The Open Source Order of the Golden Dawn

[abcnick]

http://www.osogd.org/

The Open Source Order of the Golden Dawn... Sounds kinda good don't it? The time to stop this childish secrecy is not so far away... Or it shouldn't be, at least!

I don't know, but I quite liked that name at least... The Open Source Grand Lodge of England, lol, would have been good :)

[luciferhorus]

I don't know, but I quite liked that name at least... The Open Source Grand Lodge of England, lol, would have been good :)

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/image.php?u=12641&dateline=1239366918&type=profile

I can assure you that Crowley was very much the anti-thesis of the current aristocratic Grand Master of Masonry, the Duke of Kent and that the cult orders he left behind are entirely heretical to 'regular Masonry' and are generally considered to be an assortment of blasphemers and heretics.

I went through the above Internet site and I would direct your attention to:

Requirements for admission to the Neophyte Grade
1st Lecture: To be studied in the 0=0 Grade of Neophyte
2nd Lecture: To be studied in the 1=10 Grade of Zelator
3rd Lecture: To be studied in the 2=9 Grade of Theoricus
4th Lecture: To be studied in the 3=8 Grade of Practicus
5th Lecture: To be studied in the 4=7 Grade of Philosophus

Please do not mistake my knowledge of this subject for arrogance, but I entirely pronounce the above site to be teaching Kabbalistic Orthodoxy.

Lucifer
93
http://th05.deviantart.com/fs25/300W/f/2008/148/2/8/Sigil_of_Lucifer_by_Monation.jpg
Grand Master of all manner of blasphemy and heresy, and numerous other blasphemous and heretical titles.

[watson_k]

http://www.osogd.org/

The Open Source Order of the Golden Dawn... Sounds kinda good don't it? The time to stop this childish secrecy is not so far away... Or it shouldn't be, at least!

I don't know, but I quite liked that name at least... The Open Source Grand Lodge of England, lol, would have been good :)

Read that first line on the main page, 'mostly pagan background'. I assure you the real Order will tell you their teachings predate Paganism. I also assure you the real order do keep a few things secret that are only told to their Initiates because it has always been necessary to test the individuals convictions and spiritual fortitude previous to giving them powerful tools that can cause a lot of damage in the hands of a black magician.

Whether Masons hold secrets for the same reason I cannot tell you. But for the Real Golden Dawn, I can 100% verify this with you.

An old saying is, An Acorn doesn't break through the shell instantly and become a full grown Oak. It takes time and preparation. The answers wont just appear to you, you need to seek them.

[luciferhorus]

I also assure you the real order do keep a few things secret that are only told to their Initiates because it has always been necessary to test the individuals convictions and spiritual fortitude previous to giving them powerful tools that can cause a lot of damage in the hands of a black magician.

Whether Masons hold secrets for the same reason I cannot tell you. .

So do I take it that you 'doubt' that the Masons are black magickians, and that they are not doing a lot of damage to the world.

Lux

http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/56088836.jpg?v=1&c=ViewImages&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF193CC300C081D9F4700E52C12D803887BC6 67FB72414CBE06EFA55A1E4F32AD3138
Above Right: Masonic Grand Master: Field Marshal the Duke of Kent

http://www.luciferia.tv/links/mi6heroincrimedrugsqueenelisabethhsbcbig.jpg

http://tuberose.com/Graphics/depleted-uranium.2005.jpeg

http://recollectionbooks.com/bleed/images/BB/attack.jpg

http://www.nomorebush.premiumfinder.com/war-gallery/iraq-child.jpg

[watson_k]

So do I take it that you 'doubt' that the Masons are black magickians, and that they are not doing a lot of damage to the world.

Lux


I will not take even an educated guess Lucifer. I do not know. I'm not a Mason. I look towards Bohemian Grove than Masonry for the place of black Magicians. Then again... I'm not a member of Bohemian Grove, so I still can't take an educated guess.

Now look at those pictures you put there. Look at the select members of Bohemian grove, and look at the many Hundred-Thousand members of Masons. Who's more likely to be in 'control'...Who's more likely to be the instigators of these horrid atrocities, of which go on every day. Even then, it's the 'Average Joe fighting for their country' that causes the pain. They're the ones that drop the bombs and in the case of some westerners, shoot innocent women and children. Who's the one that makes that choice? Oh right according to many it was the selfish acts of these innocents that caused them to be shot in the first place? Or we can blame it on ideas that have been made up by so-called societies brightest, which cause an ever lasting circle and never brings the 'truth-seeker' to the real answers because you can't blame an idea.

[luciferhorus]

I will not take even an educated guess Lucifer. I do not know. I'm not a Mason. I look towards Bohemian Grove than Masonry for the place of black Magicians. Then again... I'm not a member of Bohemian Grove, so I still can't take an educated guess.

Now look at those pictures you put there. Look at the select members of Bohemian grove, and look at the many Hundred-Thousand members of Masons. Who's more likely to be in 'control'...Who's more likely to be the instigators of these horrid atrocities, of which go on every day. Even then, it's the 'Average Joe fighting for their country' that causes the pain. They're the ones that drop the bombs and in the case of some westerners, shoot innocent women and children. Who's the one that makes that choice? Oh right according to many it was the selfish acts of these innocents that caused them to be shot in the first place? Or we can blame it on ideas that have been made up by so-called societies brightest, which cause an ever lasting circle and never brings the 'truth-seeker' to the real answers because you can't blame an idea.

I want to respond generally to the claim which is often made, which is that most Masons are decent people, and that 'evil' Masons are somehow a minority who are 'bad apples.'

Firstly consider the Grand Master (cult leader) of Freemasonry in the UK today.


http://aftermathnews.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/freemasons_duke_kent.jpg

Field Marshal His Royal Highness Prince Edward George Nicholas Patrick, Duke of Kent, Earl of Saint Andrews, Baron Downpatrick, Grand Master of the United Grand Lodge of England (UGLE) and First Grand Principal of the Supreme Grand Chapter of Royal Arch Masons of England, Grand Master of the Order of St Michael and St George, Knight Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order, Knight of the Order of St George and St Constantine, Knight Grand Band, the Order of the Star of Africa, Knight of the Most Illustrious Order of Tri Shakti Patta, Grand Cordon, the Order of the Renaissance, Knight of the Order of St Olav (Grand Cross), Royal Knight of the Most Noble Order of the Garter, Knight Grand Cross of the Most Distinguished Order of Saint Michael and Saint George, Knight Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order, Aide-de-Camp to Her Majesty, Royal Knight of the Garter, Knight Grand Cross of the Order of St Michael and St George, Colonel, of the Scots Guards, Colonel-in-Chief, of the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers, Royal Colonel, of the 1st Battalion, The Rifles, Deputy Colonel-in-Chief, of the Royal Scots Dragoon Guards, Honorary Air Commodore, RAF Leuchars, Honorary Air Chief Marshal, Royal Air Force Commonwealth, Colonel-in-Chief, of The Lorne Scots (Peel, Dufferin and Halton Regiment) and 'President of The Scout Association.'

http://cache.gettyimages.com/xc/56088836.jpg?v=1&c=ViewImages&k=2&d=17A4AD9FDB9CF193CC300C081D9F4700E52C12D803887BC6 67FB72414CBE06EFA55A1E4F32AD3138


Let us consider your statement again:

look at the many Hundred-Thousand members of Masons. Who's more likely to be in 'control'...Who's more likely to be the instigators of these horrid atrocities, of which go on every day. Even then, it's the 'Average Joe fighting for their country' that causes the pain. They're the ones that drop the bombs and in the case of some westerners, shoot innocent women and children.

Now let us apply this to other cult leaders.

Take for example:


http://img.timeinc.net/time/magazine/archive/covers/1995/1101950403_400.jpg

or:

http://www.orange-papers.org/orange-Moonies3.jpg


Now I think it only fair to state that it is quite reasonable to associate a cultist with their cult leader.

So when it comes to Field Marshal His Royal Highness Prince Edward George Nicholas Patrick, Duke of Kent, Earl of Saint Andrews, Baron Downpatrick, Grand Master of the United Grand Lodge of England (UGLE) and First Grand Principal of the Supreme Grand Chapter of Royal Arch Masons of England, Grand Master of the Order of St Michael and St George, Knight Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order, Knight of the Order of St George and St Constantine, Knight Grand Band, the Order of the Star of Africa, Knight of the Most Illustrious Order of Tri Shakti Patta, Grand Cordon, the Order of the Renaissance, Knight of the Order of St Olav (Grand Cross), Royal Knight of the Most Noble Order of the Garter, Knight Grand Cross of the Most Distinguished Order of Saint Michael and Saint George, Knight Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order, Aide-de-Camp to Her Majesty, Royal Knight of the Garter, Knight Grand Cross of the Order of St Michael and St George, Colonel, of the Scots Guards, Colonel-in-Chief, of the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers, Royal Colonel, of the 1st Battalion, The Rifles, Deputy Colonel-in-Chief, of the Royal Scots Dragoon Guards, Honorary Air Commodore, RAF Leuchars, Honorary Air Chief Marshal, Royal Air Force Commonwealth, Colonel-in-Chief, of The Lorne Scots (Peel, Dufferin and Halton Regiment) and 'President of The Scout Association..........

I think that to begin with we could assume that the members of the Scout Association are perhaps rather innocent, since it is the Capitalist version of the Hitler Youth and such young minds can easily be hypnotised and they generally do not associate Scout cultism with Field Marshal His Royal Highness Prince Edward George Nicholas Patrick, Duke of Kent, Earl of Saint Andrews, Baron Downpatrick, Grand Master of the United Grand Lodge of England (UGLE) and First Grand Principal of the Supreme Grand Chapter of Royal Arch Masons of England, Grand Master of the Order of St Michael and St George, Knight Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order, Knight of the Order of St George and St Constantine, Knight Grand Band, the Order of the Star of Africa, Knight of the Most Illustrious Order of Tri Shakti Patta, Grand Cordon, the Order of the Renaissance, Knight of the Order of St Olav (Grand Cross), Royal Knight of the Most Noble Order of the Garter, Knight Grand Cross of the Most Distinguished Order of Saint Michael and Saint George, Knight Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order, Aide-de-Camp to Her Majesty, Royal Knight of the Garter, Knight Grand Cross of the Order of St Michael and St George, Colonel, of the Scots Guards, Colonel-in-Chief, of the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers, Royal Colonel, of the 1st Battalion, The Rifles, Deputy Colonel-in-Chief, of the Royal Scots Dragoon Guards, Honorary Air Commodore, RAF Leuchars, Honorary Air Chief Marshal, Royal Air Force Commonwealth, Colonel-in-Chief, of The Lorne Scots (Peel, Dufferin and Halton Regiment) and 'President of The Scout Association.


When we consider cultists such as Asahara's cult or the Moon cult, any adult who wishes to join such a cult can generally do a great deal of research into the nature of the cult leader before coming to the conclusion that their cult leader is the type of person whom they wish to worship as an object of idolatry or as an example of a 'good' person. Similary with the Masonic cultists, since it is no secret who their ultimate overt worshipful Grand Master is.

If a person joins a cult whose Grand Master is a Field Marshal (the highest rank) of the British state terrorists / narco-terrorists it is only fair that we judge the cultists as persons who would consider such subhumans as the Duke of Kent to be 'good,' just as we would judge a Moon cultist or an Asahara cultist similarly.


My judgement on the Masons and my demands for their eridaction are infallible 'ex offico' judgements and thus to dispute my infallible judgement represents the highest blasphemy and heresy.

Regards


Comandante Lucifer

http://th05.deviantart.com/fs25/300W/f/2008/148/2/8/Sigil_of_Lucifer_by_Monation.jpg
Fire, plague and poisoned waters.

lux e tenebris. ordo ab chaos.

Prince of the Angels, Lord of Lords, Master and Commander of the 72 Goetic demons, bearer of the Key of Solomon, Ex offico (in the office of) Christ, Pontifex Maximus, Servus Servorum Dei, Judge of Judgement Day, Grand Commander on earth of the armies of Heaven and numerous other pompous titles.

http://www.piusxiipope.info/popeseal.gif

Nb. I have spoken here 'ex cathedra' (from the seat) and thus I speak infallibly against all other blasphemies, heresies and competing 'World Saviours,' Grand Masters, Messiahs, Maitreyas, prophets, madhi's etc; accept no cheaper or higher priced substitutes.

http://www.luciferia.tv/Law/martin3.jpg

[thelonious]

Goddamit, not every thread is about communism. :mad:

Besides, you're wrong about Crowley. He prided himself on his perceived aristocracy, but the OP didn't even mention Crowley.

[luciferhorus]

Goddamit, not every thread is about communism. :mad:.

My apologies Theolonious; I'll throw in a few Communist images for good measure.

http://i.pbase.com/o4/44/546244/1/63344903.gUvxyzsK.DSC15172W.jpg
http://apictureisworthathousandwords.co.uk/images_large/cuba4.jpg
Above: Cuban street posters.

And I must just add a touch of spice for the American Echelon computer at NSA Menwith Hill in North Yorkshire and the various search engine spiders:

revolution nuclear terrorism jihad plutonium suitcase bomb biological nuclear terrorism holocaust genocide jihad Allah O Akbar .....Allah O Akbar...... Ya Ali ...Ya Ali...... Ka Matlab Kia .......La Illah a Illah make thousands of Madressas and make every muslim a Mujahid - atomic bomb - bomb america nuke america Hezbollah Osama Bib Laden CIA hatta al-nasr, hatta al-nasr, hatta al-Quds until victory, until victory, until Jerusalem

http://www.luciferia.tv/Law/GCHQ.jpg



Besides, you're wrong about Crowley. He prided himself on his perceived aristocracy, but the OP didn't even mention Crowley.

The OP is comparing the openness of the Golden Dawn, whose most famous member was probably Crowley himself, to the alleged 'secrecy' of the regular Masonry; though I tend to think that the 'secrecy' behind Masonry has less to do with esoteric knowledge than with the details of loan sharking, narco-terrorism, corruption, organised crime in general, and wholesale Capitalist revolution, genocide, the impoverishment and enslavement of humanity, and global chaos in general, whereas the Golden Dawn are rather a group of magickians.

While Crowely's father was certainly welathy, his alleged aristocratic lineage have been described as one of his romantic fantasies; I hardly think he should be compared to your own aristocratic Grand Master, Field Marshal His Royal Highness Prince Edward George Nicholas Patrick, Duke of Kent, Earl of Saint Andrews, Baron Downpatrick, Grand Master of the United Grand Lodge of England (UGLE) and First Grand Principal of the Supreme Grand Chapter of Royal Arch Masons of England, Grand Master of the Order of St Michael and St George, Knight Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order, Knight of the Order of St George and St Constantine, Knight Grand Band, the Order of the Star of Africa, Knight of the Most Illustrious Order of Tri Shakti Patta, Grand Cordon, the Order of the Renaissance, Knight of the Order of St Olav (Grand Cross), Royal Knight of the Most Noble Order of the Garter, Knight Grand Cross of the Most Distinguished Order of Saint Michael and Saint George, Knight Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order, Aide-de-Camp to Her Majesty, Royal Knight of the Garter, Knight Grand Cross of the Order of St Michael and St George, Colonel, of the Scots Guards, Colonel-in-Chief, of the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers, Royal Colonel, of the 1st Battalion, The Rifles, Deputy Colonel-in-Chief, of the Royal Scots Dragoon Guards, Honorary Air Commodore, RAF Leuchars, Honorary Air Chief Marshal, Royal Air Force Commonwealth, Colonel-in-Chief, of The Lorne Scots (Peel, Dufferin and Halton Regiment) and 'President of The Scout Association.'

http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/resources/images/275319/?type=display
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/images/bombingiraq2.jpg
http://recollectionbooks.com/bleed/images/BB/attack.jpg
http://www.artsjournal.com/herman/images/liberated_boy.jpg
Liberated Iraqi Child: Liberating the children of Iraq of arms, legs and heads for Jesus.
http://www.smh.com.au/ffxImage/urlpicture_id_1048354635272_2003/03/26/poster24.jpg

[thelonious]

My apologies Theolonious; I'll throw in a few Communist images for good measure.

I knew you wouldn't let me down!

Here, have a few on me:

http://blogs.venturacountystar.com/vcs/propaganda/400px-Soviet_propaganda.jpg

http://incentraleurope.radio.cz/pictures/komunismus/stalin_gottwald1.jpg

http://news.bbc.co.uk/nol/shared/spl/hi/pop_ups/06/asia_pac_vietnam_propaganda_artist/img/3.jpg

http://www.oktat.com/pictures/img/stalin_09.jpg

http://www.culturalrevolutionartifacts.com/db5/00441/culturalrevolutionartifacts.com/_uimages/12-12-03143.jpg


But let's not forget these:

http://day.zp.ua/core/data/upimages/deti-dead-upa-horror.jpg

http://www.clearharmony.net/a_images/2006/02/2006-02-18-2005-12-28-rape-cases-02.jpg

http://barbadosfreepress.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/killing-fields-children1.jpg

http://www.freewebs.com/theprojectforabetterworld/freetibet.jpg

[luciferhorus]

I knew you wouldn't let me down!

Here, have a few on me:



Straw Man Argument.

You will not find any Anarchist who supports the ideology of State Capitalism as practiced in China or Stalnist Russia; indeed you won't find many Amrcists either, since they generally look to Cuba as their model.

http://barbadosfreepress.files.wordpress.com/2008/11/killing-fields-children1.jpg


Since we have already established that Pot Pot was backed by the CIA, the above is entirely appropriate as anti-American propaganda but not as anti-Communist propaganda.

LL

Lux


http://www.freespeechseattle.org/replacementsneeded/english.jpg

http://www.psywarrior.com/Breaksomeeggs.jpg

http://z.about.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/P/O/propaganda_shutmouth.jpg

http://z.about.com/d/politicalhumor/1/0/C/O/propaganda_soldier.jpg

http://cdntn.madison.com/images/articles/tct/2008/10/21/88917.jpg

http://fideidefensor.files.wordpress.com/2008/10/iraqi-children.jpg

[bowtiedaddy]

My apologies Theolonious; I'll throw in a few Communist images for good measure.

http://i.pbase.com/o4/44/546244/1/63344903.gUvxyzsK.DSC15172W.jpg
http://apictureisworthathousandwords.co.uk/images_large/cuba4.jpg
Above: Cuban street posters.

And I must just add a touch of spice for the American Echelon computer at NSA Menwith Hill in North Yorkshire and the various search engine spiders:

revolution nuclear terrorism jihad plutonium suitcase bomb biological nuclear terrorism holocaust genocide jihad Allah O Akbar .....Allah O Akbar...... Ya Ali ...Ya Ali...... Ka Matlab Kia .......La Illah a Illah make thousands of Madressas and make every muslim a Mujahid - atomic bomb - bomb america nuke america Hezbollah Osama Bib Laden CIA hatta al-nasr, hatta al-nasr, hatta al-Quds until victory, until victory, until Jerusalem

http://www.luciferia.tv/Law/GCHQ.jpg




The OP is comparing the openness of the Golden Dawn, whose most famous member was probably Crowley himself, to the alleged 'secrecy' of the regular Masonry; though I tend to think that the 'secrecy' behind Masonry has less to do with esoteric knowledge than with the details of loan sharking, narco-terrorism, corruption, organised crime in general, and wholesale Capitalist revolution, genocide, the impoverishment and enslavement of humanity, and global chaos in general, whereas the Golden Dawn are rather a group of magickians.

While Crowely's father was certainly welathy, his alleged aristocratic lineage have been described as one of his romantic fantasies; I hardly think he should be compared to your own aristocratic Grand Master, Field Marshal His Royal Highness Prince Edward George Nicholas Patrick, Duke of Kent, Earl of Saint Andrews, Baron Downpatrick, Grand Master of the United Grand Lodge of England (UGLE) and First Grand Principal of the Supreme Grand Chapter of Royal Arch Masons of England, Grand Master of the Order of St Michael and St George, Knight Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order, Knight of the Order of St George and St Constantine, Knight Grand Band, the Order of the Star of Africa, Knight of the Most Illustrious Order of Tri Shakti Patta, Grand Cordon, the Order of the Renaissance, Knight of the Order of St Olav (Grand Cross), Royal Knight of the Most Noble Order of the Garter, Knight Grand Cross of the Most Distinguished Order of Saint Michael and Saint George, Knight Grand Cross of the Royal Victorian Order, Aide-de-Camp to Her Majesty, Royal Knight of the Garter, Knight Grand Cross of the Order of St Michael and St George, Colonel, of the Scots Guards, Colonel-in-Chief, of the Royal Regiment of Fusiliers, Royal Colonel, of the 1st Battalion, The Rifles, Deputy Colonel-in-Chief, of the Royal Scots Dragoon Guards, Honorary Air Commodore, RAF Leuchars, Honorary Air Chief Marshal, Royal Air Force Commonwealth, Colonel-in-Chief, of The Lorne Scots (Peel, Dufferin and Halton Regiment) and 'President of The Scout Association.'

http://www.thetelegraphandargus.co.uk/resources/images/275319/?type=display
http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/images/bombingiraq2.jpg
http://recollectionbooks.com/bleed/images/BB/attack.jpg
http://www.artsjournal.com/herman/images/liberated_boy.jpg
Liberated Iraqi Child: Liberating the children of Iraq of arms, legs and heads for Jesus.
http://www.smh.com.au/ffxImage/urlpicture_id_1048354635272_2003/03/26/poster24.jpg

But the globalists believe in global warming.

[luciferhorus]

But the globalists believe in global warming.

http://www.smh.com.au/ffxImage/urlpicture_id_1048354635272_2003/03/26/poster24.jpg

Yes probably the 'global warning' one-liner is not quite correct.

However, if the poster stated 'They 'don't' believe in global warming,' that would not entirely be true either; it is more a question of 'why is global warming occurring?'

It is a fact that the sun heats up and cools down and that the temperature of the earth over the Aeons is not constant.

The sun is currently heating up and this is a fact; other planets are feeling the affect of this.

Global warming is a 'fact;' what is 'not' a fact is that it is caused by CO2 emissions since the the industrial revolution; the Global Warming conspiracy of the establishment is simply an excuse to raise taxes and to discourage competing nations from industrial development; it is a hoax.

The Sun is a giant nuclear reactor and our planet is like a tiny dot next to it; unfortunately we do not have a control switch to turn the temperature of our reactor up and down.

Over many 100's of thousands of years we have had cold periods and hot periods and it has had nothing to do with the burning of fossil fuels, and everything to do with the 'Sun,' the light of our world.

LL

Lux


http://www.globalwarminghoax.com/e107_images/Eagle_Earth_Logo_300px.jpg
http://www.globalwarminghoax.com/news.php
http://www.globalwarminghoax.com/e107_images/newspost_images/ponder/headerpic.jpg


The PRESIDENT has the RED NUCLEAR MAILBOMB and an RPG, so he's going to meet with the SMALL POX CRYPTO INFILTRATION team and the SUBVERSIVES from WHITE YANKEE, then ASSASINATE the SECRET SERVICE CLAYMORE MUNITIONS after lunch. 777 OIR Rand Corporation JICS spook words MOIS EAM Pseudonyms SIW 2c SORO GSGI Electron CISU SBU Mace UTU FLiR Pixar MP40 J-6 assasinate Kiwis presidential motorcade Colonel rockets screws PTT AKS-74 Area51 DSS 2600 Magazine IDEA lead styphante MJ-12 FX special forces Oscor Passwords mjtf Banner Covert Video SDF Chobetsu afsatcom Protection Agfa keebler Embassy Fetish Sergeyev HIC NSDD NSO SHA Corporation Ortega ERV M.A.R.E. MARE ASWS Tony Poe edition TDM Hillal KG-84C GSM Rewson National Information Infrastructure srt OTP WWSP snullen no|d NAVCM TIE Avi DREC SBIRS Stingers DSNET2 NATOA van Fax encryption rita monarchist MDA mindwar WORM SIRC FBI SAMCOMM 1080H MITI Tyrell replay ANZUS FMS ZL31 Tokyo GOTS M5 JOTS veggie Duress NTTC nailbomb JSOTF INI Vinnell SIGS CDA fake CISD Clandestine Tess Centro Kilderkin CNCIS Paperclip Archives STTC BLU SURVIAC IWG ISSO walburn SIGDEV pink noise SHS data havens LEASAT csim NACSE MKSEARCH ULF AG NAVELEXSYSSECENGCEN Black-Ops top secret SGI Fortezza hostages piz GSA Chan ISPE 868 Steve Case TA SAS platter charge WQC WAS VBS Standford Spall Koancho CQB DES Satellite phones J2 IW KY RDI rednoise Rojdykarna evil Daisy AGT. AMME MOSAIC MCI Competitor Ronco Skytel AOL DSNET1 White House weapons Freeh moore LUK ReMOB Jatti Secert Kyudanki burhop Time football AIEWS SEAL Team 3 BBE Blacknet Defcon VI OSS NSADS EPL CipherTAC-2000 MKNAOMI SWAT RSP HoHoCon claymore bootleg Nuclear Whitewater MP5k Information Warfare ballistic media DDP GCHQ bank gorilla Macintosh Security ARPA SATKA MIT Chicago Crust NSIRL Explosives cospo.osis.gov PGP 5.1 Morwenstow Tangimoana Beach SEL STEP Secure Internet Connections DF real M-x spook Threat orthodox S! ORT Bluebird Yakima fraud Walther MPL DCSS ssa Anonymous MD4 NMIC domestic disruption FCA Information Security TSCI counterintelligence AFSPC PGP MI5

Generated by www.EchelonSpoofer.com (www.EchelonSpoofer.com)

[flyermay]

The current global warming campaign is just a huge hoax to impose even more unfair taxes on the world's population.

Obviously, all governments support this campaign that will bright them billions of dollars to fund their expensive criminal activities; while the middle man simply falls for it (as always).

Said that, it is a fact that the earth goes through worm periods and ice ages. But this has happened even before human beings existed and will continue to happen once we are all long gone.

[thelonious]

The current global warming campaign is just a huge hoax to impose even more unfair taxes on the world's population.

Obviously, all governments support this campaign that will bright them billions of dollars to fund their expensive criminal activities; while the middle man simply falls for it (as always).

Said that, it is a fact that the earth goes through worm periods and ice ages. But this has happened even before human beings existed and will continue to happen once we are all long gone.

So you believe that industries can pump poison into the air without causing any damage?

Lucifer may find this article of interest:

http://cpusa.org/article/articleview/931/1/152/

[flyermay]

So you believe that industries can pump poison into the air without causing any damage?

I never said that!

But that doesn't mean that CO2 emissions are causing global warming (or any other human activity for that matter).

There should be no polution at all, and we actually have the technology to accomplish this task with a minimal impact to our decadent and opulent lifestyle; but that's another subject.

I assure you that buying allowances to polute, or "pay per polution", is far from effective or even fair; as with every other regulation, the rich will be allowed to do whatever they want in exchange for capitalist coin (which they happen to have in abundance).

[thelonious]

But that doesn't mean that CO2 emissions are causing global warming (or any other human activity for that matter).

You do not believe that CO2 and other human made emissions trap heat in the atmosphere?

There should be no polution at all, and we actually have the technology to accomplish this task with a minimal impact to our decadent and opulent lifestyle; but that's another subject.

I assure you that buying allowances to polute, or "pay per polution", is far from effective or even fair; as with every other regulation, the rich will be allowed to do whatever they want in exchange for capitalist coin (which they happen to have in abundance).

Agreed.

[flyermay]

You do not believe that CO2 and other human made emissions trap heat in the atmosphere?

No, I don't.

20 years ago CO2 was supposedly the cause for global dimming, suddenly it was the cause for global warming, and now we have more "impartial" scientists against global warming than in favour of it (which, given the circumstances is rather irrelevant anyway).

I can check the subject in deep for you, but it seems that all the evidences in favour of global warming are simply circumstantial in the best cases, and erroneous and/or biased in the worst cases.

Our governments are simply pushing forward the idea to crucify us with even more taxes (you know, modern weapons and professional armies are quite expensive).

[luciferhorus]

You do not believe that CO2 and other human made emissions trap heat in the atmosphere?


On 1999 and the Future: a Weather Forecast.

http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_viputHRpZ2A/R4vsTtr_HEI/AAAAAAAAARY/3ZLUCnLAdBo/s400/030929_solar_flare_02.jpg
Above solar flare: July 24, 1999. Note the tiny size of planet earth in comparison to the solar flare.

No amount of carbon taxation will convince the sun to behave otherwise.


On 1999 and the Light of the World (the Sun): The Global Warming Hoax 101.

Lucifer
Light of the World
Fire, Plague and poisoned waters,



In the most simple terms.

1: Our planet's surface is 2/3rds water.

2: As the sun heats up, the oceans heat up and release C02. Unfortunately we do not have the means yet to place the ocean in orbit around the earth and we are stuck with it.

http://www1.nasa.gov/images/content/296969main_flare_sxilabeled_HI.jpg

We know for a fact that atmospheric CO2 actually is caused by (or depends on) temperature because as ocean temperature rises it can hold less CO2. The CO2 it releases increases atmospheric CO2.

http://moregrumbinescience.blogspot.com/2009/03/does-co2-correlate-with-temperature.html

http://www.earthfiles.com/Images/news/U/UKRoundway2nd051009Graphic.jpg

3: It is a fact that the earth's temperature is rising.

4: It is a fact that CO2 levels are increasing.

5: It is a fact that the sun has been heating up in recent history.

6: It is a fact that the ice caps on the planet Mars are melting and that Mars is heating up.

7: The melting of the ice cap on Mars has nothing to do with CO2 emissions on earth and there are no fossil fuels being burned on the motorways of Mars.

8: The unscientific conclusions of the following graph.

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_KfE5s-4q1s4/ScLVic4P0hI/AAAAAAAAAB0/IWBy3fClff8/s1600/fig4.jpg


The problem with the graph above is explained on: http://moregrumbinescience.blogspot.com/2009/03/does-co2-correlate-with-temperature.html

To simplify, we know that the earth is heating up and that the oceans are pumping out CO2. Thus it would seem to the unscientific mind that the increase in CO2 is leading to the increase in temperature, but this is entirely a fallacy; the truth of the matter is exactly the opposite, that the increase in temperature is leading to the increase in CO2

"Cast your eyes back up to the graph...Towards the right hand end, you see a dot that's far above the straight line fit. You're not surprised that this is 1998 -- the year of the major El-Nino that was concurrent with a time of high solar activity. The bit farthest below the curve around 357 ppm CO2 is 1992-3 -- cooling effects of Mount Pinatubo" (Ibid)

The "El Nino (Spanish for male child or sometimes 'Christ Child)" described above is a term used to describe "an abnormal warming of surface ocean waters in the eastern tropical Pacific" which can be related to 'solar activity;' as the Light of our World (the Sun) hits the ocean it heats it up and no amount of taxation can change this.

http://knowledgerush.com/wiki_image/f/f7/Solar_flare.jpg
Light of the World

9: No amount of carbon taxation will affect the temperature of the sun.

http://hea-www.harvard.edu/hrc.ARCHIVE/2006/2006048.000000-2006048.240000/SpaceWeather/swpod2006/17feb06/zinkova1.jpg
Cool this down?

10: No amount of carbon taxation will stop the oceans pumping out CO2

Thus when we say that 'Global Warming' is a hoax; this is entirely the incorrect scientific language to use; the globe 'is' warming; the 'hoax' is that by increasing taxation through carbon taxes, that we can stop the oceans pumping out CO2 and that we can affect in any way the temperature of the Sun.


The issue of industrial pollution and is another matter entirely.

CO2 and agriculture. Most hydroponic shops actually sell CO2 canisters which marijuana growers pump into their grow rooms.

Plants love CO2 and it is entirely factual that 'giantism' occurs in plants grown in a CO2 rich environment; a 'Garden of Eden' would be a CO2 rich environment.

Higher CO2 levels are good for our planet. Higher temperature will cause global flooding. Water 'expands' as it heats up and contracts as it cools down. The anomaly is what is called the 'negative coefficient of expansion' where as water freezes it expands again, but we don't have to consider that problem with regards to our environment.

No amount of carbon taxes will stop the mass of the ocean 'expanding' as it heats up.

http://mensa-barbie.com/bloggerimages/earth_solarflarejup

Weather forecast for the Future

The Light of our World is not just 'matter;' our cosmos is entirely animistic and effected by human consciousness, as is mother earth, as is our Sun.

The Light of our World is angry; it is Enraged; it is Furious, as is our Mother.

I am furious. I am enraged.

Expect Fire, Plagues and Poisoned waters.

Expect apocalyptic war, revolution, genocides...etc.

LL

Lucifer.
lux e tenebris


http://science.nasa.gov/newhome/headlines/images/solar/rons_flare.jpg

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[flyermay]

2: As the sun heats up, the oceans heat up and release C02. Unfortunately we do not have the means yet to place the ocean in orbit around the earth and we are stuck with it.

Personally, I don't agree with a couple of points, but I'm really curious about this one: Why do you say that heating up the oceans releases CO2 (carbon dioxide) instead of O2 (water vapour)?

____________

Sorry, water vapour would be obviously H2O (as water)

[luciferhorus]

Personally, I don't agree with a couple of points, but I'm really curious about this one: Why do you say that heating up the oceans releases CO2 (carbon dioxide) instead of O2 (water vapour)?

See http://www.publicaffairs.noaa.gov/releases2003/oct03/noaa03-131.html

NOAA 03-131
FOR IMMEDIATE RELEASE
Contact: Jana Goldman
10/31/03 NOAA News Releases 2003
NOAA Home Page
NOAA Public Affairs

RELEASE OF CARBON DIOXIDE FROM THE EQUATORIAL PACIFIC OCEAN
INTENSIFIED DURING THE 1990S

A recent study conducted by oceanographers Taro Takahashi and Stewart Sutherland from Columbia University’s Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory (LDEO) and Richard Feely and Cathy Cosca from the NOAA Pacific Marine Environmental Laboratory (PMEL) indicates the partial pressure of CO2 (pCO2) measured in surface waters dramatically changed after the Pacific Decadal Oscillation (PDO) phase shift in the Pacific Ocean that occurred around 1990.

The atmosphere and the oceans carry on an exchange of carbon dioxide (CO2), a major greenhouse gas. This is particularly significant in the equatorial Pacific Ocean because it is one of the most important yet highly variable natural source areas for the emission of CO2 to the atmosphere.

“The results of our study show that the intensity of CO2 release from the western equatorial Pacific has increased during the past decade. By 2001, this reduced the global ocean uptake – about 2 billion tons of carbon a year – by about 2.5 percent, ” said Takahashi who directed the study that provides a clearer picture of the importance of PDO events on the Earth’s carbon cycle. “This is on top of the CO2 emission and absorption fluctuations seen between El Niño and La Niña years, which occur on shorter timescales.”

Takahashi said that until more is known about the causes for decadal fluctuations, it’s not possible to predict the future trend. He said the major questions remain. “Would this trend of increasing oceanic CO2 release rates continue or will it switch back the decreasing trend of 1977-1990?”

The findings, published in the Oct. 31 issue of Science, suggest that natural shifts in the properties of the ocean, observed to occur approximately every 10 to 20 years, may affect the ocean’s absorption and emission rates of CO2.

“Since CO2 is one of the primary greenhouse gases, scientists are interested in determining what are the causes of its variability in nature,” said Feely. “The implication of this study is that decadal-scale changes in ocean circulation in the tropical and subtropical Pacific cause changes in oceanic upwelling and possibly the biology which are a major cause of the long-term changes of pCO2 in this region.”


__________________


Carbon on the Land and in the Oceans: The modern carbon cycle




http://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/Features/CarbonCycle/carbon_cycle3.php (This is a NASA site).


In the oceans, carbon dioxide exchange is largely controlled by sea surface temperatures, circulating currents, and by the biological processes of photosynthesis and respiration. Carbon dioxide can dissolve easily into the ocean and the amount of carbon dioxide that the ocean can hold depends on ocean temperature and the amount of carbon dioxide already present. Cold ocean temperatures favor the uptake of carbon dioxide from the atmosphere whereas warm temperatures can cause the ocean surface to release carbon dioxide. Cold, downward moving currents such as those that occur over the North Atlantic absorb carbon dioxide and transfer it to the deep ocean. Upward moving currents such as those in the tropics bring carbon dioxide up from depth and release it to the atmosphere

Apart from this chemical process related to temperature, Carbon Dioxide in the oceans has a bio-chemical source 'within' the ocean due to oceanic plant and animal life.

..............Life in the ocean (also) consumes and releases huge quantities of carbon dioxide.

______________

Further carbon dioxide dissolves in water and can also be evaporated. The oceans of our world contain an estimated 525 billion tons of carbon dioxide.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/climatechange/_45552631_ocean_acidification02_466in.gif

http://bp3.blogger.com/_b5hcKABPlGI/SGG8p1Y1TSI/AAAAAAAAKa0/lv5ZuYosu4s/s400/06-01h.png

LL

Lux

[flyermay]

The oceans of our world contain an estimated 525 billion tons of carbon dioxide.

Amazing; I never thought the there could be any significant amounts of CO2 on the sea.

[luciferhorus]

Amazing; I never thought the there could be any significant amounts of CO2 on the sea.

See also: Global Warming not caused by carbon dioxide

http://www.nov55.com/glody.html

The following text is from the above site exposing the CO2 hoax.

"Because oceans are alkaline (pH 8.1), they absorb all carbon dioxide from the air, but salt drives out one third the amount of CO2 plants need to grow on. Without salt in the oceans there would not be enough CO2 in the air for plants to grow on.


1. The standard method of studying CO2 in a laboratory is to absorb it into an alkaline solution. The oceans are alkaline.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.nov55.com/co2e4-400.gif

2. If oceans weren't regulating the amount of CO2 in the air, the graph would be all over the place. Some years would show two or three times as much as other years. Instead, every year is identical with only a few parts per thousand change per year.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3. Oceans exchange CO2 with the atmosphere at 19 times the rate humans produce it. see numbers


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

4. Carbon dioxide is not a pollutant. Biology depends upon it, and there is a shortage. Corals remove carbon dioxide from the environment by creating calcium carbonate reefs from their shells.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

5. Carbon dioxide in the oceans is improving coral reef production, contrary to the acid-in-the-ocean fraud.


____________

LL

Lux

[flyermay]

See also: Global Warming not caused by carbon dioxide

http://www.nov55.com/glody.html

The following text is from the above site exposing the CO2 hoax.

"Because oceans are alkaline (pH 8.1), they absorb all carbon dioxide from the air, but salt drives out one third the amount of CO2 plants need to grow on. Without salt in the oceans there would not be enough CO2 in the air for plants to grow on.


1. The standard method of studying CO2 in a laboratory is to absorb it into an alkaline solution. The oceans are alkaline.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

http://www.nov55.com/co2e4-400.gif

2. If oceans weren't regulating the amount of CO2 in the air, the graph would be all over the place. Some years would show two or three times as much as other years. Instead, every year is identical with only a few parts per thousand change per year.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

3. Oceans exchange CO2 with the atmosphere at 19 times the rate humans produce it. see numbers


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

4. Carbon dioxide is not a pollutant. Biology depends upon it, and there is a shortage. Corals remove carbon dioxide from the environment by creating calcium carbonate reefs from their shells.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

5. Carbon dioxide in the oceans is improving coral reef production, contrary to the acid-in-the-ocean fraud.


____________

LL

Lux

I heard some environmental scientists talk about it, and they agree that CO2 is not the cause for global warming.

Actually the don't even believe that there is any real evidences to support global warming, for these main reasons:

The samples have just been collected for around 100 years, which is an insignificant period of time in geological terms.
The measurements are only carried in land, which is 1/3 of the planet’s surface.
The meteorological stations are situated inside or in the extra radios of cities, with human activities influencing the measurements (traffic, heating, industry, airports, etc.)
The observed rise in water levels is not homogenous throughout the planet, with some parts sinking and other rising at different levels (due to tectonic movements).

He also states that many scientists are currently agreeing with global warming just because governments provide them with quite substantial grants for investigation (and that without counting the ones who are consulted by governments, which would simply lose their jobs if they disagree).

It is rather quite a complicated subject, but as we say in Spain: "In case of doubt; do nothing".

[flyermay]

You do not believe that CO2 and other human made emissions trap heat in the atmosphere?

I found what I was refering to before on the subject Thelonious, which supports the view that global warming is not provoked by CO2:

"In a recent paper on the effects of carbon dioxide, Professor Ellsaesser of the Lawrence Livermore Laboratories, a major US research establishment in California, concluded that a doubling of carbon dioxide would have little or no effect on the temperature at the surface and, if anything, might cause the surface to cool."
Source: Gerhard Gerlich, 2007,
"Falsification Of The Atmospheric CO2 Greenhouse Effects Within The Frame Of Physics (http://arxiv.org/PS_cache/arxiv/pdf/0707/0707.1161v2.pdf)"

And about global warming, there is an increasing number of scientists that think there are no evidences of it.

It's all on this video (please disregard the title, they are real and well established scientiest; not conspiracy theorists ;)):
http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=-5949034802461518010&ei=i6QpSsLXKIeD-QajzMyjCQ&q=global+warming+hoax&hl=en&dur=3