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View Full Version : Don't fear death, it's nothing- David Icke


seanx
02-09-2007, 12:20 AM
Last week a friend died.

I happened to give her this article by dave icke - and a few days
later she told me how it had really helped her and her family. Brought
them great joy.

It was written by dave icle last year on the death of his mother
- and I hope it's OK to reprint it here.

It can transform our attitude towards death- and when you lose
that fear - there is nothing anybody can do to you.

The power of the Elite will vanish quicker than putting a pin in a
balloon.


... AND 'DYING' TO BE BORN ...

'What is death but a passage to life.' - Travis M. Farnsworth
Hello all ...

My mother died last week after a long and painful deterioration of her mental and physical health over nearly 20 years.

She struggled through it all with great fortitude until so many compounding problems meant the body computer could no longer function.

It was the point we call 'death', the most feared of all experiences throughout human existence.

It is the most extreme of the fears that keep us enslaved - the fear of the unknown.

Fear of death keeps people quiet when they could reveal great secrets that would unveil the conspiracy; it makes people slaves of the medical profession and the priesthood who they look to keep them alive or ensure they are not heading for some eternal 'Hell'.

Any form of fear is limiting, but fear of death is spiritual and emotional Alcatraz.

I was frightened of dying when I was a kid and, even more so, frightened that my mother or father would die. My mother's ill health would leave me sick with worry when she was having one of her coughing fits that had to be seen to be believed when I was young.

My father was certainly frightened of death through fear of the unknown. He had been in the medical corps with the troops that moved up through Italy in the Second World War. In Naples, especially, he saw the abject poverty of the people amid the fantastic wealth of the Roman Church. It made him fiercely anti-religion for the rest of his days.

Unfortunately, he equated any idea of life after death with the religions he so despised and he missed the point that life after death is not connected to any religion ( my emphasis).

It just is, whether you wave a cross, pledge your life to 'Jesus' or think that religion is a load of old bollocks.

We have no need to seek eternal life, we already have it. It's a gimme.

What kind of eternal life is the question, and the answer is down to us, not some angry, vindictive, judgemental 'God'. The time was that my mother's death would have been devastating to me, the same with my father.

But as I awakened to the reality of 'life' and this illusory reality I began to change my perception of this vibrational passing, or transition, that we call death.

The true nature of 'death', in fact a seamless transition from life to life, was portrayed so well in the Robin Williams film, What Dreams May Come.

Our attachments to people and memories cause us to grieve and that's understandable.

My mind is full of re-emerging memories of my mother. I remember when I was small how she used to sing a song called 'The Little Boy that Santa Claus forgot' while she was polishing the stone floor. I would always cry and tell her that he could have my presents. She would laugh and say it was just a story.
I remember when I was small how my mother would usher me to hide with her behind the sofa when the door knocked sometimes.

She would indicate me to be quiet and still - 'Shhhhhhhhh!'. After a while, for a reason I didn't understand at the time, she would say it
was okay now. I later found out that those knocks were the rent man who we didn't have the money to pay some weeks. When
he didn't get a reply he would look in the front window - hence the need to hide.

I remember smacking the school dentist and making a run for it when he was about to apply the gas mask and how I was a hundred yards down the street with my mother in pursuit, shopping bag soldered to her arm as always, shouting for me to stop.

I remember the way she would step from the bus, her legs already moving before they touched the ground, to rush off through the town
from shop to shop as if someone had just shouted 'fire'. Whenever you went shopping with my mother you spent the entire time in her
slipstream, hair trailing backwards by the speed of movement.

I remember when I phoned, she would announce to the room that it was 'our Dave' and how she never really mastered the art of leaving
answerphone messages. Three times I pressed the button at home to find the message go 'Beep,beep, Yar'. What? Yar? What was 'Yar'?
It was then that I realised that she had started to speak before the recording began and what she actually said was 'I'm just ringing up
to see how y'are.'

Yes, there are so many memories and there will be many more. When a loved one goes they take something of you with them because of
the vibrational connection. There's a hole in your life that they once filled just by the knowledge that they were there.

'Birth and death are not two different states, but they are different aspects of the same state. There is as little reason to deplore
the one as there is to be pleased over the other.' - Mahatma Gandhi

So I grieve for the loss of the mother I have known for exactly 54 years this very day, April 29th 2006.

But what am I grieving for, what do we all grieve for in these circumstances? If we understand the nature of eternal 'life', or eternal 'awareness' as I prefer to call it, we grieve for ourselves that the person is no longer with us.

We may know that they live on, but they are no longer in the same
vibrational field, no longer sitting in the chair next to you or on the end of the phone.


It is only when we misunderstand the nature of 'life' that we grieve for those who have left us. For they have been released from the
limitation of bodily illusion and they are re-born into the realms of limitless freedom.

In truth, they never left it, the sense of division is part of the illusion in this bewildered reality.

My mother suffered from severe arthritis pain for decades, and I know myself what that is like. She suffered from a stream of serious health problems, especially after she was struck by a speeding driver some years ago. In latter times her body was constantly failing and her conscious mind flipped between awareness and confusion.

Why would anyone grieve for her when she has left that suffering to re-emerge in Paradise? I don't, for one. I am relieved that her
battle is over and that she suffers no more, much as I will miss her presence.

I have never met or read of anyone who has had a near-death experience who wanted to come back. There are now fantastic numbers
of documented accounts of people who have left their bodies at 'death' and witnessed reality beyond this realm, only for their body to be revived.

Dutch cardiologist Pim van Lommel produced a massive study of near-death experiences that supported the whole concept of life after the death, as well as raising questions about DNA, the collective unconscious, and the idea of 'karma'. His findings were published in the British medical journal, The Lancet.

Van Lommel's interest was sparked 35 years ago when a patient told him about her near-death experience. But his serious study
only began after he later read a book called Return from Tomorrow, in which the American doctor, George Ritchie, detailed his
own experience of 'near-death'.

Van Lommel began to ask all his patients if they remembered anything during their cardiac arrests.

These are just some of the accounts he recorded:

'I became "detached" from the body and hovered within and around it. It was possible to see the surrounding bedroom and my body
even though my eyes were closed. I was suddenly able to 'think' hundreds or thousands of times faster -and with greater
clarity-than is humanly normal or possible. At this point I realized and accepted that I had died. It was time to move on. It was a
feeling of total peace-completely without fear or pain, and didn't involve any emotions at all.'
'I was looking down at my own body from up above and saw doctors and nurses fighting for my life. I could hear what they were saying.
Then I got a warm feeling and I was in a tunnel. At the end of that tunnel was a bright, warm, white, vibrating light. It was beautiful.
It gave me a feeling of peace and confidence. I floated towards it. The warm feeling became stronger and stronger. I felt at home,
loved, nearly ecstatic. I saw my life flash before me. Suddenly I felt the pain of the accident once again and shot back into my body.
I was furious that the doctors had brought me back.'
'This experience is a blessing for me, for now I know for sure that body and soul are separated, and that there is life after death.

It has convinced me that consciousness lives on beyond the grave. Death is not death, but another form of life.'

'The body I observed laying in bed was mine, but I knew it wasn't time to leave. My time on earth wasn't up yet; there was still a purpose.'
'I saw a man who looked at me lovingly, but whom I did not know. At my mother's deathbed, she confessed to me that I had been born out of an extramarital relationship, my father being a Jewish man who had been deported and killed during the Second World War, and my mother showed me his picture. The unknown man that I had seen years before during my near-death experience turned out to be my biological father.'

The tunnel, the bliss, being met by long-gone loved ones, and the disappointment at having to come back are constant themes of near-death
experiences. Van Lommel said that when some people return they often have a sense of being imprisoned compared with the freedom
they had briefly experienced. Others say it transformed their lives and they all lose their fear of death.

This understanding would free everyone from this ultimate fear and that is why the Illuminati have systematically suppressed this knowledge.

They want the population in fear of death, in fear of everything, because that way they are easily controlled and manipulated.

Van Lommel says:

'The most important thing people are left with is that they are no longer afraid of death. This is because they have experienced that
their consciousness lives on, that there is continuity. Their life and their identity don't end when the body dies. They simply have the
feeling they're taking off their coat.'

Exactly, exactly.

The body computer is like a space suit that allows our consciousness to experience this reality. If I don't have an outer shell that
vibrates within the frequency field of this 'world' then I couldn't type these words. I would have no fingers and, even if I did, they would pass through the keys as radio waves pass through the walls. It is the computer that 'dies', not us - the eternal consciousness that we are and forever will be.

What passes through that 'tunnel', what makes the transition, is our consciousness, our awareness. The computer is buried or cremated,
not the awareness that lived within.

Van Lommel says of 'death':

'At that moment these people are not only conscious; their consciousness is even more expansive than ever. They can hink extremely clearly, have memories going back to their earliest childhood and experience an intense connection with everything and everyone around them. And yet the brain shows no activity at all!

'What is consciousness and where is it located? What is my identity? Who is doing the observing when I see my body down there on the operating table? What is life? What is death?'

All these questions can be answered in one short sentence: They are different states of awareness, that's all.

Van ommel points out that the brain does not produce consciousness or store memories.
He says that American computer science expert Simon Berkovich and Dutch brain researcher Herms Romijn, both working independently of one another,
found it was impossible for the brain to store even a fraction of our thoughts and experiences. And Van Lommel concludes from his research what I detailed in my last book and in previous newsletters. The body/brain is a
receiver/transmitter of information like a computer or television.

'You could compare the brain to a television set that tunes into specific electromagnetic waves and converts them into mage and sound. Our waking consciousness, the consciousness we have during our daily activities reduces all the information there is to a single truth that we experience as 'reality.' During near-death experiences, however, people are not limited to their bodies or their waking consciousness, which means they experience many more realities.'
All of which is precisely what I write in Infinite Love Is The Only Truth, Everything Else Is Illusion.

He even says that DNA, not least the 95% of so-called 'junk DNA' that 'science' knows nothing about, is a receiver/transmitter of information - the very foundation of my last book and the explanation of the Matrix and how we connect with it.

The DNA connects us to our eternal consciousness, awareness, which perceives this reality through the filter of the body/brain.

At 'death' our consciousness withdraws from this connection, or the connection is broken by a malfunctioning 'computer', and we return to our out-of-body awareness. This disconnection is represented by the 'tunnel' experience.

The truth is coming out at last.

We are not our bodies, we are consciousness, awareness. It is this that is released atwhat we call 'death' to experience the limitless freedom that awaits us all beyond the 'laws' of this manipulated illusion.

Van Lommel says:

'I now see that everything stems from consciousness. I better understand that you create your own reality based on the consciousness you have and the intention from which you live. I understand that consciousness is the basis of life, and that life is principally about compassion, empathy and love.'
Yes it is. Infinite love is the only truth - everything else is illusion.

My mother did not die a few days ago. My mother cannot die. Her biological computer ceased to operate and her infinite, eternal consciousness departed to whence it came. When her family's computers do the same we will be reunited in awareness and have a bloody good laugh at what we all did, thought and said while caught in this web of illusory disconnection.

At the end of last week's newsletter, I used this quote by Chang Tzu:

'The birth of a man is the birth of his sorrow. The longer he lives, the more stupid he becomes, because his anxiety to avoid unavoidable death becomes more and more acute. What bitterness! He lives for what is always out of reach! His thirst for survival in the future makes him incapable of living in the present.'

How appropriate to repeat it here.

Our fear of death, and the fear of the death of those we love, ensures that we cease to 'live' life and instead, consciously and subconsciously, fear the inevitable death.

But it's NOT inevitable, for it does not exist, except in our deluded perception.

There is only life, only awareness.

So do not thirst to survive, thirst to live, to be joyous at this incredible revelation. In truth, there is only love. It is only in untruth that anything else exists.

Bye, bye mother and thanks for everything.

But, then, it's not the long goodbye, it's the no goodbye.

For I know you are there, but a vibration away, and we will meet again awareness to awareness when my work is done here. I know you are reunited with my Dad and he is telling you that life is not like you thought it was. I bet you're having a right old giggle.

As you would say in your unforgettable Leicester accent ...'Yer what? Yer mean it wont real?'

But some things never change and I can see it now as I float along that tunnel and a smiling face appears to me.

'Hey-up, it's our Dave, do you want a cup a tea?'
'Yes, mother, that would be great. How have you been?'
'Eternal, Dave, just eternal. Welcome home, mate.'

harris999
02-09-2007, 12:47 AM
Awesome, exactly the thing i was looking for.

hagbard_celine
02-09-2007, 11:58 AM
Well said.:) That's a wonderful post!

infinitely free
02-09-2007, 03:01 PM
Mmm, interesting, indeed...!

lydia78
02-09-2007, 04:32 PM
Thankyou for this wonderful post seanx:)

kashmirz
02-09-2007, 04:52 PM
http://media.putfile.com/memento-mori---kamelot-

seanx
02-09-2007, 08:27 PM
Here is some more stuff from Pim van Lommel, quoted
by dave icke in his article


About the Continuity of Our Consciousness

Pim van Lommel,
Cardiologist, Division of Cardiology, Hospital Rijnstate, PO Box 9555, 6800 TA Arnhem, The Netherlands

Some people who have survived a life-threatening crisis report an extraordinary experience.

Near-death experiences (NDE) occur with increasing frequency because of improved survival rates resulting from modern techniques of resuscitation.

The content of NDE and the effects on patients seem similar worldwide, across all cultures and times.

The subjective nature and absence of a frame of reference for this experience lead to individual, cultural, and religious factors determining the vocabulary used to describe and interpret the experience. NDE can be defined as the reported memory of the whole of impressions during a special state of consciousness, including a number of special elements such as out-of-body experience, pleasant feelings, seeing a tunnel, a light, deceased relatives, or a life review.

Many circumstances are described during which NDE are reported, such as cardiac arrest (clinical death), shock after loss of blood, traumatic brain injury or intra-cerebral haemorrhage, near-drowning or asphyxia, but also in serious diseases not immediately life-threatening. Similar experiences to near-death ones can occur during the terminal phase of illness, and are called deathbed visions.

Furthermore, identical experiences, so-called “fear-death” experiences, are mainly reported after situations in which death seemed unavoidable like serious traffic or mountaineering accidents. The NDE is transformational, causing profound changes of life-insight and loss of the fear of death. An NDE seems to be a relatively regularly occurring, and to many physicians an inexplicable phenomenon and hence an ignored result of survival in a critical medical situation.

And should we also consider the possibility of conscious experience when someone in coma has been declared brain dead by physicians, and organ transplantation is about to be started?

Recently several books were published in the Netherlands about what patients had experienced in their consciousness during coma following a severe traffic accident, following acute disseminated encephalomyelitis (ADEM), or following complications with cerebral hypertension after surgery for a brain tumour, this last patient being declared brain dead by his neurologist and neurosurgeon, but the family refused to give permission for organ donation.

All these patients reported, after regaining consciousness, that they had experienced clear consciousness with memories, emotions, and perception out of and above their body during the period of their coma, also “seeing” nurses, physicians and family in and around the ICU. Does brain death really means death, or is it just the beginning of the process of dying that can last for hours to days, and what happens to consciousness during this period?

Should we also consider the possibility that someone who is clinically dead during cardiac arrest can experience consciousness, and even whether there could still be consciousness after someone really has died, when his body is cold?
How is consciousness related to the integrity of brain function? Is it possible to gain insight in this relationship? In my view the only possible empirical approach to evaluate theories about consciousness is research on NDE, because in studying the several universal elements that are reported during NDE, we get the opportunity to verify all the existing theories about consciousness that have been discussed until now. Consciousness presents temporal as well as everlasting experiences. Is there a start or an end to consciousness?

In this paper I first will discuss some more general aspects of death, and after that I will describe more details from our prospective study on near-death experience in survivors of cardiac arrest in the Netherlands, which was published in the Lancet.1 I also want to comment on similar findings from two prospective studies in survivors of cardiac arrest from the USA2 and from the United Kingdom.3 Finally, I will discuss implications for consciousness studies, and how it could be possible to explain the continuity of our consciousness-----

First I want to discuss death.

The confrontation with death raises many basic questions, also for physicians.

Why are we afraid of death?

Are our concepts about death correct? Most of us believethat death is the end of our existence; we believe that it is the end of everything we are.

We believe that the death of our body is the end of our identity, the end of our thoughts and memories, that it is the end of our consciousness.

Do we have to change our concepts about death, not only based on what has been thought and written about death in human history around the world in many cultures, in many religions, and in all times, but also based on insights from recent scientific research on NDE?

What happens when I am dead? What is death?

During our life 500000 cells die each second, each day about 50 billion cells in our body are replaced, resulting in a new body each year. So cell death is totally different from body death when you eventually die.

During our life our body changes continuously, each day, each minute, each second. Each year about 98% of our molecules and atoms in our body have been replaced. Each living being is in an unstable balance of two opposing processes of continual disintegration and integration. But no one realizes this constant change. And from where comes the continuity of our continually changing body?

Cells are just the building blocks of our body, like the bricks of a house, but who is the architect, who coordinates the building of this house. When someone has died, only mortal remains are left: only matter.

But where is the director of the body?What about our consciousness when we die? Is someone his body, or do we “have” a body?




For more information :
http://http://www.iands.org/

http://http://www.iands.org/research/important_studies/dr._pim_van_lommel_m.d._continuity_of_consciousnes s.html

hagbard_celine
04-09-2007, 09:18 AM
http://www.jamesw.clara.net/

Whoops! Bang goes James Webster's Materialist Bravery Medal!

Is it just me who feels this way? The debate over life-after-death has become empty and pointless for several reasons, most notably because it has become blighted by machismo. This is certainly what I've noticed in my Spritiualist discussion group. Those who don't believe in it strut around the room with their chests out, swaggering with their thumbs in their pockets like John Wayne, and for a very good reason:

If you reject the concept of survival-of-death then you are set up for life! The street-cred it gives you will carry you through scientific and philosphical circles as a hero, a brave, hard-headed warrior who has the guts to face the "awful truth of the finality of existance which the feeble, huddling masses dare not, hiding beneath their comforting blanket of religion." I bet they get laid more than the mystics do! :rolleyes:

I wonder how many of the macho-men actually do believe in life-after-death, but won't speak out about it because they're afraid of being called wimps! It's all a bit childish to me, rather like kids showing of their muscle in the playground.

Materialist are like the big cool lads who never get picked on, win everything at sports day and date the prettiest girls in the class. Whereas the LAD-believers are the litle boy wjho still plays with teddy bears and wants his mum to walk him to school every day. "Neeah!!! I bet James Webster wears girls' clothes when he's at home!"

gordonfreeman
04-09-2007, 10:11 AM
James Webster? Who the hell is he?

So, are you saying that we should keep it to ourselves?

hagbard_celine
04-09-2007, 10:34 AM
James Webster? Who the hell is he?

So, are you saying that we should keep it to ourselves?

Keep what to ourselves?:confused:

James Webster wrote the book "Life Forever" which supports the case for life-after-death.

synergy777
04-09-2007, 11:53 AM
good article, but its not new data. many people have knew this for thousands of years. maya, reincarnation, karma, krishna, buddha etc.

seanx
04-09-2007, 12:33 PM
good article, but its not new data. many people have knew this for thousands of years. maya, reincarnation, karma, krishna, buddha etc

It's not about new data or new information - it's about iinternalizing
it - KNOWING IT - not just reading about it or believing it.

This field of research is vital.

In fact, it is the KEY to 'defeating' the Illuminati or the Elite
whatever term you use.

This is why they maintain total control of all the religions and
'modern' sciences.

We must never KNOW that we are ETERNAL AWARENESS
- that nothing can really happen to us - other wise
THEIR power- the FEAR they have over us - will vanish
overnight.

Imagine I'm a young journalist - with a great breaking story
about THEIR activities.

Look the sad truth is: 80%, probably 90% of journalists and their
editors, and especially their owners will not publish because they
will be TERRIFIED to hell what will happened to them when they
are killed.

And they know they will be killed.

This is not a critiicism of them. Most of us would do the same.
We'd find some way to rationalize ourselves OUT
of the story.

Why:

Numbing Fear.

Stomach-turning Terror.

That terrible naseau of not knowing what will happen to us ......
and to our families, if they kill us.

The fear of the void. Of the nothinglessness THEIR
sciences tell you you will experience.

Now imagine we knew and our families knew without a doubt
that life/awareness was continuous....we'd just change
form and from one dimension to another and that we could still just
as easily communicate with our loved ones..and tell them
of the great dimension I'm in now....EVERYTHING would change!

Fear would go and the truth would tumble out effortlessly.

The main power source of the Elite's FEAR over us would
be gone.

That why this research is continuously ridiculed - by 'our' scientists
and why churches like the catholic church ban mediums etc, saying
they are the work of the devil.

The OBJECTIVE is to make sure people NEVER KNOW FOR A FACT
( as a DIRECT experience) that death is nothing.

But the information is tumbling out - like water breaking out
from a dam - and now there is nothing they can do about it.

But they are trying: is this the real reason for the sudden burst
of books like dawkins book and Tv series and all the other books
questioning the existence of God ( i.e. really implying: No God = no life
after death)

is that their real objective?

lydia78
04-09-2007, 01:19 PM
True seanx...in the old days death was an accepted part of the life process,

we honoured our ancestors and did not fear death

The 'advances' in the west have helped create this fear

The search for the fountain of youth creates a resistance to age with

dignity, plastic surgery et al ensure that a person can hold back the outer

years but this symptom of vaniety also stretches into a very real fear of

death

Medical science and their contradictory views of NDE and OBE's creates

confusion, makes one doubt one's own intuition of death

we have on one hand Dr's saying 'yes this is real' on the other we are told

this phenomena is a result of the brain switching off and chemical reaction.

Death in the west also means material security is at risk for those who are l

eft behind creating more fear and confusion for those trapped in this illusion.

The rise of atheism, the dawkins factor, empirical science over experience,

I agree, the resistance to understand our spiritual heritage is a major control

factor to keep people in conditioned fear which in turn blocks our intuitive

processes and link to the 'other side'.

Our inner peace, our higher knowing that we continue on, strength and self

empowerment becomes replaced by fear that creates disharmony within our

being so we continue to run on the treadmill of the material plane running

from our own destiny, continually seeking the outer world to compensate for

our fear of death.

By realising we continue on, we become empowered, our intuition and

connection to those who have passed over becomes strong and clairfied, the

fear evaporates.....no wonder the nwo isn't keen, as you said The main

power source of the Elite's FEAR over us would be gone.

thirdwave
04-09-2007, 01:27 PM
its just like a flower.... your sprout... you grow.. you fade... then you sprout again... i think the only reason we don't remember our last sprouts is because we are dragged away from it.... when you think back to when you are really really young you are so much more in touch with who you are.... and you probably remember all sorts of stuff but it fades as we get older....

h1s_l0rdsh1p
04-09-2007, 02:27 PM
What abuot taking your life?

synergy777
04-09-2007, 03:53 PM
Moksha - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

In Hinduism, liberation occurs when the individual soul (human mind/spirit) or jīvatman recognizes its identity with the Ground of all being - the Source of all phenomenal existence known as Brahman

Bhakti sees God as the most worshippable object of love, most often a personified monotheistic conception of Vishnu. Unlike in Abrahamic traditions, this monotheism does not prevent a Hindu from worship of other aspects of God, beings or teachers, as they are all seen as rays from a single source./B]

http://www.experiencefestival.com/sikhism_life_after_death

Sikhism Life After Death: Hindu - Hinduism Dictionary on Reincarnation

reincarnation: "Re-entering the flesh." Punarjanma; metempsychosis. The process wherein souls take on a physical body through the birth process.

Reincarnation is one of the fundamental principles of Hindu spiritual insight, shared by the mystical schools of nearly all religions, including Jainism, Sikhism, Buddhism (and [B]even by Christianity until it was cast out by the Nicene Council in 787). It is against the backdrop of this principle of the soul's enjoying many lives that other aspects of Hinduism can be understood. It is a repetitive cycle, known as punarjanma, which originates in the subtle plane (Antarloka), the realm in which souls live between births and return to after death. Here they are assisted in readjusting to the "in-between" world and eventually prepared for yet another birth.

This condition of release is called moksha. Then the soul continues to evolve and mature, but without the need to return to physical existence. How many earthly births must one have to attain the unattainable? Many thousands to be sure, hastened by righteous living, tapas, austerities on all levels, penance and good deeds in abundance

Sikhism Life After Death: Dharma in Hinduism - The Hindu Dharma

What is Dharma? Dharma is so called, because it holds; Dharma alone holds the people, etc. The word Dharma is derived from the root Dhr - to hold - and its etymological meaning is - that which holds - this world, or the people of the world, or the whole creation from the microcosm to the macrocosm.


http://www.sikhiwiki.org/index.php/Bhakti

“He that is immanent in the Universe resides also within yourself. Seek, and ye shall find” (GG 695)

http://www.sikhs.org/guru3.htm

The Sikhs questioned him saying; "O Master, you have instructed us, 'fear not death, for it comes to all' and 'the Guru and the God-man are beyond the pale of birth and death', why did you then gallop past the collapsing wall?" Guru Amar Das replied; "Our body is the embodiment of God's light. It is through the human body that one can explore one's limitless spiritual possibilities. Demi-god's envy the human frame. One should not, therefore, play with it recklessly. One must submit to the Will of God, when one's time is over, but not crave death, nor invite it without a sufficient and noble cause. It is self surrender for the good of man that one should seek, not physical annihilation. "

http://www.sikhspectrum.com/102002/man.htm
This world according to Sikhism, is "the abode of God", hence real and not illusory as held by most Indian metaphysical systems. ( its construction, ignorance is the illusion), but pain, love, etc is real.

The three main currents of metaphysical thought that held their sway during Guru Nanak's time (1469 - 1526 AD) all held the world of appearance to be maya. The term maya originally denoted, "the power of a god or demon to deceive, to change form, to do trickery and magic and create illusion

In the Sikh lore, however, the doctrine of maya thus described does not find acceptance. Just as ignorance has no positive existence (being merely the aspect of the self-limited involuted spirit) so too is maya basically without any positive existence.

What is maya? What does it do?
Maya is one's being bound to pleasure and pain
And acting through one's individual ego. (SGGS: 67:4)

Though the world is ephemeral, yet within certain confines and rules it has its own reality, its own truth:

"True are Thy worlds, true the universe,
True Thy regions and true the forms.
True Thy acts and Thy thought
safflower, True Thy command and true Thy Court,
True is Thy Will, Thy utterance true.
True is Thy grace, true Thy sigh.
Myriads simply call Thee Truth.
True is Thy power, true Thy Majesty.
True is Thy grace, Thy laudation true.
O True Monarch, true is Thy dominion." (SGGS: 463:6)


The Sikh idealism is not, then, the subjective idealism of Vedanta in the sense that things existing in space and enduring in time are nothing but illusory appearances created by maya, the creative power of Brahman. Nor is it the realism of the kind that holds that physical objects exist independently of being perceived. It has a position somewhere between these two. It holds first of all that the phenomena have a noumenal source which in itself is unknowable, but can be inferred from the experience of phenomena.

Haumai or egoity comes to occupy the centre of all his activities:

"With ego doth one come, with ego doth one depart.
With ego was one born, with ego would one die
In ego doth one give, in ego doth receive.
In ego doth one earn, in ego doth one squander.
In ego is one truthful, in ego liar becomes.
In ego doth one discriminate sinfulness from virtue..."(SGGS: 466:10)

Although the manmukh is engrossed in the pursuit of evil, yet every object around him - the winds that blow and the rivers that flow and the stars that glow, and rain and hail and snow - seems to whisper a message of God and in silent voice affirm a prescence of his Creator both within and around him:

"He the limitless One, is within us as also without.
Pervades He in each and every heart.
He is on the earth, in the sky and the underworld.
Fills and sustains the universe entire." (SGGS: 293:18)

Through "Naam-simran" or practice of the prescence of God, one is imbued with a great spiritual confidence ("Chaardhi-kala") and feels as Guru Nanak declared:

"God does not die so I fear not death,
Indestructable is He, so I fret not.
He is not poor, nor am I in want.
He isn't grief, nor am I in trouble.
Except Him none can destroy." (SGGS: 391:1)

Conclusion

In conclusion one may say that in this world which is the "temple for practising righteousness", man has the sole opportunity of realizing his real self (atma) which is identical with cosmic consciousness. This he can do by subduing his empirical ego (haumai) which stands between him and God and which is the cause of all evil.

seanx
04-09-2007, 04:08 PM
lydia 78 wrote:

I agree, the resistance to understand our spiritual heritage is a major control

factor to keep people in conditioned fear which in turn blocks our intuitive

processes and link to the 'other side'.

Our inner peace, our higher knowing that we continue on, strength and self

empowerment becomes replaced by fear that creates disharmony within our

being so we continue to run on the treadmill of the material plane running

from our own destiny, continually seeking the outer world to compensate for

our fear of death.

By realising we continue on, we become empowered, our intuition and

connection to those who have passed over becomes strong and clairfied, the

fear evaporates.....no wonder the nwo isn't keen, as you said The main

power source of the Elite's FEAR over us would be gone.

Very well put.

By totally serving the link to intuition - we become totally lost
in this dimension - and soon believe it is all there is so -NATURALLY
we'll do anything to stay here.

it's here or the 'VOID' - so we do what we are told - or they'll
send us to the 'void'.

What if you take your own life?

Could it be as normal as if deciding to move from Dublin to live
in New York? Or from london to live in Melbourne?

Normal in the sense you are just moving 'locations'?

In the above example, 'moving' within the dimension - and in
other case moving to a different frequency dimension?

Will the day come when we will regard all this as quite normal?

albie
04-09-2007, 04:15 PM
What about the amounts of torture that can be applied to someone, let alone death.

You can't shut out the agony of someone prying your toe nails off.:D

synergy777
04-09-2007, 04:17 PM
or x factor trials, lol

seanx
04-09-2007, 04:43 PM
What about the amounts of torture that can be applied to someone, let alone death.

You can't shut out the agony of someone prying your toe nails off

Absolutely?

We know the body when in pain will produce huge amounts of
morphine - however -if the pain is too serve - we 'lose' consciousness.

I'm only speculating here - don't know - but this 'losing' consciousness
- is that, maybe - us 'leaving' our bodies - as reported in all these ND experiences?

In the future, will it be possible for us to consciously 'leave' our body
and let them do what they want to it?

And laugh at them, as they think they are 'destroying' us.

Might it be similar to guys who wreck your beautiful car. Yes, it's
terrible - but once you get safely out of the car and away from their
danger- you know there's always hundreds of more cars ( bodies? Dimensions?) to enjoy.

Not saying this is true - but definitely, in my opinion a strong
possibility.

lifeofbrian
04-09-2007, 07:41 PM
Last week a friend died.

I happened to give her this article by dave icke - and a few days
later she told me how it had really helped her and her family. Brought
them great joy.

It was written by dave icle last year on the death of his mother
- and I hope it's OK to reprint it here.

It can transform our attitude towards death- and when you lose
that fear - there is nothing anybody can do to you.

The power of the Elite will vanish quicker than putting a pin in a
balloon.

David Icke is very generous in sharing his private thoughts, I remember that article from last year. Good for him.

Imo, fear of life, in particular the future, seems just as common as a fear of death. It is, imo, too sad noticing people without any hope or resorting to dreams not really connected to the here and now, so how will they reach them. This fear of living can drive people to want to know everything before even setting out for real in life - as in finding out 'who am I' after the discovery 'I am I'. Only living life can tell someone who they are.

Too much apocalyptic literature should maybe be balanced with a healthy interest in life; dwelling on death and the hereafter is interesting but ultimately pointless if the life leading up to it is wasted.

Whatever animates a lifeform is energy. And energy is consciousness. When energy leaves a lifeform is goes somewhere. Everything that has ever lived on Earth, has 'died'. All that consciousness is 'somewhere'. A lot of what we call 'reptilians' or 'demons' are discarnate beings, human or other, still attached to wordly desires, and they can at times use the living to get their desires fulfilled. Energy recycled, lifetime after lifetime, growing consciousness hopefully, pretty much sums up life on Earth, imo.

Imo, people with certain belief systems and tempers end up with those of like mind and spirit in the hereafter. The opportunity on Earth is that of change and self-improvement. That determines where we end up, and with whom.

infinitely free
05-09-2007, 08:26 PM
Bhakti sees God as the most worshippable object of love, most often a personified monotheistic conception of Vishnu. Unlike in Abrahamic traditions, this monotheism does not prevent a Hindu from worship of [b]other aspects of God, beings or teachers, as they are all seen as rays from a single source./B]

That seems to be the case - and this 'single source' must really be the 'One' that David icke talks about!

pierre_jean
05-09-2007, 09:45 PM
http://img503.imageshack.us/img503/9069/802238293smallyn0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)

cruise4
06-09-2007, 06:58 AM
Eternal conciousness... yes. So re-incarnation occurs. Maybe its only the brave or those who previously inflicted pain and death themselves that suffer.

Live by the sword, die by the sword,
The meek shall inherit the Earth,

...that sort of thing.

But if you do go... aim for the light with all your might.

hagbard_celine
06-09-2007, 08:02 AM
It's not about new data or new information - it's about iinternalizing
it - KNOWING IT - not just reading about it or believing it.

This field of research is vital.

In fact, it is the KEY to 'defeating' the Illuminati or the Elite
whatever term you use.

This is why they maintain total control of all the religions and
'modern' sciences.

We must never KNOW that we are ETERNAL AWARENESS
- that nothing can really happen to us - other wise
THEIR power- the FEAR they have over us - will vanish
overnight.

Imagine I'm a young journalist - with a great breaking story
about THEIR activities.

Look the sad truth is: 80%, probably 90% of journalists and their
editors, and especially their owners will not publish because they
will be TERRIFIED to hell what will happened to them when they
are killed.

And they know they will be killed.

This is not a critiicism of them. Most of us would do the same.
We'd find some way to rationalize ourselves OUT
of the story.

Why:

Numbing Fear.

Stomach-turning Terror.

That terrible naseau of not knowing what will happen to us ......
and to our families, if they kill us.

The fear of the void. Of the nothinglessness THEIR
sciences tell you you will experience.

Now imagine we knew and our families knew without a doubt
that life/awareness was continuous....we'd just change
form and from one dimension to another and that we could still just
as easily communicate with our loved ones..and tell them
of the great dimension I'm in now....EVERYTHING would change!

Fear would go and the truth would tumble out effortlessly.

The main power source of the Elite's FEAR over us would
be gone.

That why this research is continuously ridiculed - by 'our' scientists
and why churches like the catholic church ban mediums etc, saying
they are the work of the devil.

The OBJECTIVE is to make sure people NEVER KNOW FOR A FACT
( as a DIRECT experience) that death is nothing.

But the information is tumbling out - like water breaking out
from a dam - and now there is nothing they can do about it.

But they are trying: is this the real reason for the sudden burst
of books like dawkins book and Tv series and all the other books
questioning the existence of God ( i.e. really implying: No God = no life
after death)

is that their real objective?

Yes. Very true. :) Really the spectre of our inevitable, impending death is the ultimate party-pooper. The fear of it can ruin someone's life. It demoralizes you and causes dispondancy. This is what the Illuminati want us to feel because when we're demoralized and dispondant we can be eaily manipulated! This is why they've hedged their bets onto both sides of the debate by controlling both organized religion and science.

lifeofbrian
06-09-2007, 11:57 AM
questioning the existence of God ( i.e. really implying: No God = no life
after death)



Since when does 'God' = life after death?

Primitive cultures have always known that there is life after death. Way before any missionary set foot on their land and started rambling about some 'God'.

They knew communication came from/were with passed ancestors and other living-in-the-hereafter things, and that they tapped into that field of awareness.

They didn't make it (the 'dead') their 'God' though. Like some.

Jesus called; he wants his religion back.

hagbard_celine
08-09-2007, 10:42 AM
Since when does 'God' = life after death?

Primitive cultures have always known that there is life after death. Way before any missionary set foot on their land and started rambling about some 'God'.

They knew communication came from/were with passed ancestors and other living-in-the-hereafter things, and that they tapped into that field of awareness.

They didn't make it (the 'dead') their 'God' though. Like some.

Jesus called; he wants his religion back.

The missionaries wanted to replace the true gnostic knowlege of Shamanism with a superstitious organized cult. A God that doesn't exist makes LAD conditional. You can get to heaven, but only if you believe this cult and do as the priests tell you!:rolleyes:

lydia78
08-09-2007, 11:13 AM
Since when does 'God' = life after death?

Primitive cultures have always known that there is life after death. Way before any missionary set foot on their land and started rambling about some 'God'.

They knew communication came from/were with passed ancestors and other living-in-the-hereafter things, and that they tapped into that field of awareness.



They didn't make it (the 'dead') their 'God' though. Like some.

Jesus called; he wants his religion back.




Your right

indigienous people lived according to and in harmony with the cycles of life

and death, the native americans whose lifestyle has been romanticised

in recent years lived with death every day, it was this direct experience

that breathed acceptance of the cycle of life and death for these

people.....their cermonies, rituals to honour the great spirit and in the

hours of a person passing over to assist in the transformation of the soul

to the spirit world was all about honour and respect of the life force.

They understood the cycle.

Their intuition and knowledge of the death process is intact

unlike the west, who have been raised to fear death,

as hagbard says the missionary's and their conditional faith of

heaven and hell drove the minds and hearts of the masses to see

the creator as divided and not whole as the indigious people do.

Religious constructs talk about an outer heaven and hell.

Yet these are forces we create within ourselves.

Science, religion, materialism are the dominate forces in the west,

the lowerself was borne out of these attributes which divide the human spirit,

in the best case they live a comfortably numb life,

in the extreme there is no saying...

personally I see fear of death as a symptom of disconnection from our

intuition, our trust and belief in our own soul distegrates if we overide our

inner knowing with outside constructs as above

which in itself breeds nothing but fear.

and we all know what fear can go do!!;)

lifeofbrian
08-09-2007, 11:33 AM
Well put, Ms Lydia. :)

lifeofbrian
08-09-2007, 11:34 AM
The missionaries wanted to replace the true gnostic knowlege of Shamanism with a superstitious organized cult. A God that doesn't exist makes LAD conditional. You can get to heaven, but only if you believe this cult and do as the priests tell you!:rolleyes:

Spot on mate.

bigus_dickus
08-09-2007, 01:28 PM
life and death are not separate. there is no birth, there is no death. these concepts exist only for the ego. the mind that is dependent on time, is the builder of the ego, a 'virtual self' as i call it, that is driven by fear and anxiety, that believes, that has its own virtual life in which it was born and in which it dies.

the ego is proud and this is its main fault. every nation, every administration wants the ego to be proud, or to strive to be proud by any means necessary. that's why they indoctrinate. they teach young minds that their goal is to be proud. proud of their race and origin, proud of their 'heritage', their history, proud of their color, proud of their nation, proud of themselves, proud of their material possessions, proud of their intellect, proud of their siblings, proud of their spirituality. a proud ego is die hard, it will fight, it will resist, it will persist, it will obey, for the wrong reasons.

as life should be lived to the fullest, to its infinite potential of joy, to every single moment of existence, not in loops caused by beliefs and time, not in sleep and unconsciousness that equals death, which makes a life wasted and not lived, the same way death should be celebrated and enjoyed, not feared and mourned.

a life worth living is a death worth dieing.

seanx
08-09-2007, 01:34 PM
Since when does 'God' = life after death?

Primitive cultures have always known that there is life after death. Way before any missionary set foot on their land and started rambling about some 'God'.

Of course not.

But the Elite are playing games with the minds of the 'mass public'
- the mass consciousness which, through past conditioning usually
equates the whole God business with life after death etc.

Primitive cultures as lydia78 and hagbard_celine have pointed out
know it - but all these books and the newspaper articles based on
them are aimed not at them but at Joe Public in Milton Keynes.

lifeofbrian
08-09-2007, 01:37 PM
Cheers, glad that's sorted out then, seanx.

Have a nice weekend.

lifeofbrian
08-09-2007, 01:39 PM
[...]

the ego is proud and this is its main fault. every nation, every administration wants the ego to be proud, or to strive to be proud by any means necessary. that's why they indoctrinate. they teach young minds that their goal is to be proud. proud of their race and origin, proud of their 'heritage', their history, proud of their color, proud of their nation, proud of themselves, proud of their material possessions, proud of their intellect, proud of their siblings, proud of their spirituality. a proud ego is die hard, it will fight, it will resist, it will persist, it will obey, for the wrong reasons.

[...]

"Vanity, vanity, all is vanity." --paraphrased, some fellow says in the Bible, or somewhere.

Hard to disagree.