Daithi Posted July 14, 2021 Share Posted July 14, 2021 https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/57810729 I think the IR35 change in April 2021 is a massively important and very under reported cause. Both existing drivers operating as limited company contractors and anybody thinking of starting life as a contractor will now be thinking bollocks to that and jacking it in when they get the double digit tax burden increase? Also, what of the obscene growth of Amazon Prime for retail? All those massive new warehouses and vans need HGVs to fill them up. Sure, Brexit and Covid might have had an impact too but let's make sure we're keeping an eye on all the issues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grumpy Owl Posted July 14, 2021 Share Posted July 14, 2021 Quote looming crisis in the supply chain Problem - reaction - solution "We need more immigration! Otherwise who will drive our trucks for us?" Also, I read elsewhere that the government has announced that no more diesel vans or trucks will be available to purchase in the UK from 2035. I had an interesting conversation with a delivery driver the other day, who was delivering some pallets to our neighbour at work. He was asking me about the recently implemented 'Clean Air Zone' (CAZ) in Birmingham - we're located outside of it so it doesn't really affect us - and the subject turned to vehicle emission standards. While we do now have fully-electric buses in service here, he pointed out that as far as he was aware, he didn't know of any fully electric trucks available on the market, that could handle towing loads of 18t (or more) in an efficient manner and over long distances. I merely pointed out that things were fine for now, as long as trucks and vans had Euro6 compliant engines, then there was no penalty. But this got me thinking more, these CAZ schemes are really designed to target average motorists. But what of the long-term, if even Euro6 diesel engines are going to end up 'banned'? Getting back to subject, I do note that even over the last few years, I have seen adverts around encouraging people to 'change their life' and get a HGV licence. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daithi Posted July 14, 2021 Author Share Posted July 14, 2021 2 hours ago, Grumpy Owl said: We need more immigration! Otherwise who will drive our trucks for us?" Just like in my old game, computer programming. We need more immigration! Otherwise who will code the Fourth Great Industrial Revolution reset under slave conditions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
elongated1 Posted July 14, 2021 Share Posted July 14, 2021 (edited) Oh no. Not IR35 again.... I'm sure this is all inline with killing ALL small businesses.... They came for the Buy-to-Let landlords... market killed. Made difficult of small businesses to survive during the Covid lockdown.. Now, the track drivers.... Surely, this will lead to the next step....FOOD shortage.... So predictable. Edited July 14, 2021 by elongated1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
no kidding Posted July 14, 2021 Share Posted July 14, 2021 I mentioned on another forum that many of the lorry drivers (and their trucks) have not returned from Eastern Europe. A mate who is a lorry driver is working all the (legal) hours God sends. For some reason the MSM seems to be ignoring this... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incontinentia_Buttux Posted July 14, 2021 Share Posted July 14, 2021 There's a "shortage" of drivers because British drivers want to be paid more than their Eastern European counterparts (who have stopped working in Britain because of Brexit), and companies are reluctant to pay the higher wages. As a consumer do you want to pay higher prices so companies can pay for British drivers? I guess not! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mikhail Liebestein Posted July 15, 2021 Share Posted July 15, 2021 7 hours ago, Incontinentia_Buttux said: There's a "shortage" of drivers because British drivers want to be paid more than their Eastern European counterparts (who have stopped working in Britain because of Brexit), and companies are reluctant to pay the higher wages. As a consumer do you want to pay higher prices so companies can pay for British drivers? I guess not! Brexit was always about control, the UK Cabal wanted to take control of the UK populace. They knew other European nations were more relaxed about control, and didn't want the people of the UK getting ideas. This, along with the 'disease', is straight out of V for Vendetta. Is Boris High Chancellor Sutler? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnigmaticWorld Posted July 15, 2021 Share Posted July 15, 2021 No, he isn't like Sutler, he doesn't have the right background and isn't anything like a national socialist which that character was based on. V For Vendetta has people believing that we're actually ruled over by far-right Christian extremists, but any sane person can look at the UK and see that that isn't the case. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incontinentia_Buttux Posted July 15, 2021 Share Posted July 15, 2021 2 hours ago, EnigmaticWorld said: No, he isn't like Sutler, he doesn't have the right background and isn't anything like a national socialist which that character was based on. V For Vendetta has people believing that we're actually ruled over by far-right Christian extremists, but any sane person can look at the UK and see that that isn't the case. Neither is it run by far left socialists either, which is a conspiracy theory that seems to be gaining traction lately! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EnigmaticWorld Posted July 15, 2021 Share Posted July 15, 2021 Just now, Incontinentia_Buttux said: Neither is it run by far left socialists either, which is a conspiracy theory that seems to be gaining traction lately! I think it's run by a mix of socialists and capitalists personally. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incontinentia_Buttux Posted July 15, 2021 Share Posted July 15, 2021 Just now, EnigmaticWorld said: I think it's run by a mix of socialists and capitalists personally. It is exactly that 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Itsjaybigjay Posted July 15, 2021 Share Posted July 15, 2021 10 hours ago, EnigmaticWorld said: I think it's run by a mix of socialists and capitalists personally. Yes and they are just there to be the front men to keep the masses squabbling while the technocrats behind them make the decisions Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
no kidding Posted July 16, 2021 Share Posted July 16, 2021 i thought this thread was about the shortage of HGV drivers - not yet another rant about politics. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grumpy Owl Posted July 16, 2021 Share Posted July 16, 2021 5 hours ago, no kidding said: i thought this thread was about the shortage of HGV drivers - not yet another rant about politics. Because this shortage of HGV drivers is all as a result of 'politics'. Take a step back and look at the 'bigger picture', its not hard to see what's really happening. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Macnamara Posted July 16, 2021 Share Posted July 16, 2021 On 7/15/2021 at 12:30 AM, Incontinentia_Buttux said: There's a "shortage" of drivers because British drivers want to be paid more than their Eastern European counterparts (who have stopped working in Britain because of Brexit), and companies are reluctant to pay the higher wages. As a consumer do you want to pay higher prices so companies can pay for British drivers? I guess not! Well if you don't pay british workers then they will have to go on benefits and to pay for that the state will have to tax you more so not paying british workers is a false economy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daithi Posted July 17, 2021 Author Share Posted July 17, 2021 On 7/15/2021 at 12:30 AM, Incontinentia_Buttux said: As a consumer do you want to pay higher prices so companies can pay for British drivers? I guess not! Sounds like a logical fallacy to me! Linking higher prices for consumers directly to the workers demanding better pay is too simplistic IMHO. Criminality is rampant in our supply chains but it has all been skillfully presented as the wonders of the 21st century finance. What if we broke apart the retail price of anything on a supermarket shelf to understand where the money goes? We would see the bulk of the cost being swallowed up by massive payments to financiers, bankers, by the highly leveraged corporations in the supply chain. Debt ain't cheap from loan sharks. But in corporate land it's not simply called a loan. It has a snappy title like Mezzanine finance, high yield corporate bond, collateralised debt obligation and comes with many pages of impenetrable gobble-dee-gook describing who gets paid what, and when, and how much the debt actually costs. It's so deviously complicated that mere mortals and most of the finance industry are completely flummoxed and don't see the blatant theft. instead the rapidly increasing rents and leases and debt used to pay for warehouses, supermarket buildings, lorries, staff wages, shareholder profits and so on are not very well hidden but folk cannot quite put their finger on the exact crime so they keep quiet. The great reset is already here. Looking at the wealth pie, the vast majority of us don't enjoy a slice. Our wealth today is an illusion. We can't even invest in anything other than indebted corporations and grossly inflated assets such as housing. This includes a good number of our billionaires. Their virtual wealth is powder puff numbers on a computer system. They own nothing that is real. What would our wallets look like if we removed all of the criminality from our monetary and capital systems? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Incontinentia_Buttux Posted July 17, 2021 Share Posted July 17, 2021 15 hours ago, Daithi said: Sounds like a logical fallacy to me! Linking higher prices for consumers directly to the workers demanding better pay is too simplistic IMHO. Criminality is rampant in our supply chains but it has all been skillfully presented as the wonders of the 21st century finance. What if we broke apart the retail price of anything on a supermarket shelf to understand where the money goes? We would see the bulk of the cost being swallowed up by massive payments to financiers, bankers, by the highly leveraged corporations in the supply chain. Debt ain't cheap from loan sharks. But in corporate land it's not simply called a loan. It has a snappy title like Mezzanine finance, high yield corporate bond, collateralised debt obligation and comes with many pages of impenetrable gobble-dee-gook describing who gets paid what, and when, and how much the debt actually costs. It's so deviously complicated that mere mortals and most of the finance industry are completely flummoxed and don't see the blatant theft. instead the rapidly increasing rents and leases and debt used to pay for warehouses, supermarket buildings, lorries, staff wages, shareholder profits and so on are not very well hidden but folk cannot quite put their finger on the exact crime so they keep quiet. The great reset is already here. Looking at the wealth pie, the vast majority of us don't enjoy a slice. Our wealth today is an illusion. We can't even invest in anything other than indebted corporations and grossly inflated assets such as housing. This includes a good number of our billionaires. Their virtual wealth is powder puff numbers on a computer system. They own nothing that is real. What would our wallets look like if we removed all of the criminality from our monetary and capital systems? Who is behind this "Great Reset" that you speak of? As far as I can tell it was something that was discussed by a few business leaders (and Prince Charles of all people) at one of their shindigs in the Swiss Alps, throwing lots of ideas around.... But you really think they have the power and are organised enough to carry out something on such a massive scale? And surely the whole thing is contradictory to most rich (and powerful) people's interests? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grumpy Owl Posted July 18, 2021 Share Posted July 18, 2021 13 hours ago, Incontinentia_Buttux said: Who is behind this "Great Reset" that you speak of? As far as I can tell it was something that was discussed by a few business leaders (and Prince Charles of all people) at one of their shindigs in the Swiss Alps, throwing lots of ideas around.... But you really think they have the power and are organised enough to carry out something on such a massive scale? And surely the whole thing is contradictory to most rich (and powerful) people's interests? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
no kidding Posted July 19, 2021 Share Posted July 19, 2021 On 7/16/2021 at 7:10 PM, Grumpy Owl said: Because this shortage of HGV drivers is all as a result of 'politics'. Take a step back and look at the 'bigger picture', its not hard to see what's really happening. I understand that, but whenever politics comes up, people take sides and the theme of the thread is lost, which is exactly what has happened here. It's not all about politics, anyway. It's about people changing jobs. A number of lorry drivers have told me that they've left the job because they're sick of being stuck in traffic jams and missing their delivery slots and all the hassle that goes with it. If you want to put that down to politics too, then that's your choice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Daithi Posted July 27, 2021 Author Share Posted July 27, 2021 £1000 bonus for HGV drivers https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-57983698 A significant part of this HGV driver fiasco is absolutely down to the disgrace that is IR35, blame landing squarely on Rishi Sunak and gang for persevering with this draconian tax hike for contractors across all industries. See this from 13th March 2020 https://www.itcontractor.com/brexit-ir35-mess-as-contract-hauliers-dumped-by-road-haulage-firms/ Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Chinnery Posted July 30, 2021 Share Posted July 30, 2021 Whatever happened to the coke heads driverless truck plan by 2020? https://www.businessinsider.com/george-osborne-driverless-trucks-lorries-road-trains-2016-3?op=1 Maybe convid delayed it a bit.. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kumarihta Posted February 7 Share Posted February 7 The IR35 change definitely impacted the industry and added an extra burden on drivers, making it harder to attract new talent. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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