The Bible not just a book

[Truthspoon]

4 minutes ago, MarpatV2 said:

I see you keep editing your earlier posts to bring them into line with your later posts.

 

Lol...that's all you've got. Idiot.

[Truthspoon]

https://www.truthspoon.com/p/hidden-rituals-of-old-gods.html

 

Human sacrifice was carried out extensively in the ancient world, for example, upon the death of high ranking Egyptian dignitaries, those who served them on life were ritually murdered that they might continue to serve them in death. Carthage, the ancient rival to Rome's power in modern day Tunisia, was widely criticised in the ancient world for the existence of Tophets (roasting places) were children were sacrificed to Baal. It is reported by Diodorus Siculus that: "There was in their city a bronze image of Cronus (Saturn) extending its hands, palms up and sloping toward the ground, so that each of the children when placed thereon rolled down and fell into a sort of gaping pit filled with fire."

 

“They have built the high places of Tophet, which is in the valley of the son of Hinnom, to burn their sons and their daughters in the fire; which I did not command them, nor did it come into My heart. - Jer 7:31”

 

Matthew Henry, born in 1662, was a presbytarian minster and was famous for his Bible commentaries, as he comments on Jeremiah chapter 7 verse 31 which highlights the abominable acts of the pagan Canaanites in their service to Baal:

They have particularly built the high places of Tophet, where the image of Moloch was set up, in the valley of the son of Hinnom, adjoining to Jerusalem; and there they burnt their sons and their daughters in the fire, burnt them alive, killed them, and killed them in the most cruel manner imaginable, to honour or appease those idols that were devils and not gods. This was surely the greatest instance that ever was of the power of Satan in the children of disobedience, and of the degeneracy and corruption of the human nature. One would willingly hope that there were not many instances of such a barbarous idolatry; but it is amazing that there should be any, that men could be so perfectly void of natural affection as to do a thing so inhuman as to burn little innocent children, and their own too, that they should be so perfectly void of natural religion as to think it lawful to do this, nay, to think it acceptable. Surely it was in a way of righteous judgment, because they had changed the glory of God into the similitude of a beast, that God gave them up to such vile affections that changed them into worse than beasts. God says of this that it was what he commanded them not, neither cam it into his heart, which is not meant of his not commanding them thus to worship Moloch (this he had expressly forbidden them), but he had never commanded that his worshippers should be at such an expense, nor put such a force upon their natural affection, in honouring him; it never came into his heart to have children offered to him, yet they had forsaken his service for the service of such gods as, by commanding this, showed themselves to be indeed enemies to mankind." - Matthew Henry

Child sacrifice was also practiced in Arabia before the arrival of Mohamed and Islam, as is made clear from of the Qu'ran surah 6 verse 137:

"Thus were the idol worshipers duped by their idols, to the extent of killing their own children. In fact, their idols inflict great pain upon them, and confuse their religion for them. Had GOD willed, they would not have done it. You shall disregard them and their fabrications."

Edited January 21, 2021 by Truthspoon

[MarpatV2]

Just now, Truthspoon said:

 

Lol...that's all you've got. Idiot.

Pretty intolerant of you. Lets face it, the idea of child sacrifices to moloch is a bible story that the rabbis themselves say is an initiation and not a sacrifice. You want to believe the worst possible example because it suits your belief.

[Truthspoon]

Reposting.

 

Ok I'm done with you now.

 

I've proved you wrong time and time again.

 

https://www.truthspoon.com/p/hidden-rituals-of-old-gods.html

 

The following extract from Walter Burkert and John Raffan's excellent book Greek Religion: archaic and classical, depicts the institutionalisation of the myth pederasty Gods such as Poseidon and Zeus, into civil life:

 

"Fully fledged initiation rituals are known from Dorian Crete and from Sparta. For Crete, the principal source is a fourth century report by Ephorus, who already attests the decline of the custom. Men are organised in clubs which meet regularly for communal meals (syssitia) in the men's hall (andreion) at public expense. Boys who have outgrown childhood are first summoned to the men's hall in order to perform menial services; clad in simple robes they sit on the floor. What appeared as a scandal to the other Greeks was the institutionalized homosexuality: a man from the men's hall would carry off a beautiful boy, as Zeus carried off Ganymede. For the chosen lad this actually meant a distinction. The man made known his intention in advance, and the boy's relatives arranged for a mock pursuit that ended at the men's hall. Presents were then distributed, and the man with his boy, accompanied for some distance by his now gift-leden pursuers, retired in some place in the countryside for two months. The days were spent in hunting and feasting. Finally the lover had to present the boy with a warrior's robe, an ox, and a wine cup; thus he was dismissed, being now famous, kleinos."

[MarpatV2]

Just now, Truthspoon said:

Reposting.

 

Ok I'm done with you now.

 

I've proved you wrong time and time again.

 

https://www.truthspoon.com/p/hidden-rituals-of-old-gods.html

 

The following extract from Walter Burkert and John Raffan's excellent book Greek Religion: archaic and classical, depicts the institutionalisation of the myth pederasty Gods such as Poseidon and Zeus, into civil life:

 

"Fully fledged initiation rituals are known from Dorian Crete and from Sparta. For Crete, the principal source is a fourth century report by Ephorus, who already attests the decline of the custom. Men are organised in clubs which meet regularly for communal meals (syssitia) in the men's hall (andreion) at public expense. Boys who have outgrown childhood are first summoned to the men's hall in order to perform menial services; clad in simple robes they sit on the floor. What appeared as a scandal to the other Greeks was the institutionalized homosexuality: a man from the men's hall would carry off a beautiful boy, as Zeus carried off Ganymede. For the chosen lad this actually meant a distinction. The man made known his intention in advance, and the boy's relatives arranged for a mock pursuit that ended at the men's hall. Presents were then distributed, and the man with his boy, accompanied for some distance by his now gift-leden pursuers, retired in some place in the countryside for two months. The days were spent in hunting and feasting. Finally the lover had to present the boy with a warrior's robe, an ox, and a wine cup; thus he was dismissed, being now famous, kleinos."

But you haven't. Im posting info that the rabbis themselves say passing through the fire is not child sacrifices. You come up with the standard belief of a minister.

 

Reposting doesnt mean you're right.

 

So some Greeks had some weird rituals. What are you getting at?

[EnigmaticWorld]

40 minutes ago, MarpatV2 said:

All of them? Im quite sure its variable.

 

I should hope not, I don't see why they should all capitulate.

 

40 minutes ago, MarpatV2 said:

I find them irritating for many reasons.

 

Clearly.

 

41 minutes ago, MarpatV2 said:

The fact is, those rules were meant to keep the birth rate up in a desert tribe, whose survival depended on having lots of kids.

 

Be nice to value having children in Europe again, but apparently it's the hell thing that only matters.

[Truthspoon]

As we shall soon see, when you divert from sound moral laws which the religions have taught us, and engage in mass exhibitions of ritualised obscenity such as homosexuality or transgenderism, and not only make this normal but give these people dominant status, then hell won't be something for the next world, it will be the reality for this one.

 

Morality is nothing more mysterious than simple cause and effect.

 

 

 

 

Edited January 21, 2021 by Truthspoon

[EnigmaticWorld]

Just now, Truthspoon said:

As we shall soon see, when you divert from sound moral laws which the religions have taught us, and engage in mass exhibitions of ritualised obscenity such as homosexuality or transgenderism, and not only make this normal but give these people dominant status, then hell won't be something for the next world, it will be the reality for this one.

 

Morality is nothing more mysterious than simple cause and effect.

 

 

 

 

 

No likes, but this.

[Nemuri Kyoshiro]

9 hours ago, Truthspoon said:

 

For instance, it appears that the Gospel of Luke was originally written for an audience of one, so there is no question of this being some fabrication of malicious ends, it is just what it says it is and clearly identified a real living relationship between Luke and his reader.

Theophilus. Who was he? Why was Luke writing not only an account of the life of Jesus, but, in Acts, the life and deeds of Peter and Paul, but mostly the latter? My own theory is that Theophilus was either a judge or a lawyer; Paul's judge or lawyer. Luke's Gospel goes into great detail about how Jesus was seen by the Romans. Likewise Acts, which makes it abundantly clear that Paul had committed no crime against Roman law and that is was the malice of the Jews from the province of Asia, that stirred up the crowd against him in Jerusalem. Neither Felix, Festus, nor Agrippa found Paul innocient of any crime worthy of death and had Paul not appealed to Caesar, he would have been freed.

 

Luke's Gospel and Acts contains the facts and details any lawyer would want to know. I believe they were written before Paul's first trial when he was under house arrest in Rome and the facts gathered by Luke during Paul's two-years of captivity in Caesarea. As I say, it's a theory but it fits the facts.

[Truthspoon]

15 minutes ago, Nemuri Kyoshiro said:

Theophilus. Who was he? Why was Luke writing not only an account of the life of Jesus, but, in Acts, the life and deeds of Peter and Paul, but mostly the latter? My own theory is that Theophilus was either a judge or a lawyer; Paul's judge or lawyer. Luke's Gospel goes into great detail about how Jesus was seen by the Romans. Likewise Acts, which makes it abundantly clear that Paul had committed no crime against Roman law and that is was the malice of the Jews from the province of Asia, that stirred up the crowd against him in Jerusalem. Neither Felix, Festus, nor Agrippa found Paul innocient of any crime worthy of death and had Paul not appealed to Caesar, he would have been freed.

 

Luke's Gospel and Acts contains the facts and details any lawyer would want to know. I believe they were written before Paul's first trial when he was under house arrest in Rome and the facts gathered by Luke during Paul's two-years of captivity in Caesarea. As I say, it's a theory but it fits the facts.

 

Wow, that's an excellent theory.....

[MarpatV2]

51 minutes ago, Truthspoon said:

As we shall soon see, when you divert from sound moral laws which the religions have taught us, and engage in mass exhibitions of ritualised obscenity such as homosexuality or transgenderism, and not only make this normal but give these people dominant status, then hell won't be something for the next world, it will be the reality for this one.

 

Morality is nothing more mysterious than simple cause and effect.

 

 

 

 

Sound for you maybe but repressive for people who are homosexual. I take it you feel that they are an abomination and should change then? you refer to them as being obscene. You use your religion to justify your dislike of them. You see hell as a place of homosexuals? maybe its just something raging to get out of you?

[Truthspoon]

5 minutes ago, MarpatV2 said:

Sound for you maybe but repressive for people who are homosexual. I take it you feel that they are an abomination and should change then? you refer to them as being obscene. You use your religion to justify your dislike of them. You see hell as a place of homosexuals? maybe its just something raging to get out of you?

 

No, wrong again. As usual. Actually I'm getting bored of you being so stupid.

 

Can't be bothered any more. It's one thing dealing with an idiot, but a malicious idiot is just too much.

 

Go look for someone else to persecute you creep.

 

 

 

[EnigmaticWorld]

5 minutes ago, MarpatV2 said:

Sound for you maybe but repressive for people who are homosexual.

 

Depends. I think churches should be free to practice how they wish as long as they're not harming anyone. I can understand the argument about Christians imposing views on people, but people shouldn't impose their views on churches either, so it goes both ways I guess.

 

5 minutes ago, MarpatV2 said:

Sound for you maybe but repressive for people who are homosexual. I take it you feel that they are an abomination and should change then? you refer to them as being obscene. You use your religion to justify your dislike of them. You see hell as a place of homosexuals? maybe its just something raging to get out of you?

 

What about if you hate the sin, but not the sinner? I guess you could argue that you don't see certain things as a sin, but then changing the church to suit your beliefs shouldn't worry you anyway.

[MarpatV2]

6 minutes ago, EnigmaticWorld said:

 

Depends. I think churches should be free to practice how they wish as long as they're not harming anyone. I can understand the argument about Christians imposing views on people, but people shouldn't impose their views on churches either, so it goes both ways I guess.

 

 

What about if you hate the sin, but not the sinner? I guess you could argue that you don't see certain things as a sin, but then changing the church to suit your beliefs shouldn't worry you anyway.

So you see homosexuality as a sin?

[EnigmaticWorld]

4 minutes ago, MarpatV2 said:

So you see homosexuality as a sin?

 

Tough one, especially for me as I have a bi relative and I still love her like everyone else, so it's something that I have definitely thought about a lot. I guess that I don't feel like it's productive, I mean in the "be fruitful and multiply" sense. Besides that, I will just leave God to judge. I don't like some of the stuff people are pushing to kids, but I don't care what grown adults choose to do or identify as.

Edited January 21, 2021 by EnigmaticWorld

[MarpatV2]

Just now, EnigmaticWorld said:

 

Tough one, especially for me as I have a bi relative and I still love her like everyone else, so it's something that I have definitely thought about a lot. I guess that I don't feel like it's productive, I mean in the "be fruitful and multiply" sense. Besides that, I will just leave God to judge. I don't like some of the stuff people are pushing to kids, but I don't care what grown adults choose to do or identify as.

Like I said before, I'm sure the whole point of this 'law' was the upkeep of the tribal population to ensure survival, rather than being a divine command. If somebody said Rabbi Bob has just decided this is how they had to live they might tell him to get stuffed. Another thing is the diet laws. I think the whole point was to avoid getting ill from certain types of food rather than it being unclean. There have even been speculations that the relationship between David and Jonathan was a bit too close.

[Nemuri Kyoshiro]

40 minutes ago, Truthspoon said:

 

Wow, that's an excellent theory.....

It has it's detractors, like any theory. Some insist Paul had only one trial in Rome and was condemned and beheaded. However, if you read Philippians, it's clear that Paul was quite ebullient about his trial and went so far as to ask Philemon, to whom he wrote from Rome, to prepare a guest room for him.

 

We know Paul was in Crete with Titus planting churches. He left Titus there then wrote asking him to join Paul in Nicopolis for the winter. Luke does not speak of any missionary journey to Crete in Acts so it is reasonable to suggest the visit was undertaken after his acquittal. Legend has it that Paul went to Spain and perhaps the British Isles, though there is no firm evidence he went to either, but he did express a desire to go to Spain.

 

Paul's second arrest - as the result of some wrongdoing by Alexander the coppersmith - led to his second trial and condemnation and it is clear that his second epistle to Timothy was written from the condemned cell in the Mamertine Prison in Rome, and the reader is left in no doubt as to what fate will befall him there. Luke was the only one with him at the last but writes no account of Paul's end. 

 

 

 

Edited January 21, 2021 by Nemuri Kyoshiro

[Michi713]

Unfortunately, nothing in the Bible will resonate with the “intellectual,” the proud, or the comfortable nihilist.  

 

In this age it often takes going “to hell and back” for the words of the Bible to make sense.  This is why we hear transformation stories of addicts and prostitutes, thieves and liars.  We have have been on the other extreme and it is not the place to be.  We are allowing Jesus, through prayer and his word, to repair what we have damaged and are trying to become worthy of him.  However lofty the goal, that’s the idea.  It certainly doesn’t deserve as much vitriol as is being hurled at it.  

 

So many have died just to get the Bible into our hands, just so we can have a chance.    This is meaningless to the numb, but it means everything to those who can see the gifts it contains.  

 

So much is revealed while on this path about ourselves and about what lies within the Bible.  Prophecies, parables, and history are intellectually stimulating but the real treasure is spiritual development.  

 

It is really exciting to have found this treasure, and I wish there were more people to share it with.  

[Reptile hunter]

On 1/29/2021 at 9:14 PM, Michi713 said:

Unfortunately, nothing in the Bible will resonate with the “intellectual,” the proud, or the comfortable nihilist.  

 

In this age it often takes going “to hell and back” for the words of the Bible to make sense.  This is why we hear transformation stories of addicts and prostitutes, thieves and liars.  We have have been on the other extreme and it is not the place to be.  We are allowing Jesus, through prayer and his word, to repair what we have damaged and are trying to become worthy of him.  However lofty the goal, that’s the idea.  It certainly doesn’t deserve as much vitriol as is being hurled at it.  

 

So many have died just to get the Bible into our hands, just so we can have a chance.    This is meaningless to the numb, but it means everything to those who can see the gifts it contains.  

 

So much is revealed while on this path about ourselves and about what lies within the Bible.  Prophecies, parables, and history are intellectually stimulating but the real treasure is spiritual development.  

 

It is really exciting to have found this treasure, and I wish there were more people to share it with.  

You mean like those intellectuals that study where the bible originates from? 

[Michi713]

8 hours ago, Reptile hunter said:

You mean like those intellectuals that study where the bible originates from? 

Nope.  Not those ones.