was jesus gay ? [Archive] - David Icke's Official Forums

jthedon

14-05-2009, 06:03 PM

From prophet yahweh's website

IN THE BLESSED AND HOLY NAME OF YAHWEH

Book 2

SINS OF J-ESUS
his pagan origin, homosexuality, and corrupt character

Chapter 3

WAS J-ESUS A HOMOSEXUAL?
Part One

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All Rights Reserved - Copyrighted 2007 - By Prophet Yahweh

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DEFINITION OF EQUIVOCATE

1: to avoid giving a definite answer or position
<the candidate equivocated as long as he could on controversial issues>
2: to use equivocal language especially with intent to deceive
3: to avoid committing oneself in what one says

The leaders of the Christian church: preachers, pastors,
bishops, cardinals, etc., all equivocate when asked about all the obviously false statements attributed to the messiah in their so-called Gospels. And, when they are cornered and are somewhat forced to explain, in every instance, they will only continue to deceive people just like their writings do.

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Introduction

John 13:4-5

John 13:12, 15

John 13:23-25

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INTRODUCTION

This work is Part 1 of an abbreviated, condensed study of how the New Testament scribes, who wrote the Gospels, suggested that Jesus was a homosexual.

The entire work, that presents all suggestions of Jesus' homosexuality, will be presented only to those who sign up to be my students.

In Part 2 of "Was Jesus A Homosexual?" there will be even more shocking suggestions of Jesus being a homosexual that were made by the Gospel writers.

I will send it to you in 2 or 3 days.

In the section below on John 13:4-5, I will present the first round of scriptures which prove that evil, sinister scribes of the New Testament Gospels suggested that our Messiah was a homosexual.

Keep in mind that I will be using the King James version of the bible in this study.

The King James Verison has been around since the year 1611. It has been the main bible used by English speaking people for the last 400 years.

However, over the last 50 years, there has been an explosion of different translations of the bible!

Many of the translators of these new versions of the bible are removing or re-writing the homosexual references and other things they don’t want people to know.

They want scriptures to read the way they want them to instead of how they were originally written.

Even so, in these new bibles, you can still see the homosexual hints attributed to Jesus but, in most versions, not as clearly as in the King James.

Because of this, don’t be surprised when you tell people some of these verses and they tell you that those scriptures don't read the same as they do in the different versions of the bible they use.

It will do you good to research how these verses are translated in versions other than the King James so you will better understand how to present and explain what the Gospel scribes have done.

Now, let's take a look at some of the places where the New Testament scribes suggested that Jesus was a homosexual.

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JOHN 13:4-5

John chapter 13 describes the events of the Passover dinner when Jesus washed his disciples feet.

In verse 4-5, it states:

4. "He riseth from supper, and laid aside his garments; and took a towel, and girded himself."

5. "After that he poureth water into a basin, and began to wash the disciples’ feet, and to wipe them with the towel wherewith he was girded."

The average Christian would not see anything wrong with these verses. To them Jesus was simply demonstrating an act of humility by washing his disciples’ feet.

But, what most of them won’t see is that when scriptures said that our Messiah "laid aside his garments," it meant that he took off his clothes! And, without making a distinction, this suggests that he took off his clothes in front of his disciples, as if while they watched.

If this was the case, it was an improper thing for a man to do before other men, especially a holy man before his disciples. The reason why is because it disrespects the brotherhood and shows a lack of judgement and consideration on the Messiah’s part.

Also, when John 13:4 says that he "took a towel, and girded himself," this suggests that the rest of his body was left uncovered or naked.

Now, let me bring your attention to when John 13:4-5 said that after Jesus undressed, before his disciples, "he poureth water into a basin, and began to wash the disciples’ feet."

Just think. A "basin" is really not that big. One person can easily carry it. And, a man does not have to take off his clothes to fill it up with water and wash peoples' feet no more than the people who got their feet washed did not take off their clothes for it to be done!

The writers of the Gospels want us to believe that our Messiah took his clothes and got naked before other men, to fill up a basin with water, so he could wash their feet. But, common sense should tell you that it was not necessary at all for him to take off his clothes to do this!

Where are the scribes taking us after telling us this unlikelihood?

Let's see.

Verse 5 tells us that after he finished washing their feet, he wiped them dry "with the towel wherewith he was girded."

Now, since our Messiah wrapped the towel around his waist, which covered his sexual organs, then to use that towel to dry his disciples’ feet suggests that he was so naked before them that they could see his sexual organs!

There’s something wrong with this picture.

I wonder what was on the Messiah’s mind when he ended up completely naked with his disciples able to see his penis and testicles?

I wonder what his disciples thought when he ended up naked with his sexual organs before their eyes, while they were fully clothed, as he was drying their feet.

I wonder what he thought they were thinking when they saw him naked with his penis before them?

I wonder if the thoughts of Jesus having a small or large penis came across the minds of any of his disciples when they saw it?

Regardless, let’s read on so we can see where this story goes.

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JOHN 13:12, 15

12. "So after he had washed their feet, and had taken his garments, and was set back down again, he said unto them, Know ye what I have done to you?

15. "For I have given you an example, that ye should do as I have done to you."

Based on this order he gave to his disciples, they knew that they would have to take turns getting naked before each other and wash each other’s feet, with their penises in plain view, like Jesus did.

I am certain, that the disciples with small penises wished that the other disciples did not have to see how small their penises were.

All this does not sound right even to most Christians. This is why when they perform this rite today, many of them choose to disobey Jesus’ order and leave their clothes on!

Men taking off their clothes before each other is also wrong in the eyes of YAHWEH!

In Genesis 3:21, it states:

"Unto Adam also and to his wife did YAHWEH make coats of skins, and clothed them."

From that point on, YAHWEH intended for Adam, Eve, and all their descendants to be dressed before each other, at all times, except when they were intimate with their mates.

Also, since Jesus is said to be of the high priest order (Hebrews 8:1, which states: "...we have such a high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens..."), he was to be very careful for his nakedness not to be seen.

The reason why is because of YAHWEH’s laws concerning the nakedness of the high priests found in Exodus 20:25-26. In these verses, it states:

25. "And if thou wilt make me an altar of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it.

26. "Neither shalt thou go up by steps unto mine altar, that thy NAKEDNESS be not discovered [seen] thereon."

Judging by these scriptures, we see that it is improper, in YAHWEH’s eyes, for men to do anything of a religious nature whereby their nakedness is seen.

Now consider what the scribes wrote that our Messiah said in John 8:28-29:

28. "as my Father hath taught me, I speak those things"

29. "for I do always those things that please him."

Well, for someone to write that our Messiah opposed YAHWEH’s clothing laws by taking off his clothes before other men and ordering his disciples to do the same, has to be a lie against our Messiah!

The reason why is because, he would have known that YAHWEH did not teach him or anyone else to do so, and it would not have pleased YAHWEH for him to go against His Old Testament laws based on John 8:28-29 above!

Now, the question arises:

What has all this to do with the Gospel scribes suggesting that Jesus was a homosexual?

To find out, just keep reading.

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JOHN 13:23-25

23. "Now there was leaning on Jesus’ bosom one of his disciples, whom Jesus loved."

24. "Simon Peter therefore beckoned to him, that he should ask who it should be of whom he spake."

25. "He then lying on Jesus breast saith unto him, Lord, who is it?"

Take a close look at these verses. In them, you see an act between men which is improper and unnatural!

Please consider YAHWEH’s laws against homosexuality in Leviticus 20:13. It says:

"13. If a man also lie with mankind as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

Now, consider Micah 7:5, which says:

"...keep the doors of thy mouth from her that lieth in thy bosom."

And, judging by this verse, only a woman is allowed to lie in a man’s bosom and not another man!

Now, what have we here?

The New Testament scribes are portraying our Messiah as violating YAHWEH in this matter!

How, you may ask?

By allowing one of his male disciples to lie in his bosom which is only to be done with a woman!

Now, this is sin and evil!

What about the words attributed to our Messiah in John 8:28-29 when he said:

"... as my Father hath taught me, I speak those things," and "I do always those things that please him"?

How in the world does he allowing a man to lie in his bosom please YAHWEH?

It does not please YAHWEH it displeases Him!

Now, let’s do a verse-by-verse break down of John 13:23-25.

23. "Now there was LEANING on Jesus’ bosom on of his disciples, whom Jesus loved."

According to verse 23, one of the disciples was "leaning" on the "bosom" of Jesus. The word "leaning" suggest that the disciple was in some kind of upright position. The word "bosom" means the chest or breast of Jesus.

If a disciple was "leaning" on Jesus’ "bosom," chest, or breast, the only way this can happen is if he was in between Jesus’ arms!

Now, let us use our imagination to visualize the most likely positions this verse suggest Jesus was in with his disciple:

1. Visualize both of them standing with one man "LEANING" on the other’s chest while between his arms.

Does this seem right to you?

2. Visualize one man sitting in a chair, with the other man sitting on his lap and "LEANING" on his chest while between his arms.

Does this seem right to you?

3. Visualize both men sitting on a flat surface, like a floor or bed, with one of them sitting on the other man’s lap or between the other’s legs and "LEANING" on the other’s chest while between his arms.

Does this seem right to you?

4. Visualize one man sitting in a chair with the other man standing between his legs and "LEANING" on his chest while in between his arms.

Does this seem right to you?

Hey, it most certainly should not seem right to you!

The reason why is because this example results in the man’s sexual organs (who is "LEANING" on Jesus chest while standing between his legs) being only inches away from Jesus' mouth if Jesus is sitting in a chair!

Regardless, how a person interprets this verse about the disciple "leaning" on Jesus' chest, the fact remains that this is an intimate encounter we’re seeing here!

Now consider that John 13:23-25 also make the following suggestions:

1. the man who was intimate with Jesus was a homosexual playing the role of a woman

2. that Jesus was a homosexual who was acting like his male lover was a woman

3. that both Jesus and his disciple were homosexuals who often had oral and anal sex with each other

4. that the other disciples of Jesus were accustomed to them having homosexual relations while they watched because they did not react, at all, as if it was normal for them to see Jesus' and his lover behaving in a homosexual way

5. at least one or more of the other disciples had to wonder which one of them would be the next one Jesus would want to perform oral sex on or penetrate anally

6. that Jesus and all of the disciples were a bunch of sick men!

These suggestions are totally unnatural!

This is evil!

This is perverted!

YAHWEH is against homosexuality! He destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah because of it!

(Read Genesis chapter 18 and 19)

And, now, what have we here?

What we have here are fraudulent sections of the Christian New Testament Gospels, written by demonic scribes, that portray our Messiah as a homosexual who had a man being intimate with him in a way that only a woman should do!

We saw, above, that Jesus got naked with his disciples to the point that his penis and testicles could be seen by them.

And, now we see, that, afterward, he allowed one of them "leaning," intimately, between his arms, upon his chest.

Normally, when this happens between two people, the one with the person "leaning" upon his chest, between his arms, usually has at least one of his arms around that person!

Now, let’s break down the following verses and see the suggestions they make!

24. "Simon Peter therefore beckoned to him, that he should ask who it should be of whom he spake."

Here in verse 24 of John chapter 13, we see where Simon Peter signaled to the disciple "leaning" between Jesus’ arms, upon his chest, for him to find out who Jesus was talking about.

Now, what does this suggest?

Simon Peter must have felt that this disciple had a greater power, than he did, at finding out who Jesus was talking about or he would have asked Jesus himself.

So, he signaled to the disciple who was between Jesus arms, to find out who Jesus was talking about. This suggests that this person had a strange power over Jesus like a woman does with a man who is in love with her.

Or was the power like that which a feminine male homosexual has over a masculine male homosexual that is in love with him?

Regardless, it was sick and demented!

Consider the next verse of John 13:

25. "He then LYING on Jesus breast saith unto him, Lord, who is it?"

We saw, in verse 23, that the disciple was "leaning" upright on Jesus' chest. Now, in verse 25, it says that he was "lying" on his breast.

This suggests that the intimacy involved became even more intimate!

This also suggests that after Simon Peter signaled him to find out who Jesus was talking about, the disciple started seducing Jesus, like a woman does a man who she wants something from, and he ended up lying on top of him as if for sex!

Finally, this also suggests that the disciples were watching while the man was seducing Jesus!

All this proves that I am correct when I say that the Gospels suggest that Jesus was a homosexual!

Our Messiah could not have been a homosexual!

He never would have desire having oral and anal sex with a man.

Neither could he have been so twisted, in the mind, that he fell in love with another man like he would have done with a woman.

In Part 2 of "Was Jesus A Homosexual?" there will be even more "shocking" suggestions of Jesus being a homosexual made by the Gospel writers.

I will send it to you in 2 or 3 days.

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Sincerely Yours In Truth,

PROPHET YAHWEH

Seer of Yahweh
Master Salvation Teacher
Archenemy Of The New Testament Scribes
prophetyahweh@yahoo.com

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the end

cafetimes1991

14-05-2009, 06:16 PM

Nice. Might mention this to our Reverend. Sure is interesting. :)

jthedon

14-05-2009, 06:26 PM

Nice. Might mention this to our Reverend. Sure is interesting. :)

yes it is but i'm still confused about who this yahweh guy is :(

luciferhorus

14-05-2009, 06:28 PM

On the Virgin Mary, Zechariah, Elizabeth and Gay/Bi Polyamorous Jesus.

http://www.luciferia.tv/1ChildrenOftheSlaves/66666666.gif

Lucifer

http://www.luciferia.tv/animation/A.gif
For polyamory. For world sexual revolution. For Anarchist Communism.
_________________________________

Firstly who were these people?

Zechariah was a Sadducee priest. The Sadducees were the official 'Solomonic Temple cultists, ' much like my father's cultists (the Freemasons) today who have a habit of building Solomonic Temples all over the world for the purposes of strange rites/rituals in the name of their corrupt Capitalist god.

The Illegitimate Birth and God having sex with Mary.

According to the legend Zechariah and his wife Elizabeth allegedly could not bear children. Thus Elizabeth's young relative Mary came to live with them.

This was quite common in those days; if you were rich and powerful (the Sadducees were very wealthy) and your wife could not give you a son. During the period where Zechariah and Mary were living together, Mary gave birth to a child. Zechariah is thus the foremost suspect.

Secondly 'virgin births' are common myths attributed to holy people in an age of mass illiteracy where the masses would believe almost any old myth.

Thirdly 'virgin births' do have a scientific component. Often pre-pubescent girls would be married off and since they would be having sex prior to their first menstruation, the girl's first experience of puberty would thus not be menstruation but pregnancy. What is now considered paedophilia is commonly reported in the ancient world.

Did God have sex with Mary?

With regards to Mary and Joseph having other children, this is clearly stated in the New Testament; Jesus allegedly had four named brothers and several unnamed sisters, which begs the question of ‘Did God have sex with Mary on numerous occasions, or just once?’ Or are they more likely to have been Joseph’s children?

With regards to the belief that God had sex Mary, this is obviously pre-scientific superstitious nonsense. Ask God to have sex with you and I predict that She will respond with total silence. Have ‘you’ ever had sex with God? How does She get an erection? If you want to have sex with a divine (godlike) being, you will have to have sex with one of your male or female lovers.

Insane Jesus.

With regards to Mary (his mother) being a 'saint,' note that it does state in the New Testament that his family considered Jesus to be 'beside himself (i.e., insane), and that this is allegedly the judgement of the 'Mother of God'.

Rebel

Jesus was obviously in rebellion against his father’s Capitalist cult religionists (:i.e., the Sadducees, who eventually placed a reward on him for his capture and execution). He obviously despised his father’s cultists and described them as ‘hypocrites’ and in his public debates with them, he berated them and argued against all that they stood for.

Rebellion against one’s father is an executable offence under Moses 613 laws, but that did not seem to bother Jesus any more that it bothers me, since it is clear that the Sadducees, like the Masonic cultists today are simply running a ‘God business,’ and are overtly corrupt. Rebelling against evil, is after all what defines goodness and ultimately the price for rebellion against the establishment is often ‘martyrdom.’

Gay / bisexual Jesus

The following is complied from various Internet sources

In the Gospel of John, the disciple John frequently refers to himself in the third person as 'the disciple whom Jesus loved'." 4 One might argue that Jesus loved all of his followers in a non-sexual way. Thus to identify Jesus' love for John in a special way might indicate a sexual relationship. The disciple was "the" beloved. He was in a class by himself.

During the Last Supper before Jesus' execution, the author(s) of the Gospel of John describes how the "beloved" disciple laid himself on Jesus' inner tunic -- his undergarment. See John 13:25 and 21:20. Robert Goss, assistant professor of comparative religion at Webster University in St. Louis, LA, noted that Jesus and the beloved disciple: "... eat together, side by side. What's being portrayed here is a pederastic relationship between an older man and a younger man. A Greek reader would understand

"In the Book of John a word is used eight times that means 'is in love with' with the implication of sexual intimacy. Five times it is used with reference to Jesus' relationship with John. Once it is used to define Jesus' relationship with Lazarus. And it is also used to describe his relationship with Mary and with her sister Martha

Mark 14:51-52 describes the incident when Jesus was arrested by the religious police. It describes how one of Jesus' followers was scantily dressed. The King James Version says he had a linen cloth cast on his naked body; the size and location of the cloth is not defined. The New International Version says that he was "wearing nothing but a linen garment." When the police tried to seize him, they were able to grab only his cloth; the man ran away naked. Reverend Peter Murphy wrote: "We don't know from the sources what really was going on, but we do know that something was very peculiar between Jesus and young men."

Peter Tatchell of OutRage!.
Tatchell noted that one version of St. Mark's gospel --which is still the subject of academic dispute-- alludes to Jesus having a homosexual relationship with a youth he raised from the dead.
According to the U.S. Biblical scholar, Morton Smith, of Columbia University, a fragment of manuscript he found at the Mar Saba monastery near Jerusalem in 1958, showed that the full text of St. Mark chapter 10 (between verses 34 and 35 in the standard version of the Bible) contains a passage which includes the following text. --
"And the youth, looking upon him (Jesus), loved him and beseeched that he might remain with him. And going out of the tomb, they went into the house of the youth, for he was rich. And after six days, Jesus instructed him and, at evening, the youth came to him wearing a linen cloth over his naked body. And he remained with him that night, for Jesus taught him the mystery of the Kingdom of God".

A letter which claims to have been written by Clement of Alexandria (circa 150-213 CE), confirms that there were three versions of the Gospel of Mark which were being circulated among different Christian groups in the vicinity of what is now Alexandria in Egypt

Tatchell says there is “certainly no evidence for the Church's presumption that he was heterosexual. Nothing in the Bible points to him having desires or relationships with women. The possibility of a gay Christ cannot be ruled out.” "Since there is no proof of the heterosexuality of Jesus, the theological basis of Church homophobia is all the more shaky and indefensible.

Lucifer concludes. On Effeminate Jesus

Men who profess love for other men, and who have close physical and emotional relationships with other men, who lie down with and embrace other men, who refer to other men as ‘beloved,’ who incessantly speak of ‘Love’ and who are total rebellion against homophobic religious authorities generally fit the stereotype of ‘queer.’

Further bear in mind that Judaic culture, particularly among the upper economic classes in the first century was under the heavy influence of Greek and Roman culture where exclusive homosexuality was uncommon, but bi-sexuality was probably more common than heterosexuality.

In conclusion there is absolutely no historical basis for Christian homophobia and it would appear that the Christians in general (with the exception of the Gay/Bi Christians) are more of the ilk of those who would ‘stone the prophets in the name of the prophets.’ Shame.

Love all your brothers as you love yourself is a statement of polyamory (nb., polyamory is not polygamy since polygamy involves legalised prostitution ; i.e., marriage).

Love and Light

Lucifer.

http://www.luciferia.tv/1ChildrenOftheSlaves/2004_mar_jesus.jpg

Christianity is a house built on sand. It shall in the Aeon to come, inevitably be swept away.

Love and Light

Lux.
War, revolution, anything good but strong.

http://www.luciferia.tv/1ChildrenOftheSlaves/fds.gif

oddblock

14-05-2009, 06:28 PM

If he was he'd be a bear!

1977

14-05-2009, 08:07 PM

Yes, yes, yes. For deeply esoteric and alchemical reasons.

"And the youth, looking upon him (Jesus), loved him and beseeched that he might remain with him. And going out of the tomb, they went into the house of the youth, for he was rich. And after six days, Jesus instructed him and, at evening, the youth came to him wearing a linen cloth over his naked body. And he remained with him that night, for Jesus taught him the mystery of the Kingdom of God".

Such accusations were levied against both the Templars and Cathars. And, of course, they consider John one of their own!

snoopsnuffleopagus

14-05-2009, 08:21 PM

I was Logged Out, but the Off The Chart ignorance of the OP compels me to respond.

What was most impressive about Young Yahshua haMashiyach was His Torah Consciousness and Observation.

As anyone knows, Homosexual conduct is not practiced by the Torah Conscious and Observant, this includes ALL the Apostles, Prophets and Patriarchs, and Matriarchs also.

The OP is 100% pure unadulterated Pagan Bullshit. Not one nano-particle of truth.

I am beginning to wonder if a Pagan can discern any truths at all. It must be sad. :(

Ultimately, you will find your indulgence in self-fellatio to be a Cruel Master.

oh well

tear :(

lol@u :D

1977

14-05-2009, 08:38 PM

That quote from Rev 22 in your signature is describing a woman's menstrual cycle, so lol@u x2

jthedon

14-05-2009, 09:54 PM

uncia

15-05-2009, 12:42 AM

Love all your brothers as you love yourself is a statement of polyamory (nb., polyamory is not polygamy since polygamy involves legalised prostitution ; i.e., marriage).

If you knew any Greek at all, you would know that the Greek for sexual love, eros, is not the same word as the Greek for love as in having regard for the welfare of, which is agape, which is the word used in "love thy neighbour as thyself".

hunter77

15-05-2009, 12:49 AM

was jesus gay, only if mary magdeline was a post opp transxual;):D

miracles

15-05-2009, 02:34 AM

luciferhorus

15-05-2009, 02:46 AM

If you knew any Greek at all, you would know that the Greek for sexual love, eros, is not the same word as the Greek for love as in having regard for the welfare of, which is agape, which is the word used in "love thy neighbour as thyself".

Polyamory (many loves) is not merely about 'sex' it is about loving many people and if you really love someone as an adult it follows that you would wish to be sexually intimate with them.

Jesus incessantly speaking of love should be taken in the context of:

In the Gospel of John, the disciple John frequently refers to himself in the third person as 'the disciple whom Jesus loved'." 4 One might argue that Jesus loved all of his followers in a non-sexual way. Thus to identify Jesus' love for John in a special way might indicate a sexual relationship. The disciple was "the" beloved. He was in a class by himself.

During the Last Supper before Jesus' execution, the author(s) of the Gospel of John describes how the "beloved" disciple laid himself on Jesus' inner tunic -- his undergarment. See John 13:25 and 21:20. Robert Goss, assistant professor of comparative religion at Webster University in St. Louis, LA, noted that Jesus and the beloved disciple: "... eat together, side by side. What's being portrayed here is a pederastic relationship between an older man and a younger man. A Greek reader would understand

"In the Book of John a word is used eight times that means 'is in love with' with the implication of sexual intimacy. Five times it is used with reference to Jesus' relationship with John. Once it is used to define Jesus' relationship with Lazarus. And it is also used to describe his relationship with Mary and with her sister Martha

Of course we know very little about Jesus and what record we do have is from later sources who probably did not know him personally; his sexuality certainly cannot be proven one way or another, however as the text above suggests, there is simply no foundation for Christian homophobia, on the contrary; however there is ample foundation for it in the Old Testament.

LL

Lux

uncia

15-05-2009, 08:11 AM

Polyamory (many loves) is not merely about 'sex' it is about loving many people and if you really love someone as an adult it follows that you would wish to be sexually intimate with them.
Are you some sort of pervert?

snoopsnuffleopagus

15-05-2009, 07:59 PM

zetetic0void

15-05-2009, 08:52 PM

"4. "He riseth from supper, and laid aside his garments; and took a towel, and girded himself."

5. "After that he poureth water into a basin, and began to wash the disciples’ feet, and to wipe them with the towel wherewith he was girded."

....... "laid aside his garments," it meant that he took off his clothes! And, without making a distinction, this suggests that he took off his clothes in front of his disciples, as if while they watched.

If this was the case, it was an improper thing for a man to do before other men, especially a holy man before his disciples. The reason why is because it disrespects the brotherhood and shows a lack of judgement and consideration on the Messiah’s part."
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I think it is an assumption to say it is improper. By whose cultural rules would that be improper? Cultural norms are temporary and arbitrary in nature and from what I've learned, Jesus was beyond thinking such things had absolute value. Why would Jesus think it is improper or have any other meaning applied to that. If he was truelly enlightened beyond the rules of society, he wouldn't have cared.

His desciples may have felt uncomfortable ...but it was their own minds and ingrained cultural brainwashing that was being confronted and so that's a problem within their own minds.

This from the Gospel of Thomas (not in the Bible)
(These are the secret sayings that the living Jesus spoke and Didymos Judas Thomas recorded.)

"secret sayings" ... I interpret that as 'symbolic sayings'

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37. His disciples said, "When will you appear to us, and when will we see you?"

Jesus said, "When you strip without being ashamed, and you take your clothes and put them under your feet like little children and trample then, then [you] will see the son of the living one and you will not be afraid."
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22. Jesus saw some babies nursing. He said to his disciples, "These nursing babies are like those who enter the (Father's) kingdom."

They said to him, "Then shall we enter the (Father's) kingdom as babies?"

Jesus said to them, "When you make the two into one, and when you make the inner like the outer and the outer like the inner, and the upper like the lower, and when you make male and female into a single one, so that the male will not be male nor the female be female, when you make eyes in place of an eye, a hand in place of a hand, a foot in place of a foot, an image in place of an image, then you will enter [the kingdom]."
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So what's this all pointing to. Sounds sort of Taoist to me. Sounds like someone who has entered a mental level where the supposed rules of society are seen as just what they are ... relative inventions of culture and human society ... they can change and are temporary and thus are not of the nature of the permanant base level.

Little kids run around naked because they haven't yet been molded to view that as wrong. Adults are bogged down with layers and layers of social customs most of which play their part creating the unbalanced, unpleasant induced reality of a complex culture (classism, racism, forced labour, wealthy and poor, armies brainwashed to fight for relatively short-lived glories like some Kingdom of stone that will last 100 years).

Personally, I believe the Bible was adjusted for many reasons. Not only were only certain texts accepted by the Roman Empire ....er, I mean Roman Catholic Church [ ;-) ] when they created the Bible but they banned and tried to destroy many texts and translated the Greek texts certain ways.

I do not trust the word of the Roman Empire and it's Church or offspring of that Church as alleged "Gods" word.

What the real Jesus was (if he was an actual real person and not a pure mythology or mixture of several real persons stories and characteristics) is somewhat confusing but my view is not from a Christian perspective (my view even says he wouldn't agree with the religions named after him). I tend to think he was an enlightened human in the spirit of the Asia somewhat as can be seen in the writings of Taoism and Buddhism.

-------------
-------------

I don't care if Jesus was or wasn't homosexual ... doesn't matter as I see the rules of the Christian religion as inventions by humans (ie, stating homosexuality as a sin against "God"). The Roman Empire's Catholic Church would burn people at stakes in the name of Jesus and I'm to think it's wrong to think Jesus might have been gay? Whether he was gay or not, I think he would have been greatly against the Roman Empire's Catholic Church in their acts ... the great hypocrits blinding the people.

----------------

I am just responding to that one part. I'll read the rest now.

mephibosheth

15-05-2009, 09:20 PM

Well this was good for a laugh. LOLS.

I wonder what his disciples thought when he ended up naked with his sexual organs before their eyes, while they were fully clothed, as he was drying their feet.

'My god...it's full of stars..!'

I wonder if the thoughts of Jesus having a small or large penis came across the minds of any of his disciples when they saw it?

It was the hugest, stiffest, more foreskinless member to ever swung between a man's legs. Indeed, that's why he was slain--penis envy. The Romans couldn't have someone with a bigger shlang than the Emperor just strolling about Judea.

the end

The best part of the OP! :D :D :D :D :D

luciferhorus

15-05-2009, 10:45 PM

zetetic0void

16-05-2009, 12:24 AM

luciferhorus -

Just so it's clear, I was quoting someone else's text. I usually don't click the 'quote' but do it manually so maybe divisions between my text and someone else's isn't apparant.

Or your just quoting from that segment of my post since it was right there.

Either way, your comments are welcomed (I just don't wish to be seen as having the opinion expressed in the quoted part)

---------

I really wonder how much change was done from the Greek text to the Church's translation and various translations into English.

As an example, I remember looking into this idea of "foundation sacrifice" with the building of Jericho (I believe). In various English Bible translations online, some made it almost apparent that two sons were buried as sacrifices with the building of two parts of construction but other interpretations glossed this over and it sounded like the two sons died while construction was occuring. I'd be curius what the Greek text said there.

How much of the rest of the Biblical text has been adjusted by translation?

(I can't remember the spot in the Bible though)

Makes me wish I could read Greek to see what really is there.

I got this book called "Jesus - Son of Man" by Kahlil Gibran (from 1946) and even though I'm not a Christian, I find it interesting the various people's thoughts on Jesus. There's likely various levels of bias and alteration occuring in these supposed writings but it's interesting.

darketernal

16-05-2009, 12:51 AM

That quote from Rev 22 in your signature is describing a woman's menstrual cycle, so lol@u x2

typical pagan analysis: 100% pure unadulterated Bovine Excrement

This Thread is just another semi-private Pagan Circle Jerk.

oh well, its your time thats gone.

Actually no 1977 is right on this one. That Bible verse is absolutely describing a menstral cycle. The river of life that flows from the throne of YHVH and of the lamb (Yeshua in your own words) (which is the womb of the women of his line) which yeilds its fruits every month... in the form of menstral blood (the river of life, starfire). I'm rather curious of the exact root of that word "healing" if one of the Christians cares to look it up, becuase the line flowing from the throne described here are the builders of nations.

To answer the question the OP poses... no the mythical "Jesus" would have to be bisexual, as much of the Gospels are allegorical stories foretelling of his offspring and genetic line.

fekdemasons

16-05-2009, 01:24 AM

You go yahweh , an I'll go mine

But in the meantime.......

1977

16-05-2009, 02:43 AM

miracles

16-05-2009, 10:20 AM

manxboz

16-05-2009, 12:46 PM

Jesus couldn't of been Gay or Bisexual it was against the Bible. Homosexuality is Condemned in the Bible!

The Bible's condemnation of homosexuality is as clear and plain as the Bible's condemnation of murder, adultery, premarital sex, kidnapping, lying and idolatry. Further, for me to openly condemn homosexuality theologically makes me no more a "gay basher" than I am an "adultery basher", "premarital sex basher", "kidnapper basher" or a "murderer basher". If you disagree, your argument is with God's Bible.

The homosexual community has two ways of promoting their personal choices of being homosexual through the religious forum. First, some will claim the Bible actually promotes and condones homosexuality. Second, others try to get the Bible banned from public use by categorizing it as hate literature.

For any to use the Bible to condone rather than condemn homosexual activity in the theological arena just proves such a one has absolutely no idea what the Bible actually teaches. For anyone to suggest the Bible says homosexual activity is acceptable to God, is nothing short of willful blindness. So to set the record straight once and for all, here is what the Bible teaches on the subject.

Anyone who has heard of the cities of "Sodom and Gommorah" knows that they were notorious hotbeds of homosexuality. Gen 19:5-8 "and they called to Lot and said to him, 'Where are the men who came to you tonight? Bring them out to us that we may have relations with them.' But Lot went out to them at the doorway, and shut the door behind him, and said, 'Please, my brothers, do not act wickedly.'" The Greek word in the New Testament for homosexuality is literally "a sodomite". Jock is trying to redefine what the term "sodomite" means. (A term that has unchanged in 5000 years, even today- "sodomy") Apart from the fact the city was clearly destroyed by God because of homosexuality in the narrative of Gen 19, even the New Testament clearly states exactly the same thing in Jude 7 "Just as Sodom and Gomorrah and the cities around them, since they in the same way as these indulged in gross immorality and went after strange flesh, are exhibited as an example, in undergoing the punishment of eternal fire." Any sinner should always remember that the God who commands us to love our neighbour is the same God who will cast any and all unrepentant sinners into the "eternal fire". Here are more Bible quotes, Lev 18:22-23 "You shall not lie with a male as one lies with a female; it is an abomination." Lev 20:13 "If there is a man who lies with a male as those who lie with a woman, both of them have committed a detestable act; they shall surely be put to death." 1 Cor 6:9 "Or do you not know that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Do not be deceived; neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor homosexuals" 1 Tim 1:9-10 "realizing the fact that (civil) law is not made for a righteous man, but for those who are lawless and rebellious, for the ungodly and sinners, for the unholy and profane, for those who kill their fathers or mothers, for murderers and immoral men and homosexuals and kidnappers and liars and perjurers" Rom 1:26-27 "For this reason God gave them over to degrading passions; for their women exchanged the natural function for that which is unnatural, and in the same way also the men abandoned the natural function of the woman and burned in their desire toward one another, men with men committing indecent acts and receiving in their own persons the due penalty of their error."

If the homosexual community chooses to practice homosexuality in privacy, that is there free choice. But let such persons know for certain that the Christian Bible condemns all such practices and God will judge them unfit for the kingdom of heaven if the continue to practice and openly promote homosexual sex.

Now i ain't a homophobe, i have many Gay friends and some are Christians but when we start by having a go a Jesus and mis-interprete the Bible i have no choice but to step in.

luciferhorus

16-05-2009, 03:20 PM

Jesus couldn't of been Gay or Bisexual it was against the Bible. Homosexuality is Condemned in the Bible!.

The false logic of this also infers that since the Laws of Moses demands execution for adultery, that Jesus could not have stopped the stoning of a woman for adultery, yet he did; further since the same laws forbid picking crops on a Saturn's day / Saturday (the Sabbath), Jesus could not have so, yet he did, and so forth; there are of course later edicts commanding Temple tithes, and yet a person who stated 'carry no money' could hardly be expected to pay them, and so forth and so forth.

The idea of the fulfillment of the law and the prophets does not necessarily suggest obedience to the ancient laws, just as Crowley dismissed all such religious laws and replaced them with the one thelemic law (i.e., love is the law); I tend to see Jesus as a modernist of his era, and as making a similar point to Crowley, not that too many other similarlities need to be drawn between them.

.
The Bible's condemnation of homosexuality is as clear and plain as the Bible's condemnation of murder, adultery, premarital sex, kidnapping, lying and idolatry. Further, for me to openly condemn homosexuality theologically makes me no more a "gay basher" than I am an "adultery basher", .

Well the laws of Moses demands execution for sexual relationships between men; this is certainly not a sign that one has transcended homophobia; on the contrary.

Further there are hundreds of animals which exhibit same sex relationships, thus when say that you condemn homosexuality theologically (lit. the study of God); this can also infer that you condemn the Creator of the Earth, who apparently created numerous animals to engage in such sexual behaviour.

http://static.flickr.com/5/10193854_ae8087589f.jpg

The question is of course begged: did the Devil make the animals above behave in such a way, or are they acting in accordance with their nature? If the latter, then we have only God to blame for creating Her creation in such a way.

List of mammals displaying homosexual behavior

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_mammals_displaying_homosexual_behavior

Mammals
African Buffalo[21]
African Elephant[22]
Agile Wallaby[23]
Amazon River Dolphin(Boto)[19]
American Bison[21][24]
Antelope[25]
Asian Elephant[22]
Asiatic Lion[26]
Asiatic Mouflon[27]
Atlantic Spotted Dolphin[19]
Australian Sea Lion[28]
Barasingha[29]
Barbary Sheep[30]
Beluga[31]
Bharal[32]
Bighorn Sheep[30]
Black Bear[33]
Blackbuck[34]
Black-footed Rock Wallaby[23]
Black-tailed Deer[29]
Bonnet Macaque[14]
Bonobo[35][36][37]
Bottlenose Dolphin[19][38]
Bowhead Whale[19]
Brazilian Guinea Pig[39]
Bridled Dolphin[19]
Brown Bear[33]
Brown Capuchin[40]
Brown Long-eared Bat[41]
Brown Rat[42]
Buffalo[30]
Caribou[43]
Cat (domestic)[44]
Cattle (domestic)[45]
Cheetah[26]
Collared Peccary[46]
Commerson's Dolphin[19]
Common Brushtail Possum[47]
Common Chimpanzee[48]
Common Dolphin[31]
Common Marmoset[49]
Common Pipistrelle[50]
Common Raccoon[51]
Common Tree Shrew[52]
Cotton-top Tamarin[53]
Crab-eating Macaque[14]
Crested Black Macaque[14]
Cui[54]
Dall's Sheep[30]
Daubenton's Bat[41]
Dog (domestic)[55]
Doria's Tree Kangaroo[23]
Dugong[56]
Dwarf Cavy[39]
Dwarf Mongoose[57]
Eastern Cottontail Rabbit[58]
Eastern Grey Kangaroo[23]
Elk[29]
Euro (a subspecies of wallaroo)[23]
European Bison[21]
Fallow Deer[29]
False Killer Whale[19]
Fat-tailed Dunnart[59]
Fin Whale[19]
Fox[60]
Gazelle[25]
Gelada Baboon[61]
Giraffe[25][4][62]
Goat (Domestic)[30]
Golden Monkey[63]
Gorilla[64]
Grant's Gazelle[25]
Grey-headed Flying Fox[41]
Grey Seal[28]
Grey squirrel[65]
Grey Whale[19][66]
Grey Wolf[67]
Grizzly Bear[33]
Guinea Pig (Domestic)[39]
Hamadryas Baboon[68]
Hamster (Domestic)[39]
Hanuman Langur[69]
Harbor Porpoise[70]
Harbor Seal[28]
Himalayan Tahr[71]
Hoary Marmot[72]
Horse (domestic)[73]
Human (see Human sexual behavior)
Indian Fruit Bat[41]
Indian Muntjac[74]
Indian Rhinoceros[75]
Japanese Macaque[14]
Javelina[76]
Kangaroo Rat[42]
Killer Whale[19]
Koala[77]
Kob[78][79]
Larga Seal[28]
Least Chipmunk[80]
Lechwe[81]
Lesser Bushbaby[82]
Lion[26][83][84][85][86][87]
Lion-tailed Macaque[14]
Lion Tamarin[88]
Little Brown Bat[41]
Livingstone's Fruit Bat[41]
Long-eared Hedgehog[89]
Long-footed Tree Shrew[90]
Macaque[91]
Markhor[92]
Marten[93]
Matschie's Tree Kangaroo[23]
Moco[94]
Mohol Galago[82]
Moor Macaque[14]
Moose[95]
Mountain Goat[30]
Mountain Tree Shrew[96]
Mountain Zebra[97]
Mouse (domestic)[98]
Moustached Tamarin[99]
Mule Deer[29]
Musk-ox[100]
Natterer's Bat[41]
New Zealand Sea Lion[28]
Nilgiri Langur[101]
Noctule[102]
North American Porcupine[103]
Northern Elephant Seal[28]
Northern Fur Seal[28]
Northern Quoll[104]
Olympic Marmot[105]
Orangutan[106]
Orca[31]
Pacific Striped Dolphin[19]
Patas Monkey[107]
Pere David's Deer[29]
Pig (Domestic)[108]
Pig-tailed Macaque[14]
Plains Zebra[109]
Polar Bear[33]
Pretty-faced Wallaby[23]
Proboscis Monkey[110]
Pronghorn[111]
Przewalski's Horse[112]
Puku[113]
Quokka[114]
Rabbit[115]
Raccoon Dog[116]
Red Deer[29]
Red Fox[117]
Red Kangaroo[23]
Red-necked Wallaby[23]
Red Squirrel[118]
Reeves's Muntjac[119]
Reindeer[43]
Rhesus Macaque[14]
Right Whale[19]
Rock Cavy[39]
Rodrigues Fruit Bat[41]
Roe Deer[29]
Rufous Bettong[120]
Rufous-naped Tamarin[53]
Rufous Rat Kangaroo[23]
Saddle-back Tamarin[53]
Savanna Baboon[121]
Sea Otter[122]
Serotine Bat[41]
Sheep (Domestic)[30][123]
Siamang[124]
Sika Deer[29]
Slender Tree Shrew[125]
Sooty Mangabey[126]
Sperm Whale[19]
Spinifex Hopping Mouse[127]
Spinner Dolphin[19]
Spotted Hyena[18][16]
Spotted Seal[28]
Squirrel Monkey[128]
Striped Dolphin[19]
Stuart's Marsupial Mouse[129]
Stumptail Macaque[14]
Swamp Deer[29]
Swamp Wallaby[23]
Takhi[112]
Talapoin[130]
Tammar Wallaby[23]
Tasmanian Devil[131]
Tasmanian Rat Kangaroo[23]
Thinhorn Sheep[30]
Thomson's Gazelle[25]
Tiger[132]
Tonkean Macaque[14]
Tucuxi[133]
Urial[134]
Vampire Bat[41]
Verreaux's Sifaka[135]
Vervet[136]
Vicuna[137]
Walrus[138][139]
Wapiti[140]
Warthog[141]
Waterbuck[142]
Water Buffalo[30]
Weeper Capuchin[40]
Western Grey Kangaroo[23]
West Indian Manatee[143]
Whiptail Wallaby[23]
White-faced Capuchin[40]
White-fronted Capuchin[40]
White-handed Gibbon[144]
White-lipped Peccary[145]
White-tailed Deer[29]
Wild Cavy[39]
Wild Goat[30]
Wisent[21]
Yellow-footed Rock Wallaby[23]
Yellow-toothed Cavy[39]

nb This is an incomplete list, since:

"No species has been found in which homosexual behaviour has not been shown to exist, with the exception of species that never have sex at all, such as sea urchins and aphids. Moreover, a part of the animal kingdom is hermaphroditic, truly bisexual. For them, homosexuality is not an issue."

So to restate is this a matter of demonology (i.e., did the Devil make them do it?) or is it a theological issue (i.e. God made them that way)?

Love and Light

Lux

http://www.abc.net.au/reslib/200610/r113220_355634.jpg

http://www.kersplebedeb.com/mystuff/jesus.jpg

http://godismanmade.com/holybible-warning.jpg

Tithe to God or She will curse you.

"Should people cheat God? Yet you have cheated me! "But you ask, 'What do you mean? When did we ever cheat you?' "You have cheated me of the tithes and offerings due to me. You are under a curse, for your whole nation has been cheating me. Bring all the tithes into the storehouse so there will be enough food in my Temple. If you do," says the LORD Almighty, "I will open the windows of heaven for you. I will pour out a blessing so great you won't have enough room to take it in! Try it! Let me prove it to you! Your crops will be abundant, for I will guard them from insects and disease. Your grapes will not shrivel before they are ripe," says the LORD Almighty. (Malachi 3:8-11 NLT)

The all-powerful God claims She can bring food and grapes to the masses but She can't even feed herself?

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Kill False Prophets; thrust through your children

If a man still prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall say to him, "You shall not live, because you have spoken a lie in the name of the Lord." When he prophesies, his parents, father and mother, shall thrust him through. (Zechariah 13:3 NAB)

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Natural Disasters are the jealous God's Wrath

The LORD is a jealous God, filled with vengeance and wrath. He takes revenge on all who oppose him and furiously destroys his enemies! The LORD is slow to get angry, but his power is great, and he never lets the guilty go unpunished. He displays his power in the whirlwind and the storm. The billowing clouds are the dust beneath his feet. At his command the oceans and rivers dry up, the lush pastures of Bashan and Carmel fade, and the green forests of Lebanon wilt. In his presence the mountains quake, and the hills melt away; the earth trembles, and its people are destroyed. Who can stand before his fierce anger? Who can survive his burning fury? His rage blazes forth like fire, and the mountains crumble to dust in his presence. The LORD is good. When trouble comes, he is a strong refuge. And he knows everyone who trusts in him. But he sweeps away his enemies in an overwhelming flood. He pursues his foes into the darkness of night. (Nahum 1:2-8 NLT)

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Pillage and Plunder Loot the silver! Plunder the gold!

For the land of Israel lies empty and broken after your attacks, but the LORD will restore its honor and power again. Shields flash red in the sunlight! The attack begins! See their scarlet uniforms! Watch as their glittering chariots move into position, with a forest of spears waving above them. The chariots race recklessly along the streets and through the squares, swift as lightning, flickering like torches. The king shouts to his officers; they stumble in their haste, rushing to the walls to set up their defenses. But too late! The river gates are open! The enemy has entered! The palace is about to collapse! Nineveh's exile has been decreed, and all the servant girls mourn its capture. Listen to them moan like doves; watch them beat their breasts in sorrow. Nineveh is like a leaking water reservoir! The people are slipping away. "Stop, stop!" someone shouts, but the people just keep on running. Loot the silver! Plunder the gold! There seems no end to Nineveh's many treasures – its vast, uncounted wealth. Soon the city is an empty shambles, stripped of its wealth. Hearts melt in horror, and knees shake. The people stand aghast, their faces pale and trembling. (Nahum 2:2-10 NLT)

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An Angry Jealous genocidal God

"I have wiped out many nations, devastating their fortress walls and towers. Their cities are now deserted; their streets are in silent ruin. There are no survivors to even tell what happened. I thought, 'Surely they will have reverence for me now! Surely they will listen to my warnings, so I won't need to strike again.' But no; however much I punish them, they continue their evil practices from dawn till dusk and dusk till dawn." So now the LORD says: "Be patient; the time is coming soon when I will stand up and accuse these evil nations. For it is my decision to gather together the kingdoms of the earth and pour out my fiercest anger and fury on them. All the earth will be devoured by the fire of my jealousy. "On that day I will purify the lips of all people, so that everyone will be able to worship the LORD together. My scattered people who live beyond the rivers of Ethiopia will come to present their offerings. (Zephaniah 3:6-10 NLT)

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God Will Kill Ethiopia ; slaughter them by the sword

"You Ethiopians will also be slaughtered by my sword," says the LORD. And the LORD will strike the lands of the north with his fist. He will destroy Assyria and make its great capital, Nineveh, a desolate wasteland, parched like a desert. The city that once was so proud will become a pasture for sheep and cattle. All sorts of wild animals will settle there. Owls of many kinds will live among the ruins of its palaces, hooting from the gaping windows. Rubble will block all the doorways, and the cedar paneling will lie open to the wind and weather. This is the fate of that boisterous city, once so secure. "In all the world there is no city as great as I," it boasted. But now, look how it has become an utter ruin, a place where animals live! Everyone passing that way will laugh in derision or shake a defiant fist. (Zephaniah 2:12-15 NLT)

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God's Human Slaughter Fest

Stand in silence in the presence of the Sovereign LORD, for the awesome day of the LORD's judgment has come. The LORD has prepared his people for a great slaughter and has chosen their executioners. "On that day of judgment," says the LORD, "I will punish the leaders and princes of Judah and all those following pagan customs. Yes, I will punish those who participate in pagan worship ceremonies, and those who steal and kill to fill their masters' homes with loot. "On that day," says the LORD, "a cry of alarm will come from the Fish Gate and echo throughout the newer Mishneh section of the city. And a great crashing sound will come from the surrounding hills. Wail in sorrow, all you who live in the market area, for all who buy and sell there will die. "I will search with lanterns in Jerusalem's darkest corners to find and punish those who sit contented in their sins, indifferent to the LORD, thinking he will do nothing at all to them. They are the very ones whose property will be plundered by the enemy, whose homes will be ransacked. They will never have a chance to live in the new homes they have built. They will never drink wine from the vineyards they have planted. "That terrible day of the LORD is near. Swiftly it comes – a day when strong men will cry bitterly. It is a day when the LORD's anger will be poured out. It is a day of terrible distress and anguish, a day of ruin and desolation, a day of darkness and gloom, of clouds, blackness, trumpet calls, and battle cries. Down go the walled cities and strongest battlements! "Because you have sinned against the LORD, I will make you as helpless as a blind man searching for a path. Your blood will be poured out into the dust, and your bodies will lie there rotting on the ground." Your silver and gold will be of no use to you on that day of the LORD's anger. For the whole land will be devoured by the fire of his jealousy. He will make a terrifying end of all the people on earth. (Zephaniah 1:7:18 NLT)

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God Will Kill Everyone

"I will sweep away everything in all your land," says the LORD. "I will sweep away both people and animals alike. Even the birds of the air and the fish in the sea will die. I will reduce the wicked to heaps of rubble, along with the rest of humanity," says the LORD. "I will crush Judah and Jerusalem with my fist and destroy every last trace of their Baal worship. I will put an end to all the idolatrous priests, so that even the memory of them will disappear. For they go up to their roofs and bow to the sun, moon, and stars. They claim to follow the LORD, but then they worship Molech, too. So now I will destroy them! And I will destroy those who used to worship me but now no longer do. They no longer ask for the LORD's guidance or seek my blessings." (Zephaniah 1:2-6 NLT)

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Fire Breathing Dragons

"Can you draw out Leviathan with a fishhook? Or press down his tongue with a cord? "Can you put a rope in his nose Or pierce his jaw with a hook? "Will he make many supplications to you, Or will he speak to you soft words? "Will he make a covenant with you? Will you take him for a servant forever? "Will you play with him as with a bird, Or will you bind him for your maidens? "Will the traders bargain over him? Will they divide him among the merchants? "Can you fill his skin with harpoons, Or his head with fishing spears? "Lay your hand on him; Remember the battle; you will not do it again! "Behold, your expectation is false; Will you be laid low even at the sight of him? "No one is so fierce that he dares to arouse him; Who then is he that can stand before Me? "Who has given to Me that I should repay {him?} {Whatever} is under the whole heaven is Mine.

"I will not keep silence concerning his limbs, Or his mighty strength, or his orderly frame. "Who can strip off his outer armor? Who can come within his double mail? "Who can open the doors of his face? Around his teeth there is terror. "{His} strong scales are {his} pride, Shut up {as with} a tight seal. "One is so near to another That no air can come between them. "They are joined one to another; They clasp each other and cannot be separated. "His sneezes flash forth light, And his eyes are like the eyelids of the morning. "Out of his mouth go burning torches; Sparks of fire leap forth. "Out of his nostrils smoke goes forth As {from} a boiling pot and {burning} rushes. "His breath kindles coals, And a flame goes forth from his mouth. "In his neck lodges strength, And dismay leaps before him. "The folds of his flesh are joined together, Firm on him and immovable. "His heart is as hard as a stone, Even as hard as a lower millstone.

"When he raises himself up, the mighty fear; Because of the crashing they are bewildered. "The sword that reaches him cannot avail, Nor the spear, the dart or the javelin. "He regards iron as straw, Bronze as rotten wood. "The arrow cannot make him flee; Slingstones are turned into stubble for him. "Clubs are regarded as stubble; He laughs at the rattling of the javelin. "His underparts are {like} sharp potsherds; He spreads out {like} a threshing sledge on the mire. "He makes the depths boil like a pot; He makes the sea like a jar of ointment. "Behind him he makes a wake to shine; One would think the deep to be gray-haired. "Nothing on earth is like him, One made without fear. "He looks on everything that is high; He is king over all the sons of pride." (Job 41:1-34 NAS)

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Hammer Tent Peg Into Head

Meanwhile, Sisera ran to the tent of Jael, the wife of Heber the Kenite, because Heber's family was on friendly terms with King Jabin of Hazor. Jael went out to meet Sisera and said to him, "Come into my tent, sir. Come in. Don't be afraid." So he went into her tent, and she covered him with a blanket. "Please give me some water," he said. "I'm thirsty." So she gave him some milk to drink and covered him again. "Stand at the door of the tent," he told her. "If anybody comes and asks you if there is anyone here, say no." But when Sisera fell asleep from exhaustion, Jael quietly crept up to him with a hammer and tent peg. Then she drove the tent peg through his temple and into the ground, and so he died. When Barak came looking for Sisera, Jael went out to meet him. She said, "Come, and I will show you the man you are looking for." So he followed her into the tent and found Sisera lying there dead, with the tent peg through his temple. So on that day Israel saw God subdue Jabin, the Canaanite king. And from that time on Israel became stronger and stronger against King Jabin, until they finally destroyed him. (Judges 4:17-24 NLT)

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Murder and Slavery

The tribe of Benjamin, however, failed to drive out the Jebusites, who were living in Jerusalem. So to this day the Jebusites live in Jerusalem among the people of Benjamin. The descendants of Joseph attacked the town of Bethel, and the LORD was with them. They sent spies to Bethel (formerly known as Luz), who confronted a man coming out of the city. They said to him, "Show us a way into the city, and we will have mercy on you." So he showed them a way in, and they killed everyone in the city except for this man and his family. Later the man moved to the land of the Hittites, where he built a city. He named the city Luz, and it is known by that name to this day. The tribe of Manasseh failed to drive out the people living in Beth-shan, Taanach, Dor, Ibleam, Megiddo, and their surrounding villages, because the Canaanites were determined to stay in that region.

When the Israelites grew stronger, they forced the Canaanites to work as slaves, but they never did drive them out of the land. The tribe of Ephraim also failed to drive out the Canaanites living in Gezer, and so the Canaanites continued to live there among them. The tribe of Zebulun also failed to drive out the Canaanites living in Kitron and Nahalol, who continued to live among them. But they forced them to work as slaves. The tribe of Asher also failed to drive out the residents of Acco, Sidon, Ahlab, Aczib, Helbah, Aphik, and Rehob. In fact, because they did not drive them out, the Canaanites dominated the land where the people of Asher lived. The tribe of Naphtali also failed to drive out the residents of Beth-shemesh and Beth-anath. Instead, the Canaanites dominated the land where they lived. Nevertheless, the people of Beth-shemesh and Beth-anath were sometimes forced to work as slaves for the people of Naphtali. As for the tribe of Dan, the Amorites forced them into the hill country and would not let them come down into the plains. The Amorites were determined to stay in Mount Heres, Aijalon, and Shaalbim, but when the descendants of Joseph became stronger, they forced the Amorites to work as slaves. (Judges 1:21-35 NLT)

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Micah Kills a Whole Town

Then, with Micah's idols and his priest, the men of Dan came to the town of Laish, whose people were peaceful and secure. They attacked and killed all the people and burned the town to the ground. There was no one to rescue the residents of the town, for they lived a great distance from Sidon and had no allies nearby. This happened in the valley near Beth-rehob.Then the people of the tribe of Dan rebuilt the town and lived there. They renamed the town Dan after their ancestor, Israel's son, but it had originally been called Laish. (Judges 18:27-29 NLT)

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Ten Thousand Murdered at God's Command

After Joshua died, the Israelites asked the LORD, "Which tribe should attack the Canaanites first?" The LORD answered, "Judah, for I have given them victory over the land." The leaders of Judah said to their relatives from the tribe of Simeon, "Join with us to fight against the Canaanites living in the territory allotted to us. Then we will help you conquer your territory." So the men of Simeon went with Judah. When the men of Judah attacked, the LORD gave them victory over the Canaanites and Perizzites, and they killed ten thousand enemy warriors at the town of Bezek. While at Bezek they encountered King Adoni-bezek and fought against him, and the Canaanites and Perizzites were defeated. Adoni-bezek escaped, but the Israelites soon captured him and cut off his thumbs and big toes. Adoni-bezek said, "I once had seventy kings with thumbs and big toes cut off, eating scraps from under my table. Now God has paid me back for what I did to them." They took him to Jerusalem, and he died there. The men of Judah attacked Jerusalem and captured it, killing all its people and setting the city on fire. (Judges 1:1-8 NLT)

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Kill All of Babylon

"Go up, my warriors, against the land of Merathaim and against the people of Pekod. Yes, march against Babylon, the land of rebels, a land that I will judge! Pursue, kill, and completely destroy them, as I have commanded you," says the LORD. "Let the battle cry be heard in the land, a shout of great destruction". (Jeremiah 50:21-22 NLT)

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Canaan Enslaved for Absurd Reason

Noah, a man of the soil, was the first to plant a vineyard. He drank some of the wine and became drunk, and he lay uncovered in his tent. And Ham, the father of Canaan, saw the nakedness of his father, and told his two brothers outside. Then Shem and Japheth took a garment, laid it on both their shoulders, and walked backward and covered the nakedness of their father; their faces were turned away, and they did not see their father's nakedness. When Noah awoke from his wine and knew what his youngest son had done to him, he said, "Cursed be Canaan; lowest of slaves shall he be to his brothers." He also said, "Blessed by the Lord my God be Shem; and let Canaan be his slave. May God make space for Japheth, and let him live in the tents of Shem; and let Canaan be his slave." (Genesis 9:20-27 NRSV)

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Family Killed leaving not a single male child, as the LORD had promised through the prophet Jehu

Then Zimri, who commanded half of the royal chariots, made plans to kill him. One day in Tirzah, Elah was getting drunk at the home of Arza, the supervisor of the palace. Zimri walked in and struck him down and killed him. This happened in the twenty-seventh year of King Asa's reign in Judah. Then Zimri became the next king. Zimri immediately killed the entire royal family of Baasha, and he did not leave a single male child. He even destroyed distant relatives and friends. So Zimri destroyed the dynasty of Baasha as the LORD had promised through the prophet Jehu. This happened because of the sins of Baasha and his son Elah and because of all the sins they led Israel to commit, arousing the anger of the LORD, the God of Israel, with their idols. (1 Kings 16:9-13 NLT)

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Killed by a Lion for disobedience to the Lord's voice.

Meanwhile, the LORD instructed one of the group of prophets to say to another man, "Strike me!" But the man refused to strike the prophet. Then the prophet told him, "Because you have not obeyed the voice of the LORD, a lion will kill you as soon as you leave me." And sure enough, when he had gone, a lion attacked and killed him. (1 Kings 20:35-36 NLT)

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Exterminate 7 Nations

You must destroy all the nations the LORD your God hands over to you. Show them no mercy and do not worship their gods. If you do, they will trap you. Perhaps you will think to yourselves, 'How can we ever conquer these nations that are so much more powerful than we are?' But don't be afraid of them! Just remember what the LORD your God did to Pharaoh and to all the land of Egypt. Remember the great terrors the LORD your God sent against them. You saw it all with your own eyes! And remember the miraculous signs and wonders, and the amazing power he used when he brought you out of Egypt. The LORD your God will use this same power against the people you fear. And then the LORD your God will send hornets to drive out the few survivors still hiding from you! "No, do not be afraid of those nations, for the LORD your God is among you, and he is a great and awesome God. The LORD your God will drive those nations out ahead of you little by little. You will not clear them away all at once, for if you did, the wild animals would multiply too quickly for you. But the LORD your God will hand them over to you. He will throw them into complete confusion until they are destroyed. He will put their kings in your power, and you will erase their names from the face of the earth. No one will be able to stand against you, and you will destroy them all. (Deuteronomy 7:16-24 NLT)

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Bible Quote for August 1

Kill Everyone in 7 Nations

When the LORD your God brings you into the land you are about to enter and occupy, he will clear away many nations ahead of you: the Hittites, Girgashites, Amorites, Canaanites, Perizzites, Hivites, and Jebusites. These seven nations are all more powerful than you. When the LORD your God hands these nations over to you and you conquer them, you must completely destroy them. Make no treaties with them and show them no mercy. Do not intermarry with them, and don't let your daughters and sons marry their sons and daughters. They will lead your young people away from me to worship other gods. Then the anger of the LORD will burn against you, and he will destroy you. (Deuteronomy 7:1-4 NLT)

_________________________

http://www.grudge-match.com/Images/DrEvil.gif

And so forth and so forth.

More Biblical fun on: http://www.evilbible.com/

http://schooloffish.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/free_thinker.jpg

michael christopher

16-05-2009, 07:06 PM

mephibosheth

16-05-2009, 07:20 PM

The thought also occurs to me that he was asexual

That Jesus was asexual or non-sexual is the only valid interpretation that is allowed by the Christian belief that Jesus is God. As God is neither male nor female and does not reproduce by sexual means, God is not and cannot be a sexual being. So by saying Jesus was hetero or homo we are saying that God is hetero or homo, which is nonsense.

8)

entrangermercenary

16-05-2009, 07:23 PM

Are you some sort of pervert?

That did make me chuckle from some 1 who lives in Sodom :eek:

snoopsnuffleopagus

16-05-2009, 08:03 PM

Actually no 1977 is right on this one. That Bible verse is absolutely describing a menstral cycle. The river of life that flows from the throne of YHVH and of the lamb (Yeshua in your own words) (which is the womb of the women of his line) which yeilds its fruits every month... in the form of menstral blood (the river of life, starfire). I'm rather curious of the exact root of that word "healing" if one of the Christians cares to look it up, becuase the line flowing from the throne described here are the builders of nations.

To answer the question the OP poses... no the mythical "Jesus" would have to be bisexual, as much of the Gospels are allegorical stories foretelling of his offspring and genetic line.

Hi DE, a nice swing, but a miss.

Wishful Pagan Thinking.

The 4 Levels of Scriptural Translation always remain 'Tethered' to the Torah and Testimony.

Also the 'Priciple of First Mention' refutes this argument.

The Tree of Life is the Torah. It is an actual 'way of life' that preserves the health, safety and welfare of ALL Humans'

The Bible deals explicitly with Blood: The Life of the Flesh is in the Blood.

To preserve life, you must preserve the blood.

This is where the Pagan lifestyle fails, and Yahwehs Torah prevails. Yahweh Protects. The Pagans fail to protect.

Anytime a Pagan disconnects their 'interpretation' from the Torah and the Testimony, they fail.

Since The actual Yahshua haMashiyach, not the hellenized pagan fiction jesus christ, the actual Yahshua haMashiyach was perfectly Torah Conscious and Observant, thus Celibate, during His Time here on Earth.

what you presented was wishful thinking Pagan Myth.

The Book of Yahweh is not ambiguous, to make of what you want, it is unambiguous so that anyone who can read, can become enlightened.

The Book of Yahweh is about: Torah Consciousness and Torah Observation.

And all 66 Books Chime Harmoniously.

Every scripture in the Book refutes the allegation Yahshua Messiah was bi-sexual or homo-sexual. To state otherwise is to Bear False Witness.

All you Pagans have, as always, is: Speculative Conjecture.

No Sale

1977

16-05-2009, 08:54 PM

While I think the original post is a little ridiculous, going on about how the disciples must have felt about their small penises compared to Jesus' supposedly large penis (what are these descriptions based on?), I will also say that in my opinion, if Y'shua had full awareness he would likely have been bisexual. I could be wrong, but so could anyone. The thought also occurs to me that he was asexual, but I think it's more likely that he had relations with Mary Magdalene.
Jesus would have been queer because it returned the purified initiate to the state of the original androgynous Adam Kadmon or Anthropos. As Carl Jung remarked, "such a disposition should not be adjudged negative in all circumstances, in so far as it preserves the archetype of the Original Man, which a one-sided sexual being has, up to a point, lost."

Look at Revelation again:

And in the midst of the seven candlesticks one like unto the Son of man, clothed with a garment down to the foot, and girt about the paps with a golden girdle.

Jesus, as the "Α and Ω," is being depicted as a hermaphrodite. Men do not have "paps," those unequivocally are female breasts (Greek μαστοῖς).

michael christopher

16-05-2009, 10:21 PM

That Jesus was asexual or non-sexual is the only valid interpretation that is allowed by the Christian belief that Jesus is God. As God is neither male nor female and does not reproduce by sexual means, God is not and cannot be a sexual being. So by saying Jesus was hetero or homo we are saying that God is hetero or homo, which is nonsense.

8)

It's not non-sense and I don't interpret anything through the Christian belief. It is my opinion that God would love to have sex with all beings, since he created them and most likely finds them beautiful.

God is bisexual.

Since we are all extensions of God, God is present in some manner when animals and human beings have intercourse of every kind.

uncia

17-05-2009, 10:44 AM

"If you address me and I don't respond to any of your posts, I probably have you on my ignore list."
Please put me on it immediately.

michael christopher

17-05-2009, 05:15 PM

Please put me on it immediately.

That's okay, if it's so hard for you to read through my posts you can just put me on yours.

mephibosheth

17-05-2009, 07:29 PM

Well, if you don't interpret anything related to Christianity through Christian belief then I guess you're free to make up whatever you want.

But the fact of the matter is that, given the traditional concept of God, suggesting that God is a sexual being is patently absurd. LOL, and suggesting God would want to 'have sex with all beings, since he created them' is positively ridiculous. The purpose of sex is procreation--the propigation of a species. God is not sexual because God doesn't reproduce, but rather creates forms as a direct result of the exercise of his will.

Any other suggestion and you're simply not talking about the God of the Hebrews or Christians.

It's not non-sense and I don't interpret anything through the Christian belief. It is my opinion that God would love to have sex with all beings, since he created them and most likely finds them beautiful.

God is bisexual.

Since we are all extensions of God, God is present in some manner when animals and human beings have intercourse of every kind.

michael christopher

17-05-2009, 07:35 PM

Well, if you don't interpret anything related to Christianity through Christian belief then I guess you're free to make up whatever you want.

But the fact of the matter is that, given the traditional concept of God, suggesting that God is a sexual being is patently absurd. LOL, and suggesting God would want to 'have sex with all beings, since he created them' is positively ridiculous. The purpose of sex is procreation--the propigation of a species. God is not sexual because God doesn't reproduce, but rather creates forms as a direct result of the exercise of his will.

Any other suggestion and you're simply not talking about the God of the Hebrews or Christians.

I'm not talking about the God of the Hebrews or Christians, and the historical figure that Jesus is a bad copy of did NOT represent Judaism or Christianity.

You can keep calling my beliefs "patently absurd" and "ridiculous" all you want, I don't really care what you think to be honest.

Sex is divine, literally.

miracles

18-05-2009, 03:44 AM

Jesus would have been queer because it returned the purified initiate to the state of the original androgynous Adam Kadmon or Anthropos. As Carl Jung remarked, "such a disposition should not be adjudged negative in all circumstances, in so far as it preserves the archetype of the Original Man, which a one-sided sexual being has, up to a point, lost."

Look at Revelation again:

Jesus, as the "Α and Ω," is being depicted as a hermaphrodite. Men do not have "paps," those unequivocally are female breasts (Greek μαστοῖς).

If Jesus was qeer, then queer would be normal therfor to be queer would be straight and to be straight would be queer. Sound queer? I have a feeling this place is full of homosexuals who are angry at God, anyone else think this?

mephibosheth

18-05-2009, 03:55 AM

If Jesus was qeer, then queer would be normal therfor to be queer would be straight and to be straight would be queer. Sound queer? I have a feeling this place is full of homosexuals who are angry at God, anyone else think this?

LOL, its looking more reasonable every day! :D

mephibosheth

18-05-2009, 03:59 AM

I'm not talking about the God of the Hebrews or Christians, and the historical figure that Jesus is a bad copy of did NOT represent Judaism or Christianity.

That's all well and good, but the original topic was about Jesus, the Jesus of the Christian faith, not some other person...

You can keep calling my beliefs "patently absurd" and "ridiculous" all you want, I don't really care what you think to be honest.

You don't care what anybody thinks, it seems. Again, all I was pointing out are the limitations and restrictions demanded by the traditional concept of God. A sexual God is not the God of the bible.

8)

miracles

18-05-2009, 04:41 AM

LOL, its looking more reasonable every day! :D

:D

kasalt

18-05-2009, 07:05 AM

That quote from Rev 22 in your signature is describing a woman's menstrual cycle

typical pagan analysis: 100% pure unadulterated Bovine Excrement

This Thread is just another semi-private Pagan Circle Jerk.

oh well, its your time thats gone.

Actually no 1977 is right on this one. That Bible verse is absolutely describing a menstral cycle. The river of life that flows from the throne of YHVH and of the lamb (Yeshua in your own words) (which is the womb of the women of his line) which yeilds its fruits every month... in the form of menstral blood (the river of life, starfire).

Of course it is. The interpretation is attested by Epiphanius and is so palpably obvious that it is difficult to take it any other way. We need to get our act together and realize what this shit is actually taking about.

Fascinating!

I find this part to be particularly interesting:

"...the Tree of Life, which bears twelve fruits, and yields her fruit every moon..."

The first thing I notice is that gender is attributed. The Tree of Life is a female.
Secondly, I notice that the Tree of Life "yields her fruit every moon". This is significant because the average lunar cycle is 28 days and the average menstrual cycle is also 28 days.
Thirdly, the female reproductive organs have from ancient times been regarded as tree-like in form. Here's a revealing quote from the book, Stars, Stones and Scholars:[W]e can surmise that the female reproductive organs were well known to fishermen of large fish (where they could be examined easily). The tree-like form of the female reproductive organs will thus be the real reason that Gemini originally represented "the twins" of the ancients to symbolize birth, giving rise to the concept of the Norse Irminsul (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irminsul), the "tree of life". (Link to source (http://books.google.com/books?id=VuVhE0zmhrMC&pg=PA138&lpg=PA138&dq=tree+of+life+female+reproductive+organs&source=bl&ots=fGm-jhUbEN&sig=l5sKAJZjoR9S1nqRvVC9u2cnnAo&hl=en))
This idea of the "tree of life" is very ancient, and among other things it represents "a mystical concept alluding to the interconnectedness of all life on our planet":

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_of_life

1977

18-05-2009, 07:35 AM

Yes, the "Book of Yahweh" translation is actually very helpful here, as the King James Mutilation renders "Moon" as simply "months". Gerald Massey (http://www.masseiana.org/ngbk10.htm) seems to be the only one with enough balls to actually give us the quotation:

The tree itself appears in the second passage with its meaning truly interpreted. 'I saw a tree bearing twelve fruits (one) every month, and he said to me, this is the Wood of Life.' This, says Epiphanius, they allegorize into the monthly-produced feminine flowers. That is, they retained the actual meaning of the allegory in its biological aspect. [...] likely enough they may have continued the primitive practices of the Shakti Puja and the Yonias in their mysteries, and illustrated the creative chemistry by 'mixing one with another' in a manner totally different to the one supposed. These practices are strange and revolting to us, but originally they were physiological demonstrations and eucharistic rites, intended to teach obedience to human law and bind to fealty by sacred covenants. They knew what the typical serpent was that beguiled the woman, and the true nature of the 'seed,' which is what their malignant opponents never have known.

miracles

18-05-2009, 07:36 AM

Fascinating!

I find this part to be particularly interesting:

"...the Tree of Life, which bears twelve fruits, and yields her fruit every moon..."

The first thing I notice is that gender is attributed. The Tree of Life is a female.
Secondly, I notice that the Tree of Life "yields her fruit every moon". This is significant because the average lunar cycle is 28 days and the average menstrual cycle is also 28 days.
Thirdly, the female reproductive organs have from ancient times been regarded as tree-like in form. Here's a revealing quote from the book, Stars, Stones and Scholars:[W]e can surmise that the female reproductive organs were well known to fishermen of large fish (where they could be examined easily). The tree-like form of the female reproductive organs will thus be the real reason that Gemini the twins of the ancients to symbolize birth, giving rise to the concept of the Norse Irminsul (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Irminsul), the "tree of life". (Link to source (http://books.google.com/books?id=VuVhE0zmhrMC&pg=PA138&lpg=PA138&dq=tree+of+life+female+reproductive+organs&source=bl&ots=fGm-jhUbEN&sig=l5sKAJZjoR9S1nqRvVC9u2cnnAo&hl=en))
This idea of the "tree of life" is very ancient, and among other things it represents "a mystical concept alluding to the interconnectedness of all life on our planet":

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tree_of_life

The placenta is tree like and can be seen at the birth of any human. Nothing mystical about it, Click on the image to enlarge. It doesnt take much imagination to see that our "ancient" ancestors could see the placenta, and call it the tree of life because it feeds the baby in the womb

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/a/a8/Human_placenta_baby_side.jpg/788px-Human_placenta_baby_side.jpg

kasalt

18-05-2009, 06:38 PM

The placenta is tree like and can be seen at the birth of any human. Nothing mystical about it, Click on the image to enlarge. It doesnt take much imagination to see that our "ancient" ancestors could see the placenta, and call it the tree of life because it feeds the baby in the womb

I don't see how that detracts from anything we've said. In fact, it only adds to it!

It's just more evidence that the "tree of life" is apparently a female fertility symbol.

snoopsnuffleopagus

18-05-2009, 07:23 PM

RE: Menstrual Stream. Homosexual Jesus

Sure, typical Pagan Modus Operandi is to transform the "Unclean" into "Clean".

Only Pagan gods can do that.

Scriptural Truth is the Menstruel Flow is Unclean, Filthy, useless.

The Verse declares: PURE; Water of Life=The Word of Yahweh.

1977: show your math. ;)

Likewise: it is not the Alpha & Omega; it is the Aleph & Tau=Unity and Perfection.

Aleph & Tau
http://yahweh.com/PWMags/PW12-04/search.htm

Yahweh—The Alpha And Omega?

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The phrase Alpha and Omega is written four times in the King James Version of the Scriptures. However, this phrase should only have been written three times. It was added to the Scriptures once, in order to infer that it is Yahshua Messiah Who is Alpha and Omega. Alpha and Omega are first written in:

Revelation 1:8, KJV—
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending...

This Scripture cannot be any clearer than it is. This is Yahweh speaking about Himself.

Then, Alpha and Omega are again written in:

Revelation 1:11, KJV—
Saying, I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last...

After Yahchanan heard this being spoken, he turned around to see Who said it (verse 12), but saw Yahshua Messiah (verses 13-17). We can see this for ourselves in:

Revelation 1:17-18—
17 And when I saw Him, I fell at His feet as though dead. But He laid His right hand upon me, saying to me: Do not be afraid; I am the first and the last.
18 I am He Who lives, but was dead. And: Behold, I am alive forevermore. HalleluYahweh! And I have the keys of death and Sheol; the grave.

In other words Yahshua told Yahchanan not to be afraid, for He was alive forevermore. Yahshua did not identify Himself by that title Alpha and Omega.

Then, the phrase Alpha and Omega is again written in Revelation 21:6-7, which is speaking of Yahweh.

Revelation 21:6-7, KJV—
6 And He said unto me, It is done. I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end. I will give unto him that is athirst of the fountain of the water of life freely.
7 He that overcometh will inherit all things; and I will be his Father, and he shall be My son.

Yahweh is the Father, so it is definitely Yahweh Who is doing the speaking in this prophecy.

Now, we come to the Scripture in which the words Alpha and Omega were added, in order to say that Yahshua is the Alpha and Omega. This Scripture is Revelation 22:13. Revelation 22:16 undeniably states that these are Yahshua's words.

Revelation 22:12-17, KJV—
12 And behold, I come quickly, and my reward is with me, to give every man according as his work shall be.
13 I am Alpha and Omega, 117the beginning, and the end, the first and last.
14 Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the cities.
15 For without are dogs, and sorcerers, and whoremongers, and murderers, and idolaters, and whosoever loveth and maketh a lie.
16 I Jesus have sent mine Angel, to testify unto you these things in the Churches. I am the root and the offspring of David, and the bright and morning star.
17 And the Spirit and the Bride say, Come. And let him that heareth, say, Come. And let him that is athirst, come. And whosoever will, let him take the water of life freely.

Notice Footnote Number 117, which has been circled in verse 13. The footnote of this Bible, shows that the Alexandrian (NU) and the Vatican (M) texts omit the phrase, Alpha and Omega.

117 NU-Text and M-Text read the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.

Well, you might say, "What difference does it make that those three little words were added to this Scripture in Revelation 22:13?"

Never before has there been a true understanding of what Yahweh actually said when He identified Himself as the first and the last.

Since we know that Yahweh said that He is the first and the last in Revelation 21:6, let us thoroughly study the Scriptures to come to Yahweh's truth.

In Revelation 1:8, the Being Who is speaking identifies Himself as the Almighty, Who we all know is Yahweh.

Following is an exact copy of this Scripture from The Concordant Version of the Sacred Scriptures, which one can see differs greatly from the more modern Greek Interlinear:

Almost all English versions of the Bible render Revelation 1:8 in the same way the King James Version is translated.

Revelation 1:8, KJV—
I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the ending, saith the Lord, which is, and which was, and which is to come, the Almighty.

By merely leaving this text as it is written, a tremendous understanding has been lost. However, if these two Greek letters are researched in detail, one will readily see that Yahweh is revealing much more about Himself than just being the beginning and the end.

In the Greek alphabet, the letter alpha is the first letter, and omega is the last letter. However, in the Hebrew Language, in which even the so-called New Testament Scriptures are now known to have been originally written, the letter aleph is the first letter, and the letter tau is the last.

It is an admitted fact by the Biblical scholars that Revelation 1:8 should say in Hebrew:

I am the ALEPH and the TAU
instead of
I am the ALPHA and OMEGA

The Anchor Bible, Revelation Volume 38, page 379, gives us the explanation of this phrase.

8. the Alpha and the Omega. The Hebrew would be aleph and taw, probably standing respectively for Urim and Thummim, the sacred lots of the high priest used to determine the will of God, and also meaning all "encompassing."

Adam Clarke, in his Commentary, Volume 6, page 971, agrees that alpha and omega are aleph and tau in Hebrew.

[The beginning and the ending.] That is, as aleph or alpha is the beginning of the alphabet, so am I the author and cause of all things; as tau or omega is the end or last letter of the alphabet, so am I the end of all things, the destroyer as well as the establisher of all things.

We would not be any better off, however, if this Scripture (Revelation 1:8) is properly rendered: "I am the Aleph and the Tau." We still would not know what Yahweh means when He identifies Himself by the first and last letters of the Hebrew alphabet, unless this is further researched.

The letters aleph and tau must be researched to see if they do have a meaning, or message, to convey.

What the Bible translators did not realize (or they rejected) is that each individual Hebrew letter can be a word or phrase unto itself, with a specific meaning. This is clearly pointed out by Fabre d'Olivet in his book, The Hebraic Tongue Restored. Dr. d'Olivet gives clear, precise explanations of the meanings of each individual Hebrew letter, and what they point out or declare. On page 98 of his book, Dr. d'Olivet also states that knowing that each Hebrew letter has a meaning of its own, is the key to understanding the Scriptures.

In reference to the letters aleph and tau, Dr. d'Olivet gives clear proof that these two letters make statements in their own right.

The first letter in the Hebrew alphabet, as Dr. d'Olivet points out from The Hebraic Tongue Restored on pages 95 and 287, stands for unity.

On pages 98 and 465 of this book, Dr. d'Olivet clearly points out that the letter tau, the last letter of the Hebrew alphabet, means and stands for perfection.

Incredible as it may sound, both single letters aleph and tau, are in themselves Hebrew words that have specific meanings.

As Clark in his Commentary, and the writers of The Anchor Bible, Revelation, have shown, the Alpha and Omega should have been written: the Aleph and the Tau.

Now, with the true meanings of these Hebrew letters revealed, all can see the statement that Yahweh is actually making in these Scriptures.

Revelation 1:8—
I am unity (Aleph) and perfection (Tau), the Beginning and the End, says Yahweh: Who is, and Who was, and Who is to come: the Almighty.

Other Scriptures verify that Yahweh is unity and perfection.

Deuteronomy 6:4—
Hear, O Israyl, Yahweh is our Father. Yahweh is One.

Yahshua Messiah, a begotten Son of Yahweh, Who was the Savior sent by Yahweh, taught that Yahweh is perfection.

Mattithyah 19:17—
But He said to him: Why do you question Me about righteousness? There is only One who is the standard of perfection, and that is Yahweh; so if you would enter into life, keep the Laws of Yahweh.

Mattithyah 5:48—
Therefore, become perfect, just as your Father Who is in heaven is perfect.

Yahweh is revealing Himself again to be unity and perfection. These Scriptures that reveal the Alpha and Omega, the Aleph and the Tau to be Yahweh Almighty (Revelation 1:8; 1:11; and 21:6) do not point out Yahshua Messiah. Nor can Revelation 22:13, in which this phrase was added, be used to claim that Yahshua Messiah pre-existed.

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Yahshua Messiah: First And Last—Beginning And End

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Having proven that the words Alpha and Omega were added to this Scripture, Revelation 22:13, The Book Of Yahweh correctly reads.

Revelation 22:13—_
I am the First and the Last, the Beginning and the End.

We know Yahshua said this. We know it is no contradiction for Him to call Himself the last, for He will live forever.

We know it is no contradiction for Him to call Himself "the end," for He is the end result of having kept His Father's Laws perfectly.

Romans 10:4—
For Yahshua is the ultimate result of keeping the Law unto righteousness for everyone who believes.

None of the Pagan Speculative Conjectures in this Thread are supported by any of the 4 levels of scriptural interpretations.

Ignores all other principles of Biblical Scrutiny that preserves the integrity of the Authors Intent.

You all remain Carnaly Centered, rather then Spiritualy Centered.

By remaining Carnaly Centered, blinded by ego, lust, fleshly desires of self aggrandizement, self gratification, you miss the most beautiful concepts and precepts ever offered to Humankind.

The Human Brain is the Most Complex Object in the Universe.

Yahshua haMashiyach are examples of Human Beings using 100% Potential of their Brains vast Potential. This is achieved by perfect Torah Consciousness and Torah Observation.

Yahshua haMashiyach and His Apostles were the Complete Opposite of the Village People.

Yahshua haMashiyach and Apostles: Spiritualy Centered

Homosexuals/Pagans: Carnaly Centered

1977, OP: Your Speculative Conjectures are Baseless, unsupported by any Scripture.

Remember: Scripture does not sit by silently.

Yahshua haMashiyach and His Apostles were demonstrating

Mastery over Matter, Space, Time.

Heed Torah, and your Mental Acuity and Acumen will increase. :)

Special Bonus:

The Holy Scriptures show that we accept one of two beings as our head. We can either accept Yahweh as our Father (head) or we can accept Satan as our head.

Through this world's lust to break the Laws of Yahweh, they have rejected Yahweh as their Father, while accepting Satan the adversary as their head. By doing this, they have become the people of the devil, as the Apostle Shaul describes in the following Scriptures, because they did not like to retain Yahweh in their knowledge.

Romans 1:26-32—
26 For this reason Yahweh gave them up to degrading passions: for even their women exchanged the natural use into that which is against nature.
27 And the men did the same thing: leaving the natural use of the woman, they burned in their lust for one another; men committing shameful acts with men, and suffering in their own bodies the penalty for their error, which is their fitting retribution.
28 And so, since they did not like to retain Yahweh in their knowledge, Yahweh gave them over to a reprobate mind, to do those things which are not proper.
29 Being filled with all unrighteousness, sexual impurity, wickedness, covetousness, maliciousness; full of envy, murder, strife, deceit, and malice. They are gossips,
30 Backbiters; slanderers, haters of Yahweh, despiteful, arrogant, and boastful. They are inventors of evil things, disobedient to parents,
31 And without understanding. they are covenant-breakers, without natural affection, implacable; truce breakers, and unmerciful:
32 Who, knowing the righteous judgment of Yahweh, that those who practice such things deserve death, not only continue to do these very things, but also approve of those who practice them.

Yahweh blames the false religious leaders, the preachers who are the instruments of Satan, for this worldwide rebellion against Yahweh and His Laws. Notice what the Prophet Yeremyah was inspired to write.

Yeremyah 23:21-22—
21 I have not sent these prophets, yet they ran; I have not spoken of them, yet they prophesied.
22 But if they had stood in My counsel, and had caused My people to hear My words, the Law and the prophets, then they would have turned them from their evil way, and from the evil of their doings.

The Above Mentioned are those who will tell you: "jesus is gay', the Water of Life is menstrual blood.

On the Plus side: I'm composing a new tune: Adios; Los Paganos!!!

kasalt

18-05-2009, 09:32 PM

I'd just like to add this bit of info regarding the pine cone as it relates to the "Tree of Life":Pine cone: The fruit of the evergreen symbolizes immortality and was viewed as an important fertility symbol. In Christian iconography, it can form the crown of the Tree of Life. Because of it's swirling shape, it can also be viewed as a dynamic and generative and cosmic power.
Source: http://www.adchat.net/symbolismofflowersandplants.htm
There may also be some relationship between this symbolism of the pine cone (as the crown of the tree of life) and the human pineal gland:The pineal gland (also called...the "third eye") is a small endocrine gland in the vertebrate brain...It is shaped like a tiny pine cone (hence its name).
Source: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pineal_gland

analog

18-05-2009, 09:42 PM

I dought it.

michael christopher

18-05-2009, 11:43 PM

That's all well and good, but the original topic was about Jesus, the Jesus of the Christian faith, not some other person...

Considering that Jesus never existed, talking about the person who he was based on is certainly perfectly alright, in my opinion.

You don't care what anybody thinks, it seems. Again, all I was pointing out are the limitations and restrictions demanded by the traditional concept of God. A sexual God is not the God of the bible.

8)

The God of the Bible is also not real. I don't care if you are pointing out the limitations and restrictions demanded by a traditional concept of God - why don't you point them out to someone else? I'm not interested in traditional limitations and restrictions. Clearly the whole purpose of the thread is to challenge those traditional limitations and restrictions. The post is clearly referring to the historical persona of Jesus which was based on a real person, because according to the Bible, Jesus was completely asexual. If the Bible proves that Jesus was not gay, then there is no point for this post in the first place, now is there?

Jesus never existed and he was based on a person that Christians would probably consider "the anti-Christ" since the Biblical Christ is a horrible mimic of him.

miracles

19-05-2009, 12:37 AM

miracles

19-05-2009, 12:41 AM

I don't see how that detracts from anything we've said. In fact, it only adds to it!

It's just more evidence that the "tree of life" is apparently a female fertility symbol.

I wasn't trying to detract from it or add to it. Merely joining in the discusion. Although I doubt that early man had the where with all to come up with a "tree of life" analogy with out seeing the placanta. Women give brith to children IE life, there is nothing mystical about this. Is there? Magical beautiful and wonderful yes.

ogaga4luv007

19-05-2009, 01:39 AM

Yes!,Everybody know sthat JESUS_CHRIST was a pure gay***no comment & argumments***
On the Virgin Mary, Zechariah, Elizabeth and Gay/Bi Polyamorous Jesus.

http://www.luciferia.tv/1ChildrenOftheSlaves/66666666.gif

Lucifer

http://www.luciferia.tv/animation/A.gif
For polyamory. For world sexual revolution. For Anarchist Communism.
_________________________________

Firstly who were these people?

Zechariah was a Sadducee priest. The Sadducees were the official 'Solomonic Temple cultists, ' much like my father's cultists (the Freemasons) today who have a habit of building Solomonic Temples all over the world for the purposes of strange rites/rituals in the name of their corrupt Capitalist god.

The Illegitimate Birth and God having sex with Mary.

According to the legend Zechariah and his wife Elizabeth allegedly could not bear children. Thus Elizabeth's young relative Mary came to live with them.

This was quite common in those days; if you were rich and powerful (the Sadducees were very wealthy) and your wife could not give you a son. During the period where Zechariah and Mary were living together, Mary gave birth to a child. Zechariah is thus the foremost suspect.

Secondly 'virgin births' are common myths attributed to holy people in an age of mass illiteracy where the masses would believe almost any old myth.

Thirdly 'virgin births' do have a scientific component. Often pre-pubescent girls would be married off and since they would be having sex prior to their first menstruation, the girl's first experience of puberty would thus not be menstruation but pregnancy. What is now considered paedophilia is commonly reported in the ancient world.

Did God have sex with Mary?

With regards to Mary and Joseph having other children, this is clearly stated in the New Testament; Jesus allegedly had four named brothers and several unnamed sisters, which begs the question of ‘Did God have sex with Mary on numerous occasions, or just once?’ Or are they more likely to have been Joseph’s children?

With regards to the belief that God had sex Mary, this is obviously pre-scientific superstitious nonsense. Ask God to have sex with you and I predict that She will respond with total silence. Have ‘you’ ever had sex with God? How does She get an erection? If you want to have sex with a divine (godlike) being, you will have to have sex with one of your male or female lovers.

Insane Jesus.

With regards to Mary (his mother) being a 'saint,' note that it does state in the New Testament that his family considered Jesus to be 'beside himself (i.e., insane), and that this is allegedly the judgement of the 'Mother of God'.

Rebel

Jesus was obviously in rebellion against his father’s Capitalist cult religionists (:i.e., the Sadducees, who eventually placed a reward on him for his capture and execution). He obviously despised his father’s cultists and described them as ‘hypocrites’ and in his public debates with them, he berated them and argued against all that they stood for.

Rebellion against one’s father is an executable offence under Moses 613 laws, but that did not seem to bother Jesus any more that it bothers me, since it is clear that the Sadducees, like the Masonic cultists today are simply running a ‘God business,’ and are overtly corrupt. Rebelling against evil, is after all what defines goodness and ultimately the price for rebellion against the establishment is often ‘martyrdom.’

Gay / bisexual Jesus

The following is complied from various Internet sources

In the Gospel of John, the disciple John frequently refers to himself in the third person as 'the disciple whom Jesus loved'." 4 One might argue that Jesus loved all of his followers in a non-sexual way. Thus to identify Jesus' love for John in a special way might indicate a sexual relationship. The disciple was "the" beloved. He was in a class by himself.

During the Last Supper before Jesus' execution, the author(s) of the Gospel of John describes how the "beloved" disciple laid himself on Jesus' inner tunic -- his undergarment. See John 13:25 and 21:20. Robert Goss, assistant professor of comparative religion at Webster University in St. Louis, LA, noted that Jesus and the beloved disciple: "... eat together, side by side. What's being portrayed here is a pederastic relationship between an older man and a younger man. A Greek reader would understand

"In the Book of John a word is used eight times that means 'is in love with' with the implication of sexual intimacy. Five times it is used with reference to Jesus' relationship with John. Once it is used to define Jesus' relationship with Lazarus. And it is also used to describe his relationship with Mary and with her sister Martha

Mark 14:51-52 describes the incident when Jesus was arrested by the religious police. It describes how one of Jesus' followers was scantily dressed. The King James Version says he had a linen cloth cast on his naked body; the size and location of the cloth is not defined. The New International Version says that he was "wearing nothing but a linen garment." When the police tried to seize him, they were able to grab only his cloth; the man ran away naked. Reverend Peter Murphy wrote: "We don't know from the sources what really was going on, but we do know that something was very peculiar between Jesus and young men."

Peter Tatchell of OutRage!.
Tatchell noted that one version of St. Mark's gospel --which is still the subject of academic dispute-- alludes to Jesus having a homosexual relationship with a youth he raised from the dead.
According to the U.S. Biblical scholar, Morton Smith, of Columbia University, a fragment of manuscript he found at the Mar Saba monastery near Jerusalem in 1958, showed that the full text of St. Mark chapter 10 (between verses 34 and 35 in the standard version of the Bible) contains a passage which includes the following text. --
"And the youth, looking upon him (Jesus), loved him and beseeched that he might remain with him. And going out of the tomb, they went into the house of the youth, for he was rich. And after six days, Jesus instructed him and, at evening, the youth came to him wearing a linen cloth over his naked body. And he remained with him that night, for Jesus taught him the mystery of the Kingdom of God".

A letter which claims to have been written by Clement of Alexandria (circa 150-213 CE), confirms that there were three versions of the Gospel of Mark which were being circulated among different Christian groups in the vicinity of what is now Alexandria in Egypt

Tatchell says there is “certainly no evidence for the Church's presumption that he was heterosexual. Nothing in the Bible points to him having desires or relationships with women. The possibility of a gay Christ cannot be ruled out.” "Since there is no proof of the heterosexuality of Jesus, the theological basis of Church homophobia is all the more shaky and indefensible.

Lucifer concludes. On Effeminate Jesus

Men who profess love for other men, and who have close physical and emotional relationships with other men, who lie down with and embrace other men, who refer to other men as ‘beloved,’ who incessantly speak of ‘Love’ and who are total rebellion against homophobic religious authorities generally fit the stereotype of ‘queer.’

Further bear in mind that Judaic culture, particularly among the upper economic classes in the first century was under the heavy influence of Greek and Roman culture where exclusive homosexuality was uncommon, but bi-sexuality was probably more common than heterosexuality.

In conclusion there is absolutely no historical basis for Christian homophobia and it would appear that the Christians in general (with the exception of the Gay/Bi Christians) are more of the ilk of those who would ‘stone the prophets in the name of the prophets.’ Shame.

Love all your brothers as you love yourself is a statement of polyamory (nb., polyamory is not polygamy since polygamy involves legalised prostitution ; i.e., marriage).

Love and Light

Lucifer.

http://www.luciferia.tv/1ChildrenOftheSlaves/2004_mar_jesus.jpg

Christianity is a house built on sand. It shall in the Aeon to come, inevitably be swept away.

Love and Light

Lux.
War, revolution, anything good but strong.

http://www.luciferia.tv/1ChildrenOftheSlaves/fds.gif

miracles

19-05-2009, 02:47 AM

Yes!,Everybody know sthat JESUS_CHRIST was a pure gay***no comment & argumments***

If there is no need to comment, why did you comment?:D

[

manxboz

19-05-2009, 02:21 PM

Yes!,Everybody know sthat JESUS_CHRIST was a pure gay***no comment & argumments***

[

And what evidence are you basing this on. I have not found a scriptiure, Canon or not that suggests he was Gay.

quetzalcoatl

19-05-2009, 02:36 PM

From prophet yahweh's website

IN THE BLESSED AND HOLY NAME OF YAHWEH

Book 2

SINS OF J-ESUS
his pagan origin, homosexuality, and corrupt character

Chapter 3

WAS J-ESUS A HOMOSEXUAL?
Part One

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All Rights Reserved - Copyrighted 2007 - By Prophet Yahweh

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DEFINITION OF EQUIVOCATE

1: to avoid giving a definite answer or position
<the candidate equivocated as long as he could on controversial issues>
2: to use equivocal language especially with intent to deceive
3: to avoid committing oneself in what one says

The leaders of the Christian church: preachers, pastors,
bishops, cardinals, etc., all equivocate when asked about all the obviously false statements attributed to the messiah in their so-called Gospels. And, when they are cornered and are somewhat forced to explain, in every instance, they will only continue to deceive people just like their writings do.

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Home | Table Of Contents | Last Chapter | Next Chapter

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.... inside this chapter...

Introduction

John 13:4-5

John 13:12, 15

John 13:23-25

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INTRODUCTION

This work is Part 1 of an abbreviated, condensed study of how the New Testament scribes, who wrote the Gospels, suggested that Jesus was a homosexual.

The entire work, that presents all suggestions of Jesus' homosexuality, will be presented only to those who sign up to be my students.

In Part 2 of "Was Jesus A Homosexual?" there will be even more shocking suggestions of Jesus being a homosexual that were made by the Gospel writers.

I will send it to you in 2 or 3 days.

In the section below on John 13:4-5, I will present the first round of scriptures which prove that evil, sinister scribes of the New Testament Gospels suggested that our Messiah was a homosexual.

Keep in mind that I will be using the King James version of the bible in this study.

The King James Verison has been around since the year 1611. It has been the main bible used by English speaking people for the last 400 years.

However, over the last 50 years, there has been an explosion of different translations of the bible!

Many of the translators of these new versions of the bible are removing or re-writing the homosexual references and other things they don’t want people to know.

They want scriptures to read the way they want them to instead of how they were originally written.

Even so, in these new bibles, you can still see the homosexual hints attributed to Jesus but, in most versions, not as clearly as in the King James.

Because of this, don’t be surprised when you tell people some of these verses and they tell you that those scriptures don't read the same as they do in the different versions of the bible they use.

It will do you good to research how these verses are translated in versions other than the King James so you will better understand how to present and explain what the Gospel scribes have done.

Now, let's take a look at some of the places where the New Testament scribes suggested that Jesus was a homosexual.

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JOHN 13:4-5

John chapter 13 describes the events of the Passover dinner when Jesus washed his disciples feet.

In verse 4-5, it states:

4. "He riseth from supper, and laid aside his garments; and took a towel, and girded himself."

5. "After that he poureth water into a basin, and began to wash the disciples’ feet, and to wipe them with the towel wherewith he was girded."

The average Christian would not see anything wrong with these verses. To them Jesus was simply demonstrating an act of humility by washing his disciples’ feet.

But, what most of them won’t see is that when scriptures said that our Messiah "laid aside his garments," it meant that he took off his clothes! And, without making a distinction, this suggests that he took off his clothes in front of his disciples, as if while they watched.

If this was the case, it was an improper thing for a man to do before other men, especially a holy man before his disciples. The reason why is because it disrespects the brotherhood and shows a lack of judgement and consideration on the Messiah’s part.

Also, when John 13:4 says that he "took a towel, and girded himself," this suggests that the rest of his body was left uncovered or naked.

Now, let me bring your attention to when John 13:4-5 said that after Jesus undressed, before his disciples, "he poureth water into a basin, and began to wash the disciples’ feet."

Just think. A "basin" is really not that big. One person can easily carry it. And, a man does not have to take off his clothes to fill it up with water and wash peoples' feet no more than the people who got their feet washed did not take off their clothes for it to be done!

The writers of the Gospels want us to believe that our Messiah took his clothes and got naked before other men, to fill up a basin with water, so he could wash their feet. But, common sense should tell you that it was not necessary at all for him to take off his clothes to do this!

Where are the scribes taking us after telling us this unlikelihood?

Let's see.

Verse 5 tells us that after he finished washing their feet, he wiped them dry "with the towel wherewith he was girded."

Now, since our Messiah wrapped the towel around his waist, which covered his sexual organs, then to use that towel to dry his disciples’ feet suggests that he was so naked before them that they could see his sexual organs!

There’s something wrong with this picture.

Yes, there is 'Prophet Yahweh' shame on your shame! - you have failed. :p

I wonder what was on the Messiah’s mind when he ended up completely naked with his disciples able to see his penis and testicles?

I wonder what his disciples thought when he ended up naked with his sexual organs before their eyes, while they were fully clothed, as he was drying their feet.

I wonder what he thought they were thinking when they saw him naked with his penis before them?

I wonder if the thoughts of Jesus having a small or large penis came across the minds of any of his disciples when they saw it?

Regardless, let’s read on so we can see where this story goes.

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JOHN 13:12, 15

12. "So after he had washed their feet, and had taken his garments, and was set back down again, he said unto them, Know ye what I have done to you?

15. "For I have given you an example, that ye should do as I have done to you."

Based on this order he gave to his disciples, they knew that they would have to take turns getting naked before each other and wash each other’s feet, with their penises in plain view, like Jesus did.

I am certain, that the disciples with small penises wished that the other disciples did not have to see how small their penises were.

All this does not sound right even to most Christians. This is why when they perform this rite today, many of them choose to disobey Jesus’ order and leave their clothes on!

Men taking off their clothes before each other is also wrong in the eyes of YAHWEH!

In Genesis 3:21, it states:

"Unto Adam also and to his wife did YAHWEH make coats of skins, and clothed them."

From that point on, YAHWEH intended for Adam, Eve, and all their descendants to be dressed before each other, at all times, except when they were intimate with their mates.

Also, since Jesus is said to be of the high priest order (Hebrews 8:1, which states: "...we have such a high priest, who is set on the right hand of the throne of the Majesty in the heavens..."), he was to be very careful for his nakedness not to be seen.

The reason why is because of YAHWEH’s laws concerning the nakedness of the high priests found in Exodus 20:25-26. In these verses, it states:

25. "And if thou wilt make me an altar of stone, thou shalt not build it of hewn stone: for if thou lift up thy tool upon it, thou hast polluted it.

26. "Neither shalt thou go up by steps unto mine altar, that thy NAKEDNESS be not discovered [seen] thereon."

Judging by these scriptures, we see that it is improper, in YAHWEH’s eyes, for men to do anything of a religious nature whereby their nakedness is seen.

Now consider what the scribes wrote that our Messiah said in John 8:28-29:

28. "as my Father hath taught me, I speak those things"

29. "for I do always those things that please him."

Well, for someone to write that our Messiah opposed YAHWEH’s clothing laws by taking off his clothes before other men and ordering his disciples to do the same, has to be a lie against our Messiah!

The reason why is because, he would have known that YAHWEH did not teach him or anyone else to do so, and it would not have pleased YAHWEH for him to go against His Old Testament laws based on John 8:28-29 above!

Now, the question arises:

What has all this to do with the Gospel scribes suggesting that Jesus was a homosexual?

To find out, just keep reading.

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JOHN 13:23-25

23. "Now there was leaning on Jesus’ bosom one of his disciples, whom Jesus loved."

24. "Simon Peter therefore beckoned to him, that he should ask who it should be of whom he spake."

25. "He then lying on Jesus breast saith unto him, Lord, who is it?"

Take a close look at these verses. In them, you see an act between men which is improper and unnatural!

Please consider YAHWEH’s laws against homosexuality in Leviticus 20:13. It says:

"13. If a man also lie with mankind as he lieth with a woman, both of them have committed an abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them."

Now, consider Micah 7:5, which says:

"...keep the doors of thy mouth from her that lieth in thy bosom."

And, judging by this verse, only a woman is allowed to lie in a man’s bosom and not another man!

Now, what have we here?

The New Testament scribes are portraying our Messiah as violating YAHWEH in this matter!

How, you may ask?

By allowing one of his male disciples to lie in his bosom which is only to be done with a woman!

Now, this is sin and evil!

What about the words attributed to our Messiah in John 8:28-29 when he said:

"... as my Father hath taught me, I speak those things," and "I do always those things that please him"?

How in the world does he allowing a man to lie in his bosom please YAHWEH?

It does not please YAHWEH it displeases Him!

Now, let’s do a verse-by-verse break down of John 13:23-25.

23. "Now there was LEANING on Jesus’ bosom on of his disciples, whom Jesus loved."

According to verse 23, one of the disciples was "leaning" on the "bosom" of Jesus. The word "leaning" suggest that the disciple was in some kind of upright position. The word "bosom" means the chest or breast of Jesus.

If a disciple was "leaning" on Jesus’ "bosom," chest, or breast, the only way this can happen is if he was in between Jesus’ arms!

Now, let us use our imagination to visualize the most likely positions this verse suggest Jesus was in with his disciple:

1. Visualize both of them standing with one man "LEANING" on the other’s chest while between his arms.

Does this seem right to you?

2. Visualize one man sitting in a chair, with the other man sitting on his lap and "LEANING" on his chest while between his arms.

Does this seem right to you?

3. Visualize both men sitting on a flat surface, like a floor or bed, with one of them sitting on the other man’s lap or between the other’s legs and "LEANING" on the other’s chest while between his arms.

Does this seem right to you?

4. Visualize one man sitting in a chair with the other man standing between his legs and "LEANING" on his chest while in between his arms.

Does this seem right to you?

Hey, it most certainly should not seem right to you!

The reason why is because this example results in the man’s sexual organs (who is "LEANING" on Jesus chest while standing between his legs) being only inches away from Jesus' mouth if Jesus is sitting in a chair!

Regardless, how a person interprets this verse about the disciple "leaning" on Jesus' chest, the fact remains that this is an intimate encounter we’re seeing here!

Now consider that John 13:23-25 also make the following suggestions:

1. the man who was intimate with Jesus was a homosexual playing the role of a woman

2. that Jesus was a homosexual who was acting like his male lover was a woman

3. that both Jesus and his disciple were homosexuals who often had oral and anal sex with each other

4. that the other disciples of Jesus were accustomed to them having homosexual relations while they watched because they did not react, at all, as if it was normal for them to see Jesus' and his lover behaving in a homosexual way

5. at least one or more of the other disciples had to wonder which one of them would be the next one Jesus would want to perform oral sex on or penetrate anally

6. that Jesus and all of the disciples were a bunch of sick men!

These suggestions are totally unnatural!

This is evil!

This is perverted!

YAHWEH is against homosexuality! He destroyed Sodom and Gomorrah because of it!

(Read Genesis chapter 18 and 19)

And, now, what have we here?

What we have here are fraudulent sections of the Christian New Testament Gospels, written by demonic scribes, that portray our Messiah as a homosexual who had a man being intimate with him in a way that only a woman should do!

We saw, above, that Jesus got naked with his disciples to the point that his penis and testicles could be seen by them.

And, now we see, that, afterward, he allowed one of them "leaning," intimately, between his arms, upon his chest.

Normally, when this happens between two people, the one with the person "leaning" upon his chest, between his arms, usually has at least one of his arms around that person!

Now, let’s break down the following verses and see the suggestions they make!

24. "Simon Peter therefore beckoned to him, that he should ask who it should be of whom he spake."

Here in verse 24 of John chapter 13, we see where Simon Peter signaled to the disciple "leaning" between Jesus’ arms, upon his chest, for him to find out who Jesus was talking about.

Now, what does this suggest?

Simon Peter must have felt that this disciple had a greater power, than he did, at finding out who Jesus was talking about or he would have asked Jesus himself.

So, he signaled to the disciple who was between Jesus arms, to find out who Jesus was talking about. This suggests that this person had a strange power over Jesus like a woman does with a man who is in love with her.

Or was the power like that which a feminine male homosexual has over a masculine male homosexual that is in love with him?

Regardless, it was sick and demented!

Consider the next verse of John 13:

25. "He then LYING on Jesus breast saith unto him, Lord, who is it?"

We saw, in verse 23, that the disciple was "leaning" upright on Jesus' chest. Now, in verse 25, it says that he was "lying" on his breast.

This suggests that the intimacy involved became even more intimate!

This also suggests that after Simon Peter signaled him to find out who Jesus was talking about, the disciple started seducing Jesus, like a woman does a man who she wants something from, and he ended up lying on top of him as if for sex!

Finally, this also suggests that the disciples were watching while the man was seducing Jesus!

All this proves that I am correct when I say that the Gospels suggest that Jesus was a homosexual!

Our Messiah could not have been a homosexual!

He never would have desire having oral and anal sex with a man.

Neither could he have been so twisted, in the mind, that he fell in love with another man like he would have done with a woman.

In Part 2 of "Was Jesus A Homosexual?" there will be even more "shocking" suggestions of Jesus being a homosexual made by the Gospel writers.

I will send it to you in 2 or 3 days.

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Hmm.. homophobe much? - Wot happened to 'Prophet' 'Yahweh'?? he ran outa weed? his space bros not turning up?? :p

I don't necessarily agree with wot homos do.. but what the fuck has it got to do with anything anyway? apart from a confusion or sexual act preference.. Tis not really anything to do with love - 'Jesus' (cuz if He was even a real person, must've been a fag eh? :rolleyes: or worse a 'Reptile' :rolleyes:) taught unconditional love - didn't have much to do with sexual expressions..

The washing of feet was a custom @ the time (wen every cunt walked around with sandals n shit) & was about respect & service - there's nothing sexual about it.. & He did it nude? or girded with a towel? - good job I say! way to embrace humility & smash shame! :D

I'm striving to be impartial here - & I don't give too much of a shit either-way to Jesus' sexuality.. I simply don't think there's any scriptural evidence to suggest He was gay.

Seriously some of ya'll with wild, fanciful ideas (which are obviously pushing an agenda) genuinely, I hope ya get better soon. ;)

quetzalcoatl

19-05-2009, 02:50 PM

Tis meant to be left open to interpretation.. weeds out the fearful & paranoid.. ;)

fekdemasons

19-05-2009, 02:51 PM

And what evidence are you basing this on. I have not found a scriptiure, Canon or not that suggests he was Gay.

" Get thee behind me Satan " ?????

oopps sorry , not really appropriate. Sorry Big man (JC ) ..

Well , got to be on the safe side when I reach the gates. " But Pete , come on I took it back instantly didn't I "

Gates close , and its eternal damnation...... DOH !

manxboz

19-05-2009, 02:53 PM

And this means he was gay, i don't think.

snoopsnuffleopagus

19-05-2009, 07:52 PM

I don't see how that detracts from anything we've said. In fact, it only adds to it!

It's just more evidence that the "tree of life" is apparently a female fertility symbol.

As long as you persist in 'Viewing' this Topic through a Westernized Greco/Roman Babylonish Pagan Mindset you will never understand the Truths contained within these Books.

You can view it from the Hebraic Perspective of those who wrote these Books. All the Authors were Torah Conscious and Observant Hebrews, with a Hebrew Mindset/Perspective.

The Tree of Life is well explained by Scripture. All you offer is the Babylonish Perspective. Your Presentation of the Pine Cone establishes that.

Notice how you exalt that which Abba Yahweh declares Unclean. Also there is complete disconnect from Torah.

Let Scripture Interpret Scripture.

http://www.yahweh.org/publications/articles/tree/tree_of_life.pdf

http://www.thepathtolife.com/PathtoLife.pdf

Simply Put: The Tree of Life is the Torah and Testimony

The Water of Life is Torah

Torah is the Word of Yahweh.

The Pagans Carnal Perspective is evidence of their innate, inbred, Structural Deficiencies, which is why Babylon is crumbling.

:)

kasalt

19-05-2009, 08:22 PM

The Tree of Life is well explained by Scripture. All you offer is the Babylonish Perspective. Your Presentation of the Pine Cone establishes that.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Xnuiww4u5pg

1977

19-05-2009, 09:37 PM

As long as you persist in 'Viewing' this Topic through a Westernized Greco/Roman Babylonish Pagan Mindset you will never understand the Truths contained within these Books.

You can view it from the Hebraic Perspective of those who wrote these Books. All the Authors were Torah Conscious and Observant Hebrews, with a Hebrew Mindset/Perspective.

The Tree of Life is well explained by Scripture. All you offer is the Babylonish Perspective. Your Presentation of the Pine Cone establishes that.

Notice how you exalt that which Abba Yahweh declares Unclean. Also there is complete disconnect from Torah.

Let Scripture Interpret Scripture.

http://www.yahweh.org/publications/articles/tree/tree_of_life.pdf

http://www.thepathtolife.com/PathtoLife.pdf

Simply Put: The Tree of Life is the Torah and Testimony

The Water of Life is Torah

Torah is the Word of Yahweh.

The Pagans Carnal Perspective is evidence of their innate, inbred, Structural Deficiencies, which is why Babylon is crumbling.

:)
look at all of the crazy in this post

michael christopher

20-05-2009, 12:00 AM

" Get thee behind me Satan " ?????

Ahahahahahahahahahah! That's awesome. I'm going to use that in the future.

manxboz

20-05-2009, 03:42 PM

Ahahahahahahahahahah! That's awesome. I'm going to use that in the future.

You need to read the whole of that chapter not just take little bits out.

miracles

20-05-2009, 04:03 PM

look at all of the crazy in this post

snoops is onto it.

kasalt

20-05-2009, 05:18 PM

snoops is onto it.

How can anyone who promotes a false prophet be "onto it"?

RE: http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23020

metacomet

20-05-2009, 06:06 PM

That quote from Rev 22 in your signature is describing a woman's menstrual cycle, so lol@u x2

Hahaahahahaha....

snoopsnuffleopagus

20-05-2009, 07:28 PM

How can anyone who promotes a false prophet be "onto it"?

Isayah 8:20 To the Law and the Prophecy, if they speak not according to this Word, there is no Light in them.

Ecclesiastes 12:13-14 Let us hear the conclusion of this matter: Reverence Yahweh, by observing and keeping His Commandments, for this is the whole duty of man. For Yahweh will bring every work into Judgement, including every secret thing, whether it is righteous, or whether it is evil.

These few verses repudiate all the Pagan Speculative Conjecture.

kasalt, I'll agree Yisraels Reach has exceeded his grasp. Like yours, like mine, like most humans who attempt to do things.

I do believe he is sincere, and he has erred. But I do not perceive him as a Fraud. I do perceive you as a Fraud.

Let's compare your work product with his:

http://yahweh.com/PWMags/PWtitles.html

http://yahweh.com/PWMags/PW12-04/search.htm

http://yahweh.com/TemplePage/Temple.html

High Value; High Quality

Your Work Product/Offerings:

http://www.lovewithoutend.com/

Diabetics Beware!!!

PURE FRAUD

http://www.sda-archives.com/

PURE GARBAGE written by a deceitful idiot:

http://209.85.165.104/search?q=cache:BjMKjGzYC-EJ:www.krishnamedia.org/e-books/Tattva-Viveka.pdf+Tattva-vivek&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=1&gl=us

Deliberating on the virtues and faults of this world, some moralistic monotheists concluded that the material world is not a place of pure happiness. Indeed, the sufferings outweigh the pleasures. They claim that the material world is a prison to punish the living entities. If there is punishment, then there must be a crime. If there were no crime, then why would there be any punishment? What crime did the living entities commit? Unable to properly answer this question, some men of small intelligence gave birth to a very wild idea. God created the first man and placed him in a pleasant garden with his wife. Then God forbade the man to taste the fruit of the tree of knowledge. Following the evil counsel of a wicked being, the first man and woman tasted the fruit of the tree of knowledge, thus disobeying God's command. In this way they fell from that garden into the material world filled with sufferings. Because of their offense, all other living entities are offenders from the moment of their birth. Not seeing any other way to remove this offense, God Himself took birth in a humanlike form, took on His own shoulders the sins of His followers, and then died. All who follow Him easily attain liberation, and all who do not follow Him fall into an eternal hell. In this way God assumes a humanlike form, punishes Himself, and thus liberates the living entities. An intelligent person cannot make sense of any of this.

To accept this mixed-up religion one must first believe these rather implausible things: "The living entity's life begins at birth and ends at death. Before birth the living entity did not exist, and after death the living entity will no longer stay in the world of material activities. Only human beings have souls. Other creatures do not have souls." Only extremely unintelligent persons believe this religion. In this religion the living entity is not spiritual in nature. By His own will God created the living entities out of matter. Why are the living entities born into very different situations? The followers of this religion cannot say. Why is one living entity born into a house filled with sufferings, another living entity born into a house filled with joys, another living entity born into the house of a person devoted to God, and another living entity born into a wicked atheist's house? Why is one person born in a situation where he is encouraged to perform pious deeds, and he performs pious deeds and becomes good? Why is another person born in a situation where he is encouraged to sin, and he sins and becomes bad? The followers of this religion cannot answer all these questions. Their religion seems to say that God is unfair and irrational.

Why do they say that animals have no souls? Why do birds and beasts not have souls like human beings? Why do the human beings have only one life, and, because of their actions in that one life are rewarded in eternal heaven or punished with eternal hell? Any person who believes in a truly kind and merciful God will find this religion completely unacceptable.

PURE, DECEITFUL, VERY FRAUDULENT

kasalt, you are more fraudulent than those you accuse.

Your Work Product 'Blows'

In this Thread you have refused to answer any of the challenges, instead you change topics and slur people.

you are so transparent.

Admit your defeat in this Thread and depart, you have no Light to share, only Darkness.

You Pagans got nuthin.

kasalt

20-05-2009, 07:56 PM

Admit your defeat in this Thread and depart

Rock-a-bye, baby
In the treetop
When the wind blows
The cradle will rock
When the bough breaks
The cradle will fall
And down will come baby
Cradle and all

snoopsnuffleopagus

20-05-2009, 08:00 PM

Rock-a-bye, baby
In the treetop
When the wind blows
The cradle will rock
When the bough breaks
The cradle will fall
And down will come baby
Cradle and all

and you still can't answer the challenges.

lol

michael christopher

20-05-2009, 11:41 PM

You need to read the whole of that chapter not just take little bits out.

I don't need to do anything, dude. I know it was a joke and I did read the whole post. Also, I'm certainly not going to agree with any Christian's view of who Jesus actually was anyway, since all of the information they are given is contradictory and since Jesus would consider most of their beliefs demonic anyhow. Even the Biblical Jesus would condemn Christianity, being that he warned against praying in temples and carrying money.

miracles

21-05-2009, 12:04 AM

How can anyone who promotes a false prophet be "onto it"?

RE: http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23020

meaning the false prophet Jesus?

kasalt

21-05-2009, 12:09 AM

meaning the false prophet Jesus?

Of course not, take the link: http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=23020

michael christopher

21-05-2009, 12:20 AM

meaning the false prophet Jesus?

The false prophet thus referred to was the delusional Prophet Yahweh.

meksar

21-05-2009, 02:33 AM

Cesare Borgia was a homosexual,pedophile, tyrant and performed incest with his mother and sister, this is the man the world has been deceived into believing was Christ. Yahawahshi on the other hand was the most righteous man who ever lived and his teachings have been corrupted and destroyed by the devilish Vatican.

Christ did not look like how he has been depicted in mainstream, in fact he was a dark skinned man with woolly hair and was born during spring. Christmas is nothing but Nimrod worship and is a satanic festival which is pointless. For people to suggest that damned devil Cesare was a homo, you have my full blessing, but to the say the same about Yahawahshi is speaking great words against him.

miracles

21-05-2009, 06:29 AM

The false prophet thus referred to was the delusional Prophet Yahweh.

OH I see, Thanks MC, How are you mate? I hope you are well. :)

element

21-05-2009, 10:32 AM

Maybe he was asexual. Just a thought..;)

meksar

21-05-2009, 01:21 PM

Here is Cesare Borgia

https://www.1st-art-gallery.com/thumbnail/223873/1/Cesare-Borgia-1475-1507-Duke-Of-Valencia.jpg

Here is David Mayer De Rothschild

http://sydwalker.info/blog/wp-content/uploads/2008/12/david-rothschild.jpg

The Devil's greatest trick was to convince everyone he did not exist

uncia

21-05-2009, 01:26 PM

Christ did not look like how he has been depicted in mainstream, in fact he was a dark skinned man with woolly hair.
How do you know? If Abraham and his lot came from Ur, of the Sumerians, the Sumerians were fair skinned people. See http://www.museudantu.org.br/Antiguidade/sumer.jpg

meksar

21-05-2009, 01:54 PM

Christ was not white, as for the whole Abraham thing your going by mainstream depiction(Devilish deceivers). I believe that Abraham had both Arab and Israelite blood in him, and you should know by now the 12 tribes of Israel were the people sold into slavery.

http://www.abarnett.demon.co.uk/atheism/jesus_white.html

http://www.realisraelites.com/

meksar

21-05-2009, 01:59 PM

http://greatmillstone.info/GMSpictures/slides/CESARSIGNFINALIZEDlow.jpg

uncia

21-05-2009, 02:49 PM

Christ was not white, as for the whole Abraham thing your going by mainstream depiction(Devilish deceivers). I believe that Abraham had both Arab and Israelite blood in him
You are wrong. Abraham came before both the Arabs and the Israelites.

The Arabs are descended from Ishmael (reputedly), who was a son of Hagar the Egyptian and Abraham the Sumerian.

The Israelites are descended of Isaac, who was born of Abraham's wife Sarah, another white Sumerian who was his sister. Furthermore Esau was said to have "red" skin which proves that he was white and not black.

Thus Jesus could have been white, but depends on the degree to which his ancestors retained their identity from the neighbouring peoples.

mephibosheth

21-05-2009, 06:27 PM

You are wrong. Abraham came before both the Arabs and the Israelites.

Right...he was from India, a Brahmin.

Thus Jesus could have been white, but depends on the degree to which his ancestors retained their identity from the neighbouring peoples.

Jesus 'could have been' purple for all we know. And according to hard-line Christians, he didn't have any 'ancestors' since he is God Himself. Snce Jesus was implanted in Mary, there's absolutely no need to connect his appearance to any lineage that may have been connected to Mary (or Joseph).

Unless, of course, Jesus was just born and conceived in the ordinary way...

luciferhorus

21-05-2009, 07:03 PM

How do you know? If Abraham and his lot came from Ur, of the Sumerians, the Sumerians were fair skinned people. See http://www.museudantu.org.br/Antiguidade/sumer.jpg

Abraham is approximately circa. 2300 B.C. or thereabouts, however the liberated slaves of the African slave revolution some 900 years later (i.e., the Israelites) were entirely a mixture of various types of African slaves including the Nubians who were 'black Africans;' depictions of the slaves litter the artwork of ancient Egypt and are left for us as a reminder that these African slaves were generally of African and Semitic appearance; I have yet to find a depiction in Egyptian artwork of a white, blond haired slave of the ilk of the current Israeli president.

http://www.jewishjournal.com/images/bloggish_images/ajcms-750504.gif

http://www.nostalgiamerchant.biz/Movies%20Large%20JPEGS/Blood-of-Jesus.jpg

On the Racist, Xenophobic, Nationalistic Jesus

Since Jesus described a Phoenician woman as a 'dog,' I think that this and other similar passages regarding non-Israelites makes the case that the scribes who wrote the Gospel texts present him as being xenophobic (fear or hatred of other cultures) and nationalistic; a non-Israelite reading the text would probably take offense, and thus it seems that the texts are written in the Greek, not for the Greeks themselves, but rather for the benefit of the Israelite diaspora who could read Greek.

http://www.lacoctelera.com/myfiles/feitus/kkk-ku-klux-klan2.jpg

I think it is 'entirely' accurate in the modern sense to say that Jesus was a racist, however it was a form of pseudo-racism (false racism) since the Israelites were not racially unique; I think that more accurately we could say that he was certainly xenophobic (fear or hatred of other cultures) and nationalistic.

http://softmelon.files.wordpress.com/2009/04/racist.jpg

Over 4000 years ago Abraham was an Iraqi (from Ur near Babylon) and nothing in the text indicates any racial uniqueness about him; the Israelites 2000 years ago were allegedly the descendents of the numerous types of slaves kept by Pharoah from various parts of Africa; they would have been very much the definition of 'Semi (mixed).'

http://deathby1000papercuts.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/02/jesus.jpg

Gentiles

The term 'Gentiles' can be translated as 'of other nations' or 'foreigners' and certainly the Jesus of the Gospels tells his followers 'do not to go into the towns and cities of the Gentiles' and that he has come for the 'lost sheep of Israel;' of course if Christians took this seriously, they would only spread their message among the Israelites (the African descendents of the Egyptian slave revolution), but they seem to conventiently ignore this and are generally followers of Paulianity.

Paulianity

Paul of course never met Jesus or knew him personally and lived in an age where there were numerous people still alive who had known Jesus personally, and who considered Paul to be a heretic who was spreading his own heretical version of the teachings of Jesus to the Greeks and Romans; the fact that Paul considers his message to be orthodox and ignores the criticisms of those who knew Jesus personally is simply a testimony to his arrogance.

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/223/460491308_c083c6db67.jpg

Xenophobia

'Do not even the Gentiles do the same?'

The Gospels are littered with derogatory references to the Gentiles (foreigners), however such Israelite nationalism was common in that era. I live in a small village near Glastonbury in Somerset and Somersetians are also notoriously xenophobic and generally consider non-Somersetians to be 'foreigners;' they are very much the American version of 'Rednecks.' Prior to the arrival of the communications revolution, I tend to think this type of attitude would be almost universal. The 'Arabs' even today are notoriously tribal and while they will offer hospitality to 'strangers' from foreign lands they often consider members of surrounding tribes as 'enemies' due to some distant event which occured 100's of years ago.

Fuerbachian Projectionism (Antrhomorphism)

This of course highlights a problem of Christianity; the Christian will usually import their own beliefs and values onto Jesus, and we end up with the image of Jesus as a blond haired, blue eyed European aristocrat so often portrayed in stained glass in European churches; this of course is a Jesus whose beliefs resemble those of the xenophobic Europeans, he thus becomes a defender of the European monarchs, of Capitalism, of European or American nationalism, tyranny and so forth.

The diseases of xenophobia, racism and nationalism

The diseases of xenophobia, racism and nationalism have been part of the way of thinking of our ancestors throughout history, which is why it is generally 'regressive' to pick out some ancient philosopher or spiritualist and point to them as an example, rather than pointing to some modern more progressive philosopher; it is rather like someone who has a PhD in philosophy pointing to some illiterate, uneducated, racist and overtly superstitious holy man in India and stating 'this man speaks the highest truth;' it is very much a 'backward' and non-progressive way of thinking, which is why I often suggest to Christian Capitalists that if they were truly honest with themselves, they could offer salvation in the name of some Capitalist such as George Bush and leave Jesus out of it.

http://photos.upi.com/Archives/63be1ea061d33b93388181c2ddabad95/Ku-Klux-Klan.jpg

The Ignorance of Anachronism

An anachronism—from the Greek ανά (ana: against, anti-) and χρόνος (chronos: time)—

As to how Jesus, an anti-Capitalist whose message was directed at fellow Israelites could be turned into a justification for Capitalist revolution, Anglo-American state terrorist imperialism, the economic exploitation of humanity and war against the 'Arabs' is simply a testimony to the power of human ignorance; most of our ancestors however were illiterate and uneducated and thus they have at least some excuse; not so for the Christian anti-Communists on this forum, who do not have this excuse for their ignorance and their misrepresentation of the historical Jesus; for which the penalty according to Jesus is the abandonment to the fires of Hell prepared for the Devil and his servants.

Lux

http://z.hubpages.com/u/148172_f496.jpg

danceswithbunnies

21-05-2009, 07:18 PM

uncia

21-05-2009, 07:19 PM

Actually, he was a viking war lord.
http://www.redrighthand.net/shite/SweetVikingJesus.jpg

(only kidding)

luciferhorus

21-05-2009, 07:33 PM

LUCIFERHORUS..

Do you know anything about the Xenophobia and racism of the Essenes?

I had read that John Allegro was so disgusted at the writing found at Q'mran, that he started drinking and after popping off one too many times about the extremist racism of the Essenes that he was blackballed from academia.

There are also opinions that the average Jew avoided the Essenes because they were considered...well like Heaven's Gate would be today.

Some people say that Paul used the Essene Apocalyptic Meme to infect Rome via Christianity,knowing that any culture which imported such a Meme would be commiting cultural suicide..it was a way of getting back at Rome for occupying his homeland.

At any rate, interesting ideas..

I think it is a general view among the intellectually and morally (the discernment of good and evil) retarded that texts written by our xenophobic, racist, nationalistic, overtly superstitious ancestors are somehow 'holy,' and that the syncretic metaphysical New Age beliefs of modern philosophers and writers (such as David Icke and many of the non-Christians who debate on this forum for example) are of less value; it is simply a 'backward' way of thinking and the opposite of 'progressive' thought.

The moment that a person discovers the absolute truth, and has nothing more to learn, they have only reached a state of arrogance. Experiences of gnostic enlightenment should be considered the starting point of a Quest and not the final conclusion.

LL

Lux

http://www.gdargaud.net/Humor/Pics/Bible.jpg

Rape In The Bible
http://www.evilbible.com/Rape.htm

Rape is one of the most heinous crimes imaginable. Yet few people know that the Bible often condones and even approves of rape. How anyone can get their moral guidance from a book that allows rape escapes me. Perhaps they have been lied to about the Bible and carefully detoured around all the nasty stuff in the Bible.

So grab your Bibles and follow along as I show you all the nasty rapes that your priests and preachers don't want to tell you about. Note that in many places in the Bible there are references to "taking a wife". Don't be fooled into thinking that these were voluntary marriages. This first quote clearly shows that murder and force were used to "take" these wives.

1) Murder, rape, and pillage at Jabesh-gilead (Judges 21:10-24 NLT)

So they sent twelve thousand warriors to Jabesh-gilead with orders to kill everyone there, including women and children. "This is what you are to do," they said. "Completely destroy all the males and every woman who is not a virgin." Among the residents of Jabesh-gilead they found four hundred young virgins who had never slept with a man, and they brought them to the camp at Shiloh in the land of Canaan.

The Israelite assembly sent a peace delegation to the little remnant of Benjamin who were living at the rock of Rimmon. Then the men of Benjamin returned to their homes, and the four hundred women of Jabesh-gilead who were spared were given to them as wives. But there were not enough women for all of them. The people felt sorry for Benjamin because the LORD had left this gap in the tribes of Israel. So the Israelite leaders asked, "How can we find wives for the few who remain, since all the women of the tribe of Benjamin are dead? There must be heirs for the survivors so that an entire tribe of Israel will not be lost forever. But we cannot give them our own daughters in marriage because we have sworn with a solemn oath that anyone who does this will fall under God's curse."

Then they thought of the annual festival of the LORD held in Shiloh, between Lebonah and Bethel, along the east side of the road that goes from Bethel to Shechem. They told the men of Benjamin who still needed wives, "Go and hide in the vineyards. When the women of Shiloh come out for their dances, rush out from the vineyards, and each of you can take one of them home to be your wife! And when their fathers and brothers come to us in protest, we will tell them, 'Please be understanding. Let them have your daughters, for we didn't find enough wives for them when we destroyed Jabesh-gilead. And you are not guilty of breaking the vow since you did not give your daughters in marriage to them.'" So the men of Benjamin did as they were told. They kidnapped the women who took part in the celebration and carried them off to the land of their own inheritance. Then they rebuilt their towns and lived in them. So the assembly of Israel departed by tribes and families, and they returned to their own homes.

Obviously these women were repeatedly raped. These sick bastards killed and raped an entire town and then wanted more virgins, so they hid beside the road to kidnap and rape some more. How can anyone see this as anything but evil?

2) Murder, rape and pillage of the Midianites (Numbers 31:7-18 NLT)

They attacked Midian just as the LORD had commanded Moses, and they killed all the men. All five of the Midianite kings – Evi, Rekem, Zur, Hur, and Reba – died in the battle. They also killed Balaam son of Beor with the sword. Then the Israelite army captured the Midianite women and children and seized their cattle and flocks and all their wealth as plunder. They burned all the towns and villages where the Midianites had lived. After they had gathered the plunder and captives, both people and animals, they brought them all to Moses and Eleazar the priest, and to the whole community of Israel, which was camped on the plains of Moab beside the Jordan River, across from Jericho.

Moses, Eleazar the priest, and all the leaders of the people went to meet them outside the camp. But Moses was furious with all the military commanders who had returned from the battle. "Why have you let all the women live?" he demanded. "These are the very ones who followed Balaam's advice and caused the people of Israel to rebel against the LORD at Mount Peor. They are the ones who caused the plague to strike the LORD's people. Now kill all the boys and all the women who have slept with a man. Only the young girls who are virgins may live; you may keep them for yourselves.

Clearly Moses and God approves of rape of virgins.

3) More Murder Rape and Pillage (Deuteronomy 20:10-14)

As you approach a town to attack it, first offer its people terms for peace. If they accept your terms and open the gates to you, then all the people inside will serve you in forced labor. But if they refuse to make peace and prepare to fight, you must attack the town. When the LORD your God hands it over to you, kill every man in the town. But you may keep for yourselves all the women, children, livestock, and other plunder. You may enjoy the spoils of your enemies that the LORD your God has given you.

What kind of God approves of murder, rape, and slavery?

4) Laws of Rape (Deuteronomy 22:28-29 NLT)

If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.

What kind of lunatic would make a rape victim marry her attacker? Answer: God.

5) Death to the Rape Victim (Deuteronomy 22:23-24 NAB)

If within the city a man comes upon a maiden who is betrothed, and has relations with her, you shall bring them both out of the gate of the city and there stone them to death: the girl because she did not cry out for help though she was in the city, and the man because he violated his neighbors wife.

It is clear that God doesn't give a damn about the rape victim. He is only concerned about the violation of another mans "property".

6) David's Punishment - Polygamy, Rape, Baby Killing, and God's "Forgiveness" (2 Samuel 12:11-14 NAB)

Thus says the Lord: 'I will bring evil upon you out of your own house. I will take your wives [plural] while you live to see it, and will give them to your neighbor. He shall lie with your wives in broad daylight. You have done this deed in secret, but I will bring it about in the presence of all Israel, and with the sun looking down.'

Then David said to Nathan, "I have sinned against the Lord." Nathan answered David: "The Lord on his part has forgiven your sin: you shall not die. But since you have utterly spurned the Lord by this deed, the child born to you must surely die." [The child dies seven days later.]

This has got to be one of the sickest quotes of the Bible. God himself brings the completely innocent rape victims to the rapist. What kind of pathetic loser would do something so evil? And then he kills a child! This is sick, really sick!

7) Rape of Female Captives (Deuteronomy 21:10-14 NAB)

"When you go out to war against your enemies and the LORD, your God, delivers them into your hand, so that you take captives, if you see a comely woman among the captives and become so enamored of her that you wish to have her as wife, you may take her home to your house. But before she may live there, she must shave her head and pare her nails and lay aside her captive's garb. After she has mourned her father and mother for a full month, you may have relations with her, and you shall be her husband and she shall be your wife. However, if later on you lose your liking for her, you shall give her her freedom, if she wishes it; but you shall not sell her or enslave her, since she was married to you under compulsion."

Once again God approves of forcible rape.

8) Rape and the Spoils of War (Judges 5:30 NAB)

They must be dividing the spoils they took: there must be a damsel or two for each man, Spoils of dyed cloth as Sisera's spoil, an ornate shawl or two for me in the spoil. (Judges 5:30 NAB)

9) Sex Slaves (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)

When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are. If she does not please the man who bought her, he may allow her to be bought back again. But he is not allowed to sell her to foreigners, since he is the one who broke the contract with her. And if the slave girl's owner arranges for her to marry his son, he may no longer treat her as a slave girl, but he must treat her as his daughter. If he himself marries her and then takes another wife, he may not reduce her food or clothing or fail to sleep with her as his wife. If he fails in any of these three ways, she may leave as a free woman without making any payment. (Exodus 21:7-11 NLT)

10) God Assists Rape and Plunder (Zechariah 14:1-2 NAB)

Lo, a day shall come for the Lord when the spoils shall be divided in your midst. And I will gather all the nations against Jerusalem for battle: the city shall be taken, houses plundered, women ravished; half of the city shall go into exile, but the rest of the people shall not be removed from the city. (Zechariah 14:1-2 NAB)

quetzalcoatl

21-05-2009, 08:14 PM

Yep, thought as much.. Ergo - Jesus was gay? :rolleyes: LMAO!!!

On the Racist, Xenophobic, Nationalistic Jesus

Since Jesus described a Phoenician woman as a 'dog,'I think that this and other similar passages regarding non-Israelites makes the case that the scribes who wrote the Gospel texts present him as being xenophobic (fear or hatred of other cultures) and nationalistic; a non-Israelite reading the text would probably take offense, and thus it seems that the texts are written in the Greek, not for the Greeks themselves, but rather for the benefit of the Israelite diaspora who could read Greek.

Maybe she was a bitch?? Ever meet one of those? - perhaps not, cuz the worlds full of lovely people, eh? box of fluffy ducks!

I think it is 'entirely' accurate in the modern sense to say that Jesus was a racist, however it was a form of pseudo-racism (false racism) since the Israelites were not racially unique; I think that more accurately we could say that he was certainly xenophobic (fear or hatred of other cultures) and nationalistic.

You can only think & see wot is in you to think & see.. So easy is it that the near 'best' responses & action or words can be misconstrued, especially through the mists of time & 'manipulative translations'..

But maybe that's the answer? maybe we should all go under the microscope of scrutiny - & condemn ourselves by our 'weakest' moments? nay even stretch them to places we perceive they were intended? :rolleyes:

'Humans' Judging 'Gods' - das a good un! :D

Good idea?

Fuerbachian Projectionism (Antrhomorphism)

This of course highlights a problem of Christianity; the Christian will usually import their own beliefs and values onto Jesus, and we end up with the image of Jesus as a blond haired, blue eyed European aristocrat so often portrayed in stained glass in European churches; this of course is a Jesus whose beliefs resemble those of the xenophobic Europeans, he thus becomes a defender of the European monarchs, of Capitalism, of European or American nationalism, tyranny and so forth.

There ya go! ;)

Close enough. :)

The Ignorance of Anachronism

An anachronism—from the Greek ανά (ana: against, anti-) and χρόνος (chronos: time)—

As to how Jesus, an anti-Capitalist whose message was directed at fellow Israelites could be turned into a justification for Capitalist revolution, Anglo-American state terrorist imperialism, the economic exploitation of humanity and war against the 'Arabs' is simply a testimony to the power of human ignorance; most of our ancestors however were illiterate and uneducated and thus they have at least some excuse; not so for the Christian anti-Communists on this forum, who do not have this excuse for their ignorance and their misrepresentation of the historical Jesus; for which the penalty according to Jesus is the abandonment to the fires of Hell prepared for the Devil and his servants.

Pretty much.. :)

Maybe we can get back on topic? - or alternatively feel free to start other threads about the 'atrocities' of Jesus.. Sure there'll be welcomed by many around here.. Also, don't be shy to share 'Scriptural evidence' to the claims you make.. & then you could say - well, look it is written; therefore, He must've said it! :p

Sure to every 1 piece of misconstrued Scripture you provide, I could come up with 3 promoting the opposite! ;) - if I can be fucked.. (I'm not 'full-time' :p)

See we having fun! :D

luciferhorus

21-05-2009, 09:05 PM

Maybe we can get back on topic? - or alternatively feel free to start other threads about the 'atrocities' of Jesus..

Just to place this in the context of the topic, the homophobic, Capitalist, state terrorist collaborating 'Christ' of the Christian Church is an anachronistic (out of historical context) anthromorphic (i.e., a projection of human beliefs) creation; it is very common for some barely literate pastor in some hick (red neck) village of Texas to promote the belief that only they who accept 'his' interpretation of Christianity shall be saved, and that the rest of humanity (all 6 billion of us) are damned. This process has ben going on throughout history among large and small Christian cults and it is this 'Christ' who is entirely removed from the person of the historical Jesus, assuming he existed, which I think quite likely, but to whom an array or myths and miracle stories have been attached (as has with Horus and other god-kings of antiquity) to convince the superstitious of his 'god' status.

Lux

http://schooloffish.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/free_thinker.jpg

quetzalcoatl

21-05-2009, 09:21 PM

Just to place this in the context of the topic, the homophobic, Capitalist, state terrorist collaborating 'Christ' of the Christian Church is an anachronistic (out of historical context) anthromorphic (i.e., a projection of human beliefs) creation; it is very common for some barely literate pastor in some hick (red neck) village of Texas to promote the belief that only they who accept 'his' interpretation of Christianity shall be saved, and that the rest of humanity (all 6 billion of us) are damned. This process has ben going on throughout history among large and small Christian cults and it is this 'Christ' who is entirely removed from the person of the historical Jesus, assuming he existed, which I think quite likely, but to whom an array or myths and miracle stories have been attached (as has with Horus and other god-kings of antiquity) to convince the superstitious of his 'god' status.

Lux

http://schooloffish.files.wordpress.com/2007/10/free_thinker.jpg

I do agree - glad you can see the forest in spite of the trees.. ;)

Yes, tis sickening some of the modern perverse expressions of the original teachings of Jesus.. That bulletin board speaks volumes.. :mad:

However, I do believe He was real man & 'Godly' inspired/favored &/or created - but that's another whole can of worms.. Like ya say tis quite likely - how else can so many different scribes/'historians' testify to His actuality? :)

Fair nuff if it loosely relates to the topic - dun wana split hairs, nor be hypocritical. ;)

miracles

22-05-2009, 08:09 AM

[QUOTE=luciferhorus;1003141

To be fair, I think you are taking things way too far to asign Christianity (any form of it) to the actions and motives behind the American Government and in fact any world power, I mean surely? Dude you can put the word "christian" next to anything, which you do liberally, but it means jack tit mate.

Christian Communist
Christian Capatalist
Anarchist Christian Jesus
Satanist Christians.
Anti Christians Christian Christ Church
Christian cults
Muslim Christians
Athiest Christians
Left wing right wing and cenrtist Christians
Liberalist Christians
Luciferian Christians
Anit-Christ Christians

Whatever man
PS any nob with photoshop could doctor these images

crystal genesis

22-05-2009, 09:55 AM

I admit it made me lol HARD

Jesus' sexual orientation it's something that I don't really care about anyways.

uncia

22-05-2009, 11:08 AM

... the homophobic Capitalist ... 'Christ' of the Christian Church is an anachronistic (out of historical context) anthromorphic (i.e., a projection of human beliefs) creation
No way. Christ said that not one jot of the law will be removed until everything is fulfilled. That infers capital punishment for sodomites too; and also the Jewish system of land cultivation, which was not collectivist but employed the private ownership of land principle.

miracles

22-05-2009, 12:18 PM

No way. Christ said that not one jot of the law will be removed until everything is fulfilled. That infers capital punishment for sodomites too; and also the Jewish system of land cultivation, which was not collectivist but employed the private ownership of land principle.

or title

rowan22

22-05-2009, 01:07 PM

Whatever the truth of J.Cs status one thing is for sure, he certainly didn't define reality into existence. Reality existed long before Jesus or The Pharaohs’ or any other of the civilisations who have past into dust.

Just as our "civilisation" will return to the sand. Each moment of existence is created as if new from the cosmos. This is an endless state of becoming which we are an inseparable part of. Engaging in endless musings on the actual nature of a figure from history who is represented as a god just lends credibility to a frankly ludicrous assertion.

We evolved on this planet, natural selection and environmental adaptation together with forces which seem at least largely beyond rational comprehension to shape our existence.

But exist we do, and our own self we can know given the right way of being in relation to it.

Jesus didn't invent the notion that you do unto others, its just common sense its pragmatic in the long run to have reciprocal ethics, they are self reinforcing and I would argue self validating as well.

Children learn what they live if you want them to grow up into Psychos strip them of their individuality (Capitalism) make every decision they make dependent on an external locus of evaluation (Religion) and inhibit every natural feeling of justice they have (Government).

And hey presto an average mal adjusted misanthropic average jo/joe.

Within this simple structure lies all the subsequent elitism and genocide we are now living with.

Our being is a multi faceted emotional thinking experiencing being, all we need is to be free and to be left alone to reach our true potential it is not the addition of god forms we need but the subtraction of tyranny.

displayname22

23-06-2010, 02:36 AM

Hypothetical, and new question. What if it turned out that Jesus himself was gay?

Before you give your opinion these are the points on the table for debate -Prove these points wrong:

Jesus loved all his disciples, but John specifically describes himself in the 3rd person as 'the disciple that Jesus loved,' and describes himself snuggling on Jesus' undergarments, at the last supper, which none of the others did. They had a special relationship that Greek readers understand as a normal homosexual relationship. They ate together, side by side...

The Da Vinci Code's story about Jesus and Mary Magdalene was a distracting cover, and The Vatican removed the Gospel of Thomas where Jesus said, 'Thou shalt not lust after women.' All 12 disciples wrote a Gospel, but only 4 made it in the version you were authorized to read - the King James Authorized Version.

Jesus said anyone who experiences persecution has a one way ticket to Heaven. Mistreatment of anyone is persecution - even calling them names. [they should then thank godhatesfags.com] There are many diligently edited passages, such as when Jesus 'looked at him and loved him' in Mark 10:21, and asked another man why he wasn't kissing him in Luke 7:45, and when he describes that men should be sharing the same bed in Luke 17:34. In Mark 7:14-16 Jesus says, 'There is nothing from without a man, that entering into him can defile him.'

After Mark 14:34, while the disciples are asleep, a wealthy young man accompanies Jesus in the Garden of Gethsemane with only a linen cloth wrapped around his naked body, and when guards try to grab him he drops the cloth and runs off naked. The naked man incident is always left out of Easter pageants for some strange reason.

"...the young man, looking at Jesus, loved him and began to beseech him that he might be with him...they went into the house of the young man, for he was rich... and after six days Jesus gave him an order; and when the evening had come, the young man went to him, dressed with a linen cloth over his naked body. And he remained with him that night and loved him, because Jesus taught him the mystery of the kingdom of God." - The Secret Gospel of Mark

In Luke 7:2 a Roman Centurion asked him to heal his dying servant. Centurions were not allowed to marry while in service, so they would choose a male slave as their personal assistant and sexual servant, a relationship that often developed into a loving partnership. Jesus healed the servant and proclaimed that he had 'never found faith like this even in Israel!' He was deeply moved by something that he had never encountered in Israel - faith and love.

i_am

23-06-2010, 02:43 AM

Nope not new at all :)

Merged with existing thread.

displayname22

23-06-2010, 02:46 AM

sorry i'm new here. i will use the search button next time. but anyway so this guy is saying jesus was gay and yet it was evil, and yet yhwh is not evil? not making sense...

godgoo

23-06-2010, 03:52 AM

Gay? Not from my uderstanding. But from what I heard in this documentary they just wanted him to be. I think it was satan who asked Jesus to give head? In the desert, he refused.

10 Vids here 1 - 10. History Chnnel. 'God versus Satan'.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=N3R4-pOvm-g

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PyFLLiL821M&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3FprEcT_9_g&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bPt59WOfIR4&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1PmMeDbqv-o&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=_KCJuA_B-9E&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9mXQ4TP2Owg&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LWU7Us43cQ0&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=n8LLXfhoVMQ&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=c4leHmRztXg&feature=related

I know some won't agree me using the HC, but this documentary is just so good. Stunnin!

godgoo

23-06-2010, 04:25 AM

The Original first two episodes actually captivate you a little more. So go find the Originals.

displayname22

23-06-2010, 05:16 AM

which one says satan tried to get head from jesus? :rolleyes:

godgoo

23-06-2010, 05:59 AM

which one says satan tried to get head from jesus? :rolleyes:

One of those, when he's in the desert. The documentray also goes on about male rape.

nicolaj

23-06-2010, 09:34 AM

One of those, when he's in the desert. The documentray also goes on about male rape.

where did those making this documentray get their infor from?

godgoo

23-06-2010, 09:36 AM

where did those making this documentray get their infor from?

I have no idea?

But they dressed satan up to be a real nasty character.

1588

23-06-2010, 01:28 PM

Jesus (The Light) was and is most certainly type-one, strong male. The bible and its supporters have lied about Jesus' desire for women.

If a type one to six gamut (life force) reaches the egg it develops into a male. If a type seven to 12 reaches the egg it develops into a female. There is no ambiguity between type 6 (male) and type seven (female) - the "electricity" only flows one way or the other. Homosexuality is caused when a type has been artificially inserted into the wrong sex after birth. This sexual confusion is deliberate, is happening on Earth, and forms part of a homo-socialist secret agenda, with the horrific goal of creating a single sex society, in the physical world.

The Light will not accept such a future. There will be a restoration of sexuality and wealth.

lawliet

23-06-2010, 03:03 PM

Yes :) he had 12 boy friends after all.

displayname22

24-06-2010, 02:05 AM