Crossbows

[entrangermercenary]

Crossbows are not a good weapon if you have other choices of firearms. Granted they are better than nothing. If you think you are going to fire one off and kill somebody instantly forgett it !! If you think they are silent and there is no noise , there is noise. Then there is the pissing about reloading it while matey is closing on you frothing at the mouth screaming his head off because u just shot him with a crossbow. Dont think you will be shooting at 200ms either unless you are william tell :D Ive used them, they dont work as a reliable killing weapon with one bolt !!Ive Nicked this from another site below :)


OldRecon08-12-2005, 05:05 AM
The French Special Force 1er RPIMa use some crossbows.

The French Foreign legion also have played around with crossbows. At least during the 1980's. There's a photo from that period of one legionnaire with green beret aiming a crossbow in the book on the Foreign legion by Canadian John Robert Young. The bowpiece of the weapon appears to be made of blackened steel.
Pic appears to have been taken at a "commando course" run in the Pyrenees.
As for the weapon itself, with what percentage of possibility can one produce a head shot at distances of 4 meters, 10 meters and 20 meters?
Can effects of dart/bolt be enhanced with poison?
One disadvantage with crossbows not mentioned so far is reload time.
If target consists of more than one person in close proximity of each other, I thus guess a silenced smg, carabine or pistol would work better?


Or

don't know why they would. Maybe due to the lack of military buget in their country they had to resort to something. Thinking "outside of the box" is part of special operations. I would think every spec ops type unit in the world has thought of using a crossbow, I know I did.


Here are the facts;

Crossbows are not nearly as silent as you may think. When your life is completely reliant on stelth, this is a poor choice of weaponry. Even a suppressed .22 with subsonic ammo shot through a pillow sounds like a howitzer in the dead of night when you don't want anyone to hear you.

Even proffessionaly built crossbow bolts will lack any kind of consitancy in shot grouping not to mention the relitivly short range.

An arrow/bolt kills it's victim through bleed out and shock. This can take a long time, and the victim is usually aware, and making a lot of noise. A crossbow that would be able to penetrate a human skull would be very powerfull, thus, very noisy.

Reload time is slow, and again, makes more noise than you may think.

The bulk of this weapon in relation to it's effectivness compared to that of a suppressed firearm just doesn't add up.

If you have ever done any kind of patrol in the jungle, you'll know that every once counts, every piece of gear that is not completely nessesary is soon ditched.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but this is just the way it is.

Do any research you like it all comes up negative.

Any thoughts tracker or anybody :) ??

[rydeon]

Don't be so negative man.

Crossbows still fcking hurt and kill, especially if you use barbed hunting bolts ;)

The Chinese still use them. One reason they state is that the bolts hitting a suicide bomber will not detonate where a hot, fast bullet would.

I know for defensive positions xbows rock. You can reuse bolts and make 'em much easier than bullets too :)

Firearms work too but not everyone has one :)

[dreamweaver]

In a land where all the guns have been taken away, the man with a crossbow is king... ;)

I'd be using such things for hunting, personally, but there you go.

[tom bombadil]

I remember my instuctor telling me once that in a man to man contest, the winner will be the one that go's in close to the other.

Crossbows are misunderstood by the great unwashed which is a good thing. If they can see you with it they will know that it can hurt like hell. But if someone was on the warpath then I would put down the crossbow and go for a hand to hand tool instead. A pistle or knife or billhook or axe. Let them come in close and give it to them.

I think that they are better for hunting due to the sound a gun can make copaired with a crossbow. Sounds atract people. I would later use a gun when folk are more sparten. I dont need to eat a dear a day, and a crossbow to hunt for small game at night is better for me.

I have just ordered a colapsable 150lb type for close quarter work. It fits snug on my back.

I will add for referance that it is iliegle to hunt with a crossbow in the uk. So dont tell the copper that you are hunting if he asks. You can carry it around in the open as it is perfectly legal to. But have a place that you are going to all thought out in advance. I see myself as a freeman, so my answers may differ from your own, but by having a cover story and being happy to give your name and a false address you can carry it in the open. Or put it in a bag.


Nelly.

[tom bombadil]

In a land where all the guns have been taken away, the man with a crossbow is king... ;)

I'd be using such things for hunting, personally, but there you go.

But guns are still available to the lawfull. So I say get one if you can.


Nelly.:)

[dreamweaver]

But guns are still available to the lawfull. So I say get one if you can.

I've considered getting a shotgun licence - but it occurred to me that the very first thing the policy enforcement officers will do when TSHTF is round up all the guns off the legal owners. A shotgun is a fine weapon for defending against burglars and the like - but no real match for an Armed Response Unit.

So I dunno. If I was going to get one, I'd probably acquire it by "other" means.

[tom bombadil]

I've considered getting a shotgun licence - but it occurred to me that the very first thing the policy enforcement officers will do when TSHTF is round up all the guns off the legal owners. A shotgun is a fine weapon for defending against burglars and the like - but no real match for an Armed Response Unit.

So I dunno. If I was going to get one, I'd probably acquire it by "other" means.

Get one now and then lose it tomorrow. Get ammo too first. or the means to make it.

First however, ask a mate that understands if you can use his address.


Nelly.

[cruise4]

In a land where all the guns have been taken away, the man with a crossbow is king

Yes, and they are damned scary when facing one.

[waylander]

Crossbows are not a good weapon if you have other choices of firearms.

Crossbows arn't firearms, just like dogs arn't Cats !

Even a suppressed .22 with subsonic ammo shot through a pillow sounds like a howitzer in the dead of night when you don't want anyone to hear you.

Thats funny all the ones I've used were so silent you could hear the firing pin strike the rim, but only if you were right next to it.From two feet away no noise at all.


If you have ever done any kind of patrol in the jungle, you'll know that every once counts, every piece of gear that is not completely nessesary is soon ditched.
I have, but what has this got to do with crossbows:confused:



No offence mate, but you come across as a Walt who's spent a bit of time in the TA. Trying to pass himself off as special forces:rolleyes:

Every Britsh Legion has one.;)

But guns are still available to the lawfull. So I say get one if you can.


Nelly.:)

Well said that man!:)

Waylander:cool:

[entrangermercenary]

No offence mate, but you come across as a Walt who's spent a bit of time in the TA. Trying to pass himself off as special forces:rolleyes:

Every Britsh Legion has one.;)



Well said that man!:)

Waylander:cool:


Oh shit rumbled ;)

[stickwhistler]

Even proffessionaly built crossbow bolts will lack any kind of consitancy in shot grouping not to mention the relitivly short range.

That statement is not true!

I am an archer that uses bows with all the sights weights and balances on
and can shoot into a spot of 25mm at 70 metres consistently. 40lb Hoyt recurve.

I also shoot bare bow - no sights, balances or shock absorbers etc,
and can shoot into a 50mm spot consistently at between 18 and 50 metres.
70lb Grozier Scythian bow and 50lb Korean bow. The 50lb is for visitors to try!

I also shoot crossbow, and consistently shoot groups of bolts into
a 50mm spot between 18 and 50 metres. 150lb draw weight.

The crossbow is easy to shoot accurately compared to a bow.
A bow takes weeks of practice to shoot very accurately,
a crossbow takes about 30 minutes - certainly less than an hour.

As to its lethality - using a target bolt or arrow - these will pass straight through a human at short ranges,
and unless a head shot will not kill instantly - indeed thay may not even realise thay had been shot at all for a while, depending on adrenaline levels.
The wound being about 6mm for carbon arrows, 8mm for crossbow bolt, 10mm for wooden arrows.
However my broad-head bolts leave a wound of 25mm, and that would induce death by blood loss within a few seconds (in the right place of course).

Because I was practicing for something I did not touch my crossbow for 3 months,
but the first three shots were all placed into a 50x50mm square piece of card at 30 metres.
That was after not even looking at the crossbow for 90 days! The accuracy was still good.
If I laid off the bows for 90 days, I probably would not be able to draw the 70lb,
and the grouping would be about dinner plate size instead of egg cup size at say 20 metres.

Crossbows are slower to load than bows, and care has to be taken to draw the string back evenly, or it will shoot off to one side.
There is some noise from both the bows and crossbow, but nothing like an air rifle or fire arm,
and on a windy day I doubt you would hear them at say 20 metres.

I am quite prepared to back up my claims.
Pop along to your local archery club and find out for yourselves.
Learn to shoot and then you will know, instead of speculating - usually wrongly!

[tom bombadil]

What you say is as I have read it too.

I had to choose between the two and got the crossbow as a result of staments like your own.

Bullets (rounds) travel at a far greater rate than a bolt (from bow or cr.bow) which is why when one is hit by a bullet, more damage internaly is evident.

The slower speed of the bolts wont deform either on entry, so keeping the target hole small. So by having a cutting edge (hunting head) on the bolt or arrow, one can cause more damage from this relitivly slow unit.



Nelly with more of the same :rolleyes:

[rydeon]

I've considered getting a shotgun licence - but it occurred to me that the very first thing the policy enforcement officers will do when TSHTF is round up all the guns off the legal owners. A shotgun is a fine weapon for defending against burglars and the like - but no real match for an Armed Response Unit.

So I dunno. If I was going to get one, I'd probably acquire it by "other" means.

The trick is to of got your INCH bag prepped and packed and be away before the PTB roll up for arms collections.
In WW2 the PTB actually had to ask the USA to send them rifles due to the arms bans on machine guns in the civilian sector ;)
Just got my provisional membership at the gunclub and the gun safe is in place... :)

[supertzar]

Consider the intimidation factor of pointing a crossbow at an intruder. I think most people would shit their pants at the prospect of taking a crossbow bolt.

[gilly]

I'm interested in learning to shoot a crossbow, but can't find anyone offering training in the NW. Has anyone any suggestions?

[brainfreeze]

I'm interested in learning to shoot a crossbow, but can't find anyone offering training in the NW. Has anyone any suggestions?

Maybe they can help?

http://www.lancashire-archery.org.uk/

http://www.sudden-impact.co.uk/archery.html

[gilly]

Maybe they can help?

http://www.lancashire-archery.org.uk/

http://www.sudden-impact.co.uk/archery.html

Cheers Brainfreeze. I did a bit of googling earlier, but was having problems with the internet crashing every few minutes. I'll give these a try.

{edit} No, it's all long bow archery - can't seem to get any sense out of anybody on the subject!

[stickwhistler]

I'm interested in learning to shoot a crossbow, but can't find anyone offering training in the NW. Has anyone any suggestions?


http://www.archeryworld.co.uk/acatalog/Crossbows.html

Click on the 'Home' link and you'll find their 'phone number.
Ask if they have an indoor range to try archery products,
a lot of big shops do. If they don't ask if they know anyone
who uses crossbow in their area - I'll bet they do. :)

Don't be put off by the 150lb draw weight.
Most blokes can't cock one of these without some effort,
so make/buy one of these. Make from wire coat hanger and strong string/paracord. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sSFpWjc3k2c
On that youtube link there are some other crossbow vids that may
or may not be useful to you - I haven't watched them.

If all else fails, PM me and I'll see what I can do to help.

[tracker]

Crossbows are not a good weapon if you have other choices of firearms. Granted they are better than nothing. If you think you are going to fire one off and kill somebody instantly forgett it !! If you think they are silent and there is no noise , there is noise. Then there is the pissing about reloading it while matey is closing on you frothing at the mouth screaming his head off because u just shot him with a crossbow.

Sounds to me that you have the wrong cross bow .

try something with 80bls of power , it would ( although not condoned in anyway ) fire through a car door and pin the person sitting their to that seat .

if fired in the air ------------you DONT get it back and it will dissapear out of sight way before it ever lands .

make no mistake , cross bows are deadly , they can throw a bolt through the head of a cow .
they can cut through a shead pannel 1cm thick no probs and stick into and pearce the rears wall behind it .

as for the acuracy ---------you need practice .

:cool:

[cheeney1]

http://www.crossbowchannel.com/ReviewPages/BarnettPredatorAVi_page1.htm

I had One Of These a while ago, but I gave it away :rolleyes: Crap


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sw8BcZA3LqA


But I prefer One Of These, But I Sold it, More Fun :cool: i regret it big Time :o

[entrangermercenary]

No offence mate, but you come across as a Walt who's spent a bit of time in the TA. Trying to pass himself off as special forces:rolleyes:

Every Britsh Legion has one.;)



Well said that man!:)

Waylander:cool:


Lets try and use our powers of observation again shall we.


Crossbows are not a good weapon if you have other choices of firearms. Granted they are better than nothing. If you think you are going to fire one off and kill somebody instantly forget it !! If you think they are silent and there is no noise , there is noise. Then there is the pissing about reloading it while matey is closing on you frothing at the mouth screaming his head off because u just shot him with a crossbow. Dont think you will be shooting at 200ms either unless you are william tell Ive used them, they dont work as a reliable killing weapon with one bolt !!Ive Nicked this from another site below



Being a bit pedantic about the use of the word firearms but ill give u that 1.

The point is they are not a reliable killing weapon !! Another poster said about how good the grouping is no doubting that then either as he uses bows and crossbows. But that his him standing up having a nice relaxing time under no pressure and hitting a stationary target. Using them in a defence or attack mode against any group armed with FIREARMS imo is not an option. Better off either fucking off quickly and quietly and live to fight another day, or hiding in a Bolt hole ( excuse the pun) :D

" Ive nicked this from another site below" hmm what does that mean. Well ive copied and pasted from another site as I thought it was quite relevant.Well I knew about the crossbow bit and the legion, the other bit was taken off a site about the use of crossbows ie are they any good !!

Any way Im off for a pint in the British Legion, Im the 1 in the corner talking shit having just watched the Rambo films :D ;)

[entrangermercenary]

Don't be so negative man.

Crossbows still fcking hurt and kill, especially if you use barbed hunting bolts ;)
I know for defensive positions xbows rock. You can reuse bolts and make 'em much easier than bullets too :)




Well they will hurt ov course whether barbed or not, being penetrated is not my idea of fun by anything:eek:

And u know do you that for defensive positions cross bows rock !! Explain that as I would like to know if im in that position how to use it :) Thanx

[entrangermercenary]

Don't be so negative man.

Crossbows still fcking hurt and kill, especially if you use barbed hunting bolts ;)

The Chinese still use them. One reason they state is that the bolts hitting a suicide bomber will not detonate where a hot, fast bullet would.

I know for defensive positions xbows rock. You can reuse bolts and make 'em much easier than bullets too :)

Firearms work too but not everyone has one :)


Not comeback on the last question yet then?


Are u to tell me that a suicide vest with plastic explosives and ball bearings and nuts etc will be ignited by a bullet?? :D

[rydeon]

Well they will hurt ov course whether barbed or not, being penetrated is not my idea of fun by anything:eek:

And u know do you that for defensive positions cross bows rock !! Explain that as I would like to know if im in that position how to use it :) Thanx

Well if you really want it explaining here goes.

Assuming you have a longbow you have to expose yourself while drawing / aiming and loosing.
No need to draw while exposed with a crossbow, it stays cocked and can be left cocked :)
Just pop out of cover and shoot :)

Also you need to assume this section is pretty much UK Centric, assuming you actually live in the UK then you need to factor in how byzantine FAC regulations are for actual firearms.
Therefore crossbows will be the weapon you'll likely be able to get hold of, not firearms.

In the UK come a TEOTWAWKI SITX then it will be crossbows that are THE premier weapon carried.

So to clarify, get out there, actually use a crossbow and quit whining :)

[rydeon]

Not comeback on the last question yet then?


Are u to tell me that a suicide vest with plastic explosives and ball bearings and nuts etc will be ignited by a bullet?? :D

I'm not a DI forum whore so give me a second to breath strange merc. :D

Are you for real or always acting this dumb??
Do you have any understanding of how explosives actually work?
Bullets CAN ignite plastic explosives.
HELLO MCFLY!:o:o

[tracker]

Lets try and use our powers of observation again shall we.


Crossbows are not a good weapon if you have other choices of firearms. Granted they are better than nothing. If you think you are going to fire one off and kill somebody instantly forget it !! If you think they are silent and there is no noise , there is noise. Then there is the pissing about reloading it while matey is closing on you frothing at the mouth screaming his head off because u just shot him with a crossbow. Dont think you will be shooting at 200ms either unless you are william tell Ive used them, they dont work as a reliable killing weapon with one bolt !!Ive Nicked this from another site below



Being a bit pedantic about the use of the word firearms but ill give u that 1.

The point is they are not a reliable killing weapon !! Another poster said about how good the grouping is no doubting that then either as he uses bows and crossbows. But that his him standing up having a nice relaxing time under no pressure and hitting a stationary target. Using them in a defence or attack mode against any group armed with FIREARMS imo is not an option. Better off either fucking off quickly and quietly and live to fight another day, or hiding in a Bolt hole ( excuse the pun) :D

" Ive nicked this from another site below" hmm what does that mean. Well ive copied and pasted from another site as I thought it was quite relevant.Well I knew about the crossbow bit and the legion, the other bit was taken off a site about the use of crossbows ie are they any good !!

Any way Im off for a pint in the British Legion, Im the 1 in the corner talking shit having just watched the Rambo films :D ;)

you do make some good points here .
Prefured weapon if possible --------mine would be --------------aha -not telling , but it wouldnt be a xbow . i do have one and it is good , but it isnt my prefured weapon in combat with and evil enemy who also has a weapon pointed at me .

I suppose I would just think on my feet and use whats available at the time if needed to survive .

:cool:

[entrangermercenary]

I'm not a DI forum whore so give me a second to breath strange merc. :D

Are you for real or always acting this dumb??
Do you have any understanding of how explosives actually work?
Bullets CAN ignite plastic explosives.
HELLO MCFLY!:o:o


I just thought that u could actually burn pe without ignition and it takes a input from a foreign device like a detanator, with det cord and a ingnition device for the det cord be it electronic or fire :eek:

[entrangermercenary]

Well if you really want it explaining here goes.

Assuming you have a longbow you have to expose yourself while drawing / aiming and loosing.
No need to draw while exposed with a crossbow, it stays cocked and can be left cocked :)
Just pop out of cover and shoot :)

Also you need to assume this section is pretty much UK Centric, assuming you actually live in the UK then you need to factor in how byzantine FAC regulations are for actual firearms.
Therefore crossbows will be the weapon you'll likely be able to get hold of, not firearms.

In the UK come a TEOTWAWKI SITX then it will be crossbows that are THE premier weapon carried.

So to clarify, get out there, actually use a crossbow and quit whining :)

Just pop out of cover and shoot!! :eek: And Mr William Tell u will put 1 right thru his head 1st shot :D

Have you ever played out a scenario with xbows ?? ie lets say for instance several people charging a bunker with several xbow men in it ?? Or Sentry elimination ?? Just cant c how it can work but call me thick eh :) :confused:

No weapons in the uk:confused: Thought half of Manchester and Liverpool were armed !! :)

[rydeon]

Just pop out of cover and shoot!! :eek: And Mr William Tell u will put 1 right thru his head 1st shot :D

Have you ever played out a scenario with xbows ?? ie lets say for instance several people charging a bunker with several xbow men in it ?? Or Sentry elimination ?? Just cant c how it can work but call me thick eh :) :confused:

No weapons in the uk:confused: Thought half of Manchester and Liverpool were armed !! :)

Are we now shifting from law-abiding survivalists to criminal?
I don't even think criminals are of the survivalist ilk.
Most of them will end up shooting each other to death in the cities while the real survivalists will be in the countryside watching and waiting for the sht to die down :D

[tracker]

Are we now shifting from law-abiding survivalists to criminal?
I don't even think criminals are of the survivalist ilk.
Most of them will end up shooting each other to death in the cities while the real survivalists will be in the countryside watching and waiting for the sht to die down :D


I know you never put this remark to me ( ie the quote above )

just for the record to back up what you say about towns and streets though ,

bruce lee said

the true way to win a fight ---------is not to fight .

You wont find me fighting in the towns and streets , I will be held up safe in some place even the army dont search .

not caves
not country side
not mountians

but somewhere ---------where "big bad john" has been layed to rest .

:cool:

[rydeon]

I just thought that u could actually burn pe without ignition and it takes a input from a foreign device like a detanator, with det cord and a ingnition device for the det cord be it electronic or fire :eek:

It sure does and I've seen it happen while in excercise in the forces. But I challenge you now to stand next to a suicide bombers kit and it be shot with red hot lead. Then see what happens. Hopefully no estranger decorating the ground but who knows?
I know I'd choose to be stood next to the set that gets hit with a crossbow bolt :)

[entrangermercenary]

It sure does and I've seen it happen while in excercise in the forces. But I challenge you now to stand next to a suicide bombers kit and it be shot with red hot lead. Then see what happens. Hopefully no estranger decorating the ground but who knows?
I know I'd choose to be stood next to the set that gets hit with a crossbow bolt :)

Get the kit not a problem :D Not who knows, I know it wont detonate. Did u dabble in explosives then while on exercise?? :)

[entrangermercenary]

Ok if you are thinking of getting a xbow have a read plenty more stuff out there

http://www.geocities.com/gunversation/bowsversuscrossbows/bowsversuscrossbows.htm#1)%20Crossbows%20are%20too %20powerful%20and%20therefore%20an%20unfair%20adva ntage%20when%20hunting.

http://www.crossbow.com/frequentlyaskedquestions

Hope that helps clarify things a bit. Oh yes any 1 with a suicide vest pm me for the challange. Make it to fit medium I spose please( no running for a while) :D

[entrangermercenary]

I'm not a DI forum whore so give me a second to breath strange merc. :D

Are you for real or always acting this dumb??
Do you have any understanding of how explosives actually work?
Bullets CAN ignite plastic explosives.
HELLO MCFLY!:o:o


So on "EXERCISE" what did u exactly see then, a bullet iginting this plastic stuff or it being blown up by something else ?? Just for clarification so I know what you are onabout :confused: Thanks :)

[stickwhistler]

A 5 min vid' of a couple of guys testing a steel helmet.

They shoot it with a variety of crossbows and a bow,
hit it with a sword and timber post,
then stab it with spears and a dagger.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_BQEkUyrP68

At no time did the helmet retaliate.
It did not riot.
It resisted passively with non-compliance.

[entrangermercenary]

A 5 min vid' of a couple of guys testing a steel helmet.

They shoot it with a variety of crossbows and a bow,
hit it with a sword and timber post,
then stab it with spears and a dagger.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_BQEkUyrP68

At no time did the helmet retaliate.
It did not riot.
It resisted passively with non-compliance.

LOL, well the moral of the story is don't wear a steel helmet. He could of chucked a brick from that range which would of shocked the helmet wearer :)
Would love to ov seen them testing in a field at 40yds though, then we would have had something to look at, and not 6-8 ft . :D

[flamesong]

I got a crossbow last year and I tried it out whilst camping in Wales. I fired five bolts at an earth bank. When I went to retrieve them they had all penetrated the bank up to the flights yet they had all got bent. I figured it was because they are hollow alloy and I've been looking for some solid alternatives since but all I can find are 20" and considerably bigger than the 14" bolts which were supplied with the crossbow.

Has anybody any suggestions?

Incidentally, I had a bit of a 'discussion' with the owner of my local air rifle shop who insists that it is illegal to hunt with a crossbow in the UK. I have searched UK legislation and though I found stuff about crossbows, I found nothing about hunting being illegal.

[tracker]

Crossbows are not a good weapon if you have other choices of firearms. Granted they are better than nothing.

Most situations are not in a war .
This means that using guns has so many disadvantages it is almot inpractical to name them all .
For instants .
your comment above is so wide sweeping .
You say its better than nothing . Well so is having a spear.
This comment of yours seems rather fitting to a modern warfare situation rather than when TSHTF.

Using a gun would give your position away in all curcumstances any situation .

If you think you are going to fire one off and kill somebody instantly forgett it !!
see ! your talking about quickly killing people , not animals .
when TSHTF , do you realy think that you will be able to use a gun and not get shot by the armed forces for it ?
You have wide swept the issue here of how a crossbow isnt good and is better than nothing .
you then talk about how it wouldnt kill a person outright .
Any time you feel like being proof of that entrangermercenary by all means do so .
LOL , what a silly thing to say .
Even bullets dont kill people outright .
sounds like youve been watching westerns too much lol.
Sometimes crossbows dont kill outright , but then same goes with bullets .

If you think they are silent and there is no noise , there is noise.
yes there is noise but not as much as a gun .
Now if we are talking about hunting and not killing people , when a corssbow is fired it does let off a small noise .
but not as much as a gun .
shoot a gun and for the next one half mile all wild life run off .
not with a corssbow .
yes in the emmediate area wild life will run , but atleast you havent alerted the wild life for the next one half mile or so .

Then there is the pissing about reloading it while matey is closing on you frothing at the mouth screaming his head off because u just shot him with a crossbow.
do you know that during the armed seige at the iranian embassy where the SAS stormed it .
One terrorist was shot so many times that an SAS man emptied a whole magazine from a submachine gun and that terrorist still ran at him ????????????
Do you know it took a shot to the head from another SAS man to bring him down ?
so much for people frothing at the mouth because they were shot from a crossbow .
same happens with guns too .
and by the way you said "Maty" ---------IE person .
why do you talk alot about killing people with guns ?

Dont think you will be shooting at 200ms either unless you are william tell :D Ive used them, they dont work as a reliable killing weapon with one bolt !!Ive Nicked this from another site below :)

what you are saying is that you need lost of practice.
but again your still talking about killing people .when the SHTF .
no one can rob you from 200M away .
No one can mug you , rob you , attack you from 200M.
Only the armed forces can .if a person was near enough to harm you , a crossbow would see them off .
Its not as quick as a bullet , but it does kill !


The French Foreign legion also have played around with crossbows. At least during the 1980's. There's a photo from that period of one legionnaire with green beret aiming a crossbow in the book on the Foreign legion by Canadian John Robert Young. The bowpiece of the weapon appears to be made of blackened steel.
Pic appears to have been taken at a "commando course" run in the Pyrenees.
As for the weapon itself, with what percentage of possibility can one produce a head shot at distances of 4 meters, 10 meters and 20 meters?
Can effects of dart/bolt be enhanced with poison?


LOL , PMSL !
Do you know that an average strong crossbow has 80bls per square inch ?
thats nearly 7 times stronger than any powerful air weapon .
thats strong enough to bring down a bear !and they are way bigger and badder than any man !


don't know why they would. Maybe due to the lack of military buget in their country they had to resort to something. Thinking "outside of the box" is part of special operations. I would think every spec ops type unit in the world has thought of using a crossbow, I know I did.

yeah but you missed because it was further away than ten feet .


An arrow/bolt kills it's victim through bleed out and shock. This can take a long time, and the victim is usually aware, and making a lot of noise. A crossbow that would be able to penetrate a human skull would be very powerfull, thus, very noisy.
again it sounds as though you have been watching too much TV westerns !
guns dont kill outright unless you have a good aim to vital organs .
same goes with a crossbow !


If you have ever done any kind of patrol in the jungle, you'll know that every once counts, every piece of gear that is not completely nessesary is soon ditched.

tribes live in jungles and use spears .this is the UK ! Not the jungle .
BTW , what ever training you had , was defo hollywood .
you bang on about your spec ops training , but dont give any info on it do you .
allyou do is contradict things .
this thread is not a specialists work .
you need to brush up !
give us this spec ops knowledge .
in fact if you were spec ops you should know how to hunt and kill 1st time around with a crossbow .
this isnt vietnam , rambos with guns bang bang bang .
its the UK . and so far all you have done is talk about killing people in jungles with guns .
you dont seem to have any specialist traning concerning crossbows .


Sorry to burst your bubble, but this is just the way it is.


the only bubble you have burst is the idea that you have spec op traning LOL.
anyone can see by the entirety of the length of this thread
the input
and how you seem to rate you self with jungle traning

can see

you aint no spec op and this is why

1 ) any person in the "KNOW" would know that when the SHTF , people seen with guns can be automaticly shot on site !
thus , you are giving out some real dangerous life threatening advice !:mad:
WTF !


2 ) Should anyone be cunning enough to have a crossbow , atleast when they use it , no one will here them 400mtrs away , unlike an air rifle !
thus hunting can be done relatively quietly , uncompramised !

3 ) shooting with a gun not only creates a loud noise !
it would frighten the wild life away for the next one half mile .
unlike a crossbow that would only be heard about 100mtrs or so .

4 )you can rtract the bolt and use it again .
you cant do that with a bullet .



I am not impressed with your thread !
it sounds --------------------so Naive , full of , erm how does one put it ?
SHITE from a kid !


just for the record here are some vids .


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIWY4_Gi4Hw

the bonus of hunting with no guns = no sound - no compromise on your position thus not frightening other wild life away .real stealth stuff .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5oTtTrSwAtw&feature=related



get real .

[tracker]

Don't be so negative man.

Crossbows still fcking hurt and kill, especially if you use barbed hunting bolts ;)



even bullets dont just kill outright rydeon .
it seems that the OP is giving some fantsticly wierd info and doesnt know alot about weapons .

or facts !

:)

[entrangermercenary]

Read my original op again :)

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Crossbows are not a good weapon if you have other choices of firearms. Granted they are better than nothing. If you think you are going to fire one off and kill somebody instantly forgett it !! If you think they are silent and there is no noise , there is noise. Then there is the pissing about reloading it while matey is closing on you frothing at the mouth screaming his head off because u just shot him with a crossbow. Dont think you will be shooting at 200ms either unless you are william tell Ive used them, they dont work as a reliable killing weapon with one bolt !!Ive Nicked this from another site below

OldRecon08-12-2005, 05:05 AM
The French Special Force 1er RPIMa use some crossbows.

The French Foreign legion also have played around with crossbows. At least during the 1980's. There's a photo from that period of one legionnaire with green beret aiming a crossbow in the book on the Foreign legion by Canadian John Robert Young. The bowpiece of the weapon appears to be made of blackened steel.
Pic appears to have been taken at a "commando course" run in the Pyrenees.
As for the weapon itself, with what percentage of possibility can one produce a head shot at distances of 4 meters, 10 meters and 20 meters?
Can effects of dart/bolt be enhanced with poison?
One disadvantage with crossbows not mentioned so far is reload time.
If target consists of more than one person in close proximity of each other, I thus guess a silenced smg, carabine or pistol would work better?


Or

don't know why they would. Maybe due to the lack of military buget in their country they had to resort to something. Thinking "outside of the box" is part of special operations. I would think every spec ops type unit in the world has thought of using a crossbow, I know I did.


Here are the facts;

Crossbows are not nearly as silent as you may think. When your life is completely reliant on stelth, this is a poor choice of weaponry. Even a suppressed .22 with subsonic ammo shot through a pillow sounds like a howitzer in the dead of night when you don't want anyone to hear you.

Even proffessionaly built crossbow bolts will lack any kind of consitancy in shot grouping not to mention the relitivly short range.

An arrow/bolt kills it's victim through bleed out and shock. This can take a long time, and the victim is usually aware, and making a lot of noise. A crossbow that would be able to penetrate a human skull would be very powerfull, thus, very noisy.

Reload time is slow, and again, makes more noise than you may think.

The bulk of this weapon in relation to it's effectivness compared to that of a suppressed firearm just doesn't add up.

If you have ever done any kind of patrol in the jungle, you'll know that every once counts, every piece of gear that is not completely nessesary is soon ditched.

Sorry to burst your bubble, but this is just the way it is.

Do any research you like it all comes up negative.

Any thoughts tracker or anybody ??
__________________

Hmm I didnt make it very clear that I nicked it from another site and put the info below from it.The only bit that I have added is this bit

Sorry to burst your bubble, but this is just the way it is.

Do any research you like it all comes up negative.

Any thoughts tracker or anybody


Are you the only person that is going to survive then ?? There are going to be hostile forces ie other people who want your supplies , women and anything else you may have.That is why I go on about weapon capabilities.
Do you think that everybody is going to be in the woods holding hands and smoking the peace pipe when it goes tits up.

Let me clarify tshf for me. It will be a world wide event , which means that each country will have to fend for itself without any outside assistance . That means no aid, fuel will run out as no vessels to bring it in. So no food to shops or anything else . Power supplies down, gas gone ....get the idea.



That event is really a doomsday type event with people surviving how they can, doing what they can.

[entrangermercenary]

even bullets dont just kill outright rydeon .
it seems that the OP is giving some fantsticly wierd info and doesnt know alot about weapons .

or facts !

:)

:D

http://t2.gstatic.com/images?q=tbn:GBOK-2Mw1SMl-M:http://www.istockphoto.com/file_thumbview_approve/8811594/2/istockphoto_8811594-rugged-man-digging-deep-hole-with-shovel.jpg

[lightgiver]

I'm not a DI forum whore so give me a second to breath strange merc. :D

Are you for real or always acting this dumb??
Do you have any understanding of how explosives actually work?
Bullets CAN ignite plastic explosives.
HELLO MCFLY!:o:o

So which Part of HM forces whore did you serve with :)

[tracker]

That event is really a doomsday type event with people surviving how they can, doing what they can.

Now that I can agree with entrangermercenary totally .

It might have helped you and my self ( lOL ) if you were to have made that clear in the OP .

Dont get all flustered though , I am only prodding you to get your backside into gear and start writing some brilliant survival threads based on your knowledge and experience .

thats all .:)

and I will keep prdding you :D

OI !wake up !:D

do something :)

[tracker]

Well if you really want it explaining here goes.

Assuming you have a longbow you have to expose yourself while drawing / aiming and loosing.
No need to draw while exposed with a crossbow, it stays cocked and can be left cocked :)
Just pop out of cover and shoot :)

Also you need to assume this section is pretty much UK Centric, assuming you actually live in the UK then you need to factor in how byzantine FAC regulations are for actual firearms.
Therefore crossbows will be the weapon you'll likely be able to get hold of, not firearms.

In the UK come a TEOTWAWKI SITX then it will be crossbows that are THE premier weapon carried.

So to clarify, get out there, actually use a crossbow and quit whining :)


Brilliant observations Rydeon .

Your point about the crossbows are also spot on .:cool:

[entrangermercenary]

Brilliant observations Rydeon .

Your point about the crossbows are also spot on .:cool:

Brilliant observation ;)

So all of a sudden the firearms in the Uk disappear and all we are left with is crossbows is it !!! :eek:

What do you think all these soldiers will be doing when they go awol to protect there families :confused: Hmm maybe they will just take the weapons with them, raid the armouries.
Has the thought occurred to you a black market in weapons will arise....and im scratching my head here trying to remember the last time I was offered a crossbow on my travels in exchange for certain items. Must have been in the wrong country eh :)

Oh this is not speculation Tracker its first hand experience of what actually happened. So you keep asking questions ;) Ill keep giving answers but you wont like them because they dont tally with the idealistic world that you think is going to come about when the shtf, ie hunting bambi in the woods with a xbow, making flint axes and eating dandilions :)

[petercookie]

There is some excellent crossbows and i do think they would make good weapons, although given the choice i would rather have other, more powerful things ;). But they are not as easy to get hold of.

Me dad as had afew crossbows and as got a compound bow with a 65lb draw weight and that seems quite powerful and can be slightly difficult to pull back sometimes........

I think if you get a crossbow you want a "compound crossbow", they seem better and more powerful imo.....

These look like some decent compound crossbows here - http://www.barnettcrossbows.com/compoundcrossbows/index.html
This one also looks good(although very dear) - http://www.crossbows4u.co.uk/#/stryker/4528291188

I have just checked this website out here - http://www.crossbows4u.co.uk/# - (Good site)
And this is what it says about the uk laws - ource: Act 2003

Offence:
Section 1 - (Sale): It is an offence for any person to sell or let on hire a crossbow or part there of to a person under the age of 18.

Section 2 - (Purchase): It is an offence for any person under the age of 18 to buy or hire a crossbow or part there of.

Section 3 - (Possession): It is an offence for any person under the age of 18 to have with him a crossbow which is capable of discharging a missile, or parts of a crossbow which together can be assembled to form a crossbow capable of discharging a missile.

Hunting is illegal in the UK, it is also illegal to use broadhead bolts, you must only use target points.

Be sensible when using and transporting, it is not illegal to own one but they should not be carried in public and only used on private land. Respect should be given at all times as it is a leathal weapon if used incorrectly. Be very careful where you shoot and ensure there is plenty of room beyond where you are aiming in case you miss.

[bush doctor]

some do it your self weapons:cool:

http://www.weaponscombat.com/improvised-crossbows


Weekend soldier's:D:D:rolleyes:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LF_nlR0xnhA

[entrangermercenary]

Most situations are not in a war .
This means that using guns has so many disadvantages it is almot inpractical to name them all .
For instants .
your comment above is so wide sweeping .
You say its better than nothing . Well so is having a spear.
This comment of yours seems rather fitting to a modern warfare situation rather than when TSHTF.
All the answers in red apply to the paragraph above
So what do you think it going to happen, it will be dog eat dog

Using a gun would give your position away in all curcumstances any situation .

would it really :D of course youve run a sniper course I takeit ??

see ! your talking about quickly killing people , not animals .
when TSHTF , do you realy think that you will be able to use a gun and not get shot by the armed forces for it ?

will the armed forces not be protecting there own families

You have wide swept the issue here of how a crossbow isnt good and is better than nothing .
you then talk about how it wouldnt kill a person outright .
Any time you feel like being proof of that entrangermercenary by all means do so .

course its got the potential to kill you. With a very lucky shot

LOL , what a silly thing to say .
Even bullets dont kill people outright .
Your right , but the stopping power is much more.
sounds like youve been watching westerns too much lol.
Sometimes crossbows dont kill outright , but then same goes with bullets .


yes there is noise but not as much as a gun .
Now if we are talking about hunting and not killing people , when a corssbow is fired it does let off a small noise .
but not as much as a gun .
shoot a gun and for the next one half mile all wild life run off .

Yep it will but ill be eating thanx

not with a corssbow .
yes in the emmediate area wild life will run , but atleast you havent alerted the wild life for the next one half mile or so .

you have to hit it first


do you know that during the armed seige at the iranian embassy where the SAS stormed it .
One terrorist was shot so many times that an SAS man emptied a whole magazine from a submachine gun and that terrorist still ran at him ????????????
Do you know it took a shot to the head from another SAS man to bring him down ?

IS that right.You will find they all had mags emptied into them bar 1


so much for people frothing at the mouth because they were shot from a crossbow .
same happens with guns too .
and by the way you said "Maty" ---------IE person .
why do you talk alot about killing people with guns ?

Err because if you think you are going to be alone in the woods or your little peice of the world you are sadly mistaken


what you are saying is that you need lost of practice.
but again your still talking about killing people .when the SHTF .
no one can rob you from 200M away .
No one can mug you , rob you , attack you from 200M.
Only the armed forces can .if a person was near enough to harm you , a crossbow would see them off .
Its not as quick as a bullet , but it does kill !

Only the armed forces can :D Here we go then 3 blokes are running at you with a knife each nothing else. 200m 23 or 24 seconds to run that distance. So you are going to take 3 blokes out running at you zigzaging in that time are you. Not me thats been watching films.Look at the reply about the availability of firearms in the country. Keep your xbow ;)



LOL , PMSL !
Do you know that an average strong crossbow has 80bls per square inch ?
thats nearly 7 times stronger than any powerful air weapon .
thats strong enough to bring down a bear !and they are way bigger and badder than any man !

Again you havent a clue what you are onabout. Have a look at this video rydon put up to prove his point. In fact it just blew his and your theory to peices. Look how the animal gets away and isnt found for 20mins. Look how close they have to get to hit it !!! And last not least the xbows are that safe thats why the bloke has a gun pmsl you cdnt make it up :p " we just got the signal to go in" pmsl

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJokpxvMmvA

yeah but you missed because it was further away than ten feet .

again it sounds as though you have been watching too much TV westerns !
guns dont kill outright unless you have a good aim to vital organs .
same goes with a crossbow !


Are you mad !!!!!!!!!!!! A fucking gun will cause trauma damage to any area. A round just doesnt go in and stay in or exit. A round may enter your thigh and pop out under your collar bone or anywhere. Internal bleeding or arterial bleed. A .5 sniper rifle will take your whole arm off .You just really showed your true knowledge. Go cut and paste something ffs lol


Im not even going to read the rest of the drivel you have wrote after that last comment. Wished I had read that before replying to any of your post

tribes live in jungles and use spears .this is the UK ! Not the jungle .
BTW , what ever training you had , was defo hollywood .
you bang on about your spec ops training , but dont give any info on it do you .
allyou do is contradict things .
this thread is not a specialists work .
you need to brush up !
give us this spec ops knowledge .
in fact if you were spec ops you should know how to hunt and kill 1st time around with a crossbow .
this isnt vietnam , rambos with guns bang bang bang .
its the UK . and so far all you have done is talk about killing people in jungles with guns .
you dont seem to have any specialist traning concerning crossbows .



the only bubble you have burst is the idea that you have spec op traning LOL.
anyone can see by the entirety of the length of this thread
the input
and how you seem to rate you self with jungle traning

can see

you aint no spec op and this is why

1 ) any person in the "KNOW" would know that when the SHTF , people seen with guns can be automaticly shot on site !
thus , you are giving out some real dangerous life threatening advice !:mad:
WTF !


2 ) Should anyone be cunning enough to have a crossbow , atleast when they use it , no one will here them 400mtrs away , unlike an air rifle !
thus hunting can be done relatively quietly , uncompramised !

3 ) shooting with a gun not only creates a loud noise !
it would frighten the wild life away for the next one half mile .
unlike a crossbow that would only be heard about 100mtrs or so .

4 )you can rtract the bolt and use it again .
you cant do that with a bullet .



I am not impressed with your thread !
it sounds --------------------so Naive , full of , erm how does one put it ?
SHITE from a kid !


just for the record here are some vids .


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZIWY4_Gi4Hw

the bonus of hunting with no guns = no sound - no compromise on your position thus not frightening other wild life away .real stealth stuff .
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5oTtTrSwAtw&feature=related



get real .

Oh I missed this :D Anything else.

in fact if you were spec ops you should know how to hunt and kill 1st time around with a crossbow

We deal with the reality of a situation. Im afraid crossbows have been tried and binned sry:rolleyes:

[bush doctor]

I think your trolling the HOURS if not day's of work by tracker by dis-infoing and certainly sidetracking his ideology, trackers' mission is to put a little cordite up people's asses to THINK AHEAD so they may have half a chance in a disaster scenario wtf,no one on this site has done so much for the average joe on survival'ism.

Since Dunblane any legit small arms have been removed from possession, so any held will be illegal and will draw instant death if you are not trained to use them in front of hard asse'd militia groups!!! tracker's viewpoint is projected from IMO small static extremely covert groups that have acquired good local knowledge of the terrain enabling them to set traps, hunt game, and most importantly maintain a low profile and out of site of militia groups that you seem to advocate that will be the only way to survive ffs.

More than one scenario could present its self in whatever times are to come, and trackers input is covering many, yours entrangermercenary is only one and that is from a militia view point of civil war, natural or man made disaster scenario's will take a while for any banded organisation to mobilise plan and implement attacks to get hold of any resources by killing and raiding civvi's of there stockpiles of food and fuel etc as most peeps will be in a state of panic and confusion for the day's and weeks after said event, and with trackers input like any training will give a heads up and light the cordite and to head to familiar out of the way places "quick smart" to take stock and make plans for the coming storm.

The special forces I know 2 to date would not be seen dead on this site PERIOD,that's a job for the spooks they are far too busy lmbo training training and still training for any coming scenario the norm for active personnel,any retires will be just CIVVIES with no legit small arms maybe some 12's and stalking rifles.

So unless you have retired in Hereford with your mates you will be on your own like the rest of us.

Again the spec op bods I know would delight in giving any tips for basic ground survival if asked and not in any way post sickening death vids:rolleyes: all available even to kiddies.

Don't be sidetracked tracker focus on positive input like usual;)

[tracker]

I think your trolling the HOURS if not day's of work by tracker by dis-infoing and certainly sidetracking his ideology, trackers' mission is to put a little cordite up people's asses to THINK AHEAD so they may have half a chance in a disaster scenario wtf,no one on this site has done so much for the average joe on survival'ism.

I HAVE SOMETHING VERY IMPORTANT TO SAY HERE .

1stly , Thank you Bush Doctor for spotting that and showing it out like it is . ( much apreciated ) .
Entrangermercenary has never made a detailed thread of his own concerning any knowledge that he has picked up through being military trained and then spec-ops trained . Do we need to ask why ?
Also , I have noticed that entrangermercenary does seem to pick up tiny little peaces of my work and makes a whole case around them to contradict my work.
No special -ops would just through the idea out of the window for using a crossbow . They would give detailed tactical advice both pros and cons , not just cons as he does .
IMO , and I am sure it is obviouse by now to every one who has followed recent events , that entrangermercenary is putting peoples lives at rsik .
I will get to that topic soon .


Since Dunblane any legit small arms have been removed from possession, so any held will be illegal and will draw instant death if you are not trained to use them in front of hard asse'd militia groups!!!
And there it is !
Any person found with a weapon during times like when TSHTF , will be instantly shot on sight DEAD !
Also , Any person litigating armed resistance and armed survival with GUNS , will probably be automaticly rounded up BEFORE the SHTF because of big brother monitoring .
ANY SPEC OPS WOULD KNOW THIS !

( Is the finality slowly sinking in etrangermercenary of WHO you think you are really speeking to hear ? Bet it isnt ! )

tracker's viewpoint is projected from IMO small static extremely covert groups that have acquired good local knowledge of the terrain enabling them to set traps, hunt game, and most importantly maintain a low profile
Well done ! Thankyou . You seem to have put into words what I could not and also have now bought me back to the subject of condoning guns and resistance groups on the internet .

As seen on TV , most home terrorists are recruiting and grooming simple folk with armed training and as mentioned on TV call them self "The resistance".

What you are seeing hear Bush Doctor , is a dangerous situation of someone condoning guns and asking people for meet ups .
With all respect to the young man that I think his heart is near the right place , you will not find me anywhere near this individual in any cercumstances concerning meet ups or survival trips because of how blatent and care free his attitude it towards guns and killing people . This will be noted by any authority , and he knows it .
Yes he might not give a hoot , but then that is what is realy worrying about this .



entrangermercenary is only one and that is from a militia view point of civil war,
YEP ! Ive seen this a long way back .


natural or man made disaster scenario's will take a while for any banded organisation to mobilise plan and implement attacks to get hold of any resources by killing and raiding civvi's of there stockpiles of food and fuel etc as most peeps will be in a state of panic and confusion for the day's and weeks after said event, and with trackers input like any training will give a heads up and light the cordite and to head to familiar out of the way places "quick smart" to take stock and make plans for the coming storm.

yes again well done on that one .
My reasons for giving my knowledge other than trying to inform others of this rediculousely weak system is to help people mentaly prepare for when the SHTF which will in the end and hopefuly help them --------NOT to panic because of a small edge that they have gained from these threads giving them vital knowledge .



The special forces I know 2 to date would not be seen dead on this site PERIOD,[B][I]
Looks like some one has also seen the truth here .
Whilst I do admit I was in the Elite airborn forces long ago and would probably now be old school teaching , I do not claim to be a specialist in anyway .
even when you read my threads I to tell people many times to "research the subject for them self because I am not a specialist".
I do tend to conduct my self in a profesional manner when I can even if I am not a profesional anymore .
Ya see , I face factsand also know that NO special Ops would ever come here unless they are a spook grooming people to see if they would be willing to bare ARMS !


that's a job for the spooks
Nuf said there meees thinks .


for any coming scenario the norm for active personnel,any retires will be just CIVVIES with no legit small arms maybe some 12's and stalking rifles.

Which would give your position away for many 100s of meters .
a crossbow doesnt make as much noise as an air rifle even though they do make a noise .
Now a crossbow you can make your self , but you cant make ya own gun and I still dont donate using guns .
A proper time and place for that meees says .
LIKE ? when the Russians invade Britian and your family's life is at risk then yeah sure , shoot the hell out of em .



So unless you have retired in Hereford with your mates you will be on your own like the rest of us.
YEP .




Again the spec op bods I know would delight in giving any tips for basic ground survival if asked and not in any way post sickening death vids:rolleyes: all available even to kiddies.

Thank you again for that because entrangermercenary does not give any threads on basic survivalism at all , just look at his profile it says it all !
you are right too , even a spec ops would be delieted to give survival knowledge to folks yet he does not . He only picks holes on small comments and makes a whole case around them debunking them with polite yet sprecise Grammar in an attempt to make him self look good .
it isnt good entrangermercenary .
You are not doing the survival forum any justice with your threads in it or your trashing them .




Don't be sidetracked tracker focus on positive input like usual;)

I did get side tracked once but not anymore .

I have seen entrangermercenary's profile
his threads
how he interacts with other threads
and the amount of TRUE knowledge that he gives .

Basicaly , I am not impressed .


On that note I am still sure that his heart is near the right place but since I have asked him countless times to create his own detailed tactical threads , he is still unable to create them .
We dont need to ask why .
The evidence is here in forum .

Entrangermercenary , you should stop this premotion of armed resistance .
You will eventually put peoples lives at risk .

So instead of premoting armed resistance and armed self defence

please start making some threads concerning your profesional spec-ops knowledge on survival .

it will be the best thing you can do and would be greatly apreciated by many
and you can take that comment to the bank .

:cool:

[entrangermercenary]

I think your trolling the HOURS if not day's of work by tracker by dis-infoing and certainly sidetracking his ideology, trackers' mission is to put a little cordite up people's asses to THINK AHEAD so they may have half a chance in a disaster scenario wtf,no one on this site has done so much for the average joe on survival'ism.

Since Dunblane any legit small arms have been removed from possession, so any held will be illegal and will draw instant death if you are not trained to use them in front of hard asse'd militia groups!!! tracker's viewpoint is projected from IMO small static extremely covert groups that have acquired good local knowledge of the terrain enabling them to set traps, hunt game, and most importantly maintain a low profile and out of site of militia groups that you seem to advocate that will be the only way to survive ffs.

More than one scenario could present its self in whatever times are to come, and trackers input is covering many, yours entrangermercenary is only one and that is from a militia view point of civil war, natural or man made disaster scenario's will take a while for any banded organisation to mobilise plan and implement attacks to get hold of any resources by killing and raiding civvi's of there stockpiles of food and fuel etc as most peeps will be in a state of panic and confusion for the day's and weeks after said event, and with trackers input like any training will give a heads up and light the cordite and to head to familiar out of the way places "quick smart" to take stock and make plans for the coming storm.

The special forces I know 2 to date would not be seen dead on this site PERIOD,that's a job for the spooks they are far too busy lmbo training training and still training for any coming scenario the norm for active personnel,any retires will be just CIVVIES with no legit small arms maybe some 12's and stalking rifles.

So unless you have retired in Hereford with your mates you will be on your own like the rest of us.

Again the spec op bods I know would delight in giving any tips for basic ground survival if asked and not in any way post sickening death vids:rolleyes: all available even to kiddies.

Don't be sidetracked tracker focus on positive input like usual;)


1.First of all have a look who started the thread you just posted on:)
2. Where have I ever mentioned hereford :confused: Have you just jumped in and not read any previous threads ???
3. Are the SAS the only special forces group in the world then ???

With regards to firearms did you not look at the stats I posted on the other thread. Nearly 1 million legit firearms and upto estimated 4 million illegaly held that was stats from a few yrs ago.

Yes there are many scenarios but the one we were discussing as tracker said was armaggedon... did you not read that thread either ???

If the food supply and water supply runs out the end result is the same. Who is going to feed the army and what with ?? The police will soon fuck off, and exactly the same with the army except they will be taking there weapons with them.

Bushdoctor wrote
natural or man made disaster scenario's will take a while for any banded organisation to mobilise plan and implement attacks to get hold of any resources by killing and raiding civvi's of there stockpiles of food and fuel etc as most peeps will be in a state of panic and confusion for the day's and weeks after said event

End quote

So did you not see the reports in Haiti and Chile then ??? How long did it take before the rioting and looting started. I think you will find within 24hrs, and people realized that for them the shit had truly hit the fan !!!!

Did I say I was a serving member anywhere, at any time in any thread since ive been posting here ??? A big fat fucking NO :D

You will find that only the other day I posted this read the thread :)

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1058708644#post1058708644

As for posting death videos, didnt you like that. Time for a big wake up call.

Explain to me where the population of the Uk are going to disappear to...you know the 57 million plus that live here ??? Lets say 50% die that still leaves 27 odd million. Yep they are all going to stay at home and not look for food or water are they ??? Just a thought as ive seen movements of population.

When you come back pm me and Ill send you some info okay :) Then you can come on and humbly apologize, if your man enuff :) Of course with Trackers thinking it will be photo shopped .

Oh and ask your special forces friends what they think will happen if the food and water disappears in the citys ;)

Looking forward to your pm :)

[entrangermercenary]

Grooming people for armed resistance am I ???

First of all anybody reading this thread can pm cafetimes and ask him bout the advice i gave him regarding a comment he made about wanting to blow trains up etc !!!

Secondly here is a reply to this thread :rolleyes:

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1058657554#post1058657554

Yep really grooming I am :D

Where are the 57 plus million people going to disappear to in the UK when the shtf Tracker ???

[knightofthegrail]

Note, if you want to use a crossbow for self defence (or any bow in fact), dont use sharp tips. They are great for hunting but bugger all use as far as stopping power goes. Instead use the rubber tips used on flu-flu arrows - they hit with concussion rather than penetration (good for hunting birds where you dont have space to rip apart with a broadhead) and will put a man down instantly if shot to the gut (which a broadhead will not do).

My own choice is a 55lb Grozer mongolian bow :)

[bush doctor]

1.First of all have a look who started the thread you just posted on:)
2. Where have I ever mentioned hereford :confused: Have you just jumped in and not read any previous threads ???
3. Are the SAS the only special forces group in the world then ???

With regards to firearms did you not look at the stats I posted on the other thread. Nearly 1 million legit firearms and upto estimated 4 million illegaly held that was stats from a few yrs ago.

Yes there are many scenarios but the one we were discussing as tracker said was armaggedon... did you not read that thread either ???

If the food supply and water supply runs out the end result is the same. Who is going to feed the army and what with ?? The police will soon fuck off, and exactly the same with the army except they will be taking there weapons with them.

Bushdoctor wrote
natural or man made disaster scenario's will take a while for any banded organisation to mobilise plan and implement attacks to get hold of any resources by killing and raiding civvi's of there stockpiles of food and fuel etc as most peeps will be in a state of panic and confusion for the day's and weeks after said event

End quote

So did you not see the reports in Haiti and Chile then ??? How long did it take before the rioting and looting started. I think you will find within 24hrs, and people realized that for them the shit had truly hit the fan !!!!

Did I say I was a serving member anywhere, at any time in any thread since ive been posting here ??? A big fat fucking NO :D

You will find that only the other day I posted this read the thread :)

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1058708644#post1058708644

As for posting death videos, didnt you like that. Time for a big wake up call.

Explain to me where the population of the Uk are going to disappear to...you know the 57 million plus that live here ??? Lets say 50% die that still leaves 27 odd million. Yep they are all going to stay at home and not look for food or water are they ??? Just a thought as ive seen movements of population.

When you come back pm me and Ill send you some info okay :) Then you can come on and humbly apologize, if your man enuff :) Of course with Trackers thinking it will be photo shopped .

Oh and ask your special forces friends what they think will happen if the food and water disappears in the citys ;)

Looking forward to your pm :)

quote
1.First of all have a look who started the thread you just posted on..

does that mean its to be edited by you

quote
2. Where have I ever mentioned Hereford
Err here http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=65301

quote
[I]I do about 280-450 miles per day in the countryside of glostershire, herefordshire,

quote
Did I say I was a serving member anywhere, at any time in any thread since ive been posting here
yep here
Even trialed them in the millitary unit I was with:
http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=65301

3. Are the SAS the only special forces group in the world then...
err No...you seem to imply you have your [B]kepi blanc monsieur

http://img714.imageshack.us/img714/1520/kepilegion1.jpg

quote
With regards to firearms did you not look at the stats I posted on the other thread. Nearly 1 million legit firearms and upto estimated 4 million illegaly held that was stats from a few yrs ago.....

SO
Most of these fkrs have only 1 round many have none,yeah they may start off with a full clip but no one can resist letting off a few rounds"just for practice of course" THEN HOW WILL YOU RELOAD YOUR NINE ,

quote
If the food supply and water supply runs out the end result is the same. Who is going to feed the army and what with...

err the army and there infrastructure, any one that thinks they can take on an army are clearly deluded.

quote
So did you not see the reports in Haiti and Chile then ??? How long did it take before the rioting and looting started...

EXACTLY ::::no time for millita groups to take organised control ANARCHY reins but for a short time.

quote
Did I say I was a serving member anywhere, at any time in any thread since ive been posting here
A big fat fucking yes^

quote
As for posting death videos, didnt you like that....
No why dId you.........;)

quote
Explain to me where the population of the Uk are going to disappear to.

If like you said armageddon your 50% will be more like 90% mortality Armageddon's a big deal there wont be many survivors.

quote
are all going to stay at home and not look for food or water are they:
err they wont have too if they prepared in advance and stockpile like tracker advocates.

quote
Then you can come on and humbly apologize,
: dont think so, I stand by my words

quote
Oh and ask your special forces friends what they think will happen if the food and water disappears in the citys
I dont have to they already KNOW:D

[entrangermercenary]

quote
1.First of all have a look who started the thread you just posted on..

does that mean its to be edited by you

quote
2. Where have I ever mentioned Hereford
Err here http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=65301

quote
[I]I do about 280-450 miles per day in the countryside of glostershire, herefordshire,

quote
Did I say I was a serving member anywhere, at any time in any thread since ive been posting here
yep here
Even trialed them in the millitary unit I was with:
http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=65301

3. Are the SAS the only special forces group in the world then...
err No...you seem to imply you have your [B]kepi blanc monsieur

http://img714.imageshack.us/img714/1520/kepilegion1.jpg

quote
With regards to firearms did you not look at the stats I posted on the other thread. Nearly 1 million legit firearms and upto estimated 4 million illegaly held that was stats from a few yrs ago.....

SO
Most of these fkrs have only 1 round many have none,yeah they may start off with a full clip but no one can resist letting off a few rounds"just for practice of course" THEN HOW WILL YOU RELOAD YOUR NINE ,

quote
If the food supply and water supply runs out the end result is the same. Who is going to feed the army and what with...

err the army and there infrastructure, any one that thinks they can take on an army are clearly deluded.

quote
So did you not see the reports in Haiti and Chile then ??? How long did it take before the rioting and looting started...

EXACTLY ::::no time for millita groups to take organised control ANARCHY reins but for a short time.

quote
Did I say I was a serving member anywhere, at any time in any thread since ive been posting here
A big fat fucking yes^

quote
As for posting death videos, didnt you like that....
No why dId you.........;)

quote
Explain to me where the population of the Uk are going to disappear to.

If like you said armageddon your 50% will be more like 90% mortality Armageddon's a big deal there wont be many survivors.

quote
are all going to stay at home and not look for food or water are they:
err they wont have too if they prepared in advance and stockpile like tracker advocates.

quote
Then you can come on and humbly apologize,
: dont think so, I stand by my words

quote
Oh and ask your special forces friends what they think will happen if the food and water disappears in the citys
I dont have to they already KNOW:D

Left rather quick didnt you and no pm oh well :D

[entrangermercenary]

quote
1.First of all have a look who started the thread you just posted on..

does that mean its to be edited by you

quote
2. Where have I ever mentioned Hereford
Err here http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=65301

lol yes as in travelling not the 22 pmsl

quote
[I]I do about 280-450 miles per day in the countryside of glostershire, herefordshire,

quote
Did I say I was a serving member anywhere, at any time in any thread since ive been posting here
yep here
Even trialed them in the millitary unit I was with:
http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=65301

correct, but serving means as in now this moment :rolleyes:

3. Are the SAS the only special forces group in the world then...
err No...you seem to imply you have your [B]kepi blanc monsieur

well that was hard to deduce as its been posted :)

http://img714.imageshack.us/img714/1520/kepilegion1.jpg

quote
With regards to firearms did you not look at the stats I posted on the other thread. Nearly 1 million legit firearms and upto estimated 4 million illegaly held that was stats from a few yrs ago.....

SO
Most of these fkrs have only 1 round many have none,yeah they may start off with a full clip but no one can resist letting off a few rounds"just for practice of course" THEN HOW WILL YOU RELOAD YOUR NINE ,

seems you know a lot bout this. So you will be well aware of grenades etc that are floating about

quote
If the food supply and water supply runs out the end result is the same. Who is going to feed the army and what with...

err the army and there infrastructure, any one that thinks they can take on an army are clearly deluded.

Have I said anywhere about taking the army on ??Who is going to feed the army when there is no food?? Are the army going to sit quietly while they starve or are people going to desert go home and protect families




quote
So did you not see the reports in Haiti and Chile then ??? How long did it take before the rioting and looting started...

EXACTLY ::::no time for millita groups to take organised control ANARCHY reins but for a short time.

you are talking about a local disaster with outside aid coming in. We are talking about a global disaster with no aid for any1 as they will be trying to sort there own country out !!!

quote
Did I say I was a serving member anywhere, at any time in any thread since ive been posting here
A big fat fucking yes^


Where have I ever said I was a serving member ???
quote
As for posting death videos, didnt you like that....
No why dId you.........;)

quote
Explain to me where the population of the Uk are going to disappear to.

If like you said armageddon your 50% will be more like 90% mortality Armageddon's a big deal there wont be many survivors.

lets just pluck figures out the air shall we. Example we have a solar flare , enuff to knock out all the sats and rfi chips on earth. What happens. Electrics are fried. No power to pump water, no transport, nothing moves all electrical goods fucked. Population intact

quote
are all going to stay at home and not look for food or water are they:
err they wont have too if they prepared in advance and stockpile like tracker advocates.

Stockpile by all means, ive never said not to. The conflict comes with what happens next.

quote
Then you can come on and humbly apologize,
: dont think so, I stand by my words

Yep figured you were not cut out for that
quote
Oh and ask your special forces friends what they think will happen if the food and water disappears in the citys
I dont have to they already KNOW:D

Well they know, why dont you tell us then as you are pally with them. Or is it just possible they will say people will be heading en masse for the countryside looking for the food and water ;)

Oh yep put the photo album up just for you :)


Bushdoctor wroteSince Dunblane any legit small arms have been removed from possession, so any held will be illegal and will draw instant death if you are not trained to use them in front of hard asse'd militia groups!!! tracker's viewpoint is projected from IMO small static extremely covert groups that have acquired good local knowledge of the terrain enabling them to set traps, hunt game, and most importantly maintain a low profile and out of site of militia groups that you seem to advocate that will be the only way to survive ffs.

End quote
1.Are you in the same bracket as tracker and can not read the information presented ??? First of all there are plenty of legit firearms out there.

2. Ah so now we have militia groups appearing do we. Would that be after the second week then.

3.Trackers view point is fluffy survivalism that can be done on a w/end and back to the house Monday.

4.Small static covert groups This is a big flaw that you do not seem to understand. Thousands and thousands are going to leave the city and head for the countryside/rural areas. If you dont agree with that then you are deluded. History shows in time of conflict ie war the countryside normally moves to towns. In times of food shortages/plague the city goes to the countryside !!!

5. So you will not be alone by any means in the countryside.And a bit of info on the deer population in the UK its about 2million, with over half of that in Scotland the rest in England and wales.


6. This is where you make the big fucking error. I am telling you from experience that militia groups will form, gangs are already there and its a small step from A 2 B. I am warning you that militia groups will be operating and combing, hunting and looking for food in the same locations that you are. If they come across you ...what you saw in the video is exactly what will happen to you.
Can I not make it plain enough, you will not be alone and you will be fighting others to survive, and maybe you will get time to go hunting as well !!!

No where Have I advocated joining a militia What I have said Is I live in the countryside , all the farmers are armed and if the shtf they will be joining together to protect there resources.

[bush doctor]

Well they know, why dont you tell us then as you are pally with them. Or is it just possible they will say people will be heading en masse for the countryside looking for the food and water ;)

Oh yep put the photo album up just for you :)


Bushdoctor wroteSince Dunblane any legit small arms have been removed from possession, so any held will be illegal and will draw instant death if you are not trained to use them in front of hard asse'd militia groups!!! tracker's viewpoint is projected from IMO small static extremely covert groups that have acquired good local knowledge of the terrain enabling them to set traps, hunt game, and most importantly maintain a low profile and out of site of militia groups that you seem to advocate that will be the only way to survive ffs.

End quote
1.Are you in the same bracket as tracker and can not read the information presented ??? First of all there are plenty of legit firearms out there.

2. Ah so now we have militia groups appearing do we. Would that be after the second week then.

3.Trackers view point is fluffy survivalism that can be done on a w/end and back to the house Monday.

4.Small static covert groups This is a big flaw that you do not seem to understand. Thousands and thousands are going to leave the city and head for the countryside/rural areas. If you dont agree with that then you are deluded. History shows in time of conflict ie war the countryside normally moves to towns. In times of food shortages/plague the city goes to the countryside !!!

5. So you will not be alone by any means in the countryside.And a bit of info on the deer population in the UK its about 2million, with over half of that in Scotland the rest in England and wales.


6. This is where you make the big fucking error. I am telling you from experience that militia groups will form, gangs are already there and its a small step from A 2 B. I am warning you that militia groups will be operating and combing, hunting and looking for food in the same locations that you are. If they come across you ...what you saw in the video is exactly what will happen to you.
Can I not make it plain enough, you will not be alone and you will be fighting others to survive, and maybe you will get time to go hunting as well !!!

No where Have I advocated joining a militia What I have said Is I live in the countryside , all the farmers are armed and if the shtf they will be joining together to protect there resources.



lol yes as in travelling not the 22 pmsl=======but mention it you did


correct, but serving means as in now this moment======ambiguous

well that was hard to deduce as its been posted=====what you trying to say



seems you know a lot bout this. So you will be well aware of grenades etc that are floating about====yes and no, I have half of them legit firearms that is LOL no grenades though:(


http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/7738/003xhs.jpg



Have I said anywhere about taking the army on ??Who is going to feed the army when there is no food?? Are the army going to sit quietly while they starve or are people going to desert go home and protect families.== maybe, however the military will know in advance and like as in tptb they will be ready;) they will have stocks to outlast the like of a Mancunian or Liverpudlian gangster.

you are talking about a local disaster with outside aid coming in. We are talking about a global disaster with no aid for any1 as they will be trying to sort there own country out !!!====no you were the one that mentioned Haiti and Chilli.


Where have I ever said I was a serving member===another ambiguous quote.


lets just pluck figures out the air shall we. Example we have a solar flare , enuff to knock out all the sats and rfi chips on earth. What happens. Electrics are fried. No power to pump water, no transport, nothing moves all electrical goods fucked. Population intact==== you started the stats where did you get them from.


Stockpile by all means, ive never said not to. The conflict comes with what happens next===fair point, but no one knows coz its all conjecture,knowledge is empowering no matter what the scenario.


Well they know, why dont you tell us then as you are pally with them. Or is it just possible they will say people will be heading en masse for the countryside looking for the food and water====as you have posted there will be no fuel no food from the supermarkets,,,what they gonna do WALK lmao with little or no supplies maybe tens or scores of miles, even specialists need there scran dude, they will be week and easy targets for any of us who have hunkered down with a bit of pre-planing.


1.Are you in the same bracket as tracker and can not read the information presented ??? First of all there are plenty of legit firearms out there====again you like to keep it ambiguous who knows what you are saying half the time.


2. Ah so now we have militia groups appearing do we. Would that be after the second week then.====this is what you are saying,as in the only way to survive is to join a militia, so you tell us.

3.Trackers view point is fluffy survivalism that can be done on a w/end and back to the house Monday.====nothing fluffy here apart from my cannine defence league LOL,curry them if you can, but while your slotting the dogs you've been zero'd.

http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/5622/184a.jpg


4.Small static covert groups This is a big flaw that you do not seem to understand. Thousands and thousands are going to leave the city and head for the countryside/rural areas. If you dont agree with that then you are deluded. History shows in time of conflict ie war the countryside normally moves to towns. In times of food shortages/plague the city goes to the countryside !!!=====again how they going to get there??? by train or bus, like you have said the fuel and essential stocks would have been already taken and check points will be on all major roads they will gleefully take yours that's stashed in the jalopy your going to the countryside in.:rolleyes:


5. So you will not be alone by any means in the countryside.And a bit of info on the deer population in the UK its about 2million, with over half of that in Scotland the rest in England and wales.====I hope we are not alone, any who have made it from the city's will be a welcome asset as they survived through preparation and cunning, and for continued survival labour will be in short supply.

6. This is where you make the big fucking error. I am telling you from experience that militia groups will form, gangs are already there and its a small step from A 2 B. I am warning you that militia groups will be operating and combing, hunting and looking for food in the same locations that you are. If they come across you ...what you saw in the video is exactly what will happen to you.
Can I not make it plain enough, you will not be alone and you will be fighting others to survive, and maybe you will get time to go hunting as well !!!======so you ARE saying that to survive we need to join a militia group,make your mind up...for the video the reverse is true;) that is what will happen to anyone who tries to curry my dogs .LOL

http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/7836/039ym.jpg


No where Have I advocated joining a militia What I have said Is I live in the countryside , all the farmers are armed and if the shtf they will be joining together to protect there resources.====another ambiguous quote dude make your mind up.


The whole point of trackers threads are to give a bit of a chance to Joe soap,these folks will have no weapons or formal training so don't knock the geeza for trying to shed some light,what you are saying is that no one sept organised gangs will stand a chance so we all might as well give up now,we all can create hypothetical scenario's with endless outcomes, for the likes of you me and tracker if we survive the initial chaos then we will bring our basic training methods and past experiences to the for and get on with it.:)

Why dont you start some threads on specific detailed scenarios, some like you would have been taught in La Legion with this in mind there is no ambiguous confusion and you may be taken seriously, and not like another poster said coming across as a Ross kemp wanna be and that your milli experience is from the TA's.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LF_nlR0xnhA

[them]

however the military will know in advance and like as in tptb they will be ready;) they will have stocks to outlast the like of a Mancunian or Liverpudlian gangster.

Thank you, the truth in your statement just made me laugh out loud :)

[entrangermercenary]

lol yes as in travelling not the 22 pmsl=======but mention it you did


correct, but serving means as in now this moment======ambiguous

well that was hard to deduce as its been posted=====what you trying to say



seems you know a lot bout this. So you will be well aware of grenades etc that are floating about====yes and no, I have half of them legit firearms that is LOL no grenades though:(


http://img12.imageshack.us/img12/7738/003xhs.jpg



Have I said anywhere about taking the army on ??Who is going to feed the army when there is no food?? Are the army going to sit quietly while they starve or are people going to desert go home and protect families.== maybe, however the military will know in advance and like as in tptb they will be ready;) they will have stocks to outlast the like of a Mancunian or Liverpudlian gangster.

you are talking about a local disaster with outside aid coming in. We are talking about a global disaster with no aid for any1 as they will be trying to sort there own country out !!!====no you were the one that mentioned Haiti and Chilli.


Where have I ever said I was a serving member===another ambiguous quote.


lets just pluck figures out the air shall we. Example we have a solar flare , enuff to knock out all the sats and rfi chips on earth. What happens. Electrics are fried. No power to pump water, no transport, nothing moves all electrical goods fucked. Population intact==== you started the stats where did you get them from.


Stockpile by all means, ive never said not to. The conflict comes with what happens next===fair point, but no one knows coz its all conjecture,knowledge is empowering no matter what the scenario.


Well they know, why dont you tell us then as you are pally with them. Or is it just possible they will say people will be heading en masse for the countryside looking for the food and water====as you have posted there will be no fuel no food from the supermarkets,,,what they gonna do WALK lmao with little or no supplies maybe tens or scores of miles, even specialists need there scran dude, they will be week and easy targets for any of us who have hunkered down with a bit of pre-planing.


1.Are you in the same bracket as tracker and can not read the information presented ??? First of all there are plenty of legit firearms out there====again you like to keep it ambiguous who knows what you are saying half the time.


2. Ah so now we have militia groups appearing do we. Would that be after the second week then.====this is what you are saying,as in the only way to survive is to join a militia, so you tell us.

3.Trackers view point is fluffy survivalism that can be done on a w/end and back to the house Monday.====nothing fluffy here apart from my cannine defence league LOL,curry them if you can, but while your slotting the dogs you've been zero'd.

http://img651.imageshack.us/img651/5622/184a.jpg


4.Small static covert groups This is a big flaw that you do not seem to understand. Thousands and thousands are going to leave the city and head for the countryside/rural areas. If you dont agree with that then you are deluded. History shows in time of conflict ie war the countryside normally moves to towns. In times of food shortages/plague the city goes to the countryside !!!=====again how they going to get there??? by train or bus, like you have said the fuel and essential stocks would have been already taken and check points will be on all major roads they will gleefully take yours that's stashed in the jalopy your going to the countryside in.:rolleyes:


5. So you will not be alone by any means in the countryside.And a bit of info on the deer population in the UK its about 2million, with over half of that in Scotland the rest in England and wales.====I hope we are not alone, any who have made it from the city's will be a welcome asset as they survived through preparation and cunning, and for continued survival labour will be in short supply.

6. This is where you make the big fucking error. I am telling you from experience that militia groups will form, gangs are already there and its a small step from A 2 B. I am warning you that militia groups will be operating and combing, hunting and looking for food in the same locations that you are. If they come across you ...what you saw in the video is exactly what will happen to you.
Can I not make it plain enough, you will not be alone and you will be fighting others to survive, and maybe you will get time to go hunting as well !!!======so you ARE saying that to survive we need to join a militia group,make your mind up...for the video the reverse is true;) that is what will happen to anyone who tries to curry my dogs .LOL

http://img716.imageshack.us/img716/7836/039ym.jpg


No where Have I advocated joining a militia What I have said Is I live in the countryside , all the farmers are armed and if the shtf they will be joining together to protect there resources.====another ambiguous quote dude make your mind up.


The whole point of trackers threads are to give a bit of a chance to Joe soap,these folks will have no weapons or formal training so don't knock the geeza for trying to shed some light,what you are saying is that no one sept organised gangs will stand a chance so we all might as well give up now,we all can create hypothetical scenario's with endless outcomes, for the likes of you me and tracker if we survive the initial chaos then we will bring our basic training methods and past experiences to the for and get on with it.:)

Why dont you start some threads on specific detailed scenarios, some like you would have been taught in La Legion with this in mind there is no ambiguous confusion and you may be taken seriously, and not like another poster said coming across as a Ross kemp wanna be and that your milli experience is from the TA's.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LF_nlR0xnhA






Where have I ever said I was a serving member[/COLOR]===another ambiguous quote

Its pretty simple really if you cant understand that its not my fault. Again ...where have I ever claimed I was a serving member . You have managed to put up links to other words I have typed, sure its out there if you say so:confused:

YOU WILL NOT BE ALONE.....as in the sense that other people with interests that conflict with yours will also be in and around you, and you will be fighting them to survive Clear enuff??


So you dont think farmers will band together to protect there land/livestock/families ??


I suggest you speak to Tracker about what he posts. He advocates the use of crossbows and not firearms as you will give your position away. He also wants to sit around making axes out of flint in all the spare time he has, as there will be no militias or armed individuals to contend with ??? I have not knocked tracker for info on stocking up, its the bit after that isnt the reality !!!!


Ross kemp wannabe, is that you in the photos.???.... youve been zero'd lol :eek:

Actually I get my info from when Im picking the bottles up at the British legion :)

As you are a man of experience how is the hunting these days.??? I mean with a collection of weapons like that obviously ex military sniper :)
So what is going to make you move to the hills then or where ever ???

[tracker]

Bush Doctor :D

can you see just how difficult and so unreasonable the person is who you speek too ? :D

Its a sad sad situation , you wont win , not because he is right , but because he isnt .:D

Dont waist your energy , you only have to read the 1st page of the OP to see peoples reactions and what they think .

We give him enough chances , he likes making arguements , not conversations .

leave him to it .

:cool:

[tracker]

Shame he couldnt put that much energy into making a good thread "WITH OUT" having to slag other people off .

when he does , he can only argue :D

shame realy .:cool:

[tracker]

two can play that game .

[tracker]

Crossbows are not a good weapon if you have other choices of firearms. Granted they are better than nothing. If you think you are going to fire one off and kill somebody instantly forgett it !!

I showed my 15 year old son this thread and as soon as he got the end of this small part here ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^

he frowned and said
"Bloody hell this man needs to seriousely calm down dont he ?"

now thats coming from a 15 year old boy .


He even says that this guy aint right
needs to calm down
and
people need to stay away from him .

now if a 15 year old can see it


you should too folks.

[bush doctor]

Where have I ever said I was a serving member[/COLOR]===another ambiguous quote

Its pretty simple really if you cant understand that its not my fault. Again ...where have I ever claimed I was a serving member . You have managed to put up links to other words I have typed, sure its out there if you say so:confused:

YOU WILL NOT BE ALONE.....as in the sense that other people with interests that conflict with yours will also be in and around you, and you will be fighting them to survive Clear enuff??


So you dont think farmers will band together to protect there land/livestock/families ??


I suggest you speak to Tracker about what he posts. He advocates the use of crossbows and not firearms as you will give your position away. He also wants to sit around making axes out of flint in all the spare time he has, as there will be no militias or armed individuals to contend with ??? I have not knocked tracker for info on stocking up, its the bit after that isnt the reality !!!!


Ross kemp wannabe, is that you in the photos.???.... youve been zero'd lol :eek:

Actually I get my info from when Im picking the bottles up at the British legion :)

As you are a man of experience how is the hunting these days.??? I mean with a collection of weapons like that obviously ex military sniper :)
So what is going to make you move to the hills then or where ever ???







If and when the shtf I know that there will be bods after what I have,and Ill do what ever it takes to protect them and mine, no surprise for me for you to try and enlighten me on this fact.

As for the farmers I am one but no live stock to protect "thank fck" too much like hard work,however we are are tight nit group of mainly hunters and fishermen.

I have great respect for tracker and his ideology :) to start from scratch,makes sense to me dude, he reminds me of survival instructers I have known in the past,any trainee in the army navy or wherever started there knowledge base with basic techniques, these had to be mastered before they could pass out,so all professionaly trained personel had to start somewhere eh, so why not the uninitiated on the forums,I know its going to be tough you dont have to tell me.

I miss the legion used to enjoy a pint or two there myself.

I have been a game keeper, sports shooter, stalker "deer that is"LOL plus a wild boar hunter, here in La France many can be taken to 200lbs, this is with slugs and the 12g at short range typically 40,60 mtrs, very fast adrenaline pumping stuff. though now I dont hunt at all,:eek: over 2 years now , I have had my fill of killing things and have actually become a non meat eater;) in preferance to fish and things from the sea,it makes me feel better mentally as well as physically, though I do keep my guns, like charlton heston said "youll take them from my cold dead hands" love that quote.

Never been a military sniper, but have to admitt I have signed the OSA many moons ago.

Ross Kemp pmsl touché gotta give ya that one dude, I do look like him dont I.

Dont need to go to hills as I'm near deep caves.

For me my passion now lies with feeding the mind,:) readying myself spiritualy as well as physicaly for the coming storm.

This is something the wise will include in lifes battle plans.;)

Bon weekend a tous:D

[tracker]

If and when the shtf I know that there will be bods after what I have,and Ill do what ever it takes to protect them and mine, no surprise for me for you to try and enlighten me on this fact.

As for the farmers I am one but no live stock to protect "thank fck" too much like hard work,however we are are tight nit group of mainly hunters and fishermen.

I have great respect for tracker and his ideology :) to start from scratch,makes sense to me dude, he reminds me of survival instructers I have known in the past,any trainee in the army navy or wherever started there knowledge base with basic techniques, these had to be mastered before they could pass out,so all professionaly trained personel had to start somewhere eh, so why not the uninitiated on the forums,I know its going to be tough you dont have to tell me.

I miss the legion used to enjoy a pint or two there myself.

I have been a game keeper, sports shooter, stalker "deer that is"LOL plus a wild boar hunter, here in La France many can be taken to 200lbs, this is with slugs and the 12g at short range typically 40,60 mtrs, very fast adrenaline pumping stuff. though now I dont hunt at all,:eek: over 2 years now , I have had my fill of killing things and have actually become a non meat eater;) in preferance to fish and things from the sea,it makes me feel better mentally as well as physically, though I do keep my guns, like charlton heston said "youll take them from my cold dead hands" love that quote.

Never been a military sniper, but have to admitt I have signed the OSA many moons ago.

Ross Kemp pmsl touché gotta give ya that one dude, I do look like him dont I.

Dont need to go to hills as I'm near deep caves.

For me my passion now lies with feeding the mind,:) readying myself spiritualy as well as physicaly for the coming storm.

This is something the wise will include in lifes battle plans.;)

Bon weekend a tous:D


Nicely handled there , very good .

:)

[entrangermercenary]

If and when the shtf I know that there will be bods after what I have,and Ill do what ever it takes to protect them and mine, no surprise for me for you to try and enlighten me on this fact.

As for the farmers I am one but no live stock to protect "thank fck" too much like hard work,however we are are tight nit group of mainly hunters and fishermen.

I have great respect for tracker and his ideology to start from scratch,makes sense to me dude, he reminds me of survival instructers I have known in the past,any trainee in the army navy or wherever started there knowledge base with basic techniques, these had to be mastered before they could pass out,so all professionaly trained personel had to start somewhere eh, so why not the uninitiated on the forums,I know its going to be tough you dont have to tell me.

I miss the legion used to enjoy a pint or two there myself.

I have been a game keeper, sports shooter, stalker "deer that is"LOL plus a wild boar hunter, here in La France many can be taken to 200lbs, this is with slugs and the 12g at short range typically 40,60 mtrs, very fast adrenaline pumping stuff. though now I dont hunt at all,:eek: over 2 years now , I have had my fill of killing things and have actually become a non meat eater;) in preferance to fish and things from the sea,it makes me feel better mentally as well as physically, though I do keep my guns, like charlton heston said "youll take them from my cold dead hands" love that quote.

Never been a military sniper, but have to admitt I have signed the OSA many moons ago.

Ross Kemp pmsl touché gotta give ya that one dude, I do look like him dont I.

Dont need to go to hills as I'm near deep caves.

For me my passion now lies with feeding the mind, readying myself spiritualy as well as physicaly for the coming storm.

This is something the wise will include in lifes battle plans.;)

Bon weekend a tous

Interesting....soon as I saw you picking up on words and playing with them such as Hereford... had you down as whats the army expression " green slime " :) I think you know exactly what i mean by that. If you dont its not derogatory really :p

So how many beasties have you taken down with a crossbow then and at what distance. How many cross bow shooters in France if its legal ??

Explain to me start from scratch as im confused on this issue. Do you mean as in flint axes ???

I was taking the piss abit about the military sniper bit tho. :D

But at least you have shot at a decent level then against oncoming beasties that would do serious damage.

I dont hunt :eek: doesnt appeal to me ....but im in the forest everyday tracking deer , looking where they have been etc.

Deep caves eh. Thats your problem not mine suppose youve been down them after its been pissing down for a few weeks to see how many are dry caves in that situation ??

No ERV then if compromised ??

I have a cave system not to far from me its over 600acres so not to bad. Various old mines. 2 separate large forest systems with boar, deer and all the other creature comforts :D 2 major rivers running as well in the location.

If you like trackers philosophy you wont be needing them weapons you have either !!! You can also point out some of the relevant threads for the uninitiated like myself so I can go back and read them :)

Right Laurence of Arabia is on may get myself a few more story tips eh ;)

Aurevoir

[the_count]

To Tracker, Mercenary etc

As far as i am concerned you both have relevant points, you just look at things from a different perspective, on some parts i agree with both of you but i'm not going into detail.
This forum is about survival etc, its a complicated topic depending on what the scenario is, i think its like comparing Bushcraft and Survival, whilst there is a crossover its definately 2 different things, from what i have read Tracker perhaps falls into the Bushcraft side of things and mercenary into the pure Survival side. Like i said the 2 crossover, In a SHTF scenario such as a war, then survival means just that, living from day to day, scrapping for food and water, violence, guns, crossbows whatever you can get your hands on. You could in my opinion use your bushcraft type skills, living off the land, building shelters etc once if at all things had stabalised.

Anyway, i have gone off on a bit of a tangent to be honest, i came on here to ask you all to put this to bed so to speak, i rarely come on here as it is due to all the bitching, SO lets stop all this, he said this, he said that dragging up old quotes etc, to be frank WHO FUCKING CARES ? its a bloody internet forum for fucks sake !
People will have different opinions, lets live with it eh and get on with life.
Lets not spoil this part of the forum anymore, so please just stick to sharing any info you all wish to contribute, if you dont agree lets leave all the childish shit out eh ?

Thanks :)

[bush doctor]

To Tracker, Mercenary etc

As far as i am concerned you both have relevant points, you just look at things from a different perspective, on some parts i agree with both of you but i'm not going into detail.
This forum is about survival etc, its a complicated topic depending on what the scenario is, i think its like comparing Bushcraft and Survival, whilst there is a crossover its definately 2 different things, from what i have read Tracker perhaps falls into the Bushcraft side of things and mercenary into the pure Survival side. Like i said the 2 crossover, In a SHTF scenario such as a war, then survival means just that, living from day to day, scrapping for food and water, violence, guns, crossbows whatever you can get your hands on. You could in my opinion use your bushcraft type skills, living off the land, building shelters etc once if at all things had stabalised.

Anyway, i have gone off on a bit of a tangent to be honest, i came on here to ask you all to put this to bed so to speak, i rarely come on here as it is due to all the bitching, SO lets stop all this, he said this, he said that dragging up old quotes etc, to be frank WHO FUCKING CARES ? its a bloody internet forum for fucks sake !
People will have different opinions, lets live with it eh and get on with life.
Lets not spoil this part of the forum anymore, so please just stick to sharing any info you all wish to contribute, if you dont agree lets leave all the childish shit out eh ?

Thanks :)

Fair comment last post deleted neet neet :cool::D:D

[entrangermercenary]

:pTo Tracker, Mercenary etc

As far as i am concerned you both have relevant points, you just look at things from a different perspective, on some parts i agree with both of you but i'm not going into detail.
This forum is about survival etc, its a complicated topic depending on what the scenario is, i think its like comparing Bushcraft and Survival, whilst there is a crossover its definately 2 different things, from what i have read Tracker perhaps falls into the Bushcraft side of things and mercenary into the pure Survival side. Like i said the 2 crossover, In a SHTF scenario such as a war, then survival means just that, living from day to day, scrapping for food and water, violence, guns, crossbows whatever you can get your hands on. You could in my opinion use your bushcraft type skills, living off the land, building shelters etc once if at all things had stabalised.

Anyway, i have gone off on a bit of a tangent to be honest, i came on here to ask you all to put this to bed so to speak, i rarely come on here as it is due to all the bitching, SO lets stop all this, he said this, he said that dragging up old quotes etc, to be frank WHO FUCKING CARES ? its a bloody internet forum for fucks sake !
People will have different opinions, lets live with it eh and get on with life.
Lets not spoil this part of the forum anymore, so please just stick to sharing any info you all wish to contribute, if you dont agree lets leave all the childish shit out eh ?

Thanks :)

Nice post..... but the hand of friendship was offered, taken and then rejected lol :D ;)
Ill agree if Tracker agrees I was spec ops or at least a bottle washer in the british legion :p

[them]

Disagreeing isn't necessarily unhealthy, imo.

The bickering inside here over points of view is as normal as you and yer mates arguing the toss over this & that in the 3D world :)

We are all involved in an electronic evolutionary process or meme (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme).. We are all living in A Brave New World! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brave_New_World)

[entrangermercenary]

Disagreeing isn't necessarily unhealthy, imo.

The bickering inside here over points of view is as normal as you and yer mates arguing the toss over this & that in the 3D world :)

We are all involved in an electronic evolutionary process or meme (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Meme).. We are all living in A Brave New World! (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brave_New_World)

NO ITS NOT, go on smart ass contradict me :eek: :)

[trevvytrev23]

If someone had ever had spec ops training, can't see them shouting to all and sundry about it... Hmmm?

I think someone's been playing a little too much X Box. Fantasist.

[them]

NO ITS NOT, go on smart ass contradict me :eek: :)

:D

If someone had ever had spec ops training, can't see them shouting to all and sundry about it... Hmmm?

I think someone's been playing a little too much X Box. Fantasist.

I think you're wrong about entrangermercenary.. he knows the score, imo, and isn't afraid of writing his point of view.

We need posters like him & tracker.

[hunter77]

If someone had ever had spec ops training, can't see them shouting to all and sundry about it... Hmmm?

I think someone's been playing a little too much X Box. Fantasist.

your wrong about him mate, he's the real deal;)

[entrangermercenary]

If someone had ever had spec ops training, can't see them shouting to all and sundry about it... Hmmm?

I think someone's been playing a little too much X Box. Fantasist.

Let me just correct you a bit. My boys play the xbox I cdnt even start one :o an IM serious about that. :D

[entrangermercenary]

your wrong about him mate, he's the real deal;)

Slips the £100 pound oop north :)

[trevvytrev23]

:D



I think you're wrong about entrangermercenary.. he knows the score, imo, and isn't afraid of writing his point of view.

We need posters like him & tracker.

your wrong about him mate, he's the real deal;)

*Chows down on humble pie*

I'll look at some earlier posts of theirs.

[tracker]

*Chows down on humble pie*

I'll look at some earlier posts of theirs.

PMSL .:D

its good to eat humble pie to keep the peace lol but meees sees no reason why you should eat humble pie for being observant .

well done ! :cool:

[bush doctor]

1.First of all have a look who started the thread you just posted on:)
2. Where have I ever mentioned hereford :confused: Have you just jumped in and not read any previous threads ???
3. Are the SAS the only special forces group in the world then ???

With regards to firearms did you not look at the stats I posted on the other thread. Nearly 1 million legit firearms and upto estimated 4 million illegaly held that was stats from a few yrs ago.

Yes there are many scenarios but the one we were discussing as tracker said was armaggedon... did you not read that thread either ???

If the food supply and water supply runs out the end result is the same. Who is going to feed the army and what with ?? The police will soon fuck off, and exactly the same with the army except they will be taking there weapons with them.

Bushdoctor wrote
natural or man made disaster scenario's will take a while for any banded organisation to mobilise plan and implement attacks to get hold of any resources by killing and raiding civvi's of there stockpiles of food and fuel etc as most peeps will be in a state of panic and confusion for the day's and weeks after said event

End quote

So did you not see the reports in Haiti and Chile then ??? How long did it take before the rioting and looting started. I think you will find within 24hrs, and people realized that for them the shit had truly hit the fan !!!!

Did I say I was a serving member anywhere, at any time in any thread since ive been posting here ??? A big fat fucking NO :D

You will find that only the other day I posted this read the thread :)

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?p=1058708644#post1058708644

As for posting death videos, didnt you like that. Time for a big wake up call.

Explain to me where the population of the Uk are going to disappear to...you know the 57 million plus that live here ??? Lets say 50% die that still leaves 27 odd million. Yep they are all going to stay at home and not look for food or water are they ??? Just a thought as ive seen movements of population.

When you come back pm me and Ill send you some info okay :) Then you can come on and humbly apologize, if your man enuff :) Of course with Trackers thinking it will be photo shopped .

Oh and ask your special forces friends what they think will happen if the food and water disappears in the citys ;)

Looking forward to your pm :)

bush doctor
Only just sussed your album, "sorry".

Well your defo not DI :eek:respect dude wish I could have a pint with you and be able say it vis a vis.

Great pix btw

I'v just had my scoff, but I'll eat some Humble pie by posting this to the open forum too.:cool:

[entrangermercenary]

bush doctor
Only just sussed your album, "sorry".

Well your defo not DI :eek:respect dude wish I could have a pint with you and be able say it vis a vis.

Great pix btw

I'v just had my scoff, but I'll eat some Humble pie by posting this to the open forum too.:cool:


Merci beaucoup....it is indeed a gracious man who can apologize . No hard feelings by me anyway, water off a ducks back :)

The 1st pints on me !!!

[petercookie]

bush doctor
Only just sussed your album, "sorry".

Well your defo not DI :eek:respect dude wish I could have a pint with you and be able say it vis a vis.

Great pix btw


Where is all the pixs??

I like behing a nosey unt :D (I had alook but cant find any) :o


Use all seem well kitted up with your weapons ect - but i got the best = some throwing knives, so the NWO better watch out now like...............

[bush doctor]

pm'd :D

[bush doctor]

Where is all the pixs??

I like behing a nosey unt :D (I had alook but cant find any) :o


Use all seem well kitted up with your weapons ect - but i got the best = some throwing knives, so the NWO better watch out now like...............

That's one of the benefits of living La France, almost anyone can buy a 22lr if you are over 18 and a resident, a phone bill's proof enough to walk out the shop with one in ten mins, just need to register its no's with the G'D.

Any thing bigger which takes centre fire shells like shotguns, hunting rifles and hand gun's will have the need to join a club or sit the hunting test,a doddle if you know your game and what weapons are certified to take them out,oh and if you can speako the lingo helps LOL.

I had both my shotgun and an FAC in the UK but they don't cut any ice here:mad:

If you havent got the language or the dough to join a club or even a permenant address you can still buy black powder weapons, and they come BIG if you look at my gun collection to the right of the 12g is a thumping 50 cal bolt action muzzel loader "250 euros",easy enough energy to take out a deer at 400 mtrs if you have the skill,trouble is you have to wait a week for the smoke to clear before you know if you hit it:rolleyes:

One of my m8's got a 54 cal Martini henry with full a length brass scope, what a lump that is, it's still percusion cap but you have brass shells that you charge up and load from the breach.:cool:

When I first moved to the farm every Sunday was like dodge city on a sat night when he came over and we shot the fck out of the oil drum targets, I had a navy colt 45 black powder, fun but dirty and smelly.

check out the shops:D

http://www.armurerie-auxerre.com/catalog/black-powder-rifles-c-122_203.html


http://www.fusil-calais.com/shop/cat_main.asp?7$22

http://www.fusil-calais.com/shop/cat_main.asp?7$20$1


http://www.armurerie-lavaux.com/ssf.php?id=6&ids=118

[petercookie]

If you havent got the language or the dough to join a club or even a permenant address you can still buy black powder weapons, and they come BIG if you look at my gun collection to the right of the 12g is a thumping 50 cal bolt action muzzel loader "250 euros",easy enough energy to take out a deer at 400 mtrs if you have the skill,trouble is you have to wait a week for the smoke to clear before you know if you hit it

That sounds quality that though and with the price aswell, seems very good.

Theres to many restrictions i think, guns should be made legal. ;)

I have never done any hunting (i am too much of a hippy:D) and i have never been in the army, so dont have that much experience with guns/rifles ect but if they were legal or i could get hold off one i would be tempted. because ultimately it is power, and you know that if anyone fucks with you/and or SHTF, you have alot more options available..........

I am just left with a poor old crossbow :(:D

Thanks for the links too - i will have alook

[stickwhistler]

Just for Tracker and EM to argue over :D

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QS4RKoRyTik&feature=related

and

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TAyCVTV8-lM&feature=rec-fresh+div-r-4-HM

[tracker]

Really ?

looks like someone THINKS they know me ?

Funny how such a small remark can tell you so much about the person who wrote it .

[dhcracker]

Wow what an argument over nothing. Every weapon has benefits and disadvantages to others. You want deadly silent? I have a sword that won't make a sound till it hits your bones lol. Everything has its uses.. even that sword in trained hands.

It doesn't really matter what you have as long as you can use it. And I feel so sorry for you guys that can't own firearms. They may be a danger to society or whatever but society should be able to accept the risks it wants to take in my opinion. Whats weird here is there is a waiting period for hand guns, but not high powered rifles. I'm glad I live where I can own an ak-47. I want to own a g3 and a famas next lol. I don't care for side arms really, though I do own a 40.

My weapon of choice is the compound bow for the bush. It just feels like you did something when you bag a deer with a bow. But I actually like crossbows as well because you can shoot it without moving.

[entrangermercenary]

Wow what an argument over nothing. Every weapon has benefits and disadvantages to others. You want deadly silent? I have a sword that won't make a sound till it hits your bones lol. Everything has its uses.. even that sword in trained hands.

It doesn't really matter what you have as long as you can use it. And I feel so sorry for you guys that can't own firearms. They may be a danger to society or whatever but society should be able to accept the risks it wants to take in my opinion. Whats weird here is there is a waiting period for hand guns, but not high powered rifles. I'm glad I live where I can own an ak-47. I want to own a g3 and a famas next lol. I don't care for side arms really, though I do own a 40.

My weapon of choice is the compound bow for the bush. It just feels like you did something when you bag a deer with a bow. But I actually like crossbows as well because you can shoot it without moving.


Just out of curiosity why a Famas ??

[tracker]

Wow what an argument over nothing. Every weapon has benefits and disadvantages to others. You want deadly silent? I have a sword that won't make a sound till it hits your bones lol. Everything has its uses..


I know .

this point has been made out so many times to some people here its practicly useless .

People here seem to run on the basis of trying to be top dog by making arguements about what is right and what is wrong around weapons that all simply have ( as you say ) pros and cons .Its as though they have nothing to write about unless they insight arguements .

you would think ANY true survivalist would know that any tool can be used to hunt or kill .


some people just go too far.

[dhcracker]

Just out of curiosity why a Famas ??

I like the look of the gun, also its French and I don't own any french weapons. I have fired that old WWI open clip french gun that the GI's hated but I wouldn't want to own one of those. I don't think the Famas has any special performance characteristics but it is a very nice looking weapon in my opinion. Asthetics is why I want one mostly lol.

I do have a Mauser, but I want a G3 because I've heard as far as assault weapons go its a really stable platform for accurate shooting.

I don't like the m16 at all, I have an ak that will fire after being burried for a million years almost lol. Though I can shoot more accurately with the M16 when firing burst or very quickly, I think the AK ammo is a little more powerful even if not quite as accurate, it seems to penetrate trees and bush more effectively.

[entrangermercenary]

I like the look of the gun, also its French and I don't own any french weapons. I have fired that old WWI open clip french gun that the GI's hated but I wouldn't want to own one of those. I don't think the Famas has any special performance characteristics but it is a very nice looking weapon in my opinion. Asthetics is why I want one mostly lol.

I do have a Mauser, but I want a G3 because I've heard as far as assault weapons go its a really stable platform for accurate shooting.

I don't like the m16 at all, I have an ak that will fire after being burried for a million years almost lol. Though I can shoot more accurately with the M16 when firing burst or very quickly, I think the AK ammo is a little more powerful even if not quite as accurate, it seems to penetrate trees and bush more effectively.

Yes the FAMAS is a very good bit of kit, simple to strip and effective. When you strip it down keep your finger on the firing pin parts when you take that apart as they tend to spring out. You will have to do this if you want to change the side the spent cartridges come out from left to right or the other way around.
Ak is very good as well...have you fired a grenade off one ?? The FAMAS also has that capability...but put the stock on the floor with your foot behind it to fire the grenade as it will brake you nose if you fire it like a rifle :D :)

[dhcracker]

I'm hoping the next militia shoot out eh.. its an annual event like this and at this spot

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_u1Qrl5xY0Y

I'm hoping at the next event I'll get my hands on a famas.. but no grenades allowed lol. Too many dang restrictions its hard to even get rid of tree stumps now.

Thats good to know I'm right handed but I shoot left handed because of my good left eye lol. I have to modify my guns the ones I can or put brass catchers on em so I"m not ejecting hot brass down my shirt or something.. I hate that.

You know our state is the last holdout for gun rights besides Idaho. And we are proof that guns don't lead to violence, we have some of the lowest crime rates and some of the most lax gun laws. That may be because if you rob somebody chances are they will shoot you lol.

[entrangermercenary]

I like the look of the gun, also its French and I don't own any french weapons. I have fired that old WWI open clip french gun that the GI's hated but I wouldn't want to own one of those. I don't think the Famas has any special performance characteristics but it is a very nice looking weapon in my opinion. Asthetics is why I want one mostly lol.

I do have a Mauser, but I want a G3 because I've heard as far as assault weapons go its a really stable platform for accurate shooting.

I don't like the m16 at all, I have an ak that will fire after being burried for a million years almost lol. Though I can shoot more accurately with the M16 when firing burst or very quickly, I think the AK ammo is a little more powerful even if not quite as accurate, it seems to penetrate trees and bush more effectively.

SO you know about the FAMAS as well eh ;) and you want to own one...and obviously being of high intellect you have done some research...or not maybe ;)

lifted from another site

Since the FAMAS is capable of automatic fire, it cannot be legally imported into the U.S. for the consumer market. Further, the ability to cut the receiver and barrel and import as a parts kit is not an option either. France has very strict demil laws about its old military hardware. There used to be a time when MAS 49/56 rifles were imported 80's-90's. Soon after, France would no longer surplus out small arms because they didn't want them being sold.
Until France relaxes it's policy on refusing to sell surplus small arms, you likely won't get one.

There are only around 6 (documented) FAMAS bullpups in the states, and they usually go for over $7000. The even rarer G2 can go for as much as $16,000



SO mrDHCRACKER i think you are busted ;)