David plz explain.....

[yvonne]

You say in chapter 7 in the 4th last paragraph ...That 'New Agers' talk of oneness but use polarity,that they believe in the existence of 'light' and 'dark', that these create each other, that in order to believe in 'light' we have to believe in 'dark' so we can distinguish the two.....and you go on to say that there is no light or dark as there is no good or bad, male or female that they are all illusions, that everything is one...But yet the name of the book is 'Infinite Love Is The Only Truth, Everything Else Is Illusion'....

My question is ...How would I know 'love' without 'hate'?...Is that not part of the SAME thing you just wrote about?

I would not know love without hate.

[Anders Lindman]

There has to be contrasts for experiences to be experienced so to speak. If everything would be light, then light would not be visible for example.

So there are always polarities, but the polarities are never exactly balanced. If they were, then there would never be any change at all.

[yvonne]

There has to be contrasts for experiences to be experienced so to speak. If everything would be light, then light would not be visible for example.

So there are always polarities, but the polarities are never exactly balanced. If they were, then there would never be any change at all.


I'm sorry Anders, but I don't get it :(....I'm not the one who wrote what he wrote....I'm just saying that I, or anyone for that matter, would not know love without hate, I'm not saying he's wrong or a fraud (so ppl don't get your panties in a bunch :)) It is good to question things..Is it not?..especially when it doesn't make sense.

[Anders Lindman]

I'm sorry Anders, but I don't get it :(....I'm not the one who wrote what he wrote....I'm just saying that I, or anyone for that matter, would not know love without hate, I'm not saying he's wrong or a fraud (so ppl don't get your panties in a bunch :)) It is good to question things..Is it not?..especially when it doesn't make sense.

Hopefully David will explain more in his new book. My own view is that there has to be polarities, but that they are never in balance.

[john white]

Its neither "right" or "wrong" to percieve duality or to percieve Oneness: becuase its all perception:

The question is: where does that perception place us?

How we choose to percieve existence is also how we choose to relate to existance:

What empowers us? What fullfills us? What allows us to more fully be the best of what we can be: the best of what we are

"Hate" for example, is neither the opposite of Love or a nessacary part of understanding Love:

Hate is simply how we are left percieving ourselves when our perception of Love has become weak: which we then project into the world, usually onto what we believe has weakened out perception of how we would like to be

This is, of course, becuase we forget it is always our choice

[tinmenace]

I don't agree that you have to know hate to know love. They're not opposites.

A baby (or young child) knows love without ever having known hate. Hate is a conditioned response. Love is natural and infinite.

[Anders Lindman]

Another interesting opposite is 'here' vs 'there'. But that is not the same as 'here' vs 'not here'. :confused: :)

[eternal_spirit]

Another interesting opposite is 'here' vs 'there'. But that is not the same as 'here' vs 'not here'. :confused: :)

:D I think I am I THINK therefore I am I think I must be I think.

[phoebe]

Love and hate are human emotions.
We live in dualistic reality...
Whereas one must experience hate to know love and vice versa.
However, the 'ultimate reality' (god) is oneness.
When the universe is broken down into it's tiniest parts
We see that everything is made of the same stuff.
No duality there.
Just oneness.
'Infinite love' is term interchangeable with
god/infinite potential/creative source/the one/all that is
And has nothing to do with human emotions of love/hate
(Apart from that it contains them).
:)

[Anders Lindman]

:D I think I am I THINK therefore I am I think I must be I think.

That's another good example. "I am" vs "I am not". Is that really a polarity? :confused:

[eternal_spirit]

That's another good example. "I am" vs "I am not". Is that really a polarity? :confused:

Seems so, two opposites.. It's like how I feel at the moment, I am tired mentally ( it's 3am )
I am not tired physically, but maybe that's different. I need to read the original question to this thread. If I can get my head around it.:rolleyes:

[barbitone]

Polarity would be like 1 as to -1 but what your talking about in terms of love vs fear or light vs darkness is actually 1 as to 0. Darkness doesn't exist because it's actually a description of something that is not; ie light. Where there is not light there is darkness.... Fear also does not exist except as a description of a lack of that which IS, which is love ie;connectedness\onesness...

In truth all there is, is light\love\oneness\god. Anything other than that is an illusion created by the lack of it, not anything separate from it so to speak.

[lemonique]

I don't agree that you have to know hate to know love. They're not opposites.

A baby (or young child) knows love without ever having known hate. Hate is a conditioned response. Love is natural and infinite.





You are correct in saying that Love and Hate are not opposites.
In my understanding the opposite of Love is Indifference.

Love
Lemonique

[Anders Lindman]

Polarity would be like 1 as to -1 but what your talking about in terms of love vs fear or light vs darkness is actually 1 as to 0. Darkness doesn't exist because it's actually a description of something that is not; ie light. Where there is not light there is darkness.... Fear also does not exist except as a description of a lack of that which IS, which is love ie;connectedness\onesness...

In truth all there is, is light\love\oneness\god. Anything other than that is an illusion created by the lack of it, not anything separate from it so to speak.

Yes, that sounds similar to David Icke's description. Another example is that when we have light and darkness occupying the same space, then light wins.

[1 2 free]

Darkness is not the opposite of light, it's the absence of light. The absense of love is fear.

PS I know barbitone said this already but I already typed it so I'm posting it anyway. :p :D

[mightiswrong]

In the past you were discussing Reality as an idea, and so the idea became to you the
Truth, when it was not the Truth.”
I knew that now, for my friend very soon disposed of that fallacy with the first few
words he said to me: “It does not matter very much whether it was true or not.”
What I had was not the Real---and I knew it at that very moment, and I said so.
“True, my son.” he affirmed.
Then he went on: “Nearly all literature on Truth or philosophies discusses Reality as an
idea. Reality is Life, and the mind cannot conceive what It is, therefore it is useless trying to
make an idea of Life. But when you see that an idea is but an imitation, a mental concept, it dies
away. Then Life that is ever-present becomes a Reality in you. You do not create It; what you
create is not Reality. Reality is not an idea or a mental formulation but an actual Livingness
expressing Itself in Love and affection. As long as you have merely an idea of It you will never
know or experience It.
“You must realise, my son, that you live because Reality lives. Reality is Life---the
Unknown is Life, and Life is creative; you do not know what Life is but you know that It is.”
“Yes,” I said, “I do now know that It is, I am the Life.”
“Yes,” he interrupted, “provided you do not try to make an idea of It. You see, my son,
if your prayers arise merely from an idea or a belief which is your own conditioning they
amount to nothing. This conditioning must cease to be, before the Unknown comes into Being.
“You must never lose yourself in philosophy or question another on that which can be
realised only by yourself. You see, my son, if I would philosophise to you about the wonders
of Reality you would only build up an idea of Reality. But you can never give expression to
Reality through an idea, only through the action of Love and affection.
“You do not know what Love is, but you can experience Love. Possessiveness is not
Love. Love is Eternal and Ever-present, whereas possessive love comes to an end.
“God is the Unknown and cannot be known. The moment you think you know God it
is not God you know, but an idea of God---a projected image which hinders the discovery of
the Unknown.”
“Yes, I can see that,” I said, “at first I was afraid to throw away the false. My mind
always wanted something to hang on to. But when I saw how false it all was and how my
ignorance blinded me to the falseness of it, the false fell away. The freedom I felt was beyond
words. I was no longer caught up in beliefs, in ideas; and my fears dissolved as I saw they
were my own creations.”
http://www.traveluzion.com/macdonald-bayne/Beyond-The-Himalayas.pdf

[earthseed]

Perhaps the work of Bentov might help you answer this question? He talks of the void which is nothing but pure energy and that this dualistic reality is the manifest creation which is vibrating out of it. So it's the illusion projected by some parts of the void? The void I think is what David refers to as oneness. There's the old saying that love and hate are actually quite similar both are strong feelings. Look at the great fictional romances of our time the characters usually started out hating each other but secretly loving each other at the same time.

[sentient]

I don't agree that you have to know hate to know love. They're not opposites.

A baby (or young child) knows love without ever having known hate. Hate is a conditioned response. Love is natural and infinite.





Amen. And because of all of our conditioning we begin to only see things in duality. We forget Oneness. On the other hand, "human" love is nothing more than a programme, as with hate, so we end up forming opinions and feelings based on that instead of Infinite Love, which is more than a feeling. It's a force. It's the pure nature of being. And in contrast to this pure love, everything else is an illusion. :)

[sentient]

Darkness is not the opposite of light, it's the absence of light. The absense of love is fear.

Correct. And when people say "love hurts" they fail to recognize that it's the ABSENCE of it, not love itself.

[Anders Lindman]

Christianity is my favorite religion at the moment. Here is an awesome quote:

"The eye is the lamp of the body. If your eyes are good, your whole body will be full of light. But if your eyes are bad, your whole body will be full of darkness. If then the light within you is darkness, how great is that darkness!" -- Matthew 6 (New International Version)

[john white]

Correct. And when people say "love hurts" they fail to recognize that it's the ABSENCE of it, not love itself.

Even more, its looking for love outside of oneself and failing to secure it. Inner Love NEVER hurts

[Anders Lindman]

Even more, its looking for love outside of oneself and failing to secure it. Inner Love NEVER hurts

We need to develop that inner light. It will then shine from within and light up the whole world!

[tejas]

This is a very good question that I do not think Icke has explained well.

We most know what 'love' is to be able to define it. It is certainly not 'I love you darling, fancy a quickie?' that much is clear.

Firstly, all of you who say that Love is this and that, well you are merely talking about a human emotion. If everything is infinite love that means an ant can feel infinite love, but an ant does not have the mental brain capacity to feel 'love' as we feel 'love'.

What you are describing as 'love' is merely a human emotion. I do not know the exact chemicals involved in 'love' but regardless to say that it is indeed a chemical process in the brain that allows you to feel 'love'. That doesn't make it real or unreal, the experience is still there.

Looking at it from an entirely scientific point of view, our idea of 'love' or 'agape' or whatever is simply another 'survival' drive mechanism. When you 'love' someone you care about them or whatever, you are experiencing an enhanced 'survival' drive.

Both love and hate are merely survival drives as is fear. If something is productive towards survival, it is 'lovely' if something is dangerous you 'fear' it so as to enhance your survival. And if something is 'hurtful' you hate it.

Love is essentially a form of 'union' but how can there be 'union' without 'separation'? You can only unite if you are separate to begin with. However we are not separate and we a not united, we are infinite.

I do not agree with the above post that 'hate' is a programmed by society, hate is pre-programmed in the dna sequence.

So a better term would be;

Infinite, INFINITE is the only truth - everything else is illusion.

Both love and hate, and fear exist only in a dualistic view of things.

Quick edit:
One thing I have noticed is that Icke rarely talks about us as being infinite 'love' but he uses the term infinite 'consciousness' which I think is a totally correct term and truer to the source.

[tejas]

Even more, its looking for love outside of oneself and failing to secure it. Inner Love NEVER hurts


The thing is, if you are talking about pleasure and pain, hurtful and lovely, you are again talking in dualistic terms.