

 

so the tallest building has got to be 400ft further below the curve

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4 hours ago, Gav said:

 

 

 

well thats just reaffirming the visual effect of the mirage above the waters surface

as the camera zooms in the mirage above the water hiding the boat becomes clearer and larger

 

so the zoom is working to reveal the bottom of the boat

if the camerman 'put his foot down' and zoomed like fat larrys band the ship would emerge from the visual deception

 

the lighter coloured 'water' is the dead give away.

the dark greeny blue sea stretches to the horizon point but then magically appears light bluely, transparent

 

similar to the last photo

 

 

 

 

 

nikonzoommirage.jpg

nikonzoom.jpg

10-inferior-mirage.jpg

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2 hours ago, Gav said:

 

Ignore the screenshot it is not deceiving though. Sugar alters the density of the water by depth. Refraction through a liquid is not a dismissal for refraction through air. The only difference is the distance at which it curves. I do find it significant that even when presented with video showing how variable density bends a laser, you still stick to your claim that the laser is travelling dead straight.   

 

  

 

Incorrect. The one environmental factor deliberately and always ignored by flat Earth businessmen is the way light will bend from variable heat and density.

It is entirely deceiviousIMG_20210811_215223.jpg.ac6dd817294f6492461e34316df9daf8.jpg

 

This scene is nothing like the actual experiment. Can you tell me the time this picture was lifted from the video?

 

There was no sugar content of the air recorded at lake Balaton so theres no relevance. 

 

Flat earth businessmen?.jeeze, I cant really get involved in that claim

 

2 hours ago, zArk said:

.

  

The end height of laser was 1.8m whereas the globe model required 4.32m.

 

I conclude from your quoted statement above in this post that the globe heads say

The theoretical calculations are perfect and unquestionable...... 4.32meters

 

But they cant be demonstrated because the variable factors of the earth prevent accurate recording 

 

Do you realised how pathetic it is to defend and promote cognitive dissonance?

 

The experiment showed a massive difference between planet measurable and globe theory.

 

 

 

 

 

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6 minutes ago, zArk said:

Do you realised how pathetic it is to defend and promote cognitive dissonace?


This.
This is another insult.
Why can you not post you comment with that line missing ? Why ?????????
This thread is on very thin ice.....

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11 minutes ago, zArk said:

The end height of laser was 1.8m whereas the globe model required 4.32m.

 

I conclude from your quoted statement above in this post that the globe heads say

The theoretical calculations are perfect and unquestionable...... 4.32meters

I will take your analogy as fact ,however I would say there is a rather large difference in scale and perspective, concerning the size of the earth and this experiment .

This is the very reason I don't watch these things from either side of the argument as I think they certainly muddy the waters

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4 hours ago, bamboozooka said:

its not the bottom of the city, its the bottom up to 1800ft should not be visible based on  the curvature calculation..

 

The tallest building in the city is the 110-story Willis Tower (formerly the Sears Tower), which rises 1,451 feet (442 m) in the Chicago Loop

 

so the tallest building has got to be 400ft further below the curve

 

You seriously misunderstood my question. You cannot see the bottom half of the buildings. The parts at the topyou can see are visible due to light refraction, it varies according to heat and local pressure. One thing though, you never see the bottom of the buildings.

 

Now I ask again where is it?

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3 hours ago, bamboozooka said:

space universe > here comes the sun is the thread

 

video

 

 

Perspective. I notice you completely ignored my post about how far the Sun is, so how close do those rays put it? 

 

Explain this. How does the Sun above the eyeline, dip below the horizon? Same size same speed wherever it is on the planet.

 

AntiCrepRays_Goff_960.jpg?itok=J5WlPU7F

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3 hours ago, zArk said:

It is entirely deceiviousIMG_20210811_215223.jpg.ac6dd817294f6492461e34316df9daf8.jpg

 

This scene is nothing like the actual experiment. Can you tell me the time this picture was lifted from the video?

 

There was no sugar content of the air recorded at lake Balaton so theres no relevance. 

 

Flat earth businessmen?.jeeze, I cant really get involved in that claim

 

  

The end height of laser was 1.8m whereas the globe model required 4.32m.

 

I conclude from your quoted statement above in this post that the globe heads say

The theoretical calculations are perfect and unquestionable...... 4.32meters

 

But they cant be demonstrated because the variable factors of the earth prevent accurate recording 

 

Do you realised how pathetic it is to defend and promote cognitive dissonance?

 

The experiment showed a massive difference between planet measurable and globe theory.

 

 

Do you deliberately reply in short sentences to stop responses?  It's a link bait picture. 

 

There was variance in pressure, but of course the Flat Earth businessmen didn't report this. The height of the laser is not even relevant. It can either arrive at its destination by skipping off the surface or hugging it from pressure variances. It is so simple, but sadly not you or any flat earther will ever acknowledge it. 

 

What is a "globe head"? Sounds like an insult.

 

Now tell me how far away is the Sun?

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4 hours ago, zArk said:

well thats just reaffirming the visual effect of the mirage above the waters surface

 

 

No, it's reaffirming that 90% of the boat is over the horizon. Gone, not visible, occluded. There's no mirage in play. The bottom of the visible boat is aligned with the water, the top of the far boat has no distortion.  

 

4 hours ago, zArk said:

as the camera zooms in the mirage above the water hiding the boat becomes clearer and larger

 

Are you blind? Of course it doesn't. It's beyond the horizon, it's not visible. The camera has zoomed in and we see the boat is gone.

 

4 hours ago, zArk said:

if the camerman 'put his foot down' and zoomed like fat larrys band the ship would emerge from the visual deception

 

He did zoom. The boat is beyond the horizon. If you are playing some sort of game here, it isn't funny.  

 

4 hours ago, zArk said:

the lighter coloured 'water' is the dead give away.

 

 

 This is absurd. The water is the same colour, consistency and level. The far boat is not suffering some magical flat earth mirage, it has sailed over the horizon.

4 hours ago, zArk said:

the dark greeny blue sea stretches to the horizon point but then magically appears light bluely, transparent

 

The dark greeny sea stretches to the horizon and then suddenly....................................it's the bloody horizon and the ship beyond it is not visible.

 

4 hours ago, zArk said:

similar to the last photo

10-inferior-mirage.jpg

 

That isn't even water. That is the foreground and heat is causing inverted reflections

 to appear. In terms of mirages at sea, this sometimes distorts the object, raises it in mid air or blurs it. What it doesn;t do is make the damn thing disappear.

 

You're busted. The boat is over the horizon.

 

 

Question: Flat earth claimants often refer to the 'Flat Earth Model'. Can anyone categorically tell me how far away the Sun is?

 

Can you tell me your comments on the Minnewanka curvature video previous page @Jikwanmade a silly laugh comment at it, but failed to address it. Seems to be a total game over observation.  

 

 Nobody replied to this, yet it is another game over observation. Go to an online 90 degree triangle calculator. Put in distance across the Earth 12,500 miles. When it must be 5000 miles above part of the Earth the absolute lowest elevation the Sun can achieve is as stated - 21.8 degrees.

 

Anyone care to comment on this?

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7 hours ago, peter said:

I will take your analogy as fact ,

its not an analogy ... it is fact that the experiment recorded those figures (1.79m actual vs globe predicted 4.32m)

 

the laser from one side of a lake was tracked by use of a boat with an attached vertical white screen. at points from shore to the other side of the lake, the white screen passed the laser and the point recorded and the height of the laser recorded. the path of the laser was recorded until the opposite shore.

 

the globe theory predicted a 4.32m height finishing point.

the predicted FE height was 1.84m

the actual finishing height was 1.79m

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by zArk
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4 hours ago, Gav said:

 

 

Do you deliberately reply in short sentences to stop responses?  It's a link bait picture. 

 

There was variance in pressure, but of course the Flat Earth businessmen didn't report this. The height of the laser is not even relevant. It can either arrive at its destination by skipping off the surface or hugging it from pressure variances. It is so simple, but sadly not you or any flat earther will ever acknowledge it. 

 

What is a "globe head"? Sounds like an insult.

 

Now tell me how far away is the Sun?

Iit didnt skip off the surface as the laser was recorded at multiple points across the lake.

 

you didnt watch the video.

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4 hours ago, Gav said:

No, it's reaffirming that 90% of the boat is over the horizon. Gone, not visible, occluded. There's no mirage in play. The bottom of the visible boat is aligned with the water, the top of the far boat has no distortion.  

i have screen shot the video showing you the mirage

its right there.

 

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