Jump to content

Serious question...


Free_your_mind
 Share

Recommended Posts

1 minute ago, Diesel said:

I despise that phrase but it seems to me you are guarding yourself from the alternative viewpoint. You can bury your head in the sand and scream "it's not true" but it will not make this global agenda go away. Since when did governments care about the people? 

Well that's the thing, I did think it was all true. I'm fully aware that any point I try to get across will not pass the defenses of someone who believes in an all encompassing, absolute, black and white (no grey areas anywhere!) global 'super conspiracy'. Only an individual can free their own mind of that.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Free_your_mind said:

I don't have an issue with questioning what's in a vaccine or how safe it is. Not at all. I've looked at all the information and have come to the conclusion that they do significantly more good than harm. A lot of the counter arguements don't hold up to scrutiny. And the geniune cases of serious adverse effects are so rare, they are anomalies. Although it doesn't make them less tragic. All medicines carry a risk, just read the potential side effects of paracetamol.

 

aluminium is used as an adjuvant to create an immune response

 

If you ingest aluminium for example through food or drink your body excretes it but if it is injected into muscle it provokes an immune response, which is to say macrophages swallow up the aluminium and what is now being discovered is that the macrophages then carry that aluminium over the blood brain barrier where it is able to affect gene expression and have an epigenetic effect

 

Imagine homer simpson taking maggie to work at the nuclear power plant. He's sitting at his control consol with maggie on his knee and he passes out after one too many donuts. Maggie leans forward and starts hitting all the buttons on the consol randomly and all across the power plant stuff starts to go wrong. The power goes on and off, lights flicker, the reactors shut down, alarms go off, doors lock and people are running around like headless chickens. Thats like the aluminium getting into your brain and affecting your genes causing autoimmune disorders, asthma, eczema, neurological damage, bells palsy, paralysis and a whole host of other problems

 

''But they measure that'' you might say. But the problem is that they DON'T measure that. Those problems are called NON SPECIFIC EFFECTS and the vaccine industry does not do studies into them. All the vaccine corporations are interested in is whether or not their vaccine produces antibodies

 

So the TRUTH is that no one knows the true extent of the damage of vaccines and it is believed that the VAERS system that records those adverse effects that are reported to a doctor and then passed on by doctors only record about 1% of adverse reactions.

 

The true damage caused by vaccines is vast but unrecorded and unstudied and that is the reality of the situation

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

32 minutes ago, Free_your_mind said:

Well that's the thing, I did think it was all true. I'm fully aware that any point I try to get across will not pass the defenses of someone who believes in an all encompassing, absolute, black and white (no grey areas anywhere!) global 'super conspiracy'. Only an individual can free their own mind of that.

 

just look into things like the '5 eyes' surveillance partnership and also klaus schwabs 'great reset' book. These are all networks of people who follow scripts and that is why so many countries are all in lockstep over this covid thing. They are all following a centralised direction

Link to comment
Share on other sites

42 minutes ago, Free_your_mind said:

Well that's the thing, I did think it was all true. I'm fully aware that any point I try to get across will not pass the defenses of someone who believes in an all encompassing, absolute, black and white (no grey areas anywhere!) global 'super conspiracy'. Only an individual can free their own mind of that.

 

you just lack the knowledge to see the full picture. The knowledge is out there so to not have any of it now is simply willful ignore-ance, but these clips below can get you started

 

Jay dyers technocracy reading list:

 

 

 

The Hard Road to (Technocratic) World Order
 

 

 

The Trilateral Commission and Technocracy

 

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Oakwise said:

 

So you've studied the counter-arguments have you? Can you summarise them here, please. I want to make sure you're not counter-arguing against straw men. And the fact that you didn't know what adjuvants are suggests you're not really clued up on all the various arguments. If you were clued up, you'd already know what an adjuvant is.

 

There's a lot of good science out there showing the potential for vaccine damage, above and beyond what you would expect from a 'safe' vaccine. This is the charge: The manufacturers claim they are safer and/or more effective than they actually are. 

 

On a broader level, it may actually turn out that this kind of induced immunisation is the completely wrong approach. After all, we're dealing complex biosystems with many variable and many unknowns. 

 

But that wasn't really the point I was making. You said 'anti-vax' is a turd in a punchbowl and suggested that we shouldn't focus on it. I disagreed. Nothing you've said so far has dissuaded me from that viewpoint. 

 

All the best. 

 

"This is the charge: The manufacturers claim they are safer and/or more effective than they actually are". That's not an outrageous claim. And I would tend to lean in your favour on this. Where there is commercial profit, there is room for corruption. You and I both know, many on here go way beyond that in their beliefs and their detachment from basic science. The debate can be summed up as this, vaccines are dangerous vs vaccines are safe. The framing of the debate is wrong, and neither side aren't going to make much progress, are they? You can point to examples where vaccines have been dangerous and I could point to times when they are safe. I could accept your position that they are dangerous, but it still might apply that they are less dangerous than the virus they protect against. Risk is very important. If a vaccine has a 10% chance of killing me, those are terrible odds but if the virus it protects me against (if it doesn't kill me) has a 60% percent chance of killing me, I'm going to take the vaccine. These aren't real world examples, I know. The real world examples are more like there is a 0.00001% chance the vaccine will cause damage, and if a virus is 2% likely to kill - the vaccine comes out on top every time. You can obviously point to many examples of vaccine damage (these need scrutinising very carefully imo - statistically people are dropping dead for a variety of reasons all of the time, it can be very easy to fall into the 'well they got a vaccine yesterday and now they've dropped dead for no reason, ergo it's the vaccine' trap.

 

Isn't the majority of the anti-vax movement arguing against a straw-man? 'Vaccines aren't 100% safe' one might say. Whoever said they were? They come with listed side effects as does every other medicine. When the MHRA authorise a vaccine, they are saying, 'we've looked at all the data and have come to the conclusion that the safety of the vaccine FAR OUTWEIGHS the negatives of the disease. There is a very small risk associated with taking the vaccine. Many people may suffer very mild side effects (24 hour window) a bit of swelling etc, very few people will suffer severe reactions. Those who are hyper sensitive to allergies or immunosuppressed should not take the vaccine without consulting a doctor'. So, we can go into mercury and MMR autism links. The damage done by Andrew Wakefield has been done but his association of MMR with autism has been fully debunked. But, even that doesn't win the debate, because you can point to serious damage that has actually been done by vaccines. I can only say that the science is continuously improving, mistakes have been learned from. Science is trying to improve the situation. The covid-19 vaccine is based on a very robust model for similar viruses. Vaccines aren't a magic solution to solve all our problems, but I believe it is the best we have at this moment to fight the serious threats of disease around the round.

 

I'm not an expert so I misspoke on the adjuvants. I do work with experts though. Which is why I have defended  scientists in my replies. Honestly, some of the nicest people you can meet (again, my mind here would have gone to Joseph Mengele in my conspiracy days as a way to completely reject what the person is saying. But, I now realise that you will always be able to find examples in the extreme opposite direction, and that doesn't often discredit the point being made). I find the scientists I know (I work with over 300 in a non-profit organisation) to be extremely humble, polite, sensitive, intelligent people. I guess you might argue that the scientific research system has been created to compartmentalise whole sections of the structure, and the scientists at the bottom are just doing their job. Don't buy it, although it is hard to argue against (by design). An easier point for me to make is, how many people would it take to pull of a vaccine conspiracy on the country? How is that possible? There are thousands of labs out there working on the covid vaccine in some way. Private labs, public sector labs. The argument of they 'just do as they are told, they are small pawns in a bigger game they understand', doesn;t hold up for scientists. They are the most inquisitive minds on the planet. They get off on facts, and numbers and finding the truth. Dare I say, not much different to many people on here. I just think we need recalibrating once in a while :)

 

And I've not even brought up how anti-vax beliefs fit into the super conspiracy model - depopulation, mind control, genocide of the human race (or rather it all seems to be about the white race now which is a new development), slave beings, government surveillance, inter-dimensional beings, negative frequencies. These people are working backwards from those beliefs and swallowing up reasonable discussions, such as 'how safe are vaccines?' And I unfortunately think, from my own experience, some that start of on the more sensible topics, work there way further and further down, consuming more and more information, until they've reached a point where they can't even speak to their own families normally anymore because everything, and I mean EVERYTHING, has been corrupted in their worldview.

Edited by Free_your_mind
typos
Link to comment
Share on other sites

42 minutes ago, Macnamara said:

 

aluminium is used as an adjuvant to create an immune response

 

If you ingest aluminium for example through food or drink your body excretes it but if it is injected into muscle it provokes an immune response, which is to say macrophages swallow up the aluminium and what is now being discovered is that the macrophages then carry that aluminium over the blood brain barrier where it is able to affect gene expression and have an epigenetic effect

 

Imagine homer simpson taking maggie to work at the nuclear power plant. He's sitting at his control consol with maggie on his knee and he passes out after one too many donuts. Maggie leans forward and starts hitting all the buttons on the consol randomly and all across the power plant stuff starts to go wrong. The power goes on and off, lights flicker, the reactors shut down, alarms go off, doors lock and people are running around like headless chickens. Thats like the aluminium getting into your brain and affecting your genes causing autoimmune disorders, asthma, eczema, neurological damage, bells palsy, paralysis and a whole host of other problems

 

''But they measure that'' you might say. But the problem is that they DON'T measure that. Those problems are called NON SPECIFIC EFFECTS and the vaccine industry does not do studies into them. All the vaccine corporations are interested in is whether or not their vaccine produces antibodies

 

So the TRUTH is that no one knows the true extent of the damage of vaccines and it is believed that the VAERS system that records those adverse effects that are reported to a doctor and then passed on by doctors only record about 1% of adverse reactions.

 

The true damage caused by vaccines is vast but unrecorded and unstudied and that is the reality of the situation

 

Thanks, I like the analogy! I will look into the aluminum link. You are probably right that the vaccine manufacturers do not look into this that make their job harder, either at all, or not as much as they should do. But they are not the only players in the game. The thing about scientific research is that they are forever reviewing and criticising each other's work. Independent labs or non-profit organisations would be very keen to investigate any dodgy goings on in their field. Unless you think that the entire network of research scientists are under the direct, or indirect control of Bill Gates. Yes, The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation provide a lot of money around the world for research. No question. But unless you know how the research grant process works, you're probably going to draw wrong conclusions, especially if they fit your super conspiracy theory worldview. It's more the organisations that dictate the work they do, rather than anyone directly controlling it.

 

"All the vaccine corporations are interested in is whether or not their vaccine produces antibodies."  Not fully true, is it? They are also concerned about the safety of their product as well, surely? They wouldn't sell many if it was known to be unsafe.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

30 minutes ago, Free_your_mind said:

 

"This is . . .

 

To be honest, your post is littered with weak generalisations and unproven assumptions. A lot to untangle. Very meandering and not to the point. 

 

The crux of it is: People should be able to choose what risks they take. So if they want to take the vaccine or give it to their children they can. But one would hope that they are fully aware of all the risks. There are some serious risks that a lot of people aren't aware of and it's being covered up by powerful interests (plenty of whistle blowers, independent scientists etc.)

 

You reference Wakefield. However, it turns that there is indeed a potential link between vaccines and autism. It's to do with the aluminium adjuvants - aluminium is a known neurotoxin. Prof Chris Exley, Keele University, has spent his life studying aluminium in relation to living organisms. His work strongly suggests that aluminium is a key etiological factor in many cases of Alzheimer's. 

 

His research also suggests that aluminium adjuvants could be a factor in autism. He identified that there have been no proper safety trials for the alu adjuvant, since the placebo in the control group contain the adjuvant. There's enough evidence there to at least warrant serious investigation in a cooperative, multilateral way. However, this science is being suppressed; not surprising since the implications are huge for powerful corporate powers, not just pharma but the aluminium industry as well. 

 

Here's Prof Chris Exley giving a lecture on the subject: 

 

 

  • Like 2
Link to comment
Share on other sites

  

2 hours ago, Free_your_mind said:

Thanks, I like the analogy! I will look into the aluminum link. You are probably right that the vaccine manufacturers do not look into this that make their job harder, either at all, or not as much as they should do.

 

They are not incentivised to look into it because the The National Childhood Vaccine Injury Act of 1986 was passed in the US which gave the vaccination manufacturers immunity against being sued for vaccine damage. This means that vaccine manufacturers are the only corporations who will never be held accountable when their product damages the end user

 

There are no consequences for them for their wrong doing

 

Everyone else in the world can be sued when they cause harm or damage but not the vaccine companies. So why do they need special protection? They need special protection because they are damaging so many people that they would be sued out of existence if they were operating on the open market

 

Quote

But they are not the only players in the game. The thing about scientific research is that they are forever reviewing and criticising each other's work.

 

But you need to get funding and who is going to fund indepedent studies when there is no money to be made in that?

 

Quote

Independent labs or non-profit organisations would be very keen to investigate any dodgy goings on in their field. Unless you think that the entire network of research scientists are under the direct, or indirect control of Bill Gates.

 

Certainly there are now a lot of people walking around with pockets bulging with bill gates's money. But to go back to your point of how can they suppress information there are all kinds of problems. Lets consider for example the big tabacco industry that managed to conceal from the public the truth that the cigarettes they were making caused cancer. How did they do this? They did all their science IN HOUSE. All the studies that were being produced were being funded by and vetted directly by big tobacco themselves

 

Now with the vaccines there is the issue that you need a control for your experiment and that should be people who have NEVER HAD ANY VACCINES AT ALL. In reality what they often do is they will use a control group that hasn't had the vaccine they are experimenting with but they have had other vaccines and that is not going to then act as a control to reveal non specific effects. But the point is that the vaccine companies aren't interested in non specific effects; they are only interested in whether or not their vaccine is producing antibodies for a particular thing

 

Now consider the fact that some people who have had jabs like measles for example and they later on give blood donations and when their blood is sampled it is being found that the antibodies have gone or faded meaning that the vaccines are not giving longterm antibodies and this is because your antibodies are not really your bodies best defence. I once heard them described as like the equivalent of a panic room in your house if you are under attack which is to say they are your immune systems last gasp effort to stave off attack

 

The companies are not going to waste money on studies looking into non specific effects which will only tell them that yes their product does indeed cause all sorts of problems. So instead they fund studies to check if it produces antibodies and there will be no consequences for them once the vaccine is then rolled out because they have been granted legal immunity

 

Quote

Yes, The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation provide a lot of money around the world for research. No question. But unless you know how the research grant process works, you're probably going to draw wrong conclusions, especially if they fit your super conspiracy theory worldview. It's more the organisations that dictate the work they do, rather than anyone directly controlling it.

 

Money makes the world go round. After the US Bill Gates is the biggest funder of the World Health Organisation

 

When we look at the UK vaccine council for example we see 32 members of the panel have received in excess of £200,000,000 in grants from The Bill and Melinda Gates Foundation. Ian Hudson who was the CEO of the MHRA left and went to become Bill Gates senior advisor to assist Bill with getting his vaccines through the regulatory processes of the MHRA

 

The MHRA were themselves given £980,000 from Bill Gates in 2017

 

Quote

"All the vaccine corporations are interested in is whether or not their vaccine produces antibodies."  Not fully true, is it? They are also concerned about the safety of their product as well, surely? They wouldn't sell many if it was known to be unsafe.

 

Parents of vaccine damaged children are not allowed to sue the vaccine companies because they have legal immunity so instead they have to apply to go through the secret vaccine courts (secret because they are held behind closed doors with no press allowed in).

 

This is all to conceal the full extent of the damage. They have also avoided doing studies comparing vaccinated children with non vaccinated children because that would then reveal that vaccinated children have more health problems. All that has been done until recently of that kind was two SURVEYS

 

Then they also rely on the obscurity around the underlying mechanisms at work but there are grey areas where researchers are trying to shine a light such as 'molecular mimicry', 'vaccine enhancement' and 'viral interference'. The scientists are aware these are problem areas but haven't broken them down to fundamental principles. For example pfizer mentions 'vaccine enhancement' in its own document about the trials for their covid jab in which they admit that the trials can't be complete yet because the timeframe for the trials isn't up yet:

 

Disease enhancement has been seen following vaccinationwith respiratory syncytial virus(RSV),feline coronavirus,and Dengue virus vaccines.

 

https://pfe-pfizercom-d8-prod.s3.amazonaws.com/2020-11/C4591001_Clinical_Protocol_Nov2020.pdf

Edited by Macnamara
Link to comment
Share on other sites

3 hours ago, Free_your_mind said:

Risk is very important. If a vaccine has a 10% chance of killing me, those are terrible odds but if the virus it protects me against (if it doesn't kill me) has a 60% percent chance of killing me, I'm going to take the vaccine.

 

But how do you assess the risk when the studies for non specific effects are simply NOT THERE?

 

You can mention adverse effects but if only a tiny percentage of adverse effects are mentioned to doctors and then not all of those doctors pass those onto VAERS (they are legally supposed to but don't always do it) then the adverse reactions are being massively UNDER reported

 

Now lets consider that some adverse reactions occur immediately for example a child might develop a fever. That is then easier to prove in terms of timeframe than a health issue that manifests over time such as kidney issues

 

If the public haven't been advised by doctors and the media that they should be looking out for vaccine induced problems like say a peanut allergy then how would they know to trace back that allergy to vaccines when they develop that allergy? They won't. They'll just think ''oh well nature has decided that i am to be unlucky and randomly generate this health issue''

 

In order to find out the FULL EXTENT of non specific effects you need to do studies on that comparing vaccinated to non vaccinated (people who have had NO VACCINES AT ALL) over a long period of time but those studies have not been done

 

So the first thing you need to understand is that you currently do NOT KNOW the full risk involved in vaccines

 

Quote

These aren't real world examples, I know. The real world examples are more like there is a 0.00001% chance the vaccine will cause damage, and if a virus is 2% likely to kill - the vaccine comes out on top every time.

 

Well i think the official figures for covid are something like you have a 99.98% chance of survival if you are under 70. So they want you to take an experimental vaccine that killed the animal test subjects through a process of 'immune enhancement' when the technology was experimented on in the past before bill gates dusted the concept off and pumped money into it when you basically have no chance of dying from it unless you are already a very sick person

 

Now flu survival is something like 99.99% so the two, according to the official figures, are comparable and yet we don't lockdown for the flu or rush out an experimental vaccine that hasn't completed its trial period onto the general public

 

Quote

You can obviously point to many examples of vaccine damage (these need scrutinising very carefully imo - statistically people are dropping dead for a variety of reasons all of the time, it can be very easy to fall into the 'well they got a vaccine yesterday and now they've dropped dead for no reason, ergo it's the vaccine' trap.

 

Well that works both ways round. So with illnesses in the past vaccines have been credited with lowering incidences of them for example small pox but if you actually look at the death rate figures for small pox and then you superimpose the date of the roll out of mass vaccinations we see that small pox deaths had plummeted BEFORE the vaccines were deployed. So why was that? It was because of improvements in housing, water, sewerage, nutrition and sanitation

 

Also they claim vaccines have gotten rid of polio but that isn't true. All they have done is renamed polio 'acute flaccid myelitis' and children are still out there getting paralysed.

 

On top of that we have seen autism rates go from 1 in 10,000 to about 1 in 50 in some states of the US in the space of several decades so lets call that for what it is: neurological damage. But because the vaccine industry has refused to acknowledge a link between vaccines and autism nothing has been done to stem that damage

 

Well that's not entirely true....they did remove thimerosol which is a mercury derivative and was used as a preservative and mercury is of course a well known NEUROTOXIN. So they removed thimerosol quietly from the vaccines but if challenged about it they would not admit it caused harm and would just say ''we are just removing it as a precaution''. They haven't removed it from the flu vaccine however. You take that flu vaccine and you are having a neurotoxin injected into your body that then bypasses your bodies usual defences where it expects you to ingest toxins not inject them into yourself

 

The secret vaccine courts HAVE however acknowledged a link between vaccines and autism as they have paid out money to kids with autism. Also the CDC whistleblower Dr Thomson has said that the CDC found evidence that the MMR jab caused autism in some people especially black boys and yet they sought to meddle with the data to conceal that

 

Quote

Isn't the majority of the anti-vax movement arguing against a straw-man? 'Vaccines aren't 100% safe' one might say. Whoever said they were? They come with listed side effects as does every other medicine. When the MHRA authorise a vaccine, they are saying, 'we've looked at all the data and have come to the conclusion that the safety of the vaccine FAR OUTWEIGHS the negatives of the disease.

 

They haven't weighed all of the negative effects as they haven't done the studies required to establish those

 

Edited by Macnamara
Link to comment
Share on other sites

"The Anti-Vaxx Movement"

 

"Super conspiracy"

 

We are not the fiction depicted on BBC Hatespeech.

 

We have clear and specific knowledge about these circumstances being deliberately engineered. We knew this was planned 15 years ago. You're news presents the situation like unexpected shock. You believe ignoring all information except that sanctioned by mainstream TV makes you informed. It doesn't make you ignorant, it makes you naive. What makes you ignorant is a presumption we are ignorant to whats being said on mainstream TV and the various views it airs, and the presumption that alternative views should be rejected without a fair investigation. On this side of the censorship bubble, people are encouraged to do their own research and all you have to go on are the two jokers dealt to all of you by those who have all the cards. I'm only playing with half a deck here, but my ace of spades and king of hearts says that king of diamonds wont be letting you in on any clubs. Tricky talk, we're not stupid. We know what's being said by the media now, but we also know information they know that they know we know and we know they know that we know and we know if you know it, you're in here grossly insulting us with a pack of lies because you're as bent as a 13 pound note, but lets presume you dont know what we know and the information we have will affect your pride in always being right, you will dismiss the information while trying to defend a position the information describes to be collapsed and you will attempt to throw quantities of information at us like your winning the argument is like winning the game. This is no game. This is a matter of life or death, and the value of investigation of ALL the facts which led us to here in history, is not winning the game but winning the truth.

 

What does Aaron Russo (The Director of the Eddie Murphy box office hit Trading Places) have to do with the Covid-19 Notification API? That must sound so completely random to someone with two jokers in his hands who thinks he's playing with a full deck. That's just one piece of a big jigsaw puzzle we were putting together a decade ago and what we see is a picture where all that stuff in the bubble of uncensored information is just one piece of a bigger puzzle. Seek and ye will find.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

4 hours ago, Steph said:

"The Anti-Vaxx Movement"

 

"Super conspiracy"

 

We are not the fiction depicted on BBC Hatespeech.

 

We have clear and specific knowledge about these circumstances being deliberately engineered. We knew this was planned 15 years ago. You're news presents the situation like unexpected shock. You believe ignoring all information except that sanctioned by mainstream TV makes you informed. It doesn't make you ignorant, it makes you naive. What makes you ignorant is a presumption we are ignorant to whats being said on mainstream TV and the various views it airs, and the presumption that alternative views should be rejected without a fair investigation. On this side of the censorship bubble, people are encouraged to do their own research and all you have to go on are the two jokers dealt to all of you by those who have all the cards. I'm only playing with half a deck here, but my ace of spades and king of hearts says that king of diamonds wont be letting you in on any clubs. Tricky talk, we're not stupid. We know what's being said by the media now, but we also know information they know that they know we know and we know they know that we know and we know if you know it, you're in here grossly insulting us with a pack of lies because you're as bent as a 13 pound note, but lets presume you dont know what we know and the information we have will affect your pride in always being right, you will dismiss the information while trying to defend a position the information describes to be collapsed and you will attempt to throw quantities of information at us like your winning the argument is like winning the game. This is no game. This is a matter of life or death, and the value of investigation of ALL the facts which led us to here in history, is not winning the game but winning the truth.

 

What does Aaron Russo (The Director of the Eddie Murphy box office hit Trading Places) have to do with the Covid-19 Notification API? That must sound so completely random to someone with two jokers in his hands who thinks he's playing with a full deck. That's just one piece of a big jigsaw puzzle we were putting together a decade ago and what we see is a picture where all that stuff in the bubble of uncensored information is just one piece of a bigger puzzle. Seek and ye will find.

I had all of the pieces of the puzzle together 15 years ago. Decided to scramble them up again and look at the world in a new way. Some pieces are still relevant, albiet in a different position than they were before.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2 minutes ago, Free_your_mind said:

I had all of the pieces of the puzzle together 15 years ago. Decided to scramble them up again and look at the world in a new way. Some pieces are still relevant, albiet in a different position than they were before.

Well if that's the case, what's your explanation of the propheticness of the puzzle pieces put together. I mean it's some coincidence. I have to admit I have my doubts you put together the puzzle pieces as you say you did but since you say you did, multiple predicted circumstances all happening at once despite them all being "nutty conspiracy theories" we shouldn't entertain until 'boom!' coronapanic! As you must imagine if you put the puzzle pieces together as you say you did (and your not just trying to look big), I am quite skeptical that you have a theory to explain the million to one odds involved in that.

 

So just so I know that your not just bullshitting to win your pride in an argument when the truth is more important than pride in a life or death situation, from what you've said, having put the jigsaw pieces together, you know what those "could never happen here" coincidences are so name them and tell me your theory about why they happenned here.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Steph said:

Well if that's the case, what's your explanation of the propheticness of the puzzle pieces put together. I mean it's some coincidence. I have to admit I have my doubts you put together the puzzle pieces as you say you did but since you say you did, multiple predicted circumstances all happening at once despite them all being "nutty conspiracy theories" we shouldn't entertain until 'boom!' coronapanic! As you must imagine if you put the puzzle pieces together as you say you did (and your not just trying to look big), I am quite skeptical that you have a theory to explain the million to one odds involved in that.

 

So just so I know that your not just bullshitting to win your pride in an argument when the truth is more important than pride in a life or death situation, from what you've said, having put the jigsaw pieces together, you know what those "could never happen here" coincidences are so name them and tell me your theory about why they happenned here.

Well, none of us put together the pieces ourselves, did we? They were fed to us in books, YouTube videos and message boards. I don't claim to have a theory to explain everything anymore, because I've discovered that not everything can be explained by a simple narrative. The world is complex, it is not run on a simple formula. The real world is so much more interesting than these grand narratives suggest. I believe the same for science's explanation of the universe, it's so much more vivid and detailed than the religious explanations. Our minds are conditioned to see patterns that are sometimes not there. You must know that there have been plenty of prophesies that came to nothing. This forum was alive with the theories around the Mayan Calendar, 2012 end of days stuff. But it came and went, and nothing. Yet, people have picked up other beliefs of impending 'end of days' stuff. They cycle repeats and repeats. Where is Nibiru, where are the Anunaki? What was the name of the guy who said there would be a false alien invasion, I think at the 2012 Olympics? Where is he now? I would like to ask him what happened there. He was a very engaging speaking and I liked his ancient knowledge. What happened to the Amero? Y2K? What happened to ID cards? That's so easily implemented, we're not that far from it at all - yet the government actually rolled it back. Decided NOT to do it. Where is the European army that should have been here a decade ago. Where is the next global war that was imminent 15 years ago. What happened to the hollow earth? The false reality being projected from the moon? There was a whole book on that, and now barely a peep. Where the hell does Donald Trump fit into all of this - the son of a billionaire, a narcissistic TV personality is now the champion of the working class and enemy of the elite! And when all these predictions about what will happen as a result of covid-19 end up coming to nothing significant - then how will you and others respond? Will you move onto the next theory and look over the fact that a safe vaccine and a government that doesn't seize control post pandemic literally proves your beliefs incorrect, or will you take a breathe, step back and reassess what, and more importantly, why you have found yourself believing in these things.

 

The psychology of belief systems is fascinating to me. I would argue that it's even more interesting than the belief systems themselves. 

 

Check it out - [https://religiondispatches.org/qanons-predictions-havent-come-true-so-how-does-the-movement-survive-the-failure-of-prophecy/]

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well there are some gerald celentes who eventually hit the nail on the head and there are some jordan maxwells who know something but their gifts of prophesy are somewhat wanting but without saying too much to give you a clue about what you say you already know, the specific highly unlikely coincidences I asked you to name and give your theory about are things you haven't mentioned at all while going on about some grand super conspiracy as if its some kind of theory when you're living inside the pudding that's the proof. Prove the predicted prison planet now here is just a theory? I'm sure you'll make believe its not a prison planet now its here but lets look at the walls and bars of this utopia in your eyes. Are they not exactly like the walls and bars that we were warned about all those years ago that we were derided as idiots to ever believe could ever happen here. Forget your theory to explain this for now, lets see if you even have anything more than two jokers by describing what anyone who had the jigsaw puzzle would know by you describing those walls and bars to the degree of exactness they were predicted. We have whats called "specific intelligence" from 15 years ago and you're attempting to dispute it with a "general theory" which doesn't mention the "specific intelligence" but seems to suggest we just ignore our own life experience of predictions and events you don't mention while claiming you know. You should wear a suit while making all you're rhetoric but if it doesn't amount to reason, your standing on a broken foundation looking up at people on platform built on columns you don't acknowledge standing on a foundation built on the difficult to find level in a complex terrain of lies where the television being bullshit is an important caveat we cant relate to those prostrated before it like they took the feudal oath to a piece of funiture: "I will to my master be true and faithful, loving all thay he loves and shunning all that he shuns".

 

Search the recesses of your soul, 15 years ago, you were sitting rest assured that the world was returning to normal after incidents you felt were coming back under control. You paid no heed to the value of truth and lies were never far from your lips. Words have always been things you just say to persuade people to do what you want them to do and what is in their interest is irrelevant. You will even lie in a debate to win when the purpose of debate to truthers is not to win our pride but best discern the truth in a world where we have the humility to admit we are idiots in the face of all the truth there is but lies to the seekers of truth is like a virus we develop an immunity from and this drives the salesmen and propagandists mad that we aren't naive and trusting as we once were having come across some whoppers we used to believe. We could swap points on the veracity of calling the system a democracy but if you insist on rules which are akin to saying "my master told me not believe it and people shouldn't be allowed to speak it", then there's no debate. You're master won. Who are we to dispute the wisdom of someone who has closed your ears. If you're lucky, these last bastions of free speech will be around if you change you're mind, give up you're lies and give a fair hearing to the contraflow of information you've been told should be disputed without inquiry. If they fall, don't call us, we'll call you and it will be from places over which your master has no power.

 

Tomorrow afternoon, look at the moon. Why is the reflection on the moon coming from a place other than where the sun is? It's a strange thing that's always been there you've never noticed and have no reason now to believe but seeing is believing and when you do, those theories to explain it flowing through your mind are just conjecture. You don't know why and you can only guess. Imagine you seen that 15 years ago and spent a great deal of time noting the patterns so you could discern the angle of the crescent on any given day. What would you have to say to someone who was only pretending to have looked going by the assumption that the crescent was always directed at the sun? Theories on this aside, there are many things in this world you haven't noticed yet and there is a lot of blindness inflicted on you by those who tell you to ignore things while furnishing you with information they just made up on the spot to convince you to believe what they want you to believe in disregard of any cares you should believe the truth as best as you can discern in a world which is filled with lies and censorship.

 

Sometimes the truth is wonderful and we are glad to believe it "We're all going on a summer holiday", sometimes its awful and we don't want to believe it "but the planes are fully booked". Sometimes the lies are are more wonderful than the truth and we want to believe it "but there is an alternative way to fly" but if we put our desire to believe nice things which are false, be the first to tell us the joys of alternative flight by jumping off a cliff. In a matter of life or death, even the brave deeds recounted by known liars will be suspect. You're path is with the television people for now, whats in this place you cant accept yet. This is a like the rabbit that Alice climbed down because the hare said she was late. It leads to a world where Cerebeus T. Hatter has a tea room on the edge of a vast world which contains the world you're living in now. It's a terrifying site Dorothy. Keep your green tinted glasses on until you've read the children's book by Frank L Baum the technicolor movie musical was based on. The film doesn't relate the true nature of the emerald city or that you were born there. You're not late alice, you're early. Be careful of being wise in your own eyes or essential truths may escape you.

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

They know the majority is compliant so this is all a nice test and we'll end up with less freedoms next year. The vaccine is very likely going to be mandatory if you want to air travel and go to cinema. You have some of your freedoms back but you'll be more enslaved as well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

On 12/12/2020 at 6:19 PM, Free_your_mind said:

Everyone agrees that these restrictions on a feeedoms are worrying. The pressure on mental health is significant. He's my question, what are we to believe if the government gives back our freedoms when the covid19 is under control? We've been constantly told by Icke and others that the totalitarian state is around the corner. I have been listening to David Icke and these theories for around 15 years. The gov have us by the short and curlies, if the police state theory is true, why on earth would they give up powers that they currently have? Serious question. Some might argue that they won't give up the powers they currently have. I guess only time will tell. I predict that by this time next year, all current restrictions will have lifted. People will be able to go back to their lives pre-pandemic. What's your prediction?

2021 fcst

Q1 - Full on lockdown. Xmas will be blamed, "overwhelmed" NHS, lets not let up with the vaccine here rhetoric. Similar to Q3/4 2020

 

Q2 - Can see extreme cock ups with the vaccine roll outs. This along with the rare outbreak gives the government continued excuses to control the masses. Masks etc still here. Furlough ends end of Q1, that and the delayed effect of the previous lockdowns start to come into full effect. This period begins the start of mass unemployment and business closures and failed loans. Stock market starts to get very jittery. Government tries mass QE

 

Q3 - QE doesn't save the financial institutions this time around - as the real economy starts to completely collapse and investor confidence hits rock bottom. Massive bank failures, possible bank bail ins, defaults on loans. People take to the streets in protest - start to take more of an interest in previous government policies and how they have come about. Government starts to get questioned by Joe Public as to what on earth they have been doing over Corona virus. Restrictions still in place but people now starting to completley disregard them.

 

Q4 - Digital currencies introduced and financial reset starts in earnest. Financial and social woes continue. People starting to ignore government - start to see the rise of small extremist parties.

 

Happy times uh?

Edited by Mr H
Link to comment
Share on other sites

5 hours ago, Free_your_mind said:

 Where is the European army that should have been here a decade ago.

Stop Talking About An EU Army, Nigel

by Mike Robinson
Tuesday, 28th May 2019

You’re wrong,” Farage supporters tell me. “He has been talking about the EU Army for years.

In a typical media report, “Emmanuel Macron calls for ‘real European army’ to protect EU from Russia and even AMERICA as Nigel Farage’s fears come true”. We are told “Farage was Right”.

 

Apparently, according to the article, “Nigel Farage, photographed here at the Channel 4 Brexit debate Live last night, has warned that Euro bosses are plotting their own army.

And here is the rub. He has indeed been warning of an ‘EU Army’ for years, in the full knowledge there is no EU Army, and the EU has no plans to build an army.

Calling what the EU is doing an ‘EU Army’ is diversionary. People who hear Farage speak in these terms inevitably write to their MPs using the same terms.

MPs, unaware of how to respond, pass constituents’ questions on to the Ministry of Defence, where Earl Freddie Howe is rolled out to respond.

Earl Howe’s response usually follows a template: “The Prime Minister has made it clear that the United Kingdom’s exit from the EU will not lessen our commitment to European security and defence … NATO is the cornerstone of UK defence … The EU has no plan to build an EU Army.

By insisting on using the language of an ‘EU Army’, Farage diverts his electorate away from the correct description: #EUDefenceUnion, and this offers politicians of all political hues the get out of jail free card of plausible deniability.

Why is Nigel Farage doing this?

I don’t know the answer to this question. I can perhaps speculate by asking why he would want the UK to leave an ‘organisation’ which has funded his lavish lifestyle for twenty years?

What I do know, for a fact, is that he is fully aware of the implications of #EUDefenceUnion. I also know that he believes that to include defence union in the Brexit discussion now would be ‘confusing’ for the electorate.

Of course, when he says it would be confusing for the electorate, he does not mean they would find the concepts behind defence union confusing. He means they would be confused as to why he isn’t talking about it accurately.

They would also be confused about why defence is not part of the Brexit negotiations at all, and this is another fact you will not ever hear Nigel Farage speak about.

Britain’s future defence arrangements with the EU are not part of Brexit. The European Commission has agreed with the UK government that security and defence should be a completely separate package of negotiation.

Think about how clever this whole Brexit thing has been:

  • By separating the ‘divorce’ from the ‘future relationship’, government can claim ‘Brexit’ in the full knowledge that deal or no deal there will be a ‘future relationship’ which will see is back into many, or all, the institutions we had left.
  • By separating defence into a completely different negotiation, it can be kept out of the public discourse completely.

These two bullet points define Brexit, which as I have said since 2016, is a completely fraudulent process. We will not leave, and Nigel Farage knows this.

And so does Francois Fischer, Head, Intelligence Analysis Division, EU Intelligence.

https://www.ukcolumn.org/blogs/stop-talking-about-eu-army-nigel

Link to comment
Share on other sites

10 minutes ago, Mr H said:

small extremist parties

That was a small group of people into racial hygeine and authoritarianism in the late 80s. Thanks to a bold move by a group who brought us treatments for genetic disease and a surveillance state in the 90s we don't have to worry about small extremist groups taking power anymore.  Watch out for those racists and xenophobes who dont approve of the bold move though. If they had their way, it would be like communist China.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Mr H said:

2021 fcst

Q1 - Full on lockdown. Xmas will be blamed, "overwhelmed" NHS, lets not let up with the vaccine here rhetoric. Similar to Q3/4 2020

 

Q2 - Can see extreme cock ups with the vaccine roll outs. This along with the rare outbreak gives the government continued excuses to control the masses. Masks etc still here. Furlough ends end of Q1, that and the delayed effect of the previous lockdowns start to come into full effect. This period begins the start of mass unemployment and business closures and failed loans. Stock market starts to get very jittery. Government tries mass QE

 

Q3 - QE doesn't save the financial institutions this time around - as the real economy starts to completely collapse and investor confidence hits rock bottom. Massive bank failures, possible bank bail ins, defaults on loans. People take to the streets in protest - start to take more of an interest in previous government policies and how they have come about. Government starts to get questioned by Joe Public as to what on earth they have been doing over Corona virus. Restrictions still in place but people now starting to completley disregard them.

 

Q4 - Digital currencies introduced and financial reset starts in earnest. Financial and social woes continue. People starting to ignore government - start to see the rise of small extremist parties.

 

Happy times uh?

Thanks. That's well laid out, and needs serious consideration as it is a possible outcome. I've actually changed my position somewhat, things won't be back to normal next year, like I implied in the original post - some good points have been raised on here. You're right to point out the economic damage that is being done. That will be long-lasting for some people. And things like international travel won't be back to normal, as different countries will be in different stages of handling the virus. My optimistic self though still believes we won't be in any domestic restrictions, this time next year. And hopefully by the summer. People will point out how worrying it is that I seem happy to wait for my basic freedoms to be handed back to me by the State. I understand, but that's the position we're in, I'm afraid. I know that won't sit well here, but I believe this pandemic is serious and a once in a lifetime event. Although, we were overdue an influenza pandemic before any of this, which is worrying.

 

Definitely potential for the government to mess up the roll. There will be cock-ups - especially when you have to back after 28 days to get the second jab. May also be issues with the cold storage. Can see the headlines now - 2,000 people injected with out of date vaccine.

 

The fallout of the economic collapse, if it comes, could be massive. Civil unrest, etc. All possible. But, not looking at it through a conspiracy lens, all these things could happen, but they may be natural reactions/consequences to a very complex situation. I.e. it hasn't been orchestrated. That's also possible. If the virus has been created on purpose, it doesn't seem a clever idea, given it is indiscriminate and seriously affects the elderly - it would be quite funny if it ended of killing some of the key elites.

 

Q4 and digital currencies - this is a bit of a leap for me. It's a good one to test the theory though if it happens in the next 2 years or not. 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 hour ago, Macnamara said:

Stop Talking About An EU Army, Nigel

by Mike Robinson
Tuesday, 28th May 2019

You’re wrong,” Farage supporters tell me. “He has been talking about the EU Army for years.

In a typical media report, “Emmanuel Macron calls for ‘real European army’ to protect EU from Russia and even AMERICA as Nigel Farage’s fears come true”. We are told “Farage was Right”.

 

Apparently, according to the article, “Nigel Farage, photographed here at the Channel 4 Brexit debate Live last night, has warned that Euro bosses are plotting their own army.

And here is the rub. He has indeed been warning of an ‘EU Army’ for years, in the full knowledge there is no EU Army, and the EU has no plans to build an army.

Calling what the EU is doing an ‘EU Army’ is diversionary. People who hear Farage speak in these terms inevitably write to their MPs using the same terms.

MPs, unaware of how to respond, pass constituents’ questions on to the Ministry of Defence, where Earl Freddie Howe is rolled out to respond.

Earl Howe’s response usually follows a template: “The Prime Minister has made it clear that the United Kingdom’s exit from the EU will not lessen our commitment to European security and defence … NATO is the cornerstone of UK defence … The EU has no plan to build an EU Army.

By insisting on using the language of an ‘EU Army’, Farage diverts his electorate away from the correct description: #EUDefenceUnion, and this offers politicians of all political hues the get out of jail free card of plausible deniability.

Why is Nigel Farage doing this?

I don’t know the answer to this question. I can perhaps speculate by asking why he would want the UK to leave an ‘organisation’ which has funded his lavish lifestyle for twenty years?

What I do know, for a fact, is that he is fully aware of the implications of #EUDefenceUnion. I also know that he believes that to include defence union in the Brexit discussion now would be ‘confusing’ for the electorate.

Of course, when he says it would be confusing for the electorate, he does not mean they would find the concepts behind defence union confusing. He means they would be confused as to why he isn’t talking about it accurately.

They would also be confused about why defence is not part of the Brexit negotiations at all, and this is another fact you will not ever hear Nigel Farage speak about.

Britain’s future defence arrangements with the EU are not part of Brexit. The European Commission has agreed with the UK government that security and defence should be a completely separate package of negotiation.

Think about how clever this whole Brexit thing has been:

  • By separating the ‘divorce’ from the ‘future relationship’, government can claim ‘Brexit’ in the full knowledge that deal or no deal there will be a ‘future relationship’ which will see is back into many, or all, the institutions we had left.
  • By separating defence into a completely different negotiation, it can be kept out of the public discourse completely.

These two bullet points define Brexit, which as I have said since 2016, is a completely fraudulent process. We will not leave, and Nigel Farage knows this.

And so does Francois Fischer, Head, Intelligence Analysis Division, EU Intelligence.

https://www.ukcolumn.org/blogs/stop-talking-about-eu-army-nigel

 

When I think about an EU army, a part of me thinks that there might be one at some point. It's not that mad of an idea, really. I'm not sure what it would mean in practice. But the alarmists always frame it as right around the corner, and on British streets next year. 

 

What do you think will be the position on Jan 1st? In or out? No deal etc. Or any 'no deal' will be a lie?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

8 minutes ago, Free_your_mind said:

 

 

Q4 and digital currencies - this is a bit of a leap for me. It's a good one to test the theory though if it happens in the next 2 years or not. 

Yes the timing of this prediction may or may not be Q4 (just a prediction), but it is extremely likely to  happen because.

 

1. Whether you like it or not, the current fiat currency system is collapsing and an alternative is sought - of which there are multiple possibilities.

 

2. When you listen to those in charge Economic forum and couple that with technology available - the proposed solution is a digital currency rather than sticking with what we have but re-aligning to the gold standard.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

18 minutes ago, Free_your_mind said:

 

 

Definitely potential for the government to mess up the roll. There will be cock-ups - especially when you have to back after 28 days to get the second jab. May also be issues with the cold storage. Can see the headlines now - 2,000 people injected with out of date vaccine.

 

 

 

I would add to that.

 

Take out all conspiracy for the moment.

 

They don't actually know if these vaccines actually work - they admit that. They don't know if it stops the spread. Not really a viable solution if it doesn't stop the spread of the disease. They're also claiming multiple variants of the strain which may require multiple different vaccinations by strain type. So I expect multiple iterations of various vaccines to come onto the scene all with varying degrees of success - but this will result in the whole thing being prolonged - means more potential logistical issues, supply issues, storage issues, patient attendance issues, medical staffing issues etc Not to forget all the unknown side effects that always come out of new vaccines. Think the vaccine as the solution scenario will be prolonged. 

Edited by Mr H
Link to comment
Share on other sites

1 minute ago, Mr H said:

They don't actually know if these vaccines actually work

 

May I just say that this is not a vaccine.

Vaccines work in a different way from this injection, which is a messenger Rna, which tell the cells in your body to produce particular proteins.

It is not a vaccine, it is genetic modification of the cells within your body.

You take it and you become GMO

A genetically modified organism!

No longer human.

  • Like 1
Link to comment
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.
Note: Your post will require moderator approval before it will be visible.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

 Share

×
×
  • Create New...