Do people hate success?

[asahi]

I was just thinking abouth the illuminati thing from a psychological perspective. I will be partly playing devils advocate to the grain of some of the posts so bear with me. Is it just possible that brotherhoods like freemasonary are just for very successfull people. To use a metaphor, there is a beautiful and likable girl who is loved by all the boys. Every year she wins the beauty pageant. Because you are disgusting and ugly, every year you put on your thick rimmed glasses, stinking dungarees and picket the shit out of her like a militant crazy person. Then one day someone notices you are very attractive and so you start to drop your scuzzy act and also become a beauty queen. Not sure where this is going, but basically do people get crazed about the freemasons because they are the movers and shakers of this world. Please forgive my naivity if that is indeed what I am manifesting.

[decim]

Success hates people, that is why it destroys them.

[michael christopher]

What is success, exactly?

The gain of material goods? The "right" to use money to shape authority?

Success is a malleable concept. I don't think the richest people in the world are very successful humans at all. If they were, they'd give all of their money away to the poor and expose the power brokers for who/what they really are.

[asahi]

Well sucess is being disgustingly rich, possibly famous, having an extremely attractive wife, a stupidly shiney car and a hollywood style house. Plus being spiritual, well-read, kind and the rest of it. Is there anything wrong with that?

[asahi]

I am partially joking about the above definition but I wonder why people are so against this kind of win win attitude so instantly assume some head of state, actor, rich businessmen is a satanist. They may be intense to get to where they did but do they worship lucifer? Again I don't know because I personally think, if anything freemasonary is a bit crap.

[decim]

Again I don't know because I personally think, if anything freemasonary is a bit crap.

If you're not on the square you're going no where.

[decim]

I wonder why people are so against this kind of win win attitude so instantly assume some head of state, actor, rich businessmen is a satanist.

My perception of some well off people I have dealt with, is that they can be arrogant, crass & exhibit a superiority complex.

Others have been down to earth & "normal".

To be able to converse with King & pauper with genuine interest.

British do not like flashy ostentatious 10bob millionaires, with wives that have a fur coat & no nickers larging it.
Toffs in the old sense off the word would garner a iota of respect until they try to Lord it.

Basically if you get rich don't act like a twat.

[slartibartfast]

If you're not on the square you're going no where.

Judging by the millions of successful people not "on the square", an interesting statement. Is it used as an excuse not to be successful?

[grandsecretary]

IMHO success is a matter of personal happiness.

If one achieves what one sets out to achieve, no matter how modest, or how ambitious, then personal happiness, rather than personal wealth, is the measure of success.

[eastbeast]

My perception of some well off people I have dealt with, is that they can be arrogant, crass & exhibit a superiority complex.

Others have been down to earth & "normal".



This has been my experiance too, the nicest had the most money possibly because they don't bitch about what something was going to cost!


IMHO success is a matter of personal happiness.

If one achieves what one sets out to achieve, no matter how modest, or how ambitious, then personal happiness, rather than personal wealth, is the measure of success.

Very nicely put Peter.

[tracker]

I was just thinking abouth the illuminati thing from a psychological perspective. I will be partly playing devils advocate to the grain of some of the posts so bear with me. Is it just possible that brotherhoods like freemasonary are just for very successfull people. To use a metaphor, there is a beautiful and likable girl who is loved by all the boys. Every year she wins the beauty pageant. Because you are disgusting and ugly, every year you put on your thick rimmed glasses, stinking dungarees and picket the shit out of her like a militant crazy person. Then one day someone notices you are very attractive and so you start to drop your scuzzy act and also become a beauty queen. Not sure where this is going, but basically do people get crazed about the freemasons because they are the movers and shakers of this world. Please forgive my naivity if that is indeed what I am manifesting.

Yep I do relate to what you say here about the illuminate being succesful etc , but i suppose if you or i were succesful we wouldnt cause wars just to gain a profit like they do .BUT THEN ??????????? is this what the HIDDEN enemy of the illuminate ------------want us to think ?:confused:



how ever , relating to the idea of people hating success ?

yes and partly yes .

the problem is ------------is that humanity is programmed from birth for failure .
how ? you might ask .

well ----------we are bought up with sayings like

we are only human .
if you fail at least youve tried .
you can only try .
no harm in trying .


all are sayings that actually insitgate a suguestion of failure , even before one has attempted to complete an atempted task .

yet ---------- do we hear

Yes well i managed to create the 1st rocket because im only human ?

not really ah ?

people are bought up to manage with failure too hence the phylosophies above .

but many of us , and i do mean many ------are indeed actually fearful of success .

:cool:

[tracker]

I have taken the liberty to copy and paist part of some threads that I created for other people to gain benifit from . sorry MODS , hope this didnt break the rules but I have realised that some people just dont read links . so with due humbleness I present parts of my own threads .
the reason why I have posted these subjects is to prove partly that we do hate success , but not in the case of "the illuminate being successful" . This is because many do not like the Illuminate because of what they do , and not their status on things . the other reason why I post this is because it also proves that we are boguht up partly fearing success and also bought up to be UNABLE to cope with success .

( I dont think any one doesnt like the Illuminate because they are successful . Mostly I think its because their actions {according to what we think we know} end up causing wars that kills many millions of children and inoscent adults etc etc etc , things like poisonouse jabs , food industry coruptions etc , otherwise , please enjoy the post here )

here is thread one .



3 philosophies that make us fail if we preach them .

We can only try .

if we can only try , we fail !
we fail because to "try" something is not to "do" something . Trying means to attempt but is more beneath the meaning of it self . When we "try" , we nearly make it , but not quite , but we tried .
trying is useless .
as Karate kids master says , don't try , do !

at least we tried
means you have failed .

worst still is this one !

If we fail at least we have tried !

failure twice in one sentence !

If we fail ?

why bring in failure to our mind before the task is done with "if we fail" ?

to say this is to bring in failure before the act is even attempted .

and then there is this

At Least we have tried !

tried ?
again if one tries ( which has already been explained ) the word "tried" is past tense . when try becomes tried , tried implies failure because one has tried and there for the deed has been done and failure is the outcome . thus

if we fail atleast we have tried , is a double wammy statement of potential failure ( hence the word "IF" ) backed up by past statement of tried ( past tense of tried = failed ) .

do never say to your self or others

if you fail atleast you have tried , it is a bad thing to say and also implants a failure scenario into peoples subconscious mind .

if people say these things to you , they do not think highly of you , they may not mean to sound like that , none the less it then means they do this and think this of you naturally .

do not listen to those who say these things to you . if they do , look at their life , see if they ever succeed in life , see if they get what they want out of life .
if the answer is no , then do not tell them what your plans are or what you intend to achieve .

there is nothing worse than people we trust for support , who accidentally always put negative notions on things that we intend to achieve . even if it means family or those we consider as friends .

trust me , your better off not telling them , and please , don't say it to others as it bounces back upon your self .

don't use them , and don't listen to people who do .

be it on your own head and own life if you do .








thread 2
this is a classic mistake for many if you have the time to read it .


Would you believe that saying things like "lucky bastard" can keep you poor ?


It is not as crazy as it sounds .

I am going to give you a few philosophies that we often preach , after which i will then show you how these philosophies are the very crutches that keep us down .

Money will not make you happy .
Money isn't everything .
Money isn't important .


We've all said them before , and on the face of it they make perfect sense and tend to explain them self . I too used to say them , and even today , i still believe them , as they are true .
Yet , if you have preached these sayings , and are poor , or on the bread line , i am going to tell you that you could be hypocritical in your thinking which is why you are poor .

the 1st thing to realise is the truth i am about to present to you , after which I am going to show you what they do to you inside your mind and there for thus control your life to keep you poor .

1 ) Money will not make you happy .
I have found that people who say this would be the 1st people to smile and jump up and down with joy if they found £1000 .
If it doesnt actually make them happy , they wouldn't be so happy . the truth be said , because they think money will not make them happy , inside their subconscious mind , they program them self to stay away from money making ideas and situations . which is also why many who think money wont make them happy don't win competitions .

2 ) Money isn't everything .
which is why they make them self "wage slaves" .
What is a "wage slave" ?
A "wage slave" is some one who always looks for over time , deals and money making ideas etc . Some times they have to work all those hours because they feel they have no choice , granted that could be true , but then , if money wasn't everything , why do they work so hard to get it ?
Quite often , those who say this to other people can find them self constantly under pressure in debts .
Wonder why ?

3 ) Money isn't important .
Very hypocritical .
This is not true to those who say it .
if money wasn't important , why do they use it or go to work ?
I know , I know , ( don't start because i haven't finished yet ) .
Money is important they say .
otherwise they cant pay the bills ,
get cloths
buy food
pay for schools etc etc etc .
well then , lets face it ,
in today's society , whether we like it or not , money is important .

Do you think people who made their way from rags to riches think that money isn't important ?
do you think rich people think that ?
obviously they don't think that , they think that money is important which is why they are rich . OK some have it handed down because of empire inheritances and blood lines , but other people become rich too , starting from scratch , and if they thought the 3 sayings above were true , they wouldn't be rich today .
just a thought .

So ? what to do the next time you here some one say these sayings .

When some one says to you "money wont make you happy" return it by saying " well it might not do but it sure makes the misery more bearable".

Money isn't important "well if its not important to you hand it over to me"

Money isn't everything "No its not but a lot of what we need to live on has to be payed by it and that's nearly everything".

OK granted , people need love / understanding / empathy etc , but this is not about this side of life , im just trying to give you philosophies that i call in my book "the poor philosophy" ( no offense ) but its true . most poor people have these sayings and preach them outward to other people , but when we do that it also bounces back in our own ears , and if we keep telling our self this , then it should come to no surprise why we stay poor as wage slaves with a hard life .

Now for the saying "Lucky bastard"
This is the worst thing you could ever say if you see someone better off than your self . here is why .

there is only one way to tell you this , and it relates to a time that i was a maintenance engineer .

I was sitting in the canteen with a few others as one does . you know , the typical lunch time gathering of people ranging from supervisors / engineers / production line workers .

As we sat there on that summers day ( out of the heat ) a loud rawwwwwww woooshed past the windows and we all looked out .
A fantastic Nissan sky line metallic blue with massive wheels / skirting / rear spoilers / grids on the bonnet , with a lad about 18 years old drove past with cool look of Simon Templar about him .

A production line worker called "Ian" said out loud 'Lucky Bastard'.

this was the following conversation , note how half way through , he became belittled by his own philosophy , changed his tact on the conversation and then couldn't stand any more and blamed me . ( what a --nt ! )
For now i will call Ian ---H which means "HIM"---- and my self "M" for "ME".

M ) what do you mean he is a lucky bastard ?
H ) well he has to be , he wouldn't have a car like that would he ?
M ) Why on earth not ?
H ) there is no way in the world he payed for that car !
M ) What makes you think that ?
H ) they are thousands of pounds ! he couldn't earn that type of money , probably daddy payed for it .
M ) Maybe he did and maybe he didn't . Maybe it wasn't luck and he did earn it .
H ) impossible ! I'm 27 and I've worked hard all my life and i cant afford that type of car .
M ) NO you cant ! you cant because as i have heard through out the year , you have payed for a New TV / second hand car / carpets in your flat / computers games gallor and lets face it you've got hundreds of them . you go out drinking , you smoke like a trooper and you also pay for those other little things you think will make you happy . In the mean time he has probably sacrificed all that and saved for a car like that .
H ) My expenses would not mount up to that !
M ) have you worked them out ? after all , smoking ? over 200 games at 10 to 20 quid each or more , the games machine it self ? new TV ? what about that after 5 years ? how on earth could you ever know unless you actually work out how much you have waisted over the last what ? 17 to 27 ? that's ten years ! i think you would find that you could have been driving that car by now .
H ) its not as easy as that is it ?
M ) why because you crave to much for the small things in life , but then moan at those who have the big things ?
H ) im not moaning ! im just saying he is a lucky bastard .
M ) hhm ? think about this for a while .
When you say he is lucky , you are there fore convinced that "luck" is the only way that he got that car ! thus you are saying to your self that the only way to get that car is through luck alone .
also , you are saying that there is no way you can earn or save for it !
You are also implying he is "lucky" and you are not ! Thus you think that you can only obtain that car if luck came along and placed it in your lap .
that's 2 ways so far that you have convinced your self that getting that car is impossible !
and as for regards of being a bastard ???????????
No one wants to be known as a bastard do they ?
so in a way , you associate people with riches and good cars as bastards . which is something that you do not want to be known as hence forth , you are saying that you don't want that car in case you will be called a bastard .

What i see here is that you have kept your self away from what you want 3 times over with only 2 words ! and they are your own words , and if you didn't believe them , you wouldn't say them .
thus , you keep your self away from what you want because you are unable to think out side your self !

H ) yeah but money isn't important !
M ) yeah that's why you are a wage slave .
H ) no im not !
M ) yes you are because you do every single bit of over time you can trying to earn that money , hence you make your self a slave to earning wages .and money is important to you because you have to pay bills etc etc .
H ) aaawww your impossible to talk too , people like you who earn more than me always slag us off !
M ) but im not slagging you off , im just telling you , that your own philosophy is holding you down , that's all and if you werent so unhappy with your self you wouldn't be getting all those little things from the shops every week and drinking , then blaming others for having what you don't , that's all .



anyway people , who have been brave enough to read all this , im not trying to say money will make you happy , what i am saying is this .

your own philosophies can hold you down , and IF you are poor , and if you DO believe those sayings are true , don't moan or wonder why you cant make money , that's all .


otherwise , i wish you all a good day truly .

to get out of a ruck , you have to think opposite to what you have done for , for so long . once you have changed all that , and have got out of the ruck , then philosophise those sayings , but not before . i should know this my self .

i was once poor with nothing , and now im a lot better off .i live a comfortable life . not rich , not poor , but happy , and happyness is the ultimate success !
nothing can be higher than that !happiness is the ultimate success !



and finally this situation which many of us find our selves in at times making yet again the classic mistake .


How many of us ask these questions ?

Why can't i never find love ?
Why can't i ever make things work ?
Why cant i get a good social life ?
Why can't i ever find good friends ?
Why cant i ever find a good job ?
Why is it always me ?
Why do i always get the blame ?

Have any of you asked that question inside your mind ?

I have something very controversial for you to examine .

These questions are what keep us in that ruck !

Would you like to know why ?

Our minds are duel processors , conscious and subconscious . Our conscious tends to feed the subconscious desires . Not to get too deep into that I will now start off an explanation as to why these questions hold us down and in a bad state of affairs .

Lets look at the question at hand .

Why can't I ever find love ?

seems OK , nothing wrong there .

????????? but is there ?

Lets ask the question how it should be asked .

Can't I ever find love ?

If one asks the question properly ( although i am a beginner in this field ) it is reasonable to ascertain the conclusion that if we are unable to ask the question properly , we may never find the answer .

Here is why .

When we say

"Why can't i ever find love ,?" it creates a double helix loop .

The word "why" is a question in it self . To then place these words "cant I ever find love" is another question , thus ; what we then have is like a double helix paradox that creates one question backed up by another , thus it turns back upon it self and goes nowhere ( now here nowhere ).

If we ask the question
"Can't I ever find love ?"
This then places our mind into a better state to answer the question .

We can then look at it with out feeling hurt or others saying that we feel sorry for our self .

"Can't you ever find love ?"

If the answer is "NO" then life is telling you ( not that your ugly or fat or not worth it but ) what you have done so far to date is not the right way to find it .
That's all ! It has nothing to do with looks , nothing to do with shape , form or worth . Please read my other two threads about own philosophies to see why this is true .

When we say
"Why am I always to blame ?"
It leads nowhere ever !

This is because if you ever say this to people , you are saying , you are always to blame --- but------why ?

This always leads people round in circles and they always get the blame and nothing changes .

If they ask them self ( and do not say it to others as they will carry on blaming them ) am i always to blame ?
It then puts a clearer perspective on the situation at hand , thus , if ones answer is yes , then a clear conclusion to their situation can be achieved thus they then change their friends , or break contact with those who always blame them be them family or friends or work colleagues ,
but to say
"why am i always to blame"

the double helix of going round in circles happens time and time again .

They are two different questions that come back on them self if it is said
why ---( question ) am I always to blame ?( another question )

It is safer to ask "am I always to blame ?", which then might give the answer "yes" which can then lead you to understand and ask the question "why ?".

Until then , you will carry on round and round in circles never finding the answer and never changing anything .

If one finds that one always does get the blame , the answer to "WHY" could be because those around them are blameless ignorant emotional abusers .

Thus , a better understanding of those around them and a better plan of action can be achieved .







HOPE ALL THIS HELPED THIS GREAT TOPIC THREAD WICH HAS ACTUALLY BOUGHT UP A GOOD TOPIC OF DEBATE .

:cool:

[indigo28]

Yes, honestly, I don't know any "well off" people who would consider themselves truly happy. There can never be enough material things to acquire and alot of them drink to cope and become very disenchanted and miserable and want to keep you down too. Kind of like, I'm well off so I don't want you to be as well off as me. They are not happy that I've seen. However, the "wealthy" don't care at all what you do, they have their wealth and know it. I can tell the difference between the "middle class" and "wealthy or upper class" by this test. When I ask a person whether they need more water and they say yes please and thank you very much and are polite and respectful-they are wealthy. If they are arrogant and rude and seem miserable, stressed and drink alot and trying too hard-they are not wealthy. Their credit cards are probably maxed out. See? it's an illusion.

[zero1]

Success hates people, that is why it destroys them.


Good one.

If you're not on the square you're going no where.

Another good one. :)

[grandsecretary]

Yes, honestly, I don't know any "well off" people who would consider themselves truly happy. There can never be enough material things to acquire and alot of them drink to cope and become very disenchanted and miserable and want to keep you down too. Kind of like, I'm well off so I don't want you to be as well off as me. They are not happy that I've seen. However, the "wealthy" don't care at all what you do, they have their wealth and know it. I can tell the difference between the "middle class" and "wealthy or upper class" by this test. When I ask a person whether they need more water and they say yes please and thank you very much and are polite and respectful-they are wealthy. If they are arrogant and rude and seem miserable, stressed and drink alot and trying too hard-they are not wealthy. Their credit cards are probably maxed out. See? it's an illusion.

My definition of wealth is "enough plus a penny". Who could possibly need more?

[decim]

In hindsight the op would do well to define "which" success they are questioning.

eg. monetary, spiritual, longevity, family, effecting positive change, child rearing, career preeminence etc..

There is no "ultimate" success, but for death victorious.

We succeed, compromise & fail on a daily, weekly, annular basis.

A "formula" for Your success in any matter is prerequisite.

What ever your outcome.

Enter your home righteous, take solace in your family.

A New Sun rises in the morning, there's work to be done.

Relentless & stout unto your own heart, never dither, in doubt all can fail, yet not all can forgive, even the self requires abatement from those falsehoods named success.

A lifetime of woe & happiness is assured for all, rest easy in the knowledge, no circumstance remains forever unchanged.

As the Sun is reborn each morning, as is your body as is your will, till a time the creator takes you home.

Wonder at the Wonder of a successful universe, perfection abounds, yet by many unseen, as they once looked up in awe.

Success?
Decades I have traveled to write this here, surely "A" success, as the roads I have trodden were laced with bitter failure.

Success is a whore, a false dawn on the horizon of perspective & distorter of perception.

Look east, a star, it is You.