What worries you most about Masons?

[stewart edwards]

Just curious

[lightgiver]

I have not voted but I did come across this rather disturbing info:eek:and by the sounds of it,and if you look at our history,this person is not far of the mark.

and this is what concerns me about masons and all these hierarchy types,and the manipulating of mankind and the polluting and destruction of our planet,in fact it pisses me right off.

The "FREEMASONS" are NASA (All of them!) and as such they block ALL INFORMATION they gather.
A Sientist proofed that all the pictures of Mars were manipulated to let them look red!
The "Freemasons" represent a plasma energy Lifeform that already killed Mars and Venus.
They call themselfs "GODS" over us, i.e. Religion.
Thats why they want a New World Order.

Who is the NWO?
Why a New World Order?
Is the Old World not good enough to live in?
Well it should better be!
By the Rate the "FREEMASONS" (No Free No Masons)destroy our Plane we run out of Oxygen in just a few years from NOW.
It is a very simple calculation!
We cut Trees ==> we decrease OXYGEN production
We burn Fossile Fuel ==> We INCREASE Oxygen demand.
At some stagen it will be like Venus, a RUNNAWAY GREENHOUSE EFFECT.
We MUST STOP it before it is to late.

So Who and Why NWO?
Forget what you think you know because it is all a lie.
Thousands of years misseducation, Lies and Tyranny from the Churches and Slavery from the Aristocrazy.
Who are they, where do they come from?
Well we have to go back and forh in Time.
14.400 Years ago when in our evolution something happened, a sharp rise and 21 December 2012 when the same thing happens again.
I am speaking of the alignement of our solarsystem to the center of the "Multiverse".
By then we will see a wandering planet who Zacharia Stitchin calls "Nibiru".
This Planet has a 3.600 year Rotation Cycle around the Sun.
3.600 = 60x60 (Seconds in an Hour) 360 Degrees 360 Days
That is No Coincidence!
Take a good look at OUR HISTORY.
I is an History of WAR.
It is the HISTORY OF AN INVASION!

THE ORDER OF THE ILLUMINATI!
When you are a "FREEMASON" then most them stop at the third degree, unaware that there exist higher degrees up to the 33rd Degree in two different Paths:
The "YORK RITE" and the "SCOTTISH RITE"
At the 33rd Degree Ritual they are asked: "Do you beleive in Jesus?".
If they answer :YES they hear ==> "Your Journey comes to an end, You completed the circle".
If they answer :NO they hear ==> "There is a Higher Path waiting for you. Are you willing to step above?"
This higher path is called: "THE ORDER OF THE ILLUMINATI"
Contrary to what people think it means, here is a detailed explanation.

ILLUMINATI ==> ILLUMINATE ==> SET ALIGHT ==> SET ON FIRE ==> AQUIRE POWER

THE ORDER OF THE ILLUMINATI ==> THE ONES THAT CAME TO SET THE WORLD ON FIRE

And you ONLY get in this club if you have BLUE BLOOD in your Veins.
Get it? Blue Blood, NOT RED!
Whatever it is really blue doesn't matter but it is an indicator of BIG Difference between US and THEM!
They, the "Ruling Class" KILL US, STARVE US, USE US, ENSLAVE US, BETRAY US.
They do everything to make our live miserable and WE PAY FOR IT!

So where does this "BLUE BLOOD" come from?
It is ALIEN ORIGIN, that's for sure!
But how and from which planet?
To understand this you must understand that life exists as energy alone.
Why is that?
Because LIFE IS AN ENERGY.
And it comes from the one place all energy comes from, from the Sun.
All life is a manifestation of this energy in one form and another.
AND LIFE EXISTS ON THE SUN, Life that is PLASMA ENERGY based.
Proof?
If one looks closely at Sunspots one finds that it has an outer "SHELL" of energy and an inside.
It is exacly like an egg in characteristics.
Furthermore it "TAKES ENERGY IN" that is indicated by the cooler temperatures that make a Sunspot appear darker then it's surroundings.
Again we have the characteristics of an Egg that takes the warmth of the sun or the mother to grow.
Sunspots have a 12 Year cicle from No to High Acivity.
This is their incubation Time.
From Fertilization to Birth.
Our Incubation Time is 9 months, others come in all different ranges.
This Twelve Year Cicle is manifested in Astrology and in the Chinese Zodiac.
It is on how much influence they have over us.
They are a HIGH ENERGY BASED LIFE FORM.
We are a LOW ENERGY BASED LIFE FORM.

Now connect the Dots between the ORDER OF THE ILLUMINATI and the SUN.
LUCIFER ==> Latin: "The Light Bearer" another Word for the Sun.
The CULT OF AEON ==> AEON ==> THE SUN
TO SET THE WORLD ON FIRE ==> HIGH ENERGY OUTPUT ==> HIGH ENERGY LIFEFORM
FREEMASONS ==> FREE TO ENSLAVE US ==> FREE TO BUILT WALLS AND TEMPLES
SKULL AND BONES ==> PIRATES FREE TO KILL US ==> FREE TO CREATE WAR
WICHCRAFT ==> THE RELIGION OF FREEMASONS AND WICCA ==> IT TEACHES THE USEAGE OF US, "PROFANE GOYIM"
BLOODLINES ==> FOR THEM IMPORANT BECAUSE THEY DO NOT INTERBREED WITH US
ROTSCHILD ==> THE SOURCE OF ALL EVIL

We use only 20% of our menal capacity because we only use one of our senses,
the eyes ==> Hence the "All seeing eye".
Furthermore everything we do is mathematical.
Language is a mathematical concept, so is money, time, everything.

And the FREEMASONS and the ILLUMINATI the ROSECRUTIONS they learn VEDIC MATHEMATICS.
They learn the easy way, the way to use people, "GOYIM"
They learn simpler and learn more because they are richer because they live of us.

THEY ARE NOTHING BUT PARASITES.

THEY NEED TO BE IDENTIFIED AND ELIMINATED, BEFORE THEY DESTROY US!

http://ar.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080626184356AARSw4T

[lightgiver]

Why is there is so much 'Evil' in the world today? Should be the question on everyone's mind!

It is now possible to add more evidence to the belief that the secret Masonic lodge running the USA since its inception is linked to British Israelism and Zionism. One very obvious example is the fact that The Great Seal of the United States of America has the 13 'stars' or pentagrams -
one for each of the original 13 States aligned as a six-pointed Star of David or Hexagram in full view in the centre.

The Capital of the USA's association with Freemasonry has been well known for some time now. It is extensive and there are even tours one can go on to see the sights.

THE EVIDENCE:

1. I-495 is what is otherwise known to the world as the Washington Beltway or the freeway that encircles the capital city of the USA: It is 64 miles long including an overlapping portion of I-95. more . As one can see it is a circle or magic circle? Around the Masonic Square formed by Washington District of Columbia itself.

2. The idea of a Belt or Beltway of course brings to mind the Constellation of Orion with the well known and easily visible Orion's Belt. Freemasonry is linked to Orion's Belt or the concept of a belt.

3. The Circle or Beltway also connotes an Eye with the City itself being the pupil. The Eye of Horus. The 555 foot tall Washington Monument or Obelisk is aligned with the middle star of Orion's belt.

4. The number 495 is a Kaprekar number one of only two known to exist in three of four digits. The other is 6174. It is interesting to note that the length of the I-495 Beltway is 64 miles which have the same numbers beginning and end of 6174. If one adds the two numbers together one has 6669 for an answer...another oddity. These numbers also are associated with the Great
Pyramid of Egypt which is also on the USA Great Seal. more. Is the name/number of I-495 a coincidence or an act of Masonic numerology and black magick?

Some say the Beltway is in fact 66.6 miles in circumference and 495 = 4+9+5 = 18 which of course is 6+6+6. scroll down 15% more . I-95 segement is 9 plus 5 which equals 5+5+5 or 15, the number of feet of the Obelisk.

CONCLUSION:

The entire city of Washington D.C. ,encircled by I-495, is a giant version of the London Eye ferris wheel which is 495 feet in diameter and linked to the illuminati. more The Eye is the Eye of Horus. The city is a 3-dimensional version of the etheric eye of the masons and other secret society denizens masquerading as a capital city. What does an eye do? It

WATCHES. The Watchers are the Nephilim or the fallen angels whom the government of the City serves.

http://www.scoreboard-canada.com/babylon-washington-horus.htm

and the way things are going our future aint looking to rosy either,because people are not waking up quick enough.

I am convinced Evil is running this planet.

[dhama_initiative]

The fact that they are satanic - which I know they are - but hide it?

[stewart edwards]

I am convinced Evil is running this planet.Then become Horus.

Pop over to youtube and watch Hero, by Mariah carey. It may help you. Really listen to the words. Esoterics made easy.

[michael christopher]

None of the above.

Masonry is not valuable at all, nor am I afraid of it or it's members. Like all "spiritual institutions" it is actually anti-evolutionary and causes problems that must later be fixed by people who didn't create them. However, no person truly has power over any other, merely illusory power. Those who seek illusory power do so because of their own inadequacies. People in positions of high power do not threaten or scare me, as I know the only reason they need those positions and that false sense of authority is because they are like scared little children inside, and need people to obey them in order to validate and justify their horrible existences.

[lightgiver]

Then become Horus.

Pop over to youtube and watch Hero, by Mariah carey. It may help you. Really listen to the words. Esoterics made easy.

I am not fond of Mariah careys music stewart :D I have heard it before somewhere,just ask yourself who runs the flippin commercial music industry?does Mariah plant trees.?

I would rather become a BUDDHA than Horus.;) I do not know enough of the teachings of horus.

I am concerned at what is happening to humanity and the wanton destruction of our planet,we only have one.

and TPTB should be getting their corrupt fingers out of their asses and be doing something about it,but when you are in league with Satan,its pretty damned hard.Gutless punks,all for a bit of materialistic and desire realm pleasure people will sell their stinkin souls.

Just checked the lyrics,I wonder who wrote them for her?

[michael christopher]

They are not in league with Satan, they are in league with their own egos. Satan does not exist. Their egos are so large that they make up all sorts of bullshit about why they are the chosen ones and why the rules don't apply to them. Some of them think they are possessed by great powerful spirits, or that they are at least in communion with them. They may be in touch with spirits, but they are neither great nor powerful.

More likely they are just mentally insane because of their egomania and are making up any reasons necessary, no matter how ridiculous, to justify their mindless destruction. Just because you are convinced you are the reincarnation of an ancient God, doesn't mean you really are. :p

[stewart edwards]

I do not know enough of the teachings of horus.In brief - Horus avenged his father (Osiris) after his brother (Set) killed him and brought disharmony. Horus returned the Light and rebrought harmony and balance. It applies eually to the personal level of each and every one of us, as well as to our world as a whole.

The Ancient Egyptians left us valuable teachings hidden in the plain sight of the temples to help us return light, balance, harmony, maat to this planet. MaatanchRe.

Just checked the lyrics,I wonder who wrote them for her?This thought had also crossed my mind. They came form a beautiful heart of light that is for sure.

[lightgiver]

They are not in league with Satan, they are in league with their own egos. Satan does not exist. Their egos are so large that they make up all sorts of bullshit about why they are the chosen ones and why the rules don't apply to them. Some of them think they are possessed by great powerful spirits, or that they are at least in communion with them. They may be in touch with spirits, but they are neither great nor powerful.

More likely they are just mentally insane because of their egomania and are making up any reasons necessary, no matter how ridiculous, to justify their mindless destruction. Just because you are convinced you are the reincarnation of an ancient God, doesn't mean you really are. :p

Is that to me,? or stewart?

I believe evil exists and someone or something is behind it,and I am not into silly comments by you either and neither am I in the mood for them.

[stewart edwards]

Just because you are convinced you are the reincarnation of an ancient God, doesn't mean you really are. :pDoes anyone really think this:eek:? (I am hoping that isnt a sideswipe at my avatar).

[lightgiver]

In brief - Horus avenged his father (Osiris) after his brother (Set) killed him and brought disharmony. Horus returned the Light and rebrought harmony and balance. It applies eually to the personal level of each and every one of us, as well as to our world as a whole.

The Ancient Egyptians left us valuable teachings hidden in the plain sight of the temples to help us return light, balance, harmony, maat to this planet. MaatanchRe.

This thought had also crossed my mind. They came form a beautiful heart of light that is for sure.

So where are the teachings then.?

Thats the trouble with all this secret society stuff one has to around in circles to get to the point.

[lightgiver]

In brief - Horus avenged his father (Osiris) after his brother (Set) killed him and brought disharmony. Horus returned the Light and rebrought harmony and balance. It applies eually to the personal level of each and every one of us, as well as to our world as a whole.

The Ancient Egyptians left us valuable teachings hidden in the plain sight of the temples to help us return light, balance, harmony, maat to this planet. MaatanchRe.

This thought had also crossed my mind. They came form a beautiful heart of light that is for sure.

Cheers for that Stewart,I will do some research,but I do enjoy The teachings of the Buddha, who was not born of a virgin,and was not born on the 25th of December,and did not die and rise in 3 days, in fact he died of old age,and he did not shave his head in obedience to anyone,he shaved it to show renunciation to the material world,

any way back to why people are concerned about masons,after the thread was so rudely interrupted.

[meksar]

The Luciferian doctrine through the dark side of the occult/kabbalah is the true purpose of masonry. I detest pedophilia and satanic child abuse which many high ranking masons participate in. They are literally in control of the whole structure of society and they must be stopped before they can complete their diabolical agenda.

[michael christopher]

The Luciferian doctrine through the dark side of the occult/kabbalah is the true purpose of masonry. I detest pedophilia and satanic child abuse which many high ranking masons participate in. They are literally in control of the whole structure of society and they must be stopped before they can complete their diabolical agenda.

I think people do themselves a real disservice when they assume that because Masons practice a perverted form of the Kabbalah, that all kabbalistic ideas are evil and "Luciferean." (They may well be Luciferean, but most people have no idea what the real Lucifer even represents.) Just because Freemasons practice perverted Kabbalah, does not mean all forms of Kabbalah are evil.

[lightgiver]

See Stewart,

that's the other thing why hide it in plain site,just cut to the chase and come straight out with it,that's another thing what gets me about all the secret society stuff,it would save hell of a lot of time.

and that to me speaks volumes about all this secret stuff and things being hidden from everyone,it shows they are hiding things so only a few know and that is just not fair especially when life's are at stake and a lot of bad things are happening,and the earth is being pillaged also.

No wonder people get pissed at the masons and their masters.

Just look at the earth's History,its nothing but death and destruction and you wonder why masons, politicians, royalty and all the other hierarchy are put in a bad light.

and the people are just as stupid for following blindly with out question,no wonder some of us despair.

The doctrine of Ma'at is represented in the declarations to Rekhti-merti-f-ent-Ma'at and the 42 negative affirmations listed in the Papyrus of Ani:

Declarations to Rekhti-merti-f-ent-Ma'at

It appears many of these have been broken.

[michael christopher]

When it comes to secret knowledge, I sit on the fence. On the one hand, way too much of the secret knowledge is secret, on the other hand, knowledge is power, and in a world where not everyone is equally interested in knowledge, it is quite possible that some people will use knowledge to abuse others.

I don't know what to make of it.

One of the biggest magical secrets is the power of the symbol. Symbols have psychological power, but the real secret is that psychological power is more than just metaphorical power, it's entirely real power, and it can be used to make people do things they might not naturally be inclined to do. Other secrets involve some rather insane feats of human ability... Christ knew the ancient esoteric secrets. If any random person on the street knew how to dematerialize or hypnotize people, we might be living in a worse world than we can imagine.

Because of things like this, I can on the one hand understand why knowledge must be kept secret, but on the other hand I feel like after a period of adjustment, if all secrets are revealed to humanity, then there can be no such thing darkness anymore.

[lightgiver]

Yes I can understand why some secret knowledge is hidden,but if it is good secret knowledge why hide it.?

So it goes to show its not all good,especially in the wrong hands,and that's what it appears to be in the wrong hands.

What gives bloodlines the right anyhow,everyone born on this planet as a right,if people were brought up better without all the greedy materialistic brainwashing nonsense on offer,maybe most would turn out better people.

but Order out of chaos is the on the menu these days and has been for aeons,its all hypocritical and double speak.

TPTB say they want a better society but do the opposite behind closed doors.

Its all bibble babble and corrupt,there is no getting out of it,I scratch your back if you scratch mine.

Now that is in plain site.

I do not know why I am bothering typing this I just feel its a waste of time,after all we are all in samsara.

Nowt is gonna change.:( post 2 sums it up for me.

and I,m off ti bed.

[michael christopher]

Yes I can understand why some secret knowledge is hidden,but if it is good secret knowledge why hide it.?

So it goes to show its not all good,especially in the wrong hands,and that's what it appears to be in the wrong hands.

What gives bloodlines the right anyhow,everyone born on this planet as a right,if people were brought up better without all the greedy materialistic brainwashing nonsense on offer,maybe most would turn out better people.

but Order out of chaos is the on the menu these days and has been for aeons,its all hypocritical and double speak.

TPTB say they want a better society but do the opposite behind closed doors.

Its all bibble babble and corrupt,there is no getting out of it,I scratch your back if you scratch mine.

Now that is in plain site.

I do not know why I am bothering typing this I just feel its a waste of time,after all we are all in samsara.

Nowt is gonna change.:(

Ultimately I agree with you. The only way knowledge is dangerous is if it's hidden from some people. If the knowledge is available to all, then when people get burned out of ignorance, you can honestly say it's entirely the fault of the ignorant.

When the knowledge is available to all, a more veritable option to self-salvation makes itself known.

Hiding the knowledge protects the population, but like a catch 22, it only protects the population in a world where the knowledge is hidden. If the knowledge is free and available to all, the only people who will be victim to ignorance are the willingly ignorant.

:p

[lightgiver]

Ultimately I agree with you. The only way knowledge is dangerous is if it's hidden from some people. If the knowledge is available to all, then when people get burned out of ignorance, you can honestly say it's entirely the fault of the ignorant.

When the knowledge is available to all, a more veritable option to self-salvation makes itself known.

Hiding the knowledge protects the population, but like a catch 22, it only protects the population in a world where the knowledge is hidden. If the knowledge is free and available to all, the only people who will be victim to ignorance are the willingly ignorant.

:p

Back from bed to reply,

yes but the masses are being led astray,and its not on,what happens when the resources run out and folks are not getting their daily dose of bullshit,it will be like mad flippin max,everyone will turn on one another,and the way its going its not far off,what will happen to your family and friends? all because the way of life most are living is unsustainable, and its being fuelled by the very people in the top positions who are creating this mess,because lets face it everyone is on a road to nowhere,and no amount of secret signs and handshakes will save anyone from the marauding deluded mobs, and the elites will be in their secure bunkers why everyone turns on one another like wild pack animals,and the elites will be laughing.

so something needs doing now, but come on lets face it its not gonna happen,its going to get a lot worse before it gets better.

Running a Unsustainable world will lead to a unsustainable society,and you know what that will lead to.

If the scale of the Human Economy (inner circle within the Ecological Economics model) is too large relative to the Earth System, the Human Economy is in a state of overshoot, meaning that the environmental load of humanity on the planet is greater than the long-term ability of the planet to support it. Overshoot means we are above carrying capacity. This environmental load will eventually be reduced through declines in some combination of population, resource consumption, and pollution. Either we manage to reduce our environmental load, or resource constraints and pollution will limit it for us—with unpleasant and potentially catastrophic consequences.

http://www.realgoodssolar.com/solar/p/Overshoot.html

Like I say TPTB need to get their fingers out if their asses,but they wont,because they aint got the guts to tell the people the economy is up the creek,and people need to slow down,TBH I feel TPTB are doing it on purpose,because it will assist their de population agenda.

Now I am off to mi bed.

[lizzy]

I have not voted but I did come across this rather disturbing info:eek:and by the sounds of it,and if you look at our history,this person is not far of the mark.

and this is what concerns me about masons and all these hierarchy types,and the manipulating of mankind and the polluting and destruction of our planet,in fact it pisses me right off.

The "FREEMASONS" are NASA (All of them!) and as such they block ALL INFORMATION they gather.
A Sientist proofed that all the pictures of Mars were manipulated to let them look red!
The "Freemasons" represent a plasma energy Lifeform that already killed Mars and Venus.
They call themselfs "GODS" over us, i.e. Religion.
Thats why they want a New World Order.

Who is the NWO?
Why a New World Order?
Is the Old World not good enough to live in?
Well it should better be!
By the Rate the "FREEMASONS" (No Free No Masons)destroy our Plane we run out of Oxygen in just a few years from NOW.
It is a very simple calculation!
We cut Trees ==> we decrease OXYGEN production
We burn Fossile Fuel ==> We INCREASE Oxygen demand.
At some stagen it will be like Venus, a RUNNAWAY GREENHOUSE EFFECT.
We MUST STOP it before it is to late.

So Who and Why NWO?
Forget what you think you know because it is all a lie.
Thousands of years misseducation, Lies and Tyranny from the Churches and Slavery from the Aristocrazy.
Who are they, where do they come from?
Well we have to go back and forh in Time.
14.400 Years ago when in our evolution something happened, a sharp rise and 21 December 2012 when the same thing happens again.
I am speaking of the alignement of our solarsystem to the center of the "Multiverse".
By then we will see a wandering planet who Zacharia Stitchin calls "Nibiru".
This Planet has a 3.600 year Rotation Cycle around the Sun.
3.600 = 60x60 (Seconds in an Hour) 360 Degrees 360 Days
That is No Coincidence!
Take a good look at OUR HISTORY.
I is an History of WAR.
It is the HISTORY OF AN INVASION!

THE ORDER OF THE ILLUMINATI!
When you are a "FREEMASON" then most them stop at the third degree, unaware that there exist higher degrees up to the 33rd Degree in two different Paths:
The "YORK RITE" and the "SCOTTISH RITE"
At the 33rd Degree Ritual they are asked: "Do you beleive in Jesus?".
If they answer :YES they hear ==> "Your Journey comes to an end, You completed the circle".
If they answer :NO they hear ==> "There is a Higher Path waiting for you. Are you willing to step above?"
This higher path is called: "THE ORDER OF THE ILLUMINATI"
Contrary to what people think it means, here is a detailed explanation.

ILLUMINATI ==> ILLUMINATE ==> SET ALIGHT ==> SET ON FIRE ==> AQUIRE POWER

THE ORDER OF THE ILLUMINATI ==> THE ONES THAT CAME TO SET THE WORLD ON FIRE

And you ONLY get in this club if you have BLUE BLOOD in your Veins.
Get it? Blue Blood, NOT RED!
Whatever it is really blue doesn't matter but it is an indicator of BIG Difference between US and THEM!
They, the "Ruling Class" KILL US, STARVE US, USE US, ENSLAVE US, BETRAY US.
They do everything to make our live miserable and WE PAY FOR IT!

So where does this "BLUE BLOOD" come from?
It is ALIEN ORIGIN, that's for sure!
But how and from which planet?
To understand this you must understand that life exists as energy alone.
Why is that?
Because LIFE IS AN ENERGY.
And it comes from the one place all energy comes from, from the Sun.
All life is a manifestation of this energy in one form and another.
AND LIFE EXISTS ON THE SUN, Life that is PLASMA ENERGY based.
Proof?
If one looks closely at Sunspots one finds that it has an outer "SHELL" of energy and an inside.
It is exacly like an egg in characteristics.
Furthermore it "TAKES ENERGY IN" that is indicated by the cooler temperatures that make a Sunspot appear darker then it's surroundings.
Again we have the characteristics of an Egg that takes the warmth of the sun or the mother to grow.
Sunspots have a 12 Year cicle from No to High Acivity.
This is their incubation Time.
From Fertilization to Birth.
Our Incubation Time is 9 months, others come in all different ranges.
This Twelve Year Cicle is manifested in Astrology and in the Chinese Zodiac.
It is on how much influence they have over us.
They are a HIGH ENERGY BASED LIFE FORM.
We are a LOW ENERGY BASED LIFE FORM.

Now connect the Dots between the ORDER OF THE ILLUMINATI and the SUN.
LUCIFER ==> Latin: "The Light Bearer" another Word for the Sun.
The CULT OF AEON ==> AEON ==> THE SUN
TO SET THE WORLD ON FIRE ==> HIGH ENERGY OUTPUT ==> HIGH ENERGY LIFEFORM
FREEMASONS ==> FREE TO ENSLAVE US ==> FREE TO BUILT WALLS AND TEMPLES
SKULL AND BONES ==> PIRATES FREE TO KILL US ==> FREE TO CREATE WAR
WICHCRAFT ==> THE RELIGION OF FREEMASONS AND WICCA ==> IT TEACHES THE USEAGE OF US, "PROFANE GOYIM"
BLOODLINES ==> FOR THEM IMPORANT BECAUSE THEY DO NOT INTERBREED WITH US
ROTSCHILD ==> THE SOURCE OF ALL EVIL

We use only 20% of our menal capacity because we only use one of our senses,
the eyes ==> Hence the "All seeing eye".
Furthermore everything we do is mathematical.
Language is a mathematical concept, so is money, time, everything.

And the FREEMASONS and the ILLUMINATI the ROSECRUTIONS they learn VEDIC MATHEMATICS.
They learn the easy way, the way to use people, "GOYIM"
They learn simpler and learn more because they are richer because they live of us.

THEY ARE NOTHING BUT PARASITES.

THEY NEED TO BE IDENTIFIED AND ELIMINATED, BEFORE THEY DESTROY US!

http://ar.answers.yahoo.com/question/index?qid=20080626184356AARSw4T

hi lg,......your in-depth knowledge is always amazing. ;)
Thankyou for summing it all up so succintly.

[dusthead]

Having met actual masons who have 'revealed' their 'spooky secret life' to me, I can honestly say that it is their strange beards that worry me most.

That and bad hygiene from having a pet goat in the home.

If you people seriously think this bunch of comical wackos are a threat to anything you should get out more.

[verndewd]

when the lids arent coated well and you get zinc poisoning from canning stuff.

As far as freemasons go the only thing I worry about is their ability to transcend thir own dogmas on a personal basis, If you can call it worrying.

[bluehorseman]

Why worry about the masons as a force at all? Over here they had a recruitment rally via the mass media in response to declining membership, I think that giving them this power as a world changing and ultimatly evil forse is unjustified - I don't think that is what they are about and I think that type of influence that they had reallly waned in the early 80's till it is minute now. Most of the freemasons I know are nice old codgers concerned with the role numbers of their lodges falling and not being replaced.

I think the main source for our evil is the polution being pumped into our living rooms on a daily basis on t.v - none of the programmes are positive, nearly all of them show vivid violence and guns (hand guns are illegal here and we never see them on the street but even so every night you can see one being used and someone being murdered). As such I think the main evil doers are these tv producers and programmers and production studio owners - who the majority of in Holywood are zionistic Jews.
Why?
Is it because as a society we have a morbid fascination with death? Is it because over a series of psychological tests it has been found that mass murder excites our reptile subconcious, which impells us to watch fro longer so more adds can be put on the t.v encouraging us to buy more? Is it because of all of the above plus the fact that these studio owners are evil bastards and get a kick out of brainwashing us into selling our souls without really knowing- surely they must have enough money by now so it can't be for financial goals?

Nothing worries me about the Freemasons. And all those that say "its the evil bastards at the top that sacrifice the children and want to rule the world" well I think that if the Freemasons as an entity weren't in existence at all those evil bastards would still be here anyway, still planning to sacrifce children and dominate the world - some people are just psychotic. The ritualistic part of freemasonry attracks those reptilian types and that, I suppose, is why there were so many of them in it. Now I think greed, power and materialistic possession being the mantras of todays corporate society would turn those reptilian types off from Freemasonry because;-

a) It's too slow in today's i-podded society to get ahead.
b) It's not seen as cool anymore by the youth elite.
c) There are other more fun and more relevant institutions available to the young ones to act out their power plays and goals for world domination and I can think of a couple of relevant and trendy groups that might fulfill that need in some people, not least the green movement or heaven forbid the truth movement = an unchecked society of like minded individuals up against an all powerful yet mostly unseen world dominating force hell bent on overpwering everything/one - I can see a few psychos queing up to join that (Al Gore anyone).

Those that know evil know the occult and know where to find the esoteric learnings and know where to locate a coven and through the internet can find mates, they don't need to join the freemasons anymore.

I stand by these words, I think this evil freemason bs is like a false flag, its someone saying "look over here, look over here," and while we are looking there they bomb the fuck out of little children in Palestine, Darfur, the Congolese, Afghanistan, Iraq, Somalia, Pakistan, Croatia, Bosnia, Georgia, Kurdistan, Rwanda.

It is our indivdual decisions that count - don't believe the hype. Don't buy their crap. Be friendly to your neighbour. Break your routines and make positive samaskaras. Educate the dumb people and support those that know the truth.

[element]

Nothing.

All the ''evidence'' does not convince me by a long shot.

[element]

Because of things like this, I can on the one hand understand why knowledge must be kept secret, but on the other hand I feel like after a period of adjustment, if all secrets are revealed to humanity, then there can be no such thing darkness anymore.
Well, have a look at your average religion, and see how the mundane screw things up constantly and bang on about knowing the 'true way' and others are called whatever kind of abomination. Really brilliant.
Knowledge isn't to be thrown at the street. Darkness isn't always 'hidden', it's in plain sight.

.

[cruise4]

I would have voted 'Social club possibly doing deals behind closed doors'. But you included 'possibly' and I have first hand knowledge of masons doing deals with other masons. The defence is you will get that in all walks of life. But I know there ARE masons in the police, in Law and in government and even if they had NEVER ever done a thing wrong, the situation is untenable and must not be allowed to continue. I don't care about changing the mason side of the equation, but the judiciary, police and government systems that are wholly corrupt must go. And go completely. There is nothing in democracy or one man one vote to hold onto. It's the idiots overriding the wise.

Before you start accusing me of wanting dictatorship... No. I advocate ALL people able to participate in government at any time and no mandatory anything. If everyone has money, why have taxes. If something is worth doing... you choose to pay or help pay for it... your choice. Not my enslavement. And what you spend on... IS your vote. This is TRUE democracy, not the flawed hidden tyrrany of what we have now.

Masonry, as a whole, has a long way to go in proving it's innocence to me, but I doubt most masons have any idea of higher agendas. There is an obvious danger to secret societies serving within public bodies. Self investigation is obviously ridiculous and a cover-up tactic. Change is required.

[cookiejar]

Will I remeber my lines and not for get the knocks lol:D

Oh and will I win the raffle! lol

[meksar]

The one world religion is coming, homosexuality is running rampant in society and violence has become part of everyday life. They want to bring back public human sacrifice as London is being setup as the messianic event during the 2012 Olympics. They will use the light side of the occult to convince the false religions to come as one, but during 2015 the whole thing will turn very sour.

[meksar]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nwJ0PZMbu-w

[stewart edwards]

They want to bring back public human sacrifice as London is being setup as the messianic event during the 2012 Olympics. They will use the light side of the occult to convince the false religions to come as one, but during 2015 the whole thing will turn very sour.How do you know this?

[meksar]

By connecting dots and observing things most people do not notice, you see Blair will be president of the E.U and will implement capital punishment. He and the Jesuits are creating a new Mecca aspect of London where sharia law admirers will be pleased. Then of course there is the new Jerusalem aspect and Blair considers Jerusalem home, the world religion will be sold in benevolence.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/worldnews/article-1169342/An-identity-crisis-Blair-Former-PM-describes-Jerusalem-home.html

[stewart edwards]

you see Blair will be president of the E.UOwww I want that job.:(

[cruise4]

Me too. It would be the shortest job in history.

[thelonious]

At the 33rd Degree Ritual they are asked: "Do you beleive in Jesus?".
If they answer :YES they hear ==> "Your Journey comes to an end, You completed the circle".
If they answer :NO they hear ==> "There is a Higher Path waiting for you.

This is simply not true.

In Masonry, nobody cares who believes in Jesus and who doesn't. Freemasonry is *not* a Christian organization, so there are plenty of Masons who do *not* believe in Jesus. Asking a Taoist Mason or a Buddhist Mason if he believed in Jesus would be nonsensical and childish, sort of like asking a Presbyterian if he believed in Zeus.

[thelonious]

I detest pedophilia and satanic child abuse which many high ranking masons participate in.

If there are many, could you name one?

[meksar]

If there are many, could you name one?

Listen man these bastards attend child sacrifice rituals every full moon, we know the elite do this shit and are above the law. The Freemasons are behind the most horrific crimes committed against humanity and their men have infiltrated the vast majority of society.

[thelonious]

Listen man these bastards attend child sacrifice rituals every full moon, we know the elite do this shit and are above the law. The Freemasons are behind the most horrific crimes committed against humanity and their men have infiltrated the vast majority of society.

I'll take that to mean that, despite your claim that "many" Freemasons engage in such practices, you are unable to name one.

Thank you for your time.

[meksar]

Many high ranking Freemasons who exert a level of influence or power, the royal family and the rest of their inbreed psychopaths like Blair for example are at this stuff regularly.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3yy-xHHquyY

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PPxfdGI6KfI&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gmvvc-qitVc&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=I_7Q7nFIWIM&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3wXS8ctN24&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K5R7jviXKcI&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Hmulpob8s9k&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h0slMqe4L4M&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdsi3VqzNbk&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yfOa1wjaeJ4&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rShJj7cAo9k&feature=related

[dusthead]

Listen man these bastards attend child sacrifice rituals every full moon, we know the elite do this shit and are above the law. The Freemasons are behind the most horrific crimes committed against humanity and their men have infiltrated the vast majority of society.

The ones I have met (and there are many) are generally more preoccupied with the 'I'll scratch your back you scratch mine' mentality that goes hand-in-hand with remote village communities and 'local people' (see 'League of Gentlemen').

I could even tell you where one group publicly hold their meetings. They get some pretty weird looks in that pub I can tell you.

They are sad, a little bit weird and certainly have very bad taste in facial hair, but murderous?!!! That's pretty out there. If they are evading arrest, they certainly haven't made any attempts to blend in with the wallpaper.

A missing child is always front page news whatever the situation. The Masons would have been exposed long ago if they were murdering as many people as you claim.

[cookiejar]

50% say "So far" theres no problem.

So shall we take it as read that this is over?


There is nothing wrong with freemasonry lol:D

[thelonious]

Many high ranking Freemasons who exert a level of influence or power, the royal family and the rest of their inbreed psychopaths like Blair for example are at this stuff regularly.

Blair is not a Freemason.

I also am highly skeptical of the claim that he kills kids. :rolleyes:

[cookiejar]

Blair is not a Freemason.

I also am highly skeptical of the claim that he kills kids. :rolleyes:

I find the "Illuminati / Secret Societies" part of the forum a joke and a place were people have wasted time just arguing over a lot of stuff which comes up over and over again lets just take it as read that there is nothing wrong with freemasonry.

Get over it and get on with it, I am shore if there was really anything wrong with freemasonry thelonious would be the first to point it out or look into any real thing that could mean that freemasonry rules the world or anything like that etc

Please people let this go now its over.......:(

[lightgiver]

Blair is not a Freemason.

I also am highly skeptical of the claim that he kills kids. :rolleyes:

How the eck do you know if he is a mason or not?

[lightgiver]

This is simply not true.

In Masonry, nobody cares who believes in Jesus and who doesn't. Freemasonry is *not* a Christian organization, so there are plenty of Masons who do *not* believe in Jesus. Asking a Taoist Mason or a Buddhist Mason if he believed in Jesus would be nonsensical and childish, sort of like asking a Presbyterian if he believed in Zeus.

Nothing is true according to the school of thelonious.

I suppose Shibboleth means nothing to masons also.

what concerns me also is the corruption going on in these hierarchy circles along with the bankers,just ask yourself where as all the money and gold gone?


and then ordinary people are being thrown out of their homes for owing a few pittance to the very banks that have just had billions of tax payers money.Its disgusting.

so thelonious I do not give a damn what you think.

Society is turning into some fascist dictatorship,because of some false flag war on a few crazy religious fundamentalists created by the very people who are trying to turn society into some kind of hell hole.

[cookiejar]

I find the "Illuminati / Secret Societies" part of the forum a joke and a place were people have wasted time just arguing over a lot of stuff which comes up over and over again lets just take it as read that there is nothing wrong with freemasonry.

Get over it and get on with it, I am shore if there was really anything wrong with freemasonry thelonious would be the first to point it out or look into any real thing that could mean that freemasonry rules the world or anything like that etc

Please people let this go now its over.......:(

I stand for the second time and say "I stand by my quote again, lets move on and stop picking on something means nothing to what we are trying to do".
:(
Please

[cookiejar]

How the eck do you know if he is a mason or not?

I think that the problem with him being a mason is that he is to well known to be one it would be hard to keep his memebership secret.
Of course the rules of the UGLE:

Say no politics or any thing like that it dont make sence for blaire to be a mason.

Maybe he is part of a secret order and NOT apart of a orderwith some secrets
Like freemasonry but a secret order with no proof of :rolleyes:

I bet this has come up before?

MOVE ON People!!!

[meksar]

Look you masonic shills will defend these parasites and the honest people will expose and condemn them. We are talking about the inner core of Freemasonry who control the other 95% lower ranking ones. The Jack the Ripper murders and the KKK, are just a few of many examples of the blood lust of this luciferian elite.

[lightgiver]

I think that the problem with him being a mason is that he is to well known to be one it would be hard to keep his memebership secret.
Of course the rules of the UGLE:

Say no politics or any thing like that it dont make sence for blaire to be a mason.

Maybe he is part of a secret order and NOT apart of a orderwith some secrets
Like freemasonry but a secret order with no proof of :rolleyes:

I bet this has come up before?

MOVE ON People!!!

Yes it as come up before,and why should one move on,that's why they are called secret society's.

I do not fancy Blair being into anything especially the crooked EU presidency, I would prefer it if Blair just did one,now move along yourself.

[cookiejar]

Yes it as come up before,and why should one move on,that's why they are called secret society's.

I do not fancy Blair being into anything especially the crooked EU presidency, I would prefer it if Blair just did one,now move along yourself.

Yuk , I bet you get banned in a month or two :(

[lightgiver]

Yuk , I bet you get banned in a month or two :(

Maybe you should get banned for being a sycophantic and telling noble lies a lot like thelonious.:p

This is the D Icke forum not the freemasoon free for all,yes YUK ya self.

Try looking at my join date dimwit.

No wonder people should be concerned.

[thelonious]

We are talking about the inner core of Freemasonry who control the other 95% lower ranking ones.

Who?

I asked you to give me one example. Instead, you provided the name of a non-Mason.

The Jack the Ripper murders and the KKK, are just a few of many examples of the blood lust of this luciferian elite.

The Ku Klux Klan is a Christian organization, and only admits redneck Protestants, none of them "elite".

What the hell has Jack the Ripper got to do with it? :rolleyes:

[boots]

Yuk , I bet you get banned in a month or two :(


Hahaha, Yeah right.:rolleyes:

This poll is not one that anyone on here would bother with. It misses one important question.

Do you think that freemasonary are an intricate part of the illuminati structure.

.

[meksar]

Who?

I asked you to give me one example. Instead, you provided the name of a non-Mason.



The Ku Klux Klan is a Christian organization, and only admits redneck Protestants, none of them "elite".

What the hell has Jack the Ripper got to do with it? :rolleyes:

KKK was lead by Albert Pike a masonic martyr in Amerikkka

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M3wXS8ctN24&feature=related

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OEFatAzdgTo

[michael christopher]

The one world religion is coming, homosexuality is running rampant in society and violence has become part of everyday life. They want to bring back public human sacrifice as London is being setup as the messianic event during the 2012 Olympics. They will use the light side of the occult to convince the false religions to come as one, but during 2015 the whole thing will turn very sour.

If rampant and increasing homosexuality is on the New World Order menu, I'll be leaving a really big tip. ;)

[meksar]

Jack the Ripper murder's were done by Randolph Spencer Churchill(father of Winston Churchill) a high ranking Freemason.

http://www.livevideo.com/video/realvworld/7116AABA41454A628D19987183DA933B/the-royal-illuminati-reason-fo.aspx

http://www.livevideo.com/video/realvworld/544926B14B6D4589AFF4A3AF4B8336DD/the-royal-illuminati-reason-fo.aspx

http://www.livevideo.com/video/realvworld/A30A8CF5CFFB4AB181D33848244BDC93/royal-jack-the-ripper-3-3-an.aspx

[stewart edwards]

Jack the Ripper murder's were done by Randolph Spencer Churchill(father of Winston Churchill) a high ranking Freemason.
Even if they were, and I dont have a clue who the Ripper was, the fact that someone is a high ranking Freemason, does not mean:-

1. Freemasonry was involved with murder in any way.
2. Freemasonry was responsible for murder in any way.

Now if you are claiming that someone used his lodge or masonic contacts to plan and execute murders then that would be a different matter.

Lets say that someone was a murderer, and a Freemason, a golfer, a shopper, and a husband. Is Freemasonry, the golf club, the shop or his wife somehow to blame, if they had zero knowledge or involvement?

Lets just say that you get a speeding ticket, you are a member of this forum, so does that mean that somehow all members of this forum are speeders? Do you see my point?

For years now I have been a pain in the bum as I have highlighted say-do gaps and things that shouldnt happen in the masonic world, but which do, with a view of helping the masonic world see the darkness that is hidden in plain sight, think about it and work towards takinga step forwards and reducing such darkness in the future. So I am far from a yes man, as the likes of Mike martin can confirm.

But sometimes some of the assumptions made on this forum make me bang my head against the wall, so I can only imagine how the masons here feel.

[michael christopher]

I think a lot of religious people need an evil religion to counterbalance their own worldview, so they feel more balanced, and so they pretend that Freemasonry is the anti-Christianity or the anti-Islam when it is really not much different from either, and to be quite frank, probably more intellectually advanced. That being said, I still think it's a large, useless organization that only slows down human evolution. Still, when a Christian goes out and kills someone, do people blame Christianity, or think that every Christian is somehow in on it, or guilty by association? I know I'm making the same point as stewart above me, but it really needs to be considered.

Freemasonry is really no better and no worse than any of the other religions.

[stewart edwards]

I still think it's a large,...snip... organisation that ....snip.... slows down human evolution. Sadly I agree with this sentiment. I do however think that it is useful to its members and to the charities and communities that it helps. But there is so much latent potential there that it is a crying shame that it has extreme difficulty even admitting that it has problems.

[meksar]

All the religions are false are come from the Babylon mystery school, the secret societies go hand in hand with the dogmatic religions. As we are moving into a new age the elite have to bring the occult to the light, Freemasonry will become the world religion.

[lightgiver]

All the religions are false are come from the Babylon mystery school, the secret societies go hand in hand with the dogmatic religions. As we are moving into a new age the elite have to bring the occult to the light, Freemasonry will become the world religion.

check this out meksar ;)

Freemasonry was the first organized religion. They fabricated all the other religions that came after.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6108794634466279838

They invented Gods, Lucifer, Angels and all that crap in order to dumb-down the masses.

[jacob sladder]

Speaking as a Freemason, I don't consider Freemasonry my 'Religion'.
I try to follow the precepts in Freemasonry to hopefully make me a better person - and more equable with mankind.

JS.

[cookiejar]

Maybe you should get banned for being a sycophantic and telling noble lies a lot like thelonious.:p

This is the D Icke forum not the freemasoon free for all,yes YUK ya self.

Try looking at my join date dimwit.

No wonder people should be concerned.

On my god "Look at my join date!"

I am the big man because I joined a forum before you??? WTF!

People should be concerned that most people with yout age on here are banned???????

Wy have so many been banned??? Perhaps that should be a poll!!!!

[cookiejar]

check this out meksar ;)

Freemasonry was the first organized religion. They fabricated all the other religions that came after.

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-6108794634466279838

They invented Gods, Lucifer, Angels and all that crap in order to dumb-down the masses.

Wait amin here boy, you said or agreed in a diffrent post that freemasons built king sols temple?? u?:o

Round and round the garden like a teddy bear. one step two steps......I am sure the rest will be posted soon?

[boots]

Wait amin here boy, you said or agreed in a diffrent post that freemasons built king sols temple?? u?:o

Round and round the garden like a teddy bear. one step two steps......I am sure the rest will be posted soon?


The river's run deeper than just Solomon's temple Lg has done more study than you give him credit for.


.

[thelonious]

KKK was lead by Albert Pike a masonic martyr in Amerikkka



There is no evidence that Pike was ever a member of the Ku Klux Klan, and he certainly never *led* the KKK. When Pike was alive, the KKK was led by its Grand Wizard, Nathan Bedford Forrest.

[thelonious]

Jack the Ripper murder's were done by Randolph Spencer Churchill(father of Winston Churchill) a high ranking Freemason.



If you believe that, I've got some swamp land down in Florida I'll sell you.

Real cheap.

[thelonious]

All the religions are false are come from the Babylon mystery school, the secret societies go hand in hand with the dogmatic religions. As we are moving into a new age the elite have to bring the occult to the light, Freemasonry will become the world religion.

Instead od becoming a "world religion", Freemasonry is rapidly approaching extinction. The majority of the Craft's active membership is over 65 years of age. Within a decade, the majority of these will be gone either from death or from inability to participate due to advanced age.

As an occultist myself, I would say that Freemasonry poses several points of interest to an occultist, but there are many better organizations to learn and study occultism. Freemasonry is not itself an occult organization per se, and is inferior to other groups in that regard.

Of course, if and when Freemasonry does become extinct, the true occult schools will continue to thrive. Amen.

[decode reality]

Just curious

I'm actually more worried about those who buy into the system's lies than the masons. I reckon the secret societies could stop what they're doing and the so-called sheeple would perpetuate the system for them.

Sorry, I know this isn't answering the question how you've put it, but it's the puppets that worry me more than the puppeteer.

[lightgiver]

On my god

I am the big man because I joined a forum before you??? WTF!

People should be concerned that most people with yout age on here are banned???????

Wy have so many been banned??? Perhaps that should be a poll!!!!

EH mate you are making things up now,just do one.You said I should be banned ,WTF as my posts got to do with you.You sound to me like a sycophant.

Maybe you should be banned for stirring up shit.

In fact I would prefer if you do not answer to any of my posts. D£$"£ head.

BTW the reference to my join date was I have managed to stay on here for 12 months without getting a ban or on warning,and I do not even know why I am even explaining myself to individuals like you.
But people like you just love to place suggestions and make things up hoping to get some kind of brownie points.

[deathcultreject]

I voted other.

Other reffering to a culture of privacy / secrecy which can ripple out and make other more sinister organisations look acceptable.

[lightgiver]

I'm actually more worried about those who buy into the system's lies than the masons. I reckon the secret societies could stop what they're doing and the so-called sheeple would perpetuate the system for them.

Sorry, I know this isn't answering the question how you've put it, but it's the puppets that worry me more than the puppeteer.

I agree with that one,the puppets are of more concern than the puppet masters.;)

It is the sycophantic puppets who keep the puppet masters going.

It is the bloodline family's who are the masters, and is it the masons who are the puppets?of course they will deny this.

I even think something or someone controls the Bloodline Illuminati also.

The Astor Bloodline

The Bundy Bloodline

The Collins Bloodline

The DuPont Bloodline

The Freeman Bloodline

The Kennedy Bloodline

The Li Bloodline

The Onassis Bloodline

The Reynolds Bloodline

The Rockefeller Bloodline

The Rothschild Bloodline

The Russell Bloodline

The Van Duyn Bloodline,and one imagines these can change over the years,but are the higher up masons doing their bidding?

This is what concerns me,and TBH one imagines the general public are not concerned whatsoever.

This goal has been planned away from the public's prying eyes, in secrecy within the Secret Societies. All known Secret Societies with secret grades of initiation are owned and controlled by the Illuminati, and Freemasonry is perhaps the best known of them all. The powers that control the societies and the Illuminati are occultists and black magicians. Their God is Lucifer, "The Light Bearer", and by occult practices they manipulate and influence the masses. It doesn't matter if you and I believe in this or not, as long as they do. And they take it very seriously.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RM9HORCUd3U

I was always taught to be cautious.

[stewart edwards]

I even think something or someone controls the Bloodline Illuminati also.Now this is good Lightgiver as you are stating your belief, which may or may not be correct. But, unless you really are the head honcho of the illuminati you cannot possibly know this:-
All known Secret Societies with secret grades of initiation are owned and controlled by the IlluminatiorThe powers that control the societies and the Illuminati are occultists and black magicians.Occultists plausibly, but not necessarily black magicians. Remember many secret societies were formed at a time being a "LIGHTGIVER" could have got you tortured/burnt.


Lightgiver, direct question - do you consider me to be a black magician?

There is truth in some of what you say lightgiver, but do you realise that by painting everyone with the same brush you could be considered to be acting as an agent of darkness yourself here? Why? Because you are imprinting assumptions into peoples minds. Come on lightgiver, you are a better man than that.

[lightgiver]

Now this is good Lightgiver as you are stating your belief, which may or may not be correct. But, unless you really are the head honcho of the illuminati you cannot possibly know this:-
orOccultists plausibly, but not necessarily black magicians. Remember many secret societies were formed at a time being a "LIGHTGIVER" could have got you tortured/burnt.


Lightgiver, direct question - do you consider me to be a black magician?

There is truth in some of what you say lightgiver, but do you realise that by painting everyone with the same brush you could be considered to be acting as an agent of darkness yourself here? Why? Because you are imprinting assumptions into peoples minds. Come on lightgiver, you are a better man than that.

I definitely know something controls the Illuminati,and I suspect you are not who you say you are,now whether you are dark or light I have not made my mind up yet.

I am not imprinting anything I go with my feelings,and no way am I an agent of darkness.

and to have tortured or burnt me they would have had to catch me,maybe they did or did not in a former life.

I do not profess to be anything I am here to assist sentient beings to the best of my ability's and will carry on doing so until the pack of cards fall,and there are plenty of others assisting in this task also.

We will overcome.:)

All I ask from you is to think for yourself and have an open mind. Throw away everything "you've been told", things "you've learnt in school", what you've "heard on the radio", what you've "seen on Television", what "politicians have told you" etc. - just for a moment. Let's start thinking for ourselves for just awhile. It's not too often we have that opportunity when we on a daily basis are bombarded with information and propaganda wherever we are. We are constantly fed with opinions, bad news and lies, and there are tons of untold secrets. Life is hectic; we have to earn a living, and we are afraid to be laid off work. Our survival is threatened constantly, at least that's how it seems, and this is the direction in which much thinking goes these days. So what is it that causes so much fear and uncertainty in our lives? Is life really this threatening, or is somebody creating this condition of fear on purpose? Much of this fear and terror is spread through Media, which are owned by a few people at the very top of the society, who I sometimes call the "Puppet Masters". And those people have their very own dark agenda.

Their power lies in the occult, (magic) and in economy - money creates power. The Illuminati own all the International banks, the oil-businesses, the most powerful businesses of industry and trade, they infiltrate politics and education and they own most governments - or at the very least control them.

and the next step global dictatorship.TBH they already have it and have had for thousands of years.Its already here and always has been.

Its just a matter of putting it across in a nice fashion to the masses.

[stewart edwards]

I definitely know something controls the IlluminatiHow do you definately know?

and I suspect you are not who you say you are,Your judgement is in serious error lightgiver.

now whether you are dark or light I have not made my mind up yet.When you do let me know I am interested.

and no way am I an agent of darkness.That is ego talking lightgiver. Everysingle person could be "An agent" to use Matrix terminology. Think about when you loose your temper, is that light or darkness controlling you? It is a balance that we all need to maintain. You, me, and everyone else on this planet.

[lightgiver]

How do you definately know?

Your judgement is in serious error lightgiver.

When you do let me know I am interested.

That is ego talking lightgiver. Everysingle person could be "An agent" to use Matrix terminology. Think about when you loose your temper, is that light or darkness controlling you? It is a balance that we all need to maintain. You, me, and everyone else on this planet.

I just know.

I do not do serious,how can you expect me to believe who you say you are on a forum?I really do not know anyone on here,how does anyone know anyone unless you have met them,and even then one does not really know someone.

There are plenty of good and bad agents, and the good can pretend to be bad and the bad can pretend to be good,such is life when living in such deceitful times,I rest my case.

You just sound like you are playing games to me Stewart.

when I lose my temper its not evil anger,what do you expect one to do when so much evil is going on,walk around in fluffy slippers.:rolleyes:

I am well aware of balance Stewart and so are plenty others,its just appears that the big boys and girls do not.

You know my views already,I answer to no one only the Divine.


From the occult, science, mind control and Intelligence have developed. By taking over the Movie Industry, the Record companies, and by their control of the Fine Arts, they know how to influence the teenagers to dance to their tune and accept their kind of reality. This makes sense if you look at what kind of "entertainment" we are enforced to enjoy. If you doubt it, just look at what influence the modern music has on the kids; it's not uplifting and doesn't have love and compassion as its end product. It promotes darkness, not light. And I am talking about the overall effect, not individual artists, whom on rare occasions may release something positive.

In fact, the music the teenagers have to listen to is often totally without quality and lead many of them into "robotism", apathy, violence and drugs. It's also used for mind control, as we shall see later. Real quality music is rejected by the big record companies in favor for those with lack of talent. Since Black Sabbath in the beginning of the 70:s and the Rolling Stones before them, Luciferianism (magic and black magic) has been promoted through the music industry. Many groups followed on the same track and have always been Hard Sale and heavily promoted and distributed. Ozzy Osbourne is still going strong as is his buddy, Marilyn Manson.

[stewart edwards]

You just sound like you are playing games to me Stewart.Specifically how?

[lightgiver]

Specifically how?

Well you say you know specific things,and you say I could be right and asking me certain questions,just print it for all to see, it saves going around in circles and playing guessing games.:)

I like to get to the crux of the matter.

and BTW,

The Secret Societies have been present in the history of man for a very long time. It all started thousands of years ago with the "Brotherhood of the Snake", a secret society that goes back all the way to the time of Garden of Eden. The Illuminati consider Lucifer being their God and the Old Testament God Yahweh to be ours. Their opinion is that Lucifer gave man occult knowledge, while Yahweh tried to suppress the same for jealous reasons. Yahweh was more interested in controlling us than letting us have "free will", according to them. From this viewpoint Luciferianism was developed and is practiced within secret societies up until this day.

[stewart edwards]

Well you say you know specific things,Name some of these things that i claim knowledge of, ask me questions about them and I will answer what I know.

and you say I could be right and asking me certain questions,just print it for all to see,I have been doing exactly this lightgiver, point out one specific occassion that I havent.

it saves going around in circles and playing guessing games.:)Agreed

I like to get to the crux of the matter.
As indeed do I.

[thelonious]

Your judgement is in serious error lightgiver.

Now he will call you a liar who is covering up the truth, "truth" being however he happens to define it at the moment, like his make believe "Brotherhood of the Snake", which "existed since the Garden of Eden".

It need not be mentioned that neither such a "brotherhood" nor garden ever really existed.

Trust me, friend, you're wasting your time with that one. He is a dark one.

[lightgiver]

Now he will call you a liar who is covering up the truth, "truth" being however he happens to define it at the moment.

Trust me, friend, you're wasting your time with that one. He is a dark one.

I an not even taking you on,you are only here for one purpose to spread disinformation.

Come on who are you?name rank and number.

At least I have the bottle to print my pic,unlike you and Stewart.

Out of the original Brotherhood came Freemasonry, the Rosicrucian's, The Knights Templar, Ordo Templi Orientis, Knights of Malta, Skull & Bones and more. Some people may object and say that Freemasonry, for example, is a charity organization and even a Christian society. Yes, that's what we're told and that is what most members of the secret society believe. The vast majority of people involved are good people, who are ignorant of what is practiced on the highest levels; unaware of that up there in highest places is worship of the dark forces, practiced in very dark rituals, including human sacrifice. Their God is Lucifer, and their interaction and control are the keys to what is happening in the world of today.

[stewart edwards]

At least I have the bottle to print my pic,unlike you and Stewart.Lightgiver why insult me? Again that is a possible sign of darkness winning over.

I print my name, you dont. It is easy to do a web search on me. And from that you will find my picture.

Would you rather that I never disagreed with you? Are you wanting me to be a "Yes" man?

[lightgiver]

Lightgiver why insult me? Again that is a possible sign of darkness winning over.

I print my name, you dont. It is easy to do a web search on me. And from that you will find my picture.

Would you rather that I never disagreed with you? Are you wanting me to be a "Yes" man?

going around in circles again Stewart,give me the link or print it on here.

There is a totally different struggle going on above people's heads than we are aware of, and this struggle affects our lives every day, and not in a good way, I may add. You can see the results all around you. Only because the human race is basically loving and caring, we still have decency in this world. But planet Earth has truly become much more negative than positive thanks to the Powers That Be and our own ignorance and inability to stop this from happening. Too many times we have looked the other way.

[stewart edwards]

going around in circles again Stewart,give me the link or print it on here.The link to what!!!!!! (if it is my photo you could try the archives of the masonic forum of light - look under "a" as I deleted my name after I felt bullied off for the second time.

Also can you apologise for insulting me please?


Request to anyone on this forum:-

If you ever feel that I am falling under the influence of darkness, please point it out to me. Darkness can be silent and sneaky and if no one is willing to say "Look Stewart do you not think that you have erred here" then darkness will get a grip and win over. This is a lesson that I have learnt in life.

[lightgiver]

The link to what!!!!!! (if it is my photo you could try the archives of the masonic forum of light - look under "a" as I deleted my name after I felt bullied off for the second time.

Also can you apologise for insulting me please?

Insulted?show me where:confused:

just put your profile pic up on here,How do I know if your name is Stewart Edwards?

and that goes for you 2 thelonious.

If you are a Freemason, 1° - 33°, and are reading this now, I strongly suggest you also read the article "Terminated! Freemasonry's Final Revelation", where it can tell you that being a Freemason is not the safest thing in the world. The top Masons on this planet are planning on terminating you together with most of the remaining population, until only about 500 million people remain. More about Depopulation Programs later.

[stewart edwards]

Insulted?show me where:confused:See your post 81 and my 82 above.

just put your profile pic up on here,How do I know if your name is Stewart Edwards?And how would you know it is my photo? Lightgiver you really do need to pause for a breath of air.

You do realise that the whole world is reading your posts here, and mine, and forming judgements about us from it lightgiver.

I will now let you have the last word lightgiver.

[lightgiver]

See your post 81 and my 82 above.

And how would you know it is my photo? Lightgiver you really do need to pause for a breath of air.

You do realise that the whole world is reading your posts here, and mine, and forming judgements about us from it lightgiver.

I will now let you have the last word lightgiver.

I am sure I will not be having the last word,how do you know I need air?

That is not an insult,come on I thought you were Scottish?

and still you have not got to the crux of the matter.

"we shall create and multiply free Masonic lodges... absorb into them all who may become or who are prominent in public activity, for in these lodges we shall find our principle intelligence office and means of influence.... The most secret political plots will be known to us and will fall under our guiding hands...We know the final goal...whereas the goyim have knowledge of nothing..."

Masons should recall the lesson of the French Revolution. Although "they played a colossal revolutionary role; it consumed the majority of masons..." Since the revolution requires the extermination of the bourgeoisie as a class, [so all wealth will be held by the Illuminati in the guise of the State] it follows that Freemasons must be liquidated. The true meaning of Communism is Illuminati tyranny.

Its the masons that should be concerned.

[grandsecretary]

Insulted?show me where:confused:

just put your profile pic up on here,How do I know if your name is Stewart Edwards?

and that goes for you 2 thelonious.

If you are a Freemason, 1° - 33°, and are reading this now, I strongly suggest you also read the article "Terminated! Freemasonry's Final Revelation", where it can tell you that being a Freemason is not the safest thing in the world. The top Masons on this planet are planning on terminating you together with most of the remaining population, until only about 500 million people remain. More about Depopulation Programs later.

I have told you before, that Stewart Edwards is exactly who he claims to be. Although he is not a freemason, I have known him for a number of years.

Leave it out lightgiver, or is it Mr Lightgiver?

[lightgiver]

I have told you before, that Stewart Edwards is exactly who he claims to be. Although he is not a freemason, I have known him for a number of years.

Leave it out lightgiver, or is it Mr Lightgiver?

So what does he claim to be?and why I am at what do you claim to be?

Leave what out? I thought you lot were supposed to be tough.

I mean I have not really said anything untowards,I have received a lot worse than your false allegations<I see you have a short memory when I stuck up for you,typical.So you leave it out.

You really need to toughen up.:D

and why do you not except him into your lodge,you meanie.?

I ask plenty questions and never get any straight answers?

I have asked for pic of him and thelonious,I asked where he is coming from his beliefs?He asked do I think if he is a black magician,why not just say what you believe? etc,and all I get from all of you are circles.

and then he says I have insulted him.I am not the one going around calling you agents of darkness(maybe you are),now that is an insult,but I could not care less if that's what you think,it is quite laughable TBH.

and the brotherhood of the snake does exist,but not from their own side,but they exist non the less,and are up to no good,in fact they should be called the Babylonian Brotherhood of the Snake and you lot are probably members of it.:p

because all you do is go around in circles pretending to be holier than the holy and deny anything that is said what does not go in favour of your club.

Even in Buddhism and other organisations whether high or low there are plenty Imposters.

No one is that pure only the Divine.:)

"...History is replete with whispers of secret societies... The oldest
is the Brotherhood of the Snake, also called the Brotherhood of the
Dragon, and it still exists under many different names. The Brotherhood
of the Snake is devoted to guarding the 'secrets of the ages' and the
recognition of Lucifer as the one and only true God...
It's secret symbol is the all-seeing eye in the pyramid."

The illuminati bloodlines seem to stem originally in Ancient Sumer
(modern day Iraq) and then moved to Egypt to exhaust it's vast wealth
of resources. From there, they relocate to Rome and then Europe
becoming the Royal families. Always inbreeding with each other to keep
their bloodlines pure.


and you do not have to be a genius to work that one out St Peter of York,all one as to do is take a look around and at our history that's if one can be bothered,and you know why most cannot be bothered,well I will tell you why,
They use mind control as an effective tool to keep humans hopelessly
enslaved in a materialistic society that is harmful to its environment.


I suppose one will not be getting a straight answer,it will just be some mega quote double speak rhetoric,or denial.

[luciferhorus]

What worries you most about Masons?

Since this question involves a rather detailed answer and I have pre-written essay on this subject, I have posted in a new thread Masonry and Capital.

Frankly I find their rituals rather silly and I share Crowley's disdain of them and consider Masonry in general to be a club for capitalists.

We live in an age of world Capitalist Revolution, the holocaust of all militant enemies; war for drugs and oil; the enslavement of humanity under Capital.

Masons generally in my judgement tend to be state terrorist collaborators and militant, evangelical Capitalists, fully supportive of the current world Capitalist revolution.

Certainly in the past there have been numerous Masonic Communists, particularly among the Russians and French, however in the modern world they seem to be a rarity; if they even exist at all.

One can generally know a great deal about a person by the company they keep. Among Masons you will find industrialists, lawyers, accountants, arm's manufacturers, loan sharks, police, military and other individuals who collectively constitute the Capitalist state terrorist establishment

Their Capitalist Revolution shall fail; their great Temples shall turn to dust in the blink of an eye.

LL

Lux

[boots]

So what does he claim to be?and why I am at what do you claim to be?

Leave what out? I thought you lot were supposed to be tough.

I mean I have not really said anything untowards,I have received a lot worse than your false allegations<I see you have a short memory when I stuck up for you,typical.So you leave it out.

You really need to toughen up.:D

and why do you not except him into your lodge,you meanie.?

I ask plenty questions and never get any straight answers?

I have asked for pic of him and thelonious,I asked where he is coming from his beliefs?He asked do I think if he is a black magician,why not just say what you believe? etc,and all I get from all of you are circles.

and then he says I have insulted him.I am not the one going around calling you agents of darkness(maybe you are),now that is an insult,but I could not care less if that's what you think,it is quite laughable TBH.

and the brotherhood of the snake does exist,but not from their own side,but they exist non the less,and are up to no good,in fact they should be called the Babylonian Brotherhood of the Snake and you lot are probably members of it.:p

because all you do is go around in circles pretending to be holier than the holy and deny anything that is said what does not go in favour of your club.

Even in Buddhism and other organisations whether high or low there are plenty Imposters.

No one is that pure only the Divine.:)

"...History is replete with whispers of secret societies... The oldest
is the Brotherhood of the Snake, also called the Brotherhood of the
Dragon, and it still exists under many different names. The Brotherhood
of the Snake is devoted to guarding the 'secrets of the ages' and the
recognition of Lucifer as the one and only true God...
It's secret symbol is the all-seeing eye in the pyramid."

The illuminati bloodlines seem to stem originally in Ancient Sumer
(modern day Iraq) and then moved to Egypt to exhaust it's vast wealth
of resources. From there, they relocate to Rome and then Europe
becoming the Royal families. Always inbreeding with each other to keep
their bloodlines pure.


and you do not have to be a genius to work that one out St Peter of York,all one as to do is take a look around and at our history that's if one can be bothered,and you know why most cannot be bothered,well I will tell you why,
They use mind control as an effective tool to keep humans hopelessly
enslaved in a materialistic society that is harmful to its environment.


I suppose one will not be getting a straight answer,it will just be some mega quote double speak rhetoric,or denial.

You've done very well LG, on holding your cool with these's fool's:)

Stuewie has been playing mind games in the last 2 pages of this thread. Asking question when he should have given answers or stated his opinion.


OMG you would think he was a lawyer :rolleyes::)

As for GS, well it's just obvious that he would look down on you and tell you to leave off, his freemason mate.

It's all games to these people that's why they have come to this site to cause distractions and deny the obvious, which is that freemasonary it NOT just a charitable organization but one that has a deeper hidden meaning regarding the system of control in society.

If they cant comprehend the fact that any ritual that causes harm to another either physically or with mental suggestions, such as sticking a knife to your throat or having a noose around your neck or saying that those who are not masons are the profane which sets up a division between people. IS mind control.

Mind control for those that are intellectually impaired and have not looked deep and hard into what it truly is, is anything that try's to put suggestions with in your mind. The idiot box is a mind control device, corporations use it all the time, placing auto suggestive ad's to buy there products, the media who only promotes the view of government's or those that hold the money stick over their heads, is mind control. Religions that tell you how to live THEIR way of life, is mind control and freemasonary which of course is MIND CONTROL. The satanic cults are mind control the CIA use mind control, the Military use mind control. On it go's.

Realize that we are infinite consciousness and answer to our higher selves which is connected to a GREAT SPIRIT, the unnameable, You cant put that in a box.

.

[bluehorseman]

I have told you before, that Stewart Edwards is exactly who he claims to be. Although he is not a freemason, I have known him for a number of years.

Leave it out lightgiver, or is it Mr Lightgiver?

Hello Grand Secretary if I could ask you a question please?

Is what Lightgiver is saying about black magic, satan worship and child sacrifice to your knowledge, on oath, happening at the higher than third degree levels of Freemasonry?

[cookiejar]

EH mate you are making things up now,just do one.You said I should be banned ,WTF as my posts got to do with you.You sound to me like a sycophant.

Maybe you should be banned for stirring up shit.

In fact I would prefer if you do not answer to any of my posts. D£$"£ head.

BTW the reference to my join date was I have managed to stay on here for 12 months without getting a ban or on warning,and I do not even know why I am even explaining myself to individuals like you.
But people like you just love to place suggestions and make things up hoping to get some kind of brownie points.

You will never know what I know about freemasonry or the tree of life "Sport"

You are young, but you will learn.

Lightgiver If everyone demanded truth instead of another television set,
then there'd be truth! Cookiejar 2008

[grandsecretary]

Hello Grand Secretary if I could ask you a question please?

Is what Lightgiver is saying about black magic, satan worship and child sacrifice to your knowledge, on oath, happening at the higher than third degree levels of Freemasonry?

Well first of all I am obviously not on sworn oath, but I do not need to be in order to answer your question truthfully:

ANSWER:

Not in the true form of Anglo-Saxon Freemasonry, at all, because we do not use the Rosicrucian rituals of the Moderns, including the so-called "higher-degree" rituals.

However, we have grave concerns about the rituals of the Ancient and Accepted Scottish Rite, introduced by the odious Albert Pike, which we regard as being anathema.

We are also concerned about Rosicrucianism in general, which is the power and influence behind the Moderns form of freemasonry, and this quotation from their officially published history might explain why:

History of the S.R.I.A. (Societas Rosicruciana in Anglia) by T.M.Greenhill M.B.E.

The Fama and the Confessio are fundamental to Rosicrucian thought as developed within our Society, as they pronounce fundamental truths which are as real today as when they were first written, showing a welding of spiritualist and humanist ideas essential to improving man as an individual and society as a whole; the microcosm within the macrocosm.

Humanism: a doctrine emphasizing human needs and seeking solely rational ways of solving human problems; system of thought etc. concerned with human rather than religious values; literary culture, especially in Renaissance. (SOURCE: Oxford English Dictionary)

True Anglo-Saxon Free Masonry is religious, not humanist. Do all Moderns freemasons realise that they represent a welding between the spiritual and the humanist? Their Catholic, Muslim, Hindu and Sikh members would be horrified if they knew.

These people (Anderson; Desaguliers; and others) engineered the break away from true, religious, Anglo-Saxon Free Masonry and introduced Rosicrucianism under the guise of freemasonry between 1723 and 1730. They ditched (or did not know) the rituals of true Anglo-Saxon Free Masonry (including the Holy Royal Arch) and replaced it with the Rosicrucian rituals used by the Moderns to this very day.

Specifically:

Magic? - definitely part of the Rosicrucian agenda;

Satan worship? - if any member of the Moderns regards satan to be "a supreme being" then there is NOTHING stopping them from becoming a Moderns freemason and I have no doubt that they have taken full advantage of this appalling situation.

Child sacrifice? - Not to my knowledge, and I very much doubt it.

I believe that I have answered your questions, in full.

[grandsecretary]

As for GS, well it's just obvious that he would look down on you and tell you to leave off, his freemason mate.


I speak for myself, The Grand Lodge at York and nobody else, and I will decide who my mates are old lad, not you.

Stewart is NOT a freemason, and that is it. What part of that simple five word statement are you struggling with?

He takes an interest in the subject, and that is all, and I object to you calling him a liar when he is one of the most honest people that I have ever known.

[thelonious]

Hello Grand Secretary if I could ask you a question please?

Is what Lightgiver is saying about black magic, satan worship and child sacrifice to your knowledge, on oath, happening at the higher than third degree levels of Freemasonry?

Grand Secretary's organization, the Grand Lodge of All England, is not affiliated with "mainstream Masonry", and does not practice the "higher degrees".

I belong to a traditional constitution, have passed through the so-called "high degrees", and will say this:

The higher degrees, for the most part, are elaborations on the first three. They do not make one more of a Mason but can make one a better Mason.

Masons do not practice satan worship or sacrifices, as things such as satanism are considered superstition in a supposed society of rationalists, and sacrifices are crimes with no spiritual or religious merit. Masons are obligated to practice charity in all of its forms, and to promulgate universal brotherhood while observing a relatively strict moral code.

GS is somewhat correct that Freemasonry has been influenced by Rosicrucianism, and vice versa. For example, a century before the Grand Lodge was founded in 1717, a poem appeared bearing the line "For we be brethren of the Rosie Cross; we have the Mason's word and second sight".

However, the Rosicrucians borrowed from earlier forms of Masonry just as much as Masonry later incorporated aspects of the Rosicrucians. And, unlike Masonry, the Rosicrucians were a strictly Christian organization (see the Fama Fraternitatis and Confessio).

[grandsecretary]

Grand Secretary's organization, the Grand Lodge of All England, is not affiliated with "mainstream Masonry", and does not practice the "higher degrees".

I belong to a traditional constitution, have passed through the so-called "high degrees", and will say this:

The higher degrees, for the most part, are elaborations on the first three. They do not make one more of a Mason but can make one a better Mason.

Masons do not practice satan worship or sacrifices, as things such as satanism are considered superstition in a supposed society of rationalists, and sacrifices are crimes with no spiritual or religious merit. Masons are obligated to practice charity in all of its forms, and to promulgate universal brotherhood while observing a relatively strict moral code.

GS is somewhat correct that Freemasonry has been influenced by Rosicrucianism, and vice versa. For example, a century before the Grand Lodge was founded in 1717, a poem appeared bearing the line "For we be brethren of the Rosie Cross; we have the Mason's word and second sight".

However, the Rosicrucians borrowed from earlier forms of Masonry just as much as Masonry later incorporated aspects of the Rosicrucians. And, unlike Masonry, the Rosicrucians were a strictly Christian organization (see the Fama Fraternitatis and Confessio).

Fama Fraternis:

" .. they might out of all those things which in this our Age God doth so richly bestow upon us, collect Librum Naturae, or a perfect method of all Arts: but such is their opposition, that they still keep, and are loathe to leave the old course, esteeming Porphiry, Aristotle and Galen, yea and that which hath but a meer show of learning, more then the clear and manifested Light and Truth; who if they were now living, with much joy would leave their erroneous Doctrines."

Porphiry, Greek Philosopher of Tyre, a contemporary of Aristotle, Platonist who studied under Plotinus.

Porphiry's most famous work was a closely argued case against "... the religion of Christ", making him the greatest enemy of the Christian Church of his time.

[thelonious]

Porphiry, Greek Philosopher of Tyre, a contemporary of Aristotle, Platonist who studied under Plotinus.

Porphiry's most famous work was a closely argued case against "... the religion of Christ", making him the greatest enemy of the Christian Church of his time.

I agree, but the quote there from the Fama says that Porphiry's doctrines were "erroneous", and the parts you left unquoted go into great detail how great Christianity (or at least Protestantism) is.

For the record, I consider all the hallelujiah chorus stuff in the Rosicrucians to be baloney. I think the Rosicrucians were on the right track with their looking into the Kabalah and Hermeticism, but they insisted on trying to be good Lutherans, which to me seems like a waste of time.

[lightgiver]

You've done very well LG, on holding your cool with these's fool's:)

Stuewie has been playing mind games in the last 2 pages of this thread. Asking question when he should have given answers or stated his opinion.


OMG you would think he was a lawyer :rolleyes::)

As for GS, well it's just obvious that he would look down on you and tell you to leave off, his freemason mate.

It's all games to these people that's why they have come to this site to cause distractions and deny the obvious, which is that freemasonary it NOT just a charitable organization but one that has a deeper hidden meaning regarding the system of control in society.

If they cant comprehend the fact that any ritual that causes harm to another either physically or with mental suggestions, such as sticking a knife to your throat or having a noose around your neck or saying that those who are not masons are the profane which sets up a division between people. IS mind control.

Mind control for those that are intellectually impaired and have not looked deep and hard into what it truly is, is anything that try's to put suggestions with in your mind. The idiot box is a mind control device, corporations use it all the time, placing auto suggestive ad's to buy there products, the media who only promotes the view of government's or those that hold the money stick over their heads, is mind control. Religions that tell you how to live THEIR way of life, is mind control and freemasonary which of course is MIND CONTROL. The satanic cults are mind control the CIA use mind control, the Military use mind control. On it go's.

Realize that we are infinite consciousness and answer to our higher selves which is connected to a GREAT SPIRIT, the unnameable, You cant put that in a box.

.

Hi boots,your post is spot on,

Yes they all play mind games,I am above their levels of deceit.

They never give straight answers,its all in the Craft.

In fact I am wondering why they are always are on the D Icke forum along with their sycophantic lackeys,on a forum were the guy whos name it is in does not even have 1 good word about them,and now I know why.

[lightgiver]

I speak for myself, The Grand Lodge at York and nobody else, and I will decide who my mates are old lad, not you.

Stewart is NOT a freemason, and that is it. What part of that simple five word statement are you struggling with?

He takes an interest in the subject, and that is all, and I object to you calling him a liar when he is one of the most honest people that I have ever known.

and we are supposed to believe you?you stated you have only known him 2 years and how much social time do you spend with one another off the forum were most are invisible.
Some people can know each other and still really do not know what is going on in the mind,your statement is baseless.

[lightgiver]

You will never know what I know about freemasonry or the tree of life "Sport"

You are young, but you will learn.

Lightgiver If everyone demanded truth instead of another television set,
then there'd be truth! Cookiejar 2008

so you know my age now do you?

Wisdom does not necessarily come with age.

You know nothing of me and my experiences,you are assuming.

[thelonious]

You know nothing of me and my experiences,you are assuming.

Your own words have exposed you.

[lightgiver]

Hello Grand Secretary if I could ask you a question please?

Is what Lightgiver is saying about black magic, satan worship and child sacrifice to your knowledge, on oath, happening at the higher than third degree levels of Freemasonry?

Hi blue horseman,:)

You will find freemasonry goes a lot higher than the low down 3 degrees ,in fact they complete a full circle of 360 degrees and the top nobs go by the label of Olympians.

and the Illuminati control the masons and something also controls the Illuminati.

[lightgiver]

Your own words have exposed you.

Have you no lodge to attend you are always hovering on here,agent.

I have exposed nothing,only your noble lies,how can cookie monster know anything about me?

Go and pick some corn.

Your house will never stand firm.TUBAL CAIN.

[grandsecretary]

and we are supposed to believe you?you stated you have only known him 2 years and how much social time do you spend with one another off the forum were most are invisible.
Some people can know each other and still really do not know what is going on in the mind,your statement is baseless.

I don't spend any time with him off the forums. I have corresponded with him on the forums for some considerable time and I do not appreciate your calling me a liar either. The trouble is that dishonest people like you judge others by your own standards.

[lightgiver]

I don't spend any time with him off the forums. I have corresponded with him on the forums for some considerable time and I do not appreciate your calling me a liar either. The trouble is that dishonest people like you judge others by your own standards.

So where do you see the word LIAR,another TUBAL CAIN.

Have you no corn to pick?

Placing suggestions again,so how can you know him?if you do not spend time with him,and how can he know you?


We will always hide our objective but carry out our plan.

They will perform the labour for us and we shall prosper
from their toil.

[cookiejar]

So where do you see the word LIAR,another TUBAL CAIN.

Have you no corn to pick?

Placing suggestions again,so how can you know him?if you do not spend time with him,and how can he know you?


We will always hide our objective but carry out our plan.

They will perform the labour for us and we shall prosper
from their toil.

I think your a troll and this is your way of getting this thread put in the Rant bin

[grandsecretary]

So where do you see the word LIAR,another TUBAL CAIN.

Have you no corn to pick?

Placing suggestions again,so how can you know him?if you do not spend time with him,and how can he know you?


We will always hide our objective but carry out our plan.

They will perform the labour for us and we shall prosper
from their toil.

I know that he is a truthful and very nice person but you would not recognise either honest or nice because you get off on being confrontational just for the sake of it. In fact, you are a pain in the butt.

[cookiejar]

so you know my age now do you?

Wisdom does not necessarily come with age.

You know nothing of me and my experiences,you are assuming.

No your right and I must agree but, from your actions and your replys I know I am right I have been what I study and now I am above.

Its ok for people to know more than you, its ok

:(

[lightgiver]

I think your a troll and this is your way of getting this thread put in the Rant bin

and you are a lackey who is also trying to get this ranted,go and do one.

You know NOTHING.

You assume and make things up and place suggestions,typical brainwashing mind control.

[cookiejar]

I know that he is a truthful and very nice person but you would not recognise either honest or nice because you get off on being confrontational just for the sake of it. In fact, you are a pain in the butt.

Real facts above, I second this put it down as read.
Mybe ligghtgiver is a troll? I didnt think he was but now I am not sure?

I feel for you lightgiver? As I am not agaist you but I am starting to question why you are here.

Tinmanace would see through you if she were here she knows her trolls and shrills loll:D

[lightgiver]

I know that he is a truthful and very nice person but you would not recognise either honest or nice because you get off on being confrontational just for the sake of it. In fact, you are a pain in the butt.

Personnel insults again when things are not going your way mason.

You know nothing of him how the eck can you?

It is you lot who resort to name calling and confrontation have you not seen your posts.

You all live in denial land,you all remind me of walter mitty characters,
and you never answer direct questions.

[lightgiver]

Real facts above, I second this put it down as read.
Mybe he is a troll? I didnt think he was but now I am not sure?

I feel for you light giver? As I am not agaist you but I am starting to question why you are here.

Tinmanace would see through you if she were here she knows her trolls and shrills loll:D

do not feel for me,I can handle any BS you direct my way.

[grandsecretary]

Personnel insults again when things are not going your way mason.

You know nothing of him how the eck can you?

It is you lot who resort to name calling and confrontation have you not seen your posts.

You all live in denial land,you all remind me of walter mitty characters,
and you never answer direct questions.

No, you are wrong and I ALWAYS answer the questions. You are a pain because you feel you can call people liars with impunity. Well you can't. I blame your parent.

[cookiejar]

and you are a lackey who is also trying to get this ranted,go and do one.

You know NOTHING.

You assume and make things up and place suggestions,typical brainwashing mind control.

Ha ha maybe we are the same person? you seem to make up alot about me???

thats your way its rubbish, if you stopped and talked to me I could help you, infact I give you the chance?

I am sorry light giver, now lets talk?

What I mean is, we should drop this rubbish and get on with the real truth lets do It, I open my hand to you .

[lightgiver]

Ha ha maybe we are the same person? you seem to make up alot about me???

thats your way its rubbish, if you stopped and talked to me I could help you, infact I give you the chance?

I am sorry light giver, now lets talk?

What I mean is, we should drop this rubbish and get on with the real truth lets do It, I open my hand to you .

No I do not want to talk with Blair lovers.

what exactly have I made up about you,you tell people to move on and I for one am having none of you suggestions.

People are entitled to their opinions and if some of us believe bliar is a mason then so be it.I mean he lies about everything else.

and its you who needs help pal.:p:D:D laughable yes you are.

[grandsecretary]

No I do not want to talk with Blair lovers.

what exactly have I made up about you,you tell people to move on and I for one am having none of you suggestions.

People are entitled to their opinions and if some of us believe bliar is a mason then so be it.

and it you who needs help pal.

If you believe that the Knights of St Columba is masonic (the Vatican will vehemently deny this) then Tony Blair probably is, but he is definitely NOT, and never has been a Craft Mason.

Now that is the fact of the situation. It has been posted on this forum at least 10 times to my knowledge, and it is now a very boring issue.

Anyone who believes otherwise will believe anything and their judgement is flawed beyond rescue (and I can't stand him, or his odious wife).

[lightgiver]

If you believe that the Knights of St Columba is masonic (the Vatican will vehemently deny this) then Tony Blair probably is, but he is definitely NOT, and never has been a Craft Mason.

Now that is the fact of the situation. It has been posted on this forum at least 10 times to my knowledge, and it is now a very boring issue.

Anyone who believes otherwise will believe anything and their judgement is flawed beyond rescue (and I can't stand him, or his odious wife).

It maybe boring for you but not for concerned citizens, bliar is a dangerous person,who is power mad and wants to become the president of the EU,and most of us want him to get off this planet,with the rest of the crazy elitists.

[thelonious]

I know people who can find you,so I hope you are a light sleeper.

when the shit goes down you had better be ready.

Your own words have exposed you.

Again.

[lightgiver]

gone quiet boy,well and truly exposed,to easy.

[lightgiver]

Sin for sin comes to mind here I am not going to harm nor would I want too.

I was just showning you how or what you do when you are wrong(but I am not wrong)

My spelling how much is that a cheap shot I could pick on your christain avator but I wont lol:o

Your a shame lol

People be careful of this troll he will pull you in and you will get banned

You are sinking to new depths and have been exposed for the KKK you are BOY.

Up yours,you are a bigger fool than I thought and all your suggestions will do you no favours.In big red letters,what a child.You need psychiatric help.

Nice PM,your mate the loner trys the same tactics.

I for one do not suffer fools I have to much experience pal.You really think picking on a avatar will affect,TBH I am laughing at your insanity are you fuming and stomping around like the spoilt brat that you are.

No wonder this world is messed up and shallow,and you masons are the cause of it doing your masters bidding turning people against one another.

Pike philosophy.

[cookiejar]

You are sinking to new depths and have been exposed for the KKK you are BOY.

Up yours,you are a bigger fool than I thought and all your suggestions will do you no favours.In big red letters,what a child.

Nice PM,your mate the loner trys the same tactics.

I for one do not suffer fools I have to much experience pal.

Ok your right I am sorry just make sure your mums not in to sign

HAHAHAHAHQAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!:D

[thelonious]

Ok your right I am sorry just make sure your mums not in to sign

HAHAHAHAHQAHAHAHAHAHAHAH!:D

We can see from LG's bizarre outbursts (common on this forum) that is not quite sane, and certainly not on the Path of Light.

Probably best to follow the example of the Apostle Paul, and shake the dust from our feet as far as he is concerned. He has been presented the truth, and has wilfully rejected. Christ called such "vipers".

[lightgiver]

We can see from LG's bizarre outbursts (common on this forum) that is not quite sane, and certainly not on the Path of Light.

Probably best to follow the example of the Apostle Paul, and shake the dust from our feet as far as he is concerned. He has been presented the truth, and has wilfully rejected. Christ called such "vipers".

Have you no pike forums to attend seeing you are never off this one ?

did you know Icke detests masoons especially pike ones.

[lightgiver]

sorry pal you are losing it.I do not wish to engage follis beings,who make empty threats.

[lightgiver]

I thought so you have been here before ant ya! You are a banned member?

Well hi masonic 3! I wondered why you always go on about how long you have been here??

Yes you are definitely losing it,must be all that mason brainwashing,I would get out more if I was you.

[cookiejar]

No more spaming please let get back to subject:

Nothing - masonry is a valuable societal resource 44.44% of forum agree

Lets get on with some truth! :D

[lightgiver]

No more spaming please let get back to subject:

Nothing - masonry is a valuable societal resource 44.44% of forum agree

Lets get on with some truth! :D

You will have to do a poll then,because not everyone as responded and the title is misleading,maybe it should have been do people trust the masons?and I to am done with this tickle tattle and after debates with masons on here I do not trust their organisation and never want to have anything to do with them or anything what even as a slight aroma of masons,and TBH I think I have done debating on this section,because it never leads anywhere and the real truth will never come out until it is overthrown,and that will only happen when the earth has been destroyed by some catastrophe,because masons have been doing their masters bidding foe thousands of years,and people still do not get it.

So I will just print material I come across,BYE BYE.

[thelonious]

You will have to do a poll then,because not everyone as responded and the title is misleading,maybe it should have been do people trust the masons?and I to am done with this tickle tattle and after debates with masons on here I do not trust their organisation and never want to have anything to do with them or anything what even as a slight aroma of masons,and TBH I think I have done debating on this section,because it never leads anywhere and the real truth will never come out until it is overthrown,and that will only happen when the earth has been destroyed by some catastrophe,because masons have been doing their masters bidding foe thousands of years,and people still do not get it.



God hates run-on sentences almost as much as he hates posers.

[cookiejar]

You will have to do a poll then,because not everyone as responded and the title is misleading,maybe it should have been do people trust the masons?and I to am done with this tickle tattle and after debates with masons on here I do not trust their organisation and never want to have anything to do with them or anything what even as a slight aroma of masons,and TBH I think I have done debating on this section,because it never leads anywhere and the real truth will never come out until it is overthrown,and that will only happen when the earth has been destroyed by some catastrophe,because masons have been doing their masters bidding foe thousands of years,and people still do not get it.

So I will just print material I come across,BYE BYE.

OK cowhan thats fine, your right you have taken the right path good luck truth seeker :)

[grandsecretary]

It maybe boring for you but not for concerned citizens, bliar is a dangerous person,who is power mad and wants to become the president of the EU,and most of us want him to get off this planet,with the rest of the crazy elitists.

That is a different matter, he is NOT a freemason. "Sorry I got it wrong" would not go amiss.

[lottie]

KEEP THIS THREAD ON TOPIC PLEASE!!

Any further rants, insults, threats will be dealt with incurring points!

[lightgiver]

That is a different matter, he is NOT a freemason. "Sorry I got it wrong" would not go amiss.

Yes he is a mason,and an evil lying one at that.

[lightgiver]

You will find freemasonry goes a lot higher than the low down 3 degrees ,in fact they complete a full circle of 360 degrees and the top nobs go by the label of Olympians.

and the Illuminati control the masons and something also controls the Illuminati. :p

Let the serpent eat its tail in the noble orders, but one has to prove themselves like the masons on here.

Can you keep secrets,but one has to have Psychopathic qualities when rising in the degrees.

[grandsecretary]

Yes he is a mason,and an evil lying one at that.

Evidence?

[lightgiver]

Evidence?

You show me evidence he is not,BTW I have proof but until you show me he is not, nothing is coming your way.

You really think we do not know Bliar is not part of the brotherhood of the snake:rolleyes: and so is the Pope.:p

sliver sliver sliver,Satan is very deceitful,and the Public have not got a clue.

Plato described a self-eating, circular being as the first living thing in the universe—an immortal, perfectly constructed animal.

http://img264.imageshack.us/img264/48/250pxouroboros.png (http://img264.imageshack.us/my.php?image=250pxouroboros.png)

[grandsecretary]

You show me evidence he is not,BTW I have proof but until you show me he is not, nothing is coming your way.

You really think we do not know Bliar is not part of the brotherhood of the snake:rolleyes: and so is the Pope.:p

sliver sliver sliver,Satan is very deceitful,and the Public have not got a clue.

Plato described a self-eating, circular being as the first living thing in the universe—an immortal, perfectly constructed animal.

http://img264.imageshack.us/img264/48/250pxouroboros.png
(http://img264.imageshack.us/my.php?image=250pxouroboros.png)

You made the claim mate, you prove it, or look like an idiot.

[lightgiver]

You made the claim mate, you prove it, or look like an idiot.

Well it looks like I will look like an Idiot for a while then MATE :rolleyes::D


Let the serpent eat its tail in the noble orders.

http://img149.imageshack.us/img149/8615/brotherhoodss0905.jpg (http://img149.imageshack.us/my.php?image=brotherhoodss0905.jpg)

when the shit hits the fan the elites will be in their underground homes,why joe public savage one another.

[grandsecretary]

Well it looks like I will look like an Idiot for a while then MATE :rolleyes::D

Not for the first time, and probably not the last either.

[flyermay]

Evidence?

There you are right, I double checked on this issue after my question to Mike yesterday about Blair, but the truth is that no one has been able to prove that he is a freemason.

[lightgiver]

There you are right, I double checked on this issue after my question to Mike yesterday about Blair, but the truth is that no one has been able to prove that he is a freemason.

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/3502/popeblairmasonhandshakezb3.png (http://img100.imageshack.us/my.php?image=popeblairmasonhandshakezb3.png)

Notice the thumb on the knuckle,do you really think anyone is going to start spouting it off:rolleyes:

What a laugh.You are right, as though we will fall for that one,its like a clowns circus on here.:D

Watch the comeback of denials.

most of the plotiticians in Britain are masons and the vatican,all part of the big same club.

GS as already admitted this a while ago in one of his outbursts.

[grandsecretary]

There you are right, I double checked on this issue after my question to Mike yesterday about Blair, but the truth is that no one has been able to prove that he is a freemason.

flyermay, he could not be a high profile freemason and a high profile Catholic at one and the same time.

I agree with those who suspect that he wants to wield political power and is ruthless in his ambition. IMHO he would not risk public humiliation due to excommunication from the Catholic Church due to freemasonry.

I say again, he may be, probably is a Knight of St Columba, and if you consider this to be freemasonry (the Vatican will vehemently deny this) then this is the only possibility.

Usually the sensible answer is the right answer.

[grandsecretary]

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/3502/popeblairmasonhandshakezb3.png (http://img100.imageshack.us/my.php?image=popeblairmasonhandshakezb3.png)

Notice the thumb on the knuckle,do you really think anyone is going to start spouting it off:rolleyes:

What a laugh.You are right, as though we will fall for that one,its like a clowns circus on here.:D

Watch the comeback of denials.

most of the plotiticians in Britain are masons and the vatican,all part of the big same club.

GS as already admitted this a while ago in one of his outbursts.

Don't you dare tell lies in my name, you disgusting ass.

[lightgiver]

Don't you dare tell lies in my name, you disgusting ass.

You what,really showing yourself now eh,you know very well, name calling will not work be careful or you may end up on a on warning and I for one will not be sticking up for you again you disgusting donkey:p Ha Ha truly pathetic.

Masons run the world on behalf of their masters and the Vatican is a disgrace to humanity along with all the controlled religions,what have been made up and disguised to control the masses.

Communists all around eh and their manifesto and their New age bull.

They(Vatican lot and their lackeys) are the very ones who crucified Jesus.

MACHABEN or is it MACHBINNA

[grandsecretary]

They(Vatican lot and their lackeys) are the very ones who crucified Jesus.

I don't need to say any more.

[lightgiver]

I don't need to say any more.

Good and stop pretending you are someone you are not.

Get back to what you are good at doing.ACTING

Woe unto you, (Telly evangelists,masons, bankers,royalty and politicians)scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! for ye are like unto whited sepulchres, which indeed appear beautiful outward, but are within full of dead men's bones, and of all uncleanness.

Yours is the House of desolation the home of the lizard and the spider.

You really think the Vatican is carrying out the work of JESUS,well if you think that you are sadly wrong and you very well know it.

Walking around in robes of silk and gold dripping from the Vatican and all its wealth,now that is truly disturbing and disgusting.

send your assassins I will be waiting.

[stewart edwards]

It is with much sadness that I have to accept that darkness has succeeded in destroying this thread. As the originator of it can I ask that one of the moderators locks it please. But please dont hide it away for it is (sadly) such a good example of the power of darkness penetrating and destroying and there is much that can be learnt from it. It would make a good case study in human nature, and the nature of how darkness can penetrate.

Tis a crying shame though.

[lightgiver]

It is with much sadness that I have to accept that darkness has succeeded in destroying this thread. As the originator of it can I ask that one of the moderators locks it please. But please dont hide it away for it is (sadly) such a good example of the power of darkness penetrating and destroying and there is much that can be learnt from it. It would make a good case study in human nature, and the nature of how darkness can penetrate.

Tis a crying shame though.

What makes you think that Stewart,you are getting to emotional,one as to expose lies,such is the nature of the dark world we live in,

Do you think Jesus never got passionate about injustice and tyranny?

Yes the state of humanity is a crying shame and the dark deeds what are going on under our very noses.

[flyermay]

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/3502/popeblairmasonhandshakezb3.png (http://img100.imageshack.us/my.php?image=popeblairmasonhandshakezb3.png)

Notice the thumb on the knuckle,do you really think anyone is going to start spouting it off:rolleyes:

What a laugh.You are right, as though we will fall for that one,its like a clowns circus on here.:D

Watch the comeback of denials.

most of the plotiticians in Britain are masons and the vatican,all part of the big same club.

GS as already admitted this a while ago in one of his outbursts.

flyermay, he could not be a high profile freemason and a high profile Catholic at one and the same time.

I agree with those who suspect that he wants to wield political power and is ruthless in his ambition. IMHO he would not risk public humiliation due to excommunication from the Catholic Church due to freemasonry.

I say again, he may be, probably is a Knight of St Columba, and if you consider this to be freemasonry (the Vatican will vehemently deny this) then this is the only possibility.

Usually the sensible answer is the right answer.

I don't really think that it would make any difference at this stage if Blair is proved to be a freemason or not; he is just on a different league. I'll explain: I think there are organisations around the world that really make freemasonry look as a social club. And the reason I say this is just because, even if freemasonry is involved in the plot (which I guess they do support the NWO, as most part of the public opinion), they are no where near the top of the conspiracy; even though some member might be. Therefore, Blair has already many tickets to be tagged as a puppet of the elite (illuminati, Bilderbergers, and so on), so being a freemason would just be a minor "fault" (sort of speak).

About the handshake, lol, I never saw it before and it is just a fantastic picture; thanks for sharing it. But, isn't that a apprentice handshake? :rolleyes:

No, seriously, I don't know what to think about the pope being a mason (not that I have anything in his favour), but I'm not sure that would be the case; not even after seeing that picture.

[lightgiver]

I don't really think that it would make any difference at this stage if Blair is proved to be a freemason or not; he is just on a different league. I'll explain: I think there are organisations around the world that really make freemasonry look as a social club. And the reason I say this is just because, even if freemasonry is involved in the plot (which I guess they do support the NWO, most of the public), they are no where near the top of the conspiracy; even though some member might be. Therefore, Blair has already many tickets to be tagged as a puppet of the elite (illuminati, Bilderbergers, and so on), so being a freemason would just be a minor "fault" (sort of speak).

About the handshake, lol, I never saw it before and it is just a fantastic picture; thanks for sharing it. But, isn't that a apprentice handshake? :rolleyes:

No, seriously, I don't know what to think about the pope being a mason (not that I have anything in his favour), but I'm not sure that would be the case; not even after seeing that picture.

Hi flyermay,

There are plenty more pics and Info but I am saving them for later,do not be fooled by the masons on here they are well paid for what they do.;):D

BTW The pope is just a puppet,you really think the Vatican cares for the poor,it may pretend it does and give out little bits here and there, its just a front .

It is one of the wealthiest and most powerful organisations on the planet.

They all love to kiss the Popes ring.:rolleyes::rolleyes: double roll eyes for good measure.

[flyermay]

BTW The pope is just a puppet,you really think the Vatican cares for the poor,it may pretend it does and give out little bits here and there, its just a front .

It is one of the wealthiest and most powerful organisations on the planet.

They all love to kiss the Popes ring.:rolleyes::rolleyes: double roll eyes for good measure.

I have no doubt of that, reason why I say that there are organisations far more worthy to be worried about than freemasonry.

[lightgiver]

I have no doubt of that, reason why I say that there are organisations far more worthy to be worried about than freemasonry.

As such?I love the replies when one states something but does not say who.:rolleyes: nearly forgot the rolleyes.

I see your profile as loads of info on it to,nice friends BTW.

[flyermay]

As such?I love the replies when one states something but does not say who.:rolleyes: nearly forgot the rolleyes.

You just named it; the christian church, for example.

When freemasonry starts controlling such a vast number of adepts, then I would be really worried of them.

[lightgiver]

You just named it; the christian church, for example.

Under the same umbrella.:D The masons are adepts they have been around for thousands of years.

Brotherhood of the snake.

[grandsecretary]

Posted on The Catholic Community Forum today at 10.19 pm by the Moderator CCF_Rick in response to postings made by me:

... here is a document from 1985, put forth by Cardinal Ratzinger and the CDF (Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith)

REFLECTIONS A YEAR AFTER DECLARATION OF CONGREGATION FOR THE DOCTRINE OF THE FAITH

Irreconcilability between Christian faith and Freemasonry

On 26 November 1983 the S. Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith (S.C.D.F.) published a declaration on Masonic associations (cf. AAS LXXVI [1984], 300). At a distance of little more than a year from its publication, it may be useful to outline briefly the significance of this document.

Since the Church began to declare her mind concerning Freemasonry, her negative judgment has been inspired by many reasons, both practical and doctrinal. She judged Freemasonry not merely responsible for subversive activity in her regard, but from the earliest pontifical documents on the subject and in particular in the Encyclical Humanum Genus by Leo XIII (20 April 1884), the Magisterium of the Church has denounced in Freemasonry philosophical ideas and moral conceptions opposed to Catholic doctrine. For Leo XIII, they essentially led back to a rationalistic naturalism, the inspiration of its plans and activities against the Church. In his Letter to the Italian people Custodi (8 December 1892), he wrote: «Let us remember that Christianity and Freemasonry are essentially irreconcilable, so that enrolment in one means separation from the other».

One could not therefore omit to take into consideration the positions of Freemasonry from the doctrinal point of view, when, during the years from 1970‑1980, the Sacred Congregation was in correspondence with some Episcopal Conferences especially interested in this problem because of the dialogue undertaken by some Catholic personages with representatives of some Masonic lodges which declared that they were not hostile, but were even favourable, to the Church.

Now more thorough study has led the S.C.D.F. to confirm its conviction of the basic irreconcilability between the principles of Freemasonry and those of the Christian faith.

Prescinding therefore from consideration of the practical attitude of the various lodges, whether of hostility towards the Church or not, with its declaration of 26 November 1983 the S.C.D.F. intended to take a position on the most profound and, for that matter, the most essential part of the problem: that is, on the level of the irreconcilability of the principles, which means on the level of the faith, and its moral requirements.

Beginning from this doctrinal point of view, and in continuity, moreover, with the traditional position of the Church as the aforementioned documents of Leo XIII attest, there arise then the necessary practical consequences, which are valid for all those faithful who may possibly be members of Freemasonry.

Nevertheless, with regard to the affirmation of the irreconcilability between the principles of Freemasonry and the Catholic faith, from some parts are now heard the objection that essential to Freemasonry would be precisely the fact that it does not impose any «principles», in the sense of a philosophical or religious position which is binding for all of its members, but rather that it gathers together, beyond the limits of the various religions and world views, men of good will on the basis of humanistic values comprehensible and acceptable to everyone.

Freemasonry would constitute a cohesive element for all those who believe in the Architect of the Universe and who feel committed with regard to those fundamental moral orientations which are defined, for example, in the Decalogue; it would not separate anyone from his religion, but on the contrary, would constitute an incentive to embrace that religion more strongly.

The multiple historical and philosophical problems which are hidden in these affirmations cannot be discussed here. It is certainly not necessary to emphasize that following the Second Vatican Council the Catholic Church too is pressing in the direction of collaboration between all men of good will. Nevertheless, becoming a member of Freemasonry decidedly exceeds this legitimate collaboration and has a much more important and final significance than this.

Above all, it must be remembered that the community of «Freemasons» and its moral obligations are presented as a progressive system of symbols of an extremely binding nature. The rigid rule of secrecy which prevails there further strengthens the weight of the interaction of signs and ideas. For the members this climate of secrecy entails above all the risk of becoming an instrument of strategies unknown to them.

Even if it is stated that relativism is not assumed as dogma, nevertheless there is really proposed a relativistic symbolic concept and therefore the relativizing value of such a moral-ritual community, far from being eliminated, proves on the contrary to be decisive.

In this context the various religious communities to which the individual members of the lodges belong can be considered only as simple institutionalizations of a broader and elusive truth. The value of these institutionalizations therefore appears to be inevitably relative with respect to this broader truth, which instead is shown in the community of good will, that is, in the Masonic fraternity.

In any case, for a Catholic Christian, it is not possible to live his relation with God in a twofold mode, that is, dividing it into a supraconfessional humanitarian form and an interior Christian form. He cannot cultivate relations of two types with God, nor express his relation with the Creator through symbolic forms of two types. That would be something completely different from that collaboration, which to him is obvious, with all those who are committed to doing good, even if beginning from different principles. On the one hand, a Catholic Christian cannot at the same time share in the full communion of Christian brotherhood and, on the other, look upon his Christian brother, from the Masonic perspective, as an «outsider».

Even when, as stated earlier, there were no explicit obligation to profess relativism as doctrine, nevertheless the relativizing force of such a brotherhood, by its very intrinsic logic, has the capacity to transform the structure of the act of faith in such a radical way as to become unacceptable to a Christian, «to whom his faith is dear» (Leo XIII).

Moreover, this distortion of the fundamental structure of the act of faith is carried out for the most part in a gentle way and without being noticed: firm adherence to the truth of God, revealed in the Church, becomes simple membership, in an institution, considered as a particular expressive form alongside other expressive forms, more or less just as possible and valid, of man’s turning toward the eternal.

The temptation to go in this direction is much stronger today, inasmuch as it corresponds fully to certain convictions prevalent in contemporary mentality. The opinion that truth cannot be known is a typical characteristic of our era and, at the same time, an essential element in its general crisis.

Precisely by considering all these elements, the Declaration of the Sacred Congregation affirms that membership in Masonic associations «remains forbidden by the Church», and the faithful who enrolls in them «are in a state of grave sin and may not receive Holy Communion».

With this last statement, the Sacred Congregation points out to the faithful that this membership objectively constitutes a grave sin and by specifying that the members of a Masonic association may not receive Holy Communion, it intends to enlighten the conscience of the faithful about a grave consequence which must derive from their belonging to a Masonic lodge.

Finally, the Sacred Congregation declares that «it is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations which would imply a derogation from what has been decided above». In this regard, the text also refers to the Declaration of 17 February 1981, which already reserved to the Apostolic See all pronouncements on the nature of these associations which may have implied derogations from the Canon Law then in force (Can. 2335). In the same way, the new document issued by the S.C.D.F. in November 1983 expresses identical intentions of reserve concerning pronouncements which would differ from the judgment expressed here on the irreconcilability of Masonic principles with the Catholic faith, on the gravity of the act of joining a lodge and on the consequences which arise from it for receiving Holy Communion. This disposition points out that, despite the diversity which may exist among Masonic obediences, in particular in their declared attitude towards the Church, the Apostolic See discerns some common principles in them which require the same evaluation by all ecclesiastical authorities.

In making this Declaration, the S.C.D.F. has not intended to disown the efforts made by those who, with the due authorization of this Congregation, have sought to establish a dialogue with representatives of Freemasonry. But since there was the possibility of spreading among the faithful the erroneous opinion that membership in a Masonic lodge was lawful, it felt that it was its duty to make known to them the authentic thought of the Church in this regard and to warn them about a membership incompatible with the Catholic faith.

Only Jesus Christ is, in fact, the Teacher of Truth, and only in him can Christians find the light and the strength to live according to God’s plan, working for the true good of their brethren.

Could not be clearer. No more nonsense please.

[flyermay]

I see your profile as loads of info on it to,nice friends BTW.

I guess it does :D

But see, apparent proves sometimes are misleading. Did you had a look at my leaflets?

[lightgiver]

I guess it does :D

But see, apparent proves sometimes are misleading. Did you had a look at my leaflets?

Very good:D It will take a lot more to convince me;)

I was always taught to me cautious :)

and you cannot take worldly possessions into the next life,and one would not want to be hoodwinked.

GS manages to do enough of that,hoodwinking with his copy and paste jobs.

Double speak and double think plenty of that around these days.

BTW Satan is the great Deceiver.

[flyermay]

Posted on The Catholic Community Forum today at 10.19 pm by the Moderator CCF_Rick in response to postings made by me:

Could not be clearer. No more nonsense please.

Well... I'm not that sure about that proving anything (not that I'm saying that the pope and Blair are freemasons); but I tend to look at those kind of statements in the same way as CSRs from any other organisation: they say exactly what customers want to hear, but are usually far away from the real intentions of the company.

[grandsecretary]

Well... I'm not that sure about that proving anything (not that I'm saying that the pope and Blair are freemasons); but I tend to look at those kind of statements in the same way as CSRs from any other organisation: they say exactly what customers want to hear, but are usually far away from the real intentions of the company.

Then why am I being refused Holy Communion even though I am not a Moderns Rosicrucian freemason, the clear object of this ruling? And why do I spend day after day being beaten up on that leading Catholic forum because I am a high profile Catholic Free Mason?

[flyermay]

Very good:D It will take a lot more to convince me;)

I was always taught to me cautious :)

and you cannot take worldly possessions into the next life,and one would not want to be hoodwinked.

GS manages to do enough of that,hoodwinking with his copy and paste jobs.

Double speak and double think plenty of that around these days.

BTW Satan is the great Deceiver.

Wow, the conspiracy has got really into you mate :)

It's really funny that anyone would take me as a freemason (I think even freemasons wouldn't accept me even if I wanted to become one).

I could say the same about you: you seem really interested in freemasonry, aren't you? :rolleyes:

[flyermay]

Then why am I being refused Holy Communion even though I am not a Moderns Rosicrucian Mason, the clear object of this ruling?

I really don't know GS, I haven't got a clue about how the christin church works (or any other church for that matter). but I can tell you something: they are also refusing me!!!

[lightgiver]

Wow, the conspiracy has got really into you mate :)

It's really funny that anyone would take me as a freemason (I think even freemasons wouldn't accept me even if I wanted to become one).

I could say the same about you: you seem really interested in freemasonry, aren't you? :rolleyes:

No I am concerned at the killing, slaughter and effing evil going on the world,you could say a concerned citizen,and you can think what you like.:rolleyes:

The higher masons are hiding a lot of info,they only give people what they need to know.

come of it the masons are a virus around the globe and stop pretending that you do not know,and stop making assumptions about me,another one i can smell you a mile off you all repeat the same thing.

Nothing as got to me.
The words I mentioned in the last post are masonic,I was testing the water and you bit.

[flyermay]

No I am concerned at the killing, slaughter and effing evil going on the world,you could say a concerned citizen,and you can think what you like.:rolleyes:

Like everyone else on this forum, I guess.

The higher masons are hiding a lot of info,they only give people what they need to know.

I'm wondering GS, what makes a freemason visit and participate in David Icke's forum every day? Is it just to set the record straight, or do you also believe some of Icke's statements?

[grandsecretary]

I questioned the Magisterium's position of the issue of Free Masonry and the Catholic Church, against the wishes of the Moderators, who simply will not allow any view which opposes the above statement. It is the most blatant form of censorship that you could possibly imagine, backed up by severe personal consequences.

This is what happened, followed by the statement shown above:

Today, 04:09 AM

Dear Peter Clatworthy,

You have received an infraction at Catholic Community Forum.

Reason: 7.2 Disrespect to Moderator
-------
Your blatant refusal to conform to instructions and infractions regarding public complaints of Moderator actions have now resulted in your posting privileges being suspended.

Your account is suspended for 60 days. Should you elect to conform to CCF's Acceptable Use Policy, kindly advise us of that specific intention after June 14.

CCF_Carol
Site Administrator
-------

People here may think that they are playing a great game suggesting that the Pope is a freemason, seeking to annoy people rather than engage in a civilised debate, but this issue affects people's lives, here on Earth and in the hereafter. It should not to be taken lightly and I would thank you to respect my position in this matter.

Tony Blair is subject to exactly the same constraints, and I know what I am talking about because I am suffering because of the actions of the Moderns who are totally responsible for the deliberate alienation of the Catholic and other Christian Churches. I am also responsible to the many thousands of Catholic Free Masons in this world who are now looking to us to try to relieve their terrible suffering.

[grandsecretary]

Like everyone else on this forum, I guess.



I'm wondering GS, what makes a freemason visit and participate in David Icke's forum every day? Is it just to set the record straight, or do you also believe some of Icke's statements?

It is a very important part of my job, which is to educate and to defend the many thousands of genuine, religious, Anglo-Saxon Free Masons from continued unwarranted persecution.

I am grateful to David Icke for raising important issues. I agree with some and I disagree with others. Where I agree wholeheartedly is that we MUST oppose malevolence, but I also believe in observing, and analysing before concluding.

There is far too much slagging off on this forum. It has serious consequences, and it is a poor excuse for not using the brain that God gave us.

[lightgiver]

I questioned the Magisterium's position of the issue of Free Masonry and the Catholic Church, against the wishes of the Moderators, who simply will not allow any view which opposes the above statement. It is the most blatant form of censorship that you could possibly imagine, backed up by severe personal consequences.

This is what happened, followed by the statement shown above:



People here may think that they are playing a great game suggesting that the Pope is a freemason, seeking to annoy people rather than engage in a civilised debate, but this issue affects people's lives, here on Earth and in the hereafter. It should not to be taken lightly and I would thank you to respect my position in this matter.

Tony Blair is subject to exactly the same constraints, and I know what I am talking about because I am suffering because of the actions of the Moderns who are totally responsible for the deliberate alienation of the Catholic and other Christian Churches. I am also responsible to the many thousands of Catholic Free Masons in this world who are now looking to us to try to relieve their terrible suffering.

and what about the suffering of the rest of sentient beings around the world because of the evil going on in our world,because of a few big wigs at the top who think they have some divine right to rule us.

What gives them the right to tell us what to do and who should live and die,they need taking down.

They are parasites living off the backs of others and THEY create wars and manipulate society with lies,what goes around comes around.

Blair and co have been responsible for thousands if not millions of deaths going to war based on Illuminati lies,remember 911 GS.

and the Vatican is rolling in wealth which should go to the poor and the needy of this world,I for one am sick of the Hypocrisy.

Its all about POWER AND CONTROL AND PEOPLE ARE WAKING UP,IT CANNOT COME SOON ENOUGH,AND THEN THE TRUTH WILL BE REVEALED.

My goodness your memories are short

[flyermay]

There is far too much slagging off on this forum. It has serious consequences, and it is a poor excuse for not using the brain that God gave us.

Yes, I saw it too, but please take into account that this is a sort of "entertainment" for many (including myself some times); apart from being one of the very few channels available to talk about common believes in respect to the chaotic state of our world (social, political, economical and environmental).

Either way, do you think that anyones really takes us seriously; bearing in mind that most of the world doesn't even do it with Icke?

[lightgiver]

Yes, I saw it too, but please take into account that this is a sort of "entertainment" for many (including myself some times); apart from being one of the very few channels available to talk about common believes in respect to the chaotic state of our world (social, political, economical and environmental).

Either way, do you think that anyones really takes us seriously; bearing in mind that most of the world doesn't even do it with Icke?

watch the vid and read the words,

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yEsOveQ7D7w

and take a look at the Vatican in all it splendour,Jesus would be outraged and seeing the poverty and suffering in the world.

The kingdom of heaven is within not in bricks and stones.

and the Muslim Hierarchy are no better.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tx0lqVZOnHw

[grandsecretary]

and what about the suffering of the rest of sentient beings around the world because of the evil going on in our world,because of a few big wigs at the top who think they have some divine right to rule us.

What gives them the right to tell us what to do and who should live and die,they need taking down.

They are parasites living off the backs of others and THEY create wars and manipulate society with lies,what goes around comes around.

Blair and co have been responsible for thousands if not millions of deaths going to war based on Illuminati lies,remember 911 GS.

and the Vatican is rolling in wealth which should go to the poor and the needy of this world,I for one am sick of the Hypocrisy.

Its all about POWER AND CONTROL AND PEOPLE ARE WAKING UP,IT CANNOT COME SOON ENOUGH,AND THEN THE TRUTH WILL BE REVEALED.

My goodness your memories are short

Oh no, our memories are very good indeed which is why we will not be diverted by you again.

We are all opposed to evil here, and evil includes shooting from the hip and causing a great deal of hurt to others, and I am talking about you.

Do you now accept that the Pope is not a freemason, and indeed persecutes freemasons by excommunication? If you cannot accept that, then there is no point in talking to you about it.

[flyermay]

and take a look at the Vatican in all it splendour,Jesus would be outraged and seeing the poverty and suffering in the world.

I agree: they are disgusting; I don't really have much good to say about the Vatican.

But what I trying to explain to GS is that most of us already had that opinion before we even heard of David Icke (at least me), so this forum cannot be blamed for it.

[lightgiver]

I agree: they are disgusting; I don't really have much good to say about the Vatican.

But what I trying to explain to GS is that most of us already had that opinion before we even heard of David Icke (at least me), so this forum cannot be blamed for it.

Agreed.

This has gone on for to long and the Illuminati bloodlines are at the root of this mess.
There is nothing wrong with religion and governance its just been perverted by the wrong people and the people should start championing themselves and speaking out more, it can be a peaceful revolution.;)

good night.

[flyermay]

and the Muslim Hierarchy are no better.

IMO, the other side of the same coin.

Thought that video looks like it was made by Bush and Blair's “war on terror” propaganda team.

[grandsecretary]

I am waiting for an honest reply to MY question this time.

Do you now accept that the Catholic Church is so opposed to freemasons and freemasonry that as a matter of policy it excommunicates Catholics who are freemasons?

It's a simple question, calling for a simple answer, but it takes an honest man to admit when he is wrong and to apologise when he is told that he has hurt someone by his behaviour.

[flyermay]

I am waiting for an honest reply to MY question this time.

Do you now accept that the Catholic Church is so opposed to freemasons and freemasonry that as a matter of policy it excommunicates Catholics who are freemasons?

It's a simple question, calling for a simple answer, but it takes an honest man to admit when he is wrong and to apologise when he is told that he has hurt someone by his behaviour.

Sorry, are you asking me???

[grandsecretary]

Sorry, are you asking me???

No, flyermay you only joined in the debate after lightgiver was stirring the pot. You were not to know.

lightgiver is the one who needs to face up to the facts, and to be man enough to admit that he was wrong on this issue, and apologise to me and other Catholic Free Masons who have been severely hurt and damaged by this.

On the one hand we are told, by lightgiver, that freemasons are New World Order Iluminati with the Pope and the Vatican at its head, and then on the other hand we are persecuted and mistreated by the Vatican, especially Cardinal Ratzinger, BECAUSE we are Catholics and Free Masons.

Meat in a very dirty sandwich.

His ignorance has caused untold hurt. He has called me a liar on more than one occasion on this issue, but now it has come home to roost.

There is incontrovertible proof on this thread to show that the Pope is NOT a freemason; that he and the Catholic Church, as a matter of policy, are vehemently anti-Mason in all of its forms, and excommunicates Catholics who are freemasons. This includes me, and it is solely due to the activities of the anti-Catholic Rosicrucian Modern Masons, consistently since 1723, and until today, as the latest doctrinal statement amply illustrates.

Now, let us see what lightgiver is really made of. Will he divert again, or have the guts to admit that he is as wrong as it is possible to be on this issue?

[dusthead]

I have read through as much of this nonsense as I can stomach.

If you believe the freemasons are satanic baby murdering maniacs then you have obviously never met them and you are reading shoddy bits of 'evidence' from paranoid websites.

As I have said twice already, I HAVE MET THEM MANY TIMES and they are sad weird gits with bad facial hair who keep goats and like to think they can dodge speeding tickets more easily than the rest of us (they probably do).

I would join up to avoid getting my car clamped but I can't be arsed with all the goat-herding, annual meetings and fucking awful beards.

If you think they control the world then you need help. They couldn't run a Lego factory. If they do control the world then we would all have been fucked long ago. By goats. With platted beards.

[boots]

I speak for myself, The Grand Lodge at York and nobody else, and I will decide who my mates are old lad, not you.

Stewart is NOT a freemason, and that is it. What part of that simple five word statement are you struggling with?

He takes an interest in the subject, and that is all, and I object to you calling him a liar when he is one of the most honest people that I have ever known.

Seem's like you have a screw looses :D Show me where I have called him a lair.

Takes an interest in the subject:rolleyes: He has stated that he has tried many times to join Masonary So why wont you let him join your little group?



Hi boots,your post is spot on,

Yes they all play mind games,I am above their levels of deceit.

They never give straight answers,its all in the Craft.

In fact I am wondering why they are always are on the D Icke forum along with their sycophantic lackeys,on a forum were the guy whos name it is in does not even have 1 good word about them,and now I know why.


Hi LG:)

These guy's fool around with the dark forces and are being used they by the Illuminati and dont even know it.....Sad isn't.

.

[grandsecretary]

Seem's like you have a screw looses :D Show me where I have called him a lair.

Takes an interest in the subject:rolleyes: He has stated that he has tried many times to join Masonary So why wont you let him join your little group?

Hi LG:)

These guy's fool around with the dark forces and are being used they by the Illuminati and dont even know it.....Sad isn't.

.

You are neither entitled to ask nor to receive an answer to your impertinent question. That is Stewart's private business. You have been told what the situation is and that is all you are going to get.

[dusthead]

These guy's fool around with the dark forces and are being used they by the Illuminati and dont even know it.....Sad isn't.

.

They don't even know it?!! The Illumati obviously aren't being specific enough. How will the poor bearded fools know what to do?

It's a good job there's people here to remind them to murder children and support the New World Order.

Sad isn't what?

[humito]

You are neither entitled to ask nor to receive an answer to your impertinent question. That is Stewart's private business. You have been told what the situation is and that is all you are going to get.
:D .............this post sums it up the most !
high and mighty and holier than tho.!!!
IMO most have no clue as to what is really happening in the organisation and its offshoots or in the magickal lodges inspired by it.
Even those high level masons in some of its guises have no clue and are really at the bottom of the pyramid of control.
Most masons will not (or even want to ) move beyond its lower levels,most masons have nothing to offer the organisation either!!! However some do I.E those in power positions,the rich and famous and mega rich or those with some influence in or over society and the masses ..I.E police chiefs/judges/polititians etc.

most are kept in the dark and kept busy with the lower levels ( some wasting a lifetime with it!) not knowing that thay are spoon fed rubbish that is contradicted completely at the higher levels,that is why its not worth believing anything most of them say !


What worries me most about the masons?


well I distrust anything that is elitist and hierachical as it leads to the creation of personalities such as "GRAND secretary" etc :rolleyes:

[boots]

:D .............this post sums it up the most !
high and mighty and holier than tho.!!!
IMO most have no clue as to what is really happening in the organisation and its offshoots or in the magickal lodges inspired by it.
Even those high level masons in some of its guises have no clue and are really at the bottom of the pyramid of control.
Most masons will not (or even want to ) move beyond its lower levels,most masons have nothing to offer the organisation either!!! However some do I.E those in power positions,the rich and famous and mega rich or those with some influence in or over society and the masses ..I.E police chiefs/judges/polititians etc.

most are kept in the dark and kept busy with the lower levels ( some wasting a lifetime with it!) not knowing that thay are spoon fed rubbish that is contradicted completely at the higher levels,that is why its not worth believing anything most of them say !


What worries me most about the masons?


well I distrust anything that is elitist and hierachical as it leads to the creation of personalities such as "GRAND secretary" etc :rolleyes:


Good one man. You've hit the nail on the head.

Being a mason mean's nothing. It's like the majority of society. Sheeple, which is an unfortunate term, but fitting sometimes.

What these guy's on the Icke forum dont get, is that we know, they dont know of the hidden agenda and are not truth seeker's, they dont think any deep thought's as to what is wrong with the world, they only see it in superficial term's.

"well I distrust anything that is elitist and hierachical as it leads to the creation of personalities such as "GRAND secretary" etc"

Bang on the money.

None of these elitist have proved themselves through out history. Their cunt's they only think of themselves and serving an agenda.

[boots]

You are neither entitled to ask nor to receive an answer to your impertinent question. That is Stewart's private business. You have been told what the situation is and that is all you are going to get.

:rolleyes:

Who do you think you are??

SO answer your own question as to me calling stuewie a lair? You cant because it is a false actuation. Designed to make you look as though you are "grand". what do you take me for, a fool?

Be precise in answering a POST GS Dont twist it around or put your own spin on it. and dont come across high and mighty. It doesn't cut it with me.



Stuart Edwards has stated that he has tried to join a masonic group... FACT.

.

[stewart edwards]

I am saddened that the moderators have chosen to keep this thread open. Anyhow
Stuart Edwards has stated that he has tried to join a masonic group... FACT.
.Stewart Edwards has:-

1. At the age of 20/1ish talked to a relative about joining his lodge. It was a casual chat and I approached him about it. But shortly therafter I graduated and had to move to another part of the country to find the work that I wanted in the professions. So I never followed it up.

2. Five(?)ish years ago I petitioned an UGLE lodge local to me. They rejected me before the ballot day, so I guess that while I seemed to get through the committee, some objected to me. Fair enough. But they never told me why I was rejected.

3. I have met with a fair number of masons and corresponded with countless more, current and ex, from EA to acting grand chains, globally. I have visted masonic functions and even helped "steward" a lodge. While I have been photographed with masons, some wearing chains, I have never since petitioned to join a lodge. I also once, tactfully steered a conversation away form making me a mason under the sword.

4. It is true that a fair few masons do call me brother, but as you know from GrandSecretary this is the souce of some disagreement in the masonic world.

5. I also have never been a member of, or applied to join, any esoteric group.

6. I am aware that the door is now wide open for me should I decide to walk through it and has been for some time. But, for various reasons, the time is not right for me to take that step at the moment.

7. I have in the past got as much, if not more, grief from masons who dont like me and my desire to clean up the masonic world, than I ever have from antis. A lot of it on masonic forums.

8. Will I ever join - probably inevitably. Why, because a true lodge is a valuable asset in the community. But while masons argue about my suitability, I am happy to let them get on with it. I wish the masonic world well. But it isnt for everyone.

9. Do I expect the Duke of Kent to propose me as his successor - of course not. But I would inspire and would help shake the cobwebs out and breath new life into UGLE, which would then flow through it amity fraternities and in time out to the wider masonic world. Realistically though it is likely that I will petition a comasonic lodge at some stage and settle down as an adjucnct to what I already do in my community. (Where I think that it would be fair comment to say that I am considered a right pain in the ass for demanding high standards - I have stood up to a few powers that be, while liked by those that I have helped).

I hope that clarified the situation for you Boots.

[boots]

Well, thank you for clearing that up Steward.

You came across in this post as truthful and honest. I appreciate your candor.

I guess you dont understand about energy and how it is manipulated by "other's" that have greater knowledge of esoterica energy? Do you?

Can you not see yourself as special being that is one with the creator?

That you really dont' need another's thought process to make you connected to your infinite self?

Why do you feel need to join a organization?

Don't get me wrong man I'm not trying to come over as a know it all. I care about all those I came in contact with, even though it is a cyber space interaction.

But why do you feel the need to join a masonic group? can you not rely on your own self esteem?

.

[boots]

They don't even know it?!! The Illumati obviously aren't being specific enough. How will the poor bearded fools know what to do?

It's a good job there's people here to remind them to murder children and support the New World Order.

Sad isn't what?

Mmmm do you comprehend what the Illuminati know and what they do??

http://www.illuminati-news.com/shadow-gov.htm


http://www.illuminati-news.com/2007/1021.html

It's called pawn's in a game, mate.

It boils down to the very system of law and how it is constructed.

.

[bluehorseman]

I am saddened that the moderators have chosen to keep this thread open. AnyhowStewart Edwards has:-

1. At the age of 20/1ish talked to a relative about joining his lodge. It was a casual chat and I approached him about it. But shortly therafter I graduated and had to move to another part of the country to find the work that I wanted in the professions. So I never followed it up.

2. Five(?)ish years ago I petitioned an UGLE lodge local to me. They rejected me before the ballot day, so I guess that while I seemed to get through the committee, some objected to me. Fair enough. But they never told me why I was rejected.

3. I have met with a fair number of masons and corresponded with countless more, current and ex, from EA to acting grand chains, globally. I have visted masonic functions and even helped "steward" a lodge. While I have been photographed with masons, some wearing chains, I have never since petitioned to join a lodge. I also once, tactfully steered a conversation away form making me a mason under the sword.

4. It is true that a fair few masons do call me brother, but as you know from GrandSecretary this is the souce of some disagreement in the masonic world.

5. I also have never been a member of, or applied to join, any esoteric group.

6. I am aware that the door is now wide open for me should I decide to walk through it and has been for some time. But, for various reasons, the time is not right for me to take that step at the moment.

7. I have in the past got as much, if not more, grief from masons who dont like me and my desire to clean up the masonic world, than I ever have from antis. A lot of it on masonic forums.

8. Will I ever join - probably inevitably. Why, because a true lodge is a valuable asset in the community. But while masons argue about my suitability, I am happy to let them get on with it. I wish the masonic world well. But it isnt for everyone.

9. Do I expect the Duke of Kent to propose me as his successor - of course not. But I would inspire and would help shake the cobwebs out and breath new life into UGLE, which would then flow through it amity fraternities and in time out to the wider masonic world. Realistically though it is likely that I will petition a comasonic lodge at some stage and settle down as an adjucnct to what I already do in my community. (Where I think that it would be fair comment to say that I am considered a right pain in the ass for demanding high standards - I have stood up to a few powers that be, while liked by those that I have helped).

I hope that clarified the situation for you Boots.


Don't close it, this is a good thread with interesting stuff coming out. I agree with boots this post does you well, I hope you get what you want - and if it is with Freemasonry than so be it.

[bluehorseman]

You will find freemasonry goes a lot higher than the low down 3 degrees ,in fact they complete a full circle of 360 degrees and the top nobs go by the label of Olympians.

and the Illuminati control the masons and something also controls the Illuminati. :p

Let the serpent eat its tail in the noble orders, but one has to prove themselves like the masons on here.

Can you keep secrets,but one has to have Psychopathic qualities when rising in the degrees.

Your concern is appreciated.

[stewart edwards]

Why do you feel need to join a organization? I dont, never really have done, unless you include things like the ramblers, etc (And I am not even a member of that at the moment). Perhaps I can best explain your point as follows.

Some years back now, I am guessing 10 years or so, I attended ufo meetings. One night after the meeting closed I was standing in the dark cold car park talking to the group organiser. I mentioned that I was pretty lost and wondered why there were no institutions in life there to help people like me make sense of it all.

At that time what I believed about Freemasonry in England (social club where deals are done) beared no realtion whatsoever to my plight of trying to make senses of life. So I plodded on, on my own. And I succeeeded. I really have answered the etrnal questions Boots, forund the grail so to speak, though it matters not to me if you, or anyone else, belives this. But having achieved this I do now help those that I can who are travelling the same path.

My opinion on the masonic world is simple. It has always been close to my heart, but all to often it seems to be acting as a drain of darkness as opposed to the institution of light that it thinks that it is. The best way taht I can explain it is that it feels like a father and sone relationship. I want the masonic world to turn the corner, but a son does not always listen to its father. But dont take this literally, I mean it fiuguratively. Though I do believe that I have been involved withthe ancient msyetries 4000 or so years ago (it is one possible explatation as to why I have been able to travel so far so fast - a decade from being a lost and broken man to where I am today.

Boots, please dont get your back up by this, but I really do think that you need to reconsider your view of my knowledge of ancient energy flows. As an aside I have suffered badly (by UK standards - though clearly not by global standards) at the hands of those who seek power on this plain. When you stand up to powers that be you can and do get hurt at times.

Anyhow I am about done with this thread Boots for there is far to much dark energy in previous pages and by continuing it an acceptable hidden bed of dark power is created.

[pinkfreud]

I am saddened that the moderators have chosen to keep this thread open.

oh don't be :) everyone has a right to debate and discuss as long as it isn't offensive. as always we keep a watch on all the threads.

[flyermay]

In fact I am wondering why they are always are on the D Icke forum along with their sycophantic lackeys,on a forum were the guy whos name it is in does not even have 1 good word about them,and now I know why.

I know you are going to put me back in your freemason black list, but this is not true. I heard Icke say many times that he has many mason friends and that they are wonderful people.

[runciter]

I know you are going to put me back in your freemason black list, but this is not true. I heard Icke say many times that he has many mason friends and that they are wonderful people.

is this exactly what he said? can you quote him directly?

[humito]

No, flyermay you only joined in the debate after lightgiver was stirring the pot. You were not to know.

lightgiver is the one who needs to face up to the facts, and to be man enough to admit that he was wrong on this issue, and apologise to me and other Catholic Free Masons who have been severely hurt and damaged by this.

On the one hand we are told, by lightgiver, that freemasons are New World Order Iluminati with the Pope and the Vatican at its head, and then on the other hand we are persecuted and mistreated by the Vatican, especially Cardinal Ratzinger, BECAUSE we are Catholics and Free Masons.

Meat in a very dirty sandwich.

His ignorance has caused untold hurt. He has called me a liar on more than one occasion on this issue, but now it has come home to roost.

There is incontrovertible proof on this thread to show that the Pope is NOT a freemason; that he and the Catholic Church, as a matter of policy, are vehemently anti-Mason in all of its forms, and excommunicates Catholics who are freemasons. This includes me, and it is solely due to the activities of the anti-Catholic Rosicrucian Modern Masons, consistently since 1723, and until today, as the latest doctrinal statement amply illustrates.

Now, let us see what lightgiver is really made of. Will he divert again, or have the guts to admit that he is as wrong as it is possible to be on this issue?

I think what you fail to understand GS is that catholicism and masonry are not about religion its about MONEY! It does allow masons to become members.

The official position though is that you are "in grave sin and cannot receive Holy Communion".

This started in the 1700's when the Vatican was concerened that a predecessor group the to "mafia" not affiliated with freemasonry was plotting to take control of the people. So the Pope banned membership in any group, however you were never excommunicated for it. In fact today there are priests, bishops and cardinals who are freemasons and the past 2 popes have been freemasons. it has everything to do with power and greed and nothing to do with religion.

AGAIN Freemasonry is not specifically forbidden by the Catholic Church.

Between 1730-1910 several Papal bulls were issued against Freemasonry, but Papal Bulls do not trump Canon Law and expire upon the death of an issuing Pope unless specifically extended by his successor.
Canon Law, the only legitimate rule of the Catholic Faith forbids membership in certain "secret societies" and other organizations that are believed to have agendas against the Church. Freemasonry was removed from that list under the authority of the College of Cardinals in the 1960's during the Vatican II reformations. (finalized in 1983.)

Some individuals within the Church and within the College of Cardinals still had and continue to have issues with Freemasonry, and have attempted to have Masonry once again specifically banned by Canon Law. This has not happened, despite the fact that the strongest anti-Masonic opinion in recent years, that one stating "Catholic Freemasons are in grave sin and may not take Communion" was written (in '83) by the Cardinal now known as Pope Benedict XVI.

The current Pontiff has made no further efforts against Freemasonry since writing that opinion (and that is what it is...opinion, not binding law) nor since becoming Pope, and likely will not. By and large the stance on Freemasonry is allowed to be interpreted and enforced independently within EACH DIOCESE!. Today there are some that remain very anti-Mason and others that are very friendly towards the fraternity.
IMO catholicism and masonry in all its guises are just different heads of the same ugly dragon....................IMO the current pontif probably is a mason but has to me seen as taking an anti masonic stance for the masses of catholics ...........he will never outlaw it though. Catholicism just like masonry is filled with millions of people who cannot see past their nose and the bigger picture.........all the infighting and disagreements in both the above mentioned organisations is very funny to me :)........it all adds to confusion and spiritual dilemas for its masses which is just what they want to happen really...........none of what the leaders of these organisations say is true and what does the powerfull catholic church care if a few people get upset...................THE POPE WILL NEVER BAN MASONRY!!!! this is because at its(catholicisms) very highest elite levels its the same bloody thing.............these elites are also at the bottom rung of a much higher ladder of control....as stated before it is all about vast wealth and control of the mind of the population and sod all to do with the Divine source/godhead.:) peace

[flyermay]

is this exactly what he said? can you quote him directly?

I'll find it for you, I saw it on various videos, but I'm pretty sure it is exactly what he said.

[thelonious]

The current Pontiff has made no further efforts against Freemasonry since writing that opinion (and that is what it is...opinion, not binding law) nor since becoming Pope, and likely will not. By and large the stance on Freemasonry is allowed to be interpreted and enforced independently within EACH DIOCESE!.

Any Catholic who becomes a Freemason is automatically excommunicated.


Declaration on Masonic Associations (Quaesitum est)

English Translation of a Latin Document from the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith November 26, 1983

It has been asked whether there has been any change in the Church's decision in regard to Masonic associations since the new Code of Canon Law does not mention them expressly, unlike the previous code.

This sacred congregation is in a position to reply that this circumstance is due to an editorial criterion which was followed also in the case of other associations likewise unmentioned inasmuch as they are contained in wider categories.

Therefore, the Church's negative judgment in regard to Masonic associations remains unchanged since their principles have always been considered irreconcilable
with the doctrine of the Church and, therefore, membership in them remains forbidden. The faithful, who enroll in Masonic associations are in a state of grave
sin and may not receive Holy Communion.

It is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations which would imply a derogation from what
has been decided above, and this in line with the declaration of this sacred congregation issued Feb. 17,1981. [1]

In an audience granted to the undersigned cardinal prefect, the Supreme Pontiff John Paul II approved and ordered the publication of this declaration which had
been decided in an ordinary meeting of this sacred congregation.

Rome, from the Office of the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Nov. 26, 1983

Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, Prefect
Father Jerome Hamer, O.P. Titular Archbishop of Lorium, Secretary

[grandsecretary]

I think what you fail to understand GS is that catholicism and masonry are not about religion its about MONEY! It does allow masons to become members.

The official position though is that you are "in grave sin and cannot receive Holy Communion".

This started in the 1700's when the Vatican was concerened that a predecessor group the to "mafia" not affiliated with freemasonry was plotting to take control of the people. So the Pope banned membership in any group, however you were never excommunicated for it. In fact today there are priests, bishops and cardinals who are freemasons and the past 2 popes have been freemasons. it has everything to do with power and greed and nothing to do with religion.

AGAIN Freemasonry is not specifically forbidden by the Catholic Church.

Between 1730-1910 several Papal bulls were issued against Freemasonry, but Papal Bulls do not trump Canon Law and expire upon the death of an issuing Pope unless specifically extended by his successor.
Canon Law, the only legitimate rule of the Catholic Faith forbids membership in certain "secret societies" and other organizations that are believed to have agendas against the Church. Freemasonry was removed from that list under the authority of the College of Cardinals in the 1960's during the Vatican II reformations. (finalized in 1983.)

Some individuals within the Church and within the College of Cardinals still had and continue to have issues with Freemasonry, and have attempted to have Masonry once again specifically banned by Canon Law. This has not happened, despite the fact that the strongest anti-Masonic opinion in recent years, that one stating "Catholic Freemasons are in grave sin and may not take Communion" was written (in '83) by the Cardinal now known as Pope Benedict XVI.

The current Pontiff has made no further efforts against Freemasonry since writing that opinion (and that is what it is...opinion, not binding law) nor since becoming Pope, and likely will not. By and large the stance on Freemasonry is allowed to be interpreted and enforced independently within EACH DIOCESE!. Today there are some that remain very anti-Mason and others that are very friendly towards the fraternity.
IMO catholicism and masonry in all its guises are just different heads of the same ugly dragon....................IMO the current pontif probably is a mason but has to me seen as taking an anti masonic stance for the masses of catholics ...........he will never outlaw it though. Catholicism just like masonry is filled with millions of people who cannot see past their nose and the bigger picture.........all the infighting and disagreements in both the above mentioned organisations is very funny to me :)........it all adds to confusion and spiritual dilemas for its masses which is just what they want to happen really...........none of what the leaders of these organisations say is true and what does the powerfull catholic church care if a few people get upset...................THE POPE WILL NEVER BAN MASONRY!!!! this is because at its(catholicisms) very highest elite levels its the same bloody thing.............these elites are also at the bottom rung of a much higher ladder of control....as stated before it is all about vast wealth and control of the mind of the population and sod all to do with the Divine source/godhead.:) peace

I am sorry but what you may not know is that I discuss these matters directly with the Vatican and I really do know, at first hand, EXACTLY what the situation is.

It is a matter of indisputable fact that the Catholic Church, as a matter of policy excommunicates freemasons, and it is nothing whatsoever to do with money. I have published their latest policy statement earlier on in this thread and I know they mean it because I have only recently been excommunicated myself.

I am sorry, I am not being rude, but you are expressing an opinion. I am letting you know how it really is.

PS: I am sorry I have re-read your posting. In a state of mortal sin and not allowed to receive Holy Communication IS ex-communication. My ex-communication however is personal, formal, and in writing.

[grandsecretary]

Any Catholic who becomes a Freemason is automatically excommunicated.


Declaration on Masonic Associations (Quaesitum est)

English Translation of a Latin Document from the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith November 26, 1983

It has been asked whether there has been any change in the Church's decision in regard to Masonic associations since the new Code of Canon Law does not mention them expressly, unlike the previous code.

This sacred congregation is in a position to reply that this circumstance is due to an editorial criterion which was followed also in the case of other associations likewise unmentioned inasmuch as they are contained in wider categories.

Therefore, the Church's negative judgment in regard to Masonic associations remains unchanged since their principles have always been considered irreconcilable
with the doctrine of the Church and, therefore, membership in them remains forbidden. The faithful, who enroll in Masonic associations are in a state of grave
sin and may not receive Holy Communion.

It is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations which would imply a derogation from what
has been decided above, and this in line with the declaration of this sacred congregation issued Feb. 17,1981. [1]

In an audience granted to the undersigned cardinal prefect, the Supreme Pontiff John Paul II approved and ordered the publication of this declaration which had
been decided in an ordinary meeting of this sacred congregation.

Rome, from the Office of the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Nov. 26, 1983

Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, Prefect
Father Jerome Hamer, O.P. Titular Archbishop of Lorium, Secretary

Thank you for your support on this issue thelonius. Not automatically ex-communicated though. Many Catholics continue to receive Holy Communion because they keep their masonic membership secret.

Unfortunately, as a public Mason, and as they see it causing problems for the Church, I was excommunicated earlier this week. It is a reality for me.

However, never say die, I continue with our formal submission to Rome, which we hope to complete later on in the year.

[humito]

so eating biscuits and drinking wine in a very pale imitation of the original fly agaric mushroom rite is what is at the root of and the pinnacle of being catholic? what sort of religious experience can a wafer and cheap plonk produce??lol what a fuss about nothing............why are there thousands of catholic masons around then? it must only be then that they are liars and withholding the truth from their church which isnt very christian and sums up the hypocricy with the religious masses nicely ........ like i intimated and has since been prooved if you are being public about it then officialdom has to be seen to be against it!!!! and will come down hard...neither organisation couild actually give a rats arse about you...........its always the bigger picture,like i said ..............different heads of the same dragon...........just as the americans and the british and the nazis are all the same at their deepest levels...................the world is a stage ! wars and apparent enemies and differnt religions etc are all made reality by the illuminati.......always creating conflict........................................

the catholic faith and christian faith etc are set up as mind control tools.!!!!...............as is masonry!!!!!.........of course they have to be publicly seen as being in oposition !! Its all part of the same evil though ......... How can you not see this .............the truth of the matter is then that you can publicly be a mason and a catholic but cannot take "communion"............ONE actual magical rite in the whole of its teachings!?

even that rite is a false one...............the true substances that can allow communion with the spiritual nature are kept for the elite and darkly subverted. It really is all about money,power and the control of minds ...the heads of all the religions and secret societies are united in a common cause.

The main three prongs of the tail of the beast are VATICAN CITY THE CITY OF LONDON AND WASHINGTON..............each has its masonic/egyption/annunaki obelisk.........when will you realise you do not need to have to be in a fraternity or belong to a church and have a label etc................its time to think for yourself instead of staying caught up in the games being played with reality ....... by those in charge........those who make you think you have choice and your own opinion!!!!!!!!!! Its the oldest trick in any stage magicians book!!!! and millions fall for it.


Do yourself a favour.............with a pure heart find a fly agaric mushroom thats seems "ok" with being picked.If you cup your hands around it with pure spiritual intent you will feel a tingling in your hand and know inyour heart that it will be safe and wants to fly with you.

take it carefully from the ground and thank it with a prayer.


take around three good bites and wait for a few hours..........this should be enough to allow you to experience the true glory of God and creation....take annother three bites if nothing is happening....This is what most religious experience comes from.....Divine Soma............

You do not need a church or an organisation to have the communion you desire.............!!!!!


take some milk thistle to help your liver and some manganese if your body starts to spasm and shake too much with overdose................drink plenty of blessed water.

IMO and experience Soma will help you know god.........with many experiences you will see the world in a new way and see straight through all the lies and brainwashing of religion and ritual.You will also be able ( especially in a masonic or magickal lodge ) to see the dark energy and entities that are invoked and surround us all and the planet also you will see and commune with the true beings of light and the true divine source.


DO NOT GIVE YOUR POWER AWAY TO THE CHURCH OR A LODGE OR TO THE DARKNESS !! IT IS YOURS!! peace:)

[grandsecretary]

Allow me to assist you humito:

"Sorry Peter and thelonius, I did not realise what the situation was, I was wrong. Thank you for the useful information."

It would have taken much less time and effort.

[flyermay]

http://img100.imageshack.us/img100/3502/popeblairmasonhandshakezb3.png (http://img100.imageshack.us/my.php?image=popeblairmasonhandshakezb3.png)

By the way, if anyone collects handshakes maybe you would like to add this one to your collections.

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/picture.php?albumid=333&pictureid=3361

Yes, it is Queen Elizabeth II; though the other one is of no interest (he's called Rothschild or something like that).

[grandsecretary]

I misjudged you flyermay. Why do you think that a Rothschild would need to shake the hand of the Queen as freemasons, and be photographed doing it? Surely he would just tell her at the spiffy free tea afterwards?

THINK!

[flyermay]

I misjudged you flyermay. Why do you think that a Rothschild would need to shake the hand of the Queen as freemasons, and be photographed doing it? Surely he would just tell her at the spiffy free tea afterwards?

THINK!

That's fine GS, many people misjudge me; I'm used to it.

But isn't it a bit unfair judging me when I didn't make any statement regarding that picture? Whatever you imagine I meant by posting that picture (other than being a curiosity) are simple speculations. And it surprises me coming from you, as speculation is one of the main reasons you visit this forum.

I'm really sorry the current events are having a negative effect in many people that might not deserve it. But think about the fact that this people are public figures, and as such they are subject to this kind of "interpretations"; like it or not.

[thelonious]

Unfortunately, as a public Mason, and as they see it causing problems for the Church, I was excommunicated earlier this week. It is a reality for me.



For whatever it's worth, you have my condolences. While I strongly disagree with many of the tenets of Roman Catholicism (as well as Protestantism, for that matter), I also realize that Roman Catholics usually take their church organization more seriously than other Christians do their own.

That being said, the RCC has no monopoly on spiritual truth, and if you look through history, as an excommincate, you're in some pretty good company.

[grandsecretary]

That's fine GS, many people misjudge me; I'm used to it.

But isn't it a bit unfair judging me when I didn't make any statement regarding that picture? Whatever you imagine I meant by posting that picture (other than being a curiosity) are simple speculations. And it surprises me coming from you, as speculation is one of the main reasons you visit this forum.

I'm really sorry the current events are having a negative effect in many people that might not deserve it. But think about the fact that this people are public figures, and as such they are subject to this kind of "interpretations"; like it or not.

Well, I am a pretty straight forward and plain speaking type of person. Why did you post that picture and then not make it quite clear why you did so? You only goad people like lightgiver and boots who believe anything so long as it agrees with their prejudices.

[grandsecretary]

For whatever it's worth, you have my condolences. While I strongly disagree with many of the tenets of Roman Catholicism (as well as Protestantism, for that matter), I also realize that Roman Catholics usually take their church organization more seriously than other Christians do their own.

That being said, the RCC has no monopoly on spiritual truth, and if you look through history, as an excommincate, you're in some pretty good company.

Many thanks. I am not quite sure how I feel about it at the moment, although disappointment is definitely there. I suppose that we should not be surprised when the new head of the organisation is an unreformed ex-member of the German National Socialist Party.

[eternal_spirit]

Many thanks. I am not quite sure how I feel about it at the moment, although disappointment is definitely there. I suppose that we should not be surprised when the new head of the organisation is an unreformed ex-member of the German National Socialist Party.
That's a bit unfair on ol Ratzy boy. Doubt he had a choice back then, it was mandatory and think I read that his family may have starved if he hadn't joined Hitler youth I think.

Christianity like other religions always has quarrels/differences within the denominations. Seems they can't agree on the book the Bible!

Well that's certainly news GS been excommunicated smells the Papal bull!

[flyermay]

Well, I am a pretty straight forward and plain speaking type of person. Why did you post that picture and then not make it quite clear why you did so? You only goad people like lightgiver and boots who believe anything so long as it agrees with their prejudices.

If you are looking for an excuse: I don't have one. But I can honestly answer you question anyway: I just saw the picture 5 minutes previous to posting it, and simply found it "curious".

Lightgiver and Boots are going to continue thinking whatever they thought before I posted that pictures, as well as you do. The picture, however it is interpreted by your or the other side, is of absolutely no real relevance to either cause; for a simple reason which I explained yesterday: a handshake on its own doesn't really prove anything.

I posted many messages on this forum neither supporting or attacking freemasons. It would be unfair and absurd for me to put any collective in the same sack and judge them without a tangible proof.

Said that; I really have no simpathy or empathy towards either side of that handshake. And even believe they deserve to be judged for what they really are... (open for intepretation again).

Just also say that you shouldn't take everything posted on this forum personally. And if you have any doubts: posting the picture has nothing to do with you or your believes.

[grandsecretary]

That's a bit unfair on ol Ratzy boy. Doubt he had a choice back then, it was mandatory and think I read that his family may have starved if he hadn't joined Hitler youth I think.

Christianity like other religions always has quarrels/differences within the denominations. Seems they can't agree on the book the Bible!

Well that's certainly news GS been excommunicated smells the Papal bull!

Elizabeth Lohner, 84, a close neighbour of the the Ratzingers in Traunstein, whose brother-in-law was sent to Dachau as a conscientious objector, dismisses such suggestions. “It was possible to resist, and those people set an example for others,” she said.

I am afraid that Cardinal Ratzinger, who has already made a number of major mistakes will be seen as a disaster area for the Catholic Church.

[lightgiver]

I know you are going to put me back in your freemason black list, but this is not true. I heard Icke say many times that he has many mason friends and that they are wonderful people.

To an extent,but challenge them,and you may find another side;)

maybe x masons are fine.

[flyermay]

To an extent,but challenge them,and you may find another side;)

maybe x masons are fine.

Yes, you can say that: he criticises freemasonry in general but clarifies that not all freemasons are necessarily evil, or even aware or belonging to any plot; at the contrary. But that’s, not the least, saying something positive about freemasons.

By the way, I’ve been trying to find the video without luck. Do you remember which one is it?

[lightgiver]

Oh no, our memories are very good indeed which is why we will not be diverted by you again.

We are all opposed to evil here, and evil includes shooting from the hip and causing a great deal of hurt to others, and I am talking about you.

Do you now accept that the Pope is not a freemason, and indeed persecutes freemasons by excommunication? If you cannot accept that, then there is no point in talking to you about it.

You have stated yourself the popes are masons whether this one or not,you will protect the order and craft to the death have you never taken part in the free masonic initiations:rolleyes: and lying is all part of it,can you not remember some of the posts you have posted?

I Have stated,to keep inviolate the secrets and mysteries of the Order

Cuts signs by drawing right hand across the throat.

[lightgiver]

Yes, you can say that: he criticises freemasonry in general but clarifies that not all freemasons are necessarily evil, or even aware or belonging to any plot; at the contrary. But that’s, not the least, saying something positive about freemasons.

By the way, I’ve been trying to find the video without luck. Do you remember which one is it?

Maybe not all masons are evil just like all members of the General public are not evil,what do you want me to say?

after all the world is rosy and no corruption or evil is going on,and all the elites are such lovely people who care for sentient beings:rolleyes:

Come off it flyermay.

No plots,you need to research more my friend,a lot more.

remember JFK?

BTW your photograph of queen lizzy was taken many years ago when people were a lot more ignorant than they are now.In plain view comes to mind.

wake up mate.

[lightgiver]

Well, I am a pretty straight forward and plain speaking type of person. Why did you post that picture and then not make it quite clear why you did so? You only goad people like lightgiver and boots who believe anything so long as it agrees with their prejudices.

Rubbish,I have seen your insults against fellow forum members many times,and so have others.:rolleyes:
In fact it was not long ago you got put on a On warning,you are very forgetful sonny.

[eternal_spirit]

I am afraid that Cardinal Ratzinger, who has already made a number of major mistakes will be seen as a disaster area for the Catholic Church.

Who ever appointed him doesn't foresee any disasters. Depends what you call mistakes. Besides the Nazi label doesn't fit according to many sources...


There is mounting evidence that the three major recent leaders of the Catholic church are ALL Jewish. Pope John Paul II had a Jewish mother and a Jewish grandmother. The present Pope, former Cardinal Ratzinger, may well be a German Jew (Ratzinger is a Jewish name), and the “Black Pope”, Jesuit General Peter-Hans Kolvenbach, could not look more Jewish. View his picture and you decide. (http://www.goodnewsaboutgod.com/studies/political/one_world_government/kolvenback.html)

[lightgiver]

Not for the first time, and probably not the last either.

Boo flippin hoo:rolleyes: grow up.You cant handle the truth.

[lightgiver]

Any Catholic who becomes a Freemason is automatically excommunicated.


Declaration on Masonic Associations (Quaesitum est)

English Translation of a Latin Document from the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith November 26, 1983

It has been asked whether there has been any change in the Church's decision in regard to Masonic associations since the new Code of Canon Law does not mention them expressly, unlike the previous code.

This sacred congregation is in a position to reply that this circumstance is due to an editorial criterion which was followed also in the case of other associations likewise unmentioned inasmuch as they are contained in wider categories.

Therefore, the Church's negative judgment in regard to Masonic associations remains unchanged since their principles have always been considered irreconcilable
with the doctrine of the Church and, therefore, membership in them remains forbidden. The faithful, who enroll in Masonic associations are in a state of grave
sin and may not receive Holy Communion.

It is not within the competence of local ecclesiastical authorities to give a judgment on the nature of Masonic associations which would imply a derogation from what
has been decided above, and this in line with the declaration of this sacred congregation issued Feb. 17,1981. [1]

In an audience granted to the undersigned cardinal prefect, the Supreme Pontiff John Paul II approved and ordered the publication of this declaration which had
been decided in an ordinary meeting of this sacred congregation.

Rome, from the Office of the Sacred Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, Nov. 26, 1983

Cardinal Joseph Ratzinger, Prefect
Father Jerome Hamer, O.P. Titular Archbishop of Lorium, Secretary


Pope Pius IX - freemason?

But, strange to say, there is no doubt that Pope Pius IX. was himself a Freemason. His signature still exists in the books of one of the Italian Lodges of Monte Video. Shortly after his ordination Mastai Ferretti (which was his secular name) was sent as Auditor to the Vicar-General of Chile, and at one time it was believed that he was initiated into Freemasonry in that country. When, in later years, he was appointed Apostolic Delegate in Uruguay he appeared in the Lodges as a fully qualified Freemason, and a writer in the Libertad del Pensamiento, a Madrid journal, in 1870, said that there was in existence in the possession of one whose name he gave (Soussingeas) a portrait of the Pope in Masonic regalia.

such in a world of deceit,the Vatican drips in wealth and gold and people suffer in their millions from starvation<what Hypocrisy on a massive scale.

[lightgiver]

No, flyermay you only joined in the debate after lightgiver was stirring the pot. You were not to know.

lightgiver is the one who needs to face up to the facts, and to be man enough to admit that he was wrong on this issue, and apologise to me and other Catholic Free Masons who have been severely hurt and damaged by this.

On the one hand we are told, by lightgiver, that freemasons are New World Order Iluminati with the Pope and the Vatican at its head, and then on the other hand we are persecuted and mistreated by the Vatican, especially Cardinal Ratzinger, BECAUSE we are Catholics and Free Masons.

Meat in a very dirty sandwich.

His ignorance has caused untold hurt. He has called me a liar on more than one occasion on this issue, but now it has come home to roost.

There is incontrovertible proof on this thread to show that the Pope is NOT a freemason; that he and the Catholic Church, as a matter of policy, are vehemently anti-Mason in all of its forms, and excommunicates Catholics who are freemasons. This includes me, and it is solely due to the activities of the anti-Catholic Rosicrucian Modern Masons, consistently since 1723, and until today, as the latest doctrinal statement amply illustrates.

Now, let us see what lightgiver is really made of. Will he divert again, or have the guts to admit that he is as wrong as it is possible to be on this issue?

Show yourselves to the world then are the General public aware Obama is a mason,is it on the MSM news,what codswallop you come out with.

get real GS,I do not apologise for getting to the truth,good will always win in the end.

show me a post where I have called you a liar walter?

The Illuminati ,the masons,the Vatican,the elites have caused more suffering to this world that any one could ever imagine.

So if the Vatican are such anti masons then why are you a mason then GS and a catholic?

[lightgiver]

Don't get too defensive now..

Obelisks, Court of the Pinecone, Isis Osiris Horus symbolism, Helliocentric symbolism to name a couple things.

Why has no one denied the originating source of the Masonic rites as having Jesuit involvement..?

And yes, of course they play both sides against the middle, it's called a controlled opposition.

What's interesting is that the Masonic inspired founding of the USofA may have been largely motivated by the desire to throw off Vatican influence and control. The Declaration of Independance isn't just about independance from the throne of England, but also the oppressive religious influence of the Roman Church.

But the church is patient and extremely cunning..

But if there is in fact a headship of global freemasonry, it's the Pope, right after the Crown of Prince Charles, and the whole of the aristocratic nobility of Europe, for the most part answer to the Pope one way or another. And the Bankers too, even Israel is under her influence.

The light of freemasonry, it's "logos" is you will, was crafted by the Church.

Note how Masons love to show evidence of the Vatican's opposition to the Lodge/fraternity, and the way that's done, and your reaction, they just make it even MORE obvious.:rolleyes:

If you take the position that the Roman Empire never really ended, but simply morphed into the Roman Catholic Church, with senators becoming cardinals, then how does history square with that? And in so many areas of history resides the hidden hand of the Jesuits, the military arm of the RCC.

the Vatican in Rome is in fact the de facto head of global freemasonry.

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/1712/bushpelosipoperedeye.jpg (http://img209.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bushpelosipoperedeye.jpg)

eee the good old days eh.

Just look at the good old skull and bones puppet bush just waiting and slavering to kiss the popes ring £$£$£.

[flyermay]

Maybe not all masons are evil just like all members of the General public are not evil,what do you want me to say?

after all the world is rosy and no corruption or evil is going on,and all the elites are such lovely people who care for sentient beings:rolleyes:

Come off it flyermay.

No plots,you need to research more my friend,a lot more.

I don’t see how that makes Icke never saying anything positive about freemasons? He actually repeats in all his talks that most masons are being deceived just like the rest of us.

remember JFK?

Which one, Oliver Stone's? :rolleyes:

Of course all Kennedys were assassinated by their own government. Where does freemasonry fits with it?

BTW your photograph of queen lizzy was taken many years ago when people were a lot more ignorant than they are now. In plain view comes to mind.

Yes, thought so by Rothschild's hear colour? But, does it really make any difference when it was made?

[lightgiver]

I don’t see how that makes Icke never saying anything positive about freemasons? He actually repeats in all his talks that most masons are being deceived just like the rest of us.



Which one, Oliver Stone's? :rolleyes:

Of course all Kennedys were assassinated by their own government. Where does freemasonry fits with it?



Yes, thought so by Rothschild's hear colour? But, does it really make any difference when it was made?

Yawn.

When the Illuminati assassinated President Kennedy, he was killed according to the occult number signature of eleven [11]. He was killed in the 11th month, on the 22nd day, and on the 33rd parallel. He was also killed in the Masonic Dealey Plaza, the most powerful secret society in the world today to whom the number 11 is extremely important.

Like I say do the research your self.

http://img126.imageshack.us/img126/5978/acodex72.jpg (http://img126.imageshack.us/my.php?image=acodex72.jpg)

It appears this lot cannot shake hands normally,I wonder why.:rolleyes:Or they just like kissing the Popes Ring $%$%£

[humito]

Don't get too defensive now..

Obelisks, Court of the Pinecone, Isis Osiris Horus symbolism, Helliocentric symbolism to name a couple things.

Why has no one denied the originating source of the Masonic rites as having Jesuit involvement..?

And yes, of course they play both sides against the middle, it's called a controlled opposition.

What's interesting is that the Masonic inspired founding of the USofA may have been largely motivated by the desire to throw off Vatican influence and control. The Declaration of Independance isn't just about independance from the throne of England, but also the oppressive religious influence of the Roman Church.

But the church is patient and extremely cunning..

But if there is in fact a headship of global freemasonry, it's the Pope, right after the Crown of Prince Charles, and the whole of the aristocratic nobility of Europe, for the most part answer to the Pope one way or another. And the Bankers too, even Israel is under her influence.

The light of freemasonry, it's "logos" is you will, was crafted by the Church.

Note how Masons love to show evidence of the Vatican's opposition to the Lodge/fraternity, and the way that's done, and your reaction, they just make it even MORE obvious.:rolleyes:

If you take the position that the Roman Empire never really ended, but simply morphed into the Roman Catholic Church, with senators becoming cardinals, then how does history square with that? And in so many areas of history resides the hidden hand of the Jesuits, the military arm of the RCC.

the Vatican in Rome is in fact the de facto head of global freemasonry.

http://img209.imageshack.us/img209/1712/bushpelosipoperedeye.jpg (http://img209.imageshack.us/my.php?image=bushpelosipoperedeye.jpg)

eee the good old days eh.

Just look at the good old skull and bones puppet bush just waiting and slavering to kiss the popes ring £$£$£.





http://api.ning.com/files/y85foAIg86DetXCQ5SOkKIELJl-GaHesB0ozIMajQLygEUWWjQ61MGG0edChk2WS5DqM0WdsKfg68 CNL1tUSs3zls*w7nwbh/Pope_Ratzinger_handsign22009.jpg

click to enlarge



look familiar? lol;)

[lightgiver]

Hi Humito;)

Absolutely :D LOL

http://img3.imageshack.us/img3/5615/lordlevyandblairvi7.jpg (http://img3.imageshack.us/my.php?image=lordlevyandblairvi7.jpg)

Oo Look Blair with Pharaoh Levy,best chums eh.

http://img291.imageshack.us/img291/2433/ronpaulmason01qz1.png (http://img291.imageshack.us/my.php?image=ronpaulmason01qz1.png)

whole lot of shaking going on.Ha Ha.

Everyone is being hoodwinked even the ones who think they are not being hoodwinked,controlled opposition,of course they play both sides against the middle.

[flyermay]

Yawn.

When the Illuminati assassinated President Kennedy, he was killed according to the occult number signature of eleven [11]. He was killed in the 11th month, on the 22nd day, and on the 33rd parallel. He was also killed in the Masonic Dealey Plaza, the most powerful secret society in the world today to whom the number 11 is extremely important.

Like I say do the research your self.



No need for that, it's all clear to me now!!!

[lightgiver]

After the Vatican Bank scandal erupted in the early 1980's, French and Italian news publications listed the names of more than 150 high ranking bishops, archbishops and cardinals who were active members of Freemasonry, including the P2 Masonic Lodge and other dark and sinister secret societies.

The startling information never was publicized in the United States, but the implications should have been devastating to practicing Catholics worldwide since affiliation with Freemasonry is against Canon Law and grounds for immediate expulsion from the Roman Catholic Church.

As damning as the Masonic connections should have been to the Vatican, nothing happened as the allegations were quickly swept under the rug while those high level Vatican priests connected to Freemasonry actually flourished in positions of Vatican power.

However, as bad as it was for high-ranking bishops to be connected with Masonry, now comes even more shocking allegations that Angelo Roncalli, a.k.a. Pope John XXIII was also a practicing Freemason.

The following article, originally published in the Portugal Daily Newspaper on Nov. 12, 2002, and never seeing the light of day in America, proves beyond a reasonable doubt even the highest leader of the Roman Catholic Church was serving a devilish master instead of following and spreading the word of God.

http://www.arcticbeacon.com/greg/

[lightgiver]

I am saddened that the moderators have chosen to keep this thread open. AnyhowStewart Edwards has:-

1. At the age of 20/1ish talked to a relative about joining his lodge. It was a casual chat and I approached him about it. But shortly therafter I graduated and had to move to another part of the country to find the work that I wanted in the professions. So I never followed it up.

2. Five(?)ish years ago I petitioned an UGLE lodge local to me. They rejected me before the ballot day, so I guess that while I seemed to get through the committee, some objected to me. Fair enough. But they never told me why I was rejected.

3. I have met with a fair number of masons and corresponded with countless more, current and ex, from EA to acting grand chains, globally. I have visted masonic functions and even helped "steward" a lodge. While I have been photographed with masons, some wearing chains, I have never since petitioned to join a lodge. I also once, tactfully steered a conversation away form making me a mason under the sword.

4. It is true that a fair few masons do call me brother, but as you know from GrandSecretary this is the souce of some disagreement in the masonic world.

5. I also have never been a member of, or applied to join, any esoteric group.

6. I am aware that the door is now wide open for me should I decide to walk through it and has been for some time. But, for various reasons, the time is not right for me to take that step at the moment.

7. I have in the past got as much, if not more, grief from masons who dont like me and my desire to clean up the masonic world, than I ever have from antis. A lot of it on masonic forums.

8. Will I ever join - probably inevitably. Why, because a true lodge is a valuable asset in the community. But while masons argue about my suitability, I am happy to let them get on with it. I wish the masonic world well. But it isnt for everyone.

9. Do I expect the Duke of Kent to propose me as his successor - of course not. But I would inspire and would help shake the cobwebs out and breath new life into UGLE, which would then flow through it amity fraternities and in time out to the wider masonic world. Realistically though it is likely that I will petition a comasonic lodge at some stage and settle down as an adjucnct to what I already do in my community. (Where I think that it would be fair comment to say that I am considered a right pain in the ass for demanding high standards - I have stood up to a few powers that be, while liked by those that I have helped).

I hope that clarified the situation for you Boots.

when the going gets tough the tough get going,Stewart why shut posts down?I thought you said you were a Iron man?

You really think the likes of the Label Duke of Kent wish to relinquish their false power,they are control freaks,I would forget UGLE.,you have more chance of drawing blood out of a stone than to try and change their ways.

Forget it Stewart and move on,I am sure you could join GSs lodge seeing you are such good freinds,either that are start your own lodge if your desire is so great.

"Grasping at things can only yield one of two results:
Either the thing you are grasping at disappears, or you yourself disappear.
It is only a matter of which occurs first."

[lightgiver]

The caring world eh :rolleyes:

Hypocrites of the highest order.

see its things like this that make me sick to my gut,and masons and the church go on about how great and caring they are.

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=61939

http://www.rgle.org.uk/RGLE_MHC_Egypt.htm

And Pharaoh said, I will let you go that ye may sacrifice to the Lord your God in the wilderness; only ye shall not go very far away. . . Exodus 8:28

Roman Catholic pope is going to the land of the Pharaohs. John Paul II will visit Egypt Feb. 24-26 as part of a series of trips to biblical sites in 2000, Reuters said. He will meet with government and religious leaders, including President Hosni Mubarak, Coptic Orthodox Pope Shenouda, and the country's top Islamic leader. The pope will celebrate Mass in the Catholic Coptic Cathedral in Cairo, then visit the monastery of St. Catherine in the Sinai desert, thought to be near the site where Moses received the Ten Commandments."

and they cannot even influence anyone to help the downtrodden Palestinians.

Yours is the house of desolation,springs to mind.

And Babylon shall become heaps, a dwelling place for dragons, an astonishment, and an hissing, without an inhabitant. Jer. 51:37

Scripture not only identifies the origins of the Babylonian system upon which the Egyptian mystery religion is based, but describes its demonic nature and catastrophic denouement. Pope John Paul II's historic visit to Egypt would seem to argue that Mystery Babylon the Great of Revelation 17 is not confined to the Roman Catholic Church, but encompasses the entire decentralized system of mystery religions -- which will be led by a Masonic Pope to the ash heap of condemned humanity.

[humito]

After the Vatican Bank scandal erupted in the early 1980's, French and Italian news publications listed the names of more than 150 high ranking bishops, archbishops and cardinals who were active members of Freemasonry, including the P2 Masonic Lodge and other dark and sinister secret societies.

The startling information never was publicized in the United States, but the implications should have been devastating to practicing Catholics worldwide since affiliation with Freemasonry is against Canon Law and grounds for immediate expulsion from the Roman Catholic Church.

As damning as the Masonic connections should have been to the Vatican, nothing happened as the allegations were quickly swept under the rug while those high level Vatican priests connected to Freemasonry actually flourished in positions of Vatican power.

However, as bad as it was for high-ranking bishops to be connected with Masonry, now comes even more shocking allegations that Angelo Roncalli, a.k.a. Pope John XXIII was also a practicing Freemason.

The following article, originally published in the Portugal Daily Newspaper on Nov. 12, 2002, and never seeing the light of day in America, proves beyond a reasonable doubt even the highest leader of the Roman Catholic Church was serving a devilish master instead of following and spreading the word of God.

http://www.arcticbeacon.com/greg/



http://www.sinj.com/the-star-tarot/images/obelisk-saint-peters.jpg click to enlarge



the obelisk at the vatican ........moved from egypt...........i think in the middle ages there was even a gilt sphere sun symbol on top

[humito]

After the Vatican Bank scandal erupted in the early 1980's, French and Italian news publications listed the names of more than 150 high ranking bishops, archbishops and cardinals who were active members of Freemasonry, including the P2 Masonic Lodge and other dark and sinister secret societies.

The startling information never was publicized in the United States, but the implications should have been devastating to practicing Catholics worldwide since affiliation with Freemasonry is against Canon Law and grounds for immediate expulsion from the Roman Catholic Church.

As damning as the Masonic connections should have been to the Vatican, nothing happened as the allegations were quickly swept under the rug while those high level Vatican priests connected to Freemasonry actually flourished in positions of Vatican power.

However, as bad as it was for high-ranking bishops to be connected with Masonry, now comes even more shocking allegations that Angelo Roncalli, a.k.a. Pope John XXIII was also a practicing Freemason.

The following article, originally published in the Portugal Daily Newspaper on Nov. 12, 2002, and never seeing the light of day in America, proves beyond a reasonable doubt even the highest leader of the Roman Catholic Church was serving a devilish master instead of following and spreading the word of God.

http://www.arcticbeacon.com/greg/



http://www.sinj.com/the-star-tarot/images/obelisk-saint-peters.jpg



the obelisk at the vatican ........moved from egypt...........i think in the middle ages there was even a gilt sphere sun symbol on top

who are they trying to kid??

[lightgiver]

http://www.sinj.com/the-star-tarot/images/obelisk-saint-peters.jpg



the obelisk at the vatican ........moved from egypt...........i think in the middle ages there was even a gilt sphere sun symbol on top

who are they trying to kid??

Indeed,

Scripture not only identifies the origins of the Babylonian system upon which the Egyptian mystery religion is based, but describes its demonic nature and catastrophic denouement. Pope John Paul II's historic visit to Egypt would seem to argue that Mystery Babylon the Great of Revelation 17 is not confined to the Roman Catholic Church, but encompasses the entire decentralized system of mystery religions -- which will be led by a Masonic Pope to the ash heap of condemned humanity.

For all the nations have drunk of the wine of the wrath of her fornication, and the kings of the earth have committed fornication with her, and the merchants of the earth are waxed rich through the abundance of her delicacies. Rev. 18:2,3

"The Babylonians, in their popular religion, supremely worshipped a Goddess Mother and a Son, who was represented in pictures and in images as an infant or child in his mother's arms. . . From Babylon, this worship of the Mother and the Child spread to the ends of the earth. In Egypt, the Mother and the Child were worshipped under the names of Isis and Osiris.* [* Osiris, as the child called most frequently Horus. BUNSEN.]. . . It was to glorify Nimrod that the whole Chaldean system of iniquity was formed. He was known as Nin, "the son," and his wife as Rhea, who was called Ammas, "The Mother." The name Rhea, as applied to Semiramis, had another meaning from what it had when applied to her, who was really the primeval goddess, the "mother of gods and men."

On the 11th of August, 1999 in Egypt, The organization called the "illuminati" will be invoking a ceremony called: THE DARK MOTHER. The intention of this ceremony is to seal the doorway to our collective consciousness as it begins to open. The reason they wish to have this outcome, is that this organization represents the power brokers of our planet, who would prefer to maintain their control of the knowledge, finances and spiritual/political future of our societies. This control is through FEAR and misinformation.

[grandsecretary]

when the going gets tough the tough get going,Stewart why shut posts down?I thought you said you were a Iron man?

You really think the likes of the Label Duke of Kent wish to relinquish their false power,they are control freaks,I would forget UGLE.,you have more chance of drawing blood out of a stone than to try and change their ways.

Forget it Stewart and move on,I am sure you could join GSs lodge seeing you are such good freinds,either that are start your own lodge if your desire is so great.

"Grasping at things can only yield one of two results:
Either the thing you are grasping at disappears, or you yourself disappear.
It is only a matter of which occurs first."

William Shakespeare

Th' expense of spirit in a waste of shame
Is lust in action; and till action, lust
Is perjur'd, murderous, bloody, full of blame,
Savage, extreme, rude, cruel, not to trust;
Enjoy'd no sooner, but despised straight;
Past reason hunted; and no sooner had,
Past reason hated, as a swallow'd bait,
On purpose laid to make the taker mad:
Mad in pursuit, and in possession so;
Had, having, and in quest to have, extreme;
A bliss in proof,--and prov'd, a very woe;
Before, a joy propos'd; behind, a dream:
All this the world well knows; yet none knows well
To shun the heaven that leads men to this hell.

[lightgiver]

William Shakespeare

Not my cup of tea Shakespeare.:p

I wonder what a huge Egyptian obelisk is doing outside the Vatican,we have been through all this and why are Catholics masons?:rolleyes:

The kingdoms of the world belong to the devil Luke 4:6, 1 John 5:19, Jesus did not dispute this, at the seventh trumpet the kingdom of this world will finally belong to God Rev 11:15 also 1 Cor 15:24

"Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me; you do not have in mind the things of God, but the things of men." Mat 16:2

[luciferhorus]

Not my cup of tea Shakespeare.:p

"Get behind me, Satan! You are a stumbling block to me; you do not have in mind the things of God, but the things of men." Mat 16:2

Lightbearer to Lightgiver.

The Hebrew שָׂטָן (Satan) is probably derived from the Egyptian 'Set.'

The Hebrews were allegedly African slaves and would have been aware of their master's gods.

Language is 'almost' always syncretic, but with regards to slave languages it is 'always' syncretic for obvious reasons.

Let me test my psychic powers...

By the rivers of Babylon, we sat down and wept as we remembered Zion

Now I am 'guessing' that you and most others here who are not part of the Brotherhood of Masonry are thinking of a comparitvely recent (in the historical timescale) song by a female African American vocalist whose ancestors were African slaves.

I demand Lebensraum (living space) for the slaves in the Motherland (Africa) and the total apocalyptic destruction of Babylon (Christendom).

My will shall be done on earth, on penalty of death, hell and humanity's worst nightmares.

Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein Fuhrer (One people, One Kingdom, One Messiah) is an Israeli Zionist Communist mantra which I have long invoked.

David Icke takes the position that your Israelite Communist god (Jesus) whom you worship is a myth; that is not my view at all; there were so many like him who were tortured and crucified by the 'then' establishment of tyranny (government).

I thank you for your relentless attacks against the Masonic brotherhood.

As much as you hate me, I cannot feel otherwise but love for you.

Jesus allegedly (and many others like him) attacked government, organised religion, monetarism, propertyism and so forth.

You are quite like him, but only in some ways; you remind me of him; whereas the Masonic Brotherhood reminds me of all that he hated and despised; however when I consider you and think of you, I cannot truly define you as being totally politically correct (i.e., correct politics, a/k/a Anarcho-Communism).

Jesus was arrested, allegedly because the Sadduces (the Solomonic Temple cultists, or 'proto-Masons') placed a large reward on him; his most probable father (Zecharia) was also alledly a Sadducee. Zecharia was also allegedly the father of Jesus' brother John (The Baptist) who allegedly also rejected his father's cult.

2000 years ago, in terms of 'language' there were no 'Freemasons' for you to attack; you might have cursed the Solomonic priesthood; but the term Freemasony would be unknown to you,


I wish you so much love with your mission to attack the modern day Sadducee's; I just wish you would give up you faith in that bastard biblical god.


Ll

Lux

[runciter]

The Hebrew שָׂטָן (Satan) is probably derived from the Egyptian 'Set.'

The Hebrews were allegedly African slaves and would have been aware of their master's gods.


horus was raped by his uncle seth, but took revenge and evirated him.

the habiru were nomadic tribes of the middle east, semites like the hyksos.

[tanya_suzanne]

Hello my name is David, my profile name is a girl friend of mine who I love very much, this is my first post and I didnt think it would be on freemasonry.

Seems to me theres alot of nothing here really, I mean alot of the stuff against freemasonry is "hear say" and "thats a masonic hand shake" how do you know what a masonic hand shake is? You dont! Most of the stuff on the net is from a old kiss and tell book from the 1800's.

I joined this forum, as Iam intrested in some of David Ickes ideas, but not the freemasonry stuff.(Of course I think hes wrong)


Why because I am a freemason, I am Marker Master and I am also in Holy Royal Arch and my Craft lodge is in Devon.

I think my brothers(just the masons) on here should remember the second degree apron.

What I will say is, if any of the powers that be here want to work with me we can work together to see if this higher degree stuff is real, Iam sure proving that freemasonry is not evil will not be a problem without me braking any of my 7 obligations.

[runciter]

Seems to me theres alot of nothing here really, I mean alot of the stuff against freemasonry is "hear say" and "thats a masonic hand shake" how do you know what a masonic hand shake is? You dont! Most of the stuff on the net is from a old kiss and tell book from the 1800's.


it's the point of view of a mason, based on his masonic hierarchical mindset.

non-masons can see things and decide themselves, without daddy's permission.

[tanya_suzanne]

it's the point of view of a mason, based on his masonic hierarchical mindset.

non-masons can see things and decide themselves, without daddy's permission.

I am not saying its wrong, infact if its true then I would leave freemasonry

[grandsecretary]

it's the point of view of a mason, based on his masonic hierarchical mindset.

non-masons can see things and decide themselves, without daddy's permission.

I am afraid that I agree with runciter here. The structure of the Moderns form of freemasonry is essentially a hierarchical social structure which works against freedom of expression.

I can think of many occasions where threats of withdrawal of hirearchy (promotion) have been used, quite ruthlessly, to silence opposition within the Moderns system, and hirearchy conferred in order to encourage support for the policies of the executive.

[flyermay]

I am afraid that I agree with runciter here. The structure of the Moderns form of freemasonry is essentially a hierarchical social structure which works against freedom of expression.

I can think of many occasions where threats of withdrawal of hirearchy (promotion) have been used, quite ruthlessly, to silence opposition within the Moderns system, and hirearchy conferred in order to encourage support for the policies of the executive.

I really respect your honesty. I was denied this fact about the hierarchical nature of freemasonry many times.

Can you understand now why people are so suspicious of freemasonry? There is just too much contradiction and speculation surrounding it; and it doesn't make any favour to either side.

Either way, I have to agree with your previous statement about being a freemason; as the word says, everyone should be “free” to be a “mason”, if that’s what they desire. :p

[thelonious]

I really respect your honesty. I was denied this fact about the hierarchical nature of freemasonry many times.

Can you understand now why people are so suspicious of freemasonry? There is just too much contradiction and speculation surrounding it; and it doesn't make any favour to either side.



I can't speak for the UGLE, but in the USA, it doesn't work that. Officials are elected by majority vote, so no official can threaten to withhold any type of "promotion".

It's also important to pint out that "masonic authority" is sort of make believe. The Craft is a voluntary fraternal organization, and any official's perceived authority is only relevant within that particluar organization, not in real life.

There's plenty of jockeying for position in Freemasonry, but that's usually done by people who are not successful in the real world, and therefore want high-sounding Masonic titles to help boost their otherwise deflated egos.

[flyermay]

I can't speak for the UGLE, but in the USA, it doesn't work that. Officials are elected by majority vote, so no official can threaten to withhold any type of "promotion".

It's also important to pint out that "masonic authority" is sort of make believe. The Craft is a voluntary fraternal organization, and any official's perceived authority is only relevant within that particluar organization, not in real life.

For what I have been hearing from either side, that’s also one of the main reasons for the mistrust and lack of confidence that non-masons have towards freemasonry and the defensive statements of freemasons.

Most people can’t get around the fact that Masonic practices change from lodge to lodge (though they have a common name and basis). When I started asking about freemasonry, and saw how every freemason’s answers differed from each other, my first impressions were: are they lying to me, do they have something to hide, do they consider me unworthy, or are they being deceived and simply don’t know what is really going on.

And if you add to all that confusion the fact that some freemasons are indeed guilty of using the craft for their own personal benefits and to fulfil their ambitions (activities that are not exclusive of freemasonry), we have the perfect explosive cocktail which is just starting to blow up; where all freemasons are being accused of crimes they didn’t even know existed. (That’s just my personal opinion).

[grandsecretary]

For what I have been hearing from either side, that’s also one of the main reasons for the mistrust and lack of confidence that non-masons have towards freemasonry and the defensive statements of freemasons.

Most people can’t get around the fact that Masonic practices change from lodge to lodge (though they have a common name and basis). When I started asking about freemasonry, and saw how every freemason’s answers differed from each other, my first impressions were: are they lying to me, do they have something to hide, do they consider me unworthy, or are they being deceived and simply don’t know what is really going on.

And if you add to all that confusion the fact that some freemasons are indeed guilty of using the craft for their own personal benefits and to fulfil their ambitions (activities that are not exclusive of freemasonry), we have the perfect explosive cocktail which is just starting to blow up; where all freemasons are being accused of crimes they didn’t even know existed. (That’s just my personal opinion).

There is a great deal of sense in what you say here.

[dusthead]

Mmmm do you comprehend what the Illuminati know and what they do??

http://www.illuminati-news.com/shadow-gov.htm


http://www.illuminati-news.com/2007/1021.html

It's called pawn's in a game, mate.

It boils down to the very system of law and how it is constructed.

.

I know what you and several thousand other people suspect they know and what you suspect they do, yes.

Personally I think you should all go off and spend a nice day at the beach for a change. Maybe turn your computer off and watch a nice sunset before you turn into those people who wear sandwich boards with 'THE END IS NIGH!' written on them.

[lightgiver]

Lightbearer to Lightgiver.

The Hebrew שָׂטָן (Satan) is probably derived from the Egyptian 'Set.'

The Hebrews were allegedly African slaves and would have been aware of their master's gods.

Language is 'almost' always syncretic, but with regards to slave languages it is 'always' syncretic for obvious reasons.

Let me test my psychic powers...

By the rivers of Babylon, we sat down and wept as we remembered Zion

Now I am 'guessing' that you and most others here who are not part of the Brotherhood of Masonry are thinking of a comparitvely recent (in the historical timescale) song by a female African American vocalist whose ancestors were African slaves.

I demand Lebensraum (living space) for the slaves in the Motherland (Africa) and the total apocalyptic destruction of Babylon (Christendom).

My will shall be done on earth, on penalty of death, hell and humanity's worst nightmares.

Ein Volk, Ein Reich, Ein Fuhrer (One people, One Kingdom, One Messiah) is an Israeli Zionist Communist mantra which I have long invoked.

David Icke takes the position that your Israelite Communist god (Jesus) whom you worship is a myth; that is not my view at all; there were so many like him who were tortured and crucified by the 'then' establishment of tyranny (government).

I thank you for your relentless attacks against the Masonic brotherhood.

As much as you hate me, I cannot feel otherwise but love for you.

Jesus allegedly (and many others like him) attacked government, organised religion, monetarism, propertyism and so forth.

You are quite like him, but only in some ways; you remind me of him; whereas the Masonic Brotherhood reminds me of all that he hated and despised; however when I consider you and think of you, I cannot truly define you as being totally politically correct (i.e., correct politics, a/k/a Anarcho-Communism).

Jesus was arrested, allegedly because the Sadduces (the Solomonic Temple cultists, or 'proto-Masons') placed a large reward on him; his most probable father (Zecharia) was also alledly a Sadducee. Zecharia was also allegedly the father of Jesus' brother John (The Baptist) who allegedly also rejected his father's cult.

2000 years ago, in terms of 'language' there were no 'Freemasons' for you to attack; you might have cursed the Solomonic priesthood; but the term Freemasony would be unknown to you,


I wish you so much love with your mission to attack the modern day Sadducee's; I just wish you would give up you faith in that bastard biblical god.


Ll

Lux

You do not know my faith,you are assuming to much.

and I hate no one,you are guessing again and placing suggestions where there are none.

Find a post where I have mentioned hate?or the other assumptions you claim about me.

[tanya_suzanne]

I am afraid that I agree with runciter here. The structure of the Moderns form of freemasonry is essentially a hierarchical social structure which works against freedom of expression.

I can think of many occasions where threats of withdrawal of hirearchy (promotion) have been used, quite ruthlessly, to silence opposition within the Moderns system, and hirearchy conferred in order to encourage support for the policies of the executive.

Sadly!:o
I am a freemason uder the UGLE, thid gut is not and in my eyes and any one under the UGLE or Grand lodge does not see his order as freemasonry.

This means that there is no way or time this member of there little order would be aloud in any lodge under the rules of UGLE

So really he is not a freemason, and has no masonic knowlage at all, only what he reads off the net about freemasonry and and what his club practic

Sorry m8 but you cant pretent to be something your not, and your club is not masonic.

[grandsecretary]

Sadly!:o
I am a freemason uder the UGLE, thid gut is not and in my eyes and any one under the UGLE or Grand lodge does not see his order as freemasonry.

This means that there is no way or time this member of there little order would be aloud in any lodge under the rules of UGLE

So really he is not a freemason, and has no masonic knowlage at all, only what he reads off the net about freemasonry and and what his club practic

Sorry m8 but you cant pretent to be something your not, and your club is not masonic.

We know all that tosh. We have debated it ad nauseum on this forum much to the annoyance of the vast majority here who are non-Masons.

This is NOT a Masonic Forum. This discussion is for elsewhere. I have sent you a private message.

Just so nobody misunderstands. This new member to the forum wants you to know that he is a member of the Moderns system of freemasonry, under the jurisdiction of The United Grand Lodge of England, constituted in 1813. The United Grand Lodge of England does not "recognise" The Grand Lodge of All England.

I say again, The United Grand Lodge does not "recognise" The Grand Lodge of All England, thank God. I feel sure that you are all as devastated as I am.

We do not allow our respective members to attend each other's Lodges because the Masonic systems are wholly incompatible.

Got it? Great. Now we can get back to the conspiracy theories.

Yours sincerely

thid gut

[lightgiver]

We know all that tosh. We have debated it ad nauseum on this forum much to the annoyance of the vast majority here who are non-Masons.

This is NOT a Masonic Forum. This discussion is for elsewhere. I have sent you a private message.

Just so nobody misunderstands. This new member to the forum wants you to know that he is a member of the Moderns system of freemasonry, under the jurisdiction of The United Grand Lodge of England, constituted in 1813. The United Grand Lodge of England does not "recognise" The Grand Lodge of All England.

I say again, The United Grand Lodge does not "recognise" The Grand lodge of All England, thank God.

Got it? Great.

You treat it like a masonic forum:p and you think you are the top nob on here.:rolleyes: Ha Ha

O you are awful and to easy. No corn to pick,shibboleth.

I was always taught to be cautious in this degree as well as the former.

I will letter or halve it with you.

BTW Prince Bernard of the Netherlands as the power to veto the Vatican's choice of any pope it selects?is this correct GS,because his family(haps bergs) are descended from the Roman emperors.He He.

[grandsecretary]

You treat it like a masonic forum:p and you think you are the top nob on here.:rolleyes: Ha Ha

O you are awful and to easy. No corn to pick,shibboleth.

I was always taught to be cautious in this degree as well as the former.

I will letter or halve it with you.

Pill - ock

[lightgiver]

Pill - ock

Plenty more to come,so back off,jachin I have not even started yet.;)

ooo you are awful,and your acting is terrible.

[boots]

I know what you and several thousand other people suspect they know and what you suspect they do, yes.

Personally I think you should all go off and spend a nice day at the beach for a change. Maybe turn your computer off and watch a nice sunset before you turn into those people who wear sandwich boards with 'THE END IS NIGH!' written on them.

Speak for yourself . Turn your own computer Off. Stop wasting time on here.

Have you even read an Icke book?? For starter's

.

[dusthead]

Speak for yourself . Turn your own computer Off. Stop wasting time on here.

Have you even read an Icke book?? For starter's

.

All internet forums are a waste of time - It's the social equivalent of playing Tetris.

If the 'Ikeans' are proved right we are all doomed. This begs the question, why devote your life to researching something that can only be proved in the event of mankind going down the toilet?

There are those who will say that they are trying to enlighten people to avoid this catastophe. If they succeed, then everyone will say 'Remember when that David Icke bloke said we would all be under mind control and the New World Order would take over? How wrong was he?!'

I don't get it.

[flyermay]

All internet forums are a waste of time - It's the social equivalent of playing Tetris.

If the 'Ikeans' are proved right we are all doomed. This begs the question, why devote your life to researching something that can only be proved in the event of mankind going down the toilet?

There are those who will say that they are trying to enlighten people to avoid this catastophe. If they succeed, then everyone will say 'Remember when that David Icke bloke said we would all be under mind control and the New World Order would take over? How wrong was he?!'

I don't get it.

I think their massage finally got you!!!

http://i57.photobucket.com/albums/g222/pma1963/Cheney_and_Bush_Borg.jpg