What does the koran have to say about Buddhism?

[infinite tea]

Any thoughts?

[lightgiver]

Any thoughts?

To respect all religions :)

http://www.yutopian.com/religion/compare/

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Buddhas_of_Bamyan

[mephibosheth]

Islam says that all those who fail to recognize and believe in One God and accept Mohammed as his prophet are kafir, and thus are doomed to hellfire. Buddhists are kafir, pure and simple, and their ways and beliefs are to be detested, especially since they do not believe that there is any 'one' god sitting in command of all creation, and their tendancy to create iconographic statues and artifacts, which is haraam in Islam, forbidden.

The Quraan tells Muslims to separate themselves from kafir so as their unbelief will not taint them, and to absolutely avoid their practices and traditions.

8)

[knightofthegrail]

Islam says that all those who fail to recognize and believe in One God and accept Mohammed as his prophet are kafir, and thus are doomed to hellfire. Buddhists are kafir, pure and simple, and their ways and beliefs are to be detested, especially since they do not believe that there is any 'one' god sitting in command of all creation, and their tendancy to create iconographic statues and artifacts, which is haraam in Islam, forbidden.

The Quraan tells Muslims to separate themselves from kafir so as their unbelief will not taint them, and to absolutely avoid their practices and traditions.

8)

The strange thing is.....Buddhism (or at least its core) promotes that all is One and has no place for idols (the point being unattachment, not worship).

I wonder how much of Buddhism, as it is practiced rather than its core, Buddha would actually recognise :rolleyes:

[size_of_light]

I wonder how much of Buddhism, as it is practiced rather than its core, Buddha would actually recognise :rolleyes:

Much of it, I feel.

[knightofthegrail]

Much of it.

There appears rather a lot of attachment in "Buddhism" as practiced today (which is probably why I am increasingly drawn towards "Taoism" instead ;) ). I dont just mean people being attached (as that is kind of expected :D) but of attachments being taught and dogmas/ritual getting caught up in.

[size_of_light]

There appears rather a lot of attachment in "Buddhism" as practiced today (which is probably why I am increasingly drawn towards "Taoism" instead ;) ). I dont just mean people being attached (as that is kind of expected :D) but of attachments being taught and dogmas/ritual getting caught up in.

What sort of 'attachments being taught' do you mean?

[eternal_spirit]

Yes but didn't Buddhism used to be war like and attack and invade other countries itself along time ago (including China)

LG posted something about this on another thread.

[size_of_light]

Yes but didn't Buddhism used to be war like and attack and invade other countries itself along time ago (including China)

LG posted something about this on another thread.

LG = lightgiver? I think I saw that...was it the other day?

Non-violence is a key tenet of Buddhism, yet people confuse acts of violence cloaked under the guise of 'Buddhism' as examples of flaws and deficiencies in the Buddhist teachings themselves.

All spiritual teachings are subject to perversion and when they're adopted as the 'official religion of the state', as happened in previous times, that outcome is inevitable to some degree, since states, by nature, are violent hierarchical institutions that need to commit acts of aggression in order to maintain themselves.

That they seek to justify their own violence by distorting teachings of peace is horrendous but understandable, even preferable, when viewed from the diseased mind of the state, which is why historical examples exist.

But to re-emphasise, mistaking such examples for a case against the Buddhist teachings themselves is misunderstanding the whole situation and assessing things back-to-front.

[knightofthegrail]

What sort of 'attachments being taught' do you mean?

100s of priests, sitting in monasteries all day, chanting into trance, lighting insense, concentrated mindfulness, banging cymbels. 10s of 1000s of self-identified "Buddhists" never reaching anything like nirvana.....all doing it as a "lifestyle choice"....

The Buddha taught non-attachment, the dissapation of the "separate self" illusion. However, like many Christians have done what with Christianity, what many Buddhists have done is create a Buddhism which bares little resemblance to what the Buddha taught and is instead all about obsession, ritual, self and attachment.

Another clear example is the whole uniformity idea (robes the same colour, heads all shaven) LMAO if that isnt attachment/aversion I dont know what is. :D

And whats with all these Buddha statues? Find me part of the earth that isnt Buddha (is a quote that applies).

No, sorry, what Buddhism has become is probably about as far from what the Buddha taught as Christianity is from Jesus :)

[size_of_light]

100s of priests, sitting in monasteries all day, chanting into trance, lighting insense, concentrated mindfulness, banging cymbels. 10s of 1000s of self-identified "Buddhists" never reaching anything like nirvana.....all doing it as a "lifestyle choice"....


These are monks who've taken monastic vows passed down from Buddha himself, who are engaging in the same practices that he taught. As for the 'self-identified' Buddhists never reaching anything like nirvana, it's better to make an earnest attempt and do the best you can in your life circumstances to make some clumsy steps in the right direction than it is to feel an affinity with the truth of the teachings but do nothing about it because you feel your environment isn't right.


The Buddha taught non-attachment, the dissapation of the "separate self" illusion. However, like many Christians have done what with Christianity, what many Buddhists have done is create a Buddhism which bares little resemblance to what the Buddha taught and is instead all about obsession, ritual, self and attachment.


I'm not familiar with any particular examples of these kinds of sanghas, but I'd be surprised if they didn't exist. However those situations would be the result of misunderstandings or perversions of the teachings by individual teachers or practitioners, and not a flaw in the teachings themselves.


Another clear example is the whole uniformity idea (robes the same colour, heads all shaven) LMAO if that isnt attachment/aversion I dont know what is. :D

Re: uniformity, robes are worn as one of the symbols of the monastic vows the monk has undertaken. I don't follow you about the attachment/aversion thing, sorry.


And whats with all these Buddha statues? Find me part of the earth that isnt Buddha (is a quote that applies).

Statues are representations of the Buddhas used as objects of veneration and places to focus the attention in order to inspire a sense of devotion and sacredness in practitioners. They're practical tools or aids in spiritual development, but ultimately when the training wheels come off they're nothing special.


No, sorry, what Buddhism has become is probably about as far from what the Buddha taught as Christianity is from Jesus :)

Maybe you're right, maybe you're not, but the good thing is that if you think that what the Buddha taught has merit, then it's still there in his own words for anyone to examine and work with. :)

[knightofthegrail]

These are monks who've taken monastic vows passed down from Buddha himself, who are engaging in the same practices that he taught.

Are they really? Or are they locked into a set of ritualistic behaviour that are about desire rather than desire undone....?

As for the 'self-identified' Buddhists never reaching anything like nirvana, it's better to make an earnest attempt and do the best you can in your life circumstances to make some clumsy steps in the right direction than it is to feel an affinity with the truth of the teachings but do nothing about it because you feel your environment isn't right.

I'm not saying "Buddhist lifestyle choice = Bad" I'm simply saying its a lonnnnng way from what Buddha taught in practice :D

I'm not familiar with any particular examples of these kinds of sanghas, but I'd be surprised if they didn't exist. However those situations would be the result of misunderstandings or perversions of the teachings by individual teachers or practitioners, and not a flaw in the teachings themselves.

Just take a look at the practices, with an open and honest eye, and note just how much is really about attachment/aversion. I find it rather hard to believe that a ritual based life is anything other than rooted in attachment...


Re: uniformity, robes are worn as one of the symbols of the monastic vows the monk has undertaken. I don't follow you about the attachment/aversion thing, sorry.

See above :)

[dreamweaver]

This is what the Taliban have to say about Buddhism:

Buddha statue in Afghanistan pre Taliban:

http://www.moonbattery.com/archives/buddha-statue-pre-taliban.jpg

The same Buddha statue in Afghanistan during Taliban rule:

http://www.moonbattery.com/archives/buddha-statue-post-taliban.jpg

What the Koran has to say about Buddhism is: convert or die. Only "People of the Book" (Christians, Jews and I think Zoroastrians) are allowed to continue practising their religion under Islamic rule - and on condition of paying a tax (jizyat) and under a whole set of conditions symbolising their inferior status (dhimmitude). All other non-believers must convert or die, be they Buddhists, pagans or atheists. Verily a religion of peace.

[size_of_light]

Are they really? Or are they locked into a set of ritualistic behaviour that are about desire rather than desire undone....?

You'd have to ask them yourself :p

'Ritual' can carry a negative connotation if that's the way you see it, but some ritualistic behaviour can be positive and freeing. Brushing your teeth in the morning springs to mind. In the same vein, the practices these guys engage in could be viewed as advanced and precise forms of mental/spiritual hygiene and purification.

If you're referring to 'desire' as in a desire to undertake these sorts of practices being a spiritual Catch-22, then I'd say that some desires at the outset are more freeing than others and that 'aspiration' might be a better word to describe it than desire, since in principle they're aspiring to free themselves from the root cause of desire itself.


I'm not saying "Buddhist lifestyle choice = Bad" I'm simply saying its a lonnnnng way from what Buddha taught in practice :D

Just take a look at the practices, with an open and honest eye, and note just how much is really about attachment/aversion. I find it rather hard to believe that a ritual based life is anything other than rooted in attachment...


As above.