Mirror within the mirror - Spiegel Im Spiegel

[adimon]

Having been absent from this forum for a very long time, I am returning having undergone a series of very strange experiences in recent months.

If anyone has any thoughts on these I would be very interested in their 'take' on them.

The first thing is that I have retrained myself to have lucid dreams since around August last year, and mastered the 'art' (for want of a better term) of exploring the alternative 'realities' presented to me whilst asleep/not awake.

To cut a long story short, this first phenomena 'came to a head' when last week I had a lucid dream on three successive nights, and on each occasion was unable to 'escape' when the time came that I wanted to.

Prior to this, my lucid dreams ended either when I decided I had had enough fun and 'chose' to wake up, or the dream reached a kind of movie-style logical ending point, which prompted awakening.

For now, I will just summarise the end of the first of the three dreams, and if I get time, I will go onto the others (over the next few days if I get a chance).

After what seemed like days of 'living' in the lucid dream, mainly involving walking round a fantasy city of my own imagination, experimenting with fantastical technology which doesnt exist, and having LOTS of great sex with different women (so sue me I'm a highly-sexual guy), I entered a tunnel which eventually led into a brightly lit void, where everything was WHITE: the floor was bright white and stretched to infinity (seemingly), there was no horizon, no ceiling/sky/walls etc, no features, just white everywhere, no sound other than my own footsteps and body noises/voice.

Upon looking round the tunnel had vanished! :O

I spent perhaps an hour and a half of 'realtime' inside this void, which, as you'll see became perhaps the most emotional experience of my life.

After walking around aimlessly, failing to find any evidence of optical illusion or door, or anything which might suggest that there was any purpose or feature of this void, I sat down on the floor, a little tired and very...confused, for want of a better word.

I tried very hard to just wake up, and slapped myself around the face which sometimes works. Then I waited, literally just sitting there daydreaming, whilst presumably still actually dreaming. I waited for around an hour.

After this time, it suddenly occured to me that one thing that might explain my predicament was if if I was dead. I felt a wave of dread wash over me, and yet more confusion, and also...kinda panic I guess.

I should stipulate at this point that in my waking life I am fairly strongly skeptical, although recent events, this included, have begun to weaken my skepticism slightly.

Anyway, I became quite sad as I became more convinced by the idea that I had died in my sleep and was in some kind of limbo or whatever.

Just as I was getting very, very emotional and upset indeed (on the brink of tears - I havent cried in real life in 10 years), I heard a voice, not from distance, nor from inside my head, which said the following:

"Life is the seed, knowledge is the flower, love is the fragrance, death is the fruit."

From my remembrance of the eastern religious material I cruised in my earlier years, this to me seems like its describing reincarnation.

Before I go onto the other dreams and other experiences, what does everyone else think?

Very grateful for any input.

Hope you are all well.

Chris

[element]

Heh Adimon, this is a deja vu for me. Although I don't know you at all, when I saw you posting a while back I already had the feeling you would come back with some sort of 'strange' experience. Believe it or not, but that's just..strange?:eek: Being genuine here.

It's hard to tell what your dream means, maybe you have experienced something inside yourself..
Maybe a part of your ego has disappeared, or something that has been part of you for a long time? I recommend to write down dreams every time, it makes you become more aware of your 'subconscious'. How do you feel now, and look if anything has changed. Take notes etc.

I don't think I can help much with the dream, because it is so incredibly hard to interpreted dreams. I sometimes still check back old dreams (lucid ones of course), and it's still hard to understand. The only one who can best understand it, is you. Maybe I'm wrong, and hopefully some other peeps have some good interpretation. :D

[adimon]

Heh Adimon, this is a deja vu for me. Although I don't know you at all, when I saw you posting a while back I already had the feeling you would come back with some sort of 'strange' experience. Believe it or not, but that's just..strange?:eek: Being genuine here.

Wow that IS odd.

I recommend to write down dreams every time, it makes you become more aware of your 'subconscious'. How do you feel now, and look if anything has changed. Take notes etc.

Yeah I do. That was part of my lucid dream training. Some of them are quite unbelievable. If I find the time I might end up posting them all on here.

[psyked]

How did you learn to lucid dream? how long did it take?

[nectars]

How did you learn to lucid dream? how long did it take?

Check out http://www.saltcube.com/ it the most effective and fastest way of training yourself to Lucid dream & OBE(astral travel) at will. I was going to post the Full Video for you but the fkers 1.12Gb in size, so unless you know somewhere I could host a file that large for free... :/

Anyway let me know if you do :)

Cool experience adimon, cant really comment as these things mean different things to each of us. If your going in the direction of understanding this though, you should perhaps check out "The Inner Guide Meditation" by Edwin C Steinbrecher. Link: http://www.amazon.com/Inner-Guide-Meditation-Spiritual-Technology/dp/0877286574. Its an active meditation where you interact within the astral dimension that runs parallel to the Physical. As for being skeptical, try it, the only thing that will get you over skepticism is your own experience of it -as it sounds like you've noticed.

I have a few very handy sayings I like to keep in mind with all this stuff; "Take it for checking; prove it to yourself" & "I only know that which I can do". Both of these come from a guy names Lester Levenson and are designed to stop us from fooling ourselves into the delusions set up by ourself or others.

Hope this helps :)

[miracles]

Having been absent from this forum for a very long time, I am returning having undergone a series of very strange experiences in recent months.

If anyone has any thoughts on these I would be very interested in their 'take' on them.

The first thing is that I have retrained myself to have lucid dreams since around August last year, and mastered the 'art' (for want of a better term) of exploring the alternative 'realities' presented to me whilst asleep/not awake.

To cut a long story short, this first phenomena 'came to a head' when last week I had a lucid dream on three successive nights, and on each occasion was unable to 'escape' when the time came that I wanted to.

Prior to this, my lucid dreams ended either when I decided I had had enough fun and 'chose' to wake up, or the dream reached a kind of movie-style logical ending point, which prompted awakening.

For now, I will just summarise the end of the first of the three dreams, and if I get time, I will go onto the others (over the next few days if I get a chance).

After what seemed like days of 'living' in the lucid dream, mainly involving walking round a fantasy city of my own imagination, experimenting with fantastical technology which doesnt exist, and having LOTS of great sex with different women (so sue me I'm a highly-sexual guy), I entered a tunnel which eventually led into a brightly lit void, where everything was WHITE: the floor was bright white and stretched to infinity (seemingly), there was no horizon, no ceiling/sky/walls etc, no features, just white everywhere, no sound other than my own footsteps and body noises/voice.

Upon looking round the tunnel had vanished! :O

I spent perhaps an hour and a half of 'realtime' inside this void, which, as you'll see became perhaps the most emotional experience of my life.

After walking around aimlessly, failing to find any evidence of optical illusion or door, or anything which might suggest that there was any purpose or feature of this void, I sat down on the floor, a little tired and very...confused, for want of a better word.

I tried very hard to just wake up, and slapped myself around the face which sometimes works. Then I waited, literally just sitting there daydreaming, whilst presumably still actually dreaming. I waited for around an hour.

After this time, it suddenly occured to me that one thing that might explain my predicament was if if I was dead. I felt a wave of dread wash over me, and yet more confusion, and also...kinda panic I guess.

I should stipulate at this point that in my waking life I am fairly strongly skeptical, although recent events, this included, have begun to weaken my skepticism slightly.

Anyway, I became quite sad as I became more convinced by the idea that I had died in my sleep and was in some kind of limbo or whatever.

Just as I was getting very, very emotional and upset indeed (on the brink of tears - I havent cried in real life in 10 years), I heard a voice, not from distance, nor from inside my head, which said the following:

"Life is the seed, knowledge is the flower, love is the fragrance, death is the fruit."

From my remembrance of the eastern religious material I cruised in my earlier years, this to me seems like its describing reincarnation.

Before I go onto the other dreams and other experiences, what does everyone else think?

Very grateful for any input.

Hope you are all well.

Chris

I googled this in various parts therof, it appears to be very religeous, eatern, even egyptian mysticism.

I would be careful as to it's origins - Im a Christian, I urge caution.:)

google "Life is the seed" then "Knowlede is the flower" this will give a little insite as to what religions teach this stuff, as a christian I dont believe it is from God, rather it is from a darker side.

Now this is my Biblical Christian World view, any who dont agree with my view, I dont care to have you get stuck into me for it. If you dont mind.

[michael christopher]

That is a very interesting dream, I loved reading your description of it. I am trying to train myself to "wake up" in the dream state, but I am just getting started I think. So, did your dream just end after you heard that voice? You said that your dream seemed to last days?

[branjo]

How I would interpret this experience would be a very positive one.
I think you have stumbled on to the entire point to life my friend many of us only imagine having a passing glimpse at. I have heard the time spent between incarnations as the time when you are in fact with the one consciousness, described before as the Void, which probably would carry with it an "initial" feeling of loneliness, but maybe that's the reason the one is fragmented so much into all life, because then it won't know loneliness,( letting my imagination run a bit, but this is what I get from it)

The time spent within the Void stays within your memory through every incarnation as a kind of knowing, not explainable and not sensory related. Your description of "Life is the seed, knowledge is the flower, love is the fragrance, death is the fruit." Is a beautiful way of understanding it, even reading it brought a smile to my face. It is fractal, the nature of the universe and all life in it.

Many people talk of lucid dreaming as the door to who you are, and the removal of the bonds of reality, some say the messages are chaotic and quite often bizarre but when a moment of clarity is reached, can give profound impact to your life.

It is being the pioneer of the inner self, there is no way this came from anywhere else but deep in the consciousness of you and you are connected to everything in the cosmos. I would look on this as something you were destined to feel and not let it slip away through fear or distrust.

I don't remember many dreams, and I have only a few to speak of in my entire life, I envy those who can master this skill and would like to know, what you read or practiced or did it just come naturally to you. I have seen myself become very impatient in the past but of late I am letting go of the things that do not benefit me like the fear and distrust of uncertainty, I am always on the look out for the positive in life now and I feel better for it too.

I say keep on trucking, I would like to hear more.

[miracles]

How I would interpret this experience would be a very positive one.
I think you have stumbled on to the entire point to life my friend many of us only imagine having a passing glimpse at. I have heard the time spent between incarnations as the time when you are in fact with the one consciousness, described before as the Void, which probably would carry with it an "initial" feeling of loneliness, but maybe that's the reason the one is fragmented so much into all life, because then it won't know loneliness,( letting my imagination run a bit, but this is what I get from it)

The time spent within the Void stays within your memory through every incarnation as a kind of knowing, not explainable and not sensory related. Your description of "Life is the seed, knowledge is the flower, love is the fragrance, death is the fruit." Is a beautiful way of understanding it, even reading it brought a smile to my face. It is fractal, the nature of the universe and all life in it.

Many people talk of lucid dreaming as the door to who you are, and the removal of the bonds of reality, some say the messages are chaotic and quite often bizarre but when a moment of clarity is reached, can give profound impact to your life.

It is being the pioneer of the inner self, there is no way this came from anywhere else but deep in the consciousness of you and you are connected to everything in the cosmos. I would look on this as something you were destined to feel and not let it slip away through fear or distrust.

I don't remember many dreams, and I have only a few to speak of in my entire life, I envy those who can master this skill and would like to know, what you read or practiced or did it just come naturally to you. I have seen myself become very impatient in the past but of late I am letting go of the things that do not benefit me like the fear and distrust of uncertainty, I am always on the look out for the positive in life now and I feel better for it too.

I say keep on trucking, I would like to hear more.

God is not a God of confusion, from what I read, this chap had a very upsetting emotional experience and has absoluetly no idea what it means. Im convinced this is not a positive experience, nor would I suggest that "being removed form the bonds of reality" to be something one seeks after. This was not a moment of clarity, it was a moment of profound confusion.

[branjo]

You will never reach clarity unless you experience confusion.

By bonds of reality I meant the needless connection to the body and the inherent pain that comes along with it. Didn't Jesus have confusion on the cross, "My God, My God, Why hast thou forsaken me". You should have already known that, but I just thought you might need reminding.

And if you think that hearing "Life is the seed, knowledge is the flower, love is the fragrance, death is the fruit." is in anyway negative or evil then I feel your perception of the very thing you say you hold dear as a Christian is bottom line, confused.

But the guy asked for opinions not a debate

[miracles]

You will never reach clarity unless you experience confusion.

By bonds of reality I meant the needless connection to the body and the inherent pain that comes along with it. Didn't Jesus have confusion on the cross, "My God, My God, Why hast thou forsaken me". You should have already known that, but I just thought you might need reminding.

And if you think that hearing "Life is the seed, knowledge is the flower, love is the fragrance, death is the fruit." is in anyway negative or evil then I feel your perception of the very thing you say you hold dear as a Christian is bottom line, confused.

But the guy asked for opinions not a debate

True, but in my experience, threads often kick of many debates in different directions. Its certainly been the case with any thread I have started. Your response is the typical anti christain sarcastic response I have come to loath on these threads. Very spiritual of you, well done.

[branjo]

Ok then fair enough we can go that route.

How was I anti anything? I merely pointed out that you basically contradicted yourself by claiming your religion as some sort of foregone conclusion that you know more about the divine than anyone else.

Religion itself is just a word to describe a collection of opinions that happen to be the same, there is no oneness in religion. Organized religions look at a spiritual person as somehow beneath them instead of equal. Has Religion or more to the point Christianity got a proven track record for the ability make the world a safer and more beautiful place? "Turn to my way of thinking or its eternity in fire for you, hold on till I get my hat and coat and I'll be right with you.:rolleyes: <--- that was sarcasm.

How many wars have been fought in the name of organized religion? probably hundreds. How many wars have been fought in the name of spirituality, undoubtedly none. Spirituality has only one place were a person needs to worship the divine from, the heart and that's it.

"The kingdom of god is within", not in strategically placed buildings drenched in gold while the people who are dragged there out of guilt are fighting to stay alive from the fear of eternal damnation. Hardly a warm and inviting concept.

Why did you have to "google" anything to find out what it meant, how come you didn't just know enough to give an opinion based on your particular perspective of it instead of answering the question based on how someone else on the internet would interpret it. This is the error of religion my friend "Dogma", you don't need to turn to a book to explain how you feel about something you already know it deep down.

The seed of life is also the name given to the cells multiplying in the womb, how can you really attribute anything dark with that description? Life is the flower, can that not mean that a developing flower as the developing love for life, it reaches its fullness and must fade, but before it goes it leaves a seed to start the whole thing over again and provide more life. Aren't we like the dying fruit with children as our seed?

If god is everything then god IS everything, nothing gets left out. If someone can feel confused then god can feel confusion as we are all a fragment of that divine influence then what we feel and indeed what you feel is inherently god given, is it not?

There is nothing separate from god, no evil person or evil entity, nothing exists outside the realms of the whole because if it did then it would be more than one and wouldn't really be the "whole".

I am not trying to start an argument with you dude, I saw it one way and you saw it another, I saw positivity and you saw negativity. I would like to know, why you had an immediate distrust of his dream without resorting to google for your answer.

[miracles]

Ok then fair enough we can go that route.

How was I anti anything? I merely pointed out that you basically contradicted yourself by claiming your religion as some sort of foregone conclusion that you know more about the divine than anyone else.

Religion itself is just a word to describe a collection of opinions that happen to be the same, there is no oneness in religion. Organized religions look at a spiritual person as somehow beneath them instead of equal. Has Religion or more to the point Christianity got a proven track record for the ability make the world a safer and more beautiful place? "Turn to my way of thinking or its eternity in fire for you, hold on till I get my hat and coat and I'll be right with you.:rolleyes: <--- that was sarcasm.

How many wars have been fought in the name of organized religion? probably hundreds. How many wars have been fought in the name of spirituality, undoubtedly none. Spirituality has only one place were a person needs to worship the divine from, the heart and that's it.

"The kingdom of god is within", not in strategically placed buildings drenched in gold while the people who are dragged there out of guilt are fighting to stay alive from the fear of eternal damnation. Hardly a warm and inviting concept.

Why did you have to "google" anything to find out what it meant, how come you didn't just know enough to give an opinion based on your particular perspective of it instead of answering the question based on how someone else on the internet would interpret it. This is the error of religion my friend "Dogma", you don't need to turn to a book to explain how you feel about something you already know it deep down.

The seed of life is also the name given to the cells multiplying in the womb, how can you really attribute anything dark with that description? Life is the flower, can that not mean that a developing flower as the developing love for life, it reaches its fullness and must fade, but before it goes it leaves a seed to start the whole thing over again and provide more life. Aren't we like the dying fruit with children as our seed?

If god is everything then god IS everything, nothing gets left out. If someone can feel confused then god can feel confusion as we are all a fragment of that divine influence then what we feel and indeed what you feel is inherently god given, is it not?

There is nothing separate from god, no evil person or evil entity, nothing exists outside the realms of the whole because if it did then it would be more than one and wouldn't really be the "whole".

I am not trying to start an argument with you dude, I saw it one way and you saw it another, I saw positivity and you saw negativity. I would like to know, why you had an immediate distrust of his dream without resorting to google for your answer.

No I gave my opinion and advise form my perspective - didnt bother reading the rest of what you said. Nor will I

[adimon]

How did you learn to lucid dream? how long did it take?

I visited lucidity.com, got some pointers, and started keeping a dream journal. I watched some videos on the subject, and the movie "Waking Life" :)

It took me a few months but eventually I was able to have a handful of lucid dreams.

I then joined the army (this is a few years ago now) and was in for like a couple of years. During that whole time I was too preoccupied with adjusting to army life and had none.

Last summer, I met my girlfriend who is quite into meditation and it prompted me to try again. I thought that the protracted absence would make it hard to get back into the lucid dreaming thing, but it worked first time!

Since then I have probably lucid dreamt 80% of the nights I have slept. The dreams are more detailed, more fantastic, and more numinous. I have had serial dreams, where a single storyline is continued across several dreams. My degree of control has increased, and my 'sensitivity' - for want of a better word. For example, I am able to have orgasms in my dreams, and then wake up physically undergoing orgasm. I am also able to get up and move my body around, though this requires a lot of concentration and is easily the most tiring thing ever. I have willed myself to walk across the room and pick up a football, for example, and have then woken up and found myself laying on the floor holding the ball. I have been unable to wake up on my feet yet, but I'm trying.

I say just keep persisting and it will probably work out for you. I am relatively 'unspiritual' compared to most people on this forum, and until recently have been a staunch humanist and skeptic. However, the spat of dreams I had recently (which seem to be on hold for the moment - perhaps to give me time to mull them over) have made me question pretty much everything. Not being able to wake up after what seems like hours or days of trying will do that to you!

While I'm at it, I will briefly say that I had another almost identical dream to the one I posted above, trapped in a white void (like the matrix loading program) only this time the voice said

"Passion is the feeling the beach receives when the wave crashes upon it"

Very interesting, and very beautiful.



Cool experience adimon, cant really comment as these things mean different things to each of us. If your going in the direction of understanding this though, you should perhaps check out "The Inner Guide Meditation" by Edwin C Steinbrecher. Link: http://www.amazon.com/Inner-Guide-Meditation-Spiritual-Technology/dp/0877286574. Its an active meditation where you interact within the astral dimension that runs parallel to the Physical. As for being skeptical, try it, the only thing that will get you over skepticism is your own experience of it -as it sounds like you've noticed.

I have a few very handy sayings I like to keep in mind with all this stuff; "Take it for checking; prove it to yourself" & "I only know that which I can do". Both of these come from a guy names Lester Levenson and are designed to stop us from fooling ourselves into the delusions set up by ourself or others.

Thanks for the tips! :)

I googled this in various parts therof, it appears to be very religeous, eatern, even egyptian mysticism.

The message I received was very clear, and bear in mind that as a complete sentence it is very powerful. When I googled the whole thing, nothing came up, so I am satisfied that its from "me", or something I have personally experienced/accessed, rather than some kinda mythological cellular-memory thing.

I would be careful as to it's origins - Im a Christian, I urge caution.:)

Thanks but I never take Christians' advice on anything. The 'origins' of my experience are within me, that much I am sure of. If you're a Christian, then why are you worried about evil spirits? Surely god is all powerful? Does he not want me to have this experience? Or is it the devil?

I dont want to sidetrack this thread, but the whole omnipotence/presence of a rival thing is really completely pointless.

Plus, any religion that would have me stone my girlfriend (a very beautiful person) to death on her father's doorstep because I wasnt the first man lucky enough to make love to her, is utterly repellent to me, and I'm not interested. I would thank you for your concern, but I dont believe its genuine. So sue me.

google "Life is the seed" then "Knowlede is the flower" this will give a little insite as to what religions teach this stuff, as a christian I dont believe it is from God, rather it is from a darker side.

Now this is my Biblical Christian World view, any who dont agree with my view, I dont care to have you get stuck into me for it. If you dont mind.

Well...I think I've made it clear what my view is of your Christian view, so I guess you can probably see that I REALLY dont "care to have you get stuck into me for it". Try googling "christianity + child abuse".

That is a very interesting dream, I loved reading your description of it. I am trying to train myself to "wake up" in the dream state, but I am just getting started I think. So, did your dream just end after you heard that voice? You said that your dream seemed to last days?

I literally woke up with the message resounding in my head.

Yes, some of my dreams are now lasting a couple of weeks of 'dream time', which when experienced lucidly, can be very disorienting upon waking up.

How I would interpret this experience would be a very positive one.
I think you have stumbled on to the entire point to life my friend many of us only imagine having a passing glimpse at. I have heard the time spent between incarnations as the time when you are in fact with the one consciousness, described before as the Void, which probably would carry with it an "initial" feeling of loneliness, but maybe that's the reason the one is fragmented so much into all life, because then it won't know loneliness,( letting my imagination run a bit, but this is what I get from it)

The time spent within the Void stays within your memory through every incarnation as a kind of knowing, not explainable and not sensory related. Your description of "Life is the seed, knowledge is the flower, love is the fragrance, death is the fruit." Is a beautiful way of understanding it, even reading it brought a smile to my face. It is fractal, the nature of the universe and all life in it.

Many people talk of lucid dreaming as the door to who you are, and the removal of the bonds of reality, some say the messages are chaotic and quite often bizarre but when a moment of clarity is reached, can give profound impact to your life.

It is being the pioneer of the inner self, there is no way this came from anywhere else but deep in the consciousness of you and you are connected to everything in the cosmos. I would look on this as something you were destined to feel and not let it slip away through fear or distrust.

I don't remember many dreams, and I have only a few to speak of in my entire life, I envy those who can master this skill and would like to know, what you read or practiced or did it just come naturally to you. I have seen myself become very impatient in the past but of late I am letting go of the things that do not benefit me like the fear and distrust of uncertainty, I am always on the look out for the positive in life now and I feel better for it too.

I say keep on trucking, I would like to hear more.

Thanks! :)

I will post more when I get the chance!

God is not a God of confusion, from what I read, this chap had a very upsetting emotional experience and has absoluetly no idea what it means. Im convinced this is not a positive experience, nor would I suggest that "being removed form the bonds of reality" to be something one seeks after. This was not a moment of clarity, it was a moment of profound confusion.

Not a moment of clarity, no, but it has made me question things. I guess when you're used to ignoring quite how much incest, rape, genocide, slavery, child abuse and human sacrifice is in your scripture, you get used to not questioning things.

Thanks also for making all those massive assumptions about me. If you look at my posting history you will see that I am not someone that is afraid to question things - I consider myself to be a healthy skeptic - and yes elements of this are upsetting, but so is closing yourself off to things!

You will never reach clarity unless you experience confusion.

By bonds of reality I meant the needless connection to the body and the inherent pain that comes along with it. Didn't Jesus have confusion on the cross, "My God, My God, Why hast thou forsaken me". You should have already known that, but I just thought you might need reminding.

And if you think that hearing "Life is the seed, knowledge is the flower, love is the fragrance, death is the fruit." is in anyway negative or evil then I feel your perception of the very thing you say you hold dear as a Christian is bottom line, confused.

But the guy asked for opinions not a debate

Opinion, debate, outrage, joy - I welcome them all. :)

Your response is the typical anti christain sarcastic response I have come to loath on these threads.

So forgive branjo. ;)

I am not trying to start an argument with you dude, I saw it one way and you saw it another, I saw positivity and you saw negativity. I would like to know, why you had an immediate distrust of his dream without resorting to google for your answer.

I'd be interested to hear what miracles thinks of the "passion/beach/waves" message, and whether it is also wholly negative in his view. And everyone else of course?

No I gave my opinion and advise form my perspective - didnt bother reading the rest of what you said. Nor will I

:D

Thanks everyone for your input so far!

Really interesting :)

[miracles]

I visited lucidity.com, got some pointers, and started keeping a dream journal. I watched some videos on the subject, and the movie "Waking Life" :)

It took me a few months but eventually I was able to have a handful of lucid dreams.

I then joined the army (this is a few years ago now) and was in for like a couple of years. During that whole time I was too preoccupied with adjusting to army life and had none.

Last summer, I met my girlfriend who is quite into meditation and it prompted me to try again. I thought that the protracted absence would make it hard to get back into the lucid dreaming thing, but it worked first time!

Since then I have probably lucid dreamt 80% of the nights I have slept. The dreams are more detailed, more fantastic, and more numinous. I have had serial dreams, where a single storyline is continued across several dreams. My degree of control has increased, and my 'sensitivity' - for want of a better word. For example, I am able to have orgasms in my dreams, and then wake up physically undergoing orgasm. I am also able to get up and move my body around, though this requires a lot of concentration and is easily the most tiring thing ever. I have willed myself to walk across the room and pick up a football, for example, and have then woken up and found myself laying on the floor holding the ball. I have been unable to wake up on my feet yet, but I'm trying.

I say just keep persisting and it will probably work out for you. I am relatively 'unspiritual' compared to most people on this forum, and until recently have been a staunch humanist and skeptic. However, the spat of dreams I had recently (which seem to be on hold for the moment - perhaps to give me time to mull them over) have made me question pretty much everything. Not being able to wake up after what seems like hours or days of trying will do that to you!

While I'm at it, I will briefly say that I had another almost identical dream to the one I posted above, trapped in a white void (like the matrix loading program) only this time the voice said

"Passion is the feeling the beach receives when the wave crashes upon it"

Very interesting, and very beautiful.



Thanks for the tips! :)



The message I received was very clear, and bear in mind that as a complete sentence it is very powerful. When I googled the whole thing, nothing came up, so I am satisfied that its from "me", or something I have personally experienced/accessed, rather than some kinda mythological cellular-memory thing.



Thanks but I never take Christians' advice on anything. The 'origins' of my experience are within me, that much I am sure of. If you're a Christian, then why are you worried about evil spirits? Surely god is all powerful? Does he not want me to have this experience? Or is it the devil?

I dont want to sidetrack this thread, but the whole omnipotence/presence of a rival thing is really completely pointless.

Plus, any religion that would have me stone my girlfriend (a very beautiful person) to death on her father's doorstep because I wasnt the first man lucky enough to make love to her, is utterly repellent to me, and I'm not interested. I would thank you for your concern, but I dont believe its genuine. So sue me.



Well...I think I've made it clear what my view is of your Christian view, so I guess you can probably see that I REALLY dont "care to have you get stuck into me for it". Try googling "christianity + child abuse".



I literally woke up with the message resounding in my head.

Yes, some of my dreams are now lasting a couple of weeks of 'dream time', which when experienced lucidly, can be very disorienting upon waking up.



Thanks! :)

I will post more when I get the chance!



Not a moment of clarity, no, but it has made me question things. I guess when you're used to ignoring quite how much incest, rape, genocide, slavery, child abuse and human sacrifice is in your scripture, you get used to not questioning things.

Thanks also for making all those massive assumptions about me. If you look at my posting history you will see that I am not someone that is afraid to question things - I consider myself to be a healthy skeptic - and yes elements of this are upsetting, but so is closing yourself off to things!



Opinion, debate, outrage, joy - I welcome them all. :)



So forgive branjo. ;)



I'd be interested to hear what miracles thinks of the "passion/beach/waves" message, and whether it is also wholly negative in his view. And everyone else of course?



:D

Thanks everyone for your input so far!

Really interesting :)


Forgiveness is not a blanket for all to wrap themsleves in to cover all crimes - forgiveness is given only when it is humbly and genuinely requested, and it is gladly and freely ,without question, granted at that.:). I withdraw my advise to you then. All the best. Next time you ask for thoughts, please include the rider - No Christians welcome, then I wont bother wasting my breath, and no offense will be taken.

I am not trying to start an argument with you dude, I saw it one way and you saw it another, I saw positivity and you saw negativity. I would like to know, why you had an immediate distrust of his dream without resorting to google for your answer.

I googled parts of the quote, and what came up was new age indian/eastern mysticism religion. Particularly "Life is a seed"

Finally to the OP, since you are being given "new and wonderfiul insites into the unknown" best you keep it to yourself until you have all the answers then you can start your own religion and inlighten us all. I would argue that as a complete sentence, it's utterly meaningless, at best a rather nice line for a poem.

[branjo]

Wow adimon, this sounds like something I would really like to experience. I keep hearing advice to keep a dream journal by a number of people who's information resonates very well with me. I have given some of the info on lucidity.com a quick read, and it sounds pretty straight forward. Everything has reason and I think I have heard enough reasons, Im gonna give it a go. Thanks bro.

[adimon]

I withdraw my advise to you then. All the best. Next time you ask for thoughts, please include the rider - No Christians welcome, then I wont bother wasting my breath, and no offense will be taken.

That's not advice, that's preaching. And in no way constructive or positive.

best you keep it to yourself until you have all the answers then you can start your own religion and inlighten us all. I would argue that as a complete sentence, it's utterly meaningless, at best a rather nice line for a poem.

This forum is for sharing and discussion, NOT for preaching. I'm not talking about starting my own religion, I just don't want to hear about yours and I think that places me in the majority when it comes to forum members here, sorry.

Thanks for calling my thoughts meaningless. Really appreciate it :mad:

Wow adimon, this sounds like something I would really like to experience. I keep hearing advice to keep a dream journal by a number of people who's information resonates very well with me. I have given some of the info on lucidity.com a quick read, and it sounds pretty straight forward. Everything has reason and I think I have heard enough reasons, Im gonna give it a go. Thanks bro.

Good luck! Let us know how you get on! :)

[infinite tea]

Having been absent from this forum for a very long time, I am returning having undergone a series of very strange experiences in recent months.

If anyone has any thoughts on these I would be very interested in their 'take' on them.

The first thing is that I have retrained myself to have lucid dreams since around August last year, and mastered the 'art' (for want of a better term) of exploring the alternative 'realities' presented to me whilst asleep/not awake.

To cut a long story short, this first phenomena 'came to a head' when last week I had a lucid dream on three successive nights, and on each occasion was unable to 'escape' when the time came that I wanted to.

Prior to this, my lucid dreams ended either when I decided I had had enough fun and 'chose' to wake up, or the dream reached a kind of movie-style logical ending point, which prompted awakening.

For now, I will just summarise the end of the first of the three dreams, and if I get time, I will go onto the others (over the next few days if I get a chance).

After what seemed like days of 'living' in the lucid dream, mainly involving walking round a fantasy city of my own imagination, experimenting with fantastical technology which doesnt exist, and having LOTS of great sex with different women (so sue me I'm a highly-sexual guy), I entered a tunnel which eventually led into a brightly lit void, where everything was WHITE: the floor was bright white and stretched to infinity (seemingly), there was no horizon, no ceiling/sky/walls etc, no features, just white everywhere, no sound other than my own footsteps and body noises/voice.

Upon looking round the tunnel had vanished! :O

I spent perhaps an hour and a half of 'realtime' inside this void, which, as you'll see became perhaps the most emotional experience of my life.

After walking around aimlessly, failing to find any evidence of optical illusion or door, or anything which might suggest that there was any purpose or feature of this void, I sat down on the floor, a little tired and very...confused, for want of a better word.

I tried very hard to just wake up, and slapped myself around the face which sometimes works. Then I waited, literally just sitting there daydreaming, whilst presumably still actually dreaming. I waited for around an hour.

After this time, it suddenly occured to me that one thing that might explain my predicament was if if I was dead. I felt a wave of dread wash over me, and yet more confusion, and also...kinda panic I guess.

I should stipulate at this point that in my waking life I am fairly strongly skeptical, although recent events, this included, have begun to weaken my skepticism slightly.

Anyway, I became quite sad as I became more convinced by the idea that I had died in my sleep and was in some kind of limbo or whatever.

Just as I was getting very, very emotional and upset indeed (on the brink of tears - I havent cried in real life in 10 years), I heard a voice, not from distance, nor from inside my head, which said the following:

"Life is the seed, knowledge is the flower, love is the fragrance, death is the fruit."

From my remembrance of the eastern religious material I cruised in my earlier years, this to me seems like its describing reincarnation.

Before I go onto the other dreams and other experiences, what does everyone else think?

Very grateful for any input.

Hope you are all well.

Chris


Lol, this is a dream right now. Everything is just conciousness experiencing itself (a dream) Your "lucid dreams" that you cannot escape from, are just slightly less lucid than this dream you are having right now. We are One - could there be a simpler explaination of oneness than this being a dream??

[michael christopher]

Yes, some of my dreams are now lasting a couple of weeks of 'dream time', which when experienced lucidly, can be very disorienting upon waking up.

That is beautiful. I am going to train myself to do that...

Also, to everyone, a bit of advice on a certain troll in this thread - stop responding to it. Just stop. It loves the attention. Projection is when a person puts out what they want, and acts like they don't want it. Do you know what I'm saying? Keep your energy for yourself or for people better worth the effort.

[infinite tea]

That is beautiful. I am going to train myself to do that...

Also, to everyone, a bit of advice on a certain troll in this thread - stop responding to it. Just stop. It loves the attention. Projection is when a person puts out what they want, and acts like they don't want it. Do you know what I'm saying? Keep your energy for yourself or for people better worth the effort.

Hey MC,

it's all aspects of yourSelf - there are no "other" people. One means One.

[miracles]

That's not advice, that's preaching. And in no way constructive or positive.



This forum is for sharing and discussion, NOT for preaching. I'm not talking about starting my own religion, I just don't want to hear about yours and I think that places me in the majority when it comes to forum members here, sorry.

Thanks for calling my thoughts meaningless. Really appreciate it :mad:



Good luck! Let us know how you get on! :)


I was offering you my thoughts genuinely - All of a sudden Im getting the shit kicked out of me for being a christian and for preaching. Then the whole christian faith and the bible is attacked. If I'm preaching then your all preaching.

If you cant take being told something is meaningless then dont tell me my thoughts and views are meaningless. One thing I will take on board though, is I will let you get on with trying to ecape from reality and "find yourselves in a lucid dream after having shagged everything that moves in it". Careful your don't drown in your own cum.

[miracles]

Wow that IS odd.



Yeah I do. That was part of my lucid dream training. Some of them are quite unbelievable. If I find the time I might end up posting them all on here.

Oh yes please post all your dreams, I can't wait.

mate have you ever heard of the sayings "Its just a dream" and "stop dreaming" and "dream on" If your intention is to break free from the "matrix" or understand the nature of reality, then, just a thought, try waking up.

If you hadn't started with getting stuck into me for sharing my views genuinely, you wouldnt be having to cop this flak from me. You reap what you sow. That came to me when I was awake one day.

Heres an idea, why dont all you anti-christs just have a winge to the moderators suggesting that we believe in freedom of speech unless its christian and they will probably consider banning me and we will all be happy.

[size_of_light]

Adimon - get your girlfriend to write something on a piece of paper and put it on top of a bookshelf, then see if you can go there and read it correctly in your next lucid dream.

Also experiment with sticking post-it notes up around the house with your own instructions on them for what you want to do in your dreams. If you can actually see them, or even just recall that you did that while you're dreaming, it might help to focus your mind.

[branjo]

I was offering you my thoughts genuinely - All of a sudden Im getting the shit kicked out of me for being a christian and for preaching. Then the whole christian faith and the bible is attacked. If I'm preaching then your all preaching.

If you cant take being told something is meaningless then dont tell me my thoughts and views are meaningless. One thing I will take on board though, is I will let you get on with trying to ecape from reality and "find yourselves in a lucid dream after having shagged everything that moves in it". Careful your don't drown in your own cum.



I would like to know what single act of Christianity you have shown in this thread.

I would also like to know when the Bible was attacked?, I quoted the bible word for word in direct contradiction to the very person your are pretending to be.

You are not a Christian, you think I have no right to say that or I do not know you, well yes I do. I have met a ton of people like you and they have let hatred and Jealousy take over them like some sort of parasite.

Just because you may go to a building and pray does not make you a Christian. Tell us exactly what you do as a Christian?, Do you love your neighbor?, Do you respect everyone you meet no matter how abrupt they may be to you?, Do you turn the other cheek? Do you offer compassion and understanding to everyone you meet?

No you don't, you are so twisted in your beliefs that you forget or assume that no one else knows anything about religion, You are the most uninformed Christian I have ever conversed with in my entire life. And I know some awesome people who are Christians. And they don't try and ram some kind of negativity down the throats of everyone they encounter.

The world got along fine for Millions of years before Christianity was created, and here is a shocker for you, Jesus wasn't a christian, does that make sense to you? probably not. The power structure "Used" his message to suit their agendas a long time after he was gone.

Do you think if Jesus ever incarnated here again he would walk to the nearest Church and feel assured that his message was taken the right way?

The last person who should call themselves a "Spiritual Christian" is a seemingly forked tongued person like yourself. You my friend talk about forgiveness like you even understand the concept?

You said in your own special way

"Forgiveness is not a blanket for all to wrap themsleves in to cover all crimes - forgiveness is given only when it is humbly and genuinely requested, and it is gladly and freely ,without question, granted at that."

You would be 100% Wrong!

Forgiveness is a choice that a person can make in the face of every single ounce of their being telling them to take revenge on what has been done to them. That takes great self control and compassion for your fellow man. It means to take on the burden of defeat in the eyes of your peers and trust your very soul that retaliating is nothing more that satisfaction of the ego, and will ultimately end in more conflict. To forgive is to break the repetitive loop of the self serving ego.

If one day you would however like to be a Christian then on that day you will see the error of your ways. Right now you are arrogant and stubborn and you have no understanding of the Religion you claim to be a part of. If you are to embrace the Religion of Christianity then you must also be aware of what Constantine did to the perception of the Bible associated with it. The bible after the Council of Nicaea was a mere shadow of the teachings given by those who actually documented their time with Jesus and what he did or didn't say. Anything that threatened the appearance of the "PTB" of the day was quickly rejected, in favour of a more flattering view of them. So when you leap to defend a book that is not whole, you leap before you look.

I feel it has to be said that by the way you are acting and reacting, you are bringing shame to something you have no comprehension of, not one person here has directed anything at Christianity itself, just the shills who operate among it is where the blame squarely lies, if the shoe fits.

You are Jealous that someone had an experience like adimon and you are Jealous of the beauty in it, because it doesn't reflect that of your own life.
If you did as he did and even attempted a lucid dream you might find your self talking to God from within, but I think you fear the guilt on your part that would come from an experience of such magnitude, I believe you know this and are in denial about it, and maybe you saw yourself in that lonely sounding void that adimon spoke of and it scared you.

I absolutely dislike being this confrontational to anyone, and I have been warned off replying to your posts by other people in private messages from other threads stating that no matter what the subject, you will constantly remind everyone you are a Christian, maybe in the hopes that another like minded Christian will come to your aid so you can feel some sort of "Us versus Them".

I hope and I mean this sincerely, that you at least see how what you have said from your very first post came as a knee jerk reaction by a person who is clearly gripped by the negative side of reality that is so easily changed by maintaining an open mind.

However, I cannot and will not sit idly by and let you or anyone else take something that was spiritually and emotionally uplifting and poison it without out wanting to know, Why? Which btw you still have not given any reason for doing.

And before you reply and say you didn't read my post and stopped at the first line, which was a lie the first time you said it, we know it, and you know it too. Just remember one thing if nothing else, You brought all this purely upon your self

[miracles]

I would like to know what single act of Christianity you have shown in this thread.

I would also like to know when the Bible was attacked?, I quoted the bible word for word in direct contradiction to the very person your are pretending to be.

You are not a Christian, you think I have no right to say that or I do not know you, well yes I do. I have met a ton of people like you and they have let hatred and Jealousy take over them like some sort of parasite.

Just because you may go to a building and pray does not make you a Christian. Tell us exactly what you do as a Christian?, Do you love your neighbor?, Do you respect everyone you meet no matter how abrupt they may be to you?, Do you turn the other cheek? Do you offer compassion and understanding to everyone you meet?

No you don't, you are so twisted in your beliefs that you forget or assume that no one else knows anything about religion, You are the most uninformed Christian I have ever conversed with in my entire life. And I know some awesome people who are Christians. And they don't try and ram some kind of negativity down the throats of everyone they encounter.
The world got along fine for Millions of years before Christianity was created, and here is a shocker for you, Jesus wasn't a christian, does that make sense to you? probably not. The power structure "Used" his message to suit their agendas a long time after he was gone.

Do you think if Jesus ever incarnated here again he would walk to the nearest Church and feel assured that his message was taken the right way?

The last person who should call themselves a "Spiritual Christian" is a seemingly forked tongued person like yourself. You my friend talk about forgiveness like you even understand the concept?

You said in your own special way

"Forgiveness is not a blanket for all to wrap themsleves in to cover all crimes - forgiveness is given only when it is humbly and genuinely requested, and it is gladly and freely ,without question, granted at that."

You would be 100% Wrong!

Forgiveness is a choice that a person can make in the face of every single ounce of their being telling them to take revenge on what has been done to them. That takes great self control and compassion for your fellow man. It means to take on the burden of defeat in the eyes of your peers and trust your very soul that retaliating is nothing more that satisfaction of the ego, and will ultimately end in more conflict. To forgive is to break the repetitive loop of the self serving ego.

If one day you would however like to be a Christian then on that day you will see the error of your ways. Right now you are arrogant and stubborn and you have no understanding of the Religion you claim to be a part of. If you are to embrace the Religion of Christianity then you must also be aware of what Constantine did to the perception of the Bible associated with it. The bible after the Council of Nicaea was a mere shadow of the teachings given by those who actually documented their time with Jesus and what he did or didn't say. Anything that threatened the appearance of the "PTB" of the day was quickly rejected, in favour of a more flattering view of them. So when you leap to defend a book that is not whole, you leap before you look.

I feel it has to be said that by the way you are acting and reacting, you are bringing shame to something you have no comprehension of, not one person here has directed anything at Christianity itself, just the shills who operate among it is where the blame squarely lies, if the shoe fits.

You are Jealous that someone had an experience like adimon and you are Jealous of the beauty in it, because it doesn't reflect that of your own life.
If you did as he did and even attempted a lucid dream you might find your self talking to God from within, but I think you fear the guilt on your part that would come from an experience of such magnitude, I believe you know this and are in denial about it, and maybe you saw yourself in that lonely sounding void that adimon spoke of and it scared you.

I absolutely dislike being this confrontational to anyone, and I have been warned off replying to your posts by other people in private messages from other threads stating that no matter what the subject, you will constantly remind everyone you are a Christian, maybe in the hopes that another like minded Christian will come to your aid so you can feel some sort of "Us versus Them".

I hope and I mean this sincerely, that you at least see how what you have said from your very first post came as a knee jerk reaction by a person who is clearly gripped by the negative side of reality that is so easily changed by maintaining an open mind.

However, I cannot and will not sit idly by and let you or anyone else take something that was spiritually and emotionally uplifting and poison it without out wanting to know, Why? Which btw you still have not given any reason for doing.

And before you reply and say you didn't read my post and stopped at the first line, which was a lie the first time you said it, we know it, and you know it too. Just remember one thing if nothing else, You brought all this purely upon your self


Excellent now Im being castrated for not demonstrating a Christ like attitude to abuse.

Im human mate, Im not a door mat, and I dont take shit, any more than you will. You can write a book about it if you want. I dont waste my time reading it though. This thread was not poisened by me, I was scorned for offering a well mean genuine christian view point. Just because Im not a wall flower who lies down to be pissed on doenst mean I have poisened the thread. You wake up the gentle giant, your likely to get stomped on fella. There's lots of Christians in Irag figthing and dieing for your freedom while your waxing on about dreams. Keep that in mind and stop whineing.

[nectars]

There's lots of Christians in Irag figthing and dieing for your freedom

Sorry to butt into this lovely discussion, but thats utter nonsense. Give just one single reason or justification as to how their dying over there does anything for you?

Their fighting and dying for no other good reason at all but for the phantasmagorical creations of a few very misguided megalomaniacs.

[element]

Oh yes please post all your dreams, I can't wait.

mate have you ever heard of the sayings "Its just a dream" and "stop dreaming" and "dream on" If your intention is to break free from the "matrix" or understand the nature of reality, then, just a thought, try waking up.

If you hadn't started with getting stuck into me for sharing my views genuinely, you wouldnt be having to cop this flak from me. You reap what you sow. That came to me when I was awake one day.

Heres an idea, why dont all you anti-christs just have a winge to the moderators suggesting that we believe in freedom of speech unless its christian and they will probably consider banning me and we will all be happy.
Dreams can give a lot of information, and can give us more understanding of our subconsciousness. Lucid dreams can be amazing and they can be like 'miracles'. I once had a lucid dream that turned out to be a lifesaver. What's the problem anyway? Just because we don't always understand dreams, doesn't mean they're ''unreal'' or ''just a dream'' or anything. If you ever had a prophetic dream or a very important one that gave you new insights, you wouldn't have sad the things you just did.;)

[miracles]

Sorry to butt into this lovely discussion, but thats utter nonsense. Give just one single reason or justification as to how their dying over there does anything for you?

Their fighting and dying for no other good reason at all but for the phantasmagorical creations of a few very misguided megalomaniacs.

True, but they are well meaning people, many of them Christian. Thats my point, Im not saying it does anything for me. My point is stop the Christian bashing, it's boring.

[miracles]

Dreams can give a lot of information, and can give us more understanding of our subconsciousness. Lucid dreams can be amazing and they can be like 'miracles'. I once had a lucid dream that turned out to be a lifesaver. What's the problem anyway? Just because we don't always understand dreams, doesn't mean they're ''unreal'' or ''just a dream'' or anything. If you ever had a prophetic dream or a very important one that gave you new insights, you wouldn't have sad the things you just did.;)

True, I love my dreams and I often try to discover what they mean. I dont have a problem with that at all. I just have a problem with being bollocked for having an opinion.

Cheers

[darketernal]

Ladies and gentlemen, the OP of this thread is asking questions that fallinto the category of this subforum.

We have an entire religion forum for all of you to argue about and discuss the merits or failings of various religions and religion in general. This is neither a pro-Christian nor an anti-Christian thread and this debate is hijacking the OP's thread and if it continues there will be moderation actions taken. This goes for both sides of this.

[branjo]

Hey Dark,

bro this was neither a religious debate not an anti religious debate until this "Miracles" guy came in and because someone disagreed with him he started getting all defensive saying it was done out of him being a Christian which he is clearly not, He has done nothing but disrupt the thread and drag it down to his level, all he tries to do is provoke with every post and then switch it to something else. You only need to read it for yourself.

There have been numerous attempts to get back on topic but this Troll will constantly drag it back to a religious debate, He has the audacity to tarnish a Religion that most of my family is and claims he knows anything at all about it, I personally had enough of his negativity and lies and what I said needed to be said.

If I offended the OP, Adimon, I am truly sorry bro and would gladly rather just read on about others thoughts on Lucid Dreaming than participate in the thread if you so wished, your the OP so I am cool with whatever.

Miracles is constantly playing the poor little victim and using Religion as some kind of excuse for him being an annoying obnoxious person.

Quote below, you can see, him trying to muster sympathy based on a religion he is clearly not connected with, and steer the discussion into another heated confrontational debate, by mentioning Christianity and the Iraqi Invasion.

Excellent now Im being castrated for not demonstrating a Christ like attitude to abuse.

Im human mate, Im not a door mat, and I dont take shit, any more than you will. You can write a book about it if you want. I dont waste my time reading it though. This thread was not poisened by me, I was scorned for offering a well mean genuine christian view point. Just because Im not a wall flower who lies down to be pissed on doenst mean I have poisened the thread. You wake up the gentle giant, your likely to get stomped on fella. There's lots of Christians in Irag figthing and dieing for your freedom while your waxing on about dreams. Keep that in mind and stop whineing.

You clearly read that Adimon was in the Armed forces and now you are going for that angle now, trying to force him somehow into agreement with you, and again cause more disruptions among others in the thread.

If you think your being intelligent your not, we can all see right through you, your trying to drag people into anything you can to induce negativity and contempt for you, I know "what you are" pal, you are plain evil and you will try and pull on sympathy and remorse to try and manipulate your agenda. Well you won't get any of that from me.
I don't deal out sympathy or entertain the weak minds of trolls anymore.

You can say what you wish, while hiding behind the skirt of a religion. We ALL know your not a christian miracles you are here to clearly pervert the thread, and you will be ignored by me from here on in, but before I stop conversing with you, I want to tell you this from one human being to another.

"I personally forgive you for doing and saying the hurtful and disgusting things that you felt like you needed to say to be taken notice of, and I am sorry for offending you too, I hope the small part of Light within you is allowed to grow into a mighty Lantern, and may god bless you with good luck and a calm life."

So in the spirit of the beautiful message that this thread tried to develop before it went of the rails, Lucid Dreaming

Namaste

[adimon]

Branjo, your interest is appreciated. You didnt offend me at all :)

Ok, next dream...

Rather than write it all out again, I am going to post the message log from my Skype where I described it to my gf.

This is the first one that I had upon trying to get back into lucid dreaming. Happened back in August last year.

Would be interested in any feedback, especially on the symbols seen in the dream. In a few days I will post the 'sequels' to this dream - the 2 subsequent companion dreams which continue the story.

- - - - -

15:04:12] ME: I had a LUCID dream last night!
15:04:17] GF: you did
15:04:21] ME: Well, this morning actually
15:04:25] GF: i am jealous
15:04:28] ME: I didnt go to sleep until 3am
15:04:39] GF: i know smarty
15:04:44] GF: when you went to bed
15:04:56] ME: It was an incredible dream
15:05:02] GF: hey
15:05:07] GF: tall me
15:05:17] GF: tell me, don't keep me on my toes
15:05:23] ME: I thought I would give the old technique I learned a try
15:05:27] GF: the children can not wait of a long time
15:05:39] ME: I woke up at 9am and did not remember a dream
15:05:49] ME: Then did another 2 cycles and it worked
15:06:01] ME: The dream was of me in a large city
15:06:05] GF: 2 cycles a
15:06:07] GF: :O
15:06:17] ME: 1 cycle - 90mins approximately
15:06:20] GF: [17:06:10] каза: Then did another 2 cycles and it worked
15:06:52] ME: I mean that I waited another 3 hours (2x 90mins) and when I woke up, it was INSIDE the dream
15:06:59] ME: (not really woke up)
15:07:01] ME: But LUCID
15:07:30] ME: The city was kinda like a Middle-Eastern or North African city
15:07:47] ME: Where all the buildings are short, not tall, and the alleyways between them are very narrow
15:07:52] ME: Dust everywhere
15:07:56] ME: Lots of people
15:07:58] ME: Lots of noise
15:08:06] ME: I was exploring all the different zones
15:08:18] ME: I wandered in and out of strange shops
15:08:21] ME: And theaters
15:08:27] GF: and
15:08:28] ME: And arenas
15:08:48] ME: And spent lots of time in each looking at SO many interesting things I could not name them all
15:09:01] ME: Towards the end of the dream...
15:09:06] GF: were any things there
15:09:13] GF: you do not even seen before
15:09:17] ME: YES
15:09:20] ME: SO MANY
15:09:26] ME: Strange technologies
15:09:28] ME: Devices
15:09:31] GF: you do not know their names
15:09:33] ME: Fantastic shit
15:09:41] ME: Fantasy stuff
15:09:47] ME: They are not real, no names
15:09:57] GF: that is not true
15:10:11] GF: of course they are real, just on here
15:10:18] GF: on our planet
15:10:19] GF: describe at least one
15:10:28] ME: ok, that's one way of looking at it I suppose ;) :)
15:10:41] GF: that is my way, my dear
15:10:45] ME: Anyway...towards the end of the dream...I went into a very old library
15:10:54] GF: go ahead
15:10:59] ME: And as I was taking all the books off the shelves
15:11:02] GF: I am very interested
15:11:23] ME: I saw a woman sat on a settee reading a book that had light coming out of it
15:11:31] ME: That woman was you
15:11:51] GF: :O
15:11:54] GF: :O
15:12:00] ME: I was really happy to see you
15:12:08] ME: And you were very happy to see me
15:12:10] ME: We hugged
15:12:18] GF: in that kind of town, I am sure you are happy to see me

[adimon]

15:12:32] ME: And then you led me by the hand through a series of doors, passageways and out through the maze of buildings
15:12:40] ME: And led me to some sort of temple
15:12:46] ME: Mystical type place
15:12:54] ME: There were rows of stone seats
15:13:08] ME: And you made me sit at the front row, next to the aisle
15:13:32] ME: And then you went up to a stone platform, which had a hole in it, for a book to go into.
15:13:39] ME: You put your book into the hole
15:13:52] ME: and the light which was coming out of the book, started again
15:14:00] GF: so, the book had light coming out of it
15:14:03] ME: And the light went up to the ceiling, and hit a mirror ball
15:14:11] ME: Yes the book had light from the pages
15:14:33] ME: The light came down from the mirror ball in a strange pattern, like the mirror balls in real life
15:14:42] ME: And then you motioned for me to join you
15:14:46] ME: And we danced under the light
15:14:48] ME: There was music
15:14:54] ME: Of a kind I've never heard before
15:14:55] GF: what is mirror balls
15:15:00] ME: 1sec
15:15:28] GF: you have to be shitting be
15:15:35] ME: http://www.eventsconnection.com/MirrorBall.jpg
15:15:36] GF: this is a very strange dream
15:15:44] ME: I closed my eyes
15:15:48] ME: And the music went inside me
15:15:55] ME: And I could still feel you holding me
15:16:00] ME: And you put your head on my shoulder
15:16:04] ME: Then there was a white flash
15:16:07] ME: And I woke up for real
15:16:14] GF: doesn't want to open this link
15:16:29] ME: http://tbn0.google.com/images?q=tbn:0ZhHMCsTnu0iVM:http://joshammy.co.uk/mirrorball.jpg
15:16:32] ME: try that one instead
15:16:40] ME: http://joshammy.co.uk/mirrorball.jpg
15:17:04] ME: But before I even met you in this crazy library, I was exploring this strange city for 10 hours it seemed
15:17:07] ME: Very long dream
15:17:18] ME: Probably 45-60 mins of REM I would imagine
15:17:41] ME: As soon as I woke up for real, I rushed to Skype so I could tell you

[adimon]

15:18:11] GF: very strange dream
15:18:16] GF: what was in that city
15:18:22] ME: Brilliant dream
15:18:31] GF: did you right it down
15:19:19] GF: discribe at least one thing of that machines
15:19:25] ME: No, I didnt write it down, because after rushing to the PC to tell you, I got a message flashing up telling me that I had new emails...and I thought they might be from you, so I opened it, and most of it went out of my head
15:19:32] GF: the best you can
15:19:36] ME: Ok, i can remember some of the devices
15:19:51] GF: shit
15:19:58] GF: what was this city like
15:20:00] ME: You know those machines that the waitresses carry, to put your credit card in ?
15:20:04] GF: man that is a killer dream
15:20:17] GF: sliding machines
15:20:19] GF: yep
15:20:37] ME: Well, one of the devices, which was in a shop in the city...looked a bit like those
15:20:48] ME: and the storekeeper demonstrated its use for me
15:20:52] GF: what was his function or you can not tell
15:21:04] GF: what was it for
15:21:14] GF: need to pee really bad
15:21:17] GF: one sec
15:21:21] GF: keep writing
15:21:23] ME: you put blue or red crystals into the machine and it turned them into big, round, circles of something which felt like plastic
15:21:30] GF: and tell be about his city, very curious
15:21:42] ME: But these circles floated when you throw them
15:21:49] GF: holy cow, you should write all this shit
15:21:51] ME: And with your finger, you can write messages on them
15:22:03] GF: and describe me the temple
15:22:04] ME: So its like email
15:22:15] ME: But you dont know who it will go to
15:22:21] GF: and that book I was reading, going to the tw
15:22:24] GF: WC
15:22:33] ME: The red crystal is for long, long distance
15:22:53] ME: The blue crystals made plastic discs which, if you threw them, would go maybe 50m
15:23:01] ME: The red ones went 10km or something like that
15:23:15] ME: Ok, I will describe the temple, but now I need the toilet also
15:23:18] ME: Back in a min
15:28:15] GF: back
15:28:28] GF: i am reading what you wrote
15:29:02] ME: ok
15:29:34] GF: very interesting dream
15:29:34] ME: i'll let you catch up before i talk about the temple
15:29:39] GF: :O
15:29:44] GF: i am amased
15:29:49] GF: i did
15:29:53] GF: keep writing
15:30:00] GF: what was the city like
15:30:08] GF: big city, kosmopolitan city
15:30:20] GF: well developed, third country
15:30:25] ME: Big city, third world
15:30:29] ME: It never got light
15:30:33] ME: It was always dusk
15:30:52] ME: There were lots of different people there
15:30:58] GF: what were they like
15:31:23] ME: No native population, just lots of travellers, and foreigners...as if the city was a place where lots of people passed through...but nobody stayed
15:31:24] GF: i wish i have dreams like that, sounds really kinky

[adimon]

15:31:34] GF: cool
15:31:46] GF: now the temple and the book
15:32:04] GF: i am becoming MRS DEMANDING
15:32:10] ME: The temple is hard to describe..but i will try
15:32:22] ME: The outside wall was not solid
15:32:29] ME: It was like pillars in a circle
15:32:31] ME: 1sec
15:33:45] sent file "temple.jpg" to members of this chat

15:33:54] ME: i have drawn it as well as i can
15:33:56] ME: i am a bad drawer for real thinga
15:34:05] ME: things*
15:34:10] ME: there was a roof on it though
15:34:13] ME: like a dome
15:34:59] GF: looks a bit like stone hange
15:35:05] GF: just vice versa
15:35:11] sent file "temple2.jpg" to members of this chat

15:35:45] ME: from the outside pillars, there was one aisle leading to the stone with the hole for the book, and the mirrorball was above that
15:35:59] ME: either side of the aisle were rows of seats
15:36:16] ME: like stone seats at an ampitheater
15:37:15] GF: and the book
15:37:29] GF: sounds like the worlds book
15:37:32] ME: dark grey leather cover
15:37:38] GF: the book of everything
15:37:41] ME: :D
15:37:48] GF: very funny
15:37:54] ME: pretty normal. not decorated or anything
15:38:04] ME: The paper looked soft, like a Bible pages
15:38:06] GF: did you take a look of what is in it
15:38:17] ME: :D
15:38:26] ME: You wouldnt let me!
15:38:30] GF: was there a title in the front cover
15:38:52] ME: When I tried to look, is when you closed it and led me by the hand through the city to the temple
15:38:57] ME: There was no writing on the cover, no
15:39:27] GF: such a cool dream of yours
15:39:41] GF: so this one was lucid
15:39:53] ME: yes i was in control of myself
15:40:00] ME: i chose where to go in the city and what to do
15:40:03] GF: in the meaning of you can take control of what happens in it
15:40:10] ME: and eventually i found you :)
15:40:29] GF: were you looking for me
15:40:37] GF: did you know i will be there
15:40:52] GF: were there any bars and disco clubs and stuff like that
15:40:57] ME: No I wasnt looking for you
15:41:10] ME: Yes there were bars and clubs
15:41:16] GF: did you take a peak
15:41:27] GF: come on now, do not make me pull the words
15:41:43] ME: I did not know you will be there
15:41:53] ME: I was very surprised when I saw you, and very happy
15:42:12] ME: Even though it was lucid, I still knew it was you
15:42:31] ME: Because when you are lucid, you know you are dreaming, and you know its not real, even though it feels real
15:42:35] ME: like being in a film
15:42:40] ME: Did I take a peak of what?
15:42:49] GF: bars and clubs
15:43:25] ME: I stopped in a bar to talk to some people, but I dont really remember that bit. Nothing unusual happened or was said.
15:43:53] ME: Everywhere I went the music was very strange
15:43:55] ME: But very good
15:44:05] GF: :)
15:44:05] ME: I think the music is from all the stuff you have sent me
15:44:12] GF: (rofl)

[adimon]

15:44:33] GF: that is very interesting, the whole dream
15:44:39] GF: indeed
15:44:39] GF: and the book
15:44:53] ME: Da
15:45:11] GF: i wish i can do it too
15:45:11] GF: you should train yourself again to remember your dreams
15:45:34] GF: anything else you did not tell me
15:45:38] ME: Well, I remembered about 1/3 of it
15:45:55] ME: I would have remembered 2/3 if I was not distracted by email
15:46:02] ME: But yes..
15:46:22] ME: with training, I could return to the situation where I can remember all of it in very high detail
15:46:26] ME: This is where I was before
15:47:01] GF: that is so cool
15:47:29] GF: you have to tell me all about dreams in person, when you come in bg
15:47:35] GF: i will be very interested
15:47:39] ME: Ok baby
15:47:48] GF: promise not to stop you or tell you that you talk too much
15:47:50] ME: I'd be happy to
15:48:06] GF: start writing them down again
15:48:13] ME: Ok baby
15:48:25] GF: it will me helpfuk
15:48:29] GF: helpful
15:48:31] ME: (bow) Mrs Demanding ;) :D
15:48:41] GF: (bow)
15:48:45] ME: :P
15:48:48] ME: PLAYING
15:49:00] GF: i am only demanding about he dreams, nothing else
15:49:02] GF: indeed
15:49:56] GF: but this dream is really cool
15:50:04] GF: do you choose to wake up
15:50:10] GF: if you are in control
15:50:18] ME: Sometimes
15:50:31] GF: no i mean in this one
15:50:32] ME: Sometimes, like this morning...I just wake up
15:50:47] ME: But I think the dream had reached its natural end or something
15:50:55] GF: got you
15:51:02] ME: We were dancing in the light, and there was peace and music...
15:51:08] ME: just seemed like the end
15:51:24] GF: cool ending indeed

[michael christopher]

That's a pretty cool dream. I was just thinking today about how I have had random location dreams as well, or dreams where I just played around and worked out physics but that seemed to have no real meaning. I have a lot of dreams about a weird, warped Cincinnati where everything is closer together and there are more alleys and places to go - but the people are nicer (isn't too hard, Cincinnati sucks). I do random things in these dreams, but I have the recurring Cincinnati area. I also have a recurring area out in the Arizona desert, but I have never been there. In one of my Cincinnati dreams I was Spider-Man and chased around a lot of villains, it was pretty damn fun actually. I think in these dreams, we are just seeing our mirror selves, or our "soul" or spirit self. You can see someone's "mirror self" if you smoke a high dosage of salvia as well, and it can actually talk to you and say different things to you than your friend is saying. I think this realm you saw is real, at least in a spiritual sense - but that's more real than a physical sense anyway, isn't it?

It's really cool that you went through a traveler's town. I'll try to go there if I ever get that in control of my dreams, maybe we'll bump into each other. I'll say "Hi, Adimon."

You know, whether you are awake or asleep, your soul is constantly alive and doing things without you... your life was just dreamed up in the space of a few moments on the other side of reality, it come and went like a memory - but you are here experiencing it, because that's the whole point. When it's done, we will all return to our actual selves - the ones we dream about.

EDIT: I'm doing an experiment. I'll tell you what I'm doing after you answer and you'll probably think it's ridiculous, but was there a tall blonde man in your dream that said "Hello, Adimon. Twelve," and then walked away?

You will laugh when you hear what I'm doing... but I'm very curious to see if it works.

[adimon]

EDIT: I'm doing an experiment. I'll tell you what I'm doing after you answer and you'll probably think it's ridiculous, but was there a tall blonde man in your dream that said "Hello, Adimon. Twelve," and then walked away?

You will laugh when you hear what I'm doing... but I'm very curious to see if it works.

Unfortunately, I don't remember most of that particular dream. I spoke to many different people over the course of the many hours I was in The Secret City.

I'd like to say that I would probably remember someone addressing me in that name, since Adimon is only my pen name, and not my real name (Chris).

However, I'm fairly conscious-suggestible so I won't be surprised if this element now finds its way into a future dream.

Change the number, don't tell me, and we'll see what happens.

Or have I totally misunderstood your experiment? :D

[michael christopher]

No, sometimes I start having having crazy thoughts. ;)

I figured if the time-space continuum is completely permanent and that there is no such thing as linear time, if I were to say ask one of my spirit guides to go speak to you in your dream when it occurred, it wouldn't matter when I made the request since time isn't real, and it may have done it to be a confirmation to either of us.

too bad you can't remember it all! It makes sense in time-space theory and if you believe in spirit entities and things like that.

EDIT: Okay, here is my new experiment; I am sending a particular symbol into the next dream that you have and can remember enough to post about. This is my direct willful intention. If you happen to post this symbol in your dream description in some way, then I will know the experiment worked. :)

[branjo]

Have you guys ever actually flew? or even gone to different parts of the solar system or are you confined as it were to just the earth?

[michael christopher]

Have you guys ever actually flew? or even gone to different parts of the solar system or are you confined as it were to just the earth?

I have flown, being Spider-Man was pretty similar... I play a lot of games when I'm dreaming I think. I haven't gone anywhere else in the solar system. If I was in my regular mode of consciousness when I was dreaming - like I am now - the first place I would go would be another planet! But unfortunately my mind seems to be concerned with other things when I'm dreaming.

[branjo]

When I can remember vivid dreams, lucid or not I don't know as the concept wasn't in my mind I used to wake up out of it and put it down to something I had glanced at throughout the day, not exactly something I focused on but something I either payed no attenion to or I forgot to pay it attention, like "oh I'll come back to that" sort of thing. Then in my dream it pretty much revoloves around that little seemingly insignificant thing.

So (and correct me where this needs correcting), if your Lucid dream is a picture painted with the things you have seen maybe that day, would it not be possible to say read a book on a certain planet say Jupiter for instance and go there that night in a dream.

Have you tried to give yourself the lucid dream parameters before you have had it? and has this worked?

Or is it a take it as you find it sort of thing and just go with what ever presents itself.

This is a fascinating ability and I was youtubing a few people talking about it and someone left a very strangely applicable comment.
They said that since your sleeping life is a large part of your life that you caould also be learning in it.

Now to put aside the fantasy aspect of lucid dreaming which does sound quite very intriguing and pretty phenomenal, do you think with practice one could scan through a book of science for example just making sure to see the words and be aware that the text although not fully understood could be further studied from aspects of photographic memory?

Could you actually educate yourself "Academically" while in the Lucid dream?

[mane]

^^I think so. At any rate, you might process the information through your vantage in a way that opens your mind to the subject, thus you are more susceptible to the subject at hand. But more so, the processing of such information would be subjective, like if I were solving a problem it would reveal a facet that might help me realize the solution.

Dreaming changes us. From what I gather, we rewire information in relating it to particular aspects of us, and without dreaming a lot of information is lost in incoherent bits and pieces.

My dreams are consistently reflections of my thoughts of about two week periods, bringing to light areas I need to adjust in my life and reinforcing the positive directions, all with recurring themes and wild twists. Of course there are deviations from the two week periods, but two weeks is significant to my self, as it became a cycle in realization and creation.

[adimon]

So (and correct me where this needs correcting), if your Lucid dream is a picture painted with the things you have seen maybe that day, would it not be possible to say read a book on a certain planet say Jupiter for instance and go there that night in a dream.

My lucid dreams are not of this sort. My days are very boring, and spent mainly reading and writing on my PC. My dreams are absolutely fantastic (to me at least, I hope writing them here doesnt bore too many people! :P) by contrast.

Have you tried to give yourself the lucid dream parameters before you have had it? and has this worked?

I shall post the sequel dreams to "The Secret City" and you shall see how they follow on from the first.

Part Two follows straight on from the end of Part One, even though the dreams were days apart, and I did not consciously try to have a related dream.

Part Three, I did deliberately concentrate (in my last few waking moments) to continue the story, but this was a number of weeks after Part 2.

Or is it a take it as you find it sort of thing and just go with what ever presents itself.

Pretty much this is it.

This is a fascinating ability

Not sure I agree much with the choice of the word 'ability'. I think that everyone is capable of lucid dreaming from what I have read in my research. I would probably describe it as a "practise of remembering". Sorry to be pedantic :D

They said that since your sleeping life is a large part of your life that you caould also be learning in it.

I totally agree. I feel like I am learning to ask myself questions a lot more, and to create extra impetus to live my life directly, without reflection, by limiting most of my reflection to my dreams.

Now to put aside the fantasy aspect of lucid dreaming which does sound quite very intriguing and pretty phenomenal, do you think with practice one could scan through a book of science for example just making sure to see the words and be aware that the text although not fully understood could be further studied from aspects of photographic memory?

Text and small details - such as photos - are blurry and unreadable to me in my lucid dreams. I believe this is a common, if not universal phenomenon. As advised by others, this is a method I used in my training to establish that I WAS dreaming in the first place.

The 'communications disks' I found in the secret city had writing on them, and the storekeeper demonstrated one for me right in front of my 'eyes' but it was drawn with his finger rather than a pen, and the writing faded immediately after glowing briefly, like when children write their names with sparklers (fireworks). It was more like I knew that he was writing, rather than reading the words.

Could you actually educate yourself "Academically" while in the Lucid dream?

Academia is not education. And I say this as an academic! :D

[adimon]

EDIT: Okay, here is my new experiment; I am sending a particular symbol into the next dream that you have and can remember enough to post about. This is my direct willful intention. If you happen to post this symbol in your dream description in some way, then I will know the experiment worked. :)

A figure in my dream last night carried a handheld device with the symbol of a pentagram on it.

Was this your symbol?

(I sound like David Blaine - "Is this your card?")

[michael christopher]

A figure in my dream last night carried a handheld device with the symbol of a pentagram on it.

Was this your symbol?

(I sound like David Blaine - "Is this your card?")

Nah, I sent you a coin with nothing on either side of it. Guess it didn't work, unless you remember that too. :p

[adimon]

Can you please try another one without telling me what it is?

[michael christopher]

Can you please try another one without telling me what it is?

I am sending a message to your next dream. It is an entity with a message. Let me know if you get it!

[adimon]

I am sending a message to your next dream. It is an entity with a message. Let me know if you get it!

Will do :)

[branjo]

This is a really cool experiment fingers crossed it works, I hear that there are some sort of familiar things that most of the people I read about lately take as signs that they are in the dream state, like a special bird or marker that they use, like you said adimon the unreadable writing for you is one.

So do you guys have anything similar in markers, maybe thats what you could focus on to relay a message. Like a weird tree or large rock you could infact put something under or on.

There are people who can do this in thier waking life so its not out of bounds to think it could be done in the dream state either. Good luck.

[adimon]

Could you actually educate yourself "Academically" while in the Lucid dream?

I stand corrected of what I said before. Just woke from a lucid dream and was practising my Bulgarian in it. Really quite amazing :)

[branjo]

lol Awesome!

[michael christopher]

I stand corrected of what I said before. Just woke from a lucid dream and was practising my Bulgarian in it. Really quite amazing :)

Did you speak to any weird looking entities? :p

[adimon]

That's not a very nice way to describe Bulgarian people! :eek:

j/k :D

Not that I can remember. Last night's one was hard to hold onto upon waking because I was distracted by its sexual aspects :o