Me, Myself and I. On and on and on.

[lifeofbrian]

That is not enlightenment.
That is not "being awake".
That is a classic ego trip.

Those "awake" care about social problems and other people.
They are not afraid of "negativity".
They do not waste their time polishing that which is not broken - just to see their own reflection.

Wake up.

[soglad]

Ok, since you obviously know us all very well personally, let me know more about you, since you're obviously the shining light of truth. What have you done in your life that would constitute this type of critique.

I'm not egotistical, in fact I'm quite opposite, I reject the ego. I try my best in my daily life to make people happy and I do this quite successfully. Please try not come on here trying to tell us all not to be who we are. This is not ego, this is soul.

This "not caring about social problems" thing. Can you just read that for one moment? What are the social problems? Ignorant people, drug addicts, scumbags, wars, killings and poverty? I'm afraid that by saying it is OUR job to fix OTHER people's willingly created problems is not our job. This life is all about free will. Some people get themselves in the social predicaments they are in at the moment and search for answers outside themselves only to be mislead again. Another reason for societies problems would be the system laid down by the government. This system fucks people over regardless, so I reject the system and all it stands for. I don't use it. Is this "not caring"? Should I abide by the system just so I'd be "caring"? And what form of action in the system could be classified as caring, in your eyes? More donated money? Give the misfortunate people illusory paper? Very caring.

[lifeofbrian]

I'm afraid that by saying it is OUR job to fix OTHER people's willingly created problems is not our job. This life is all about free will. Some people get themselves in the social predicaments they are in at the moment and search for answers outside themselves only to be mislead again.

NWO loves you.

"I have no duty to care about my fellow man!"

Fantastic.

Why the hell is David Icke talking endlessly to the public, writing and researching, I wonder?

Why does he care what other people think?

[soglad]

NWO loves you.

"I have no duty to care about my fellow man!"

Fantastic.

I never said that. I said a lot of people create their own problems, you can always show them how to fix it, as I do, but it's up to them to walk it. I've done my part, they've to do the rest.

Please try not to continually speak in a condescending manner....it's quite annoying. Especially since you use it almost every post. :confused:

[lifeofbrian]

I never said that. I said a lot of people create their own problems, you can always show them how to fix it, as I do, but it's up to them to walk it. I've done my part, they've to do the rest.

Please try not to continually speak in a condescending manner....it's quite annoying. Especially since you use it almost every post. :confused:

Good for you. Having done your part. Life should be a holiday for you from now on. No karma to think of. Have you turned 30 yet?

Listen up. I express myself in the way I express myself. Deal with it.

The initial post obviously struck some sensitive chord in you but was not aimed at you so no need to take it personally.

This forum does not revolve around you.

[soglad]

Good for you. Having done your part. Life should be a holiday for you from now on. No karma to think of. Have you turned 30 yet?

Listen up. I express myself in the way I express myself. Deal with it.

The initial post obviously struck some sensitive chord in you but was not aimed at you so no need to take it personally.

This forum does not revolve around you.

No it doesn't and again you use language to paint me as selfish and ignorant, which I wish you wouldn't do. What I AM is a part of this forum, and as you were aiming this comment (from what I can see) at everyone ON this forum, this applies to me.

:D

[garth]

That is not enlightenment.
That is not "being awake".
That is a classic ego trip.

Those "awake" care about social problems and other people.
They are not afraid of "negativity".
They do not waste their time polishing that which is not broken - just to see their own reflection.

Wake up.

I assume that you are commenting on Infinite love?

Ego is a filter, created primarily out of fear, shed the fear, shed the ego.

Being afraid of negativity & living without fear are too very different states of being IMO

Your reality, as is mine, is only a reflection of what you put out

[lifeofbrian]

I assume that you are commenting on Infinite love?

Ego is a filter, created primarily out of fear, shed the fear, shed the ego.

Being afraid of negativity & living without fear are too very different states of being IMO

Your reality, as is mine, is only a reflection of what you put out

Not to my knowledge. But since it was brought up, the idea of infinite love and humans don't go together. The rain is capable of infinite love; it falls without discrimination. The sun is capable of infinite love, same reason. Humans are not.

Being afraid of negativity is a trait common with those high on their own ability to picture themselves living in a dreamworld. It is a fragile ability though. And it requires a cruelty which in itself proves the rosy dreamworld is an illusion built upon a lie.

I don't think I wrote living without fear is the same thing. Living without fear is what a sociopath does I imagine. Being courageous enough to face reality with constructive action to counter the ugly injustice and horror worldwide does not mean fear is absent; courage would not be needed if there was no fear.

I seriously doubt I have 'put out' that babies in the third world are to starve, but thanks for the cliché.

[kblood]

That is not enlightenment.
That is not "being awake".
That is a classic ego trip.

Those "awake" care about social problems and other people.
They are not afraid of "negativity".
They do not waste their time polishing that which is not broken - just to see their own reflection.

Wake up.

Yea, being egoistic doesnt help much, but solitude does make it easier to further an awakening. Being close to others clouds your mind with their thoughts and your body with their emotions. Hard to focus with so many energies around.

[lifeofbrian]

No it doesn't and again you use language to paint me as selfish and ignorant, which I wish you wouldn't do. What I AM is a part of this forum, and as you were aiming this comment (from what I can see) at everyone ON this forum, this applies to me.

:D

In fact, the initial post was offered as a basis for a discussion about the increasingly popular ideas being tossed about; that enlightenment/being awake means being aware of conspiracy theories.

States of being can be talked about without getting personal, in my experience.

Ego trips are 100% self-centered and not of much use in any "truth movement". Ego trips have their time and place too; like in the formative years when people are trying out which qualities they have and the results these qualities generate. Like 'testing, testing, 123, testing personality and what I can get away with and what will serve me best'.

In the context of conspiracies and truth, however, it seems ego trippers should join the Club For Mutual Admiration, Inc. instead.

Now there is another expression. "Know thyself." Socrates advice to physicians in his time. That is neither 'enlightenment'. It is mapping out the personal strengths and weaknesses and make the conscious decision to become a work in progress. Part of this development can be the knowing about conspiracies and gullability, trust and intelligence.

Infinite love, keep it.

Compassion and co-operation, bring it on.

[tejas]

What the hell are you on about?

[lifeofbrian]

Yea, being egoistic doesnt help much, but solitude does make it easier to further an awakening. Being close to others clouds your mind with their thoughts and your body with their emotions. Hard to focus with so many energies around.

Well, point was, enlightened people already 'awake' have no need to be so wrapped up in themselves anymore.

They got over themselves the moment they 'woke up'.

The striving for enlightenment could be an interesting discussion all by itself.

[lifeofbrian]

What the hell are you on about?

The difference between hippie bullshit babble and common sense.

[peter19]

In fact, the initial post was offered as a basis for a discussion about the increasingly popular ideas being tossed about; that enlightenment/being awake means being aware of conspiracy theories.

i wouldnt agree with that, to me "enlightenment" is helping your naibours and helping people if you can, behing at peace in yourself and behing yourself no-matter where your at.

i wouldnt say its just thinking certain thoughts like- "9-11 inside job" to me, its more about behing and not just more content and a bundle of thoughts. what does it matter if i think one thing or another?, its still me whos thinking them.

you could say you are enlightened to someone if you believe this or that, and it could be a trap, a person goes away thinking they are enlightened when youv just sort of been conned. almost like thinking aint i a good little citizen for doing what iv been told.

most of the times anyways i would say enlightenment is a mind goal, you conceptualize it, and when you do that is it really enlightenment, or is it enlightenment version 1.5 lol.

Those "awake" care about social problems and other people.
They are not afraid of "negativity".
They do not waste their time polishing that which is not broken - just to see their own reflection.

Wake up.

i think im affraid of negativety and its something i need to learn to accept, not hide from like i mostly do.

for me your right, i need to wake up and not be scared of my naibours. not protect false illusions.

[phoebe]

That is not enlightenment.
That is not "being awake".
That is a classic ego trip.

Those "awake" care about social problems and other people.
They are not afraid of "negativity".
They do not waste their time polishing that which is not broken - just to see their own reflection.

Wake up.

There are no awake people on this forum.
It is amazing the amount of people around here who class being 'awake'
As knowing about the conspiracy.
That's not being awake!

I'm not egotistical, in fact I'm quite opposite, I reject the ego. I try my best in my daily life to make people happy and I do this quite successfully. Please try not come on here trying to tell us all not to be who we are. This is not ego, this is soul.

This "not caring about social problems" thing. Can you just read that for one moment? What are the social problems? Ignorant people, drug addicts, scumbags, wars, killings and poverty? I'm afraid that by saying it is OUR job to fix OTHER people's willingly created problems is not our job. This life is all about free will. Some people get themselves in the social predicaments they are in at the moment and search for answers outside themselves only to be mislead again. Another reason for societies problems would be the system laid down by the government. This system fucks people over regardless, so I reject the system and all it stands for. I don't use it. Is this "not caring"? Should I abide by the system just so I'd be "caring"? And what form of action in the system could be classified as caring, in your eyes? More donated money? Give the misfortunate people illusory paper? Very caring.

I, I, I, I'm, I'm I'm - pure ego.
Constantly defending yourself - pure ego.
This is not an insult soglad
But the words you use...
success, ignorant people, scumbags...
All very egoic (your ego's opinions of other egos).
But...
I think it is a mistake to feel that ego is a bad thing.
It is not.
In renouncing ego you reinforce it tenfold.

[peter19]

There are no awake people on this forum.
It is amazing the amount of people around here who class being 'awake'
As knowing about the conspiracy.
That's not being awake!


so its not a good way of getting followers though?, just say to people "here if you dont believe 9-11 was an inside job you are not an enlightened behing". lol.

[phoebe]

Anyone thinking of enlightenment as something to be attained
Is in for a very, very long journey.
Neverending in fact.
Enlightenment is realisation.
Nothing more.
Realise your true nature, who you are,
(Or rather, what you are NOT)
That you are enlightenment

THAT is enlightenment.

A monk searched everywhere for enlightenment, but could find no answer - until one day, he saw an old man walking slowly, bearing a great burden of a huge sack of rocks, down a mountain path.
The monk sensed that this old man knew the secret he had been desperately seeking for many years.
'Old man, please tell me what you know. What is enlightenment?'
The old man smiled at him for a moment, put down his sack of rocks and stood straight.
'Yes, I see!' cried the monk. 'My everlasting gratitude. But please, one question more. What is after enlightenment?'
The old man picked up the sack once again, slung it over his shoulders, steadied his burden, and continued on his way.

[mr_moon]

The difference between hippie bullshit babble and common sense.

We must acknowledge our Ego and acknowledge our Self. We are not 'merely human' but Lifeforms made up of Sound and Light, as is everything else. Science is recognising it (at last) and people are becoming aware of it.

Living in this 'Dualistic' society can be tough and is highlighted ALL the time through sentences such as "Hippie bullshit babble VS Common Sense"

It's always one versus the other- left brain versus right brain. East versus west etc...etc...

Being 'Awake' has been twisted and contorted by people failing to grasp the true meaning of it.

I think the term to use is 'Aware'. It is a common truth that people are becoming more aware of the events that are occuring in the World and within themselves. People are becoming more aware of Energetic Forces that once were not detectible by most people. Now i hear story after story of people seeing Ghosts, Orbs, Hearing Voices, Psychic experiences etc... and this is because people are becoming more Aware.

Our Consciousness is Evolving, the frequencies of the Earth are rising and in turn so are the Vibrational Frequencies of Human Beings. Whenever sound is increased in pitch in relation to matter- it changes shape. Think about what this is doing to our bodies, our Minds and our Perceptions...

So 'Being Awake' is not really the correct term to use, if you are speaking about Conscious Awareness. It is merely a word being used by people who are struggling inside, to accept the changes occurring naturally in our Universe.

The conflict inside us now is strong- unfortunately it reflects in the External World and we are beginning to see more conflict and struggle there too.

Everything is heading towards something beautiful, even though it may appear otherwise and we need to do what we feel is the right thing to do and follow our Intuition. There is no right or wrong way to do it...

Much Love,

Jay
xxx

[Anders Lindman]

That is a classic ego trip.

Those "awake" care about social problems and other people.


I want to be rich. But I also want to care about social problems and other people. Money is the key to this I think. We need money that is not controlled by the banking elite. And we need a free, competitive and open market economy.

I don't see the consumer society as a problem. The problem is that there is a severely lopsided imbalance in the system somehow. While some people stuff themselves full with pizza and beer in front of a flat screen TV, other people are starving to death, are killed or have the threat of being killed hanging over them on a daily basis.

I have no problem with loads of consumer products IF there is at least SOME balance in the system.

Then we have another imbalance, where poor people in certain cultures are very happy, while westerners many times feel miserable, even with their flat screen TVs and so on.

[peter19]

Anyone thinking of enlightenment as something to be attained
Is in for a very, very long journey.
Neverending in fact.
Enlightenment is realisation.
Nothing more.
Realise your true nature, who you are,
(Or rather, what you are NOT)
That you are enlightenment

THAT is enlightenment.

A monk searched everywhere for enlightenment, but could find no answer - until one day, he saw an old man walking slowly, bearing a great burden of a huge sack of rocks, down a mountain path.
The monk sensed that this old man knew the secret he had been desperately seeking for many years.
'Old man, please tell me what you know. What is enlightenment?'
The old man smiled at him for a moment, put down his sack of rocks and stood straight.
'Yes, I see!' cried the monk. 'My everlasting gratitude. But please, one question more. What is after enlightenment?'
The old man picked up the sack once again, slung it over his shoulders, steadied his burden, and continued on his way.

i like that story and i think its right. we protect our illusions to the death. alot of what the monk carrys is who he thinks he is, who he should be, how he should act, needing to be spiritual and other things. it is all a burden, but its one we seem to not know we are carring and almost think the burden is us. defending the sticks like our life depends on it.

[eternal_spirit]

[quote=phoebe;101999]There are no awake people on this forum.
It is amazing the amount of people around here who class being 'awake'
As knowing about the conspiracy.

That's not being awake!

...............

That's a bit of a generalised statement. I suspect the only evidence you have to reach this conclusion is from the posts you read here? Awake to the fact there are other explanations for what's happening in the World. Awake can mean more than one thing as I'm sure you are aware.

define awake :) ?

[tinmenace]

There are no awake people on this forum.


Including you.

[kblood]

Well, point was, enlightened people already 'awake' have no need to be so wrapped up in themselves anymore.

They got over themselves the moment they 'woke up'.

The striving for enlightenment could be an interesting discussion all by itself.

Yup, some truth to this. As Pheobe wrote it is a long neverending journey though. It seems there will always be more to learn. I think I might have gotten far, but there are still a few things I need to find out about, and then I hope to find a way to use it. Being awake alone doesnt really get you anywhere but to a happier better life, if used in everyday life. If the awakening is to be used to help change the world, it gets really complicated though. I believe that the awakening alone does make the world a better place though. The things you can see beyond the awakening is frightening to say the least. I usually just try to live a normal life to avoid others having any expectations of me. Also I dont like when people come looking for me, but if they do find me, I guess they deserve the answers they seek. Answers come quite easily with scrying. Astral travelling is a hard one as well, and really drains you of mental energy. Healing is something I try to avoid, since it is rather complicated, and you need to be very calm and in a good state of mind. The thing I mostly find startling is how many truly belief healing, telepathy and so on isnt possible. There must be a way to get more people at least acknowledging that it is possible to enter other states of mind, heal and work miracles. I have found a few ways and try to make others learn about it and put it to good use. Takes a long time fighting people that knows of the secrets of the mind and have experiences with these as well. Even on this forum I have only noticed writing about a few. Hard to tell from text alone, and then there is the fact that all of us on this forum could just be lying :o

[phoebe]

Including you.

I said:
'There are no awake people on this forum.'
Which of course includes me since I post on this forum.

I reckon that anyone who is awake
Would just not post on forums anymore.
They wouldn't need the support, reassurance or anything else.

[phoebe]

That's a bit of a generalised statement. I suspect the only evidence you have to reach this conclusion is from the posts you read here? Awake to the fact there are other explanations for what's happening in the World. Awake can mean more than one thing as I'm sure you are aware.

define awake :) ?

I've already given my thoughts on this
In my other posts in this thread.

:)

[phoebe]

i like that story and i think its right. we protect our illusions to the death. alot of what the monk carrys is who he thinks he is, who he should be, how he should act, needing to be spiritual and other things. it is all a burden, but its one we seem to not know we are carring and almost think the burden is us. defending the sticks like our life depends on it.

Exactly.
Another way of saying it is:

Before enlightenment - chop wood, carry water.
After enlightenment - chop wood, carry water.

:)

[mr_moon]

I said:
'There are no awake people on this forum.'
Which of course includes me since I post on this forum.

I reckon that anyone who is awake
Would just not post on forums anymore.
They wouldn't need the support, reassurance or anything else.

I think helping people to become aware of this is important- people such as I like to post on this forum, to help people become more Aware of what is going on both Internally and Externally.

Of course i'm not here to TELL people what to think but merely a guiding voice of Awareness.

Much Love,

Jay
xxx

[john white]

I reckon that anyone who is awake
Would just not post on forums anymore.
They wouldn't need the support, reassurance or anything else.

Before enlightenment - chop wood, carry water.
After enlightenment - chop wood, carry water.


So why not:

Before enlightenment - post on forums
After enlightenment - post on forums?
Need doesn't come into it: one does, because

I, I, I, I'm, I'm I'm - pure ego.
Constantly defending yourself - pure ego.
This is not an insult soglad
But the words you use...
success, ignorant people, scumbags...
All very egoic (your ego's opinions of other egos).
But...
I think it is a mistake to feel that ego is a bad thing.
It is not.
In renouncing ego you reinforce it tenfold.

I once asked Humanoid how one is supposed to relate personal experiance without personal pronouns? Never did get an answer (other than "Yeah fair point")

We often mistake the pattern forced through the use of language with the consciousness behind the language

"The Map is not the territory"

[tinmenace]

I said:
'There are no awake people on this forum.'
Which of course includes me since I post on this forum.

I reckon that anyone who is awake
Would just not post on forums anymore.
They wouldn't need the support, reassurance or anything else.


Ok. Not to get into a tussle with you or anything, but if you're not "awake", then you don't know what "awake" is.

Maybe refrain from criticizing until you know what "awake" means. Until then, you're a pleb, like the rest of us.

[eternal_spirit]

I said:
'There are no awake people on this forum.'
Which of course includes me since I post on this forum.

I reckon that anyone who is awake
Would just not post on forums anymore.
They wouldn't need the support, reassurance or anything else.
..............

Problem some of us have is were we live. I have no one to talk to about most of the stuff discussed here. I could go the pub ( I don't like drink ) people talk shite in pubs and put on the socially acceptable mask, so that's a no go area, besides I don't wan't to be watching some rugby or football match like all the other clones there do. The music on the duke Box is all commercial brotherhood promoted mind fucked crap!
Or people with terrible voices trying to sound like Maddona or whoever on Karaoke lol. Sorry if I'm off topic here.

I can only discuss so much of it with family and friends, most can't follow the complicated stuff or think it's crazy ( means they think I am mad) that's my excuse anyway :D


Okay if I were to judge myself on being awake, I can't do it.
All I have is info, knowledge and my music. :D

[lifeofbrian]

i wouldnt agree with that, to me "enlightenment" is helping your naibours and helping people if you can, behing at peace in yourself and behing yourself no-matter where your at.

i wouldnt say its just thinking certain thoughts like- "9-11 inside job" to me, its more about behing and not just more content and a bundle of thoughts. what does it matter if i think one thing or another?, its still me whos thinking them.

you could say you are enlightened to someone if you believe this or that, and it could be a trap, a person goes away thinking they are enlightened when youv just sort of been conned. almost like thinking aint i a good little citizen for doing what iv been told.

most of the times anyways i would say enlightenment is a mind goal, you conceptualize it, and when you do that is it really enlightenment, or is it enlightenment version 1.5 lol.

A mind goal, you wrote. Sounds about right.

The classic example of an enlightened being would be Buddha. The wealthy person who went out into the world and experienced suffering and the stuff on the other side of the coin. Eventually taking a time out and having the famous insight. Of course it was a process over a long period of time, took years. Then he wanted to spread the knowledge to other people and so gathered followers.

Loads of people have tried the same formula or variations thereof. With the ambition to become enlightened. Compassion not sparked by a major life changing experience is in a sense equaly 'enlightened'. Maybe more so. Compassion without the goal being the own drinking from a fountain of wisdom wants no reward other than improving conditions for all.

Like a lot of terms and concepts from gurus and schools of thought 'enlightenment' have in a way lost all real meaning in the sense it has become a self-help technique as if we all need help, and have no help to offer.

i think im affraid of negativety and its something i need to learn to accept, not hide from like i mostly do.

for me your right, i need to wake up and not be scared of my naibours. not protect false illusions.

One can look at positive things and see how that works and then try to apply it to negative things, to change it.

[phoebe]

So why not:

Before enlightenment - post on forums
After enlightenment - post on forums?
Need doesn't come into it: one does, because

That's very true John.
And I suppose I myself am evidence of that
Since I have tasted what may be called enlightenment/wakefulness.
But the state didn't last.
And I was back to normal again.
And it didn't stop me posting on forums.
Which, I guess is pretty much the same as the
Monk with the rocks...
Perhaps one day I will be permanently in that state
Whilst still in this body
And then may be called truly 'enlightened' Christ/Buddhalike?
Whether or not I'll choose to still post on forums
I don't know.
But you're right, now I come to think about it. :)


I once asked Humanoid how one is supposed to relate personal experiance without personal pronouns? Never did get an answer (other than "Yeah fair point")

We often mistake the pattern forced through the use of language with the consciousness behind the language

"The Map is not the territory"

I and I (;))understand this.
I and I didn't really mean it to come across how it did.
I and I wanted to tell soglad that there's nothing wrong with ego.
And that in letting everyone know how 'non-egoic' he is
He is actually being tres-egoic.
Not that he's any different to me or anyone else
But I and I feel it is a 'trap' (for want of a better word)
That a lot of 'spiritual seekers' fall into.
(In renouncing ego, it finds its way in the back door.)

Humanoid - that name's a blast from the past!
As I recall he was very interested in 'Ego death' and such.
But by his own admission
Had one of the biggest egos around.
A great guy.
Sorely missed.

[phoebe]

Ok. Not to get into a tussle with you or anything, but if you're not "awake", then you don't know what "awake" is.

Maybe refrain from criticizing until you know what "awake" means. Until then, you're a pleb, like the rest of us.

I have had a taster of enlightenment/wakefulness.
But the state didn't last.
As I said in the response to John above.
It is hard therefore to know (after it's happened)
Whether it DID actually happen!

I don't recall criticising.
And I surely do know what awake/enlightened means.
We are all it.
None of us are plebs.
It's not something to be attained.
It's just a realisation.
Until we realise we're not plebs
We can't be awake.

[john white]

If there was one of those big heart emoticons

And i used it right now

Would it be egoic?

;)

[john white]

A taste is all we need

For one lifetime

[phoebe]

If there was one of those big heart emoticons

And i used it right now

Would it be egoic?

;)

...depends...

[phoebe]

A taste is all we need

For one lifetime

I think you're right.
Or we'd all be sitting on cloud nine
And forget the point of being here.

[tejas]

Anyone thinking of enlightenment as something to be attained
Is in for a very, very long journey.
Neverending in fact.
Enlightenment is realisation.
Nothing more.
Realise your true nature, who you are,
(Or rather, what you are NOT)
That you are enlightenment

THAT is enlightenment.

A monk searched everywhere for enlightenment, but could find no answer - until one day, he saw an old man walking slowly, bearing a great burden of a huge sack of rocks, down a mountain path.
The monk sensed that this old man knew the secret he had been desperately seeking for many years.
'Old man, please tell me what you know. What is enlightenment?'
The old man smiled at him for a moment, put down his sack of rocks and stood straight.
'Yes, I see!' cried the monk. 'My everlasting gratitude. But please, one question more. What is after enlightenment?'
The old man picked up the sack once again, slung it over his shoulders, steadied his burden, and continued on his way.

Very clever, I like it.

[tinmenace]

I have had a taster of enlightenment/wakefulness.
But the state didn't last.
As I said in the response to John above.
It is hard therefore to know (after it's happened)
Whether it DID actually happen!

I don't recall criticising.
And I surely do know what awake/enlightened means.
We are all it.
None of us are plebs.
It's not something to be attained.
It's just a realisation.
Until we realise we're not plebs
We can't be awake.

Hi Phoebe,

All I'm saying is that if you don't know what "awake" is, how can you tell who is "awake" and who isn't?

"Awake" is different for each and every one of us because no two beings are alike. It's a personal thing.

See?

[phoebe]

Hi Phoebe,

All I'm saying is that if you don't know what "awake" is, how can you tell who is "awake" and who isn't?

See?

I didn't say I don't know what awake is, did I?

[tinmenace]

I didn't say I don't know what awake is, did I?

You implied it by stating that nobody on this forum is awake.

[kblood]

You seem to know quite a bit about the awakening Pheobe. I once studied psychology and found out some secrets about our way of speaking. How we might actually be unable to lie, if you understand a language enough. It was a long time ago though. The basic concept is about a room of people with people that either are lying or telling the truth. Nothing in between. You are there and a person tells you that he heard another guy tell him that he was a lier. Is he then lying or telling the truth? :p

[phoebe]

You seem to know quite a bit about the awakening Pheobe. I once studied psychology and found out some secrets about our way of speaking. How we might actually be unable to lie, if you understand a language enough. It was a long time ago though. The basic concept is about a room of people with people that either are lying or telling the truth. Nothing in between. You are there and a person tells you that he heard another guy tell him that he was a lier. Is he then lying or telling the truth? :p

Well...
I think the best way to answer that is
With a quote from Socrates
'All I know is that I know nothing'
And that includes the answer to your logic puzzle. :rolleyes::confused::eek::D

[garth]

I, like a lot of people have for a long time thought of "enlightenment" as the goal, this I have learned is counterproductive as placing a desired state of being as something to strive for simply puts into the same state as any other goal. Like "things will be great as soon as I get a new job or new car" or whatever. It's not the destination, but the journey that counts, so being on a path is really, IMO not the right way to look at it.

Like the monk with his sack of rocks, day to day live doesn't change much, but your experience of it will.

[lemonique]

I, like a lot of people have for a long time thought of "enlightenment" as the goal, this I have learned is counterproductive as placing a desired state of being as something to strive for simply puts into the same state as any other goal. Like "things will be great as soon as I get a new job or new car" or whatever. It's not the destination, but the journey that counts, so being on a path is really, IMO not the right way to look at it.

Like the monk with his sack of rocks, day to day live doesn't change much, but your experience of it will.

I can relate to what you say Garth. My 2 bob's worth is: actions speak louder than words.....as the old Monk demonstrated.

[dondaz]

So, the bigger the ego, the less enlightened? Even if the ego in question is much more positive than negative?

Obviously not talking about myself here:rolleyes:

[cruise4]

"I have had a taster of enlightenment/wakefulness"

Regardless of whether it did or didn't happen, care to put me out of my misery and recount this experience. Metaphors and Fables are serving to only cover up the issue unnecessarily. By your own admission you claim to know something about the words 'aware' and 'enlightenment' as relating to you. Seems like important information to share to me.

"Like a lot of terms and concepts from gurus and schools of thought 'enlightenment' have in a way lost all real meaning in the sense it has become a self-help technique as if we all need help, and have no help to offer."

Good comment. Enlightenment could mean setting light to yourself for all the clarity going on here.

[soglad]

I generally don't thrive to purely "awaken". Most life situations have helped me along the way.

[oceanwave]

That is not enlightenment.
That is not "being awake".
That is a classic ego trip.

Those "awake" care about social problems and other people.
They are not afraid of "negativity".
They do not waste their time polishing that which is not broken - just to see their own reflection.

Wake up.

like to add,..

...those who are 'aware' don't care...

:)

[i am all i am]

I said:
'There are no awake people on this forum.'
Which of course includes me since I post on this forum.

I reckon that anyone who is awake
Would just not post on forums anymore.
They wouldn't need the support, reassurance or anything else.

I LOVE YOU.

G'day Phoebe.

Having started reading this thread, your comments really stood out to me.

How is it that someone that is not "awake", as you have declared of yourself, able to determine what an awakened state is, or whether or not another is in that state of being ???

Not being "awake", how can you also then determine what someone that is in an awakened state of being would or wouldn't do ???

(Edit): Ok, I read further and saw that ths has been discussed. I will add that, personally, I believe that if you are aware of Who You Truly Are, then you are in an awakened stae of being. Everything that we experience is a relationship to that which surrounds us, therefore, having the reference point of knowing Who You Truly Are will allow you to determine the relationship that you have with your surroundings. So, until an individual has the reference point of knowing Who They Truly Are, then their perceptions of what surrounds them will only flow from a unknowing state of being, which will not allow them to know that which surrounds them.

THANK YOU.



http://www.lifeshore.com/smiley/data/media/3/3D_emoticon_S34.gif With LOVE http://www.lifeshore.com/smiley/data/media/3/3D_emoticon_S36.gif

[i am all i am]

Need doesn't come into it: one does, because

I LOVE YOU.

G'day John White.

Well said brother.

Be...cause. In all things for you, you are being the cause, or in other words, you are creating your own reality. The only responsibility that we have is for what thoughts / words / actions that we choose to express and experience, that which we are being the cause of, BECAUSE they are our individual choices to both express and experience.

THANK YOU.



http://www.lifeshore.com/smiley/data/media/3/3D_emoticon_S34.gif With LOVE http://www.lifeshore.com/smiley/data/media/3/3D_emoticon_S36.gif

[lifeofbrian]

Cheers everyone, good posts.

Attempting a definitions of terms

Aware -
self-awareness; personal development psychological and emotional
social and political awareness

Awake -
spiritually awake; expanded awareness, state of being fully present in the moment more than usual, a keen awareness both from the spiritual and functional/practical perspective

Enlightened; having transcended the theatre of drama both within and without because of total understanding of nature of existence and self.

Picture a fire drill, what is the procedure:

Save - those at immediate risk
Alert - those in the building
Call - the fire dep./ ambulance
Attempt - if possible put the fire out yourself
Exit - leave the building

Knowing of the procedure in theory is being aware of it.
Understanding the priorities, their order, and knowing you have the presence of mind not to freak out in a crisis is being awake.
Knowing that shit happens and fires happen for a reason is being enlightened.


In a world full of the wisdom of those gone before like Sid (Buddha) and Jessie (Christ) and other famous and infamous characters, we know the wheel has been invented already. They left blueprints behind. Explained how it worked and all. Some people use wheels every day, no big deal. They do it with such ease though it doesn't seem very 'magical' or 'mysterious' however. So it's not noticed.

Common sense suggests applying the existing wisdom - the drill procedure - and see how it works in the functional and practical sense.

Help those in danger immediately, to the best of our ability.
Warn people of potentially harmful activity and do it appropriately; parents could use information about the MMR vaccine, students can be offered alternative sources in their respective field, the elderly information about natural cures for minor ailments, etc.
Use the system against itself by questioning why, for example in "the land of freedom", jabs are mandatory, etc? Challenge those in positions to be men and women of their vows and words.
Learn some skill and enter the playing field to alter the game. Standing on the sideline shouting is frankly just a big pain in the arse for those out there trying to make a difference. Then, give it a try, maybe you are the genius needed to create real change, or prevent some fire from spreading.
At the end of the day, and life, hopefully it was a great experience with happiness and fulfillment also.

Is it really necessary for every new generation to re-invent the wheel? Of course we use more modern materials today - more modern terms/different circumstances, but nothing ever changes if people keep going back to the drawing board. A wheel is round, it is a timeless eternal fact.

Actions speak louder than words. Either the wheels are discussed and argued over and fights break out over insults and whatnot. Or they are put to good use to go from here to there. There is no need to become a Sid or Jessie copycat to be able to apply their knowledge, in a practical and functional way. Once the effects appear, the experiences can be owned as wisdom.

Why should we care about what happens to other people and in the world?
Because we are human. It's what we do. We care.

Ego deserves a thread of its own.