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Has the virus been isolated and does it exist?


MaryCochrane
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On 2/5/2021 at 3:51 PM, mike hunt said:

Has any virus ever been isolated? Flu, Chicken pox, herpes?

Or in animals - rabies, foot and mouth.

 

Have any of these ever been isolated according to Koch's postulates?

 

Yes, they have. Rumour has it that Dr. Coffin (who was a virologist at UCL) isolated herpes simplex type 1 from a colleague who had a cold sore, engineered it, and later (after many years of clinical trials) this became an approved therapy for cancer.

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Speaking as a complete idiot on such matters, I feel my contribution to this thread is important because most of humanity appear to have turned into idiots. Could I point out that when we had the very impressive TV press conferences with the sinister Dr June Raine and cronies giving us the jargon on the needles being available and that it was a giant step for mankind (that woman scared me to death), wouldn't we have had a similar extravaganza on isolation?

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AUG 4 email sez:     

(FROM:    Matt Belair and Beth Martens, Canada 

Choose Freedom Law Summit

>>>>>Patrick King last night who has won an important case on the basis that the CV virus has never been isolated. This is the very crux of the plandemic house of cards that is on shaky ground, now more than ever.

He's agreed to be interviewed on the King Hero's Journey to share his victory stories!!!

Join me at 3:30 PM CDT today to interview Patrick and hear his first hand account of how he was able to bring this beast potentially to its knees and how he may have been instrumental in getting restrictions lifted in Alberta and maybe across Canada.<<<<<<

Here's a link to join the live interview

https://kingheros.bethmartens.com/blog/58037-patrick-king-first-hand-court-victory-ending-restrictions-alberta

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18 hours ago, The Andernovian said:

 

I'd be carful about that. From this paper: ''Additional evidence to confirm the etiologic significance of 2019-nCoV in the Wuhan outbreak include identification of a 2019-nCoV antigen in the lung tissue of patients by immunohistochemical analysis, detection of IgM and IgG antiviral antibodies in the serum samples from a patient at two time points to demonstrate seroconversion, and animal (monkey) experiments to provide evidence of pathogenicity.'' https://www.nejm.org/doi/10.1056/NEJMoa2001017

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and the system shrugs saying "so what!"

 

this type of 'Victory' was announced years ago with the scum called Mark Ceylon , Michael O'Bernicia, Guy Taylor, Jon Witterick when Tom Crawford was used as a showcase for 'freeman on the land' nonsense

 

seriously. He is not using common law. He is not fighting the system.

He is the defendant.

He agreed to being subject to their court.

His subpoena was nonsense

He'll end up with a WHOPPING BILL from his shenanigans

 

🤦‍♂️

these type of people are trying to agitate people into needlessly breaking the law, contesting the charges, using his method of questioning the basis of covid and being the defendant for the end goal of trying to swamp the court system in the hope of it grinding to a halt

 

these agitators are communists who have no respect for the law

they mix common law with statutory law , confuse the law and legal process, confuse the position of complainant, defendant and claimant

 

be aware

 

Incredible law resources

1215.org -- bill thornton for common law introduction and application against the legal system (in depth)

karl lentz (audio videos)  https://duckduckgo.com/?q=karl+lentz+common+law&t=ffab&iar=videos&iax=videos&ia=videos

Edited by zArk
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I am going to reserve judgement about whether the virus is a fabricated hoax, as opposed to just an exaggerated hoax of an actual virus.

 

It seems to me this debate goes to the heart of virology and its validity.  In that regard, this article by Thomas Rivers may be of interest:

 

https://journals.asm.org/doi/pdf/10.1128/jb.33.1.1-12.1937

Edited by Ergo Storm
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4 hours ago, Ergo Storm said:

I am going to reserve judgement about whether the virus is a fabricated hoax, as opposed to just an exaggerated hoax of an actual virus.

 

It seems to me this debate goes to the heart of virology and its validity.  In that regard, this article by Thomas Rivers may be of interest:

 

https://journals.asm.org/doi/pdf/10.1128/jb.33.1.1-12.1937

 

That PDF was about Rivers extension of the Koch Postulates.

 

Now read this ...

Ten Reasons Why SARS-CoV-2 Is an “Imaginary” and “Theoretical Virus”. “They Never Isolated the Virus”

https://www.globalresearch.ca/10-reasons-sars-cov-2-imaginary-theoretical-virus/5735833

 

I've added a PDF copy here if you wish to pass it on to anyone.

 

Edited by webtrekker
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My view: I think it's real and it mutates. Many people die from old age or a co-morbidity, after a flu strain comes and pushes them over. Doh, that's not new. Politicians and media have latched onto it as it offers them opportunities to ''build back better''. They have been very transparent about that. All the scare didn't work with the swine flu, that was pre-social media era, but it does work now.

Edited by Firebird
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On 8/5/2021 at 5:40 AM, zArk said:

and the system shrugs saying "so what!"

 

this type of 'Victory' was announced years ago with the scum called Mark Ceylon , Michael O'Bernicia, Guy Taylor, Jon Witterick when Tom Crawford was used as a showcase for 'freeman on the land' nonsense

 

seriously. He is not using common law. He is not fighting the system.

He is the defendant.

He agreed to being subject to their court.

His subpoena was nonsense

He'll end up with a WHOPPING BILL from his shenanigans

 

🤦‍♂️

these type of people are trying to agitate people into needlessly breaking the law, contesting the charges, using his method of questioning the basis of covid and being the defendant for the end goal of trying to swamp the court system in the hope of it grinding to a halt

 

these agitators are communists who have no respect for the law

they mix common law with statutory law , confuse the law and legal process, confuse the position of complainant, defendant and claimant

 

be aware

 

Incredible law resources

1215.org -- bill thornton for common law introduction and application against the legal system (in depth)

karl lentz (audio videos)  https://duckduckgo.com/?q=karl+lentz+common+law&t=ffab&iar=videos&iax=videos&ia=videos

Thanks - out of reactions

 

The trouble is that in the west, media control perception for the majority.

 

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Surely by now the argument as to whether or not the virus exists is immaterial ? people have had 18 months to make up their mind and real or not what is more pressing is whats being introduced by governments around the world in lockstep with one another

All legal challenges have fell on their collective backsides and nothing,and i really do mean nothing has changed whatsoever

They are now about to start jabbing children ,proving in an internet forum that the virus does or does not exist won't save the countless numbers of kids who are going to die

What will it take for people to focus on whats pressing right now?

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16 hours ago, webtrekker said:

 

That PDF was about Rivers extension of the Koch Postulates.

 

Now read this ...

Ten Reasons Why SARS-CoV-2 Is an “Imaginary” and “Theoretical Virus”. “They Never Isolated the Virus”

https://www.globalresearch.ca/10-reasons-sars-cov-2-imaginary-theoretical-virus/5735833

 

I've added a PDF copy here if you wish to pass it on to anyone.

 

 

Rivers' paper was in 1937.  He died in 1968, so the date given in the link is wrong.  

 

The 1937 paper does not extend Koch's postulates, it rejects them for the purpose of virology (even Koch himself questioned his own postulates - as a proper scientist should).  Rivers comes up with new postulates to reflect the fact (or belief, if you prefer) that a virus is an intercellular parasite and thus cannot be isolated.

 

Your link keeps repeating that SARS Cov-2 cannot be isolated, indeed is not isolable, as if this is some sort of major revelation, but the conventional scientific position is that it is not isolable because it is a virus, and that has always been the position in science.  When you scream, "The virus has not been isolated!", my response is: "Yeah, so what?"

 

The issue I have with the 'party line' taken on this Forum is that you are simplifying something that is quite complicated and, like the Covid-19 cultists and hysterics, refusing to acknowledge that science is always provisional.  There is inherent uncertainty about what specifically causes disease in particular cases because that is the state of human knowledge.  If you want, you can say it's all educated guesswork, but that does not in itself invalidate it.  

 

For me, what invalidates it is the hysterical overreaction which suggests to me that an adverse event has been seized on and exploited by a mixture of dupes, incompetents and psychopaths.  It's possible, but rather unlikely, that the entire corpus of virology is wrong.  I am open to considering it.  It seems more likely that virology will develop and evolve, maybe into a new paradigm, as knowledge and experimentation improves, and that's no bad thing.  Along the way, unscrupulous people - on all sides of various controversies and debates - will exploit the inherent uncertainty in science to advance their own agendas.

 

I'm not interested in adopting anybody's agenda, whether it is denying viruses or hysterically over-exaggerating the risk of viruses to public health.  Both these extreme polar positions contain kernels of truth.  It is true that virology could be wrong in its fundamentals, just like any other science could be wrong.  Viruses are a concept.  They may not exist in physical reality or (more likely) they do exist but need to be reconceptualised, just as in the past science has had to go through paradigmatic shifts as new discoveries emerge or reinterpretations of old discoveries become accepted.  That's normal, because science is man-made and therefore fallible and incomplete - it will always be this way.  Equally, it's true that people are getting sick with something, in some cases very ill, and I don't want to catch it, but the scale of the reaction is grossly exaggerated and abusive of civil liberties and I will not wear a mask or submit to the vaccine.

Edited by Ergo Storm
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1 hour ago, Ergo Storm said:

 

Rivers' paper was in 1937.  He died in 1968, so the date given in the link is wrong.  

 

The 1937 paper does not extend Koch's postulates, it rejects them for the purpose of virology (even Koch himself questioned his own postulates - as a proper scientist should).  Rivers comes up with new postulates to reflect the fact (or belief, if you prefer) that a virus is an intercellular parasite and thus cannot be isolated.

 

Your link keeps repeating that SARS Cov-2 cannot be isolated, indeed is not isolable, as if this is some sort of major revelation, but the conventional scientific position is that it is not isolable because it is a virus, and that has always been the position in science.  When you scream, "The virus has not been isolated!", my response is: "Yeah, so what?"

 

The issue I have with the 'party line' taken on this Forum is that you are simplifying something that is quite complicated and, like the Covid-19 cultists and hysterics, refusing to acknowledge that science is always provisional.  There is inherent uncertainty about what specifically causes disease in particular cases because that is the state of human knowledge.  If you want, you can say it's all educated guesswork, but that does not in itself invalidate it.  

 

For me, what invalidates it is the hysterical overreaction which suggests to me that an adverse event has been seized on and exploited by a mixture of dupes, incompetents and psychopaths.  It's possible, but rather unlikely, that the entire corpus of virology is wrong.  I am open to considering it.  It seems more likely that virology will develop and evolve, maybe into a new paradigm, as knowledge and experimentation improves, and that's no bad thing.  Along the way, unscrupulous people - on all sides of various controversies and debates - will exploit the inherent uncertainty in science to advance their own agendas.

 

I'm not interested in adopting anybody's agenda, whether it is denying viruses or hysterically over-exaggerating the risk of viruses to public health.  Both these extreme polar positions contain kernels of truth.  It is true that virology could be wrong in its fundamentals, just like any other science could be wrong.  Viruses are a concept.  They may not exist in physical reality or (more likely) they do exist but need to be reconceptualised, just as in the past science has had to go through paradigmatic shifts as new discoveries emerge or reinterpretations of old discoveries become accepted.  That's normal, because science is man-made and therefore fallible and incomplete - it will always be this way.  Equally, it's true that people are getting sick with something, in some cases very ill, and I don't want to catch it, but the scale of the reaction is grossly exaggerated and abusive of civil liberties and I will not wear a mask or submit to the vaccine.

The points you make here are very valid. I dont fully believe in germ theory. I do like the idea of terrain theory. Neither are fully proven. What people are getting sick with is a big question. My guest would be like many have said some type of radiation from wifi or phones, also the body does once a year  detox itself which can be flu like. Of course its possible there could be a HIV type flu going round that is transferable. But i dont believe in asymptomatic spreading its not possible in my opinion.

Edited by Captainlove
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1 hour ago, Captainlove said:

The points you make here are very valid. I dont fully believe in germ theory. I do like the idea of terrain theory. Neither are fully proven. What people are getting sick with is a big question. My guest would be like many have said some type of radiation from wifi or phones, also the body does once a year  detox itself which can be flu like. Of course its possible there could be a HIV type flu going round that is transferable. But i dont believe in asymptomatic spreading its not possible in my opinion.

 

It is possible that in 50 or 100 or 200 years from now, people will laugh at us for believing in viruses and virology.  "They believed that invisible, sub-microscopic parasites cause infections!  Ha-ha, that's like believing in spirits causing illness!  What a bunch of dumb asses!"   That's just the way of the world.  Knowledge moves on and the conventional wisdom of the past looks obviously silly through the eyes of later generations who have better knowledge, methods and techniques (or think they do).

 

I think it is more likely that the next paradigm in this area of science will be a further development of virology, but who knows?  Maybe some of the theories you mention could turn out to be true.  I honestly don't know, which is why I am cautious.  It could be a trap to discredit us or send us off on a tangent discussing something of academic importance while they build a prison for us.

Edited by Ergo Storm
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6 hours ago, zarkov said:

Thanks - out of reactions

 

The trouble is that in the west, media control perception for the majority.

 

Ally McBeal and Better call Saul 

 

reality of young evil gov lawyers destroying families of vaccine damaged children wouldnt be great viewing imo

Edited by zArk
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7 hours ago, whatthefoxhat said:

Surely by now the argument as to whether or not the virus exists is immaterial ? people have had 18 months to make up their mind and real or not what is more pressing is whats being introduced by governments around the world in lockstep with one another

All legal challenges have fell on their collective backsides and nothing,and i really do mean nothing has changed whatsoever

They are now about to start jabbing children ,proving in an internet forum that the virus does or does not exist won't save the countless numbers of kids who are going to die

What will it take for people to focus on whats pressing right now?

 

This thread came about as a result of combining several new topics repeatedly started by new members all asking the same question.  (back in August 2020)

 

The topic is still relevant today, and I moved it from 'Research Assistance' to the 'COVID-19 NWO' area, just for the benefit of any new members trying to explore the background of all of this.

 

Because yes, everything in the 'narrative' falls apart, if enough people understand that if the virus has never been isolated, then that renders the PCR tests meaningless that everyone has been subjected to.

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10 hours ago, whatthefoxhat said:

Surely by now the argument as to whether or not the virus exists is immaterial ? people have had 18 months to make up their mind and real or not what is more pressing is whats being introduced by governments around the world in lockstep with one another

All legal challenges have fell on their collective backsides and nothing,and i really do mean nothing has changed whatsoever

They are now about to start jabbing children ,proving in an internet forum that the virus does or does not exist won't save the countless numbers of kids who are going to die

What will it take for people to focus on whats pressing right now?

100% spot on.

 

I have to wonder at the motives of some for continuing to focus on the "virus". If there ever was anything at all virus-like (some minor strand of flu that got used to kick this hysterical scam off), that time has long since passed.

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1 hour ago, Anti Facts Sir said:

100% spot on.

 

I have to wonder at the motives of some for continuing to focus on the "virus". If there ever was anything at all virus-like (some minor strand of flu that got used to kick this hysterical scam off), that time has long since passed.

You're right to question my motives.  I'm working for the intelligence services. My codename is Fuck Drop.  You've blown my cover. I'll need to go back to working as an extra on soft porn adverts for Walkers Crisps.

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I agree with you Grumpy Owl about the fact that people had 18 months to really look for other point of view. A friend of mine and myself talked(sms) about this plandemic since the early days. We were both on the same page that there is a cult behind those thing for long time now, at least 10 years before this "virus" thing ....ok we still fell for the virus lies for about a week or two.

 

I remember exchanging sms with him in the late spring of 2020 and saying "it had never  been so obvious to me, and most people do not see". He replied"it is like the ones who are awake become more and more awake and those who are asleep get more and more asleep." Dam it is true and i was able to verify it on a daily...and in the last 3 or 4 months i notice a change in my connection toward those who are still under the MMS spell. I started to put less and less energy trying to explain to them what really going on. I really notice a change in my emotional implication. Maybe some will wake-up only for the diner, but i started to really think that most of those who have the ability to wake up have already done it. And the 24th of july Gareth Icke said in a very good way what i was feeling and thinking.

 

Is the "separation" between those who see and those who don't is, in most part, already completed?

Edited by Pierre-Luc
I was not paying enough attention reading it before posting...forgot a word..maybe more i am still not completely sure.
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23 hours ago, DarianF said:

The DELTA Variant is Total FAKE NEWS! Dr Andrew Kaufman explains, using science on how the delta variant scare mongering going on with the main stream media.

VIDEO: https://freeworldnews.tv/watch?id=60f9e83673a7b3082db33cc0

 

Surely as per the subject of this thread, if the virus has never been proven to exist, then neither do ANY of these so-called variants.

 

I have also NEVER seen any scientific explanation for how these variants have ever been 'identified' from use of PCR testing.

 

As far as I am concerned, these variants only exist in the media, planted there by medical expert 'stooges' who can simply turn around and say they have 'identified some new variant' without question.

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