The British Called: They Want Their Guns Back!

[waronyou]

The British Called: They Want Their Guns Back!
Good luck Brits but that's probably not going to happen... Americans, don't let it happen here!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yTq2NEUlhDE&eurl=http://www.dailypaul.com/&feature=player_embedded
http://ronpaulforum.info/index.php?topic=661.msg822;topicseen#msg822

[and justice for all]

The British Called: They Want Their Guns Back!
Good luck Brits but that's probably not going to happen... [...]


Yup you got that straight.

But BTW, I'm 19 seconds into the vid and I'm already pissed at two statements... "People want freedom, they want to be able to hunt"

Oh! So killing innocent animals is "freedom" for the english? Nevermind that you have no civil rights to speak of, no constitution, no clearly stated bill of rights, cameras pointing at your face in every corner, secrecy laws that buries what's really happening in your country... that's immaterial! Hunting is what freedom is all about! (WHAT???!) :eek:

Then an old clueless woman says... "Everything is going...our traditions. And this is what we're fighting for"

Traditions!!! What the hell did traditions do for you? Not to mention those "traditions" are what got you where you are now. Take a long hard look.

[mikeproteau]

so are you against people have guns?

[kblood]

so are you against people have guns?

I have to say I dont see why people need to hunt animals just for sport. Once upon a time it was about getting food for survival, now its just to tell the buddies that you shot some poor animal who didnt know what was comming, and maybe hang its head on a wall.

As for people wanting guns for self defense, get real. The rare situations were a gun would help, the gun might put everyone in all the more danger than if it wasnt in the mix. Especially if the ones trying to use these guns dont have any real experience using them. And no, hunting isnt experience, its just needless slaughter.

[tb303]

Nevermind that you have no civil rights to speak of, no constitution, no clearly stated bill of rights...


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/English_Bill_of_Rights:

Bill of Rights (or Declaration of Rights) is an act of the Parliament of England, whose formal name is An Act Declaring the Rights and Liberties of the Subject and Settling the Succession of the Crown. The Bill of Rights of the United Kingdom is largely a statement of certain rights to which citizens and permanent residents of a constitutional monarchy were thought to be entitled in the late 17th century, asserting subjects' right to petition the monarch, as well as to bear arms in defence.

Hmmm, now I wonder what happened to our guns? :rolleyes:

[bowtiedaddy]

I have to say I dont see why people need to hunt animals just for sport. Once upon a time it was about getting food for survival, now its just to tell the buddies that you shot some poor animal who didnt know what was comming, and maybe hang its head on a wall.

As for people wanting guns for self defense, get real. The rare situations were a gun would help, the gun might put everyone in all the more danger than if it wasnt in the mix. Especially if the ones trying to use these guns dont have any real experience using them. And no, hunting isnt experience, its just needless slaughter.

silliness. Having guns is a very good idea. I'd like to see someone break into a house and kill someone when the owner comes down the stairs with a loaded shotgun. You wouldn't see any mass public shootings either. They wouldn't hardly be able to take the gun out before someone took them out....let alone the fact that they would know people are armed would be that much more of a deterrent... let's not also rule out if there is some sort of invasion... the military will fight against them, but it's not like they'll be watching YOUR specific house. You would be just another statistic should someone try to kill your family.

You go out into the backwoods rural neighborhoods, where everyone is armed to the hilt, and people tend to think twice before robbing and mugging people. Criminals LOVE gun control, less opposition to get what they want.

Also, there is a reason why gun control ALWAYS comes before genocides. Must I remind you of the FEMA camps dotting the landscape of America?

What's wrong with hunting? Humans are omnivores by design. At least you know you aren't eating meat pumped full of hormones, steroids, colorants and other harmful chemicals. Plus, don't you think factory farming is a bit more inhumane than hunting? By the way: It's almost purely the rich idiots who hunt just for sport. Most hunters eat the animals they kill. At least any of the hunters I've known do.

[brainstormer]

The government want more gun crimes, so their amnesty worked in their favour; as they can now appoint more police into their force for this nanny state.

[bowtiedaddy]

The government want more gun crimes, so their amnesty worked in their favour; as they can now appoint more police into their force for this nanny state.

The only reason they want more gun crime, is to take away guns, and look like heros with the peoples' blessing in doing so.

scenario one: the UK enacts Martial Law and starts throwing people into camps (you've got a few over there too, I've heard).

Scenario outcome: . . .


scenario two: The US enacts Martial Law and starts throwing people into camps:

Scenario outcome: . . .

What do you think this will be?

[twistedconcept]

I'm all for guns as a tool of self defence. Remember, guns don't kill people, people kill people. The gun merely acts as a tool (much like a knife or any other weapon) to complete the method. The person pulling the trigger is ultimately responsible for the outcome.

I only support hunting when it's necessary (if you need to feed yourself). I don't consider killing animals a "sport".

All in all, I think that people should have the right to bear arms. It was put into America's constitution to protect them against a tyrannical government.

When they come to take me and my family to a FEMA camp, I'd rather be armed. I may go down, but I'll take a few of them with me.

[rydeon]

Yup you got that straight.

But BTW, I'm 19 seconds into the vid and I'm already pissed at two statements... "People want freedom, they want to be able to hunt"

Oh! So killing innocent animals is "freedom" for the english? Nevermind that you have no civil rights to speak of, no constitution, no clearly stated bill of rights, cameras pointing at your face in every corner, secrecy laws that buries what's really happening in your country... that's immaterial! Hunting is what freedom is all about! (WHAT???!) :eek:

Then an old clueless woman says... "Everything is going...our traditions. And this is what we're fighting for"

Traditions!!! What the hell did traditions do for you? Not to mention those "traditions" are what got you where you are now. Take a long hard look.

Traditions are what binds the English.
Hunting is a link back to our ancient past and one we need to get into again.
The Scottish and Americans are allowed to hunt, so must we!

[twistedconcept]

Traditions are what binds the English.
Hunting is a link back to our ancient past and one we need to get into again.
The Scottish and Americans are allowed to hunt, so must we!

Tradition is manufactured culture. We've been told what to eat, what to drink, what to wear, what to like, etc. It was tradition to stone/drown/hang people suspected of being involved in magic.

I can't understand why anybody would get a thrill out of killing an animal for "sporting" purposes. If you're killing for food, hunting is necessary. Otherwise, I think it's just another barbaric bloodsport.

[brainstormer]

Tradition is an odd thing, it makes us believe that following truly bizarre rituals is normal; take for example 90% of the public sheep that go out around the same time every year to buy a dying tree that someone else has chopped down and killed solely for this purpose and their profit, for you to bring into your house, hang shiny balls on, only to throw the remains of the dead tree into the street a few weeks later. Totally bizarre when you think about it, but most people don't think.

Analyse any tradition deeply enough, and you'll soon realise that almost all are verging on the ridiculous. Traditions are designed for the sheeple and their consumerism.

[goldenratio]

IMO
Hunting for pleasure is cruel and unnecessary
Hunting for food is morally preferable to buying a battery hen from the supermarket or imported beef that is pumped full of hormones with unknown provenance

Gun control (licensing) is essential as it stops irresponsible people from obtaining lethal firearms
Banning guns is wrong (and impossible)

[bowtiedaddy]

Traditions are what binds the English.
Hunting is a link back to our ancient past and one we need to get into again.
The Scottish and Americans are allowed to hunt, so must we!

Yes, especially with all of the frankenfoods out there. There is nothing wrong with hunting for that purpose. Hunting for sport is a nutty idea, but we're omnivores. We need meat, and why rely on a factory farm who poisons their meat, rather than a pure source?

[mikeproteau]

I have to say I dont see why people need to hunt animals just for sport. Once upon a time it was about getting food for survival, now its just to tell the buddies that you shot some poor animal who didnt know what was comming, and maybe hang its head on a wall.

As for people wanting guns for self defense, get real. The rare situations were a gun would help, the gun might put everyone in all the more danger than if it wasnt in the mix. Especially if the ones trying to use these guns dont have any real experience using them. And no, hunting isnt experience, its just needless slaughter.


you didnt answear my question, you want to take my guns away don't you? I don't need a reason to own a gun. Freedom means that if I enjoy shooting at a range just for fun that is a good enough reason.

[grenadene]

If anyone thinks the way to a sustainable source of fresh organic food is to blast the shit out of the local animal population they are sorely mistaken. Organise yourselves, put up some polytunnels, hammer down the doors of you locals council and demand some land to start a community farm...possibly a more practical solution :)

[duckandcover]

Every UK citizen has the right to own a shotgun and rifle, unless you`ve got a history of violence or serious crime they can`t turn you down. Join a clay-pigeon club , you can bang away all day and no animals are harmed ! Handguns are a different story though , after Dunblane and the knee-jerk reaction, the only handguns are in the hands of 15yr olds :mad:

[bvwh]

I'm shocked by how many people in that vid (and on here) seem to think that the right to own a gun has anything to do with freedoms and civil liberties. Nobody needs a gun. Plain & fucking simple, just like nobody needs to hunt foxes.

I agree that here in the uk we are losing a lot of civil liberties, as our a lot of other countries and I am of course completely against that, but gun owning does not count in my book.

As for the pro fox hunters moaning about their livelihood...here's a solution....find a job that doesnt involve the murder of other lifeforms that we happen to share this planet with.

Failing that..give the guns to the foxes ;)

[brainstormer]

I'm shocked by how many people in that vid (and on here) seem to think that the right to own a gun has anything to do with freedoms and civil liberties. Nobody needs a gun. Plain & fucking simple

Tell that to the thousands of police who carry them then.

Something is way out of balance here

[bowtiedaddy]

If anyone thinks the way to a sustainable source of fresh organic food is to blast the shit out of the local animal population they are sorely mistaken. Organise yourselves, put up some polytunnels, hammer down the doors of you locals council and demand some land to start a community farm...possibly a more practical solution :)

So, it's better to let a farmer blast away at captive animals in a barn than out in the wild? What's the difference? If anything, hunting doesn't captivate the animal for their entire lives. If one wants to be a vegetarian, fine. It's not how their body was designed, but it's their right. If someone wants to personally choose the meat that they put into their bodies, they should also have that right. The very fact that our society is completely dependent on others for 100% of our food supply is a disaster just waiting to happen. It's like putting your life 100% in someone else's hands. Is it some how morally upright to grab a pre-cut packaged steak (loaded with harmful chemicals) at the grocer and put it into a cart? How does that logic work?

I do absolutely agree that community organic farms would be a splendid idea. It is a lot more practical as a "solution". I would support a concept like this every step of the way (just so long as the government kept their slimly mitts out of it). But, what does this practical solution have to do with refusing people the right to hunt for their own food.

Beyond the hunting issue:

The simple fact is, people need the right to arm themselves so they can protect their own lives. If you ban guns, only criminals will have them. A population of sitting ducks to be robbed and raped at gunpoint by scum bags who get their arms illegally in the first place.

You can't uninvent the gun. No matter how nice it would be for guns not to exists, they do. If someone comes to your house to rob you, what are you going to do to protect yourself if you are unarmed? If someone opens fire in a shopping mall, what are you going to do to protect yourself if you are unarmed? How many people will they mow down before the police are able to arrive? How many more people will they mow down while the police try to dispel the situation? A well placed bullet would have stopped the Virginia Tech massacre within the instant of it happening. Imagine if one of the teachers at columbine had a pistol in their desk. Those two fuckers would have been history, and the body count probably wouldn't have surpassed 1 or 2 people before they got taken down. An armed population is essentially a much safer one. Imagine how many less rapes there would be. Imagine how many less property damage crimes. If a criminal/murderer were to plan a crime, do you think he would go after a victim that could blow his fucking head off within two steps past the front door, or do you think he'll go to the nice little suburban house of the "pro gun control" fanatics with his unregistered black market gun and just do/take whatever he wants? It's not like they could do anything to stop him. Maybe they could just wish him away? Maybe they could throw stones at him while he opened fire?

ANYTHING could be used as a weapon, anyway. Where does the banning of weapons and potential weapons end? Maybe they should just get it over with and literally ban everything that exists on earth. We would have to be banned as well, because we'd be killing each other with our fists if we didn't have any actual weapons around. You just can't legislate morality and civility. Either someone is a law abiding moral person, or they aren't. You can't elminate crime. In the most overbearing police states that the world has ever seen, crime was just as rampant, only people were miserable and being wrongly jailed/executed for doing nothing wrong on top of it. They should send the dangers to society away and leave the rest of the good law abiding people alone for a change.

Also:

Nobody has answered my two scenarios.

Martial Law/camps in the UK, where nobody is armed. What would be the outcome?

Martial Law/camps in the US, where literally MILLIONS are armed, and millions more have the ability to arm themselves at any time. What would be the outcome?

There is a reason why tyrants love gun control.

[bowtiedaddy]

I'm shocked by how many people in that vid (and on here) seem to think that the right to own a gun has anything to do with freedoms and civil liberties. Nobody needs a gun. Plain & fucking simple, just like nobody needs to hunt foxes.

I agree that here in the uk we are losing a lot of civil liberties, as our a lot of other countries and I am of course completely against that, but gun owning does not count in my book.

As for the pro fox hunters moaning about their livelihood...here's a solution....find a job that doesnt involve the murder of other lifeforms that we happen to share this planet with.

Failing that..give the guns to the foxes ;)

Are you nuts? Just wait till you elect another Hitler, Mao, or Stalin. You could kiss your asses goodbye. It could happen here, there, anywhere.

If you have a gun, you have leverage. Just wait till some hood comes breaking into your house with an illegal weapon, and then you can applaud the wonderful government taking away your means to protect your family.

There is NO WAY to stop people from hurting and killing each other. People would be killing each other with rocks and fists if other weapons didn't exists.

As for fox hunting. Yeah, I can completely understand why sport hunting is a bit of a sick idea. There's nothing wrong, however with hunting for your food any more than killing a plant for food is wrong. Human beings are designed as omnivores. We require a balance of both plants and meat to be optimally healthy. What's the moral difference to grabbing meat that is killed by someone else, injected with nasty shit, and packaged for your dinner plate, and cutting out the middle man, controlling 100% what you put into your body from the source. Do you object to fishing as well?

[bowtiedaddy]

Tell that to the thousands of police who carry them then.

Something is way out of balance here

exactly. Guns are leverage. The more guns the PEOPLE have, the less they could be pushed around. The government should be in constant fear that if they don't run things in the interest of the people, huge mobs of armed citizens will come marching to literally MAKE them. It shouldn't be that the people are cowering defenseless in a corner while the goose stepping cops and military kick them around and keep them in line.

Why do you think we're losing all of our freedoms folks? We just allow it all to happen. We snoozed on the job, and now we're reaping the "rewards".

Remember how the Magna Carta was signed?

[grenadene]

So, it's better to let a farmer blast away at captive animals in a barn than out in the wild? What's the difference? If anything, hunting doesn't captivate the animal for their entire lives. If one wants to be a vegetarian, fine. It's not how their body was designed, but it's their right. If someone wants to personally choose the meat that they put into their bodies, they should also have that right. The very fact that our society is completely dependent on others for 100% of our food supply is a disaster just waiting to happen. It's like putting your life 100% in someone else's hands. Is it some how morally upright to grab a pre-cut packaged steak (loaded with harmful chemicals) at the grocer and put it into a cart? How does that logic work?

I do absolutely agree that community organic farms would be a splendid idea. It is a lot more practical as a "solution". I would support a concept like this every step of the way (just so long as the government kept their slimly mitts out of it). But, what does this practical solution have to do with refusing people the right to hunt for their own food.

Beyond the hunting issue:

The simple fact is, people need the right to arm themselves so they can protect their own lives. If you ban guns, only criminals will have them. A population of sitting ducks to be robbed and raped at gunpoint by scum bags who get their arms illegally in the first place.

You can't uninvent the gun. No matter how nice it would be for guns not to exists, they do. If someone comes to your house to rob you, what are you going to do to protect yourself if you are unarmed? If someone opens fire in a shopping mall, what are you going to do to protect yourself if you are unarmed? How many people will they mow down before the police are able to arrive? How many more people will they mow down while the police try to dispel the situation? A well placed bullet would have stopped the Virginia Tech massacre within the instant of it happening. Imagine if one of the teachers at columbine had a pistol in their desk. Those two fuckers would have been history, and the body count probably wouldn't have surpassed 1 or 2 people before they got taken down. An armed population is essentially a much safer one. Imagine how many less rapes there would be. Imagine how many less property damage crimes. If a criminal/murderer were to plan a crime, do you think he would go after a victim that could blow his fucking head off within two steps past the front door, or do you think he'll go to the nice little suburban house of the "pro gun control" fanatics with his unregistered black market gun and just do/take whatever he wants? It's not like they could do anything to stop him. Maybe they could just wish him away? Maybe they could throw stones at him while he opened fire?

ANYTHING could be used as a weapon, anyway. Where does the banning of weapons and potential weapons end? Maybe they should just get it over with and literally ban everything that exists on earth. We would have to be banned as well, because we'd be killing each other with our fists if we didn't have any actual weapons around. You just can't legislate morality and civility. Either someone is a law abiding moral person, or they aren't. You can't elminate crime. In the most overbearing police states that the world has ever seen, crime was just as rampant, only people were miserable and being wrongly jailed/executed for doing nothing wrong on top of it. They should send the dangers to society away and leave the rest of the good law abiding people alone for a change.

Also:

Nobody has answered my two scenarios.

Martial Law/camps in the UK, where nobody is armed. What would be the outcome?

Martial Law/camps in the US, where literally MILLIONS are armed, and millions more have the ability to arm themselves at any time. What would be the outcome?

There is a reason why tyrants love gun control.

I feel you may have misunderstood my thoughts, so just to clarify :)

I'm all in favour of people hunting their own food, but historical evidence shows us that we hunt things to extinction so unless people were prepared to contribute to the management of wild herds supplies would soon run out. I live in the UK and the wild stocks of stuff wouldn't feed us for long if we were all out there foraging out of necessity.
The thought of my neighbourhood armed and hungry, tramping round the countryside looking for dinner :eek:

I don't suggest people turn veggie unless they want to, I'm not, I will eat wild/locally reared (naturally) meat and don't touch that muck the peddle for meat in the supermarkets. I can pluck and gut and shoot (something fairly large at close range!). Thing is though, the vast majority of people can't. So community farms and getting ourselves self-sufficient in good food is the real answer to the 'food crisis' I don't really agree that we 'need' guns to feed ourselves, apart from pig shooting.

Guns scare me and all the wrong sorts of people seems to have them, but I suppose I could kill someone with a pair of scissors if the mood took me. All sane humans could be trusted at the shooting range, I've been on shoots and its all frightfully polite, but if the shit hits the fan and tempers flare... dum dum dum .......*hides under bed* ;)

[ayomide]

Oh God - if the British say jump - I have to ask ''would you like a sugar in your tea?''

And hand them thier crumpets - with a fake colonial smile.