Doctors and medicine - Don't believe the hype

[Anders Lindman]

Don't believe the hype about doctors and medicine. Doctors are stupid at best and both stupid and evil at worst, and medicine is at best placebo and at worst poison.

When you are thinking about seeing your physician; don't go there!

[gordonfreeman]

It's really to hard to avoid, when you are living with a city dwelling 'normal, sane, clever' human family. So, I usually don't care as much, but I get used to it. Shit, now I really don't trust doctors and their stupid M.H.D. or P.H.D.

[auron]

I haven't seen a doctor since i was about 10 years old. :D

[anoninnyc]

i see doctors but i am extremely cautious of taking any prescription medication. it is the pharmaceutical companies that scare me the most, and they give doctors kickbacks if they prescribe their meds.

[smashstuff]

Don't believe the hype about doctors and medicine. Doctors are stupid at best and both stupid and evil at worst, and medicine is at best placebo and at worst poison.

When you are thinking about seeing your physician; don't go there!

:cool:

Most are just high class drug dealers.

[Anders Lindman]

It's really to hard to avoid, when you are living with a city dwelling 'normal, sane, clever' human family. So, I usually don't care as much, but I get used to it. Shit, now I really don't trust doctors and their stupid M.H.D. or P.H.D.

I must admit that this was a bit of an angry rant post from me. :D But, seriously, I think doctors have become victims of dysfunctional power interests. More and more the doctors are trained to almost mechanically dish out more and more prescription drugs. The more people believe they have no power to heal themselves, the more prescription drugs and medical treatments and checkups can be pushed onto them.

[Anders Lindman]

I haven't seen a doctor since i was about 10 years old. :D

Wow. That is really impressive. I know that in Sweden for example, going to the doctor from time to time is very common. I did a search on the web and found the statistics for how many times people went to the doctor per 1000 people, and for the year 2002 the number is (total primary health care plus special health care): 2865. This means that on average the Swedish citizen goes to the doctor almost 3 times per year! :eek::eek::eek:

From: http://www.socialstyrelsen.se/NR/rdonlyres/4E58F450-D0FA-4461-A01C-FDE4DBFED0A0/2912/2004463.pdf

[Anders Lindman]

i see doctors but i am extremely cautious of taking any prescription medication. it is the pharmaceutical companies that scare me the most, and they give doctors kickbacks if they prescribe their meds.

Absolutely. In Sweden it's very common for pharmaceutical companies to target doctors directly. And the same is likely true for most countries.

[Anders Lindman]

:cool:

Most are just high class drug dealers.

Swedish media has recently reported many cases where doctors have given patients prescriptions for drugs that are used as narcotics. The patients give the doctors illegal money just like they would with any other drug dealer on the street. :eek:

[auron]

Wow. That is really impressive. I know that in Sweden for example, going to the doctor from time to time is very common. I did a search on the web and found the statistics for how many times people went to the doctor per 1000 people, and for the year 2002 the number is (total primary health care plus special health care): 2865. This means that on average the Swedish citizen goes to the doctor almost 3 times per year! :eek::eek::eek:

From: http://www.socialstyrelsen.se/NR/rdonlyres/4E58F450-D0FA-4461-A01C-FDE4DBFED0A0/2912/2004463.pdf
Yeah man!

But the fuckers still got me with their vaccinations at school. :mad:

[kooo]

Our family doctor was very good like that, he charged a fee of course but any private prescriptions or paperwork that needed signing was swiftly dealt with. Now that's what I call good service! He was an old school doctor, didn't believe in prescribing unnecessary drugs, he used to prescribe fruit and vegetables. Not like doctors today, whose loyalties lie firmly with the state and pharmaceutical companies.

[anoninnyc]

doctors are different today in the usa at least. unless you are super super rich you will go to a doctor that accepts insurance. once the hmos got involved the doctors lost control and also get paid much less than they used to. they really are at the mercy of the hmos and pharmaceutical companies for their living, which puts us as the patient in a very bad situation indeed. i have not yet seen michael moore's movie sicko about healthcare in america but i am planning to. i am not a fan of his though and will take the info in that movie with the proverbial grain of salt.

[fccool]

Less than they are used to? Average salary for a doctor in 2004 was 163k per year. That's 4 times more than national average. Medicine is a monopolized cartel today in US. I know that there are multitude of doctors who want to help people, but they are brainwashed into thinking that helping means either a surgery or some kind of magic potion.
What is the difference between a doctor and an "average" person such as you and I? If I get sick I look for simptoms, and then decide how I would treat my disease ... that's exactly what disease is ... dis - ease your body is not comfortable with something that either you or environment is causing. So it is dis-easy with something. Cure consists of eliminate the factor that causes the dis ease. As simple as that. Doctors way around it is to cover up the simptoms of the dis-ease by drugs (not all of doctors... there are many of them who practice prevention medicine, but most are not unfortunatly). We are conditioned to believe that drugs cure something. In effect you body, and your body only has the ability to cure itself. You have it all to begin with. So the better you take care of it the better off you are.
I will take drugs only if my life is suspended by thread and my body absolutely can not handle the desease on its own. Other than that... why make your body weaker by depending on the external "cures"?

[misscpb]

When you think of the doctors from years ago, they had time to spend talking with a patient, which I feel was healing a person on all levels, and indeed doctors may have been giving natural healing without realising it.

Now because of modern day pressures and also the indoctrination of the way medical school dictates to doctors, all natural ways and indeed supernatural ways or whatever you want to call it have gone. As soon as you are in the doctors surgery they are usually typing on the computer screen and not fully listening to you and then give you a prescription, in and out.

Healing is just masked by prescriptions, like a temporary bandage.

[lizzy]

Good Post.
It might also be noted that 'doctors' ' are also in cohorts with the State informing them of malfesance if their treatment plans are not followed. In such cases children are removed from the family. We have heard of this recently on the forum.
Forced vacinations and SSRI's to children as young as 2yrs.
Big Pharma is the most evil arm of the NWO Elite, corrupting and killing for profit and population reduction. Now planning to eliminate competetion by force of law now ( Codex Alimentarus, which will make many herbal rememdies illegal next year).
lizzy

[gorgeousbutterfly]

Good Post.
It might also be noted that 'doctors' ' are also in cohorts with the State informing them of malfesance if their treatment plans are not followed. In such cases children are removed from the family. We have heard of this recently on the forum.
Forced vacinations and SSRI's to children as young as 2yrs.
Big Pharma is the most evil arm of the NWO Elite, corrupting and killing for profit and population reduction. Now planning to eliminate competetion by force of law now ( Codex Alimentarus, which will make many herbal rememdies illegal next year).
lizzy


HERBAL REMEDIES ILLEGAL? ARE YOU SERIOUS?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[sunyatta60]

Dear Friends,



As I was perusing through New Scientist this week, my eye alighted on an interview with a Patrick Lemoine. This orthodox French psychiatrist made the astonishing admission that something like 35-40 per cent of all official prescriptions given patients are ‘impure’ placebos. By that he means a pharmacologically inactive substance —a sugar pill —‘contaminated’ with a
little bit of active ingredient. It’s not enough to have a clinical effect but just enough for doctors to claim that it does.

The good French doctor was basically saying more than a third of all prescriptions are dummy pills and if they work at all, it’s because of the power of the mind.

That statistic blew my mind. Here was an orthodox psychiatrist, up until recently, the head of a psychiatric services at a hospital in Lyon, admitting that a giant chunk of doctors count on a patient’s belief in the drug.

The placebo effect has shown that beliefs are powerful, even when the belief is false. The placebo is a form of intention – an instance of intention trickery. When a doctor gives a patient a placebo, or sugar pill, he or she is counting on the patient’s belief that the drug will work.

It is well documented that belief in a placebo will create the same physiological effects as that of an active agent – so much so that it causes the pharmaceutical industry big headaches when designing drug trials. So many patients receive the same relief and even the same side effects with a placebo as with the drug itself that a placebo is not a true control.

Our bodies do not distinguish between a chemical process and the thought of a chemical process.

Witchdoctors
Lemoine says that the placebo effect ‘rests in the relationship between the patient and the doctor—the belief on the part of the patient that what the doctor has given him will work.

“It is what remains of the craft of the witch doctor, because unless you really know what you are doing, it’s unpredictable,” says Lemoine. “Doctors hate not to be able to predict or control the outcome of a treatment, because it makes them feel like charlatans.”

This is why, in Lemoine’s view, they prescribe ‘impure’ placebos. “This way they can fool themselves, at the same time as they fool their patients, that the treatment has predictable, scientifically tested effects.”

I remember reading about a study once that proved that it was the patient’s belief in the doctor’s ‘power’ that had mostly to do with his getting better. What he actually took—whether real drug or placebo—made absolutely no difference.

The study involved 46,000 heart patients, half of whom were taking a placebo. After examining the statistics of who got better, the researchers made the astonishing discovery that patients taking a placebo fared as well as those on the heart drug.

The only factor determining survival seemed to be belief that the therapy will work and a willingness to follow it religiously.

Those who stuck to doctor’s orders to take their drug three times a day fared equally well whether they were taking a drug or just a sugar pill. Patients who tended not to survive were those who had been lax with their regimen, regardless of whether they had been given a placebo or an actual drug.

Dummy dopamine
The power of the placebo was best illustrated by a group of patients treated for Parkinson’s disease, a motor system disorder in which the body’s system for releasing the brain chemical dopamine is faulty. The standard treatment for Parkinson’s is a synthetic form of dopamine.

In a study at the University of British Columbia, a team of doctors demonstrated with PET scanning that, when patients given placebos were told they had received dopamine, their brains substantially increased the release of their own stores of the chemical (Science, 2001: 293: 1164-6).

In another dramatic instance, at Methodist Hospital in Houston, Dr Bruce Moseley, a specialist in orthopaedics, recruited 150 patients with severe osteoarthritis of the knee and divided them into three groups.

Two-thirds were either given arthroscopic lavage (which washes out degenerative tissue and debris with the aid of a little viewing tube) or another form of debridement (which sucks it out with a tiny vacuum cleaner). The third group were given a sham operation: The patients were surgically prepared, placed under anaesthesia and wheeled into the operating room. Incisions were made in their knees, but no procedure carried out.

Over the next two years, during which time none of the patients knew who had received the real operations and who had received the placebo treatment, all three groups reported moderate improvements in pain and function. In fact, the placebo group reported better results than some who had received the actual operation (New England Journal of Medicine, 2002; 347: 81–88).

The mental expectation of healing was enough to marshal the body’s healing mechanisms. The intention, brought about by the expectation of a successful operation, produced the physical change.



The doctor’s own placebo
But what was most astonishing of all about Lemoine’s interview was his disclosure that doctors also grow to believe in the power of their own placebo ‘sorcery’. The power of THEIR minds also seems to be involved in the healing process.

It’s not “uncommon”, says Lemoine, for a doctor to lose respect for a patient when the patient fails to respond to treatment. “He may decide the patient is imagining or faking his symptoms.”

This becomes a vicious circle of doubt. The doctor’s lack of respect gets transmitted to the patient, and then he, in turn, is less likely to believe in the doctor. “Any treatment he then prescribes is less likely to be effective and may even produce unpleasant side effects,” says Lemoine.

This is called the ‘nocebo’ effect and it means the power of the mind to believe an inert substance causes harm.

Perhaps the most remarkable case concerned a woman called Annie, whose severe depression landed her in a Lemoine’s psychiatric hospital for more than a decade. Most of her days were spent curled up in an armchair in the corner of her ward. After Lemoine struck up a friendship with her, he persuaded her to take part in a trial of a new antidepressant. She agreed and responded so well to the drug that she was able to leave the hospital. Subsequently she found both an apartment and a boyfriend. Her case in fact may have helped get the drug on the market.

Much later, when the ward was being redecorated, Lemoine found the antidepressant pills Annie was supposed to have taken, buried deep in the folds of her armchair. She’d hid them away, he realized, and when he checked he discovered she hadn’t taken even one.

Instances like this convince me that for the most part, we don’t need drugs, just our sincere belief that something is going to work.

Remember I was writing about this last week? For 400 years, since Isaac Newton developed his laws of motion and gravity, we have operated on the assumption that the universe is a tidy collection of well-behaved objects existing independently of each other. Matter — like us — is inviolate and self-contained. Living things like human beings are more or less a discrete assemblage – something that gets completed on its own back, through its own genetic material.

However, the latest discoveries about gut bacteria discover something closer to a constant two-way flow of information, in which the pathogen, in a sense, completes its host, both genetically and metabolically.

The best estimates are that these microscopic organisms —at last estimate there about about 1014 of them in the average gut —contain at least 100 times as many genes as we do).

We become a ‘super organism’ with an ability to do things far in excess of our innate genetic material. These little bugs don’t just complete us; they offer many improvements over the original.

This little dialogue carries on, in the form of constant signalling from the bacteria. Certain signals get turned on, depending upon which pathogen or which system in the body is out of whack.

The part about this that most interests me is that it underscores the greater question: where exactly we end and the rest of the world begins?

Even the lowliest of bacteria influences us at every moment.

For more information about this two-way flow, see our latest January issue of WDDTY.





http://www.wddty.com/

Doctors are just the same as lawyers;
the only difference is that lawyers merely rob you,
whereas doctors rob you and kill you, too.
Anton Chekhov

Better go without medicine than call in an unskilful physician.
Japanese Proverb

A physician is one who pours drugs of which he knows little into
a body of which he knows less.
Voltaire

Most men die of their remedies,
and not of their illnesses.
Moliere

Many funerals discredit a physician.
Ben Jonson

By quack I mean impostor not in opposition to,
but in common with physicians.
Horace Walpole.