Is War with Islam Avoidable at all? [Archive] - David Icke's Official Forums

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arten

19-01-2009, 01:27 AM

read these and watch the clip below before giving us your solution to this crisis.

Excerpts from the Hamas Charter

"Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it."

"There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors."

Hamas In Their Own Voices - YouTube

arten

19-01-2009, 01:51 AM

What you are seeing in the video is Mossad Propaganda, the aim of which is to radicalize the whole of the Muslim world.
It could end up in WW3, that is the plan which the Mason Albert Pike wrote about in detail, that should spell big trouble for us in the UK and the end of America. According to Nostrodamus it is Islam that triumphs in this conflict, that is how Rome is destroyed.
I suppose if they are going to try and impose the one World Government and One World religion then they are going to have to do something about Islam which was created by the Vatician/Jesuits in the first place.
It may well be that the only thing stopping the elites from creating their NWO is Islam if that is the case then maybe the Muslims are Freedom fighters because those who want the NWO intend to enslave humanity and put the mark of the beast in the form of a chip on every man woman and child.

nirvana00

19-01-2009, 02:14 AM

Muslims want their own world order which is sharia law all over the world. That's because Muslims, actually believe they are right, and that their religion is the path to salvation for all. They consider their faith as more superior than the rest. Try attending some lectures by Islamic preachers and see for yourself what they have to say about other religions. For example:

Death/Capital Penalty/Punishment for Apostates/Apostasy! (Dr. Zakir Naik) - YouTube

To these people, domination is the most important. They take pride in meaningless numbers. I think many people in our movement are delusional in thinking that radical Islamists (Yes they exist) are somehow always correct or our friends in some way just because Zionists are waging a war against Islamic countries. And by the way, Muslims seem to have some land disputes with almost every religion in this world.

bim11

19-01-2009, 02:18 AM

Quote from faithfreedom.org

Quran 52:24 (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/052.qmt.html#052.024) Round about them will serve, (devoted) to them, young male servants (handsome) as Pearls well-guarded. Also in Surah 76:19 (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/076.qmt.html#076.019) Allah promises fresh youths to Muslim men. And round about them shall go youths never altering in age; when you see them you will think them to be scattered pearls. I apologize if the above picture is disturbing. It is indeed disturbing. But it would be more disturbing if no one spoke about it. When Catholic priests molest children there is a law, there is a justice that holds them accountable. The Mullahs ARE the law, justice and the government. So they can do their shameful acts in public and who is going to stop them?

Homosexuality in Islam is punishable by death but pederasty is permissible.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/176-1/mollah.jpg

size_of_light

19-01-2009, 02:20 AM

bim11

19-01-2009, 02:34 AM

Quote from faithfreedom.org

Quran Teaches Peace

9:39 (http://cwis.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/009.qmt.html#009.039), Unless ye go forth, (for Jihad) He will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place; but Him ye would not harm in the least.

Islam means peace (apparently)

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/104-1/terrorist.jpg

More Qur'an Quotes:

And fight with them until there is no fitnah (sedition, perfidy) and religion should be only for Allah 2.193 (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/002.qmt.html#002.193) All translators of the Quran have translated fitnah as oppression, tumult, persecution, etc. This shows how Muslims lie to make Islam look benign.

Peace in Islam means subduing others.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/141-1/killjews.jpg

size_of_light

19-01-2009, 02:42 AM

Fighting in Self Defence is fully acceptable in all branches of Islam.

Fighting in self defence is fully acceptable to the rest of us too.

But you need to give Muslims more credit for being thinking human beings instead of just a Borg-collective of brainless drones who'd mistake an attack or invasion of another Muslim country as a trigger to all of a sudden turn into bloodthirsty kill-bots roaming the streets in search of infidels.

Actually, you don't need to do anything, but that might help give you a better idea of the reality of things.

bim11

19-01-2009, 02:48 AM

Fighting in self defence is fully acceptable to the rest of us too.

But you need to give Muslims more credit for being thinking human beings instead of just a Borg-collective of brainless drones who'd mistake an attack or invasion of another Muslim country as a trigger to all suddenly turn into bloodthirsty kill-bots roaming the streets in search of infidels.

Actually, you don't need to do anything, but that might help give you a better idea of the reality of things.

With all those extreme exaggerations anyone would think you were a Muslim yourself.

size_of_light

19-01-2009, 02:51 AM

With all those extreme exaggerations anyone would think you were a Muslim yourself.

What difference would that make?

bim11

19-01-2009, 02:53 AM

What difference would that make?

Not a lot, however I don't agree with MOST of Islam. If anything I find it slightly disturbing.

Quotes from faithfreedom.org

You are not allowed freedom of speech, or even freedom of lifestyle.

Under Muslim Holy Way, Stoning is the punishment for homosexuality.

The condemned is wrapped in a sheet and buried up to his/her waist. The Muslim mob gather around her and throw stones at her while shouting Allah is great. Stoning is the punishment for adultery and homosexuality.

An Arab proverb says al awamo kal anam (Common people are like animals). In Islam people are treated like animals and have similar rights.

And take in your hand a green branch and beat her with It and do not break your oath; (Q.38:44 (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/038.qmt.html#038.044))

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/47-3/beatingwomen.jpg

As for those from whom ye fear rebellion, admonish them and banish them to beds apart, and beat them. Q. 4:34 (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/004.qmt.html#004.034)

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/50-2/beaten.jpg

Flogging: An Iranian boy is punished for breaching the Sharia law possibly drinking bear or a similar crime.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/52-1/flogging.jpg

Related Links:
Disturbing video of stoning (http://www.iran-e-azad.org/stoning/)
A Nigerian woman sentenced to stoning (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/2116540.stm)
Nigerian sentenced to stoning for being gay (http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200507/s1410598.htm)
New Zealand Muslim MP won't condemn stoning of homosexuals (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/story.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10334250)

A woman being prepared to be stoned to death.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/66-2/stoning2.jpg

A scene of stoning in Afghanistan

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/70-1/stoning3.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/1730-1/pics-stone-to-death-2.jpg

PayAm Amini, was hanged in public on Sunday Sep. 29, 2002. He screamed: "..we didn't kill anyone, we don't deserve to die. So many terrible crimes are committed in this country every day and yet no one is punished for it.."

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/55-2/hanged1.jpg

This is how Islam elevates Woman

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/58-2/hang4.jpg

Maiming

Qur'an 5:33 (http://cwis.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/005.qmt.html#005.033), The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides, or exile from the land: that is their disgrace in this world, and a heavy punishment is theirs in the Hereafter; [Anyone who disbeliefs in Islam and speaks against it is considered to be waging war against Allah and his messenger]

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/62-1/handcut0.jpg

The cult of domination

Unless ye go forth, (for Jihad) He will punish you with a grievous penalty, 9:39 (http://cwis.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/009.qmt.html#009.039), "I wouldn't want to create the impression that I wouldn't like the government of the United States to be Islamic sometime in the future...But I'm not going to do anything violent to promote (http://www.frontpagemag.com/Articles/ReadArticle.asp?ID=6473) that. I'm going to do it through education." - Ibrahim Hooper CAIR Spokesman. "Those who stay in America should be open to society without melting (http://www.worldnetdaily.com/news/article.asp?ARTICLE_ID=32341), keeping Mosques open so anyone can come and learn about Islam. If you choose to live here, you have a responsibility to deliver the message of Islam ... Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faiths, but to become dominant. The Koran, the Muslim book of scripture, should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on Earth." - Omar Ahmad Co-founder of the Council on American-Islamic Relations

Islam wants to dominate the UK

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/34-1/future_uk.jpg

bim11

19-01-2009, 03:00 AM

Quotes from faithfreedom.org

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/37-1/UK_muslims_taliban.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/39-1/jihadtriple.jpg

Palestinian boy dresses like a suicide bomber during a 'Land Day' demonstration in the West Bank city of Ramallah, March 30, 2001. (Osama Silwadi/Reuters). (Right)

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/515-2/suicide_bomber.jpg

The Palestine/Israel war may be over land, but the hatred of the Jews is fomented in Quran

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/517-2/bookofterro.jpg

Lynching in Islam

"Men never do evil so completely and cheerfully as when they do it from religious conviction." -Pascal

BangaliHindu

A Hindu being beaten by Muslims in a mosque in Bangladesh. He was captured outside the mosque while going home. After Friday prayers were over, the Muslims came out and grabbed the first Hindu they could. Mr. Vimal Patak a Bangladeshi born Hindu was beaten to death with sticks as the Muslim mullahs (priests) chanted "kill the Kafir!" (non-Muslim). With folded hands he begged for his life and died a brutal death.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/73-2/BangaliHindu.jpg

Palestinian crowd waves entrails of butchered Israeli victims. in Ramala. The expression on their faces show they are orgasmic. This level of hate is only possible in Islam

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/76-2/bodyparts.jpg

This level of hate is only possible in Islam

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/78-1/lynching3.jpg

A Palestinian shows his bloody hands to the ecstatic fellow Muslims after butchering a Jew.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/80-1/bloodyhands.jpg

The butchered Jew is thrown from the window.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/82-1/lynching2.jpg

Members of Hamas praise a child in "suicide bomber" costume.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/90-1/hamas.jpg

haukipesukone

19-01-2009, 03:03 AM

Is War with Islam Avoidable at all?

How can you have a war against Islam? It's like War on Terror. You can have war against Islamic countries, not against Islam. Stupid headline. It's not really a question at all. It really says: "You should be afraid of Islam and anyone and anything connected to it."

size_of_light

19-01-2009, 03:07 AM

Not a lot, however I don't agree with MOST of Islam. If anything I find it deeply disturbing.

You are not allowed freedom of speech, or even freedom of lifestyle.

Under Muslim Holy Way, Stoning is the punishment for homosexuality.

The condemned is wrapped in a sheet and buried up to his/her waist. The Muslim mob gather around her and throw stones at her while shouting Allah is great. Stoning is the punishment for adultery and homosexuality.

An Arab proverb says al awamo kal anam (Common people are like animals). In Islam people are treated like animals and have similar rights.

And take in your hand a green branch and beat her with It and do not break your oath; (Q.38:44 (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/038.qmt.html#038.044))

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/47-3/beatingwomen.jpg

As for those from whom ye fear rebellion, admonish them and banish them to beds apart, and beat them. Q. 4:34 (http://www.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/004.qmt.html#004.034)

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/50-2/beaten.jpg

Flogging: An Iranian boy is punished for breaching the Sharia law possibly drinking bear or a similar crime.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/52-1/flogging.jpg

Related Links:
Disturbing video of stoning (http://www.iran-e-azad.org/stoning/)
A Nigerian woman sentenced to stoning (http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/africa/2116540.stm)
Nigerian sentenced to stoning for being gay (http://www.abc.net.au/news/newsitems/200507/s1410598.htm) New Zealand Muslim MP won't condemn stoning of homosexuals (http://www.nzherald.co.nz/section/story.cfm?c_id=1&objectid=10334250)

A woman being prepared to be stoned to death.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/66-2/stoning2.jpg

A scene of stoning in Afghanistan

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/70-1/stoning3.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/1730-1/pics-stone-to-death-2.jpg

PayAm Amini, was hanged in public on Sunday Sep. 29, 2002. He screamed: "..we didn't kill anyone, we don't deserve to die. So many terrible crimes are committed in this country every day and yet no one is punished for it.."

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/55-2/hanged1.jpg

This is how Islam elevates Woman

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/58-2/hang4.jpg

Maiming

5:33 (http://cwis.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/005.qmt.html#005.033), The punishment of those who wage war against Allah and His Messenger, and strive with might and main for mischief through the land is: execution, or crucifixion, or the cutting off of hands and feet from opposite sides, or exile from the land: that is their disgrace in this world, and a heavy punishment is theirs in the Hereafter; [Anyone who disbeliefs in Islam and speaks against it is considered to be waging war against Allah and his messenger]

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/62-1/handcut0.jpg

Some crazy shit there, but nothing in the way of evidence to show that you could unite the entire Muslim world in a war against the West.

bim11

19-01-2009, 03:18 AM

Quotes from faithfreedom.org

Quran Teaches Peace

9:39 (http://cwis.usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/009.qmt.html#009.039), Unless ye go forth, (for Jihad) He will punish you with a grievous penalty, and put others in your place; but Him ye would not harm in the least.

Islam means peace (apparently)

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/104-1/terrorist.jpg

Mass Hysteria in Islam

After coming out of the Mosque Muslims are at their most dangerous and volatile state of mind. They are systematically filled with hate and ready to explode.

Muslims after "prayer".

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/135-1/ashura3.jpg

Thousands of Muslims marched to the church in Alexandria after Friday noon prayers at the local mosques, stabbed a nun to complain over a play that showed the abuse suffered by Christians converting to Islam.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/138-1/copt1.jpg

Parental love is instinctive both in animals and in humans. These pictures are to show the level of brainwashing that it takes to make a parent harm and mutilate his own toddler to appease his imaginary deity otherwise known as Allah or Mohammed.

Parental love is instinctive both in animals and in humans.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/123-1/giraffe_vs_muslims.jpg

An Muslim mother rejoices after inflicting wounds on the head of her toddler.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/126-1/ashura2.jpg

A father cutting his son to bleed as penitence for the killing of Imam Hussein.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/128-1/ashura1.jpg

A loving father teaching "religious values" to his son, Islamic way.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/130-1/ashura11.jpg

A proud mother watching her son bleed. The more pain the greater the reward. After this she is assured of paradise.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/132-1/ashura12.gif

size_of_light

19-01-2009, 03:24 AM

bim, I'm beginning to think you don't like Muslims. :D

bim11

19-01-2009, 03:31 AM

Quotes from faithfreedom.org

Rejoicing over the death of kufars (non Muslims)

These images depict the crude expression of how Muslims feel about the non-Muslims. How peace is possible with this much hatred? When Palestinians say end of occupation what do they mean? Click here (http://www.frontpagemag.com/media/slideshowimages/slide1.html) to start slideshow.

A man jumps to escape the burning tower on 9/11.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/156-1/9-11.jpg

Palestinians rejoice after hearing about the September 11.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/159-1/9_11_Palestinian2.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/161-1/palestinians.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/163-1/palescelebration.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/165-1/9_11_Palestinians.jpg

It is not our nationality that defines our humanity.

While many Islamists celebrated, thousands of Iranians poured into the streets to show their solidarity with the families of the victims of the terrorist attack at America. They wept bitterly. They were beaten by agents of Islamic regime and many were taken to custody. The difference between the Iranians and the Palestinians is that over 50% of Iranians do no more believe in Islam. Many of those Iranians who still are Muslims were as jubilant as the Palestinians in the above pictures. It is not our nationality that defines our humanity. It is our beliefs.

Iranians poured into the streets to show their solidarity with the families of the victims of the terrorist attack at America

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/168-1/Iranvigil0918-03.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/171-1/Iranvigil0918-10.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/173-1/Iranvigil3.jpg

haukipesukone

19-01-2009, 03:32 AM

bim, I'm beginning to think you don't like Muslims. :D

Why do you say that? I think you lack evidence to form an opinion on the matter.

bim11

19-01-2009, 03:35 AM

bim, I'm beginning to think you don't like Muslims. :D

Nope, and I'm not racist. Most Muslims are born into "Islam" and it is forced upon them and they grow up believing it to be true. I don't have a problem at all with Muslims. They are simply people - most of them unknowing and blindly following the Qur'an - the Holy Book of "Islam"

If you read my earlier posts its "Islam" that I find slightly disturbing.

haukipesukone

19-01-2009, 03:35 AM

Palestinians rejoice after hearing about the September 11.

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/159-1/9_11_Palestinian2.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/161-1/palestinians.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/163-1/palescelebration.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/165-1/9_11_Palestinians.jpg

So what? The reactions in Finland were similar when we heard about the WTC towers. The only exception was that I didn't see any machine guns being hoisted in the air.

And how do you know the pictures are due to 9/11? Maybe it's after their team won at football.

bim11

19-01-2009, 03:42 AM

Quotes from faithfreedom.org

Islam and Naziism

Similar ideologies, similar strategies. Read about Nazi Islam connection (http://www.tellthechildrenthetruth.com/)

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/184-1/naziislam.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/187-1/naziislam2.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/189-1/naziislam3.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/191-1/naziislam5.jpg

http://news.faithfreedom.org/gallery2/d/193-1/naziislam4.jpg

size_of_light

19-01-2009, 03:48 AM

octopusrex

19-01-2009, 04:03 AM

War with Islam? Who is at war with Islam? You?

What a title for a thread!

To be a muslim you need only believe 2 things (according to the last Sunni Muslim I interviewed)

1. That Mohammed is a prophet of God.
2. That there is no other God than God.

The Koran states clearly that a Muslim must not slay a Muslim (unless he is attacked).

Therefore, Muslim attacks of Muslims (whoever started) are all unlawful by the Prophet's Law.

It is not impossible for Christians, Jews and Pagans to accept that Muhammed is a prophet of God. It is quite obvious that there is only one God and it's God. Therefore, the vast majority of the world is muslim and might not know it.

Don't make naive statements about religious beleifs because they can get you killed. Instead, try and UNDERSTAND what the "fanatic" on the other side of the trenches is saying before more folks get blown up.

A Holy War is by nature a defensive war where the very religion that is threatened is in need of defending. Mexicans faught and lost a Holy War against the Catholic Church and the might of Queen Isabella. Their temples were broken up, their people were murdered... Do we really need to go there, again?

The Sufis have been trying to establish a point of reference between Islam and the rest of the world. Perhaps, instead of demonizing Islam we should start trying to figure out how to understand it.

scooby85

19-01-2009, 04:12 AM

According to Nostrodamus it is Islam that triumphs in this conflict, that is how Rome is destroyed.

I suppose if they are going to try and impose the one World Government and One World religion then they are going to have to do something about Islam which was created by the Vatician/Jesuits in the first place.

Didnt muhammad pbuh prophesise that islam will conquer rome 1100 years before nostradamus? he also prophesised that islam will one day rule the world..

And none of the abrahamic religions were created by the vatican.. i mean why in a book wud they ask all muslims (over a billion) to fight to death when fighting the enemy (vatican/illuminati) when their aim is for global control?? thats hardly going to help their cause is it...

If u look back in history its always been good v evil..

moses v pharoahs
david v goliath
muhammad v satan
jesus v satan
even today we have islam v zionism/illuminati
and in the future it will be imam mahdi and jesus v the antichrist

theres more im sure..

14april2000

19-01-2009, 04:13 AM

Here is a video of brave Muslim woman living in America. She tells about the terror that woman,minorities/Infidels and homosexules lives under in a country witch have sharia law as there basic law. She also talk about the double talk under friday prayer, there is a moderate speech when there is non muslims/Infidels guests and the iman speak in the language of there host nation and when guests are gone or on days where is no guests the iman speak in arab or other languages in direct hate speech aginst all Infidels or non muslims and there way of life.

Wafa Sultan is living in hiding, under death threats from islam. She is an inspiration for those who know how troubling the islamic core is. She is a warning to those who are still ignorant of islamic teaching.

islam: sharia law - YouTube

size_of_light

19-01-2009, 04:14 AM

moses v pharoahs
david v goliath
muhammad v satan
jesus v satan

...Hulk Hogan v King Kong Bundy.

octopusrex

19-01-2009, 04:16 AM

14april2000

19-01-2009, 04:53 AM

How the Jihadi Mayhem began with the Jihad against the Arabs (622-634 C.E. 1-8 A.H.)

This site brings you the history of the Islamic Jihad from its beginnings at Mecca in 620 C.E. up to 9/11, and the lessons it has for us in today’s challenging times. If we are to understand Islam, we need to understand the temperament of its founder Mohammad (PBUH*), the way victorious Muslims have treated the subject people, and above all the reasons for the victory of Islam.

This site is dedicated to frank and fearless reporting and commenting on the Islamic Jihad.

http://www.historyofjihad.com/

14april2000

19-01-2009, 04:58 AM

The AKP’s Agenda in Turkey: Islamization
January 14th, 2009 By: Michael van der Galien

http://www.poligazette.com/2009/01/14/the-akps-agenda-in-turkey-islamization/

Middle East Forum published a great, high quality, and well-researched article about Turkey, written by Bassam Tibi. Tibi shows that the country’s leadership, the AK Parti (or Justice and Development Party) of Prime Minister Recep Tayyip Erdogan and President Abdullah Gul may sometimes act as if it respects and even favors secularism but that it has, in fact, a clearly religious goal; the Islamization of Turkey.

Se the link below from the Middle East Forum

Islamists Approach Europe
Turkey's Islamist Danger

by Bassam Tibi
Middle East Quarterly
Winter 2009, pp. 47-54

http://www.meforum.org/article/2047

As Tibi explains, Erdogan and Gul want to bring the Islam of Anatolia - Turkey’s heartland - to the rest of the country, especially to its major cities. Istanbul, Ankara and Izmir - the three largest cities - are slowly but surely overtaken by conservative Muslims from Anatolia who live in slums, who are often uneducated, and who believe that political Islam is the answer to their problems.

Interestingly enough, the AKP is supported by both the European Union and the United States, because it acts as if it values democracy. It does not do so, however; as Tibi explains, the only reason Erdogan and Gul have embraced democracy is because they believe that they may accomplish their goal (the Islamization of Turkey) by democratic means. Not because they value democracy - they oppress the opposition, they ignore it, vocal opponents are persecuted and so on - but because they understand that they have the advantage because a large part of the Turkish electorate is uneducated, undeveloped and distinctly non-modern.

The author also explains that what Turkey truly needs is a “Europeanization of Islam.” By this he means an “enlightened” and “tolerant” Islam; an Islam most Turks - not just Turks living in Turkey but also Turkic peoples in the rest of the world - already adhere to. Turkish Islam is far more tolerant and modern than “Arab Islam,” which brings me to my only point of disagreement with Tibi: Turkish Islam has historically been quite dominant. Not ‘enlightened’ as such, because the masses were not educated, but tolerant nonetheless, and open to other influences and change. Erdogan et al. are factually reforming Islam in Turkey; they are actively trying to make it less tolerant, less open, less ‘enlightened.’ They want to make ‘Turkish Islam’ similar to the interpretation of it in most Arab countries.

Nonetheless, the article is a good read. Tibi shows what the problem with Erdogan and his AK Parti is, and why secularists in and outside of Turkey should do everything in their power to remove them from power. Europeans and Americans should stop pretending that the AKP is an ally; it is not. In essence, it is the worst leader of Turkey imaginable to the West.

Especially this part of the article is worded perfectly: “The Turkish diaspora in Europe, as well as the population in Turkey itself, is caught between Europeanization and Islamization. The European decision-makers have proven in the past to be incapable of designing policies to address challenges arising from ethnic-cultural diversification of the population. European officials neglect or simply ignore cultural issues such as the identity of Europe and Europeanization.”

So what should Europe (and the U.S.) do? Well, Tibi explains: “The proper solution for crisis-ridden Turkey is neither the tacit Islamic law of the AKP nor a coup by the Turkish secularists. Rather, the European Union and the United States should encourage the strengthening of civil society by making the weak institutions of Turkish democracy stronger. Moderate Islamists want to Islamize, not democratize.[41] They are committed to the procedure of democracy but not to its pluralistic and peaceful political culture. Political Islam in Turkey is an important issue for Europe. Turkey not only has close relations to the West, but it also has a diaspora of more than four million in the European Union.[42] While many moderate Muslims seek to Europeanize Islam, the Islamism practiced by the AKP is an ideology of cultural divide, tension, and conflict, despite all of the pro-Europe rhetoric in which Islamists in Turkey engage in their pursuit to exploit the European Union for their agenda of Islamization.”

I am again somewhat in disagreement because I wonder whether ‘full democratization’ will produce the results we long for. Liberal democracy is, as we know full well in the West, far from a perfect system; it is merely the best system humans have come up with, at least when applied to Western countries. The situation is quite different in Turkey, I am afraid. Here, secularists need to be protected against conservative Muslims, whom we often also call “Islamists” (conservatism does not mean the same in Turkey as it means in the West; it means a bigger role for - what they see as - Islam in the affairs of the state, for instance). Not only do Islamists use the power of the state to force their will on the population at large, they also use public pressure, which is highly effective in a social and even collectivist society. ‘Democratization’ may be less effective than Tibi thinks.

14april2000

19-01-2009, 05:13 AM

The True Face of Islam: Quotes from the Koran

By J. Best

O believers, take not Christians and Jews as friends,there are friends of each other.Whoso of you makes them his firends is one of them. God guides not the people of he evildoers. Yet thou seest those in whose hearts is sickness vying with one another to come to them, saying 'We fear lest aturn of fortune should smite us.' But it may be that God will bring the victory, or some commandment from Him, and then they will find themselves for that they kept secret within them, remorseful, and the believers will say, "What, are these the ones who swore by God most earnest oathss that they were with you? Their works ahve failed; now they are losers.'
------
translated from the Koran by Arthur Arberry, pg. 108-109, chapt. "the table"

How did Islam become so "great and glorious"? Islam is a religion that believes in conquering, torturing, ravishing, plundering, pillaging all infidels unless they accept upon themselves the allegiance of Islam. A conquered territory (or country) may be carnaged and looted. Ransom is not just condoned by the Koran; it is specifically stated that this is the methodology to use in warfare. Islam was spread by the sword - either become a Moslem or be killed. No better convincing argument than that! Why not check out the Koran from your local library - you might be surprized by its world outlook and encouragement of killing!

How is it with you, that you are two parties touching the hypocrites, and God has overthrown them for what they earned? What, do you desire to guide him whom God has led astray?
Whom God leads astray, thou wilt not find for him a way.

They wish that you should disbelieve as they disbelieve, and then you would be equal; therefore take not to yourselves friends of them, until they emigrate in the way of God; the, if they turn their backs, take them, and slay them wherever you find them; take not to yourselves any one of them as a friend or helper except those that betake themselves to a people who are joined wiht you by a compact, or come to you with breasts constricted from fighting with you or fighting their people.

Had God willed, He would have given them authority over you, and then certainly they would have fought you. If they with draw from you, and do not fight you, and offer you peace, God assigns not any way to you against them.

You will find others desireing to be secure from you, and secure from their people, yet whenever they are returned to temptation, they are overthrown in it. If they withdraw not from you, and offer you peace, and restrain their hands, take them, and slay them wherever you come on them/ against them we have given you a clear authority.
------
translated from the Koran by Arthur Arberry, pg. 85-86, chapt. "women"

If a people surrender to the warriors of Islam, they may be permitted to live; however, this is only as a very second class citizen with absolutely no rights. They must pay a high tribute to the ruler to continue to exist and may be dispensed of with out any recourse.

Today, Islamic nations are arming themselves with weapons of mass destruction at an alarming rate. Soon they will have nuclear weaponry. They do not want a western life-style - they prefer a closer to the earth life, void of sophisticated colleges. They can operate sophisticated weaponry! Do not be fooled into thinking that they are just a bad dream - they are vibrant in their desires to conquer the world, as is Mohammed's desire.

Fight them, till ther is no persecution and the religion is God's; then if they give over, ther shall be no enmity save for evildoers.

14april2000

19-01-2009, 05:14 AM

Sura (8:12) - "I will cast TERROR into the hearts of those who disbelieve. Therefore strike off their heads and strike off every fingertip of them"

STRIKE OFF THEIR HEADS MEANS BEHEAD !!!

Sura (47:4) - "So when you meet in battle those who disbelieve, then smite the necks until when you have overcome them, then make (them) prisoners,"

Muhammad Beheaded up to 900 Jews OF BANU QURAYZA tribe in south Arabia and the women taken as CONCUBINE.
The story of a Jewish rabbi tortured by the order of Muhammed , HIS EYES WERE PUT OUT , it is all recorded in the most AUTHORITATIVE ISLAMIC HISTORY.
THE LIFE OF MUHAMMED ,SIRAT RASUL ALLAH (recorded historical events taken place to the tribes)
by MUHAMMED BIN ISHAQ (733 AD)(he was an Arab historian)

meksar

19-01-2009, 05:25 AM

I think the whole Islamic uprising agenda could be very useful in the long run,the only way this possibility can be avoided is to clearly expose the false flag operations that were used to create fear and hatred for Muslims amongst many other things.You can be sure whatever happens in the long run the Zionist's will come out smelling like roses when they have been the main problem we have been facing.I think an attack on Iran would push a lot of people over the edge as this will be more destructive then the Iraq War,and we know that Israel wants to expand its nation by any means necessary.

14april2000

19-01-2009, 05:28 AM

At the siege of Vienna in 1683 Islam seemed poised to overrun Christian Europe. We are in a new phase of a very old war.

1400 Year Jihad Against the West
by Richard Jansen

July 28, 2008

http://gatesofvienna.blogspot.com/2008/07/1400-year-jihad-against-west.html

This is a continuation of a 1400 year jihad against the Dar al Harb, the world of the infidels, by the Dar al Islam, the world of Islam. From 633 until 1683 Islam conquered Lebanon except for Mount Lebanon, Syria, Palestine, North Africa, Mesopotamia, Persia, most of Eastern Christianity, and most of Spain. At the time of the Reformation Islamic armies had just conquered Hungary and were threatening Germany. In his book On War Against the Turk written in 1529 Martin Luther demonstrated that he had a good understanding of Islam and the threat it posed for all Christians and Christian lands. He understood that in Islamic lands Christians were not allowed to preach or confess Christ.
- - - - - - - - -
Luther in 1529 had a better understanding of the threat to the Christian West posed by Islam than many do today. Unfortunately today many in the West either fail to understand or refuse to understand that we are now involved in a continuation of a 1400 year jihad or holy war against the West that was for the most part in abeyance from 1683 when the Ottoman Empire failed to take Vienna, until the resurgence of Islamic jihad in the 20th century following the upheavals of the First World War. This blog commemorates 1683.

In order to understand the religious wars that Militant Islam has declared on the West we first must go back to the time of Mohammed and his companions in the 7th century. The suras or chapters in the Koran were transcribed first in Mecca and then in Medina. In Mecca Mohammed courted the Jews but in Medina, after they failed to accept Mohammed as their last Prophet, he turned on them. Ibn Ishaq, in the first biography about Mohammed, wrote as follows about the surrender of the Jews at B. Qurayza; “Then they surrendered, and the apostle confined them in Medina in the quarter of d. al-Harith, a woman of B. al-Najjar. Then the apostle went out to the market of Medina (which is still a market today) and dug trenches in it. Then he sent for them and struck off their heads in these trenches as they were brought to him in batches. Among them was the enemy of Allah Huyayy b. Akhtab and Ka’b b Assad their chief. There were 600 or 700 in all although some put the figure as high as 800”. This biography of Mohammed was written by a Muslim about one hundred years after Mohammed’s death.

When Mohammed died in 632 a dispute arose as to who should be the first Caliph, The Prophet had made no provision for his successor. One side favored keeping the leadership in Mohammed’s family by naming Ali, the husband of his daughter Fatima, as Caliph. The other side favored naming Abu Bakr, Mohammed’s loyal assistant, as Caliph. In the end Abu Bakr was named Caliph. Ali later became the 4th Caliph, and was killed in battle.

In a subsequent power struggle Ali’s son Husayn was killed in the Battle of Karbala. The followers of Ali and his son Husayn are known today as the Shi’a, i.e. The Party of Ali. The death of Husayn is commemorated in Karbala as the Shi’a holy day of Ashura.

Shi’a believe that Ali was the first legitimate Caliph. Those that believe that Abu Bakr and the Caliphs that immediately followed him are the first Caliphs are known as the Sunni, or the Tradition of Islam. The family line of Mohammed through Ali and Husayn became extinct in 873 when the last Shi’a Imam Mohammed al-Mahdi disappeared. The Shi’a are waiting for this twelfth Shi’a Imam to re-appear after having been hidden for over a millennium. Today 90% of Muslims in the World are Sunni and 10% are Shi’a.

The Shi’a are found mostly in Iran and Iraq. Theological differences are not large. They relate mostly to the legitimacy of the early Caliphs, the importance of the martyrdom of Ali and his son Husayn, and the concept of the “hidden Imam.” However, the rivalry between these two branches of Islam that has been waxing and waning for fourteen hundred years is becoming increasingly important in these days of asymmetric warfare and nuclear weapons.

By the time World War I began, Serbia and the rest of the Balkans had become free of Ottoman rule. When the war between Serbia and Austria started, Germany allied itself with Austria while Britain, France and Russia allied themselves with Serbia. The Ottoman Empire made a very bad choice by siding with Germany and Austria. When the war was over the victorious powers proceeded to carve up the Ottoman Empire, which already was known as “The Sick Man of Europe.”

Britain was granted Mandates over a newly created Iraq and Palestine, while France was granted Mandates over Lebanon and Syria. Britain through T.E. Lawrence apparently had promised Sharif Husayn of Mecca an Arab homeland in exchange for his help in fighting against the Ottoman Empire. However, Britain with the Balfour Declaration of 1917 had also promised the Jews a National Homeland in Palestine.

In 1919 the Emir Feisal, Sharif Husayn’s son signed an agreement with Chaim Weitzman, the head of the Zionist organization in which he agreed to recognize a Jewish state in Palestine if an Arab state under his authority as Caliph also was formed. This did not come to pass. The fact is none of the Arab states wanted this to happen. The British made Feisal King of Iraq and his brother Abdullah the Emir of Trans-Jordan, which was 80% of the Palestine Mandate, thus pretty much nullifying the 1917 Balfour promise to the Jews. Feisal and Abdullah were both eventually assassinated.

In Iran a military coup in 1921 established a military dictatorship under Reza Khan. In 1926 the Pahlavi dynasty was established with Reza Shah Pahlavi as a hereditary Shah. Egypt became independent from the British in 1922 and Fuad I became King. In 1936 he was succeeded by his son King Farouk. In Arabia Ibn Saud and his forces defeated Sharif Husayn of Mecca. In 1932 the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia was formed. The stage was now set for the religious wars of the 20th century to begin. Two interlocking lines of Islamic thought, Salafism and Wahhabism, added fuel to the smoldering fire.

Salafism and Wahhabism

After World War I there was much unhappiness and frustration within the Muslim world in the Middle East. In the late 19th and early 20th centuries, Britain established hegemony over Egypt, France over Algeria and Morocco, and Italy over Libya. Arabs became aware of their own weaknesses as the Ottoman Empire was defeated in the “great war” of 1914-1918 and carved up by the Western Powers.

Iraq and Palestine became British mandates, and Lebanon and Syria became French mandates. Attaturk saved Anatolia from dissection and established the Republic of Turkey as a secular state. He abolished the Sultanate and the Caliphate thus ending 1400 years of a Caliphate, i.e. an Islamic ruler in a direct line from the political and spiritual rule of Mohammed himself. Jews at this time were moving into Palestine, and it is a core article of belief in Islam that any land that had once been Islamic must remain so.

Western Imperialism became the scapegoat for all the problems in the Muslim world.

There came a renewed longing for the “olden days”, the time of the Prophet and his companions. Salafism provided a theological and historical grounding for this longing. Salafism is a line of thought within Islam which hails the “righteous ancestors” as those who serve as examples of how Islam should be practiced. The term “righteous ancestors” refers to Mohammed, his companions and the first three generations of Muslims. The modern version of Salafism developed in Egypt in the late 19th century. Wahhabism is another closely related movement that is named after Mohammed ibn al Wahhab who lived in the 18th century. The movement claims inspiration and theological descent from ibn Tymiyya, 1263-1328, and is the state religion of Saudi Arabia.

Both Salafism and Wahhabism claim that Islam has gone wrong and strayed from the true path over the centuries. Both advocate emulating the Islam of Mohammed and his companions. This was a confident and aggressive Islam that within one hundred years after Mohammed’s death ruled all of the Arabian peninsula, Egypt, Palestine, Syria, much of Mesopotamia and Persia. Both Salafism and Wahhabism advocate that war should be waged on all unbelievers, i.e. all non-Muslims until they have become Muslim, submitted totally and unconditionally to Islam or have been killed. Islam requires jihad, fighting on behalf of Islam, as a religious duty. Salafism and Wahhabism also discouraged many religious practices that had developed over the centuries such as praying over tombs, invoking anyone in prayer other than Allah and making drawings of human beings.

Muslim Brotherhood.

The Muslim Brotherhood was founded in Egypt as a reform movement by Hassan al Banna in 1928. Although a Sufi himself, his views were heavily influenced by Salafism and Wahhabism. His movement strongly opposed the ascendancy of secular, primarily Western ideas in the Arab and Muslim world. Al Banna wanted to see a strong move back to the supremacy of Allah in human affairs. The credo of the Muslim Brotherhood is : “Allah is our objective, the Koran is our law, the Prophet is our leader, Jihad is our way, and dying for the sake of Allah is our highest hope.” The Muslim Brotherhood is worldwide, with branches in essentially all Arab countries and in the United States as well.

Members of the Brotherhood assassinated the Egyptian Prime Minister Mahmud Fahm Nokrashi in 1948. Shortly after Al Banna himself was murdered, presumably by a government agent. In 1954 a member of the Brotherhood attempted to assassinate President Nasser. Nasser’s successor Anwar as-Sadat released from prison members of the Brotherhood and said he would implement Shariah law in Egypt. He failed to do so and, in addition, signed a peace treaty with Israel. The Brotherhood murdered Sadat in 1981.

Sayyid Qutb

In many ways Sayyid Qutb is the father of the modern jihad movement against infidels and all unbelievers, in keeping with Mohammed and the Koran. He strongly opposed Western imperialism and materialism. The immorality and corruption of the Christian West appalled him. He believed in the righteousness of God and the sinfulness of mankind. In his mind the only hope for mankind was the universal adoption of the Shariah law in all countries. Qutb opposed most Western ideas, including both capitalism and socialism, as being materialistic in nature. In his view only Muslims who followed the Koran and Islamic law were truly Muslims. All others were unbelievers and should be dealt with accordingly. For him the Shariah law was a universal law, applicable to all, and an Islamic society was the only civilized society.

The following paragraph from his book Milestones, written while he was in prison, pretty well sums up his beliefs: “It is not the intention of Islam to force its beliefs on people, but Islam is not merely beliefs. As we have pointed out, Islam is a declaration of the freedom of man from servitude to other men. Thus it strives from the beginning to abolish all those systems and governments which are based on the rule of man over men and the servitude of one human being to another. When Islam releases people from this political pressure and presents to them its spiritual message, appealing to their reason, it gives them complete freedom to accept or not to accept its beliefs. However, this freedom does not mean that they can make their desires their gods, or that they can choose to remain in the servitude of other human beings, making some men lords over others. Whatever system is to be established in the world ought to be on the authority of Allah, deriving its laws from him alone. Thus every individual is free, under the protection of this universal system to adopt any belief he wishes to adopt. This is the only way ‘the religion’ can be purified for Allah alone. The word ‘religion’ includes more than belief; ‘religion’ actually means a way of life, and in Islam this is based on belief. But in an Islamic system there is room for all kinds of people to follow their own beliefs, while obeying the laws of the country which are themselves based on the divine authority.”

Sayyid Qutb was executed by hanging August 29, 1966.

Al Qaeda

Al Qaeda, meaning in Arabic “the base”, began as a response to the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. Osama bin Laden, a wealthy Saudi businessman, was a prime financial supporter of the fledgling organization. He became radicalized after Iraqi invasion of Kuwait when American forces located in the Islamic holy ground of Saudi Arabia. The government of Saudi Arabia expelled bin Laden in 1991 and he relocated in the Sudan.

Osama bin Laden issued a fatwa, or declaration of war, first published in Al Quds Al Arabi, a London-based newspaper, in August, 1996. The fatwa was entitled “Declaration of War against the Americans Occupying the Land of the Two Holy Places.” On February 23, 1998 the World Islamic Front issued a statement entitled “Jihad against Jews and Crusaders.” This group consisted of : Shaykh Usamah Bin-Mohammed Bin-Ladin, Ayman al-Zawahiri, amir of the Jihad Group in Egypt, Abu-Yasir Rifa’i Ahmad Taha, Egyptian Islamic Group, Shaykh Mir Hamzah, secretary of the Jamiat-ul-Ulema-e-Pakistan and Fazlul Rahman, amir of the Jihad Movement in Bangladesh. This was and is a declaration of war against the West and Israel. Unfortunately the West did not start to understand until September 11, 2001. Unfortunately too many people still do not understand.

14april2000

19-01-2009, 05:50 AM

How the Vatican created Islam. The astonishing story from an ex-Jesuit priest, Alberto Rivera, which was told to him by Cardinal Bea while he was at the Vatican.

http://www.cloakanddagger.de/lenny/alberto_rivera.htm

http://www.davidicke.com/content/view/744/48/

From "The Prophet":

This information came from Alberto Rivera, former Jesuit priest after his conversion to Protestant Christianity. It is excerpted from "The Prophet," published by Chick Publications, PO Box 662, Chino CA 91708. Since its publication, after several unsuccessful attempts on his life, he died suddenly from food poisoning. His testimony should not be silenced. Dr. Rivera speaks to us still ...

"What I'm going to tell you is what I learned in secret briefings in the Vatican when I was a Jesuit priest, under oath and induction. A Jesuit cardinal named Augustine Bea showed us how desperately the Roman Catholics wanted Jerusalem at the end of the third century. Because of its religious history and its strategic location, the Holy City was considered a priceless treasure. A scheme had to be developed to make Jerusalem a Roman Catholic city.

"The great untapped source of manpower that could do this job was the children of Ishmael. The poor Arabs fell victim to one of the most clever plans ever devised by the powers of darkness. Early Christians went everywhere with the gospel setting up small churches, but they met heavy opposition. Both the Jews and the Roman government persecuted the believers in Christ to stop their spread. But the Jews rebelled against Rome, and in 70 AD, Roman armies under General Titus smashed Jerusalem and destroyed the great Jewish temple which was the heart of Jewish worship...in fulfillment of Christ's prophecy in Matthew 24:2.

"On this holy placed today where the temple once stood, the Dome of the Rock Mosque stands as Islam's second most holy place. Sweeping changes were in the wind. Corruption, apathy, greed, cruelty, perversion and rebellion were eating at the Roman Empire, and it was ready to collapse. The persecution against Christians was useless as they continued to lay down their lives for the gospel of Christ.

"The only way Satan could stop this thrust was to create a counterfeit "Christian" religion to destroy the work of God. The solution was in Rome. Their religion had come from ancient Babylon and all it needed was a face-lift. This didn't happen overnight, but began in the writings of the 'early church fathers'.

"It was through their writings that a new religion would take shape. The statue of Jupiter in Rome was eventually called St. Peter, and the statue of Venus was changed to the Virgin Mary. The site chosen for its headquarters was on one of the seven hills called 'Vaticanus', the place of the diving serpent where the Satanic temple of Janus stood.

"The great counterfeit religion was Roman Catholicism, called 'Mystery, Babylon the Great, the Mother of Harlots and Abominations of the Earth'- Revelation 17:5. She was raised up to block the gospel, slaughter the believers in Christ, establish religions, create wars and make the nations drunk with the wine of her fornication as we will see.

"Three major religions have one thing in common - each has a holy place where they look for guidance. Roman Catholicism looks to the Vatican as the Holy City. The Jews look to the wailing wall in Jerusalem, and the Muslims look to Mecca as their Holy City. Each group believes that they receive certain types of blessings for the rest of their lives for visiting their holy place. In the beginning, Arab visitors would bring gifts to the 'House of God', and the keepers of the Kaaba were gracious to all who came. Some brought their idols and, not wanting to offend these people, their idols were placed inside the sanctuary. It is said that the Jews looked upon the Kaaba as an outlying tabernacle of the Lord with veneration until it became polluted with idols.

"In a tribal contention over a well(Zamzam) the treasure of the Kaaba and the offerings that pilgrims had given were dumped down the well and it was filled with sand - it disappeared. Many years later Adb Al-Muttalib was given visions telling him where to find the well and its treasure. He became the hero of Mecca, and he was destined to become the grandfather of Muhammad. Before this time, Augustine became the bishop of North Africa and was effective in winning Arabs to Roman Catholicism, including whole tribes. It was among these Arab converts to Catholicism that the concept of looking for an Arab prophet developed.

"Muhammad's father died from illness and sons born to great Arab families in places like Mecca were sent into the desert to be suckled and weaned and spend some of their childhood with Bedouin tribes for training and to avoid the plagues in the cities.

"After his mother and grandfather also died, Muhammad was with his uncle when a Roman Catholic monk learned of his identity and said, "Take your brother's son back to his country and guard him against the Jews, for by god, if they see him and know of him that which I know, they will construe evil against him. Great things are in store for this brother's son of yours."

"The Roman Catholic monk had fanned the flames for future Jewish persecutions at the hands of the followers of Muhammad. The Vatican desperately wanted Jerusalem because of its religious significance, but was blocked by the Jews.

"Another problem was the true Christians in North Africa who preached the gospel. Roman Catholicism was growing in power, but would not tolerate opposition. Somehow the Vatican had to create a weapon to eliminate both the Jews and the true Christian believers who refused to accept Roman Catholicism. Lookng to North Africa, they saw the multitudes of Arabs as a source of manpower to do their dirty work. Some Arabs had become Roman Catholic, and could be used in reporting information to leaders in Rome. Others were used in an underground spy network to carry out Rome's master plan to control the great multitudes of Arabs who rejected Catholicism. When 'St Augustine' appeared on the scene, he knew what was going on. His monasteries served as bases to seek out and destroy Bible manuscripts owned by the true Christians.

"The Vatican wanted to create a messiah for the Arabs, someone they could raise up as a great leader, a man with charisma whom they could train, and eventually unite all the non-Catholic Arabs behind him, creating a mighty army that would ultimately capture Jerusalem for the pope. In the Vatican briefing, Cardinal Bea told us this story:

'A wealthy Arabian lady who was a faithful follower of the pope played a tremendous part in this drama. She was a widow named Khadijah. She gave her wealth to the church and retired to a convent, but was given an assignment. She was to find a brilliant young man who could be used by the Vatican to create a new religion and become the messiah for the children of Ishmael. Khadijah had a cousin named Waraquah,, who was also a very faithful Roman Catholic and the Vatican placed him in a critical role as Muhammad's advisor. He had tremendous influence on Muhammad.

'Teachers were sent to young Muhammad and he had intensive training. Muhammad studied the works of St. Augustine which prepared him for his "great calling." The Vatican had Catholic Arabs across North Africa spread the story of a great one who was about to rise up among the people and be the chosen one of their God.

'While Muhammad was being prepared, he was told that his enemies were the Jews and that the only true Christians were Roman Catholic. He was taught that others calling themselves Christians were actually wicked impostors and should be destroyed. Many Muslims believe this.

'Muhammad began receiving "divine revelations" and his wife's Catholic cousin Waraquah helped interpret them. From this came the Koran. In the fifth year of Muhammad's mission, persecution came against his followers because they refused to worship the idols in the Kaaba.

'Muhammad instructed some of them to flee to Abysinnia where Negus, the Roman Catholic king accepted them because Muhammad's views on the virgin Mary were so close to Roman Catholic doctrine. These Muslims received protection from Catholic kings because of Muhammad's revelations.

'Muhammad later conquered Mecca and the Kaaba was cleared of idols. History proves that before Islam came into existence, the Sabeans in Arabia worshiped the moon-god who was married to the sun-god. They gave birth to three goddesses who were worshipped throughout the Arab world as "Daughters of Allah" An idol excavated at Hazor in Palestine in 1950's shows Allah sitting on a throne with the crescent moon on his chest.

'Muhammad claimed he had a vision from Allah and was told, "You are the messenger of Allah." This began his career as a prophet and he received many messages. By the time Muhammad died, the religion of Islam was exploding. The nomadic Arab tribes were joining forces in the name of Allah and his prophet, Muhammad.

'Some of Muhammad's writings were placed in the Koran, others were never published. They are now in the hands of high ranking holy men (Ayatollahs) in the Islamic faith.'

"When Cardinal Bea shared with us in the Vatican, he said, these writings are guarded because they contain information that links the Vatican to the creation of Islam. Both sides have so much information on each other, that if exposed, it could create such a scandal that it would be a disaster for both religions.

"In their "holy" book, the Koran, Christ is regarded as only a prophet. If the pope was His representative on earth, then he also must be a prophet of God. This caused the followers of Muhammad to fear and respect the pope as another "holy man."

"The pope moved quickly and issued bulls granting the Arab generals permission to invade and conquer the nations of North Africa. The Vatican helped to finance the building of these massive Islamic armies in exchange for three favors:

1. Eliminate the Jews and Christians (true believers, which they called infidels).

2. Protect the Augustinian Monks and Roman Catholics.

3. Conquer Jerusalem for "His Holiness" in the Vatican.

"As time went by, the power of Islam became tremendous - Jews and true Christians were slaughtered, and Jerusalem fell into their hands. Roman Catholics were never attacked, nor were their shrines, during this time. But when the pope asked for Jerusalem, he was surprised at their denial! The Arab generals had such military success that they could not be intimidated by the pope - nothing could stand in the way of their own plan.

"Under Waraquah's direction, Muhammad wrote that Abraham offered Ishmael as a sacrifice. The Bible says that Isaac was the sacrifice, but Muhammad removed Isaac's name and inserted Ishmael's name. As a result of this and Muhammad's vision, the faithful Muslims built a mosque, the Dome of the Rock, in Ishmael's honor on the site of the Jewish temple that was destroyed in 70 AD. This made Jerusalem the 2nd most holy place in the Islam faith. How could they give such a sacred shrine to the pope without causing a revolt?

"The pope realized what they had created was out of control when he heard they were calling "His Holiness" an infidel. The Muslim generals were determined to conquer the world for Allah and now they turned toward Europe. Islamic ambassadors approached the pope and asked for papal bulls to give them permission to invade European countries.

"The Vatican was outraged; war was inevitable. Temporal power and control of the world was considered the basic right of the pope. He wouldn't think of sharing it with those whom he considered heathens.

"The pope raised up his armies and called them crusades to hold back the children of Ishmael from grabbing Catholic Europe. The crusades lasted centuries and Jerusalem slipped out of the pope's hands.

"Turkey fell and Spain and Portugal were invaded by Islamic forces. In Portugal, they called a mountain village "Fatima" in honor of Muhammad's daughter, never dreaming it would become world famous.

"Years later when the Muslim armies were poised on the islands of Sardinia and Corsica, to invade Italy, there was a serious problem. The Islamic generals realized they were too far extended. It was time for peace talks. One of the negotiators was Francis of Assisi.

"As a result, the Muslims were allowed to occupy Turkey in a "Christian" world, and the Catholics were allowed to occupy Lebanon in the Arab world. It was also agreed that the Muslims could build mosques in Catholic countries without interference as long as Roman Catholicism could flourish Arab countries.

"Cardinal Bea told us in Vatican briefings that both the Muslims and Roman Catholics agreed to block and destroy the efforts of their common enemy, Bible-believing Christianm missionaries. Through these concordats, Satan blocked the children of Ishmael from a knowledge of Scripture and the truth.

"A light control was kept on Muslims from the Ayatollah down through the Islamic priests, nuns and monks. The Vatican also engineers a campaign of hatred between the Muslim Arabs and the Jews. Before this, they had co-existed peacefully.

"The Islamic community looks on the Bible-believing missionary as a devil who brings poison to the children of Allah. This explains years of ministry in those countries with little results.

"The next plan was to control Islam. In 1910, Portugal was going Socialistic. Red flags were appearing and the Catholic Church was facing a major problem. Increasing numbers were against the church.

"The Jesuits wanted Russia involved, and the location of this vision at Fatima could play a key part in pulling Islam to the Mother Church.

"In 1917, the Virgin appeared in Fatima. "The Mother of God" was a smashing success, playing to overflow crowds. As a result, the Socialists of Portugal suffered a major defeat.

"Roman Catholics world-wide began praying for the conversion of Russia and the Jesuits invented the Novenas to Fatima which they could perform throughout North Africa, spreading good public relations to the Muslim world. The Arabs thought they were honoring the daughter of Muhammad, which is what the Jesuits wanted them to believe.

"As a result of the vision of Fatima, Pope Pius XII ordered his Nazi army to crush Russia and the Orthodox religion and make Russia Roman Catholic." A few years after he lost World war II, Pope Pius XII startled the world with his phoney dancing sun vision to keep Fatima in the news. It was great religious show biz and the world swallowed it.

"Not surprisingly, Pope Pius was the only one to see this vision. As a result, a group of followers has grown into a Blue Army world-wide, totaling millions of faithful Roman Catholics ready to die for the blessed virgin.

"But we haven't seen anything yet. The Jesuits have their Virgin Mary scheduled to appear four or five times in China, Russia, and major appearance in the U.S.

"What has this got to do with Islam? Note Bishop Sheen's
statement: "Our Lady's appearances at Fatima marked the turning point in the history of the world's 350 million Muslims. After the death of his daughter, Muhammad wrote that she "is the most holy of all women in Paradise, next to Mary."

"He believed that the Virgin Mary chose to be known as Our Lady of Fatima as a sign and a pledge that the Muslims who believe in Christ's virgin birth, will come to believe in His divinity.

"Bishop Sheen pointed out that the pilgrim virgin statues of Our Lady of Fatima were enthusiastically received by Muslims in Africa, India, and elsewhere, and that many Muslims are now coming into the Roman Catholic Church."

14april2000

19-01-2009, 06:00 AM

Did the Vatican Create Islam?

Did the Vatican Create Islam? - YouTube

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

An account of a former Jesuit priest on the teachings of the inner circle of the Catholic Church and the New World Order.

Alberto Rivera:
http://www.geocities.com/tlthe5th/alb...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alberto_...
http://www.reformation.org/jesuits.html
http://www.whale.to/b/jesuits.html

Jesuit Oath and more:
http://www.reformation.org/jesuit-oat...
http://www.reformation.org/secret.html
http://www.ianpaisley.org/article.asp...

video from:
http://www.youtube.com/user/Jossher700

14april2000

19-01-2009, 06:12 AM

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

The Catholic-Muslim relationship the Catholic creation of Islam. This topic has puzzled numerous expositors. How does Islam fit into the picture of global conflict? Is this a political, religious, or ... all » religio-political conflict?

What is its origin and what are its goals? How does it impact on ecumenism and on the doctrine of salvation in Christ? Find out in this informative video. A clear line is drawn through history, showing that the reality is more startling than the theory.

Seventh-Day-Adventist Walter J. Veith presents his thesis regarding close ties between
Rome, the Vatican, the Catholic faith and Islam. Both having their roots in Babylonian
paganism. The false-front of the rapidly growing Christian faith was simply grafted on by
Constantine in early A.D. (Ano Domini).
http://z10.invisionfree.com/The_Unhiv...
(I'm not an Adventist btw)

http://www.spirituallysmart.com/
http://www.geocities.com/tlthe5th/alb...
http://www.reformation.org/jesuits.html
http://www.reformation.org/secret.html
http://www.reformation.org/jesuit-oat...

14april2000

19-01-2009, 06:27 AM

Radical Islamofascism Quotes from the Koran - YouTube

koran Qur'an Islam is so destructive, 9 out of every 10 people employed in Saudi Arabia are imported from other countries. Islam doesn't produce much. But one thing its really good at is - Jihad. We can all look forward to it soon enough with more suicide bombings and attacks. Why? Why do they hate us? you ask so I will answer.

decode reality

19-01-2009, 07:27 AM

I think what would cause war would be if people challenged the popular notion of the religion's origin. If you dare suggest that its origins in the ancient African/Sumerian/Indus Kush world and was 'tweaked' by the Vatican, you run the risk of being called a kaffir, and worse consequences, I imagine. Who knows, that could be on the agenda, couldn't it? After all, the Protocols talk about destroying ALL religions. I'm quite sure that to challenge the veracity/originality of the Koran is too much to accept to even the most avowedly 'anti NWO' devotee to Islam. Just a thought!

drael

19-01-2009, 07:29 AM

Ireland dealt with terrorism effectively.

Basically its the same as youd treat a high school bully, you ignore them...

When they start making offers, or concessions, you listen, but in a detached way.

Eventually chasing ur own tail becomes boring..Its the animated response that keeps the energy alive..

14april2000

19-01-2009, 07:48 AM

Radical Islamofascism Exposed: Why they hate us - YouTube

Why do they hate us? It is a common question asked by many Americans and the west. Radicals hate the west not because of anything we did or didn't do. It is written in the koran quran and they are instructed by god to hate and kill us. When will we wake up and protect ourselves instead of blaming ourselves. Nuclear war is coming very soon if we don't act today.

The book of Allah (Quran) - YouTube English meaning of Quran..

Who was Mohamed - YouTube

Who was Prophet Mohamed (pbuh)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lk6VgFg-EK4&feature=related

Islam is full of hate to the jews and Christians. and then they say Islam is peaceful religion.

Can Muslims Take Jews and Christians as Friends? - YouTube

"Muslims In America: Surviving After September 11th" by Siraj Wahhaj
Purchase the full-length lecture at http://www.MeccaCentric.com or call 1-800-607-9810

A lecture that looks at the climate of fear and conditions of prejudice that has been brought upon the Muslim community as a result of September 11th. Imam Siraj Wahhaj implores the Muslim community to seize the opportunity of a willingness to dialogue in order to educate others about the truth of Islam. The Muslim community seems to be dormant and needs to wake up to the world around it. The Muslim world is under tremendous scrutiny and must understand this and live up to the Muslim name. He continues by saying that Muslims must be more than just advocates of peace; they must be examples of peace. And while we must advocate and exude peacefulness, we must also speak out against injustices. We cannot sit back and ignore injustices perpertrated against us. In conclusion, Muslims must put forth the best example in a post September 11th world so that others will see it and come to a better understanding of Islam.

Does the Quran say dont take Jews and Christians as friends? - YouTube

Does the Quran say dont take Jews and Christians as friends? Lets fiend out in this Show on TheDeenShow to learn more Visit www.TheDeenShow.com

What if I cant do Islam 100% - YouTube

Shaykh Yusuf Estes Answers a very important question on the mailbag to learn more visit www.TheDeenShow.com

Slavery Islam - YouTube

Whats Islam say about Slavery?Yusuf Estes answers the question to learn more visit www.TheDeenShow.com

Islam, Slavery and the African - By Abdullah Hakim Quick - YouTube

Abdullah Hakim Quick, an African-American convert to Islam, sheds light on the fascinating topic of Islam and the African people. From the beginning,
Africa has been a continent of various religion...

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

muslims are known for making up funny stories to make the koran believable. The funny thing is that they end up looking stupid because they don't read. The Bible says that from the Ishmaelites will come people who will go astray and worship a god that is not the real God of Abraham. God knows that muslims would claim that Arabs are from Ishmae even though they're not.I don't even know why muslims claim that Arabs are from Ishmael because they end up in more trouble. 1st, Ishmael has nothing to do with Arabs. Ishmael wasn't even an Arab since neither his father Abraham (a Hebrew) nor his mother Hagar (an Egyptian) were Arabs! Arab muslims took over Egypt by the sword and make themselves call themselves Arabs, but Egyptians are Africans, not Arabs. LOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL, funny muslims indeed!!!!!!! I don't know where they get their ideas from. To make matters worse, Ishmael didn't even marry an Arab, but an Egyptian: "While he was living in the Desert of Paran, his mother got a wife for him from Egypt." Genesis 21:21
There is also much doubt whether Muhammad was truly from the line of Ishmael, as the following sources show: http://religionresearchinstitute.org/... http://answering-islam.org/Shamoun/is... http://answering-islam.org/Shamoun/is...

Does the Quran say fight Jews and Christians Must see!!! - YouTube

Whats the Quran say about Violence towards Jews and Christians? To learn more of the truth visit www.TheDeenShow.com

Islam 4 wives? TheDeenShow - YouTube

In this Show Shaykh Yusuf Estes will answer the question
about a man being able to have more then 1 wife in Islam. To learn more visit www.TheDeenShow.com

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

Qur'an is the only religious book on the face of the earth that says 'marry only one'. The context of this phrase is the following verse from Surah Nisa of the Glorious Qur'an:
"Marry women of your choice, two, or three, or four; but if ye fear that ye shall not be able to deal justly (with them), then only one." [Al-Qur'an 4:3]
Before the Qur'an was revealed, there was no upper limit for polygyny and many men had scores of wives, some even hundreds. Islam put an upper limit of four wives. Islam gives a man permission to marry two, three or four women, only on the condition that he deals justly with them.
In the same chapter i.e. Surah Nisa verse 129 says:
"Ye are never able to be fair and just as between women...." [Al-Qur'an 4:129]
Therefore polygyny is not a rule but an exception. Many people are under the misconception that it is compulsory for a Muslim man to have more than one wife.
Broadly, Islam has five categories of Do's and Don'ts:
i. 'Fard' i.e. compulsory or obligatory
ii. 'Mustahab' i.e. recommended or encouraged
iii. 'Mubah' i.e. permissible or allowed
iv. 'Makruh' i.e. not recommended or discouraged
v. 'Haraam' i.e. prohibited or forbidden
Polygyny falls in the middle category of things that are permissible. It cannot be said that a Muslim who has two, three or four wives is a better Muslim as compared to a Muslim who has only one wife.

Can Women marry without thier parent's will - YouTube

This Video is part of a lecture on the topic "Women's Rights in Islam - Just or Unjust" followed by Question and answer session by Sister Amtul Mateen (B.Sc. Genentics) Manager of IREF women section hyderabad and she gave the answer of many question like, divorce in islam, marriege in islam, women rights in islam etc. Amtul Mateen is ready to give the lectures in and aroound or out of hyderabad on any topic and she gave many lectures in and out side of IREF(Hyderabada. India).
Tags : Video of IREF Debates of IREF Lectures of IREF Questions on Islam and Islamic Teachining

Divorce in Islam - YouTube

The logical and comparative answers on many questions like, does islam allow women to work and doesnot Islam degrades women?, Divorce in Islam etc by Sister Amtul Mateen(B.Sc Genetics) second wife of Br.Imran and Manager of IREF Women Section (more)

The laws of marriage and divorce in Islam disprove Islam!!-Sam Sahmoun - YouTube

See how Shamoun's points had been soundly debunked by brother Osama Abdulah demonstrating the abrogation of the marriage laws between the Old and New Testaments, and the contradiction that exists in the NT between Paul and Jesus. Not only that, but Paul's audience never knew what Jesus initially said since they never heard the other disciples' teachings. Therefore, Paul's teachings clearly contradicting Jesus'!
He also proved that GOD Almighty never sent fixed Revelations to all of Mankind. His social laws that He sent to the People of Israel were only limited to them and not to all of Mankind. Therefore, Islam's different laws of marriage and divorce do not in anyway disprove Islam, because again, the Bible itself abrogated itself in these laws. also see how the bible allows polygamy

questions:
1- is it normal to have a mistress ,but not normal to have a second wife!this is twisted logic

2-How come gays are approved and allowed by the church while polygamy is discarded

http://www.answering-christianity.com...

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

Maybe you're suffering under the misconception of the "Religion of Peace".

The Koran tells Muslim men that they can take non-Muslim women as "war booty". They want war because they want sex-slaves here on Earth and in Heaven.
http://usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/004.qmt...

From the earliest years of Islam to the present day, Muslims trade in non-Muslim slaves for sex.
http://wikipedia.org/wiki/Arab_slave_...
http://guardian.co.uk/uk/2004/mar/11/...

From the streets of European cities, where protesting Muslims call for war to take women as "war booty", to the Sharia Courts of Nigeria, Pakistan and Saudi Arabia, Sharia law makes convicting a man for rape impossible, because of the need for 4 male(!) witnesses after the "crime" of BEING RAPED.

This leads to massive under-reporting of rape in these countries. Muslims will point to the numbers of rapes in the USA, where rape within marriage is a crime, as is wife beating.
http://usc.edu/dept/MSA/quran/004.qmt...

Islam is a misogynistic cult and Sharia laws goes hand in hand with its societies.
http://sabbah.biz/mt/archives/2006/04...
http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/midd...
http://usc.edu/dept/MSA/fundamentals/...

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

http://www.saintbirgitta.com/

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

Rape of an Arab girl: Video which shows a man spirit of prepares for rape a girl

Kidnapping rape ISLAM looting rape of a Christian girls P 1 - YouTube

NIRMIN AIAD NASHED FROM ALMIHALA ..
Raped and changed their religion to Islam by force

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

http://www.saintbirgitta.com/

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

All About Islam and Sex

Arab Sex Education and Islam - YouTube

UAEStudents.Blogspot.com brings you short clips from a debate about Arab sex education. The public, in some moderate regions, is demanding more public sex education. Others think it should remain a family matter. For more info check out UAEStudents.Blogspot.com blog.

Child sex normal in Islam and Quran - YouTube

Sahih Bukhari Volume 7, Book 62, Number 65:
Narrated 'Aisha:
That the Prophet married her when she was SIX years old and he
consummated his marriage when she was nine years old.

Raping Women is O.K... - YouTube

a pakistani woman who was gang raped in so called "honour" p - YouTube

a pakistani woman who was gang raped in so called "honour" punishment says she fears for her safety after court overturned the convictions of five

Honor Killing - Iraqi Girl Stoned - YouTube

An Iraqi girl is stoned to death for having been seen with a boy from the wrong sect.

muslim girl Aqsa Parvez killed for not wearing hijab - YouTube

QURAN 4:34 - "Men have authority over women because God has made the one superior to the other, and because they spend their wealth to maintain them. Good women are obedient. They guard their unseen parts because God has guarded them. As for those from whom you fear disobedience, admonish them and send them to beds apart and beat them. Then if they obey you,
take no further action against them. Surely God is high, supreme."

Take off your Hijab - YouTube

Re: Take off your Hijab - YouTube

guard the freedom of ideas at all costs. Be alert that dictators have always played on the natural human tendency to blame others and to oversimplify. And don't regard yourself as a guardian of freedom unless you respect and preserve the rights of people you disagree with to free, public, unhampered expression. ~Gerard K. O'Neill, 2081

Please excuse my twitching nose and the pauses between video segments. I'm going through some kind of allergic reaction now so my nose itches terribly and I have to make frequent pauses for water.

Saudi woman protest against the wear of hijab in Saudi A - YouTube

http://blog.unmasking-islam.net/?cat=22

Saudi woman protest against the wear of hijab in Saudi Arabia

French muslim on jihad - YouTube

Bardot speaks here mind in france and well she lands in court, What happens in france comes to the USA

anthony65

19-01-2009, 08:15 AM

There are some tragic and sickening images posted on this thread, but to claim that this could only happen in Islamic countries is wrong.

Fanatics / pyscopaths of any kind, religious, nationalist, aetheist, communist, fascist, ANYTHING are capable of these kinds of barbarism.

I want to see an end to hatred and injustice. I feel sad for the victims shown here, but this thread is a crude anti-islam propaganda piece that is one-sided and destructive.

Is war with Islam avoidable at all?

Of course it fucking is! :mad:

runciter

19-01-2009, 08:28 AM

Excerpts from the Hamas Charter

"Israel will exist and will continue to exist until Islam will obliterate it, just as it obliterated others before it."

"There is no solution for the Palestinian question except through Jihad. Initiatives, proposals and international conferences are all a waste of time and vain endeavors."

it's not that easy to recognize an expansionist state with no stable borders.

i clearly remember that some time ago hamas declared it was ready to recognize israel, but only if it retired inside its pre-1967 borders... then (sad coincidence) a dozen palestinians died in a raid or something like that, and everyone forgot about it.

zionist gangsters know their stuff, and they still want all palestinian land.

grachtengordel

19-01-2009, 09:34 AM

why is this thread in 'news'?

This is NOT news, this is a torrent of israil propaganda.

So this forum becomes a portal for the most evil, outragious, incendiary propaganda that the 'mainstream' zionist media does not dare to try as it is so transparent.

looks like they can spead thier divisive poison anywhere, with impunity, from fox news to this forum. despicable

14april2000

19-01-2009, 09:51 AM

No ofcouse not it is just more or extremely commen in some islamic countrys speciale the once that has the Islamic law sharia as there basic law witch is iran,afghanistan,pakistan, saudi arabia, and sudan. Maybe other countrys to but this is the only once i know about. There also alot muslims that in force sharia or Jihad them self without from the goverment ,The muslims or radical islamists accused them for being a product of western imperialism bbut they had being irak for more when 600 years befor islam came to irak in 651AD. In Iralk befor war started in marts 2003 there was 1 mio christians but thanks to the western led nwo almost every christian are kick out there is only very few are left the once that cot not travel like the old and the very young and some others. they live is now a living hell because they are still under dayly is from threat of radical islamists.
If you would like to know how it is to live in country that has sharia law it would be europe under the Inquisition or befor the Protestant Reformation or worst. Islam mean "submission"

Christianity-suffering religion in Iraq

http://www.indiastudychannel.com/resources/31378-Christianity-suffering-religion-Iraq.aspx

Christian Assyrian Heritage of Iraq Before Islam

http://www.christiansofiraq.com/Karbala.html

Christian Assyrian Heritage of Iraq Before Islam

http://www.christiansofiraq.com/Karbel.html

Islam

Islam - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

1. the Medieval Inquisition (1184- 1230s)
2. the Spanish Inquisition (1478-1834)
3. the Portuguese Inquisition (1536-1821)
4. the Roman Inquisition (1542- ~1860 )

Inquisition - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Counter-Reformation

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Counter-Reformation

Reformation: The Counter-Reformation

http://www.wsu.edu/~dee/REFORM/COUNTER.HTM

Galileo Galilei

Galileo Galilei - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Galileo Galilei (15 February 1564[2] – 8 January 1642) was a Tuscan physicist, mathematician, astronomer, and philosopher who played a major role in the Scientific Revolution. His achievements include improvements to the telescope and consequent astronomical observations, and support for Copernicanism. Galileo has been called the "father of modern observational astronomy",the "father of modern physics",the "father of science", and "the Father of Modern Science. The motion of uniformly accelerated objects, taught in nearly all high school and introductory college physics courses, was studied by Galileo as the subject of kinematics. His contributions to observational astronomy include the telescopic confirmation of the phases of Venus, the discovery of the four largest satellites of Jupiter, named the Galilean moons in his honour, and the observation and analysis of sunspots. Galileo also worked in applied science and technology, improving compass design.

Galileo's championing of Copernicanism was controversial within his lifetime. The geocentric view had been dominant since the time of Aristotle, and the controversy engendered by Galileo's presentation of heliocentrism as proven fact resulted in the Catholic Church's prohibiting its advocacy as empirically proven fact, because it was not empirically proven at the time and was contrary to the literal meaning of Scripture. Galileo was eventually forced to recant his heliocentrism and spent the last years of his life under house arrest on orders of the Roman Inquisition.

http://www.cs.rutgers.edu/pub/soc.religion.christian/faq/galileo

Galileo and the Church

By Julian A. Smith

November, 1992

On October 31 of this year, the Roman Catholic Church finally admitted
that it had erred in its 359-year-old persecution of the 17th century
astronomer and physicist Galileo Galilei (1564-1642). The announcement was
made by Pope John Paul II at a meeting of the Vatican's Pontifical Academy
of Sciences in Rome. The Pope said that "the underlying problems of this
case concern both the nature of science and the nature of faith...one day
we may find ourselves in a similar situation, which will require both sides
to have an informed awareness of the field and the limits of their own
competencies."
The question of "informed awareness" is an important one. Little has
been shown so far by the media. Scarcely the ink was dry on the so-called
acquital when magazines and newspapers began airing their surprise at this
apparent anachronism. The Toronto Star said, "It's official: the Earth
revolves around the Sun, even for the Vatican." Others were less
charitable: the headline in one campus newspaper read "Galileo Acquited:
Earth actually round, says Pope." Humour writers began to poke fun at the
apparent foolishness of a 13-year-long Papal commission of learned
theologians, scientists and historians, whose immense labours had brought
forward an all too obvious result. Why did they take so long to establish
something this simple? And how did the Roman Catholic Church get stuck in
this embarrassing situation in the first place?
To find out, we have to look back some four centuries. History is almost
never "cut and dried", and a more detailed examination will always reveal
complications in an otherwise pretty, romantic story. The image of a
heroic scientist like Galileo, battling fearlessly for truth, all alone
against a powerful, corrupt and ignorant religious institution, has been
carefully cultivated in generations of history books...but the facts reveal
a somewhat different picture.
Galileo developed his theories at a time of great intellectual ferment.
In the realm of faith, Protestant reformers like Martin Luther (1483-1546)
and Jean Calvin (1509-1564) were undermining Catholic tradition and
authority, and arguing for a much more literal interpretation of the Holy
Scriptures. And in the realm of science, astronomers were wrestling with
the difficult question of whether to retain Claudius Ptolemy's (c.100-c.170
AD) ancient "geocentric" universe, which had all the planets circling the
Earth, or adopt the new "heliocentric" system of Nicolaus Copernicus(1473-
1543), where planets and Earth circled the Sun. How did one choose between
them?
Surprising as it may seem to the modern reader, in the 16th century there
was no observational test or proof available for either of the two
theories. Both were mathematically complex, both used uniform circular
motion and a combination of deferents and epicycles to represent the
planets, and both gave tolerably good predictions for planetary positions.
A scientist could reasonably hold either theory "in good faith", and a
decision between them could not be made on scientific grounds alone; so it
is not so unusual that people looked to revelation and faith to bridge the
gap.
So what did their faith tell them? The Catholic Church supported a
largely Aristotelian physical world view, skilfully woven into Christian
theology by St. Thomas Aquinas (1225-1274). In it, Man had a privileged
position as lord of a fixed, motionless and spherical Earth at the center
of the Universe. Surprisingly enough, scientists had always thought the
Earth to be round, even back into Ancient Greek times; in fact, one Greek
mathematician named Erastosthenes even accurately calculated its diameter!
It is false to say the Catholic Church of Galileo's day expected Galileo to
believe in a flat earth; it was its motion that was problematic. The Bible
promised the faithful that "God fixed the Earth upon its foundation, not to
be moved forever"; also, there were a lot of "common sense" reasons to keep
the Earth motionless. If the Earth moved, wouldn't the air be left behind
in space? And wouldn't the Earth be shaken apart, and objects thrown
upwards not come back down again?
It is in this environment that Galileo began his work. Like all other
late 16th century figures, Galileo too was torn at first over whether to
embrace Copernicus or hang on to Ptolemy. Oddly enough, Copernicus'
densely mathematical Latin book, On the Revolutions of the Celestial
Spheres, had never really attracted much interest from Roman Catholics;
earlier Medieval philosophers like Nicholas Oresme (c.1325-1382) and
Nicholas of Cusa (1401-1464) had already suggested a moving Earth, and
Catholics were used to interpreting Scripture allegorically. So what else
is new? It was the Protestants, particularly Lutherans, who saw that
Copernicus' moving Earth was fatal to their cherished literal
interpretation of the Bible: "This fool [Copernicus]," wrote Luther in his
Table Talk, "will turn the whole science of astronomy upside-down!"
Meanwhile, Lutheran Andreas Osiander (1498-1552) had written a preface to
Copernicus' book, reassuring readers it was all just a "mathematical
exercise", and did not need to be taken literally. So again, much to the
modern readers' surprise, in the 16th century the Catholic Church was more
progressive and tolerant than its rivals on this question!
Galileo was probably quickly convinced by Copernicus, but he wisely kept
quiet about it...until 1610. In that year, he made a telescope and found
that the heavens were not at all perfect like the Ancients said; the Sun
had spots, the Moon had mountains, Jupiter had satellites, and Venus showed
phases. These were all arguments against the old astronomy, but they were
not proofs that Copernicus was right. But by 1613, Galileo had "gone
public" with his beliefs in his Letters on Sunspots, and two years later he
was telling his readers to separate science and religion, suggesting
reason, experiment and mathematics were needed for the first, but faith and
revelation were required for the second.
It was here that Galileo began to get into trouble with the Church.
Galileo visited Rome in 1615 to find out if he could teach Copernicus; and
after a lengthy commission, Pope Paul V (1552-1621) said no, largely to
avoid Protestant criticisms that the Catholic Church was "not Biblical
enough". So Paul told Galileo to abandon "the holding or defending of that
view." Galileo returned to Florence, where he decided to write a dialogue
which would give both sides equal time; in the Dialogue Concerning the Two
Chief World Systems, Salviati would be the clever Copernican, Sagredo would
be the interested layman, and Simplicius would be the foolish Aristotelian.
Galileo wouldn't take sides, so he would be safe.
Or would he? Galileo didn't know that back in Rome, someone had secretly
added an extra page to the Vatican records, telling Galileo he could not
discuss the forbidden doctrine at all, and if he did he would be thrown in
jail! The Pope had never said this, but it would later cause Galileo a lot
of trouble.
So Galileo published his dialogue in 1632. By that time, the Catholic
Church had a new Pope, Urban VIII (1588-1644). Happily for Galileo, Urban
was fond of science, so Galileo expected all would be well. Urban had told
Galileo he believed the Earth was fixed. But more importantly, Urban said,
God was so clever, he could produce any effect he wanted, any way he
wanted; so if He wanted to make a fixed Earth look like it was moving (or
vice versa), then He could go right ahead. Imagine Urban's surprise to
find his favourite argument in the mouth of the foolish Simplicius, not the
clever Salviati!
Urban was justifiably upset, and hauled Galileo back to Rome in 1633. It
was here that Urban asked the Vatican files to be searched, and that
incriminating "extra page" turned up. From Urban's point of view, it
seemed like Galileo had deliberately broken the law, and insulted him at
the same time. This does not justify what happened to Galileo, but at
least it helps us understand why Church officials behaved the way they did.
The motion of the Earth was not the point, they thought; Galileo had
cheated, reneged on his promises, and broken his word!
Recent books, newspapers and magazines have had a field day talking about
the cruelty of the Inquisition towards Galileo. But contrary to popular
belief, Galileo was never tortured; nor was he ill-treated; nor did he
stubbornly swear "But it does move!" after denying Copernicus. The worst
sentence he got was house arrest in his villa in the hills above Florence.
So we can see there are a lot of "nonscientific" reasons why the Catholic
Church decided to "condemn" Galileo, and neither side in the dispute is
above reproach. Urban VIII could reasonably plead ignorance; how was he to
know that the secret edict was a forgery? He was more concerned with
"keeping up with the Joneses"; that is, making his Church look as true to
the Bible as those pesky, rival Protestants. And, you had to admit,
Galileo was particularly irritating to a lot of people, taking delight in
strong, vitriolic polemics that made his opponents look like idiots; a
little diplomacy would probably have saved him a lot of trouble. From his
point of view, the Church was making a tragic mistake, and he was only
trying to save it. Galileo quite reasonably wanted the Church to divide
scientific questions from religious ones, and stick to the latter. That
way, even if science advanced, the Church would never have to commit itself
to a viewpoint it would later have to change. It could teach a religion
that would be the same "yesterday, today and tomorrow."
Where does this leave the Church now? The head of the Vatican's recent
commission, Cardinal Paul Poupard, probably put it best when he said "this
subjective error of judgment, so clear to us today, led them to a
disciplinary measure from which Galileo had much to suffer. These mistakes
must be frankly recognized." The Vatican has done this much, and is to be
applauded for its apology. But it is not to be condemned for stubbornly
insisting the Earth was flat, or denying the evidence of its own senses.
To claim this is to do a disservice to history.

orderoutofchaos

19-01-2009, 09:55 AM

Nope, and I'm not racist. Most Muslims are born into "Islam" and it is forced upon them and they grow up believing it to be true. I don't have a problem at all with Muslims. They are simply people - most of them unknowing and blindly following the Qur'an - the Holy Book of "Islam"

If you read my earlier posts its "Islam" that I find slightly disturbing.

You are showing the minority of Muslims here. Most Muslims are peace loving people, unlike the Terrorist Israeli regime, who i suspect you are allied to. Of course stoning women to death is unacceptable in a modern world, but, bombing innocent women and children is not going to bring about change. It will just make the victims more and more barbaric.

14april2000

19-01-2009, 09:59 AM

it's not that easy to recognize an expansionist state with no stable borders.

i clearly remember that some time ago hamas declared it was ready to recognize israel, but only if it retired inside its pre-1967 borders... then (sad coincidence) a dozen palestinians died in a raid or something like that, and everyone forgot about it.

zionist gangsters know their stuff, and they still want all palestinian land.

Not to forget where zionist gangsters gets there order from, the notorious Jesuit order in the vatican state near rome.

runciter

19-01-2009, 10:04 AM

Not to forget where zionist gangsters gets there order from, the notorious Jesuit order in the vatican state near rome.

no, i think they take orders from the rothschild family, all the jesuit stuff is disinfo imo.

killerzzs

19-01-2009, 10:06 AM

a definite give away for a person who HATES islam is when they start quoting a few quotes out of context from a text they have no understanding of and then post stuff out of a right wing racist website and try and make a connection between the 2, as if to say this is what "muslims" really do, never mind there are a over a billion of them and never mind the fact that this person has not stopped to consider whether they are actually behaving as "muslims" or just as sadistic twisted people, regardless of race, religion or creed

its as ridiculous to say that when bush is starting wars and killing innocents its the actions of a "christian"

so it seems we have our zionist islam bashing coadjuators even on this forum

if you look around in the world there is no other belief system or ideology left in the world that could possibly challenge the nwo, or rather than challenge you could say its "in the way"

now i a not advcating islam as a means to defeat the nwo, but am saying that its the only thing left that is big enough and strong enoughy ideologically to really trouble the nwo, communist russia was defeated, only islam is left, which is why they have always surpressed and kept muslim nations down, as even the possibility of 1 billion + people spanning several continents rising under one flag would be a disaster

thats why the zionists are hell bent on the most sensationalist propaganda directed at islam and this is why the zionists want to turn as many people as possible against muslims, so their job is easier

their latest coup is in india, where muslims were already brutally surpressed, since mumbai its open season, the tragedy of this is that some muslims will become the extremist types they have tried to create all over the world

runciter

19-01-2009, 10:14 AM

its as ridiculous to say that when bush is starting wars and killing innocents its the actions of a "christian"

exactly, and i believe the elites of almost every nation have a secret "religion", different from the mainstream ones and based on duality: they think evil must be worshiped in order to mantain some sort of balance (they are mentally ill).

anthony65

19-01-2009, 10:14 AM

You are showing the minority of Muslims here. Most Muslims are peace loving people, unlike the Terrorist Israeli regime, who i suspect you are allied to. Of course stoning women to death is unacceptable in a modern world, but, bombing innocent women and children is not going to bring about change. It will just make the victims more and more barbaric.

It's the same story throughout the world. The decent majority are exploited by a ruthless and pyscopathic minority.

The world will be a better place when we all realize that differences such as religion, nationality, class, race, sex etc. really mean nothing.

What joins us or separates us is the quality of our hearts.

runciter

19-01-2009, 10:16 AM

It's the same story throughout the world. The decent majority are exploited by a ruthless and pyscopathic minority.

The world will be a better place when we all realize that differences such as religion, nationality, class, race, sex etc. really mean nothing.

What joins us or separates us is the quality of our hearts.

synchronicity :)

we both posted at 03:14, expressing the same thoughts.

runciter

19-01-2009, 10:36 AM

is it possible that the pharisees of the gospels were "farsi", zoroastrians?

runciter

19-01-2009, 10:39 AM

Zurvanism

Unlike Mazdean Zoroastrianism, Zurvanism considered Ahura Mazda not the transcendental Creator, but one of two equal-but-opposite divinities under the supremacy of Zurvan. The central Zurvanite belief made Ahura Mazda (Middle Persian: Ohrmuzd) and Angra Mainyu (Ahriman) twin brothers that had co-existed for all time.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zurvanism#Introduction

arten

19-01-2009, 11:39 AM

anthony65

19-01-2009, 11:56 AM

To those of you (all two of you that is ;)) who object to the inital title you probably have English Comprehnsion problems. Of course the world can goto war with Islam, Islam itself is a collective made up of all those who call themselves Muslims.
The way I see this is that Islam is no better or worse than Christendom, the Christians were only 500 years ago commiting the same disturbing psychotic crimes in the name of their god Jesus. The only difference between then and now is that today the events are recorded but back then we can only rely on written testimony.
It looks to me like all the monotheist religions were set up to oppose one and other and cause all the world's ills. People object to the proctocols of zion claiming they were forged, but the info in them is and has come to pass.
Both Islam and Christendom want to dominate the whole world, the Jews are the exception they don't run around like headless chikens trying to proslytise others.
It may come down to fight or die anyway if the whole of the Muslim world takes up arms. What are you going to do if they appear in your neighbour hood and start killing your friends and your families.
Goering said most people don't want war but they will be brought to war by various means. I don't want war I would rather just get on with my life and not play this illuminatie game out. But I am not going to just sit there and watch my children or grandchildren being butchered by a load of Psychotic Mulsim thugs.
BTW I live in the UK and I have to agree that the powers that be are allowing this to happen. Anyone involved in any type of crime especially if they are Muslim should be deported asap. It won't happen though because they want civil war on our streets.

No I don't have English comprehension problems, but at a time when muslims are being butchered by the Israelis in Gaza, I find this thread dangerously provocative.

"The world can go to war with Islam"

The world?

Which world is that?

Which nations are you referring to?

The US, UK, Israel of course, but what about Russia, China, India, the South American countries etc. Are you lumping them all in there together?

What utter bollocks!

it sounds like you're dreaming of a New World Order to rise up and confront the threat of Islam...

Err..

What threat?

What military threat do Islamic nations represent?

On the "world" side you have the USA, UK, Israel, and throw in China, India, Russia if you like.

On the "Islamic" side you have Pakistan, Egypt, Saudi, Indonesia, etc.

Oh what bollocks your arguments are.

If you read my initial reply, you'd see that I do condemn atrocities carried out in the name of Islam, but the same atrocities, or worse, have and are being carried out in the names of many causes.

The UK musilims want civil war on the streets of Britain?

Well, firstly, there are many muslims in the UK who just want to live their lives.

Yes, there are some fanatics, who, as you wrote, were often inspired by UK/US intelligence supported nutters.

But how many fanatical muslims are there in the UK?

And how many of the rest?

Rarely has so much inane bollocks been written in one post.

Congratulations!

You're a record breaker! :D

tyler

19-01-2009, 11:59 AM

This whole thread has been swamped by Zionist trolls. Take note of who they are for future reference.

grachtengordel

19-01-2009, 12:06 PM

To those of you (all two of you that is ;)) who object to the inital title you probably have English Comprehnsion problems.

If you want to split hairs regarding language and play snide ......

1. initial

2. comprehension

spell these correctly and I will suffer less "problems" comprehending your post

3. It is unwise to refer to the "initial" (worse to call it inital) title of the thread as there appears to be no 'new' or 'secondary' title. Just call it the 'title'

4. the 'title' is an example of VERY poor english, it should read "is war with islam unavoidable?"
"avoidable at all" is just bad english

5. you state "you probably have English Comprehnsion problems" but have you ever studied the english language? or are you referreng to a symptom of being english?

marpat

19-01-2009, 12:15 PM

How exactly would you go about radicalising the entire Muslim world, anyway?

It's not one country, it's a religion and the interpretation and understanding of Jihad as meaning a call to engage in physical warfare against an external enemy is confined to a relatively small percentage of Muslim practitioners.

Unless they can wheel out a new prophet or unifying spiritual leader who can somehow manager to convince 1.6 billion people that he's not only the real deal, but that the majority of them have failed to comprehend the Koran accurately, then I think it's pretty unlikely it will ever happen.

Nice to see some sensible posting. Not only that but a lot of muslims would happily turn their backs on that religion given the chance. How many women wish to be forced into marriage. How many of them want to make their own way through life without their clerics telling them what to do? I think the only thing that keeps a lot of them on side is the punishments and the fear of disgracing their families and being outcasts.

runciter

19-01-2009, 12:19 PM

Nice to see some sensible posting. Not only that but a lot of muslims would happily turn their backs on that religion given the chance. How many women wish to be forced into marriage. How many of them want to make their own way through life without their clerics telling them what to do? I think the only thing that keeps a lot of them on side is the punishments and the fear of disgracing their families and being outcasts.

don't forget that islamic fundamentalism is infiltrated and manipulated by western & mossad agents.

marpat

19-01-2009, 12:20 PM

Note also that during WWII Islam was recruited into the Waffen SS and committed many atrocities. Their head cleric was very anti Jewish and was well up for the extermination of jews.

marpat

19-01-2009, 12:22 PM

don't forget that islamic fundamentalism is infiltrated and manipulated by western & mossad agents.

Only in the minds of the deluded.

Lets see some proof of these ideas. Anybody can write stuff like that but unless you can back it up it is just an empty idea.

runciter

19-01-2009, 12:24 PM

Only in the minds of the deluded.

Lets see some proof of these ideas. Anybody can write stuff like that but unless you can back it up it is just an empty idea.

it has been proved beyond doubt many times, you can easily find all the information you need.

anthony65

19-01-2009, 12:25 PM

If you want to split hairs regarding language and play snide ......

1. initial

2. comprehension

spell these correctly and I will suffer less "problems" comprehending your post

3. It is unwise to refer to the "initial" (worse to call it inital) title of the thread as there appears to be no 'new' or 'secondary' title. Just call it the 'title'

4. the 'title' is an example of VERY poor english, it should read "is war with islam unavoidable?"
"avoidable at all" is just bad english

5. you state "you probably have English Comprehnsion problems" but have you ever studied the english language? or are you referreng to a symptom of being english?

:D

runciter

19-01-2009, 12:38 PM

Note also that during WWII Islam was recruited into the Waffen SS and committed many atrocities. Their head cleric was very anti Jewish and was well up for the extermination of jews.

the jewish persecution was set up by the rothschilds, in order to create israel.

in 1941 zionist stern gang-sters offered their collaboration to the nazis.

tusme

19-01-2009, 12:47 PM

This thread is turning this forum into a "Gaza" strip...!!

Utterly disgusting...!!

anthony65

19-01-2009, 12:49 PM

Note also that during WWII Islam was recruited into the Waffen SS and committed many atrocities. Their head cleric was very anti Jewish and was well up for the extermination of jews.

"Islam was recruited into the Waffen SS".

How do recruit "Islam" into the Waffen SS?

I can imagine that there were muslims in the SS and I read once that Adolf admired Islam (but detested Christianity).

Do you have sources for your claims about Muslim SS men? What were their nationalities? The Waffen SS also had volunteers from France, Holland, Denmark, etc.

"Their head cleric...".

Whose head cleric?

The head cleric of Islam? Well, there isn't one, so we can forget that, so you must mean the head cleric of the muslim volunteers for the Waffen SS.

Well, if he was in the Waffen SS then you'd expect him to have been anti-Jewish wouldn't you.

"He was well up for the extermination of the Jews". Any sources for this claim? Maybe he was, but who was he and who made these claims?

griswald

19-01-2009, 12:50 PM

tb303

19-01-2009, 12:54 PM

Only in the minds of the deluded.

Lets see some proof of these ideas. Anybody can write stuff like that but unless you can back it up it is just an empty idea.

Pretty bloody obvious.

Try this for starters:

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/18/68772733_a94c2aafa2.jpg

anthony65

19-01-2009, 12:55 PM

There is no one country, religion, sect, group of people in the world today that is any worse than any other group.
Unfortunately, collectively all of humankind has perfected the art of brutality and inhumanity towards each other more effectively than we have learnt the benefits of love, compassion and peace towards our brothers and sisters.

griswald

I disagree Griswald.

It is an evil minority who organize and encourage this brutality.

The majority of people are good to each other.

They may have many failings, but the majority are good.

The big challenge is getting the majority to recognize that they are being manipulated into condoning and carrying out evil.

Take World War 1 as an example. I'm sure that the vast mayjority of the men fought were good, decent men who "trusted" the authorities and allowed themselves to slaughter other decent men and be killed in their turn.

Remember the Christmas truce of 1914?

I agree with the first part of your post, but the second part is too negative.

There is plenty of goodness and kindness in the world.

Unfortunately there is not yet enough wisdom and courage to stop the tyranny of the evil few who pull the strings!

anthony65

19-01-2009, 12:58 PM

Pretty bloody obvious.

Try this for starters:

http://farm1.static.flickr.com/18/68772733_a94c2aafa2.jpg

Ah yes...

Brzezinski, known for his hardline policies on the Soviet Union, initiated in 1979 a campaign supporting mujaheddin in Pakistan and Afghanistan, which were run by Pakistani security services with financial support from the CIA and Britain's MI6. This policy had the explicit aim of promoting radical Islamist and anti-Communist forces to overthrow the secular communist People's Democratic Party of Afghanistan government in Afghanistan, which had been destabilized by coup attempts against Hafizullah Amin, the power struggle within the Soviet-supported parcham faction of the PDPA and a subsequent Soviet military intervention.

Years later, in a 1997 CNN/National Security Archive interview, Brzezinski detailed the strategy taken by the Carter administration against the Soviets in 1979:

We immediately launched a twofold process when we heard that the Soviets had entered Afghanistan. The first involved direct reactions and sanctions focused on the Soviet Union, and both the State Department and the National Security Council prepared long lists of sanctions to be adopted, of steps to be taken to increase the international costs to the Soviet Union of their actions. And the second course of action led to my going to Pakistan a month or so after the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan, for the purpose of coordinating with the Pakistanis a joint response, the purpose of which would be to make the Soviets bleed for as much and as long as is possible; and we engaged in that effort in a collaborative sense with the Saudis, the Egyptians, the British, the Chinese, and we started providing weapons to the Mujaheddin, from various sources again—for example, some Soviet arms from the Egyptians and the Chinese. We even got Soviet arms from the Czechoslovak communist government, since it was obviously susceptible to material incentives; and at some point we started buying arms for the Mujaheddin from the Soviet army in Afghanistan, because that army was increasingly corrupt. [19]
Milt Bearden wrote in The Main Enemy that Brzezinski, in 1980, secured an agreement from the Saudi king to match American contributions to the Afghan effort dollar for dollar and that Bill Casey would keep that agreement going through the Reagan administration.[20]

In 1998, Brzezinski was interviewed by the French newspaper Nouvel Observateur on the topic of Afghanistan. He revealed that CIA support for the mujaheddin had started before the 1979 Soviet invasion, knowingly increasing the probability of a Soviet invasion. Brzezinski saw the invasion as an opportunity to embroil the Soviet Union in a bloody conflict comparable to America's experience in Vietnam. He referred to this as the "Afghan Trap" and viewed the end of the Soviet empire as worth the cost of strengthening militant Islamic groups.

He went on to say in that interview, "What is most important to the history of the world? Some stirred-up Moslems or the liberation of Central Europe and the end of the cold war?" When the interviewer questioned him about Islamic fundamentalism representing a world menace, Brzezinski said, "Nonsense!"

eternal_spirit

19-01-2009, 01:12 PM

If it walks and look like a duck then it is.
Islam is quackers.

Some good info at the start of the thread and the evil in Islam needs to be exposed.

eternal_spirit

19-01-2009, 01:15 PM

You need to ask why does Islam and Jews circumcise.
Islam and Judaism are more a like than some of them like to think.
Kabbalah
Kabba

Koran
Talmud

There's part of what these topics are about came before both religions begun.

dynamicwiseman

19-01-2009, 01:16 PM

This whole thread has been swamped by Zionist trolls. Take note of who they are for future reference.

The Hordes of Zionist trolls are like those agent smiths types in the Matrix. Me me me me too!

tb303

19-01-2009, 01:18 PM

Ah yes...

Brzezinski...

And this is one of the wankers behind Obaaamaaa...

runciter

19-01-2009, 01:18 PM

Palestinians rejoice after hearing about the September 11.

The Five Dancing Israelis Arrested On 9-11

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/fiveisraelis.html

eternal_spirit

19-01-2009, 01:20 PM

Been to any beheadings, stonings recently? maybe a child's head cutting ritual

runciter

19-01-2009, 01:41 PM

Been to any beheadings, stonings recently? maybe a child's head cutting ritual

recently i witnessed the slaughtering of 1300 persons by the israeli army.

griswald

19-01-2009, 01:43 PM

I disagree Griswald.

It is an evil minority who organize and encourage this brutality.

The majority of people are good to each other.

They may have many failings, but the majority are good.

The big challenge is getting the majority to recognize that they are being manipulated into condoning and carrying out evil.

Take World War 1 as an example. I'm sure that the vast mayjority of the men fought were good, decent men who "trusted" the authorities and allowed themselves to slaughter other decent men and be killed in their turn.

Remember the Christmas truce of 1914?

I agree with the first part of your post, but the second part is too negative.

There is plenty of goodness and kindness in the world.

Unfortunately there is not yet enough wisdom and courage to stop the tyranny of the evil few who pull the strings!

There is not enough goodness and kindness tho, to cancel out the negativity, at the moment......

I see you are interested in Masaru Emoto,s positive energy..........maybe thats the answer.....I know it is;)

griswald

runciter

19-01-2009, 01:44 PM

There is not enough goodness and kindness tho, to cancel out the negativity, at the moment......

our beliefs shape our reality.

14april2000

19-01-2009, 02:01 PM

http://vaticanassassins.org/bushladen.jpg

The multi-billion dollar Carlyle Group, headquartered in Washington, D.C. - which capital city has been in the hand of the Jesuit Order's Georgetown University since the day Lincoln was assassinated at the direction of the Jesuit B. F. Wiget (Mary Surratt's confessor) - is a Vatican-controlled international corporation. Its Chariman is a Knight of Malta and a former Deputy Director of the Black Pope's Central Intelligence Agency, Frank C. Carlucci. Another brother Knight of Malta working for the Group is none other than America's former Gulf War President, a former Director of the CIA and accomplice in the Kennedy Assassination, George H. W. Bush - the former business partner of both Islamic Freemasons, CIA operatives Saddam Hussein and Osama bin Laden.

Carlyle, controlling America's Military Industrial Establishment known as "the Iron Triangle," is nothing more than thee cartel-capitalist corporate-fascist profiteer and one of the Papacy's mightiest bulworks and invisible driving forces behind President George W. Bush's neo-Nazi, fascist dictatorship. The Gestapo of the American Reich is the Office of Homeland ("Romeland") Security, which has now absorbed the Federal Emergency Management Agency, the Secret Service, the Coast Guard and a host of other federal agencies. The OHS is presently commanded by a "Jesuit of the short robe," the Roman Catholic Knight of Columbus, Tom Ridge, who in turn is being "advised" by a former Director of the Soviet KGB.

When watching this nearly one hour long program, notice that Carlyle executives just happened to be in front of a TV at the very time the WTC turned to ashes amidst convolluted steel beams - as though that mass-murder and demolition had been planned! The Pope's Knight of Malta-led Carlyle Group will be to Edward Cardinal Egan's American neo-Nazi fascist Reich as the Pope's Knight of Malta-led I.G. Farben and IBM were to Eugenio Cardinal Pacelli's German Nazi fascist Third Reich.

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article3995.htm

George Herbert Walker studied under the Jesuits of Stonyhurst for two years (1892-4).
George Herbert Walker - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Some of his descendants then went on to Yale, joined Skull and Bones where they kissed the slippered toe of the Pope and bowed before Don Quixote who is really Ignatius Loyola (Cervantes based his character on his contemporary Loyola who he studied with at the University of Salamanca) and dubbed a Knight of Eulogia in the tomb of Skull and Bones-the Brotherhood of Death who tap individuals from certain backgrounds and lineage to initiate them into the Jesuits' Illuminati. http://prescottbush.quickseek.com/

This is a fact but the specifics of what they studied and what went on is unknown except that Prescott designed the golf course for the boys. Were George HW Bush's father and grandfather Jesuits of the short robe? Could be. It would make so much sense when you consider the fact that Prescott acted as an advisor to President Eisenhower, was a Connecticut Senator, a Nazi financier, mentored Richard Nixon. He had so much access to power. What do you think?

Brother Nicholas N. Rivera

Prescott Sheldon Bush George HW Bush's father and Prescott's father-in-law George Herbert Walker were Jesuit-trained NOT SMOM George HW "Poppy" Bush (his Skull and Bones occult name is Magog). However Bush Sr. was working for the CIA at the time of the JFK assassination. Bush claims he can't remember where he was on Nov. 22 1963. Well, this FBI memo shows he was in the CIA before he was made director. He proved his loyalty to the Jesuits' NWO and was rewarded with the CIA directorship by acting as an accessory to the murder conspiracy against JFK before the fact. Bush Sr. is a murderer and worthy of the death penalty for his complicity and involvement in the assassination of President John F. Kennedy. If there were an honest and fair trial this incriminating evidence alone would convict him and an impartial jury would find him guilty. There is more evidence which ties Bush Sr. to the CIA.

http://tomflocco.com/Docs/Jfk/HooverFbiMemo.htm

The CIA of course denies it and claims the George Bush mentioned in the memo is not Bush Sr. but an Army General George Bush.

http://demopedia.democraticunderground.com...sination_let ter

This is a sure smoking gun which is irrefutable. The memo here places Bush in Dallas on Nov. 22 1963 the day of the assassination.

Scroll down to see photos of Nazi Jesuit of the short robe Prescott S. Bush with Ike and his protege Nixon (another conspirator)

http://www.jfkmurdersolved.com/bush.htm

Brother Nicholas N. Rivera

anthony65

19-01-2009, 02:16 PM

There is not enough goodness and kindness tho, to cancel out the negativity, at the moment......

I see you are interested in Masaru Emoto,s positive energy..........maybe thats the answer.....I know it is;)

griswald

I was just wondering how you knew that, and then I remembered! :D

Yes, this one is "Hope".

They're really beautiful: except for the hate filled ones...

It makes you think!

Or the immediate difference you see in someone when they smile genuinely.

Sometimes the radiance of a person who is genuinely smiling can be amost overwhelming.

I believe that this radiance is there inside most of us and it's wonderful when we are positive enough to set off a chain of smiles as we go through the day.

I said most, because I'm not sure whether all people still have this genuine spark of humanity within them.

14april2000

19-01-2009, 02:34 PM

Vatican is a terrorist organization that hires rapists - YouTube

Nixon Moreno is being protected from Justice in a Vatican property. This way the Vatican hires criminals into their criminal organization by assuring loyalty through guilt. A common practice amongst criminals.

Undeniable proof: Liccio Gelli

Look the name up in google.

The Vatican and all it's properties must be confiscated and all made public! The church, the house of prayer of all peoples, which they have turned into a den of vipers and thieves!

With their usurous Vatican Bank! WE MUST CHASE THE MONEY CHANGERS, VIPERS AND THIEVES, FROM THE TEMPLES AS CHRIST TAUGHT US!

LET THE WORD OF GOD BE ENACTED!

14april2000

19-01-2009, 02:38 PM

The Black Pope's Islamic Terrorist Network in America.

http://www.vaticanassassins.org/terrorist_network.htm

Dear Brethren and Friends,

The map below illustrates the Black Pope's Islamic Terrorist Network in America. The Luciferian Jesuit Superior General, via his several personal Assistants and eighty-five worldwide Provincials, controls "the Invisible Empire" of occult, high-level, Scottish Rite and Grand Orient Luciferian Freemasonry. (White) Scottish Rite, (Black) Prince Hall Rite and Grand Orient Freemasonry control all Islamic leaders not only in America (including FBI informer, "Nation of Islam" spokesman, the Jew-hating, White/Black race war advocate and hostile mulatto, Louis Farrakhan) throughout the entire Middle East. The evil "Invisible Empire" of Luciferian Freemasonry especially controls the Saud Dynasty administering Jesuit Superior General Peter-Hans Kolvenbach's OPEC, controlled by his oil bonanza, Saudi Arabia. The Masonic Saud Dynasty is directed in its policies by the Order's New York City-based Council on Foreign Relations (CFR). Every American Secretary of State has been a member of, or is controlled by, the CFR since the Council's inception in 1921, including mulattos Condoleezza Rice and 33rd Degree Freemason Colin L. Powell.

The Jesuits created the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia in 1932 using their fanatical, Islamic cult known as "Wahhabi Islam." Wahhabi Islam, "the Sword of the Church" intended to be used against apostate, White Protestant, Western Civilization, was a creation of the Society of Jesus using certain Papal Knights controlling the once Protestant British Empire. With the Empire having been governed by the Order through Freemasonry for the last two hundred years, Wahhabi Islam was fortified during the reign of that wicked, Jesuit-controlled murderer of the Irish people, Queen Victoria of England. British SIS agent, English noble and Knight of Malta, Sir John Philby, feigned himself to be a Wahhabi among the Arabs, thereby facilitating the enthronement of Masonic Ibn Saud as the first king of Saudi Arabia. Both Freemasons Winston Churchill and, yes, Benito Mussolini, whose confessor was a powerful Italian Jesuit and the Secretary of the Company, Pietro Tacchi-Venturi, also aided in the establishment of the Masonic Islamic Kingdom of Saudi Arabia. "Allied" Britain and "Axis" Italy worked together, as they would during Jesuit-trained, Jesuit-favored and Jesuit-advised, Pope Pius XII's World War II, the grand finale of the Black Pope's Second Thirty Years' War (1914-1945).

Saudi Arabia, because of its CFR-created, cartel-capitalist oil monopoly, finances the Black Pope's International Terrorist Network; that Network is overseen by the "Father General's" SS/Central Intelligence Agency, which in turn has been consistently directed by CFR affiliates since its inception, they being either oathbound Knights of Malta, 33rd Degree Freemasons or members of Yale's Satanic Brotherhood known as "Skull and Bones." The CIA is presently directed by CFR-member and Skull and Bonesman, Porter J. Goss. Goss now answers to another CFR-member tied to British Intelligence through his wife; he is another "brother Skull and Bonesman," John D. Negroponte, the new National Intelligence Tzar (our Nazi Heinrich Himmler or Soviet Lavrenti Beria), appointed by another brother "Bonesman," President George W. Bush. It is this evil, CFR-controlled, Luciferian World System overseen by the Black Pope, for the ultimate benefit of the White Pope, through which Satan controls both sides of our present Anglo-American-led "War on Terror."

We believe the Jesuit Order, through its control of the Office of Immigration, has cautiously and cunningly erected its Islamic Terrorist Network in America. One of its purposes is to create anarchy through carefully calculated "terrorist attacks." There are strong indications that our coming desolations will include several detonations of "dirty," highly radioactive, atomic devices now in place throughout the Black Pope's "Holy Roman" Fourteenth Amendment American Empire. The Jesuit Theater has told us as much with its movies, True Lies and The Sum of All Fear. Certain American Generals, hosted by the New York Press Club in 2004, believe that from five to ten devices will be detonated simultaneously, killing hundreds of thousands, maybe millions, of Americans. The Jesuits will blame their Masonic Islamic Middle Eastern leaders, men like "the former" Bush family business partner and "former" CIA operative, Osama Bin Laden. These unprecedented "terrorist attacks" will justify the suspension of the Constitution, the decree of martial law, the committing of all domestic police powers into the hands of Michael Chertoff's Office of Homeland "Romeland" Security locking down the nation while implementing gun confiscation. Meanwhile the Order's CFR-controlled Congress will ram a national Draft down our throats. We deceived Americans will be all too willing to aggressively deploy and kill the Moslem peoples and destroy their Mosques in Mecca, Medina and Jerusalem, never knowing that we have been set-up to do the killing for the Society of Jesus in accordance with its evil Council of Trent.

As you examine the map below, notice the cities in which the "Islamic Terrorists" maintain a strong presence are also cities that are completely in the hands of the Jesuits. Seattle, San Francisco, Santa Clara, Los Angeles, Detroit, Chicago, Boston, New York City and Washington, D.C., all host Jesuit Universities, they being in fact military fortresses. Within the walls of the Order's military staging bases, operating under the guise of "institutions for higher learning," the Black Pope's North American Jesuit Assistant, in cooperation with his ten American Jesuit Provincials and Jesuit University heads, can direct his stratagems and flanking maneuvers as events begin to unfold and favorable opportunities present themselves.

In the meantime, we AV1611 Bible-believing White Anglo-Saxon Protestant and Baptist-Calvinist Americans must begin to take the lead in calling for repentance and belief on the risen Son of God of the New Testament, the Lord Jesus Christ. Upon repenting from our personal and national sins, and humbly calling upon our Heavenly Father to sovereignly intervene for us, we then must begin to preach political secession from this Jesuit-controlled Fourteenth Amendment American Empire.

Politically, our sovereign Nation-State is everything; the oppressive, thieving, murderous, taxing, lawless, Constitution-hating, occult Fourteenth Amendment American Empire is nothing. Every State must gather in Sovereign Convention and pass Ordinances of Secession, thereby cutting off the Company's absolute temporal/political power; we must sever all spiritual and temporal ties with Washington, D.C., that city rightfully named "Rome on the Potomac." As did the Protestant Netherlands when they seceded from Jesuit-controlled Spain, as did the Protestant American Colonies when they seceded from Jesuit-controlled England, and as did the Protestant Southern Confederate States of America when they seceded from the Jesuit-controlled, Radical Red Republican Party having usurped the Constitutional government of Protestant America, we must physically prepare to repel invasions from other nations under the power of the Black Pope, and to mentally prepare to punish high treason committed by the Order's oath-bound agents ruling that diabolical Trojan Horse from within--the Masonic Islamic Terrorist Network! May we seriously seek the Lord in our prayers; may we separate ourselves from the sin that so easily besets us; may we acquit ourselves as men and begin to do our duty before the day is spent and the night is at hand.

Brethren, we have no time to lose!

Sincerely in Faith,

Brother Eric

http://www.vaticanassassins.org/Terrorist_map.gif

DEYO NOTE: Terrorists are a very real and growing threat in America and to American interests around the world. It should be assumed these are not the only cell locations within the US and that they are subject to change.

14april2000

19-01-2009, 02:46 PM

http://www.vaticanassassins.org/cia_bin_laden.htm

Understanding the Present Campaign of the American Press,
Controlled by the Archbishop of New York’s Council on Foreign Relations Presently Overseeing
the Black Pope’s Central Intelligence Agency, Against the Visible Head of
the Black Pope’s International Masonic/Islamic Terrorist Network,
Osama bin Laden

By Eric Jon Phelps

In order to obtain a clear view of the present massive disinformation campaign raging against Osama bin Laden, the Islamic Saladin of the Twenty-First Century, we must first briefly review the relevant history of the Twentieth Century. This review will restate the maxims having been established in Vatican Assassins and will give us a clear view of the true players in the religious game of world hegemony.

The foundation for our conclusions is anchored in the conviction that The Holy Bible, the thirty-nine books of the Old Testament and the twenty-seven books of the New Testament, is the Word of God to the exclusion of any other book or books in existence, past or present. For the English-speaking peoples, we believe that The Authorized King James Version of 1611 in its present edition of 1769, having been faithfully and accurately translated from the Old Testament Hebrew Masoretic Text and the New Testament Greek Majority Text by the forty-seven learned and godly White Calvinist Englishmen, is our final authority of faith and practice. We hold that all other “Bibles” are to be stoutly rejected as Papal heresy favoring Rome’s Latin Vulgate, declared to be “the Scriptures” by the Jesuit General’s evil and wicked Counter-Reformation’s Council of Trent, having assembled from 1545 to 1563.

The last five hundred years of “His story” is to be understood in the light of the Great Controversy between the risen Son of God’s Calvinist Protestant Reformation in opposition to Satan’s Jesuit Roman Catholic Counter-Reformation. This obvious and simple white/black dialectic is the key to understanding our present North American plight, having now been blamed on the Jesuit Order’s most willing scapegoat, the Lee Harvey Oswald of the World Trade Center mass murder, CIA operative Osama bin Laden.

A few of the maxims as proven in Vatican Assassins will be briefly given before we begin our expose of the Jesuit General’s International Intelligence Community in command of his International Masonic Terrorist Network, which includes his International Masonic/Islamic Terrorist Network, its visible head being Freemason Osama bin Laden. The Jesuit General will be referred to hereafter as “the Black Pope”, a most appropriate and well-earned title conferred by the oppressed Roman Catholic people of Italy nearly two centuries ago.

1. The military brotherhood of the Society of Jesus, commonly called the Jesuit Order, is ruled by its Superior General, a military commander and absolute autocrat, thee Sovereign over the world’s Sovereigns. His purpose is to destroy the Protestant Reformation, with its peoples, governments, nations and liberties, and to return the World to the Pope’s meridian of both spiritual and temporal/political, absolutist power — the dreaded Dark Ages.

2. The Pope, or rather “the Papal Caesar,” with his enforced universal Temporal Power, is to be the earth’s Universal Deified Monarch upon recovering from his mortal wound, ruling the World’s governments and peoples from Solomon’s rebuilt Temple in Jerusalem.

3. From 1540 to 1773 the Order exerted all of its power to affect these ends. The Jesuits became the confessors to nearly every king in Europe, orchestrating assassinations and wars worldwide until formally suppressed with a Papal Bull by Pope Clement XIV in 1773.

4. As punishment for its suppression the Jesuit Order, in control of Luciferian Continental Freemasonry, ignited the French Revolution and the resultant Napoleonic Wars, punishing the Pope and the Roman Catholic monarchs of Europe who dared to suppress the Order.

5. By the time of the Congress of Vienna in 1815, the Society of Jesus had been revived by Pius VII, and its General, the Black Pope, had gained control of both the English Monarchy and the Papacy, which control he has maintained to this day. This means that British Intelligence, including MI5 and MI6, is presently overseen and directed by the Black Pope.

6. With the Jesuit assassination of President Abraham Lincoln in 1865, the Order began its “Holy Roman” Fourteenth American Empire in 1868. The purpose for this weapon of vengeance, built upon the ruins of George Washington’s Protestant Calvinist Republic, would be to restore the Temporal Power of the Pope over every nation on earth. With the advent of the Empire’s first Masonic “Holy Roman Emperor,” Theodore Roosevelt, we abandoned George Washington’s wise foreign policy of isolation. Rather, the American Empire, in conjunction with the British Empire, has been wickedly and sinfully used to both diplomatically and militarily intervene and alter, the internal affairs of every nation on earth during the last one hundred years — for the benefit of the Pope! These battered nations include the Moslem Arab peoples of the Middle East presently suffering through an American-led Papal Crusade against Islam under the guise of an unconstitutional, undeclared “war on terror.” The leaders of both sides, George W. Bush, Tony Blair and Osama Bin Laden, work together in obeying the orders of the Black Pope (via his CFR-controlled trusted third parties) for the present benefit and future international political dominion of the White Pope.

7. From 1914 to 1945 the Black Pope waged his Second Thirty Years’ War benefiting mightily therefrom. In 1914 the Order caused the Bolshevik Revolution; in 1922 the Order installed its Jesuit-trained Roman Catholic Freemason Joseph Stalin as the Secretary of the Communist Party and continued to systematically purge Russia of its “heretics and liberals” pursuant to the evil Council of Trent. Financed by the Archbishop’s New York Wall Street Banks, including the Federal Reserve Bank directed by Papal Knights, the Order carried out its Twentieth Century Inquisition within the U.S.S.R. using the Cheka, which in time became the NKVD “head hunters”, and then became the KGB. During World War II, the NKVD was built by and cooperated with the Vatican-orchestrated OSS, now the CIA. The KGB and the CIA have continued to work together under the direction of the Jesuit General since their inceptions, killing tens of millions of “heretics and liberals” during the Pope’s Cold War in accordance with the Council of Trent.

8. In 1932, after the breakup of the Ottoman Empire, the Black Pope used the British Empire to create his base of operation for the destruction of the “heretic and liberal” people of the United States. That base was the Kingdom of Saudi Arabia, the heart of Sunni/Shiite/Wahhabi/American NOI Islam in which are located two of its most “holy places,” Mecca and Medina. In 1932 the fascist and secret Freemason Benito Mussolini, advised by Jesuit Pietro Tacchi-Venturi (who was the Secretary of the Society of Jesus), gave military and financial aid to Ibn Saud, the first King of Saudi Arabia. (Indeed, the Order finances what it controls.) In 1937 Mussolini, the man who restored the Temporal Power of the Pope in 1929, was presented “the Sword of Islam” and hailed as “the Defender of Islam” by Libya. Later, America’s domestic oil wells would be shut down forcing trillions of our dollars to be spent overseas thereby consolidating massive wealth in Islamic Saudi Arabia while creating a dependence on Middle Eastern oil. This massive wealth in the hands of fanatical, Wahhabi Moslems would provide the basis for Saudi Arabia’s financing of the Black Pope’s International Masonic/Islamic Terrorist Network presently headed by Freemason Osama bin Laden and financed by Saudi Arabia’s Masonic House of Saud. This Masonic/Roman Catholic fascist connection to Masonic/Islam is imperative to understand if we are to come to grips with our present danger under the pro-Patriot Act I and II, Supreme Court appointed and darling of the Jesuit Order’s fascist Fox News Network mogul and Papal Knight of Malta, Rupert Murdock, anti-Bible and slave of Freemason Pope John Paul II, Skull and Bones initiate and Freemason, George W. Bush.

9. From 1933 to 1945 Jesuit General Ledowchowski used his Nazi SS – patterned after the Jesuit Order – in cooperation with Stalin’s NKVD to purge Europe and Western Russia of its Jews, Polish anti-communists and any Protestants who dared to get in the way. The Nazi SD, being the central intelligence of the SS, was secretly managed by Heinrich Himmler’s resident Jesuit Temporal Coadjutor, Dr. Richard Korherr. As the Black Pope’s favorite, SD Jesuit Heinrich Himmler carried out his Superior Jesuit General’s policy by giving orders directing Hitler’s Secretary – the man behind the Fuhrer greater than Fuhrer himself – SS General Martin Bormann! After the war’s end Himmler’s “suicide” was faked by the British SIS, and Bormann, disguised as a Jesuit priest, “escaped” to South America having become a lay brother in a secret branch of the Jesuit Order called the Redemptorists. From Argentina, Bormann contributed in the rebuilding of Roman Catholic West Germany in obedience to the design of the Society of Jesus. German Protestantism had now been destroyed thanks to the Black Pope’s Second Thirty Years’ War (1914-1945).

10. Having worked with the Allies during the war, the Nazi SS, including its entire intelligence apparatus, was brought into the West by New York Archbishop Francis Cardinal Spellman as “anti-communists” and into the East by Gregory Cardinal Agagianian as supposed “freedom fighters” in the eyes of the West. In fact, the CIA and KGB shared Reinhard Gehlen’s old solders during the Hoax known as “the Cold War”. The CIA and KGB in control of the American and Russian governments were NEVER enemies at the top. Both agencies were financed by the Vatican’s international banks and corporations headed by the Knights of Malta and Shriner Freemasons. They merely served as the Order’s two controlled forces of its political dialectic, the outcome of every crisis furthering the plans of the Black Pope in Rome.

Now we can begin to understand the use of Osama bin Laden. This man was recruited into the CIA in 1986 and given approximately 3 billion dollars by that Agency. Why? To build an Islamic force to resist the Russians called the Mujaheddin during the Soviet war in Afghanistan, so we are told. But if the Black Pope’s SS/CIA was giving aid and weapons to Bin Laden to fight the Black Pope’s KGB controlling Soviet forces that could have easily crushed the Mujaheddin, what was the real purpose in building bin Laden’s al Qaeda International Terrorist Network including Hamas, Hezbollah, the PLO and the Egyptian Islamic Jihad?

The answer is simple.

The Black Pope is planning a massive Islamic invasion into the United States, via Cuba, using an incited, angered and crazed Arab army who believe in the words of their false prophet Mohammed, “a day and a night with the sword is better than a week of fasting and prayer.” To excite them to a fever pitch the SS/CIA has created its International Masonic/Islamic Terrorist Network while the Company is directing American military campaigns, via Generals who are members of and subordinate to the New York Archbishop’s Council on Foreign Relations, in a region whose people are offended by our very “infidel” presence.

Coupled with massive civilian bombings, the CIA brutalizing the populace, and the coming destruction of Mecca and Medina – to the delight of the Pope –, the fanatical Arab Moslems will heartily attack the “heretic and liberal” people of North America – the greatest haven for the risen Son of God’s beloved Hebrew/Jewish People on earth! This foreign Moslem attack will be supported by the murderous, anti-White and Jew-hating American Black Nation of Islam (the NOI for the last fifty years having recruited tens of thousands of violent, criminal Blacks within American prisons controlled by the Jesuits). It is for this reason that when any leaders seek to bring about peace in the Middle East, the Black Pope's International Intelligence Network in command of his International Terrorist Network puts them to death. The Israeli/Arab Agitation must continue. This is why Anwar Sadat was murdered. This is why Yitzak Rabin was murdered. And this is why President John F. Kennedy was murdered, having been “wounded in the house of his friends” — the Jesuits!

When our nation is finally attacked and destroyed, as was apostate Protestant Germany, a united Europe under the Pope (led by a cabal of high-level Knights of Malta – like Juan Carlos, the Jesuit-trained Bourbon King of Spain) will take America’s place as Masonically-controlled Zionist Israel’s protector. The Pope will be hailed as a hero by his Masonic Jewish Zionist Press in Israel, and Jerusalem’s Third Hebrew Temple will be built. Sometime thereafter, the Papal Caesar will enter into a treaty with his CFR-controlled Zionist government of Israel, which government hated New York’s Rabbi Meir Kahane. (For Kahane believed that Israel should be governed by patriotic Jews and not the Pope’s Masonic Jewish Zionists, they in his words “having hijacked the nation.” It was for this outcry that he was murdered by an SS/CIA controlled Islamic assassin, El Sayyid Nosair.)

Once the Third Hebrew Temple is built the stage will be set for the coming “covenant with many.” And with the signing of that “covenant with death,” Daniel’s Seventieth Week of Years will begin “the Time of Jacob’s Trouble.”

“And he shall confirm the covenant with many for one week: and in the midst of the week he shall cause the sacrifice and the oblation to cease, and for the overspreading of abominations he shall make it desolate, even until the consummation, and that determined shall be poured out upon the desolate.”

Daniel 9:27

“Alas, for that day is great, so that none is like unto it: it is even the time of Jacob’s trouble; but he shall be saved out of it.”

Jeremiah 30:7

“For I would not, brethren, that ye should be ignorant of this mystery, lest ye should be wise in your own conceits; that blindness has happened in part to Israel, until the fullness of the Gentiles be come in.

And so all Israel shall be saved: as it is written, There shall come out of Sion the Deliverer, and shall turn away ungodliness from Jacob:

For this is my covenant unto them, when I shall take away their sins.”

Romans 11:25-27

“Even so, come, Lord Jesus.”

Revelation 22:20

14april2000

19-01-2009, 02:50 PM

Pope's Zionist

http://www.vaticanassassins.org/popes_zionist.htm

Masonic, Talmudic, Pro Nazi, Pro Pope,

Pro Wahhabic Neo Islamic, Anti Son of God, CFR- controlled, Zionist Government of the Nation of Israel

The Jesuit General – 1540

(Controlling the Papacy and its Hierarchy – 1814)

International Shriner Freemasonry – 1800

(Supreme Council of the 33rd Degree)

Protestant British Throne and Empire – 1800

(King George III; Queen Victoria)

Masonic Jewish Zionism – 1890s

(English Masonic House of Rothschild; Theodor Herzl)

The Unjust Dreyfus Affair – 1894-1906

(Chief of the French General Staff was

guided by his Jesuit Confessor.)

Balfour Declaration – 1918

(Masonic Chaim Weizmann;

“Palestine” a Homeland for the Jews)

(How do we Jesuits get the Jews of Europe to move to Palestine so that they can build the Temple for our future Jesuit Pontiff?)

Second Thirty Years’ War – 1914-1945

(Vengeance for the Nineteenth Century;

The Order’s “Century of Disaster”)

Jewish Holocaust – 1933-1945
(Knight of Malta Joseph J. Larkin, Chase Bank
Jesuit SS General Heinrich Himmler

Jesuit Temporal Coadjutor and assistant to Himmler

Traditionalist Roman Catholic Dr. Richard Korherr;

Masonic Zionist Rudolf Kastner, Hungarian Judenrat

Masons Roosevelt, Churchill and Stalin

forbade Immigration or Emigration to Palestine)

Papal Caesar’s Communist United Nations Created – 1945

(Shriner American President Harry Truman signs the Charter in the city of San Francisco controlled by the Jesuits since 1850.)

Pius XII’s Communist United Nations passes Resolution 181 [II] – 1947

(Six months prior to Israel’s Declaration of Statehood, Jerusalem was made a “body of separate covenant” as distinguished from Israel and all other nations to be under the UN Charter.)

Israel a Nation – 1948

(Proclaimed by Freemason Chaim Weizmann; Recognized by Shriner American President Harry Truman in eleven minutes; Aided by the Masonic Grand Mufti of Jerusalem who ordered 650,000 Arab Palestinians to flee the land resulting in a Zionist victory.)

Pius XII’s Communist United Nations passes Resolution 194 [III] – 1948

(U.N. Trusteeship Council is given full authority over Jerusalem; this will be enforced after the present World War III during the building of the third Hebrew Temple for the coming risen Papal Antichrist.)

Israel admitted into the Papal Caesar’s United Nations – 1949

(Jesuit Coadjutor Francis Cardinal Spellman rallies his South American dictators to vote in favor of Israel with the intention of Jerusalem being declared to be an international city for the Papacy.)

Central Intelligence Agency creates the Mossad – 1951

(Zionists are trained by the Nazis of Hitler’s Intelligence Chief, Roman Catholic Knight of Malta Reinhard Gehlen, to work in conjunction with KGB-trained Yassir Arafat bringing truly anti-Zionist Arab enemies to the forefront through acts of violence encouraged by the Pope’s CIA justifying their execution by the Mossad, it being an arm of the Black Pope’s International Intelligence Community.)

Jerusalem is liberated by the beloved Hebrew/Jewish People,

But is captured by the Pope’s Masonic Jewish Zionists – 1967

(The Six-Day War is a success thanks to the help of the Black Pope’s Masonic, Wahhabi, pro Nazi, Neo Islamic Arabic leaders.)

Israel’s Zionists give the Old City of Jerusalem to the Vatican – 1993

(On September 10, 1993, the Italian newspaper La Stampa reported that then Foreign Minister, Freemason and Jesuit trained Shimon Peres concluded a secret deal with Pope John Paul II. Peres promised to internationalize Jerusalem, granting the U.N. political control of the Old City of Jerusalem and the Vatican hegemony over the Temple Mount. This was an act of high treason against the risen Son of God’s beloved Hebrew/Jewish/Israelitish People.)

The Papal Caesar recognizes the Nation of Israel – 1993

(On December 30, 1993, Israeli – Vatican Relations formally begin with “The Fundamental Agreement Between The Holy See and The State of Israel” in “normalizing relations between Catholics and Jews.” This was a formal payback for deeding the Old City to the Papacy.)

World War III begins – 2001

(The Jesuit General with his Military Company of Jesus, in control of George W. Bush, Tony Blair, Saddam Hussein, Osama bin Laden and the Wahhabic Neo Islamic King of Saudi Arabia, will destroy the holy places of Islam including Mecca, Medina and Jerusalem's Dome of the Rock enabling the Third Hebrew Temple to be built.)

14april2000

19-01-2009, 03:01 PM

The Pope's Zionist Sabbateans

Dear Friends and Brethren,

The following article is written by my friend, Barry Chamish, whom I consider to be the foremost authority on both the past and present state of affairs within Israel today. I highly recommend the reading of his several books, as they sustain the fact that the Pope of Rome has controlled the Zionist, anti-Torah, Socialist-Communist government of the Nation of Israel from its inception - to the detriment, pain, and heartbreak of the beloved Hebrew/Jewish/Israelites people of the Most High within and without the nation.

In light of my research, his article simply put is as follows: the Pope's Masonic Jewish Zionists, including those racially half-Jews known as "Sabbateans," are merely the open, visual agents of the Black Pope in fulfilling his wicked Council of Trent in making the Pope the "Universal Monarch of the World" ruling from Jerusalem's soon-to-be-built Third Hebrew Temple. The fulfillment of the Order's Council of Trent (upheld by every Pope since its conclusion in 1563) means the deliberate mass-murder of historic "heretic" Reformation Protestants, pre-Reformation Baptists, racial and religious Jews, as well as "liberal" anti-Communist, anti-Jesuit, anti-Masonic Roman Catholics.

In giving examples illustrating the above point, history attests to the mass-murder of six hundred thousand, anti-Jesuit, Roman Catholic French Vendee by the Order's great Masonic avenger - Napoleon Bonaparte. This is why the Order, in control of the Masonic Islamic Young Turks, murdered over one million "heretic" non-Roman Catholic, Orthodox Armenian Christians (many of whom were racial Jews, as were the "Roma" Gypsies having been exterminated in Nazi Death Camps deep within the forests of Roman Catholic Poland) during World War I - the beginning of the Black Pope's Second Thirty Years' War (1914-1945). This is why, in returning the Russian Orthodox Church to the "One Shepherd" of Rome, the Jesuit "Society of the Perfect" murdered over two million Russian Orthodox people and overthrew the Orthodox Romanoff Dynasty during its Bolshevik Revolution and ensuing five-year Civil War. This is why the Sons of Loyola used their occult SS - patterned after the Jesuit Order by the infamous Bavarian Roman Catholic Jesuit Coadjutor Heinrich Himmler - to murder nearly seven million Jews, tens of millions of non-German Protestant European "Aryans," and tens of millions of Russian "Slavs" during World War II. All these massacres were financed by the Rothschild/Schiff/Warburg Vatican Bankers and/or were openly led half-Jews who, in fact, were mere agents of Jesuit General Ledochowski. Hitler, Himmler, Heydrich, Lenin, Trotsky, and Stalin were all Vatican-controlled, racially half-Jews who worked in conjunction with the Pope's Masonic Jewish Zionists, while murdering millions of "perfidious Jews" so surnamed by the Pope's Canon Law.

As of 1946, the Professed of the Fourth Vow Luciferian Society of Jesus altered its Constitutions so as to admit Jews into the Company. I contend that Jews were secretly admitted into the Order - at the absolute discretion of the Jesuit General - for two reasons. First, to secretly carry out the Order's Council of Trent committing horrible atrocities in the name of Communism, Fascism, and Zionism. Payback would be the breakup of the Ottoman Empire and the transfer of Palestine and Jerusalem's Temple Mount to the control of the Pope's Masonic Jewish (truly anti-Jewish) Zionists. In turn, the Pope's "Court Jews" of Israel would deed back the Temple Mount to the Papacy in 1993. Later, the Pope's CFR-controlled American Jewish Zionists would aid the Order's Knight of Malta and former Director of the CIA, George J. Tenet, in demolishing the World Trade Center and then igniting a "War Against Islam," intending to ultimately destroy the Mosques now legally on the Pope's Temple Mount.

The Second reason the Sons of Loyola have admitted Jews into the Order is more ominous and deadly than the average Jew or Gentile can imagine. The Pope's Masonic Jewish Zionists, covertly overseen and controlled by the Society of Jesus (while they overtly finance and/or direct the Company's bloody revolutions during the last two centuries), have knowingly, and willingly, and purposely, and consciously, betrayed and framed the Jews of America and the world, in cunningly creating worldwide anti-Jewish fury so necessary to the culmination of the Pope's Anglo-American-led Crusade and the coming international rule of Antichrist. It is for this reason that during "the time of Jacob's trouble," the coming Great Tribulation to last 1260 days, the LORD from heaven will cry out to all the Jews on earth:

"Come out of her, my people, that ye be not partakers
of her sins, and that ye receive not of her plagues."

Revelation 18:4

May the elect remnant of Jews, about to inherit salvation in Messiah, come out of the Mother Of Harlots today and believe the true gospel as preached by the Jewish Apostle Peter when he said in Acts 3:10-12:

"Be it known to you all, and to all the people of Israel, that by the name of
Jesus Christ [Joshua the Messiah] of Nazareth, whom ye crucified, whom
God raised form the dead, even by him doth this man stand here before you
whole.

This is the stone which was set at nought of you builders, which is become
the head of the corner [Psalm 118: 22],

Neither is there salvation in any other: for there is none other name under
heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved."

For Isaiah 62:11 declares:

"Behold, the LORD hath proclaimed unto the end of the world,
Say ye to the daughter of Zion,

Behold thy salvation [Yeshua] cometh;
behold, HIS reward is with HIM,
and HIS work before HIM."

My comments are in brackets and in Blue,

Brother Eric

KERRY, GAZA AND THE NEW JEWISH SABBATEAN HOLOCAUST

by Barry Chamish

In the first week of February 2004, two related incidents occurred in Israel and America. Prime Minister Sharon announced his decision to evacuate the Jewish residents of Gaza and John Kerry won enough primaries to just about settle the issue of who will be the Democratic Party candidate in the upcoming American elections.

Here are a few less than publicized facts about Kerry:

- He is a graduate, like both President Bushes, of the occult Yale University cabal, the Skull And Bones Society.

[Half-Jew Roman Catholic John Kerry, J.D., was later educated in the law by Jesuits at their Boston College.]

So whoever Americans vote for, they get the same secret society determining their lives. - Kerry, like Howard Dean, Wesley Clark and Joe Leiberman are all members of the Council On Foreign Relations (CFR). So whoever Americans choose to be the Democratic candidate, they will get the same CFR agenda.

- The well publicized CFR agenda insists on Israel withdrawing from Gaza, Judea and Samaria and half of Jerusalem, making Israel unviable as a state. To that end, like Dean before him, Kerry has promised to appoint Jimmy Carter (CFR) or Bill Clinton (CFR) as his administration's Middle East advisor.

[The Pope's CFR-Roadmap (Roadblock) agenda is intended to create a war within Israel that will result in the destruction of the Temple Mount Mosques enabling the Third Temple to be built - for the Pope.]

- Not that Kerry will receive any new advice from either of them, since his campaign manager is Alan Solomant, an executive of Peace Now - America.

- Kerry is being protected from exposure of the ugly crime of participating in a massacre in Viet Nam.

- But as his prominence grew, so did the investigation of his past. And what did we recently discover; why Kerry is Jewish on his father's side. Somehow, he forgot the fact that his grandparents were prominent Jewish business people in Prague and that his father is 100% Jewish. Ask yourself, do you know anyone who doesn't know his father's religious background?

As rare as it must be, that affliction runs rampant in CFR circles. Former CFR Secretary-of-State Madeleine Albright also forgot that both her parents were Jews, even though she was raised in the Jewish home of her relatives in London.

If you don't feel like voting for Kerry, there is Wesley Clark waiting in the wings. Uncannily, he is also a CFR member who only discovered his father was Jewish while he was burning Bosnia to ashes.

[Bosnia is composed of non-Papal Orthodox Serbs condemned by the Order's Council of Trent. As the Order used its SS Croatian Muslim Division in killing Tito's Orthodox Serbs during World War II, so it is now using Albanian Muslims to continue the same genocide pursuant to the Council of Trent.]

Now how come, no matter which Democrat you choose, you get a CFR half-Jew who forgot all about it? The answer is found in the Sabbatean (also Shabbataian and similar spellings) policy of having their Jewish apostate followers converting and hiding their roots and beliefs.

Allow me to quickly summarize Sabbateanism/Frankism:

In my previous article, "The Deutsch Devils", I revealed the findings of Rabbi Antelman in his books To Eliminate The Opiate Volumes I and II. His focus is the false messiah Shabtai Zvi, and the continuation of his evil ministry through the Turkish sect called the Donmeh. In the eighteenth century, Jacob Frank brought the Donmeh ideology to Europe and joined a fateful alliance. This was described in the article as:

Frankfurt at the time was the headquarters of the Jesuit, Adam Weishaupt, founder of the Illuminati, as well as Rothschild Brothers' financial empire. This is worth repeating: Frankfurt was the birthplace of both the Illuminati and the Rothschild empire.

[The Jesuit General Ricci's Illuminati was born in the Pope's ancient stronghold of Bavaria, Southern Germany. Nonetheless, the alliance between the Rothschilds and the Jesuit Order was completed by 1776.]

When Jacob Frank entered the city, the alliance between the two had already begun. Weishaupt provided the conspiratorial resources of the Jesuit Order, while the Rothschilds contributed the money. What was missing was a means to spread the agenda of the Illuminati and that the Frankists added with their network of agents throughout the Christian [non-Christian Roman Catholic; Christian Protestant] and Islamic worlds.

Jacob Frank became instantly wealthy because he was given a nice handout by the Rothschilds of Frankfurt. There is no other explanation.

And from this starting point, Rabbi Antelman gave us a blueprint for the war against Judaism and all its good, and indeed against humanity and all its moral treasures. A movement of complete evil now took hold. The Jesuits' goal was the destruction of the Protestant Reformation leading to a return of one pope sitting in judgment on all mankind. The Rothschilds goal was to control the wealth of the planet. And the Frankist vision was the destruction of Jewish ethics [Torah-based Judaism] to be replaced by a religion based on the exact opposite of God's intentions. When these factions blended, a bloody war against humanity, with the Jews on the front lines, erupted and it is reaching its very pinnacle at this moment.

Rabbi Antelman traces the means of the worldwide reach of this ugliness. By the 1770s, the Illuminati was exposed and banned in Germany and then throughout Europe. Weishaupt made a strategic change that worked miracles for the international spread of his goals. He infiltrated agents into the Freemasonic lodges of England and Scotland, changing their highest tenets to his own, until every lodge in every nation accepted them. Thus, the Illuminati now had two centers of activity, Germany and Britain [and France, as Weishaupt joined the Grand Orient Lodge in Paris in 1777].

Before diving into the proofs that Israel is being set up for another Sabbatean Holocaust [as foretold by Isaiah 28:14-18], permit me the liberty of explaining the inspiration for this piece. On February 1/04 I visited Gefen Books in Jerusalem to pick up some copies of my Hebrew book, Who Murdered Yitzhak Rabin and David Morrison's book, Lies - The Rabin Assassination And Israel's Secret Service.

Dr. Morrison's book has made a powerful case for a conspiracy behind the Rabin assassination. One of the favors he did for me was, as a psychiatric doctor, confirming that my analysis of Rabin's medical records was the correct one. Though I had met him just once, he has aided my cause enormously.

That time I met him was in my home when he and Gefen publisher, Ilan Greenfield arrived to hear me out and decide whether to publish a Hebrew edition of my Rabin book, or not. Ilan told me something I didn't know. "If it wasn't for David, I would never have published your book. I left your place and told him you were coocoo. He answered that if I didn't publish your book, he'd never talk to me again. As a psychiatrist he watched you carefully and concluded you were totally sane. He told me, "He thinks differently than us, that's why he can see how the truth works. That's not called crazy, it's called gifted."

I told Ilan that without knowing how much I owed him, I had repaid David many times over by reviewing Lies in my book, The Last Days Of Israel, and by selling lots of copies of the book in Hebrew and English at my lectures. Ilan's eyes lit up and he said, "Do you know we published two other books by him? Maybe you could promote them as well." He then showed me the books. He chose to display the newest book first. It is called, The Gush, and it is very relevant to today's impending withdrawal from Gush Katif. This book tells the human story of the Jewish residents of Gush Etzion, also secretly on the chopping block no matter what Sharon says.

It was a nice book, I told Ilan, but my readers expect deep information from me. Then he showed me the other Morrison book, Heroes, Antiheroes And The Holocaust. I struck gold.

David Morrison's book on the secrets of the Holocaust stands with Perfidy, The Transfer Agreement and The Scared And The Doomed as one of the great studies of how Labor Zionism prevented the rescue of European Jewry. Morrison doesn't see this as policy but you will with the knowledge we have gained together.

Morrison doesn't realize that he is reporting a Sabbatean massacre, yet he instinctively writes about the Young Turks. We begin and end our overview with that subject. I will add my comments beginning and ending with two stars **.

** The First Sabbatean Holocaust - The Dry Run **

pp 48 - The [Jesuit-controlled, Masonic] Young Turks who led the 1908 revolution were Turkish nationalists and established secular institutions, overthrowing the religious [anti-Jesuit, Sunni] Moslem order. They viewed [anti-Pope, Eastern Orthodox] Armenians as a direct threat to their revolutionary plans. The evidence is overwhelming that the massacre of the Armenians was a deliberate, planned genocide [pursuant to the Council of Trent].

The Young Turks allied themselves with Germany and used world War I as a cover for their slaughter of Armenians... As did the Nazis in World War II, the Turks used their intended victims as slave laborers building a trans-Turkish railway for German business interests.

** And who were these Young Turks who organized The Armenian genocide? We turn to Sabbatean Messianism as Proto-Secularism: M. Avrum Ehrlich for the answer. **

The extent to which Jews were involved in the Young Turk revolution is debated, some arguing that Jews and Donme dominated the Committee of the Union and Progress Party (C.U.P) which gained control of the State. Others argue that this was anti-Semitic rhetoric and exaggerated and that while the Jews supported the revolution on a grass roots level, they were not highly represented in the upper echelons of the party. Indeed, British diplomats did report to the home office that a Jewish-Masonic conspiracy was at work favouring the revolution [as would later transpire in Orthodox Russia]. The Donme are believed to have been equally involved in the revolution but exact details are less known due to a number of reasons...It was via the Masonic lodges that the Donme, the Jews, Bektashi and secularists who were less accepted in mainstream society were able to meet on an equal footing, many of them becoming major instruments of the revolution...Whether the suspicions that Masonry is responsible for sedition and subversive activities are true or not, in this context they were a convenient home for the revolution, providing lodges and personnel, secrecy and structures for the revolution [thus duplicating the Order's Masonic French Revolution in 1789]. The Donme thrived in the Masonic environment, allowing them to be both secretive and influential, maintaining their religious ideas in a non-dogmatic atmosphere. Bridging the gap between the Jews and the Muslims [linking Masonic Jewish leadership with Masonic Muslim leadership evidenced in the Middle East today, the late Prime Minister Rabin and King Hussein of Jordan having been hailed as "Masons of Peace"], they seemed to represent the happy medium of the secular Young Turk revolution. Even today Donme are involved in the Masonic Lodof Turkey. Sahir Talat Akev of the Kapanci-Izmir group of Donme was the Grand Master of the Masons until his death in 1999.

Dr Nazim, Nuzhet Faik, Mustafa Arif, Muslihiddin Adil, Sukru Bleda, Halide Edip Adivar and Ahmet Emin Yalman were all active in the Young Turks and of Donme families. Mehmet Kapanci (1839-1924) who was a mayor of Salonica and a well-known banker funded the C.U.P and was a Donme. Other Jews active in the Young Turks were Nissim Mazliah from Izmir and Vitali Faradji , Moise Cohen (later called Munis Tekinalp) who was an active Jew and once rabbinical student who turned to business and actively asserted a proud Turkish identity along with Zionist sentiments...It is curious that Israel's first and second Prime Ministers, [Masonic] David Ben Gurion and Moshe Sharett and her second president Yitzchak Ben Zvi had lived and studied in Istanbul and embraced the concept lehitatmen, Hebrew for "to become an Ottoman". Ben Zvi is alleged by some to be descendent of a Sabbatean family. Sharett served in the Ottoman army in WW1. Ben Gurion gave up Russian citizenship for Ottoman citizenship, something many others in Palestine were afraid to do. Israeli Presidents Ben Zvi, Zalman Shazar and to a lesser degree Yitzchak Navon became students of Ottomanism.

Mehmet Cavit Bey (1875-1926) was one of the most significant Donme political figures. He was active in the revolution as a highly articulate editor of a tabloid and professor of finance and was three times Finance Minister of Modern Turkey until his execution for his alleged role in the assassination attempt of Ataturk. ]Ataturk was completely in the hands of the Jesuits. Like Fidel Castro, Ataturk would be protected at all costs]. It is believed that Cavit Bey was an ardent Zionist and saw the advantages for Turkey in the Jewish settlement of Palestine.

No less today than in the early days of its activities, secular Zionism and the Israeli Left in particular show distinctive utopian aspirations that in many ways resemble forms of religious Jewish messianism, oddly enough bolstered by an almost religious dogmatism. Despite a declared and articulate opposition to conservative orthodoxy and religious messianism, this group seems to have unconsciously adopted many messianic characteristics and uses almost religious symbolism to address its message [like the occult "Star of David" called in Amos 5:26, "the star of your god which ye made to yourselves."]. In contrast with the early Zionists whose goal was a secular political messianism aimed at establishing a political State and securing sovereign territory by force of arms as an essential premise, the latter manifestation of the Israeli Left has more mystical messianic leanings. On one hand, the Israeli Left [its open anti-popish policy] acknowledges its national aspirations for Jewish sovereignty in the Land of Israel, but on the other hand, it [its secret pro-popish policy] ]supports extreme territorial compromise with Israel's enemies [in order to further justify interventionist Papal diplomacy]. These two values are often perceived to negate one another [as those two policies are cunningly intended to deceive the innocent observer]. In a situation which is quite possibly un-resolvable in real-politick, it is however, considered entirely possible and likely in the paradigm of peace that the Leftist movement professes. Most interesting is the movement's choice of messianic terminology when describing the peace process with Israel's Arab neighbours, including a new world order in the Middle East, an uncanny political rendition of the messianic kingdom of heaven on earth.

[This language justifies the rule of the Pope's Masonic anti-Jewish Zionists, they having aided and abetted the Pope's Nazi SS leadership during the Jewish Holocaust, to the exclusion and elimination of truly patriotic Jewish leaders such Rabbi Meir Kahane, who angerly exclaimed, "the Zionists have hijacked Israel." For Kahane's truthfulness and courage he was assassinated by a Moslem secretly handled by the Pope's CIA. The Kahane assassination further proves the link between the Pope's SS/CIA and its creation - the Masonic Islamic International Wahhabi-led Terrorist Network known as "Al Qaeda."]

Most interesting is the extreme anti-nomian nature of the Israeli Left Wing. A new dimension to anti-nomianism was created in this mutation of messianism that extended beyond the rejection of Jewish ritual into a form of national anti-nomianism. There existed an overwhelming pressure on believers amongst the Israeli Left not only to neglect Jewish tradition but a fundamental imperative to forfeit Jewish sovereignty particularly over Jewish religious sites (Cave of Joseph, Cave of Machpela, Temple Mount) by which peace was directly achievable.

Furthermore, a curious similarity between the Israeli Left and the Sabbatean movement is illustrated in the Left's strong public ties with Arabs and Islam while privately rejecting and even despising their lifestyle, morality and habits. Stark similarities are evident with the Donmeh who showed great public affection with Islam but amongst themselves entirely rejected and even despised Islam. This, of course, is not so much because of causal influences that Sabbateanism had on Zionism but rather because the same impulses and mechanisms active in both groups. Their belief that assimilation was an important utopian/messianic goal is therefore argued to be a motivation in both Sabbatean and Left Wing Zionist messianism.

[This same policy of the Jesuit Order is being forced upon the White Protestant nations of the West. Coerced amalgamation leading to miscegenation between Whites and Blacks, and thus the mongrelization and browning of historic Reformed nations, is producing a White Protestant Holocaust. Protestant White Rhodesia (Zimbabwe) and Protestant White South Africa - along with their Jewish communities - are finished, as hundreds of Whites are being murdered every month. This same Holocaust will continue in North America unless a group of White Calvinist Reformed peoples secede from the Empire and form their own nation once again.]

** M.A. Ehrlich's great accomplishments include verifying Rabbi Antelman's grand conspiracy involving the British rites of Freemasonry but exceeds Rabbi Antelman in the strong evidential connections to Labor Zionism and today's Israeli Left. They are being guided to acquiesce in a new Israeli Holocaust, no less than the American leaders of Labor Zionism and the Left did so acquiesce in the 30s and 40s. For a revealing look at modern American Sabbateanism, visit: http://www.donmeh-west.com/# **

The Rothschild Connection

** Kerry and Clark are not the only world leaders who deliberately forgot their Jewish fathers. Numerous sources have claimed that Adolph Hitler's real father was a Rothschild and this assertion is not off the wall. Hitler's mother was working as a maid on a Rothschild estate when her son was conceived either through an affair or rape. No less an authority as the History Channel, in a Jan./04 series on dictators, revealed that Hitler razed the Austrian town he was born in, "to destroy all hints of his Jewish father."

Could Hitler have been a Sabbatean?

The initial financiers of Labor Zionism and Theodore Herzl were barons of the Rothschild clan. Their goal was the creation of a state in the image of their Sabbatean beliefs: that is, anti-Torah, anti-Talmudic, anti-religious and anti-Jewish. To the Sabbateans, any Jew who does not accept anti-Judaism is fit for execution. Israel has chosen morality and God, and that means execution is the correct punishment.

Rabbi Antelman is not alone in tracing the Rothschild path to an American financial takeover. Hundreds, if not thousands, of researchers have proven that the European Rothschilds sent their German agents of the Schiff, Astor and Warburg families to serve the interests of the cabal formed by the [Jesuit General in control of] Jesuit Illuminati, British Freemasonry and Sabbateanism.

We return to David Morrison's book to have a look at who was conducting the affairs of American Jews during the Holocaust era.

pp. 36-37 - "The leading figures were Judge Mayer Sulzberger, Louis Marshall, Cyrus Adler and Jacob Schiff. Schiff was the towering figure of that group that, to a large degree, represented wealthy American Jews of German background. Louis Marshall was named president of the JDC, and Schiff's son-in-law Felix Warburg, the treasurer. Warburg soon became chairman.

** In the 1940s, the Warburg connection to Hitler was exposed in a startling book by one of their own, Sidney Warburg. He wrote that he was sent to Hitler's court to finance Hitler's rise with American funds funneled through the Warburg banking operation in Hamburg. For further confirmation, read Anthony Sutton's, Wall Street And the Rise of Hitler. And who was Felix Warburg allied to but Chaim Weizmann? (Later President of Israel) **

]Both were 33rd Degree Jewish Freemasons intent on rebuilding Solomon's Temple. Weizmann's American brother Mason of the 33rd Degree was President "Dirty Harry" Truman, creator of the Airborne Nuclear War Hoax, the Cold War Hoax, the Pope's Central Intelligence Agency and a most obedient servant of "the American Pope,"Knight of Columbus Francis Cardinal Spellman.]

pp 63 - When traveling to America Weizmann and his wife enjoyed the company of Felix Warburg and his wife Frieda.

pp 40 - The power behind the group that made up the JDC and American Jewish Committee was Jacob Schiff.

[Jacob Schiff, according to his son, helped to finance the Black Pope's Bolshevik Revolution to the tune of twenty million dollars in gold. This is another example of the Pope's "Court Jews" financing the Jesuit General's many revolutions.]

From a wealthy banking family in Germany, he joined Kuhn Loeb in New York in 1873. In 1875 he won the hand in marriage of the daughter of Solomon Loeb and a full partnership in the firm. His specialty was railroad finance. Working with E.H. Harriman, he acquired the Union Pacific Railroad in 1897.

[The Jesuits were busy uniting both the East and West Coasts via the railroads in creating the Pope's "Holy Roman" Fourteenth Amendment American Empire. The Company had just finished its brutal "ethnic cleansing" known as the Indian Wars of the Great Plains, or, more properly, America's First Thirty Years' War (1865-1895). By 1901 the Order, via Freemason Theodore "Rex" Roosevelt, would begin to restore the Pope's Temporal Power around the world using the fearless American Military and high finance of the Rockefellers, the Schiffs and the Morgans. In 1913 these American Vatican Bankers would create the Pope's Federal Reserve Bank - the biggest bank in the world!]

** Now we dive into the bowels of the plot. Schiff backed the Rockefeller railroad interests, which led ultimately to the foundation of the CFR in 1921 by the same J.D. Rockefeller. E.H. Harriman was the company Prescott Bush (George Jr.'s grandfather), was working for when he funneled millions of dollars to Hitler. This connection has been documented by numerous writers including Anthony Sutton and John Loftus. The Rothschild method was to identify crooked robber barons and promise them total wealth and control, if they would follow and promote the Illuminati/Sabbatean line. The CFR is the diplomatic arm guiding America and the world into a global Satanism. And no matter who the American voter chooses, he gets the CFR and more. If Bush wasn't elected last time around, Al Gore would have been president. His daughter is married to the grandson of Jacob Schiff, assuredly meaning he is Sabbatean.

Rabbi Antelman asserts that the Sabbateans sent more than financiers from Germany to infiltrate American Jewry. He insists the Conservative, and moreso, the Reform Movements, are tools used to draw American Jews away from their traditions and into the arms of the Sabbateans. **

pp 39 - Judah Magnes confessed without provocation that in Berlin he had been converted to Orthodoxy and he knew Theodore Herzl.

pp 41 - All three groups courted Judah Magnes for a leadership role. Schiff was a major supporter of the Reform Temple Emanu-El in New York but he and Felix Warburg also contributed to the Jewish Theological Seminary. Solomon Schechter, who came from England in 1902 to become president of the seminary, lent his support and prestige to the Zionist cause.

** "We shall have World Government, whether or not we like it. The only question is whether World Government will be achieved by conquest or consent." -- Statement made before the United States Senate on Feb. 7, 1950 by James Paul Warburg ("Angel" to and active in the United World Federalists), son of Paul Moritz Warburg, nephew of Felix Warburg and of Jacob Schiff, both of Kuhn, Loeb & Co. which poured millions into the Russian Revolution through James' brother Max, banker to the German government. **

** Sabbatean Labor Zionism concocted a dreadful tradeoff with the Nazis, which resulted in 50,000 indoctrinated German Jews escaping to Palestine from 1933 to 1939. The 3 million Jews of Poland were too religious to join the enterprise. [Further, according to one source, there were over 300 Messianic Jewish assemblies among the Polish Jews at that time. Assuredly, the Pope's "Court Jews" would never allow those "heretic" Jews to enter Palestine but rather they would be sent to the Death Camps.] And those who weren't religious largely supported the moral and proud scions of Zeev Jabotinsky, known at the time as the Revisionist Zionists. **

[The Order hated Jabotinsky for which reason he was expelled from Israel by Chaim Weizmann, one of the Pope's Masonic anti-Jewish Zionists. Jabotinsky, who died in 1940 near Hunter, New York, was not allowed to be buried in Israel until a much later date. He like Kahane, wanted a sovereign nation of Israel, rather than a "Jewish Sate" run by the Pope's "Court Jews."]

pp 42 - Louis Dembitz Brandeis, an early Zionist leader, protested to the Schiff-Warburg group over the route that Joint Distribution Committee funds took from the United States to Polish Jewry. Millions of dollars were channeled through the Aid Society of German Jews that included Max Warburg. Brandeis protested to Felix Warburg that the German group supported the ban on immigration of Polish Jews into Germany.

pp 47 - At the outset of WWI, Jacob Schiff felt the tug of his German roots. He aided Germany financially and told a friend: "My sympathies are naturally altogether with Germany, as I would think as little to side against my country as I would against my own parents."..Schiff's brother-in-law, Max Warburg, was a German delegate to the economic talks at Versailles. He had discussions with John Foster Dulles...Dulles' brother Allen served in Turkey as assistant to the US High Commissioner. From that post he aided the attempt to cover up the Turkish massacre of the Armenians during the war. His superior, High Commissioner Mark Bristol averred: "The Armenians are a race like the Jews - they have no national spirit and poor moral character."

** There isn't the space to present the machinations of the leaders of American Jewry, so we will focus on just one, the leader of Reform Judaism and the American Jewish Congress, Stephen Wise. His closest friend and correspondent was Felix Frankfurter. Of him, Jerry Rabow in his book, 50 Jewish Messiahs, writes:

"United States Supreme Court Justice Felix Frankfurter is reported to have received a copy of Eva Frank's portrait from his mother, a descendent of the Prague Frankist family."

Here is a quote from Frankfurter:

"The real rulers in Washington are invisible and exercise their power from behind the scenes."-- Justice Felix Frankfurter, U.S. Supreme Court.

Of Stephen Wise, Rabbi Antelman provides this description in To Eliminate The Opiate, Volume II:

"Consider Stephen Wise, head of the Reform movement in the United States during World War II. As the slaughter was going on in Europe, Wise was more interested in his own gratification. Wise was both a Communist and a Sabbatian. That he was a Communist is attested to by Maurice Malkin, a member of the Communist Party who returned to Judaism, in his book Return To My Father's House. Wise was a Sabbatian, as was shown in Helen Rawlinson's book Stranger At The Party. In her chronicle of a sexual encounter with the so-called Rabbi Wise, she describes how Wise had sex with her in his office on his conference table, and quoted the verse from Psalms which Sabbatians did when engaged in sexual intercourse." pp 217
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Roman Catholic Bishop Francis T. McConnell and Rabbi Stephen S. Wise, 1933

[Zionist Stephen Wise, a personal friend of Chaim Weizmann, was also the mutual friend and co-worker of the Roman Catholic Bishop, Francis T. McConnell. Both men were servants of Jesuit-trained Patrick Cardinal Hayes of New York. Later, Jesuit-trained Archbishop Spellman would control Democrat Rabbi Stephen Wise from "the Powerhouse" - St. Patrick's Cathedral in New York. Wise's autobiography, Challenging Years, was completed the year of his death in 1949. Pursuant to Vatican policy, Wise along with 33rd Degree Freemason FDR, refused to come to the rescue of European Jewry perishing at the decree of Pope Pius XII and his Jesuit-led SS.]

** Now follow David Morrison's chronicle of Wise deliberately condemning European Jews to death by torture. Lest you believe today's American Jewish leaders aren't capable of organizing a second Holocaust, always recall the very same process, using carbon copy American Jewish leaders, is at work against Israel at this moment. PM Sharon is simply doing what the CFR tells him to. **

pp 107 - Wise wrote to Albert Einstein displacing blame for Roosevelt's silence on the Nazi atrocities on the Warburgs: "I must say to you in strictest confidence that I saw the President yesterday...His first word was, 'Max Warburg wrote to me lately that things were so bad in Germany that nothing could be done.' The President threw up his hands as if to say, 'Well, if Max thinks nothing can be done, then nothing can be done.'"

[Again, Wise and FDR working for "The Powerhouse" in New York, condemning the Jews of Europe to death.]

pp 110 - Steven Wise circulated, in January, 1937, an internal memorandum to the Governing Councils in the World Jewish Congress making it clear, "in the most emphatic terms that it cannot be a party to any scheme of the Polish government which looks to a place for Polish-German emigrants."

pp 113 - At the same time, he circulated this memorandum, he wrote to a New York congressman who intended to introduce legislation to ease restrictions on emigration to America: "I have every reason to believe that any effort that is made at this time to ease the immigration laws will result in a serious wave of anti-Semitic feeling in this country."

[Wise and FDR refused immigration of European Jews to America, while after the War, thousands of Nazis were given sanctuary in the US under the guise of "fighting godless Jew Communism." One of those Nazis was the Jesuit Coadjutor, SS "Gestapo" Heinrich Muller.]

pp 120 - After Austria fell, Wise met with representatives of the American Jewish Committee and some non-Jewish groups. The meeting came in the wake of an attempt by New York Congressman Samuel Dickstein, to introduce legislation that would allow unused refugee quotas to be allocated to those fleeing Hitler. The gathering agreed unanimously: The organizations represented at the conference will take the position that the proposed legislation is inadvisable."

pp 128 - In the week following Kristallnacht, the British offered to give up most of the 65,000 quota for British citizens to emigrate to the United States to increase places for Jewish refugees. Under Secretary Of State [CFR-controlled] Sumner Welles responded: "I reminded the Ambassador that the President stated there was no intention on the part of his government to increase the quota for German nationals. I added that it was my strong impression that the responsible leaders among American Jews would be the first to urge that no change in the present quota for German Jews be made...The influential Sam Rosenman, one of the "responsible" Jewish leaders sent Roosevelt a memorandum telling him that an "increase of quotas is wholly inadvisable. It will merely produce a 'Jewish problem' in the countries increasing the quota."

pp 129 - The General Jewish Council met the following day and spent hours of debate on an agenda that did not include the Kristallnacht. When the leaders of the American Jewish Congress addressed the issue, they did so by adopting a resolution giving the following advice to their constituents across the country:

"Resolved that it is the present policy of the General Jewish Council that there should be no parades, public demonstrations or protests by Jews." Stephen Wise on American Jewish Congress stationary sent out a report to his members labeled: CONFIDENTIAL. NOT FOR PUBLICATION IN AMY FORM WHATSOEVER: "In behalf of the American Jewish Congress I send you this report clarifying our policy in meeting the present crisis in the life of our fellow Jews in Germany. The silence of the American Jewish Congress should not be regarded as a lack of activity on our part. It is the result of well considered policy."

[Indeed, silence was not only the policy of the Order's American Jewish Congress, but of Pope Pius XII himself. For Hitler's Pope was the master behind the Order's "Final Solution to the Jewish Question." The Vatican's files on Pope Pius XII, censored by the Pope's confessor Jesuit Robert Leiber and three other Jesuits, are still closed to the scrutiny of investigators - just as the CIA files on the Kennedy Assassination are closed to those patriotic Americans who would know the truth.]

pp 145 - In the wake of Kristallnacht, New York Senator Wagner introduced legislation to allow 20,000 German Jewish children into the United States. Stephen Wise testified before the legislation committee: "If there is any conflict between our duty to those children and our duty to our country, our country comes first; and if children cannot he helped, they cannot be helped."...Reynolds saw no difficulty in accommodating the refugee children in the United States. The legislation, without support from the Jewish leadership, got nowhere.

** If the children were not destined from Germany to Palestine, they were not destined to live. The same thing happened when choosing [if] the Polish Jews [were] fit to live. **

pp 154 - A letter to American Jews on United Jewish Appeal stationery continued to support the 'selected' immigration of Jews to Palestine, despite the fact that 3 million Jews were now trapped in Nazi-occupied Poland: "Selectivity is an inescapable factor in dealing with the problem of immigration to Palestine. By selectivity [it] is meant the choice of young men and women who are trained in either agriculture or industry.

pp 178 - During the summer of 1942, Gerhart Riegner sent a cable to the State Department detailing the Nazi plan for exterminating European Jewry. At the behest of Under Secretary Of State [CFR-controlled] Sumner Welles, Wise kept the report secret.

pp 187- In the February, 1943 issue of Wise's American Jewish Congress publication, Opinion, there is an extensive review of the Hitler era to date with articles contributed by 52 people. No one mentioned the word 'rescue.'

pp 200 - When [Roman Catholic Papal Knight] Anthony Eden was in Washington he met with Wise and told him nothing could be done...Eden's private secretary Oliver Harvey noted in his diary: 'Unfortunately, A.E. loves Arabs and hates Jews [which was then and is now the present policy of the Jesuit Order].'

pp 212 - There was an appeal from Italy which stated that an appeal from the pope might stop the deportation of Jews from Italy. The Zionist Emergency Committee did nothing about this matter. A meeting wasn't even called.

[And Pope Pius XII said nothing as further revealed in Rolf Hochhuth's 1963 masterpiece, The Deputy.]

pp 217 - Stephen Wise declared: "We are Americans first. Nothing else that we are, whether by faith or race, qualifies our Americanism...The way to save Jews is to unite the Jewish people behind the victory program of President Roosevelt."

pp 220 - A White House staffer recorded in his diary that, "The President told us from his bedroom that he would not see the delegation of rabbis."... Judge Rosenman, who was also in the bedroom said the group was not representative of the most thoughtful elements in Jewry. Rosenman's statement to Roosevelt that "leading Jews of his acquaintance" opposed the rabbis' march.

pp 227 - While Wise sent private memos clearly stating they thought the rescue of Jews was possible...in public they supported the Roosevelt administration's steadfast assertion that nothing could be done...

pp 230 - Congressman Gillette recalled a visit to his office by Wise and a few of his colleagues:" None of these gentlemen seemed to be enthusiastic for...the saving of the remnant of the Jewish people."

pp 241 - Wise felt strongly that the Gillette legislation did not provide for the "proper type of commission." With all that was known about the obstruction of the Jewish rescue by the State Department [then as now controlled by the Archbishop of New York], Wise was lobbying to leave the issue in their hands...Henry Morgenthau's aide Josiah Dubois uncovered the State Department's policy relevant to the issue of Jewish rescue... The stunning title to the Dubois memorandum was: REPORT TO THE SECRETARY ON THE ACQUIESCENCE OF THIS GOVERNMENT IN THE MURDER OF JEWS...Dubois pointed to the restrictions on visas as, "the most glaring example of the use of the machinery of this government to actually prevent the rescue of Jews."

** David Morrison's conclusions are too generous, but his scholarship is invaluable. He has added an essential contribution to the indisputable fact that America's Jewish leaders, led by Stephen Wise, purposely murdered by proxy, the Jews of Europe.
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Rabbi Stephen S. Wise Addressing a Protest Rally in New York, 1933

[Stephen Wise was a mere puppet of the Black Pope in adhering to the secret policy of the Allied leaders -Masons Churchill, FDR and Stalin - who also worked in conjunction with the Order's Axis fascist Roman Catholic dictators - Mason Mussolini and Hitler. That secret policy was the deliberate isolation of European Jewry thus condemning it to the Death Camps of Poland, those six slaughter pens having been financed and built by corporations owned or controlled by Vatican Knights of Malta.]

Now they are working on the Jews of Israel, starting with those of Gaza. **

End

The CFR is at work taking over the media of the Israeli patriots. Ronald Lauder of the CFR and his frontman Moshe Ben Zvi have bought out the newspapers Hatsofe and Makor Rishon, as well as the religious TV channel Tchelet. The first thing they did at Tchelet and Makor Rishon was fire the staff and change policies. This week Makor Rishon's editor was ousted and the new management has promised a more "middle of the road" editorial policy.

To prove the Gaza withdrawal is a gesture of war, consider what could have been done. Next door to Gaza is the 36,000 sq. mile Sinai Peninsula, which Egypt has been using to funnel-tunnel weapons against Israel, obviously in contravention of its supposed peace treaty with Israel. The population of the Sinai is under 50,000 and if anyone actually wanted to bring peace to the region, a viable Palestinian state could be established there.

[How true! But the Order's "foreign elite," controlled by the Pope, do not want peace - not quite yet. The withdrawal from Gaza - a land given by God to the tribe of Judah - is not only a gesture but rather a guarantee to another coming war in Israel, as was the Versailles Treaty the foundation for a subsequent war in defeated and plundered apostate Protestant Germany. In further igniting the present Anglo-American-led Papal Crusade against Islam, several CIA-pre-placed nuclear devices will be detonated on US soil in the near future. The Moslems will be blamed via the Order's CIA-controlled Al Qaeda Terrorist Network, and Mecca, Medina and the Jerusalem Mosques will reduced to rubble to the infinite delight of the Black Pope and the White Pope - the successor of the soon-to-be-deceased Pope John Paul II.]

octopusrex

19-01-2009, 03:14 PM

You want to avoid WWIII with Islam?

Easy: You get the highest ranking Imam, the Pope, the Dalai Lama, the highest ranking atheist etc. to come together to a round table and discuss the future of Islam.

Start bombing Muslims and you might just not be able to do it tho.

If the ordinary Muslim protects the Jihadist it is because the "enemy" has harmed the ordinary Muslim, don't you think?

14april2000

19-01-2009, 03:18 PM

http://www.vaticanassassins.org/jews.htm

Jewish Alert
Blowing the Shofar In America

We believe that Rome’s agenda for Apostate Protestant America is identical to her agenda carried out against Apostate Protestant Germany during the Jesuit General’s Second Thirty Years’ War conducted from 1914 to 1945. This includes the arrest and mass murder of the Jewish People within America’s borders in which crime we Believers on the Lord Jesus Christ of the Bible of the Protestant Reformation will NEVER participate. We have heeded the warning of the Word of God so beautifully restated by the poet R. H. McCartney found in Louis S. Bauman’s masterpiece, The Time of Jacob’s Trouble, An Answer to the Question of a Little Jewish Girl — “Tell Me Father, What Makes Folks Hate Us So?”, published in 1939 during the Jewish Holocaust in Europe:

http://www.vaticanassassins.org/holocaust.gif

Hands off, ye fools! Beware of what you do—
To man or nation, ‘tis most surely true
A curse on those who persecute the Jew!
Ye have not marked him—surely ‘tis his God—
He standeth now beneath the chastening rod—
Yet greatest rebel on the earthly sod!
Jehovah set apart, and not in vain
With a more fatal mark than once on Cain
For centuries the butt of grief and pain.

http://www.vaticanassassins.org/sephardi-1.gif

They had been sinners—surely sinners great—
Jehovah chose them for a high estate
That they to earth His glory would relate:
To stand His witnesses to near and far—
Who to earth’s night would be a glorious star
To give hope to a world that sin did mar!

http://www.vaticanassassins.org/sephardi-3.gif

When all the world a-whoring from Him went—
When to obnoxious gods men’s backs were bent,
Debauchery and wickedness man’s sole intent;
‘Twas then Jehovah in His sovereign grace,
Took by the hand, to have one chosen race,
To set the Jew before the wide world’s face!
They were to be His monuments of grace,
His priests, His witnesses to human race—
Head of all nations during time and space.

http://www.vaticanassassins.org/birkenau.gif

Hands off, O Gentile! or be grief your dower—
They still are girded by Jehovah’s power;
Who else could keep them for a gracious hour?
Tho’ curse be on them yet—and they must go
To ghastly depths of suffering and woe—
Yet woe to hand that shall that woe bestow!
Hands off, I say, for lo, Jehovah still
Hath a high place, now wretched Jews shall fill—
And none can hinder that—what is His will!

http://www.vaticanassassins.org/judaism.gif

A renovated world—a new-born earth—
No curse of sickness, nor a case of dearth,
A world of happiness, and song, and mirth!
Lo, then the Jew once more takes highest place:
The priests, the leaders of the human race—
But, then, blood-washed in Christ’s atoning grace,
Of former evil in the Jew—no trace!
A heaven on earth shall be in every space—
And earth behold—THE GLORY OF CHRIST’S FACE!

http://www.vaticanassassins.org/royalgrant.gif

The Sovereign Nation of Israel During Its Millennial Kingdom
Ruled by the Promised Seed of David, the King of the Jews,
The Lord Jesus Christ

This is the Royal Land Grant given by the preincarnate Son of God to Abraham, its western border being “the great (Mediterranean) Sea” (Ezekiel 48:28), its southern west to east border extending from the “river of Egypt” unto “the great river, the river Euphrates” (Genesis 15:18); and, its north to south border extending from “Hamath”, northeast of Damascus, to “Kadesh” in the south (Ezekiel 48:1-29). The Fourth and final Temple will be built by the Messiah and the Shekinah Glory will return. Messiah’s rule shall be “from sea to sea, and from the river (Euphrates) even to the ends of the earth” (Zechariah 9:10). Daily sacrifices will again be offered in remembrance of the death, burial and resurrection of the Lord Jesus Christ on behalf of his beloved “house of Jacob”, composing the “house of Israel” and the “house of Judah”, having established a “New Covenant” with them (Jeremiah 31:31-33). The converted, born again, Nation of Israel, through which “all nations of the earth” will then “be blessed”, will finally be, in the words of Moses (Deuteronomy 28:12, 13), the Head of all Nations. The risen Papal Caesar turned “Antichrist”, along with his Luciferian Jesuit Order, will have been disposed of by “the sharp two-edged sword” that proceeded out of the mouth of the “God of Jacob”, the returning “King of kings and Lord of lords”, Yeshua the Messiah.

Sincerely in the Faith of Christ,

Brother Eric

14april2000

19-01-2009, 03:34 PM

no, i think they take orders from the rothschild family, all the jesuit stuff is disinfo imo.

Rothschild Vatican Bankers

http://www.vaticanassassins.org/rothschild.htm

Ileana Stan 6.6.08 / 4am
http://www.gravatar.com/avatar/d790ff99df6ae9a5f24676a39bccafe7?s=32&d=identicon
Maybe the Pope is a loyalist of Lord Jack de Rothschild, you know? Not viceversa, le’olam…

http://www.vaticanassassins.org/troyspace-32.jpg
http://octagonlounge.wetpaint.com/
http://myspace.com/soul_inspiration

How to make this brief?
Excerpts from “Does the Vatican Hold Your Mortgage?” by William Thomas:
http://www.willthomasonline.net/willthomasonline/Vatican_Mortgage_Part_1.html

“In a country where there are Jesuits, they must either rule or the country must go to ruin… it is they who rule the world.” -Luigi Desanctis, official Censor of the Inquisition, Protestant Reformed pastor (1852)
“The Great Depression put all the smaller banks out of business and made the Federal Reserve Bank ‘lord of all’,” Eric Phelps documents. Guess who helped trigger the Great Depression? According to FDR’s son-in-law, it was a Knight of Malta named Joseph Kennedy. As Curtis Dall relates: “The feeling around the Street, in succeeding months, was that there were, in particular, three large short-sellers of stock, allegedly, Tom Bragg, Ben Smith, and Joe Kennedy… Of the three mentioned well-known short-sellers, Joe Kennedy was allegedly the most important, the most powerful and the most successful… Was Joe Kennedy carefully selected by world money leaders to sell short?”
Today, the largest bank in the world today, the Federal Reserve “is one of the greatest contributors, or players, in international trading,” Mullins observes.
The Fed gets its orders from the Queen Mum of All Banks, the Bank of England - aka, the Bank of Rothschild. Considered by many to be the world’s most powerful institution - the power behind all presidencies, dictatorships and thrones - does the Bank of England answer to any other bank?
Well, yes, actually.
The Bank of Rome began opening branch offices in Venice in 1587.
Bank of Rome = Vatican Bank controlled by the Jesuit General, aka the “Black” (hidden, shadowy) Pope.
The Jesuit’s Bank of Rome opened its Bank of England branch in 1694. The first bank to be named after a country, the Bank of England had nothing to do with the British government - except to own it through privately held, interest-compounded debt.
Unaccountable to either the Queen or Parliament, the misleadingly labeled “Bank of England” finances the throne, the British prime minister, parliament and much of the planet out of “The City” located in central London. All major British banks have their main offices in this “Square Mile” - as well as 70 U.S. banks. Throw in the London Stock Exchange, Lloyd’s of London, the Baltic Exchange (shipping), Fleet Street (publishing and newspapers), the London Commodity and Metal exchanges - and you are looking at Earth’s financial axis. [Descent into Slavery]
The City operates as a sovereign state, just like the Vatican. Since 1820, the Rothschilds have traditionally chosen The City’s Lord Mayor.
Back in the USA, as author Eric Phelps explained in an interview just before publication of his secrecy-shredding Vatican Assassins, (which was held up to include corrections by sympathetic Jesuits) - the Vatican’s Black Robes “own and control” the Federal Reserve Bank “by proxy, through the Knights of Malta, with their various trusts and so on. They never own anything outright; they always own it through a trusted third party.”
Including the Vatican-home mortgage connection.
“That the Jesuits were the disturbers of kingdoms, the oppressors of nations, the masters of the world, I freely admit.” -Marcel de la Roche Arnauld, Roman Catholic Priest (1827)
“All roads do lead to Rome … We have the Federal Reserve begat by the Bank of England begat by the Bank of Rome. Similarly, the Bank of Canada is an offspring of the Bank of England, which in turn is a child of the Bank of Rome - aka, the Vatican Bank.
And the Vatican, as everyone “knows” is run by the CNN-featured “White” Pope. Left untranslated is the coronation moment when the new Pontiff is told in Latin: “Take thou the tiara adorned with the triple crown, and know that thou art the father of princes and kings, and art the governor of the world.” [Vatican Assassins]
So who runs the White Pope?
Why the Googleable, shadowy Black Pope of course! The Jesuit General.
“This irritable tribe of priests, have subverted the pure morality of primitive Christianity to serve their own selfish interests.” The Jesuits have “perverted” Christianity “into an engine for enslaving mankind, a mere contrivance to fetch wealth and power to themselves.”
- Thomas Jefferson
According to Baron Avro Manhattan, author of a jaw-dropping series of Vatican books, “Many historians and researchers and one American Congressman stated that: ‘The Vatican through the Jesuit Order controlling the Illuminati is in control of the United States Federal Reserve.’” [Vatican Billions by Avro Manhattan]
The Jesuits had been tossed out Rome and every country in Europe for their back-stabbing treachery. As Phelps explained to interviewer Rick Martin: “Weishaupt was the promoter of the Illuminati, with the House of Rothschild, for the punishment of the Catholic monarchs of Europe, and the Pope, for suppressing the Jesuit Order. Weishaupt was under the supervision, at least initially, of Jesuit General Ricci, who died in 1775 in Italy. Weishaupt was under orders.”
http://www.willthomasonline.net/willthomasonline/Vatican_Mortgage_Part_2.html
“It is absolutely necessary for the salvation of every human creature to be subject to the Roman Pontiff.” -Pope Boniface, Unam Sanctam (1302)
… we’re beginning to see how more than 150 years ago, the General of a subversive military power called the Jesuits could brag to Duke de Brissac, “From this room, your grace, I govern not only Paris, but China - not only China, but the whole world - and all without any one knowing how it is done.” [Constitution of the Jesuits 1843]
National and personal sovereignty haven’t improved much since. As Baron Avro Manhattan put it, the Pope “doesn’t have to pray for divine intervention to operate the levers of economic power - he merely has to give instructions to his officials in the Vatican Bank. Only the pope and a couple of top bank officers know precise details of its operations… This secrecy is one of the main reasons why few people know that the papacy directs one of the world’s major financial corporations.”
The Vatican likes to point out that it’s going broke running Vatican City. But Cardinal Edmund Szoka, the Vatican’s unofficial finance minister, told Money Week that the Vatican’s assets total some $5 billion. Vatican City “has a separate financial statement,” he added.
According to Baron Manhattan’s research: “The Vatican has large investments with the Rothschilds of Britain, France and America, with the Hambros Bank, with the Credit Suisse in London and Zurich. In the United States it has large investments with the Morgan Bank, the Chase-Manhattan Bank, the First National Bank of New York, the Bankers Trust Company, and others. The Vatican has billions of shares in the most powerful international corporations such as Gulf Oil, Shell, General Motors, Bethlehem Steel, General Electric, International Business Machines, T.W.A., etc. ”
A nationally syndicated Catholic priest has stated, “The Catholic Church must be the biggest corporation in the United States. We have a branch office in every neighborhood. Our assets and real estate holdings must exceed those of Standard Oil, A.T.&T., and U.S. Steel combined. And our roster of dues-paying members must be second only to the tax rolls of the United States Government.” [The Vatican Billions]
“But this is just a small portion of the wealth of the Vatican, which in the U.S. alone, is greater than that of the five wealthiest giant corporations of the country,” Baron Manhattan explains. “The Catholic church is the biggest financial power, wealth accumulator and property owner in existence.” [Vatican Billions]
Don’t forget to throw in more than 18,000 works of art. [Fortune Dec 21/87]
The Vatican’s gold treasure alone has been estimated by the United Nations World Magazine to amount to several billion dollars. The Independent has independently confirmed that “the Vatican Bank - Istituto per le Opere di Religione - manages more than $4 billion in assets. It does not reveal its profits or dividends, which are paid directly to the Pope. It enjoys the status of a central bank and has a dealing room adorned with crucifixes and papal portraits where 20 traders work .” [Independent Apr 19/02]
“The Society of the Jesuits has the power to hide the sun, and make men blind and deaf to its caprice.” -Montlarc (circa 1700)
“It is my opinion that if the liberties of this country - the United States of America - are destroyed, it will be by the subtlety of the Roman Catholic Jesuit priests, for they are the most crafty, dangerous enemies to civil and religious liberty. They have instigated most of the wars of Europe.” - General Lafayette, aide to General George Washington (1799)
“The Jesuits are a naked sword, whose hilt is at Rome but its blade is everywhere, invisible until its stroke is felt.” -Andre’ Dupin, French Statesman, member of King Louis Philippe’s Cabinet which expelled the Order (1831)
“They are a public plague, and the plague of the world… Every species of vice finds its patronage in them. There is no perjury, nor sacrilege, nor parricide, nor incest, nor rapine, nor fraud, nor treason which cannot be masked as meritorious beneath the mantle of their dispensation.” -Paolo Sarpi, Italian Roman Catholic historian of the Jesuits’ Council of Trent (1620)
“The Jesuits are a military organization, not a religious order. Their chief is a general of an army, not the mere father abbot of a monastery. And the aim of this organization is: Power. Power in its most despotic exercise. Absolute power, universal power, power to control the world by the volition of a single man. Jesuitism is the most absolute of despotisms: and at the same time the greatest and most enormous of abuses… The general of the Jesuits insists on being master, sovereign, over the sovereign. Wherever the Jesuits are admitted they will be masters, cost what it may. Their society is by nature dictatorial, and therefore it is the irreconcilable enemy of all constituted authority. Every act, every crime, however atrocious, is a meritorious work, if committed for the interest of the Society of the Jesuits, or by the order of the general.” -Napoleon Bonaparte.

http://troyspace.wordpress.com/2008/06/04/john-mccains-rothschild-connections/

size_of_light

19-01-2009, 03:56 PM

Why so spam crazy, 14april? Few (if any) people will actually bother to read all that info.

14april2000

19-01-2009, 03:57 PM

The Five Dancing Israelis Arrested On 9-11

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/fiveisraelis.html

This for you runciter

Why Jewish Bankers Love Anti-Semites

http://www.savethemales.ca/001143.html

Yes, the Mossad was involved. Yes, the CIA played an important role. Yes, the members of the CFR knew what was coming down. And yes they all knew full-well and without a shadow of a doubt that Muslim terrorists were going to be used as scapegoats and that they had the full cooperation of all the Middle East leaders who agreed to play the bad guys in this fake war on terrorism and who together with their corrupted American leaders are all playing on the same New World Order/Illuminati team.

Confession No. 14: The 9/11 Dead, Speaking In The Midnight Skies, Demand Justice
Any discussion of who are the real perpertrators of 9/11 is incomplete with discussing Vatican and Jesuit Order hierarchy.
15 Sep 2006

http://www.arcticbeacon.com/confessions/15-Sept-2006.html

By Greg Szymanski

If you listened closely last night, the voices of the 9/11 dead began speaking from the heavens, demanding with a thunderous midnight cry to bring the true perpetrators to justice.

And in the name of the fallen, we begin this Sept. 11 Confession with the Jesuits with a moment of silence and a solemn prayer for the more than 3,000 innocent souls killed by the U.S. government with complicity of the Vatican hierarchy and the evil hierarchy of the Jesuit Order.

Yes, the Mossad was involved. Yes, the CIA played an important role. Yes, the members of the CFR knew what was coming down. And yes they all knew full-well and without a shadow of a doubt that Muslim terrorists were going to be used as scapegoats and that they had the full cooperation of all the Middle East leaders who agreed to play the bad guys in this fake war on terrorism and who together with their corrupted American leaders are all playing on the same New World Order/Illuminati team.

However, even if you nailed every last one of them you still wouldn't have cut off the head of the real snaky perpetrator until the chain of 9/11 legal causation was linked to the Vatican hierarchy and the creepy hierarchy of the Jesuit Order led by the priest known as the Black Pope and the Jesuit General, Fr. Peter-Hans Kolvenbach.

Although prayers or a court of law can never bring back the lives cut short on 9/11, we can at least in the names of those who died, as well as for the sake of their loved ones, dedicate all of America's resources and all of America's waking hours to nail the real killers hiding behind black robes and the thin veil of a free America.

Simply put, five years have passed and the 9/11 criminal investigation has been a joke.

The U.S. has put up a big smokescreen. The media has helped spread more smoke. Hollywood movie and video makers are now profiting from the tragedy by spreading more false propaganda.

And the table is now set like it was in the JFK assassination debate for 30 more years of endless seminars and symposiums among truth seekers who enjoy listening to themselves talk ad essentially playing with the tail of the snake instead of having the courage to cut off it's ugly head.

As we meet for Confession 14 among the peaks of the Rockies where God's beauty still abounds, we urge the Jesuit Order and the Vatican hierarchy "to finally come clean and give it up," so to speak in the parlance of street criminals, as many good Americans now fully understand who are the true spiritual leaders of the New World Order.

However, those Americans who still only listen to Katie Couric and mainstream media, who are covering for the spiritual controllers, are told the war on terrorism is being caused and 9/11 was caused by Muslim extremists.

For those Americans who don't buy the official government story, now estimated by a recent poll to be 36 percent of the population, they are forced to turn to the alternative media for answers.

And when one turns to the alternative media, they are most likely to hear in unison from most sources in radio, print and internet television, the real perpetrators of the war on terrorism and 9/11 are either the international banksters and the Zionist Jews.

What's most disturbing in the alternative media is that usually the discussion of the real snakes in the grass goes no farther than corrupted politicians, Zionist Jews and international thieves and banksters.

However, after a close examination of distorted and hidden history, as well as modern day realities of the true power of the Vatican and their henchmen Jesuits, we have come to the conclusion that any discussion of who really caused 9/11 is incomplete without a thorough investigation of the above-mentioned entities, both of which are far more than just benign religious organizations.

Knowing this discussion will be silenced on this 5th anniversary of 9/11 by the true spiritual controllers and their temporal co-conspirators in the media, government and other religious organizations, we present the writings of true patriot, Eric Jon Phelps, author of Vatican Assassins, who is one of the few Americans brave enough to speak out and cut off the head of the real snake behind 9/11 and the war on terrorism – the Vatican hierarchy and the hierarchy of the Jesuit Order.

Here are some of Phelps' writings:

Vatican and Jesuit Connection to 9/11

Peter-Hans Kolvenbach, the General of the International Military Order of the Society of Jesus, commonly known as "the Black Pope", ordered the attack on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon on Tuesday, September 11, 2001, with the advice and consent of his General Staff, composed of five assistants (each representing a hemisphere and under whom are many advisory Provincials), an advisor (resembling the likes of a military commander to warn him of any faults or mistakes), and his confessor (to ease his conscience and absolve him of his many sins).

Why? Because the appointed time has arrived for the Jesuit General to destroy both the Dome of the Rock and the Al Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem, secretly using his CIA/Nazi-trained, Masonic Zionist Mossad in conjunction with his CIA/Nazi-trained, Masonic Islamic Intelligence Agencies, including Osama bin Laden's MAK and Pakistan's ISI, while shrouded in the confusion of a huge aerial war yet to come. This will enable the General's crusading Knights Templars (the present day Shriner Freemasons) to rebuild Solomon's Temple — for the Papal Caesar in Rome's Vatican. And how could the Black Pope destroy these Moslem Mosques, they comprising the third most important Islamic religious site in the world behind Saudi Arabia's Mecca and Medina, without causing an uncontrollable Moslem holy war, called a "jihad", resulting in the destruction of Pope Pius XII's creation of Zionist Israel? (Remember, Israel was admitted into the New York-based United Nations in 1949 through the efforts of Jesuit-trained Francis Cardinal Spellman – the darling of Pope Pius XII who, after his Jesuits carried out the Jewish Holocaust in Europe and then driving the survivors to Palestine, intended, under the guidance of his Jesuit confessor, Augustin Cardinal Bea, to make Jerusalem an international city – while governed by the Papal Caesar's Chaim Weizmann and his Masonic Jewish Zionists.) The Black Pope must cause a war using a country he also wishes to further destroy. Enter the "Holy Roman" Fourteenth Amendment American Jesuit Empire created in 1868 on the ruins of George Washington's Calvinist Republic, the last political stronghold of the Protestant Reformation with freedom of conscience, freedom of speech and freedom of the press.

Here was the "Father General's" plan. In synchronizing his worldwide overt and covert factions to work the Order's evil ends of the Vatican's Counter-Reformation in restoring the Papal Caesar as the absolute Universal Monarch of the World, the Black Pope used his Masonically-controlled, fanatically anti-Jewish Race, Islamic Intelligence operatives under the domestic control of the CIA (Osama bin Laden having been directed, financed and trained by the CIA for at least ten years — just like Jesuit-trained and CIA-financed Fidel Castro before he, like bin Laden, became a false enemy of the CFR-controlled American government) to be openly and notoriously instructed as Islamic pilots at the Venice Airport (a Florida facility used by the CIA since 1948) in order for Archbishop Egan's controlled American Press to spread the prepared news release that the doomed airliners were hijacked by "Arab terrorists" in the employ of Osama bin Laden when in fact, to the horror of the American pilots, the airliners had been taken over and guided to their targets, remotely controlled by American Military Intelligence operatives overseen by the Black Pope's CIA/NSA.

The Mussulmans in training never boarded the airliners involved in the September attacks evidenced by the absence of Islamic names on all four passenger lists. There was no fight between the passengers and the "hijackers" on flight 93, as reported by the deceived wife of the late Jeremy Glick. For flight 93 was shot down by an F-16 fighter, blowing off its wing which landed at least six miles away from the main wreckage! And if the inexperienced "hijackers" had boarded all four airliners, the novices never would have been able to navigate the planes into the targets unless they had been crack fighter pilots according to a group of highly professional, both civilian and military, American aviators. Archbishop Egan's CFR-controlled American Press then placed the blame for these acts of high treason and murder squarely on the shoulders of the Black Pope's Saudi prince and CIA operative, Osama bin Laden, including his al-Qaeda Network secretly working for the Jesuit General's International Terrorist Network. Tens of thousands of "heretic and liberal" Americans perished, thereby justifying a war between the Moslem World and "the Great Satan".

(Has not American technology, developed through the Protestant right of freedom of conscience as applied to science, brought wealth and prosperity to the once poverty stricken, barren wilderness of Saudi Arabia, the cultural center for the religion of Islam? And if so, why would not Saudi Arabia, in a gesture of thankfulness, give economic aid to their brother Moslem Arab Palestinians enabling them to relocate to other surrounding Islamic nations of their choice? Would not this further secure the peace of the Jewish People now in their own land, having been persecuted and mass murdered for the last two thousand years, whose right to the land through the Abrahamic Covenant has never been abrogated by them or disannulled by Almighty God who gave it to this "seed of Abraham" in Genesis 17: 7, 8?

A Papal conspirator in the assassination of Israel's Masonic Prime Minister, Yitzak Rabin, Freemason Shimon Peres, who was educated by Jesuits as a youth in Poland and now the Minister of Foreign Affairs of Zionist Israel, is being welcomed to the Jesuit General's Council on Foreign Relations, based in New York's Harold Pratt House, by its Masonic Chairman of the Board, Peter G. Peterson, and by one of its Directors, Leslie H. Gelb, on September 29, 1993. Shimon Peres also holds shares in the PLO's public phone company, Paltel, in conjunction with the Bin Laden Royal Family of Saudi Arabia and Yassir Arafat! Since there is an obvious Bush/Bin Laden business connection through the CFR,s Carlyle Group headed by Edward Cardinal Egan's Knight of Malta Frank C. Carlucci, why should not there be a similar connection between Peres, Bin Laden and Arafat? For they are all in the same Masonic Brotherhood's "Invisible Empire" overseen by the sovereign Grand Master and Commander of all - the Black Pope.

A Papal mass murderer of Jewish People, "Chairman" of the Palestinian Liberation Organization (PLO) and professional agitator, Freemason Yassir Arafat is also being welcomed by the Archbishop of New York's Council on Foreign Relations in the person of one of its "Presiders", Lee H. Hamilton, on January 20, 2000.

Could it be that neither the Masonic Jewish Zionists in the person of CFR-controlled Shimon Peres nor the Masonic Moslem Palestinian Liberation Organization in the person of CFR-controlled Yassir Arafat, both being secret agents for the Black Pope, truly want to resolve this Jesuit agitation? Do not the ongoing and unfair international negotiations, like the historic Treaty of Versailles, always promote more intense resultant agitations, furthering the agenda of Rome's Papal Caesar who intends to rule the world from a Third Temple in Jerusalem? Indeed, this unceasing agitation is necessary if the Pope is to be the Universal Monarch of the World!)

The Black Pope now has a perfect war between two Peoples he wishes to destroy. For both Peoples, the White and Black Protestants and Baptists along with the Jewish Race of North America, and the Semitic Moslems of the Middle East, are condemned by the Jesuits' evil and wicked Council of Trent, they having been historically the greatest enemies of the Jesuit Order's "infallible" Pope, who, since the days of Innocent III (1215), has claimed to be the one true God on earth. According to Motley's The Dutch Republic, it was America's White Anglo-Saxon Protestant-Calvinist Dutch Reformed forefathers, known as the "Wild Beggars of the Sea", who gave religious liberty to Bible-based Western Civilization. These godly and fearless sailors, in stoutly resisting Papal tyranny, wore an Islamic Crescent – not a Cross – on their caps with the immemorial inscription written below:

"Rather Turkish Than Popish".

The institutions to be destroyed on September 11, 2001 were the Banking and Military centers of "the Great Satan" – the Pope's World Trade Center and the Pentagon overseen by his Knights of Malta – supporting and protecting the Pope's Zionist government of Israel. There, the Jewish People, in the midst of whom are the Lord's beloved Jewish Race, known as "the holy seed" with Biblical promises yet to inherit including the fulfilling of the Abrahamic and Davidic Covenants under their returning Messiah, the Lord Jesus Christ, have been set up to be ultimately betrayed, as they are UNKNOWINGLY living under the secret government of the Black Pope, publicly overseen by his Masonic Jewish Zionists in conjunction with certain of his Masonic Talmudic Rabbis, who betrayed their own Jewish People, both racially and religiously, into Hitler's Death Camps during World War II!

Its subterranean storehouse of gold quite possibly having been previously removed to the New York Federal Reserve Bank, the World Trade Center was sacrificed, INTERNALLY IMPLODED, using surgically placed Composition C5 charges detonated by the New York Archbishop, Edward Cardinal Egan, through his unified American Intelligence Community.

Cardinal Egan's American Intelligence Network includes the Central Intelligence Agency, the National Security Agency, the Secret Service, Military Intelligence, the Federal Bureau of Investigation, and the Mafia Commission. Years ago these agencies and criminals all worked together in carrying out the Kennedy Assassination and Cover-up under the control of their former master, Francis Cardinal Spellman. The World Trade Center's Masonic Twin Towers, Jachin and Boaz, were sacrificed in EXCHANGE for the future destruction of the Dome of the Rock and the Al Aqsa Mosque in Jerusalem. This mass murder has ignited American blind patriotic rage as calculated, that rage being now directed by the Black Pope's CFR-controlled Press, including his CFR-controlled Masonic Jewish Zionists, against the Islamic Middle East Peoples — among whom reside the Masonic Moslem branch of the Jesuit General's International Terrorist Network. This act of secret Papal terrorism has been used to justify a massive foreign war, a secret Papal Crusade, while the tools of the Jesuit Order have tyrannically implemented domestic martial law by means of the "USA PATRIOT Act" in America and the "Bomb Bill C-36 Act" in Canada. Sadly, cooler and more informed, truly patriotic heads have not prevailed. God help us!

This attack was an act of war carried out by the slaves of the Black Pope, both domestic and foreign, thereby enabling the White Pope's American fascist puppet, George W. Bush, to declare a "war on [Islamic] terrorism" – to the exclusion of Roman Catholic terrorism led by secret Jesuits such as Fidel Castro of Communist Cuba and Gerry Adams of the IRA – with no specific enemy nation in sight. (For Washington, D.C. is secretly ruled by Edward Cardinal Egan from St. Patrick's Cathedral in New York. As the country's "Military Vicar" and most powerful American Archbishop, Egan is aided by Georgetown University and Fordham University Jesuits including the learned and seasoned, eighty-two year old, Avery Cardinal Dulles.) This massive retaliation, to last between four to ten years being another Papal Crusade against the Islamic Peoples in rivaling those of the Dark Ages, has now been declared. It will be waged by Cardinal Egan's CFR-controlled Commander-in-Chief, George W. Bush, having been advised of his role to play during his most recent visit with the Baal-worshipping, cannibalistic (believing the unbiblical doctrine of transubstantiation), absolute dictator in the Vatican, Pope John Paul II.

New York's Edward Cardinal Egan, being the "Archbishop of the political Capital of the World", the master of the Council on Foreign Relations and thus controlling all the agencies comprising his unified American Intelligence Network, has used six primary tools in igniting this secret Papal Crusade. They are President George W. Bush, ex-President George H. W. Bush, Vice President Dick Cheney, National Security Advisor to the President Condoleezza Rice, Federal Reserve Board Chairman Alan Greenspan, and CIA Director George Tenet, all being members of the Archbishop's Council on Foreign Relations. The following Bill of Particulars justify our charges:

1. The "terrorist" attacks were predicted and exposed well in advance of September 11, 2001. Dr. Garth Nicholson, Ph.D., a foremost researcher of the Gulf War Syndrome investigators, reported to Pentagon officials that he had confirmed intelligence indicating that on Sept. 11, 2001 a "terrorist" strike against the Pentagon would be made. Their sources included individuals in key intelligence positions, the Mafia, and one high-level African diplomat. The warning was passed on to, among others, the National Security Council (Condoleezza Rice) but is was ignored. Dr. Leonard Horowitz, an award winning author of several tremendous books, also made a valiant effort to alert the government, but to no avail.

2. On Friday, September 7, Florida Governor Jeb Bush, a brother to the President, issued an Executive Order in which members of the Florida National Guard were activated, "for the purpose of training to support law-enforcement personnel and emergency management personnel in the event of civil disturbances or natural disaster." The Bush Dynasty, including the former Director of the CIA and business partner of the Gulf War's Saddam Hussein, Shriner George H. W. Bush, not only knew the attacks were coming but actively participated in them.

3. On Sunday night, September 17, 2001, in the Providence of the risen Son of God, CBS's television program titled "60 Minutes" revealed that President Bush's close associates had suddenly, and inexplicably, sold all their airline stock only a few days before the "terrorist" attacks. The story was subsequently buried by the CFR-controlled Press, which includes CFR-controlled CBS. Again, the CFR/CIA-controlled Bush Dynasty, had a foreknowledge of the coming mass murder and thus stand indicted of high treason being the agents of Edward Cardinal Egan.

4. President and Papal Agent George W. Bush controlling the Federal Emergency Management Agency (FEMA) sent the Urban Search and Rescue Team to New York City THE NIGHT BEFORE the attacks occurred! One FEMA official, Mr. Tom Kennedy, told Press icon, CFR member and player in the Kennedy Assassination, Dan Rather, on September 11, 2001, "We're currently one of the first teams that was deployed to support the City of New York in this disaster. We arrived on late Monday night [that is, on September 10, the NIGHT BEFORE] and went right into action on Tuesday morning."

5. Osama bin Laden and his band of "Terrorists" could not have pulled off the "sophisticated" operation of four simultaneous air hijackings, and precision directed attacks, without the support of one or more "intelligence organizations [which includes the CIA and its Director, CFR member George Tenet]." This was the expert testimony provided by past CIA Afghanistan operations director and bin Laden's intelligence advisor, Milt Bearden, interviewed by Dan Rather on September 12, 2001. In fact, when pressed by Dan Rather to endorse the theory of bin Laden's culpability, Mr. Bearden stated, "If they didn't have an Osma bin Laden, they would invent one."

6. On October 31, 2001, the French daily "Le Figaro" reported that Osama bin Laden had met with a high-level CIA official in July 2000. At that time, bin Laden was already being sought for trial due to his involvement in two U.S. Embassy bombings and the U.S.S. Cole attack. The meeting was held in bin Laden's private suite in the plush Dubai Hospital built by American construction companies for the care of the Order's Masonic royal Moslem families running Islam's unified Middle East Intelligence Community and Terrorist Network on behalf of the CIA. Though he could have been killed – like the CIA's Fidel Castro – according to President Bill Clinton's intelligence findings, on July 14th he was released and left Dubai on his private jet. Osama bin Laden is a creature of the Black Pope's CIA and has remained so to this day.

7. Osama bin Laden took his direction and money from the CIA for ten years. During this time, approximately five (5) billion dollars was funneled to his organization through black op budgets (financed by the Black Pope's International Drug Trade) into a CIA operation known as Maktab al-Khidamar—the MAK. It is clear, as a MAK mercenary army leader, bin Laden's fortune vastly increased during that time. Since, like the Mafia, "Once in the CIA, always in the CIA", bin Laden's MAK is merely an extension of the Black Pope's International Intelligence Community and Terrorist Network. And if the CIA controls the Intelligence Network of Afghanistan, then it controls the Intelligence Agencies of Pakistan, Iraq, Iran, Jordan, Syria, Lebanon, Egypt, Libya and Turkey. Indeed, the words of Taliban leader Mullah Mohammed Omar were correct when he said in an interview contained on page thirty-four in the November issue of Free American:

"America controls the governments of the Islamic countries…It should stop trying to impose its empire on the rest of the world, especially on Islamic countries."

8. Aaron Swirsksi, one of the architects of the World Trade Center, said they designed the towers to withstand airplane collisions. "I designed it for a 707 hit," he said. The collapse of the buildings came as a complete "shock" to him and his colleagues. Van Romero, a demolition expert, former director of the Energetic Materials Research and Testing Center, and current Vice President for research at New Mexico Institute of Mining and Technology, said that the manner in which the Twin Towers collapsed resembled those of controlled implosions used in planned demolition. "My opinion is, based on the videotapes, that after the airplanes hit the World Trade Center there were some explosive devices inside the buildings that caused the towers to collapse," Romero said. NBC News interviewed people who had escaped "ground zero" on September 11, 2001. One unidentified man said "We were stuck on the stairs for a while. I came down from the 85th floor. When we were just about to leave the building, there was a blast." A woman's testimony followed: "I got stuck on the stairs. When we got to the lobby there was a blast," she said.

Further, the demolition of the North Tower of the World Trade Center, floors 22, 23, and 24, destroyed massive FBI evidence against CFR member James Giffen, the CEO of the CFR's Mobile Corporation, for illegal oil swaps between Iran and Kazakhstan. There was also evidence against CFR member and Shriner Freemason Alan Greenspan – the Jewish Chairman of the Board of Governors of the Jesuit General's Federal Reserve Banking System – involving GOLD PRICE FIXING. Greenspan's Masonic Jewish Zionist partners in crime included the CFR's Morgan Stanley & Company and the CFR's Goldman Sachs & Company. The evidence shows that those floors exploded and were destroyed minutes before the explosions from the airplane, and suggests that the airplane crashes were simply a "ruse of war". Obviously, the Intelligence Community of Archbishop Edward Cardinal Egan IMPLODED the buildings which not only suppressed and destroyed evidence, but also resulted in the death and burial of at least forty-two of his loyal Knights of Columbus and several honest FBI agents. Indeed the Archbishop followed the great Jesuit maxim of "the ends justify the means."

9. On September 11, 2001, President Bush, with the full knowledge of CFR member and the intimate friend of Archbishop Egan, Vice President Richard Cheney, was in Sarasota, Florida (the home of the Venice Airport, a CIA facility, that had openly and notoriously trained Islamic pilots thereby enabling the Black Pope's CIA to blame its contract agent, Osama bin Laden, for the destruction of the WTC). The President was "reading to children in a classroom at 9:05 a.m. when his chief of staff, Andrew Card, whispered [the news] into his ear, according to an Associated Press release of September 12, the day after the attack. The President briefly turned somber before he resumed reading…[Next] President Bush listened to eighteen Booker Elementary School second-graders read a story about a girl's pet goat…before he spoke briefly and somberly about the terrorist attacks." Here we have America's Commander-in-Chief calmly talking for about thirty minutes before he leisurely responded to the country's greatest national security crisis in history along with its accompanying tragedies. And no wonder, for he had been briefed by Pope John Paul II during his visit to the Vatican only weeks prior to our national disaster! CFR member and CIA Director George Tenet had also kept the President advised.

10. Many journalists have reported that the bombing of Afghanistan, allegedly intended to punish the Taliban for affiliations with bin Laden, is simply a cover for the Taliban's destruction of Afghanistan's opium crop thus the curtailing of the Black Pope's International Drug Trade. The Taliban also withdrew its former support for an oil pipeline to be built by CFR Henry Kissinger and CFR George Shultz's Unocal Corporation through Afghanistan from the vast Caspian Sea oil fields. September 11 provided a great excuse to pursue the Jesuit Order/CFR's illegal drug traffic along with its petrochemical, economic, and "national security" martial law objective. More importantly, this pipeline is necessary for the fueling of the war machine of our future invader, the massive Red Chinese Army, under the command of the Company of Jesus.

We, the American people, thanks to our Popish, prostitute Press, have been hoodwinked into fighting this war even as we were deceived into fighting the Pope's war against the Japanese People during World War II, the consummation of the Jesuit General's Second Thirty Years War waged from 1914 to 1945. For the attack on Pearl Harbor was no surprise to the nation's most visible Shriner Freemason, President Franklin D. Roosevelt, even as the attack on the World Trade Center and the Pentagon was no surprise to the nation's most visible Skull and Bones member, the wicked and evil mass murderer, President George W. Bush.

If the foregoing scenario is true, we believe the American People, deceived by our own Jesuit/CFR-controlled government, will fall into the trap of fighting a lengthy, large scale Middle East War, resulting in at least six things that will further our country's demise including the scrapping of our Reformed Protestant Constitution, while thoroughly benefiting the Jesuit Order's Counter-Reformation. They are:

1. Worldwide anti-Jewish fury on a grand scale, especially in America, as a result of the Black Pope's openly agitating, secretly CFR-controlled, Masonic Jewish Zionists and thus, the beloved Jewish People of Israel being blamed for the Papal Caesar's international Jesuit Crusade;

2. The destruction of both the Dome of the Rock and the Al Aqsa Mosque – blamed on American Military forces – thereby enabling the Pope's Shriner Freemasons to rebuild Solomon's Temple, while simultaneously unifying Islamic fury, coordinated and directed by the Black Pope's Masonic Moslem Intelligence Agencies in conjunction with his Masonic North American Intelligence Agencies, against the "heretic and liberal" American and Canadian Peoples of North America, we having been paganized through the Jesuit Order's Bible-rejecting and deceptive educational systems, controlled Press and demoralizing theater movies;

3. The killing of millions of fanatical Moslems who would otherwise attack Israel when the Dome of the Rock and the Al Aqsa Mosque are destroyed in Jerusalem, not to mention the possible destruction of Mecca and Medina, further securing the peace of the Papal Caesar's Zionist government of Israel. That false peace will be maintained by the united European nations, their unity brought about by the Club of Rome in the person of the Spanish Knight of Malta and Commander of NATO forces during the bombing mass-murder of Orthodox Serbs in Yugoslavia, JAVIER SOLANA. These united, predominantly Roman Catholic, European nations will compose the Pope's revived Holy Roman Empire , the new "Sword of the Church". At this time the Black Pope will have no more need for the drugged, exhausted, bankrupt, amalgamated and demoralized American People of his "Holy Roman" Fourteenth Amendment American Empire;

4. The tyranny of a White American fascist military dictator having arisen out of the "New Right" Republican Party due to anarchy giving way to a race war as a result of Negro and Hispanic rioting in our major cities coordinated by the Black Pope's Masonically-led and racist Black army of the Nation of Islam. He will use America's existing concentration camp system to kill millions of Jews, "heretics and liberals" pursuant to the Jesuits' evil Council of Trent – just as Hitler "the Austrian" and homosexual drug addict destroyed apostate Protestant Germany with the help of FDR's USAF and Churchill's RAF - further justifying our nation's destruction;

5. The betrayal and defeat of our armies fighting a two-front war which we cannot win, one in the Middle East and the other possibly in the Far East against China, just as Napoleon betrayed his army in Russia in 1812, and just like Hitler betrayed his army in Russia one hundred and thirty years later, both treasonous dictators having been under orders from the advisors of the Black Pope;

6. Massive invasion and attack into North America, China and Russia storming the West Coast while China and a united Moslem host march into the Southeast Coast, known as "the Bible belt", using the Bahamas and Cuba as staging bases. Our Jesuit-controlled leaders carrying out the nation's immigration policies, in establishing a huge resident "fifth column" of Chinese, Moslem, Hindu and Hispanic aliens within our borders, have betrayed us Americans. The heart-breaking result will be the subjugation of the last apostate bastion of the Protestant Reformation and will compel Europe to unite reviving the old Holy Roman Empire – under the Papal Caesar.

This scenario is the answer as to Who and Why we were attacked on September 11, 2001, Bloody Black Tuesday. But after all, we apostate, Bible-rejecting White People deserve it, as I have said on this web page and in my book, Vatican Assassins: "Wounded In The House Of My Friends". The Jesuit General's "Holy Roman" Fourteenth Amendment American Empire has been used to fulfill the Papal Caesar's evil Council of Trent by oppressing and destroying "heretic and liberal" Bible believers, peoples and governments of at least eighty nations during the last one hundred years. Called by Jesuit John Courtney Murray and Knight of Malta Henry R. Luce "the American Century", the Knights of Malta and Shriner Freemasons on Wall Street restored the Temporal Power of the Papacy (which Power was destroyed in the glorious Nineteenth Century) by financing Mao Tse-tung's Communism, Stalin's Communism, Hitler's Nazism and the Fascism of Mussolini, Franco and Castro.

We Americans have it coming, and now that we have leapt into this trap of a Middle East war with the Moslem World, advocated by our Pennsylvania Senator and Shriner Freemason, the infamous Arlen Specter (who was "Cardinal Spellman's Jew" having authored the magic single-bullet theory of the Warren Commission and served as President Clinton's defender while on trial in the Senate), apparently the righteous Judgment of the risen Son of God is about to unfold. Our beloved country, the only nation in the history of the world to be founded on the Bible of the Protestant Reformation, will be turned into a nightmarish police state and a Nazi/Soviet concentration camp hell-on-earth because we have forgotten the God of our White American Protestant and Baptist-Calvinist founding fathers, the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob Whose Spirit inspired these words:

For God so loved the world, that he gave his only begotten Son,

that whosoever believeth in him should not perish,

but have everlasting life.

For God sent not his Son into the world to condemn the world;

but that the world through him might be saved.

He that believeth on him is not condemned:

but he that believeth not is condemned already,

because he hath not believed in the name

of the only begotten Son of God.

--John 3:16-18

What is the Real Power of New York's Edward Cardinal Egan

The power of the Archbishop of New York has not diminished but rather grown. Today, the man who wields the power of Cardinal Spellman from "the Powerhouse" in New York - St. Patrick's Cathedral (across the street from Rockefeller Center) - and continues to suppress the truth about the assassination of President Kennedy by virtue of his Oath as a Cardinal, is the arch-conspirator, traitor to his American countrymen and master of the infamous, Jesuit-trained agitator, high-level Freemason and CFR member, former President Bill Clinton, and now master of Skull and Bones member, President George W. Bush, (whose father, George H. W. Bush, is also a high-level Freemason, a former Director of both the CFR and CIA, as well as a participant in the Kennedy Assassination),

Remembering that Fr. Kolvenbach is the master of the Pope, Edward Cardinal Egan of New York, and President "elect" George W. Bush (of the Bush crime family descending from England's House of Stuart), as well as the petty military dictators of Communist Russia and China, we would do well to meditate on the words of Napoleon recorded in his Memoirs - the Emperor having been betrayed into the hands of his captors by his Jesuit masters - while imprisoned on the island of St. Helena in the middle of the South Atlantic Ocean:

"The Jesuits are a military organization, not a religious order. Their chief is a general of an army, not the mere father abbot of a monastery. And the aim of this organization is POWER. Power in its most despotic exercise. Absolute power, universal power, power to control the world by the volition of a single man...

The General of the Jesuits insists on being master, sovereign, over the sovereign. Wherever the Jesuits are admitted they will be masters, cost what it may... Every act, every crime, however atrocious, is a meritorious work, if committed for the interest of the Society of the Jesuits, or by the order of the general."

Cardinal Egan, a staunch supporter of the "infallible" Pope's Temporal Power and the Jesuit General's evil Council of Trent, will continue the Great Jesuit Cover-up, even as his predecessors, Cardinals Spellman, Cooke and O'Connor. This power is exercised through New York's Council on Foreign Relations, as both former Presidential candidates, Albert Gore and George W. Bush are under its control. Both candidates were also present (along with former President Bill Clinton and his wife Hillary) during Cardinal O'Connor's funeral overseen by the Knights of Malta at St. Patrick's Cathedral.

President and Mrs. Clinton were flanked by presidential candidates George W. Bush (lef and Al Gore - none of whom were Roman Catholics - at the funeral Mass for their political boss, John Cardinal O'Connor.

Of this Jesuit power over statesmen through the Pope and his hierarchy, M.F. Cusack wrote in her 1896 masterpiece, The Black Pope, on page 106:

"It is here that the tremendous power of the Church makes itself felt. It is through this [Jesuit] 'direction' that statesmen are compelled to act, not for the benefit of the country to which they belong, but for the benefit of the Church, which controls them. It is here that matters of the most secret nature are discussed and decided [like the present Crusade against Islam, the attack into Afghanistan commencing on the anniversary of the naval Battle of Lepanto when the Armada of the Pope's Knights of Malta destroyed the Armada of the Islamic Ottoman Turks on October 7, 1571]. It is here that alliances...are arranged, and political treaties are agreed on."

Hopefully, the Jesuit Order, in control of the Archbishop with his Network of Vatican Assassins, will be brought to justice for the cold-blooded murder of President Kennedy and for continuing the Great Jesuit Cover-up of his death. This includes the most recent murder of John F. Kennedy, Jr. along with his beautiful wife, Carolyn Bessette and her sister, Lauren. Justice will only be done when the Jesuit presence has been purged from the Justice Department in control of the FBI - Rome's Holy Office of the Inquisition within the American Empire.

And why was JFK, Jr, along with his innocent passengers, murdered? According to Tom Kuncl in the August 31, 1999 issue of the National Examiner, JFK, Jr. had, "...recently launched an all out investigation, to find his father's real killer."

[For John had said in his own words:]

"I want to know who killed my father. I want there to be absolutely no doubt."

Nicolini, in his History of the Jesuits published in 1854, gives us further light, declaring on page 269:

"...one of the most prominent characteristics of Jesuitism, [is] never to forgive an injury, and to persecute the remotest descendants for the offences they may have received from their ancestors."

Therefore, the following chart (go to www.vaticanassassins.org ) contained in Vatican Assassins: Wounded In The House Of My Friends is humbly given on behalf of the Kennedy and Bessette families. They must know the same savage Jesuit power that killed President Kennedy, mercilessly murdered their three darlings in the prime of their young lives. The same has been done to Princess Diana; for, the Jesuits would never permit the Moslem offspring of her union with an Arab prince to be an heir to the British throne. That throne may only be occupied by a monarch loyal to the Jesuits' "infallible" Pope of Rome - a loyalty that has been unbroken from the wicked King George III, whose Prime Minister was the Jesuit Lord Shelburne, to the present Queen Elizabeth II. For uniting with Dodi Fayed, the "Moslem dog" or "Moslem wog" as the English nobles would call him, Princess Diana was buried out of public view at Althrop Park in Northamptonshire, on a small island in the middle of a pond, where only pet dogs had previously been buried!

As you examine the chart dear reader, picture in your mind's eye the faces of President Kennedy, Princess Diana, John F. Kennedy, Jr., Carolyn and Lauren Bessette. Then may your heart be strengthened to do you duty in exposing the criminal Papal Knights manning that great Sword of the Jesuit General - the Vatican's International Intelligence Community,

"...whose points are everywhere and whose hilt is in Rome."

Dear fellow soldier in Christ, having been born-again by the will of God, remember the Words of God spoken through the great King Solomon:

"The wicked flee when no man pursueth:

but the righteous are bold as a lion."

- Proverbs 28:1

"The fear of man bringeth a snare:

but whoso putteth his trust in the Lord shall be safe."

- Proverbs 29:25

"The Lord is my light and my salvation;

whom shall I fear?

The Lord is the strength of my life;

of whom shall I be afraid?"

- Psalms 27:1

Remedy

A photo, taken from the November 13th, 2000 edition of Pittsburgh's Tribune Review, depicts the late Leah Rabin in 1995, following her "private audience" at the Vatican, with the greatest accomplice to her husband's cold-blooded murder, the "infallible" Pope John Paul II. The Mossad, an arm of the Jesuit General's International Intelligence Community, carried out the assassination; as, the disobedient Freemason and Prime Minister Yitzak Rabin opposed Rome's policy for Zionist Israel. For the Jesuits will never allow any portion of the old city of Jerusalem to be given to the Moslems, especially the Palestinians controlled by the Order through Arafat. Indeed, "the arm of the Church is long."

In ending, Vatican Assassins: "Wounded In The House Of My Friends", calls for national repentance to all Americans, a return to the Protestant Bible and maxims of the true faith in the Christ of the English Reformation and the expulsion of the Jesuit Order from American Soil.

We American Protestants and Baptists, having inherited the greatest Protestant form of government in the history of the world - our blessed Presbyterian Constitution and Baptist Bill of Rights - will be used no more to enthrone fascist-communist military dictators around the world in restoring and maintaining the Temporal Power of the Jesuits' "infallible" Pope.

If we, the American People, do not bring the real assassins of President Kennedy and his son to justice,(as well as 9/11 victims)and if we do not take back our sovereign federal powers usurped by the Jesuit General on behalf of the "infallible" Pope, if we do not dissolve the Council on Foreign Relations through which the Jesuit General rules New York, Washington D.C., the American Empire and thus the whole World (while deceptively employing certain notorious Masonic Jews and Gentiles as front men), if we do not expel the Army of the Pope - those odious Sons of Loyola - then our nation is truly lost. For then the Jesuits will use the very peoples our government oppressed (having armed and financed merciless tyrants in submitting them to the "infallible" Pope's Temporal Power), to invade our land, destroy our people and we will deserve it! The peoples we speak of are the Russians who suffered under Stalin, the Romanians who suffered under Ceaucescu, the Bulgarians who suffered under Zhivkov, the Hungarians who suffered under Kadar, the Japanese who suffered under Tojo, the Chinese who suffered under Mao Tse-tung, the Vietnamese who suffered under Diem, the Cambodians who suffered under Pol Pot, the Germans who suffered under Hitler and then Stalin, the East Germans who suffered under Honecker, the Spanish who suffered under Franco, the Italians who suffered under Mussolini, the Yugoslavians - particularly the Serbs - who suffered under Tito (and under American bombers), the Argentineans who suffered under Peron, the Portuguese who suffered under Salazar, the Mexicans who suffered under De la Madrid, the Chileans who suffered under Pinochet, the Haitians who suffered under Aristide, the Panamanians who suffered under Noriega, the South Africans who continue to suffer under Mandela, the Iraqis who continue to suffer under Hussein, and the Cubans who continue to suffer under Castro, just to name a few.

For the Jesuits, in restoring and maintaining the Temporal Power of the "infallible" Papal Caesar, have shed the blood and spent the treasure of this once great Protestant Nation for the entire Twentieth Century. And in so doing Rome, in which is The Sovereign State of Vatican City, has fulfilled these words concerning herself:

"...the great whore that sitteth upon many waters...

arrayed in purple and scarlet...is that great city,

which reigneth over kings of the earth...

and in her was found the blood of the prophets,

and of saints, and of all that were slain upon the earth."

Revelation 17:1, 4, 18; 18:24

We, the betrayed American People, can expect a created national crisis resulting in widespread lawlessness, similar to the Negro rioting of 1968 following the King Assassination. (Possibly the Masonic, Black Muslim leadership, subject to the Archbishops of New York and Chicago, will ignite urban riots across the nation with their private army, "the Fruit of Islam". Their greatest target will be the capital, Washington D.C., eighty percent of its population being easily agitated Blacks, the majority having been taught from their youth to hate all White people. (Remember, the Black "Reverend" CFR member Jesse Jackson, the Jesuits' professional agitator functioning as a Masonic "Yassir Arafat of America" having never pastored a Church, years ago as a waiter used to spit on the food of White people he would serve!) This violent city, which has insanely banned all handguns, holds the "honor" of being "the murder capital of the world". More importantly, it hosts the Empire's most powerful Jesuit presence - the military fortress of Georgetown University. (We know Washington is their target as the Jesuits' major European and Asian revolutions began in capital cities, a few of them being Paris (1789,1848), Moscow (1917), Berlin (1933) and Peking (1912,1949).)

The ensuing anarchy will result in a Jesuit-controlled, right-wing, fascist military dictator (like "Bonesman" George W. Bush, whose President father, George H. W. Bush, is a Shriner Freemason, a drug lord and was a player in the Kennedy Assassination, and whose uncle, Prescott Bush, Jr., is a Knight of Malta and whose grandfather Prescott Bush, Sr., was one of the original founding members of the Jesuit General's Council on Foreign Relations. President Bush is also endorsed by CBN's Evangelical Pat Robertson, who was a friend of the late J. Peter Grace, and whose past consultant and personal friend is another Knight of Malta, Jeremiah Denton who wrote When Hell Was In Session). There will be mass roundups, torture and murder of American Jews in concentration camps (just like in the Jesuits' Nazi Germany). (Codenamed "Rex 84", the camps were established by Ronald Reagan and his Director of the CIA, Knight of Malta, William J. Casey.) There will be foreign war (like "Spelly's War" in Southeast Asia), invasion, occupation and persecution of the American Protestants and Baptists by foreign armies under the command of Jesuit-controlled dictators (like the Grand Inquisitor - Joseph Stalin). The army presently being prepared to spearhead this massive invasion of the American Empire is that of the Red Chinese in particular.

This will be the final blow, to individual liberty, national sovereignty and the Protestant Reformation. It will be the greatest victory for the Jesuit General's Counter-Reformation, restoring the Pope's "Holy Roman Empire" - founded on a reunited and rebuilt Germany - and returning the world to the Dark Ages. For then it shall come to pass, with Satan's last attempt to destroy the Lord Jesus Christ's beloved racially Jewish People, having used Rothschild's Masonic Zionists - controlled by Rome's Mossad - to resettle them in Israel for the purpose of rebuilding Solomon's Temple, that the Jesuit General's "infallible" Papal Caesar,

"...which had the wound by a sword, and did live...",

- Revelation 13:14

shall become

"...that man of sin..."

- II Thessalonians 2:4

who, possessed by the devil himself, will be called

"...the beast...".

- Revelation 13:4

The beast will rule all nations from Solomon's rebuilt Temple in Jerusalem for

"...forty and two months..."

- Revelation 11:2 ;13:5

as,

"...the abomination of desolation..."

- Daniel 9:27

- Matthew 24:15

"...he shall exalt himself, and magnify himself above every god..."

- Daniel 11:36

"...so that he as God sitteth in the temple of God, showing himself that he is God..."

- II Thessalonians 2:4

"...he shall speak great words against the most High..."

- Daniel 7:25

"...he shall also stand up against the Prince of princes;..."

- Daniel 8:25

"...until Shiloh come..."

- Genesis 49:10

"...In flaming fire taking vengeance on them that know not God..."

- II Thessalonians 1:8

"...out of his mouth goeth a sharp sword,

that with it he should smite the nations..."

- Revelation 19:15

"...the Lion of the tribe of Juda...shall...roar..."

- Revelation 5:5

- Isaiah 42:13

"...he shall fill the places with the dead bodies;

he shall wound the heads over many countries..."

- Psalms 110:6

"...his feet shall stand in that day upon the Mount of Olives..."

- Zechariah 14:4

"...and there was given him a dominion, and glory, and a kingdom..."

- Daniel 7:14

"...and the Lord God shall give unto him the throne of his father David..."

- Luke 1:32

"...and his dominion shall be from sea even to sea...to the ends of the earth..."

- Zechariah 9:10

"...Of the increase of his government and peace there shall be no end..."

- Isaiah 9:7

"...And he shall judge among many people, and rebuke strong nations afar off;

and...the kingdom shall come to the daughter of Jerusalem..."

- Micah 4:3,8

"...for out of Zion shall go forth the law,

and the word of the Lord from Jerusalem..."

- Isaiah 2:3

"...In his days Judah shall be saved and Israel shall dwell safely..."

- Jeremiah 23:6

"...At that time they shall call Jerusalem the throne of the Lord;

and all the nations shall be gathered unto it..."

- Jeremiah 3:17

"...all kings shall fall down before him: all nations shall serve him..."

- Psalms 72:11

"...That at the name of Jesus every knee should bow... And that every tongue should confess that Jesus Christ is Lord to the glory of God the Father...".

- Philippians 2:10,11

"For the father judgeth no man, but hath committed all judgment unto the Son:

That all men should honour the Son, even as they honour the Father.

He that honoureth not the Son honoureth not the Father which hath sent him."

- John 5:22, 23

For the Semitic, Hebrew/Jewish-Israelitic

risen and returning Son of God,

Jesus of Nazareth, the King of the Jews,

not the Gentile Priest-King Papal Caesar of Rome

presently treading down Jerusalem with his Masonic Jewish Zionists,

who are persecuting and afflicting

Jehovah's beloved and racially Hebrew/Jewish People,

"until the times of the Gentiles be fulfilled"'

- Luke 21:24

is the only

"KING OF KINGS AND LORD OF LORDS".

- Revelation 19:16

Unless we repent, our time is short and our destruction, as a Protestant nation enjoying

Baptist-Calvinist liberties, is at hand!

Greg Szymanski

14april2000

19-01-2009, 04:06 PM

The Hordes of Zionist trolls are like those agent smiths types in the Matrix. Me me me me too!

I am not sure who the agents are, but i would call them The Hordes of JESUIT trolls.

Illuminati Defector Details Pervasive Conspiracy

http://www.savethemales.ca/141002.html

Quote: Svali 2002 interview with Henry Markow

Israel

Svali: "The conflict in the Middle East is only to the advantage of the Illuminists. They HATE Israel, and hope one day to see it destroyed, and are biding their time. One of the olive branches offered by the UN when it takes over is that they will prevent war in the Middle East, and this will be greeted with joy by many.

At the same time, the Illuminati covertly supply guns and funds to BOTH sides to keep the conflict fuelled. They are very duplicitous people. They used to funnel guns through the USSR to Palestine, for example, in the name of promoting "friendliness" between the USSR and this state and other Arab nations. Then, the US Illuminists would help funnel guns to Israel, for the same reason.

These people love the game of chess, and see warfare between nations as creating an order out of chaos. The USSR is going to get stronger again. It has too strong a military both openly, and covertly (ALL Illuminati military trainers have visited Russia to learn from them) to sit quietly and quiesciently to the side. In the NWO, they will be stronger than us."

Is the Illuminati a JEWISH conspiracy?

Svali: "Absolutely not. In fact, Hitler and his people (especially Himmler and Goebbels) were top Illuminists. The Illuminati are racist in the extreme, and as a child, I was forced to play "concentration camp" both on my farm in Virginia, and also in Europe in isolated camps in Germany.

The Jews historically fought against the occult (see Deuteronomy and the Old Testament for how God through the Jewish people tried to cleanse the land of the occult groups that were operating there, such as those who worshipped Baal, Ashtarte, and other Canaanite and Babylonian gods.

(from an email to Henry Makow) Yes, there are some very powerful Jewish people in this group. For instance, the Rothschild family literally runs the financial empire in Europe (and indirectly the States), and are a well-known Jewish family. I have also known people whose parents were Jewish diamond merchants in the group, and at every level. But to rise to power in the Illuminati, a Jewish person at night would be forced to renounce their faith, and to give their first allegiance to Lucifer and the beliefs of the Illuminati. In return for this betrayal, they believe that power (financial) and rewards come; and in one sense they do, but at too high a price (losing their eternal soul).

scooby85

19-01-2009, 05:26 PM

What I am trying to say here:

There are corrupt Catholics.
There are corrupt Jews.
There are corrupt Muslims.
There are corrupt Vaisnavas.
There are corrupt Atheists.
There are corrupt Communists.

And then there's the rest of us trying to figure out who is lying about their religion in order to obtain more power for themselves.

There are corrupt Catholics.(worship jesus - son of god)
There are corrupt Jews. (worship azra - son of god)
NOTE: (both of jesus and azra represent the 'sun' thanks to the ptbs)

There are corrupt Muslims. (worship the one and only supreme being)
There are corrupt Vaisnavas. (worship idols)
There are corrupt Atheists. (worship nothing)
There are corrupt Communists. (no religion)

this to me shows that islam has no need to lie about their religion..

scooby85

19-01-2009, 05:39 PM

I want to see an end to hatred and injustice. I feel sad for the victims shown here, but this thread is a crude anti-islam propaganda piece that is one-sided and destructive.

Someone with a brain in here :rolleyes:

runciter

19-01-2009, 06:23 PM

The Jews historically fought against the occult

the jewish elite has always been into the occult.

the rothschilds are the hidden gods of the sabbatean frankist satanic cult.

they are the direct descendants of the self-proclaimed messiah sabbetai zevi, who was mentally ill.

runciter

19-01-2009, 06:25 PM

Is the Illuminati a JEWISH conspiracy?

no, it is a rothschild conspiracy.

marpat

19-01-2009, 07:34 PM

it has been proved beyond doubt many times, you can easily find all the information you need.

another evasion, getting good at that you are

marpat

19-01-2009, 07:36 PM

the jewish elite has always been into the occult.

the rothschilds are the hidden gods of the sabbatean frankist satanic cult.

they are the direct descendants of the self-proclaimed messiah sabbetai zevi, who was mentally ill.

Total rubbish. I guess that is the good thing about beliefs, you dont have to have any proof of them. Anybody who proves you wrong are then part of teh conspiracy.

marpat

19-01-2009, 07:38 PM

recently i witnessed the slaughtering of 1300 persons by the israeli army.

Did you witness the killing of Israeli civilians by palestinians using rockets fired from areas near school? probably beyond your field of vision that one.

I know what you are suffering from, selective sight.

runciter

19-01-2009, 07:39 PM

another evasion, getting good at that you are

i won't do the work for you, if you're interested you can easily find lots of information.

runciter

19-01-2009, 07:43 PM

Total rubbish. I guess that is the good thing about beliefs, you dont have to have any proof of them. Anybody who proves you wrong are then part of teh conspiracy.

maybe you know i'm right, maybe not, maybe the rothschilds have no power at all.

runciter

19-01-2009, 07:51 PM

Did you witness the killing of Israeli civilians by palestinians using rockets fired from areas near school? probably beyond your field of vision that one.

I know what you are suffering from, selective sight.

how many israelis were killed or wounded by the rockets launched before the massacre?

3dom

19-01-2009, 08:00 PM

Q. Is War with Islam Avoidable at all?

A. Unfortunately I would have to say that war with Islam / Middle Est in unavoidable because TPTB must fullfill the prophecies of the book. There will never be peace in the middle east, dont forget thats where they will have their "great" battle, Amageddon. Also the Dome of the Rock must also be destroyed that alone will cause carnage like never before. All these events 9/11, 7/7, Afghanistan, the war on terror, Israel and Palestine etc they are all paving the way for the Anti Christ, end of times, and as i said their greatest battle yet Armageddon. The sick rulers of this world need to fullfill the prophecies!

arten

19-01-2009, 08:27 PM

14april2000

19-01-2009, 08:57 PM

no, it is a rothschild conspiracy.

Your Sources to the Khazar conspiracy comes from pure Roman catholic gentile jew hates or protestant gentlie traitors with close connections to the VENETIAN bloodlines in the jesuit order. Who put this kind infomation up on the internet? If Khazar jews really run the world you would not find much infomation about them on the internet because they would shout down any web site with this kind of infomation or better would remove all search words from googleyahoo,msn and all other search engines so it would as hard find as they do with Eric Jon Phelps infomation.

Why Jewish Bankers Love Anti-Semites

http://www.savethemales.ca/001143.html

Most conspiracy related research only find jewish connections why?

Because Rome hates the Jews and is framing them.

If Rome hates the Jews why dos black nobilty intermarriage with rich jews?

Like this one the guardian of vatican treasure or the vatican banker Jacob Rothschild, the current head of the Rothschild dynasty, has intermarried with the Sinclair family.

It's just all a con. Bottom line is, Rome is making it look like the Jews are to blame. The late Sherman Skolnick called certain Jews "papal court Jews"--these are Jews loyal to the Vatican and, I might add, traitors to their own people.

So it is scame, i have alway fund it stanges that blue bloods would concider marry a jew. I german they are called Hof-Juden

Most of these Jews at the top are not actually racially Jewish, they descend from the northern parts of modern day Turkey. These Jews are always used as a scapegoat and are placed at the front line while behind them you have black nobility, supposed descendants of Cain.

As for the Jews--yep, scapegoat indeed, and a huge smokescreen.

Consult Makow's work on Svali. She stated that the Luciferian elite allow Jews in if they swear off the written Torah and submit to Lucifer and the Babylon Mystery religion. Did you know that according to Makow, Jacob Rothschild is only half a Jew for example?

OK Is the Talmudic law not Luciferian out of the Babylon Mystery religion I think it is?

Because most information out there is from the Intelligensia working for the Pope's, Knights of Malta. Vatican talk was very hard to come about since say the 1940s. Jesuits control all the education giving you hardly any Reformation information. The Talmud is linked with the Babylonians and is nothing to do with the Torah. These followers of the Pontifex Maximus are Sabbatean Frankists following Lucifer.

Its pretty funny how most bookshops sell things related to David Icke,Alex Jones and its pretty hard to find anything written by Eric Jon Phelps

And wasn't it "Rome" that was reported to have created Radical Islamic Fundamentalist "terrorists"?

Create the "problem", generate public demand for a "fix", then create the "fix"

As they say - All roads lead to Rome - the "Revived Roman Empire" and the one world govt., one world religion, one world money

Yes, the Vatican (not Jesuits as they didn't exist in the 8th century) created Islam...they needed hired thugs to take Jerusalem.

http://www.savethemales.ca/141002.html

From Henry Markows 2002 Interview with Svali

Israel

Svali: "The conflict in the Middle East is only to the advantage of the Illuminists. They HATE Israel, and hope one day to see it destroyed, and are biding their time. One of the olive branches offered by the UN when it takes over is that they will prevent war in the Middle East, and this will be greeted with joy by many.

At the same time, the Illuminati covertly supply guns and funds to BOTH sides to keep the conflict fuelled. They are very duplicitous people. They used to funnel guns through the USSR to Palestine, for example, in the name of promoting "friendliness" between the USSR and this state and other Arab nations. Then, the US Illuminists would help funnel guns to Israel, for the same reason.

These people love the game of chess, and see warfare between nations as creating an order out of chaos. The USSR is going to get stronger again. It has too strong a military both openly, and covertly (ALL Illuminati military trainers have visited Russia to learn from them) to sit quietly and quiesciently to the side. In the NWO, they will be stronger than us."

Is the Illuminati a JEWISH conspiracy?

Svali: "Absolutely not. In fact, Hitler and his people (especially Himmler and Goebbels) were top Illuminists. The Illuminati are racist in the extreme, and as a child, I was forced to play "concentration camp" both on my farm in Virginia, and also in Europe in isolated camps in Germany.

The Jews historically fought against the occult (see Deuteronomy and the Old Testament for how God through the Jewish people tried to cleanse the land of the occult groups that were operating there, such as those who worshipped Baal, Ashtarte, and other Canaanite and Babylonian gods.

(from an email to Henry Makow) Yes, there are some very powerful Jewish people in this group. For instance, the Rothschild family literally runs the financial empire in Europe (and indirectly the States), and are a well-known Jewish family. I have also known people whose parents were Jewish diamond merchants in the group, and at every level. But to rise to power in the Illuminati, a Jewish person at night would be forced to renounce their faith, and to give their first allegiance to Lucifer and the beliefs of the Illuminati. In return for this betrayal, they believe that power (financial) and rewards come; and in one sense they do, but at too high a price (losing their eternal soul).

The nazi/concentration camp mentality is very strong, though, and I was told that Hitler, Himmler, Goebel, and others were high-ranking German members of the group (Himmler was higher than the other two), and Mengele their paid puppet as well, who later worked as a high trainer of the American branch between his periods of hiding in South America. They honestly believed that they were acting as agents of their 'gods' to exterminate the Jewish race, and I am so, so sorry that this group has enacted so many horrors on the earth (and so, so glad that I left it).

I hope this helps you. I have always wondered this, though, why some of the highest ranking financial families in the group (baron Rothschild of France is one of the 13 European lords, or "kings" that run the group in Europe, and sits on the World Council) are Jewish, yet the group espouses hatred of their own race."

ARE THEY RACIST?

Svali: "Lots of Illuminists have Fourth Reich programming inside. The Illuminati are racist, and have a very "Aryan" outlook. They believe strongly in the rule of the "pure" and "intelligent" by their definitions, and in their ceremonies, there will occasionally be minorities killed in ceremonies.

They are trying to breed a "genetically superior" race to rule, with their children and descendants. They are also followers of Plato's Republic, and believe that they will be the ones to usher in this "Utopian" rule with the NWO in their opinion. In their Utopia, the intelligentsia will rule, and the sheep like masses will follow their leaders (that is their view of the world; that the occult leaders are "enlightened' and intelligent, while the average person is a "sheep" to be led by the nose)."

picha

19-01-2009, 08:59 PM

14april2000

19-01-2009, 09:14 PM

how many israelis were killed or wounded by the rockets launched before the massacre?

I believe it was 10 israelis that was killed, if it`s was befor the latest war on gaza you are talking about.

14april2000

19-01-2009, 10:02 PM

the jewish elite has always been into the occult.

the rothschilds are the hidden gods of the sabbatean frankist satanic cult.

they are the direct descendants of the self-proclaimed messiah sabbetai zevi, who was mentally ill.

“THe DeuTSCH DeViLS”
December 31, 2003 -
by Barry Chamish

SOURCE: http://www.redmoonrising.com/chamish/Dec03.htm

http://www.israeluniverse.com/images/barry.gif

Rabbi Marvin Antelman was right all along. Way back in 1974, he identified the source
of all the evil against Jews and humanity but his message and style were too unaccessible to get through to anyone but the most advanced students of anti-semitism. What he lacked most was simplicity, a common enough failure of thinkers decades in advance of their contemporaries. What he needed was someone to put out a Cliff’s Notes simplified explanation of his thesis…and someone, without intention, just did.
The name of the book is, 50 Jewish Messiahs by Jerry Rabow (Gefen Publishing, Jerusalem). It is an informative but shallow overview of just what the title says, but in its shallowness lies vital depth. We begin with Chapter 17, about the “most damaging messiah to the Jewish people,” Shabbatai Zvi. First we’ll read Rabow and then add commentary opening Rabbi Antelman’s work to the wide world.

pp 91 - Shabbatai Zvi was born in Smyrna, Turkey on the ninth of Av, 1626. The ninth day of Av is the day of a triple tragedy for the Jewish nation. According to tradition, the First Temple, the Second Temple and Bar Kokhba’s Betar fortress all fell on this day.

pp 93 - He changed the holiday celebrations and violated the dietary prohibitions. All of this followed from his declaration that the usual rules were inapplicable to messianic times.

pp 95 - He declared that the coming of the messianic era meant that the biblical commandments were no longer binding. He proclaimed that God now permitted everything.

** This is Rabbi Antelman’s central assertion; that Shabbataism was the polar opposite of Judaism. That Shabatai Zvi’s program was to destroy all the tenets of the Torah and replace them with their opposites. Incredibly, more than half the Jews of the world at the time, believed he would be revealed as their promised messiah: **

pp 101 - Then he finally made the announcement for which the Jewish community had been waiting for 1600 years - he would begin the Redemption on the 15th day of the month of Sivan, June 18, 1666.

** There are many who will recognize the significance of the date. June is the sixth month, 18 divided by three is 6+6+6 and 1666 is clear enough. Either he knew what he was doing or the prophesies of the emergence of an evil false messiah or anti-Christ are right, and Shabbatai Zvi was him. **

pp 110 - Through all of this, Shabbatai continued to issue proclamations of the theological changes wrought by the coming of the messianic age. Shabbatai’s new prayer was, “Praised be He who permits the forbidden.” Since all things would be permitted in the age of the messiah, Shabbatai declared many of the old restrictions of the Torah no longer applicable. He abolished the laws concerning sexual relationships. He eventually declared that all of the thirty six major biblical sins were now permitted and instructed some of his followers that it was their duty to perform such sins in order to hasten the Redemption.

** Shabbatai’s fall from grace among the great masses of Jews came in September 1666, when the Sultan of Turkey threatened him with torture unless he converted to Islam. He relented and most of Jewry abandoned him. But not all. A core of his followers kept their messiah alive and kicking hard. **

pp 112 - In order to bring on the Reformation, Shabbatai had descended into the darkness of the Muslim world to gather the scattered fragments of the light of creation hidden there. There was an outward reality and an inner reality. Nathan transformed Shabbatainism into a theology of paradox. Once the followers accepted the concept of paradox, they would be able to keep on believing in Shabbatai Zvi…An inner circle of his followers accepted the explanations of Nathan and continued to believe in Shabbatai the Messiah.

** The Shabatai followers continued their hidden life in the Turkish sect of the Donmeh, whose activities continue to this day, as reported extensively this year, even by the staid Jerusalem Post. One of the Donmeh followers was Jacob Frank, who would transform Europe and the world into a Shabbataian hell barely a century later. **

pp 121 - The Donmeh now converted the Shabbatain Purim into an annual orgy, when members exchanged spouses for a ceremony called “extinguishing the lights.” The Donmeh justified their Purim orgies, and their regular practise of sharing wives and engaging in other sexual activities, by citing biblical precedents.

pp 123 - Although Jacob Frank (1726-1791) was born fifty years after the death Shabbatai Zvi, he deserves to be regarded as Shabbatai’s true successor.

pp 125 - Frank’s followers requested ecclesiastic protection on the grounds that their own beliefs were not Jewish but rather, “anti-Talmudist.”..The bishop declared that the “anti-Talmudists”, Frank’s followers, were entitled to practise their religion, and ordered that all copies of the Talmud within his diocese be seized and burned. Now under the protection of the crown, adoring followers gave Frank huge donations to his movement.

pp 127 - He extended the paradoxical teachings of Shabbati Zvi that the coming of the messianic age had transformed sexual prohibitions of the bible into permissions and even obligations. According to Frank, engaging in sexual orgies now became the means to purify the soul from its sins. Debauchery became therapy…Frank convinced his followers that the only way for their special form of Judaism to survive was for them to outwardly become Christians, just as the Donmeh had descended into the world of Islam…In February, 1759, the Frankists told the Church they were ready to be baptized…The Frankists promised to deliver 5000 new Christians from Poland, Moravia, Hungary and Turkey.

pp 130 - The Frankists also became involved in international political intrigue, and sent secret emissaries to the Russian government and the Eastern Orthodox Church offering to help in the overthrow of Poland and the Catholic Church…By 1786, Frank suffered temporary financial problems, and moved his court to Offenbach, near Frankfurt. There Frank’s money problems were somehow solved. The source of Frank’s immense wealth is not clear. He may have used his movement’s system of secret messengers and clandestine cells to engage in the constant political turmoil involving Austria-Hungary, Turkey and the Balkans.

** And how we reach the final depth of Rabow’s understanding and let Rabbi Antelman take over. **

Frankfurt at the time was the headquarters of the Jesuit, Adam Weishaupt, founder of the Illuminatti, as well as Rothschild Brothers’ financial empire. This is worth repeating: Frankfurt was the birthplace of both the Illuminatti and the Rothschild empire. When Jacob Frank entered the city, the alliance between the two had already begun. Weishaupt provided the conspiratorial resources of the Jesuit Order, while the Rothschilds contributed the money. What was missing was a means to spread the agenda of the Illuminatti and that the Frankists added with their network of agents throughout the Christian and Islamic worlds.
Jacob Frank became instantly wealthy because he was given a nice handout by the Rothschilds of Frankfurt. There is no other explanation.
And from this starting point, Rabbi Antelman gave us a blueprint for the war against Judaism and all its good, and indeed against humanity and all its moral treasures. A movement of complete evil now took hold. The Jesuits’ goal was the destruction of the Protestant Reformation leading to a return of one pope sitting in judgement on all mankind. The Rothschilds goal was to control the wealth of the planet. And the Frankist vision was the destruction of Jewish ethics to be replaced by a religion based on the exact opposite of God’s intentions. When these factions blended, a bloody war against humanity, with the Jews on the front lines, erupted and it is reaching its very pinnacle at this moment.
Rabbi Antelman traces the means of the worldwide reach of this ugliness. By the 1770s, the Illuminatti was exposed and banned in Germany and then throughout Europe. Weishaupt made a strategic change that worked miracles for the international spread of his goals. He infiltrated agents into the Freemasonic lodges of England and Scotland, changing their highest tenets to his own, until every lodge in every nation accepted them. Thus, the Illuminatti now had two centers of activity, Germany and Britain. It was from Germany to London that the apostate Jews Karl Marx and Frederick Engels were sent to devise the rot of communism. Shortly after that task was done, the Rothschilds sent their agents John Jacob Astor and Jacob Schiff from Germany to America. They financed the robber barons like Rockefeller and Morgan, who in 1922, founded the Council On Foreign Relations, to overthrow the American constitution and switch the nation’s diplomacy to Illuminattiism.

THE REAL WAR AGAINST THE JEWS AND HUMANITY

In 1932, how many organizations in Germany represented German Jewry? Over 250. In 1933, how many? One, and one only; Labour Zionism. We will return to the significance shortly.
First, Rabbi Antelman’s account continues. To corrupt the Jews, the Frankists adopted, at first, a humane policy of sorts. With Rothschild money and Jesuit power, the so-called Enlightenment was initiated by the German Jewish apostate Moses Mendelsohn. Napolean was financed to liberate the Jews wherever he conquered and from Germany, the Reform and Conservative movements were financed to further dilute the faith and introduce totally foreign concepts to their congregations. But the pace wasn’t fast enough. The ornery Jews just weren’t cooperating with evil, so those stubbornly accepting Torah morality would have to be removed permanently and only those practising Shabbatainism would be permitted to survive.
Yes, in the 2000 years of European Jewish history there were pogroms, Crusades and Inquisitions, the latter aided and abetted by the Jesuits. But compared to what happened from the 1880s on, life was a tolerable picnic. The turning point in the final war against the Jews was the founding of Zionism by the Shabbataians. The final aim of the movement was to establish a Shabbataian state in the historical land of the Jews, thus taking over Judaism for good.
To foment the idea, life had to made so intolerable for Europe’s Jews, that escape to Palestine would appear to be the best option. The Cossack pogroms were the first shot in this campaign and for them, the Frankists turned to the Jesuits and their influence over the Catholic Church. The Jesuits had done more to spread communism, beginning with their feudal communes in South America, and now they wanted to punish the anti-papists of Europe by imprisoning them behind communal bars. The deal was simple: The Jesuits provided the pogroms, the Frankists the communists. And naturally, the Rothschilds would provide the moolah.
Once the situation turned foreboding, the German writing intellectuals took over. In Vienna in 1885, the journalist Natan Birnbaum fired the opening salvo which successfully planted the fast-growing seeds of Zionism. He was followed by another Vienna writer, Peretz Smoleskin who provided more intellectual justification for returning to a safe home in Israel. However, neither man had the charisma of still another Vienna writer, Theodore Herzl. He could rally the masses as neither of them could and he was chosen to be the spokesman and symbol of the movement.
Read any honest biography of Herzl and the same quandary appears. Herzl claimed he wrote the Judenstaat one summer in Paris. But Herzl wasn’t in Paris when he said he wrote the most influential book of Zionism. It had to have been written for him. Anyone who reads Herzl’s dreadful plays, has to doubt his sudden departure from literary mediocrity.
In 1901, Herzl appeared in Britain where he was not well received. We are told he backed another option, creating a Jewish sanctuary in British controlled East Africa. If the idea caught on, it would neutralize the Shabbataians’ game plan. Herzl died not long after and not one biography of him tells us how. He entered a Paris sanatorium for a not known condition and never emerged. This was highly fortunate for the British Freemasons doing the Shabbataians’ bidding, for they replaced Herzl with one of their own, a German-educated Jew named Chaim Weizmann. In time, a cockamamie legend was created involving the Balfour declaration creating a Jewish homeland in Palestine as a reward for Weizmann finding a way to make acetone for explosives from dried up paint. Not one explosion in World War One came from this magic process. But the British took great pains to capture Palestine from the Turks and appoint the leaders of the upcoming Shabbataian state.
Meeting in London during the War, Weizmann and Balfour had to deal with the problem of the people already living in Palestine, most of whom were religious Jews, who were the majority in such major centers as Jerusalem, Sfat and Tiberius. The myth of an ancient Palestinian Arab indigenous population is belied by any number of reports by visitors as talented as Twain and Balzac, who accurately noted the paucity of Arabs in the land during the 19th century. The later economic success of the new enterprise drew hundreds of thousands of Arabs from as far away as Iraq to the region with consequences the Illuminatti were possibly well aware of.
To neutralize the religious Jews, many of whom had been living in the land since antiquity, Balfour and Weizmann inducted Rabbi Avraham Kook into the fold and after the war, he was appointed the first Chief Rabbi of the enterprise, while Weizmann was made the first head of the Jewish Agency. Kook proceeded to strip the landed Orthodox Jews of their real estate and political rights, while introducing a new concept into Judaism; the purity of land redemption. His philosophy was based on profound historical truth, nonetheless, his followers don’t understand how he and they are playing out the Shabbataian nightmare.
Stage one was complete. Now the real business at hand was revved up. Rabbi Antelman proves that the American President Woodrow Wilson was thoroughly corrupted by the Frankists through their agent Colonel House. It was Wilson who put an end to America’s open immigration policy. Until then, despite all their despair, most Eastern European Jews rejected Palestine as an escape route, the majority choosing America as their destination. From now on very few would enjoy that option. It would have to be Palestine or nowhere.
We now jump to 1933. Less than 1% of the German Jews support Zionism. Many try to escape from Naziism by boat to Latin and North American ports but the international diplomatic order was to turn them back. Any German Jew who rejected Palestine as his shelter would be shipped back to his death.
By 1934, the majority of German Jews got the message and turned to the only Jewish organization allowed by the Nazis, the Labour Zionists. For confirmation of the conspiracy between them and Hitler’s thugs read The Transfer Agreement by Edwin Black, Perfidy by Ben Hecht or The Scared And The Doomed by Jacob Neuberger. The deal cut worked like this. The German Jews would first be indoctrinated into Bolshevism in Labour Zionism camps and then, with British approval, transferred to Palestine. Most were there by the time the British issued the White Paper banning further Jewish immigration. The Labour Zionists got the Jews they wanted, and let the millions of religious Jews and other non-Frankists perish in Europe without any struggle for their survival.
But not all Jews fell for the plan. A noble alternative Zionism arose led by Zeev Jabotinsky. He led the Jews in demanding free passage to Palestine and a worldwide economic boycott of the Nazi regime. The Labour Zionists did all in their power to short-circuit the opposition. First, they forced all the German Jews in Palestine to use their assets to buy only goods from Nazi Germany. This kept the regime afloat. Then Chaim Weizmann and his Jewish Agency employed their appointed agents in the US to neutralize Jabotinsky and his followers using any means at their disposal. This culminated in Jabotinsky’s suspicious death in New York in 1941. Later, Jabotinsky’s most literate advocate, Ben Hecht, was run over by a truck on a Manhattan sidewalk. His crime was being the first to widely expose the Jewish Agency-Nazi plot.
Into this plot against the Jews we add the Jesuits, who wished with all their hearts, to wreck the land that produced Luther, but the Vatican’s role in the Holocaust is not the focus of this overview. We now return to America where the Jewish leadership used all their contacts and resources to make good and certain that the unwanted non-Shabbataian Jews of Europe never again saw the light of day.
We return to a quote from Jerry Rabow:

pp 132 - Frankist families, both those living as Christians and those living as Jews, tried to marry only among themselves. In the summers, the German groups regularly held secret meetings in the resort of Carlsbad…It is said by the middle of the nineteenth century, the majority of the lawyers in Prague and Warsaw were from Frankist families. United States Supreme Court Justice Felix Frankfurter is reported to have received a copy of Eva Frank’s portrait from his mother, a descendent of the Prague Frankist family.

Here is a quote from Frankfurter:

“The real rulers in Washington are invisible and exercise their power from behind the
scenes.”– Justice Felix Frankfurter, U.S. Supreme Court.

The difference between Rabow and Rabbi Antelman is the latter proves that literally all of FDR’s court Jews were German-descended Sabbataians, determined to purge Jewry of its unnecessary European, non-Sabbataian morality-believing cohorts. Here is a short list of these Jewish community leaders:

Felix Brandeis - Received Secondary School education in Germany. There, Englishman Jacob de Haas introduced him to Zionism.
Henry Morgenthau Jr., Stephen Weiss, Judah Magnes, Felix Warburg - All descended from German Jews. Here is a telling quote from the latter Frankist family:

“We shall have World Government, whether or not we like it. The only question is whether
World Government will be achieved by conquest or consent.” — Statement made before the
United States Senate on Feb. 7, 1950 by James Paul Warburg (”Angel” to and active in the
United World Federalists), son of Paul Moritz Warburg, nephew of Felix Warburg and of Jacob Schiff, both of Kuhn, Loeb & Co. which poured millions into the Russian Revolution through James’ brother Max, banker to the German government.

When World War II ended, barely 100,000 European Jews survived and when they arrived in Palestine they had to obey Bolshevik edicts or starve to death. However, they weren’t enough to stave off the number one threat to the Frankist state, the Arabs. The wrath of the savage tribes threatened the whole enterprise and only the infusion of large numbers of soldiers could stave off their invasion. To that end, European-controlled Arab dictators were persuaded to go against their national interests, stir up bloody anti-semitism and get the Sephardic Jews to Israel. Their first reward was wealth through seizure of Jews’ assets.
Before the Sabbataians introduced it, there was no such thing as Jewish self-hatred. Their religion and heritage came as naturally as breathing. This was the state the Eastern Jews were in when they were driven to Israel. There, the Frankists had to apply all the lessons they learned turning German Jews into their image to change the newcomers. Every effort was made to divest these peoples of their faith and the results were often shattering. This is one reason, for instance, why Moroccan Jews who fled to France are so much better off than their families in Israel.
Initially, the American Frankists supported the new nation, believing it would soon spread darkness to the nations. But the Jews didn’t cooperate and held on to their decency. That is when the CFR unleashed its evilest Frankists on the Jews once again. The most prominent of this lot is the German-born Henry Kissinger but the list is long and includes the Austrian-educated Madeleine Albright, and German descendents such as Joe Lieberman and Sandy Berger.
Today, the Frankist agenda is being promoted through the thinking of the German-born American philosopher, Leo Strauss. To show you all is not what it seems, here are a few words about him from a Jewish writer for the Executive Intelligence Report, run by the Germacentric Lyndon LaRouche:

“If Strauss’ influence on politics in the capital of the most powerful nation on Earth was awesome in 1996, it is even more so today. The leading “Straussian” in the Bush Administration is Deputy Defense Secretary Paul Wolfowitz, who was trained by Strauss’ alter-ego and fellow University of Chicago professor Allan Bloom. Wolfowitz leads the “war party” within the civilian bureaucracy at the Pentagon, and his own protege I. Lewis “Scooter” Libby, is Vice President Dick Cheney’s chief of staff and chief national security aide, directing a super-hawkish “shadow national security council” out of the Old Executive Office Building, adjacent to the White House. According to Bloom biographer Saul Bellow, the day that President George H.W. Bush rejected Wolfowitz and Cheney’s demand that U.S. troops continue on to Baghdad, during Operation Desert Storm in 1991, Wolfowitz called Bloom on his private phone line to bitterly complain. It seems that “Bush 41″ was not enough of a Nietzschean “superman” for Wolfowitz’s taste”

Compare that report with this one recently published by the Jerusalem Post.

LONDON- A British coroner has rejected a German police claim that a 22 year old Jewish man from London, Jeremiah Duggan, committed suicide in March after attending a meeting of the far-right Schiller Institute in the German town of Wiesbaden.
The Schiller Institute draws its inspiration from American conspiracy theorist Lyndon LaRouche, who was among the speakers at the meeting…
He said, “Mum, I am in deep trouble. I am frightened.” As he attempted to give his location, the line went dead.”

Duggan made the fatal mistake of getting too close to the true connection between LaRouche and the Frankists. Their program calls for the brainwashing of Jews to hate themselves and they don’t cotton to rebels. Here is how that is accomplished through the Israeli higher education system, as reported by Caroline Glick this week in the Jerusalem Post:

“Students speak of a regime of fear and intimidation in the classroom.
Ofra Gracier, a doctoral student in Tel-Aviv University’s humanities
faculty explains the process as follows:
‘It starts with the course syllabus. In a class on introduction to
political theory for instance, you will never see the likes of Leo
Strauss or Friedrich Hayek or Milton Friedman. You will only get Marx
and Rousseau and people like that. So, if you want to argue with Marx,
you are on your own. You don’t know anything else.’”

The fatal error of Israeli Jews was rejecting the Frankists and their Labour Party. The Shabataians would rather see the Arabs overrun Israel than witness the revival of a state run by true Judaism. They have thoroughly financed and infiltrated the high leadership and especially, far left groups, to prepare the ground for defeat. And if utter demoralization doesn’t do the trick, read another local report issued this week:

PREPARATIONS TO USE FIREPOWER AGAINST JEWS.
Our contacts have reported that the following has been introduced by the
people preparing MEGA YAMIT.
IBA “B” reported, in three consecutive reports following the Geha
Junction islamic mass murder assault that GERMAN EXTREME RIGHT
WING Jews were those that performed the bombing.
(Refer to the IBA “B” records) .

Rabbi Antelman was right. He looked at the enemy and saw the mirror opposite of real Judaism. A war to the finish is on in Israel and it is being spread to the rest of the planet. Our salvation can only arise when the Arabs realize the Jews of Israel are fighting the same battle they are and against the same enemies. If they can’t overcome the brainwashing and hatred, they’ll go down along with Israel. And then the rest of the planet will follow.

end

These two sites may help in your understanding of the German connection to planetary wickedness:

http://boards.marihemp.com/boards/msg1×54701.shtml

http://www.originofnations.org/index.htm

I gave an hour long interview on the subject this week. Go to the following site and click on the Tamar Yona program. I should be archived by now.

http://www.israelnationalnews.com

My books are:

Save Israel
Who Murdered Yitzhak Rabin
The Last Days Of Israel - Israeli Edition
Israel Betrayed
Bye Bye, Gaza
The Kennedys

http://www.thebarrychamishwebsite.com/

And do remind your Hebrew reading friends to visit: http://chamish.tsedek.com

And your English-reading friends:

http://thetruthonly.narod.ru/index.htm

www.pushhamburger.com/barry.htm

www.geocities.com/freepages4all/index.htm

http://www.redmoonrising.com/bclist.htm

rhydra

19-01-2009, 10:21 PM

Religion will always be used and abused, in some cases to justify killing and conquest, whether it is Islam, Christianity, Judaism or whatever. People have an identity though their religion, sometimes people come along and persuade them that the only way that they can prove their identity and their commitment to their religion is to carry out their "holy duties."

Some call it Jihad, though the term is debatable inside and outside Islam, Crusade, there is no doubt about that or some other term which can be variably linked to religion, nationalism, race etc.

Religion, all religion, in itself can't be blamed completely, though it has a huge part to play. mankind however, is inherently weak to suggestion and compliance so if it was not religion it would be something else.

Those pictures, if photography was available in Europe under the religious zeal in the medieval times I wonder how many people would now be giving Christians a wide berth as many do Muslims?

grachtengordel

19-01-2009, 10:34 PM

I guess that is the good thing about beliefs, you dont have to have any proof of them.

remind me, which one are you

http://www.tvgasm.com/newsgasm/muppets.jpg

octopusrex

20-01-2009, 12:08 AM

tb303

20-01-2009, 12:51 AM

another evasion, getting good at that you are

Don't fuck with him, try fucking with me.

I posted pictoral evidence of what you seem to be ignorant of.

Bring it on.

14april2000

20-01-2009, 03:25 AM

The US, UK, Israel of course, but what about Russia, China, India, the South American countries etc. Are you lumping them all in there together?

Have you been living on the moon or what? Do you not know that Russia has been involved in a big war with Muslims in Chechneya and that Muslims are a big problem in Southern China.
So from the Muslim persepcitve it does indeed look like it is taking on the world because it wants to conquer the world. Anyone talking bollocks it is you pal stop projecting your crap onto others.

[QUOTE=grachtengordel;741983]If you want to split hairs regarding language and play snide ......

1. initial

2. comprehension

spell these correctly and I will suffer less "problems" comprehending your post

When do typos or spelling mistakes have anything to do with your problems of Comprehension which seem obvious to me by your obtuse and asinine reply to my OP in this thread?

arten TURN OFF YOUR TELEVISION!

Mass Mind Control Through Network Television - Are Your Thoughts Your Own?

- Why do countless American people go along with the War on Iraq? Why do so many people call for a police state control grid? A major component to a full understanding of why this kind of governmental and corporate corruption is to discover the modern science of mind control and social engineering. -
- by Alex Ansary, Out Of the Box, Dec 29, 2005 -

TV: A Powerful Tool of Mind Control - YouTube

Shiekh Abdullah Hakim Quick shares his experiences and views from his travels throughout the Muslim world and suggests that we live in a very confusing and deceiving time. And one of the main reasons for this is the propaganda and mass media of the West and the influence it has on the hearts and minds of the peoples throughout the world. And unfortunately, as the sheikh honestly admits, the Muslims are caught up in this deception as well. He warns that we must be aware of this, be on guard, and strive to establish the "Islamic" new world order.
Other topics discussed: slavery, Algeria, Muslims ruling Spain, Islamic economics vs. interest, women in Islam, fear and hope, fast-food, attitudes amongst the youth, the mercy of the Prophet (P), helping Muslims in other parts of the world, centralized leadership, women covering the face, Halloween, and associating with non-Muslim family members during their holiday celebrations.

Country western triggers in many of the words in the songs
Website - http://www.MeccaCentric.com

MeccaCentric - Producing videos about Islam and Muslims on DVD. Islamic lectures, speeches, talks and sermons are also available on audio CD.

"Islam and the New World Order" by Abdullah Hakim Quick
Purchase the full-length lecture at http://www.MeccaCentric.com or call 1-800-607-9810

telivision mind control - YouTube

Corny kind of sarcastic voice about television being about televisions influence, but something to think about any ways

RANDOM NOTES on mind control etc

Web Results 1 - 10 of about 228 for "MIND CONTROL" deprogramming techniques "how to" nlp. (0.17 seconds)

http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendID=13524445&blogID=88325294&MyToken=56b75916-be7f

http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fus...

mission mind control

http://www.heartbone.com/various/RedP...

http://johnmccarthy90066.tripod.com/i...

http://www.yourbbsucks.com/forum/vide...

http://mysite.verizon.net/res7dhyg/id...

http://www.saferchildren.net/papers/0...

http://www.heartbone.com/various/RedP...

TURN OFF YOUR
TELEVISION!

http://www.alternativescentral.com/tu...

Use Of Monarch Mind Control Methodology

http://nesara.insights2.org/Monarch.html

Stewart Swerdlow

cryptocracy

www.stewartswerdlow.com

1-269-429-8615

yogies

heavy rock stars frequency

Mass Mind Control
Through Network Television
Are Your Thoughts Your Own?

By Alex Ansary
Outside The Box
12-29-5

http://rense.com/general69/mass.htm

http://www.alexansary.blogspot.com

Why do countless American people go along with the War on Iraq? Why do so many people call for a police state control grid? A major component to a full understanding of why this kind of governmental and corporate corruption is to discover the modern science of mind control and social engineering. It's baffling to merely glance at the stacks of documentation that this world government isn't being constructed for the greater good of humanity. Although there are a growing number of people waking up the reality of our growing transparent soft cage, there seems to be just enough citizens who are choosing to remain asleep. Worse yet, there are even those who were at least partially awake at one time but found it necessary to return to the slumber of dreamland.

This is no accident; this is a carefully crafted design. The drive to dumb down the populations of planet earth is a classic art that existed before the United States did. One component to understanding and deciphering the systems of control is to become a student of the magicians of influence and propaganda. In order to defeat our enemies (or dictators), its imperative that we understand how they think and what they believe in.

When people think about mind control, they usually think in terms of the classic "conspiracy theory" that refers to Project MkUltra. This program is a proven example of 'overt mind control.' The project had grown out of an earlier secret program, known as Bluebird that was officially formed to counter Soviet advances in brainwashing. In reality the CIA had other objectives. An earlier aim was to study methods 'through which control of an individual may be attained'. The emphasis of experimentation was 'narco-hypnosis', the blending of mind altering drugs with carefully hypnotic programming.

A crack CIA team was formed that could travel, at a moments notice, to anywhere in the world. Their task was to test the new interrogation techniques, and ensure that victims would not remember being interrogated and programmed. All manner of narcotics, from marijuana to LSD, heroin and sodium pentathol (the so called 'truth drug') were regularly used.

Despite poor initial results, CIA-sponsored mind control program flourished. On 13 April 1953, the super-secret project MK-ULTRA was born. Its scope was broader than ever before, and only those in the top echelon of the CIA were privy to it. Official CIA documents describe MK-ULTRA as an 'umbrella project' with 149 'sub-projects'. Many of these sub-projects dealt with testing illegal drugs for potential field use. Others dealt with electronics. One explored the possibility of activating 'the human organism by remote control'. Throughout, it remained a major goal to brainwash individuals to become couriers and spies without their knowledge.

When it was formed in 1947, the CIA was forbidden to have any domestic police or internal security powers. In short, it was authorized only to operate 'overseas'. From the very start MK-ULTRA staff broke this Congressional stipulation and began testing on unwitting American citizens.

Precisely how extensive illegal testing became will never be known. Richard Helms, CIA Director and chief architect of the program, ordered the destruction of all MK-ULTRA records shortly before leaving office in 1973. Despite these precautions some documents were misfiled and came to light in the late 1970's. They laid bare the spy agency's cynicism. Despite the widespread knowledge of MK Ultra and the civil lawsuits that followed, this form of behavior modification is not the most expansive. The real dangers are the types of thought control that are 'covert' and not the subject of several dozen Hollywood movies like "Clockwork Orange" and Mel Gibson's "Conspiracy Theory."

Our founding fathers faced enormous challenges in the formation of this country and its bill of rights. One challenge was laying down the groundwork or a free society without knowing what kind of technological advances would be made. Who would have guessed in those times that we needed an article in the bill of rights that specifically prohibits the government and it's associates from engaged in mind control or thought control. The closest item that promises our protection from the government is the 4th Article in The Bill of Rights which states, "The right of the people to be secure in their persons, houses, papers, and effects, against unreasonable searches and seizures, shall not be violated, and no warrants shall issue, but upon probable cause, supported by oath or affirmation, and particularly describing the place to be searched, and the persons or things to be seized." Like many are now beginning to note, the US Constitution and its Bill of Rights are merely given lip service by our supposedly elected officials.

One of the most common examples of mind control in our so-called free and civilized society is the advent and usage of the television set. This isn't to say that all things on TV are geared towards brainwashing you. They're not. But most of the programming on television today is run and programming by the largest media corporations that have interests in defense contracts, such as Westinghouse (CBS), and General Electric (NBC). This makes perfect sense when you see how slanted and warped the news is today. Examining the conflicts of interest is merely glancing at the issue, although to understand the multiple ways that lies become truth, we need to examine the techniques of brain washing that the networks are employing.

Radio isn't any different in its ability to brainwash a population into submission. Sixty-seven years ago, six million Americans became unwitting subjects in an experiment in psychological warfare. It was the night before Halloween, 1938. At 8 p.m. CST, the Mercury Radio on the Air began broadcasting Orson Welles' radio adaptation of H. G. Wells' War of the Worlds. As is now well known, the story was presented as if it were breaking news, with bulletins so realistic that an estimated one million people believed the world was actually under attack by Martians. Of that number, thousands succumbed to outright panic, not waiting to hear Welles' explanation at the end of the program that it had all been a Halloween prank, but fleeing into the night to escape the alien invaders.

According to researcher Mack White ( http://www.mackwhite.com/), "Psychologist Hadley Cantril conducted a study of the effects of the broadcast and published his findings in a book, The Invasion from Mars: A Study in the Psychology of Panic. This study explored the power of broadcast media, particularly as it relates to the suggestibility of human beings under the influence of fear. Cantril was affiliated with Princeton University's Radio Research Project, which was funded in 1937 by the Rockefeller Foundation. Also affiliated with the Project was Council on Foreign Relations (CFR) member and Columbia Broadcasting System (CBS) executive Frank Stanton, whose network had broadcast the program. Stanton would later go on to head the news division of CBS, and in time would become president of the network, as well as chairman of the board of the RAND Corporation, the influential think tank which has done groundbreaking research on, among other things, mass brainwashing. Two years later, with Rockefeller Foundation money, Cantril established the Office of Public Opinion Research (OPOR), also at Princeton. Among the studies conducted by the OPOR was an analysis of the effectiveness of "psycho-political operations" (propaganda, in plain English) of the Office of Strategic Services (OSS), the forerunner of the Central Intelligence Agency (CIA). Then, during World War II, Cantril and Rockefeller money assisted CFR member and CBS reporter Edward R. Murrow in setting up the Princeton Listening Center, the purpose of which was to study Nazi radio propaganda with the object of applying Nazi techniques to OSS propaganda. Out of this project came a new government agency, the Foreign Broadcast Intelligence Service (FBIS). The FBIS eventually became the United States Information Agency (USIA), which is the propaganda arm of the National Security Council. Thus, by the end of the 1940s, the basic research had been done and the propaganda apparatus of the national security state had been set up--just in time for the Dawn of Television."

Experiments conducted by researcher Herbert Krugman reveal that when a person watches television, brain activity switches from the left to the right hemisphere. The left hemisphere is the seat of logical thought. Here, information is broken down into its component parts and critically analyzed. The right brain, however, treats incoming data uncritically, processing information in wholes, leading to emotional, rather than logical responses. The shift from left to right brain activity also causes the release of endorphins, the body's own natural opiates--thus, it is possible to become physically addicted to watching television, a hypothesis borne out by numerous studies which have shown that very few people are able to kick the television habit. It's no longer an overstatement to note that the youth today that are raised and taught through network television are intellectually dead by their early teens.

The dumbing down of humanity is represented by another shift which occurs in the brain when we watch television. Activity in the higher brain regions (such as the neo-cortex) is diminished, while activity in the lower brain regions (such as the limbic system) increases. The latter, commonly referred to as the reptile brain, is associated with more primitive mental functions, such as the "fight or flight" response. The reptile brain is unable to distinguish between reality and the simulated reality of television. To the reptile brain, if it looks real, it is real. Thus, though we know on a conscious level it is "only a film," on a conscious level we do not--the heart beats faster, for instance, while we watch a suspenseful scene. Similarly, we know the commercial is trying to manipulate us, but on an unconscious level the commercial nonetheless succeeds in, say, making us feel inadequate until we buy whatever thing is being advertised--and the effect is all the more powerful because it is unconscious, operating on the deepest level of human response. The reptile brain makes it possible for us to survive as biological beings, but it also leaves us vulnerable to the manipulations of television programmers. This is where the manipulators use our own emotions as strings to control us. The distortions and directions we are being moved to are taking place in the subconscious, often undetected.

Propaganda techniques were first codified and applied in a scientific manner by journalist Walter Lippman and psychologist Edward Bernays (nephew of Sigmund Freud) early in the 20th century. During World War I, Lippman and Bernays were hired by then United States President, Woodrow Wilson, to participate in the Creel Commission, the mission of which was to sway popular opinion in favor of entering the war, on the side of Britain. Edward Bernays said in his 1928 book Propaganda that, "The conscious and intelligent manipulation of the organized habits and opinions of the masses is an important element in democratic society. Those who manipulate this unseen mechanism of society constitute an invisible government which is the true ruling power of our country."

The Creel Commission provided themes for speeches by "four-minute men" at public functions, and also encouraged censorship of the American press. The Commission was so unpopular that after the war, Congress closed it down without providing funding to organize and archive its papers. The war propaganda campaign of Lippman and Bernays produced within six months such an intense anti-German hysteria as to permanently impress American business (and Adolf Hitler, among others) with the potential of large-scale propaganda to control public opinion. Bernays coined the terms "group mind" and "engineering consent", important concepts in practical propaganda work. The current public relations industry is a direct outgrowth of Lippman's and Bernays' work and is still used extensively by the United States government. For the first half of the 20th century Betrays and Lip man ran a very successful public relations firm. World War II saw continued use of propaganda as a weapon of war, both by Hitler's propagandist Joseph Gobbles and the British Political Warfare Executive, as well as the United States Office of War Information.

Turn on your local newscast. You have a few minutes of blue-collar crime, hardly any white collar crime, a few minutes of sports, misc. chit chat, random political jibber-jabber, and a look at the weather that no one is forecasting correctly. Is that what happened in your town? And we're supposed to own the airwaves! The mainstream media openly supports the interests of the prison industrial complex. The stories focus on minority criminal groups, and exploit the real threat to appear much more dangerous than they are. Think about the growing per capita number of prisoners in the country. Then remember that this is happening at the same time that our prison boom began. The police on our streets have created criminals. The focus is to keep us in a state of fear, that way the elitists can attack any group they want to without fear of consequence. This is why the media is continuing to craft the timeless art of dehumanization.

The techniques are increasing in their sophistication over time as the mind scientists that serve the empire continue to discover scientific breakthroughs as to how the human brain functions, learns, retains information, and behaves. The most effective brainwashing techniques are used on the most successful propaganda networks. Examine the music bed that lies low during the fright night scope of the second. It's spooky. I wonder if we are supposed to be thinking with our minds or getting ready for stunt. Observe the graphics with the music. They're glitzy and flashing. Like the monkey that is attracted to shiny objects, it's our monkey hand that controls to remote often stops the search for entertainment when the proper amount of glamour catches their attention. Most importantly, notice the repetition behind the lies that the politicians and their corporate media groupies tell us. You see, the unimaginable fallacies are created as 'truth' not because it's logical or provable, but because of the broken record technique. No matter how ridiculous the lie, it's repeated often enough that the brain doesn't know the difference between reality and nursery rhymes. This technique is under estimated in its ability to allow the puppeteers to hypnotize millions of people. Instead of "Fair and balanced" it's "We say it enough times, and you believe it."

It's a tragic day when the state can monopolize on the enslaving and imprisonment of a population. Hollywood will continue to frighten us with films on the mafia, gangsters, and the corrupt blue collar criminal whose stupidity and greed get them caught. In the end, our minds are already pre conditioned to accept living in a police state economy and society because we read it in the paper, saw it praised on the news and talk shows, or saw it in a movie. There are several movies planned right now that support the official story of 911 and a few movies that glamorize the War on IRAQ. According to David L Robb, Author of Operation Hollywood, "Hollywood and the Pentagon have a long history of making movies together. It's a tradition that stretches back to the early days of silent films, and extends right up until the present day. It's been a collaboration that works well for both sides. Hollywood producers get what they want - access to billions of dollars worth of military hardware and equipment - tanks, jet fighters, nuclear submarines and aircraft carriers - and the military gets what it wants - films that portray the military in a positive light; films that help the services in their recruiting efforts. The Pentagon is not merely a passive supporter of films, however. If the Pentagon doesn't like a script, it will usually suggest script changes that will allow the film to receive the military's support and approval. Sometimes these proposed changes are minor. But sometimes the changes are dramatic. Sometimes they change dialogue. Sometimes they change characters. Sometimes they even change history." They create something coined 'disinfotainment'. They mix disinformation with entertainment and call it disinfotainment.

Unadulterated Violence is now accepted on regular TV. Killing in the name of the mother government is praised, that is unless the violence is committed in self defense to protect someone from the system. Sharp shooters, bombers, and assassin are worshipped if they are fighting for the system, are in the military, or are associated with groups that control the masses locally, such as the local police department. I don't condone violence, however it's hypocritical to support one form of homicide when it favors the elite, and condemn another when it's done to protect your land, freedom, or loved ones. This odd reality transfers itself into the shady world of video games that are stepped in plots and tasks to kill as much as the player can. The players are getting younger and younger with 7 out of 10 children playing games with a 'Mature' rating. Recently I was browsing the PC video game selection at a very large electronics store. I was appalled to see nearly 50 different games in which the setting of the game is IRAQ and the goal is to kill as many insurgents as possible and fulfill the mission. Children today are being indoctrinated through their favorite games and law enforcement programs to be the button pushes of the weapons of mass destruction for tomorrow's world.

Is it any wonder why there are two house bills and a senate bill (with more on the way), which are giant steps in dismantling free speech of the general public. These bills together would kill (PEG) cable access centers where the public still owns the airwaves. It's the programming created locally, without censorship or commercial gain. Their income is derived from franchises within the local cities and a small percentage cable subscriber frees. This is a corporate takeover because this is centralizing communication by removing the locally based programming and moving the audience to the more official, nationalistic, and sensational programs that promotes violence, uniformity, and slavery over peach, diversity and freedom. Cable access features free speech and information with perspectives neglected by mainstream television. It also features a free flow programming system with fresh programs being aired by new producers on a rotating basis. This keeps the content and information creative and locally based while network TV is rigid with regular time slots and repetitive programming.

The blocks of programming that are universally accepted parallel the shift to craft our entire lives towards the factory's bell and the illusion of time. This is the creation of the hive mind. The hive mind is result of massive brainwashing to the general public. Everyone shares the same thoughts, goals, knowledge and understanding. A hive mind society gears itself towards conformity and ignores diversity while masqueraded as the road to utopia in mainstream television. Network programming, weather it's the news or drama, is geared towards artificially creating your world and reality. With the proper amount of entertainment and sensationalism, we may even be living our lives through the television set. Many anchors and actors are beautiful and research shows that attractive people are usually perceived as trust worthy. While the real news rolls quickly by on the bottom of your screen, the anchor is selling you on the idea of having your very own police state hell hole right here in your local jurisdiction, or how 2 sports opposing teams chased around on a court for 2 hours in attempt to score points means something to you. No education, no information, SPIN. Today the media represents a tool of brainwashing and indoctrination that is utilized on behalf of the owners interests.

Since the 1996 Telco act, television and radio stations all across the nation were bought out by major international media outlets. Clear Channel and Infinity are the two largest corporations in radio today. This has centralized the distribution of information and has threatened our free society ever since. The media drums to the heartbeat of its owners, whose interests are not of the general public. Instead they are interested in their other financial endeavors like defense contracting, oil business, political parties, prison industry. The conflicts of interest are monumental with the deregulation of the corporations. The lines are now blurred between one network's coverage of the war and the other.

Once we come to the conclusion that the media is intentionally deceiving us, we can apply the principles of problem-reaction-solution. This formula takes a problem by either creating it or allowing it to happen and presenting that to the population. It could be terrorism, molestation, extra terrestrials. These topics create fear and no one in their right mind would support terrorism or crime. It's therefore OK to blast the television, the papers, and radio with 'the problem.' The natural reaction from the people is a request for more control to ensure more safety. Most let their fear and emotional side control their decisions and usually translated into something like, "The government needs more power over our lives to make us safer and freer from tyranny. I believe what the media tells me so I will support whatever decisions they make." Today's mainstream corporate news program discourages dissent of the war and paints activists with a negative brush that hints of treason. At the same time, the so-called journalists are cogs in a much larger machine who know that if they report a story that paints the government in a dark light, is likely to remain on 'the wire' and off the front page.

The most disturbing thing about spending a single hour examining network cable news and modern Hollywood films are the reoccurring themes in the backdrop. The central ideas of countless "investigative reports" or "Friday night special" features are about a threat of some type over the horizon. The end of the world as we know it is being sold. If the news isn't feeding it to you, then the History Channel or Discover Channel are either talking about the crusades, asteroids, UFOs, earthquakes, terrorism, or exposes about serial killers. They are crafted a message that our world is unstable, and the threat is always an invisible and dangerous one that only our military can fix. When you record and log all the messages, you end up with a script, a screen write produced through the movie studios of Hollywood hell.
I am not alone in noting this observation. Local and network news are designing their editorials about despair and fear because the owners, producers, and editors now understand that fear sells. The end result are the desired ratings, delivered like expected. The masters of modern spin understand that we like to be terrified. Just look at the success in the action/suspense/terror genres that have plopped onto the conveyor belt and packaged for our glee consumption. When the editors in charge found out that simply plastering a terror alert chart didn't scare the people the same way it used to, they began to kick up the campaign of terror a few notches with new and creative ways to sell the police state.

When you get to the other side of the terror alerts of all shapes and sizes, you find another nightmare masquerading as the savior. The 'Ministry of Truth' will protect you. The mother government is here to rescue you and squash this brown terrorist bug, this gray alien, this avian bird flu, and every other nightmare that the nightly news brought you. The finest public relations specialists take the science of worshipping our kings down to a frame by frame level. George W. Bush is pictured in numerous poises with a hallo around his head. In other pictures, he stands tall with dozens of American flags blowing in the wind behind him. A more blasphemous display features him speaking in front of the cross of Jesus Christ. The message send couldn't be more clearly presented. Our current leaders are of the messiah status and only through them, will we reach the gates of safety. The lie that has been accepted by so many as truth is that this is a religious war. Numerous prime time programs are telling the story of the crusades (without the horrors) to synch our vibrations up to something out of the 13th Century, instead of the 21st Century. If the America people accept the fact that the crusades are here, that George Bush reports directly to god, and that revelations are here, then they have won the war for our minds.

The loudspeaker whispers, "All our problems are by accident, never design." Across the room the system's minion snorts, "If you have nothing to hide, you have nothing to fear." It's that plot that says Middle Eastern terrorists from an Afghan cave are the reason beyond our little, "War on terror." Related messages in the script demonize young minority males and suggest harsh punishments for crimes they commit. They don't come out overtly and state their racist agenda. They come at you from the side by airing the same crime news repetitively, usually when it's committed by the minority group. The networks love the fact that the TV sets the norms in society and today, and hence politically opinion. Who would imagine that in the United States of America, both candidates of both parties in the 2004 election would be members of the Skull and Bones society at Yale University? Out of 290 million Americans, this is the best we could come up with?

It is the decision of the owners to influence producers, editors, and others involved to paint to brush to fit the objective, which is the bottom line. If Sports is what the people want, then they get it, usually in large doses. Multi-media sports (or spectator sports) is just an escape from our own existence. It's like gambling, or drug addiction. It provides that buffer zone of rooting for something with other people that we've been told is good. People's fantasies also lead them to fixating on sports. Its simulated masculinity, in an age where there's a push to change us from men to robots. It's human nature to resist and fight that which is suppressing us. The sociologists and psychologists in areas of influence know this. Spectator sports prove the outlet internationally for what has been stripped away from us. We've lost the right to rebel and change our government through warfare if necessary. Today the bulk of our nation's population today doesn't know what's really going on with the fall of the American dollar and the plans for the transfer of American wealth to other countries. However, most can tell you who the top basketball or football players are. A lot of fans wish they were the stars, out there on the stage, the court, and the drag strip. Either you're "numero uno" in center stage or you're nothing. End of story.

What I never understood when I was in high school was why my peers and friends would act naïve or ignorant in a "Wayne's World" or "Beavis and Butthead" kind of way. What I've learned since then is that the numerous programs that are pimping themselves of as 'entertainment' are actually demo graphed to the lowest common denominator. This is especially true with disc jockeys in Radio today. The reason our airwaves are saturated with jokes and content centered on fart jokes, private parts, borderline racism, and general trash talk is because it is selling. In the meantime, large numbers of our children, young adults, and older audiences are mimicking what they see and hear because the current 'norm' is selling this behavior as cool or 'chic.' When the conditioned is so intense that these forms of content are considered the norm, anything else seems either bizarre or uninteresting to the average American's attention span that is decreasing by the day. Hypothetically, if a producer on a network did get away from a feature story exposing government corruption at the highest levels, chances are the large impact necessary wouldn't be realized because the average viewer's brain has already been conditioned to seek out certain types of disinfotainment.

The media has created the picture perfect society that could exist if we only did things their way, (their interests/government interest). It tells us what happiness is and what it is not and same for love, hate or anything else they can implant into our sub consciousness. We can become the perfect slave to the system through indoctrination given through network TV. Over time the messages are becoming increasingly racist, violent, and dishonest. But the programming began decades ago and few have the eyes to see it for what it has become. We live in a world where the populations give their minds away to the official version of the event, where utopia is right around the corner when big brother is riding shotgun. It's a world where Hollywood can make you believe anything, even that you are free. It's a world in which the prosecutor and the judge sit on the same side of the bench. The most obvious reason that our minds are being controlled on a massive scale psychologically, is become our culture has been conditioned incriminatingly to a TV, a radio, or a paper. We are given the world reality through a screen, some ink, or radio waves. The truth is hiding in plain site. The indoctrination through these mediums warns us that views other than those presented by them are unimportant and too be condemned. This Administration and media monopoly has a carefully crafted dehumanization program to anyone that dissents the official version of events.

Some people are wrong about 5% of the time. Some are wrong most of the time. I wish I was wrong all the time. A lot of people deal with these
intense realities, by asking me rhetorically, "What is the solution, smart guy?" Remember, it's the viewers, the consumers and all the other little votes called dollars that helped this oligarchy system lay its concrete foundation in our backyards. We must recognize the truth about why the system is flawed and enslaving us if we wish to beat it. The most important solution to fighting this type of brainwashing and mind control is to start with ourselves and our own awakening in the smaller things. In this case, it's brainwashing but after awhile we break Outside the Box and begin venturing outside the system and into unknown terrain. Fighting with people and forcing them to understand 'our truth' is not a solution. If our collective free will created this nightmare, than only our collective free will change it. The battle begins in the heart and mind of the beholder, and then extends outward from there, only to those open to the information.

If you choose to travel the road to the truth, then you must be prepared for the obstacles that await you. You may be condemned or criticized by your family, your friends, your lovers, or your co-workers. This is their programming that began at birth that is doing exactly what it's supposed to do. You're going to have to be stronger than that. You must realize that there is a reality that exists outside of this controlled artificial system. Like Indiana Jones in the Last Crusade, he took that 'leap of faith' over the bridgeless canyon in an attempt to get to the other side. Like Neo in the Matrix, he took the red pill from Morpheus in his attempt to cross over to his real self. Once you wake up, it's as if a hypnotist came along and snapped his fingers. You wake up and say to yourself, "Oh my god. I can see it now. Why did it take me so long to wake up?!" For some of you it can be a major shock. Like anything else, take this information and knowledge in stages. If it took a lifetime for them to mold your reality for you, then you know that it may take longer than a day to fully awaken. Remember, the journey of a thousand miles begins with a single step.

bowtiedaddy

20-01-2009, 06:18 AM

runciter

20-01-2009, 06:46 AM

Don't fuck with him, try fucking with me.

I posted pictoral evidence of what you seem to be ignorant of.

Bring it on.

he is programmed to ignore all evidence that goes against his beliefs.

runciter

20-01-2009, 06:48 AM

arten

20-01-2009, 08:07 AM

anthony65

20-01-2009, 08:30 AM

[QUOTE=14april2000;743729][QUOTE=arten;742916]The US, UK, Israel of course, but what about Russia, China, India, the South American countries etc. Are you lumping them all in there together?

Have you been living on the moon or what? Do you not know that Russia has been involved in a big war with Muslims in Chechneya and that Muslims are a big problem in Southern China.
So from the Muslim persepcitve it does indeed look like it is taking on the I hardly ever watch Television except for sport! Are you denying that both Russia and China have had problems with Radical Muslims in the recent past or what?
Ok for some strange reason I am unable to post this reply :mad:

You've got your quotes in a twist. The original quote is from me...

The US, UK, Israel of course, but what about Russia, China, India, the South American countries etc. Are you lumping them all in there together?

And here is Artens reply...

Have you been living on the moon or what? Do you not know that Russia has been involved in a big war with Muslims in Chechneya and that Muslims are a big problem in Southern China.
So from the Muslim persepcitve it does indeed look like it is taking on the I hardly ever watch Television except for sport! Are you denying that both Russia and China have had problems with Radical Muslims in the recent past or what?
Ok for some strange reason I am unable to post this reply :mad:

And here is my reply to Arten's reply...

No, I haven't been living on the moon.

Yes, Russia has been involved in long conflict with Chechen rebels/freedom fighters/terrorists, depending on your perspective...

The Chechens have been fighting to kick the Russians out of their country. The Russians consider Chechenya to be strategically important and are unwilling to let it go. The US have been meddling in Soviet/Russian affairs for a long time: See Brzezinski again. And the Islamic fundamentalists made a bee line for Chechenya to push their radical islamic agenda. But who set up and financed Islamic extremists in Afghanistan to hurt the Soviets? Brzezinski!

There is a lot more that could be written about Chechenya, but what it is not is an attack on Russia by muslims.

Russia gets on pretty well with most of its muslim neighbours. Yes, there might be tensions there, but nothing so dramatic that Russia would participate in global crusade against muslims. The Russians have close relations to some muslim states in the Middle East, Syria, for example, and I'm sure they'd like to fill any power vaccuum created by a weakening of US/UK economies.

As for China...

Let's take a look at the demographics...

Hui people - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There are 10 million Hui muslims in China.

Han Chinese - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There are 1.2 billion Han Chinese in China.

List of ethnic groups in China - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

There are 105 million Chinese who belong to a variety of ethnic groups.

The bigger muslim groups include...

Uyghur people - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

9 million according to wiki

Most of the ethnics are Taoist, Buddhist, Animist or Christian

In total, let's say there are between 20 and 40 million muslims in China.

Out of a total population of 1.3 billion.

Given these facts, could you imagine China joining the global crusade against Islam?

Do you still see an Islamic threat to China?

China is dependent on oil imports, mainly from Islamic countries.

Islamic countries provide important markets for Chinese products.

** I don't watch any television! You get your news from the telly? :eek:

arten

20-01-2009, 10:12 AM

I don't watch any television! You get your news from the telly?

I rarely watch tv news and hardly ever buy newspapers. The fact is you asked if the Muslims are going to war against the whole world and in recent times we have seen that happen. You have radicalised Muslims causing problems in Russia and China they may have some justification for their actions. I see Palestininans as Freedom fighters not terrorist. However, the stated aim of the Muslim Fundies is to conquer the world.
Of course most of us would rather live in peace and thankfully the vast majority of Muslims want to do that as well.
If you read William Bramelys book The God's of Eden you will quickly agree that the world is controlled by a Non Human intelligence that manipulates us into wars.
Now no matter how abhorent fighting is what do you think we should do if we are attacked in our homes and streets if it actually comes to a war with these religious nutters.

runciter

20-01-2009, 10:17 AM

beware of central bankers, they are our real enemy!

anthony65

20-01-2009, 10:25 AM

I don't watch any television! You get your news from the telly?

I rarely watch tv news and hardly ever buy newspapers. The fact is you asked is the Muslims are going to war against the whole world and in recent times we have seen that happen. You have radicalised Muslims causing problems in Russia and China they may have some justification for their actions. I see Palestininans as Freedom fighters not terrorist. However, the stated aim of the Muslim Fundies is to conquer the world.
Of course most of us would rather live in peace and thankfully the vast majority of Muslims want to do that as well.
If you read William Bramelys book The God's of Eden you will quickly agree that the world is controlled by a Non Human intelligence that manipulates us into wars.
Now no matter how abhorent fighting is what do you think we should do if we are attacked in our homes and streets if it actually comes to a war with these religious nutters.

Hello Arten,

This post gives us the chance to find some common ground! :)

I wholeheartedly agree with much of what you write here.

I did read Bramley's book. It was recommended to me by someone whose views I value highly. An interesting read.

Unfortunately there are nutters of all flavours, not just religious, but their arguments are usually (always) flawed. We can help to stop negative mainpulation if we stay cool and highlight the key facts that destroy their bogus claims.

I hope that some of the radical muslims in the UK, for example, will realize that they they are playing into the hands of their true enemies.

There is a lot of wisdom in the muslim world. Let's keep on pushing for peace! :)

dreamweaver

20-01-2009, 10:34 AM

Those pictures, if photography was available in Europe under the religious zeal in the medieval times I wonder how many people would now be giving Christians a wide berth as many do Muslims?

But surely that's the whole point? That kind of medieval savagery has no place in the modern world. Saying that the Christians did such things hundreds of years ago is not a valid excuse for the same barbarism being carried out in the name of Islam today.

But to get back to the central question of whether war with Islam is avoidable at all, well, the prospects aren't exactly looking good. There are moderate Muslims who do their best to oppose the fundies but they simply aren't strong enough to remove them from power at the moment. On the Western side of the equation, more people are waking up to what is going on, but again time is short. I would say the chances of avoiding an all-out war with Islam are still very, very slim indeed. :(

runciter

20-01-2009, 10:44 AM

this is what the rothschilds have planned for us,

they're using israel to foment hatred against the west.

bowtiedaddy

20-01-2009, 10:55 AM

this is what the rothschilds have planned for us,

they're using israel to foment hatred against the west.

. . .and against the Jews. (they always do that)

bowtiedaddy

20-01-2009, 11:01 AM

beware of central bankers, they are our real enemy!

mhmmm. Certainly. They practically own all of the Royalty AND Vatican.

On that note, some media that speaks a bit of truth. Have you seen the new movie coming out about how the global bankers are running the world and destroying everything?

I was actually a bit shocked that this amount of truth was put into a major movie. It spelled the entire reality out, even in just the preview. (right down to the concept of through enforced debt, enslaving the entire population and usurping law and order as well as national sovereignty to benefit a small elite of baking cartel. WOAH.)

anthony65

20-01-2009, 11:01 AM

But surely that's the whole point? That kind of medieval savagery has no place in the modern world. Saying that the Christians did such things hundreds of years ago is not a valid excuse for the same barbarism being carried out in the name of Islam today.

But to get back to the central question of whether war with Islam is avoidable at all, well, the prospects aren't exactly looking good. There are moderate Muslims who do their best to oppose the fundies but they simply aren't strong enough to remove them from power at the moment. On the Western side of the equation, more people are waking up to what is going on, but again time is short. I would say the chances of avoiding an all-out war with Islam are still very, very slim indeed. :(

Please tell me how you define "Islam" here. Islam is a religion. How do you go to war against a religion. What do you mean by a "war with Islam"?

So I assume you are referring to Islamic nations. Which nations do you mean and how do they represent a threat to the west? A threat great enough to justify a "war with Islam".

Are you referring to a western war against Islam?

Which western nations do you expect would participate and why?

Why are the chances of this theoretical conflict being prevented so very slim?

What is happening in the world at the moment to justify this statement?

runciter

20-01-2009, 11:45 AM

. . .and against the Jews. (they always do that)

yes, of course you're right, and i hope more and more jews will wake up to this reality.

runciter

20-01-2009, 11:54 AM

anti defamation league

founded: 1913

federal reserve system

created: 1913

interesting coincidence

bowtiedaddy

20-01-2009, 12:06 PM

yes, of course you're right, and i hope more and more jews will wake up to this reality.

Me too. A lot of Jews don't realize that some of the modern Jewish Cliches are actually an invention by people who want to exterminate the Jews.

It's all by design. Israel is also for this purpose.

The Jews are the eternal scapegoat, only the slave masters have adapted. This time around, instead of openly conquering and exterminating, they convince people to enslave themselves (not with just the Jewish people, but this is a prime example).

Israel is a way to make the Jews exterminate themselves. :(

bowtiedaddy

20-01-2009, 12:44 PM

anti defamation league

founded: 1913

federal reserve system

created: 1913

interesting coincidence

Both have as little to do with REAL Jews as possible. This is something that weighs very heavily on my heart. TPTB are very adapt at placing the blame, and giving the illusion of absolute innocence, or even opposition to, their own plan.

It is really sad. The average Jewish person has a great deal of love for humanity, longing for spiritual enlightenment, and Joy in all that is pure. In my growing up as a Jew, there was never once any hint of anything but love for my fellow man, and love for everything that is pure and good.

In my adulthood, I'm not a religious Jew (religion has no meaning, or benefit for me, regardless of which interpretation it takes), but it pains me, to see the multiple sides of the perceptions and realities. There is such a fear that Jews are racists or elitists. Jews are TOLD that they are the chosen people, but it is quite often to hear a Jew say...so, you say we're the chosen people, can't you choose someone else? I don't believe at all this hogwash. Every human being on the planet is "the chosen people," but unfortunately you have to understand the nature of how deep social conditioning can go. Not to say that this even has that much meaning in reality to the average Jew. The "chosen people" concept is no more extreme than the average Christian believing that "Jesus" is the only way to go to heaven, but that's besides the point. Even through all of this, there is not so much as a hint of a feeling of this superiority that anti-semites believe is the center of Jewish culture.

I simply just don't know why Jews are branded as a scape goat throughout history, beyond a broad hatred of all Semitic people. There are bad apples, just as any race, or religion. We fucking hate the scum bag jews right along with scum bags in any other walk of life. For some reason, the bad apples in this particular group are often blamed for the bad apples in every other one. Forget the Roman Catholics, the Germanic, or the Asian conspirators, it must be the Jews, all in it together. (Fuck. I wish we were all rich. I've always been as poor as dirt. Money would at least make life a bit less stressful)

I sincerely hope we don't repeat this in future times. I feel that TPTB are trying to fall back into this popular and historically effective diversion. I've seen a resurgence of (albiet subtle) anti Jewish conditioning and propaganda (and the counterfeit Jew Rothschild state of Isreal hasn't hurt that at all, this much is for sure). I've seen this take place more-so in Europe than North America (NA does, as many anti semites claim have a more positive Jewish perspective... well...we do have more Jews here than anywhere else, even Israel, even if we're still far less in numbers than the majority)

I can say, I don't see it working as well as it has in the past, yet I still worry. Even those that hold the same dream that I do, which is ultimate liberation of ALL people, of ALL races, of ALL religions, of ALL walks of life, rich and poor, young and old, every pure soul in absolute harmony, living and working together and exploring the magnificent splendor that befalls us, are so easily led to hate people of my blood for no other reason than the lineages that we were born to. I have been criticized by my own brethren on many occasion for simply being of Jewish blood as if I had a secret telephone to the head of the Illuminati waiting to shower tonnes of gold and power on me at my beckoned call.

History has rarely seen 100 years in the last several millennia without a major bloodletting of the Jews. This troubles me. We're overdue, if the cycle repeats itself. Our brothers, the Islamic people of the world are mistreated in the name of the Jews. Jews are mistreated in the name of the Islamic people. The real hands that set into motion real events go unnoticed as the misdirected hate compounds on itself and festers amongst those who don't know any better.

white knight

20-01-2009, 01:05 PM

Is War with Islam Avoidable at all?

Yes, there won't be any major wars with Islam....as much as many people wish it to be so, it just can't happen at this stage.

I would just like to point this out...

Evil is growing like a disease on this beautiful planet Earth. But evil has hit a major problem at this time, it has started to consume itself through it's own misguided ways...unfortunately for these evil entities, this process is unstoppable.

Evil must continue in it's ways even after most of the planet's inhabitants are completely aware of their existence....they will be forced to carry out their evil acts right up until their final self-induced destruction.

Now, go out and have a nice day! :)

dreamweaver

20-01-2009, 01:13 PM

Please tell me how you define "Islam" here. Islam is a religion. How do you go to war against a religion. What do you mean by a "war with Islam"?

So I assume you are referring to Islamic nations. Which nations do you mean and how do they represent a threat to the west? A threat great enough to justify a "war with Islam".

Are you referring to a western war against Islam?

Which western nations do you expect would participate and why?

Why are the chances of this theoretical conflict being prevented so very slim?

What is happening in the world at the moment to justify this statement?
The thread is about whether a "war with Islam" is avoidable. Ask the original poster if the concept of an ideological war is so confusing for you.

runciter

20-01-2009, 01:14 PM

the adl was created by masonic b'nai b'rith to serve the interests of the elite.

the elite has its own cult that has nothing to do with 'mainstream' religions.

http://www.redicecreations.com/specialreports/2005/08aug/shabbetai.html

anthony65

20-01-2009, 01:18 PM

The thread is about whether a "war with Islam" is avoidable. Ask the original poster if the concept of an ideological war is so confusing for you.

I already exchanged several posts with the OP.

Care to answer the questions I asked you?

Please tell me how you define "Islam" here. Islam is a religion. How do you go to war against a religion. What do you mean by a "war with Islam"?

So I assume you are referring to Islamic nations. Which nations do you mean and how do they represent a threat to the west? A threat great enough to justify a "war with Islam".

Are you referring to a western war against Islam?

Which western nations do you expect would participate and why?

Why are the chances of this theoretical conflict being prevented so very slim?

What is happening in the world at the moment to justify this statement?

runciter

20-01-2009, 01:19 PM

Both have as little to do with REAL Jews as possible. This is something that weighs very heavily on my heart. TPTB are very adapt at placing the blame, and giving the illusion of absolute innocence, or even opposition to, their own plan.

It is really sad. The average Jewish person has a great deal of love for humanity, longing for spiritual enlightenment, and Joy in all that is pure. In my growing up as a Jew, there was never once any hint of anything but love for my fellow man, and love for everything that is pure and good.

In my adulthood, I'm not a religious Jew (religion has no meaning, or benefit for me, regardless of which interpretation it takes), but it pains me, to see the multiple sides of the perceptions and realities. There is such a fear that Jews are racists or elitists. Jews are TOLD that they are the chosen people, but it is quite often to hear a Jew say...so, you say we're the chosen people, can't you choose someone else? I don't believe at all this hogwash. Every human being on the planet is "the chosen people," but unfortunately you have to understand the nature of how deep social conditioning can go. Not to say that this even has that much meaning in reality to the average Jew. The "chosen people" concept is no more extreme than the average Christian believing that "Jesus" is the only way to go to heaven, but that's besides the point. Even through all of this, there is not so much as a hint of a feeling of this superiority that anti-semites believe is the center of Jewish culture.

I simply just don't know why Jews are branded as a scape goat throughout history, beyond a broad hatred of all Semitic people. There are bad apples, just as any race, or religion. We fucking hate the scum bag jews right along with scum bags in any other walk of life. For some reason, the bad apples in this particular group are often blamed for the bad apples in every other one. Forget the Roman Catholics, the Germanic, or the Asian conspirators, it must be the Jews, all in it together. (Fuck. I wish we were all rich. I've always been as poor as dirt. Money would at least make life a bit less stressful)

I sincerely hope we don't repeat this in future times. I feel that TPTB are trying to fall back into this popular and historically effective diversion. I've seen a resurgence of (albiet subtle) anti Jewish conditioning and propaganda (and the counterfeit Jew Rothschild state of Isreal hasn't hurt that at all, this much is for sure). I've seen this take place more-so in Europe than North America (NA does, as many anti semites claim have a more positive Jewish perspective... well...we do have more Jews here than anywhere else, even Israel, even if we're still far less in numbers than the majority)

I can say, I don't see it working as well as it has in the past, yet I still worry. Even those that hold the same dream that I do, which is ultimate liberation of ALL people, of ALL races, of ALL religions, of ALL walks of life, rich and poor, young and old, every pure soul in absolute harmony, living and working together and exploring the magnificent splendor that befalls us, are so easily led to hate people of my blood for no other reason than the lineages that we were born to. I have been criticized by my own brethren on many occasion for simply being of Jewish blood as if I had a secret telephone to the head of the Illuminati waiting to shower tonnes of gold and power on me at my beckoned call.

History has rarely seen 100 years in the last several millennia without a major bloodletting of the Jews. This troubles me. We're overdue, if the cycle repeats itself. Our brothers, the Islamic people of the world are mistreated in the name of the Jews. Jews are mistreated in the name of the Islamic people. The real hands that set into motion real events go unnoticed as the misdirected hate compounds on itself and festers amongst those who don't know any better.

i think the jewish elite has often, if not always, collaborated with the enemy.

anthony65

20-01-2009, 01:34 PM

But to get back to the central question of whether war with Islam is avoidable at all, well, the prospects aren't exactly looking good. There are moderate Muslims who do their best to oppose the fundies but they simply aren't strong enough to remove them from power at the moment. On the Western side of the equation, more people are waking up to what is going on, but again time is short. I would say the chances of avoiding an all-out war with Islam are still very, very slim indeed. :(

Let's try again Dreamweaver...

Okay....

"The central question of whether war with Islam is avoidable..."

In a later post, you stated that you are referring to an ideological war.

The OP mentioned Nostradamus, WW3 and a supposed Islamic triumph.

How does an ideological war escalate into WW3?

Who is supposed to be fighting who?

Where is the Islamic threat in military terms?

To quote you again:

I would say the chances of avoiding an all-out war with Islam are still very, very slim indeed

Please describe this all out war you speak of? What scenario are you referring to? Why, in your opinion are the chances of avoiding it so slim? Where is there currently a serious military threat from "Islam"?

octopusrex

20-01-2009, 02:14 PM

You know what gets to me?

Imagine that you have two families living side by side in Brooklyn. One is Jewish. One is Muslim.

The Jewish family tells their kids: don't go play with those muslim kids, they will do terrible things to you.

The Muslim family tells their kids: don't go playwith those jew kids, they are monkeys and apes.

The kids ... They couldn't give a shit otherwise. But in order to please their parents, they start to hate.

Now move the family to Gaza.. See what you get?

dreamweaver

20-01-2009, 02:20 PM

Let's try again Dreamweaver...
Let's not bother. I haven't the slightest interest in your games.

If you think you can stop the forthcoming war by having a philosophical debate with the protagonists ("This isn't really a war, you know. How can you possibly have a war with an idea?"), go right ahead. Preferably by standing in no man's land, waving a banner.

anthony65

20-01-2009, 02:30 PM

Let's not bother. I haven't the slightest interest in your games.

If you think you can stop the forthcoming war by having a philosophical debate with the protagonists ("This isn't really a war, you know. How can you possibly have a war with an idea?"), go right ahead. Preferably by standing in no man's land, waving a banner.

What games?

You mean if I ask you a question that you can't answer, because you're talking out of your arse, then I'm playing mind games?

What war?

There is no war with Islam!

There is a bogus war against terror, which is being carried out by the same people who came up with the idea of creating, training and supplying Islamic terrorists in the first place: ie Brzezinski and co. plus the Israelis of course who encouraged Hamas to weaken the PLO.

One of the best ways we have to prevent conflict is for people of all nations around the world to be made aware that we are being cynically deceived and betrayed by an elite who thrive on manufactured conflict. An elite who have tricked millions into fighting, killing and dying for a long, long list of bogus causes.

You come on here and write about the inevitability of a war against Islam, but you're not capable of backing up your arguments.

In fact, you don't have any arguments!

You are seeking to stir up hatred and create division.

I want to achieve the opposite!

You accuse me of being some kind of naive pacifist.

I accuse you of being a cynical warmongerer...

Tell me I'm wrong....

dreamweaver

20-01-2009, 02:35 PM

What games?

You mean if I ask you a question that you can't answer, because you're talking out of your arse, then I'm playing mind games?
All your questions were answered with the following: "If you think you can stop the forthcoming war by having a philosophical debate with the protagonists ("This isn't really a war, you know. How can you possibly have a war with an idea?"), go right ahead. Preferably by standing in no man's land, waving a banner."

You are trolling and I'm not playing your game.

anthony65

20-01-2009, 02:41 PM

All your questions were answered with the following: "If you think you can stop the forthcoming war by having a philosophical debate with the protagonists ("This isn't really a war, you know. How can you possibly have a war with an idea?"), go right ahead. Preferably by standing in no man's land, waving a banner."

You are trolling and I'm not playing your game.

I am trolling? :D:D:D

Could you please tell me what I have written in our exchange that amounts to trolling?

I asked you questions.

You didn't answer them, but you did throw in a sarky comment.

I asked you more questions.

You let fly another sarky comment.

So I gave you one back.

Who is the troll Dreamweaver?

I'll leave that for the audience to judge...

What do you think audience?

dreamweaver

20-01-2009, 02:45 PM

anthony65

20-01-2009, 02:58 PM

I did answer your questions, you didn't like the answers. So you accuse me of not answering them and so the cycle goes on. It's a well-known trolling technique.

Your questions are based on a false assumption, chiefly that wars cannot be fought against an idea. Thus by your "logic", the Crusades never happened and neither did the many battles fought in the name of Islam, a creed that is documented to have been spread through wars and forced conversions.

Therefore you are either woefully ignorant or just plain trolling. Either way, I see little value in engaging with you, especially when you are too dishonest to admit that I have already answered your questions (you just didn't like the answers).

You didn't answer my questions!

You posted a reply that was basically a smarmy insult.

My questions were given clearly in response to what I consider to be an ill thought out and bogus notion of a war against Islam.

Wars are not fought against ideas.

You can not fight an idea.

Wars are fought in the name of ideas. These ideas are generally bogus concepts used as excuses for wars that are really fought with aims of gaining power and wealth.

The Crusades is an excellent example!

There was nothing noble about the crusades.

There was nothing "Christian" about the Crusades.

There were crusades against other Christian sects and against non-Christian Slavs.

When the crusaders reached Jerusalem during the first crusade, they murdered Muslims, Jews and Christians.

One of the Crusades was diverted to sack Constantinople.

Yes, there were many battles and conflicts between Islamic and Christian nations, but if you take the example of Spain, for example, El Cid fought for Christian and Muslim Lords against Christian and Muslim enemies.

I am ignorant?

You are the one who is warmongering on the basis of zero facts.

You have a strange concept of what constitutes an answer to a question.

I would really appreciate a moderator to take a look at my exchange of posts with Dreamweaver. I'm tired of being accused of trolling by someone who posts bullshit about wars with Islam and provides no basis for his arguments, but simply snipes back with sarcastic comments and accusations of trolling

dreamweaver

20-01-2009, 02:58 PM

I did answer your questions, you didn't like the answers. So you accuse me of not answering them and so the cycle goes on. It's a well-known trolling technique.

anthony65

20-01-2009, 02:59 PM

I did answer your questions, you didn't like the answers. So you accuse me of not answering them and so the cycle goes on. It's a well-known trolling technique.

See my post 142.

dreamweaver

20-01-2009, 03:07 PM

runciter

20-01-2009, 03:18 PM

Michael Hoffman's "Judaism Discovered From Its Own Texts"

January 19, 2009

by Henry Makow, Ph.D.

"Judaism Discovered," Michael Hoffman's monumental new work on Judaism is subtitled, "A Study of the Anti-Biblical Religion of Racism, Self-Worship, Superstition and Deceit."

But, what does Hoffman really think of Judaism?

We are in crisis. It's time we listened to plainspoken pariahs like Michael Hoffman. Anti-Semitism is on the rise and Hoffman's book explains why this is not irrational "hate." It's more important for Jews than anyone to learn that they are associated with a "religion" they don't really understand.

Two polls, one on August 9, 2007 and one on January 3, 2009, indicated a sharp growth of anti-Semitism in America. The August poll, conducted for the CIA-controlled RAND Corporation of Santa Monica showed 35% of the American public polled displayed moderate to strong anti-Semitic feelings while a similar poll in January of 2009 showed that percentage had jumped to 62%! This corresponds to the progress of the financial crisis. No doubt, Israel's genocidal attack on Gaza has contributed more. Look at one of the slick new anti-Jewish websites sprouting on the Internet like dandelions.

Many people serve as witting and unwitting agents of the central bankers' plan for world tyranny (the New World Order.) Collaboration is a criterion for "success" today. Increasingly, the NWO is called the "Jew World Order" because of the out-sized role Jews play. Most Jews are just trying to please their mother ("be successful dear") but it's time they learned they are part of a sinister force, and they may end up holding the bag.

Is the NWO driven primarily by the bankers' megalomania or by their adherence to a Jewish corporate agenda? Since many of the bankers are Cabalist Jews, the answer is probably both. The Jewish bankers have expanded their power base by co-opting the decadent gentile elite through intermarriage and Freemasonry (which is based on Jewish Cabalism.) This entity is a Satanic secret society called "The Illuminati Order."

Illuminati bankers are behind the recent financial collapse which is designed to facilitate political change. "Economic crises have been produced by us for the goyim by no other means than the withdrawal of money from circulation." -- (Protocols of Zion, 20) As Pastor Lindsey Williams said recently, long term, "these people are out to own and control everything...they are out to break us."

HOFFMAN BOOK

Hoffman's book is required reading for understanding the Satanic mindset driving both the Illuminati and New World Order.

Normally, a 1100-page book would be daunting. But not in this case. "Judaism Discovered" is an encyclopedia in one volume consisting of more than 140 readable articles. The 10 x 7 inch format, large type and generous spacing make the book approachable. Consider it an opulent banquet. I haven't read it all yet.

Hoffman is a Talmudic adepts' worst nightmare. The goyim aren't supposed to learn this stuff. Ordinary Jews aren't supposed to know either. Hoffman has research assistants, some of whom are Jews, who read Hebrew, Yiddish, Aramaic and German. He is a brilliant scholar and an eloquent, courageous writer. He is clearly not motivated by "hate" but rather by a desire to disabuse both Jews and non-Jews. He sees them as victims of an ongoing scam.

A sample of article titles suggests the provocative theme and range:

The Superiority of the Jews
The Inferiority of the Gentiles
Sexual Intercourse with Little Girls is Permissible
Immanuel Kant
The X-Rated Talmud
Sex Magic
Ritual Murder
Hasidic Paganism
Modern Protestant View of Judaism
From Kaballah to Aggadah: A Sexual Progression
No "Judeo-Christian" Tradition
The Rabbinic World in the Pre-Modern Age
The Talmud in the Toilet
The Attire of the Pharisaic Male
Who are the Jews Today?
Rabbi Judah Loew and Queen Elizabeth's Dr. John Dee
US Gov't. Lays the Groundwork for Talmudic Courts

SAMPLING THE FEAST

Judaism is a secret Satanic cult posing as a religion. Hoffman's main point is that Judaism represents the repudiation by the Pharisees of both the Old Testament and the Mosaic Code. Judaism is not Monotheistic but Luciferian. Its goal is the replacement of God with the secret Jewish leadership. Both the Talmud and the Cabala are dedicated to the proposition that only Jews are human. "The raison d'etre of the Talmud and Orthodox Judaism is the essential spiritual and racial superiority of the Judaic over the non-Judaic," Hoffman writes. This template has been transferred to the Illuminati elite.

I don't know why this information would offend Jews, most of whom consider themselves "secular humanists." Their Jewishness is cultural. They have contempt and even hatred for Orthodox Jews who return the compliment. However, a larger question is, to what extent is the pagan materialist secular culture dominant today a form of Judaism? Especially, when you consider the widespread acceptance of Cabala-based New Age beliefs (i.e. human divinity, pantheism, goddess & sex worship and the vogue of many other occult practices.)

There is so much in Hoffman's book I can only provide a taste. An essay on Moses Hess (1812-1875) suggests modern history and culture have been contrived by Cabalists to overthrow Christian civilization and enslave society. Hoffman shows how Hess' ideology was at the nexus of Communism, Nazism and Zionism and nurtured all three. In other words, Cabalists control mankind by controlling the Hegelian thesis and antithesis. With Communism, the Cabalist bankers attempted to take our country, property, family, race, religion and liberty (still the goals of the NWO.) The reaction to Communism was Nazism, and the reaction to Nazism was Zionism. All three Frankensteins were built in the same occult laboratory using common parts.

Tellingly, the Nazis did the rabbis' work by killing "unauthorized" opponents of Judaism like Edith Stein, Irene Nemirovsky and Maximilian Kolbe. (Hoffman, p. 650)

A true Christian, Hoffman says the way to stop the Hegelian dialectic is to stop fighting. In a timely reference to Zionist colonizers and Palestinian resisters, he writes that both groups of violent combatants "are mutually draining their enemy and themselves of blood, treasure and most damaging of all, their humanity, since this killing entails the dehumanization of the opposing force and the brutalization of one's own...No authentic Christian engages in this pagan, uroboros, victim-into-executioner cycle. Peace pays the greatest dividends. All you live by the sword die by the sword. (Mathew 26:52)." (86)

PAYING THE PRICE

Our financial woes will expose the moral and political bankruptcy of Western Society. We will pay the price for our complacence, for allowing the Illuminati to seduce us and subvert all our institutions.

While Christian civilization was dedicated to the revelation of the Creator by obeying natural and spiritual (moral) laws governing human life, the New World Order replaces God's Will with the Illuminati bankers'. What is presented to us as "progressive" (e.g. sexual "liberation," the breakdown of gender identity, marriage and family) refers to progress toward Luciferian tyranny.

Michael Hoffman writes: "The core of Judaism, like the core of Gnosticism and Egyptian Hermeticism, is magic, the manipulation of the universe, contra God's creation; i.e. against nature. Gershom Scholem, Professor of Kabbalah at Hebrew University wrote that Kaballah embraced a great deal of "black magic, ...a wide realm of demonology and various forms of sorcery that were designed to disrupt the natural order of things..." (Hoffman, p.779.)

(I elaborate on this opposition to God and nature expressed by Jewish and now "modern" culture in my book "Illuminati.")

Babylonian and Egyptian paganism is the progenitor of Judaism, Hoffman writes. "The rabbis hold Egypt in awe as a magical powerhouse. Pharonic Egypt is the model, root and source for Talmudic and Kabalistic priestcraft." (780) This may explain the pyramid on the US dollar and in the logos of so many corporations.

Hoffman seems mindful of the Illuminati when he writes on his website that , "the evil should NOT be assigned to a particular people denominated as "Jewish," but rather to the spirituality and ideology of Pharisaic/rabbinic origin which can, and does, afflict any people who adhere to its tenets, be they Khazars or Sephardim, WASPs such as George W. Bush, or Germans such as the current Pope of Rome."

Modern history and culture reflect a Cabalistic (Satanic) spell cast on the human race. It is dedicated to the fulfillment of prophecy, the eventual enslavement of mankind by the "Jews" who in practice will be the crazed Illuminati Order. But Jews who have no clue about this demented plan will take the blame. That's why it is essential for Jews and non-Jews alike to understand the true nature of Judaism and oppose the NWO. In a spirit of Christian mercy and love, Michael Hoffman has performed an invaluable service to mankind.

----

Relates- My "Jews Must face 'Dark' Side of Judaism"

http://www.henrymakow.com/michael_hoffmans_judaism_disco.html

anthony65

20-01-2009, 03:21 PM

Already answered. Your questions are based on a false assumption that wars cannot be fought against ideas.

Allow me to introduce you to the concept of memes: "A meme (pronounced /miːm/) comprises a unit or element of cultural ideas, symbols or practices; such units or elements transmit from one mind to another through speech, gestures, rituals, or other imitable phenomena. The etymology of the term relates to the Greek word mimema for mimic.[1] Memes act as cultural analogues to genes in that they self-replicate and respond to selective pressures."

Religions and other ideologies are whole collections of memes, known as memeplexes. The Islamic memeplex is a particularly virulent form, which has been analysed in some depth here: http://www.citizenwarrior.com/2007/10/terrifying-brilliance-of-islamic.html The "War on Terror" is another memeplex, as is fractional reserve banking for that matter.

Each of these memeplexes are mind viruses that propagate themselves in a manner directly analagous to biological viruses. That is why I believe the clashes between these competing memeplexes are unavoidable.

Oh, and if you don't like my posts, you don't have to read them. There is an "ignore facility" on the board, you don't need to cry to the moderators (but go right ahead if you want to give them a good laugh :D )

Why should I ignore your posts?

Why is it considered to be crying to the mods if i ask them to read the exchange of posts between me and somebody who calls me a troll in every post?

Who is playing games dreamweaver?

And remember, this thread is about "The War against Islam", which the OP described as potentially leading to WW3, but is more likely to be used as a bogus excuse to murder more muslims.

So now it's not just a war against Islam, a war against an idea, it is a war against a dangerous meme.

No it is isn't.

It is a war against people.

Wars kill people, not memes.

The memes are usually thought up and propagated by the same elite who stir up the other side to go and fight their wars.

We've just been watching the murder of innocents in Gaza.

The excuses of the murderers sounded very much like your reasoning here.

Please add more memes for extremist Jews, Christians, Hindus, Communists, Fascists, etc.

We can discuss and debate ideologies.

We can not fight them.

We fight people.

dreamweaver

20-01-2009, 03:31 PM

Why should I ignore your posts?
You're the one having a problem with them in this thread. Nobody else is.

Why is it considered to be crying to the mods if i ask them to read the exchange of posts between me and somebody who calls me a troll in every post?
In my view it is exactly that. But I also invited you to complain to them, so that they can have a good laugh. :)

So now it's not just a war against Islam, a war against an idea, it is a war against a dangerous meme.

Islam has been a memeplex (a collection of ideas) all along, it hasn't just suddenly become so in the last few minutes. And I already covered the other religions in my statement that "Religions and other ideologies are whole collections of memes", if you had bothered to read my post properly.

Wars kill people, not memes.
Memes are units of cultural information. The language used to order a soldier to kill is itself a meme. "War" in itself is an abstract concept, so you've just inadvertently defeated your own claim that one cannot fight against an abstract concept. :cool:

anthony65

20-01-2009, 03:41 PM

You're the one having a problem with them. Nobody else is.

In my view it is exactly that. But I also invited you to complain to them, so that they can have a good laugh. :)

Islam has been a memeplex (a collection of ideas) all along, it hasn't just suddenly become so in the last few minutes.

Memes are units of cultural information. The language used to order a soldier to kill is itself a meme. "War" in itself is an abstract concept, so you've just inadvertently defeated your own claim that one cannot fight against an abstract concept. :cool:

I actually agree with you on the first point.

Apparently there isn't much interest from anyone else regarding the bs warmongering on this thread.

If the mods get a laugh out of this then I'd be pretty disappointed in them.

As for your clever use of language at the end...

Oh what twisted bollocks.

Oh what a sad excuse for humanity.

If you can reduce the killing and maiming of innocents to memes, then God help you... :(

If you can reduce mass murder to an abstract concept, the God help you... :(

Hasn't there has been enough slaughter of innocents in the name of memes and abstract concepts? :(

dreamweaver

20-01-2009, 03:54 PM

Hasn't there has been enough slaughter of innocents in the name of memes and abstract concepts? :(
Apparently not. :(

I sincerely believe in the concept of memes and that they act in a manner directly analagous to genes as described in Dawkins' book The Selfish Gene. They don't "care" about the welfare of their host, all that matters is that it is transmitted to the next generation of hosts. Not everyone believes in the "memetics" theory but I think it offers a very good explanation of how ideas spread in our society.

The malign memes can be countered by good ones. As David Icke has said, "all you need is love". The more people try to counter the ideologies of war, hate and greed, the better the chance humanity has. Here in the UK, probably the best we can do is go on the demos outside the Israeli embassy, boycott Israeli products, write to our MPs demanding they oppose the war in the Middle East and so on.

I've been pessimistic about avoiding the conflicts because it seems such an uphill struggle, not because I want them to happen. But that doesn't mean I think people should stop trying to prevent them. On the contrary, it's the only chance we have of a future.

anthony65

20-01-2009, 03:59 PM

Apparently not. :(

I sincerely believe in the concept of memes and that they act in a manner directly analagous to genes as described in Dawkins' book The Selfish Gene. They don't "care" about the welfare of their host, all that matters is that it is transmitted to the next generation of hosts. Not everyone believes in the "memetics" theory but I think it offers a very good explanation of how ideas spread in our society.

The malign memes can be countered by good ones. As David Icke has said, "all you need is love". The more people try to counter the ideologies of war, hate and greed, the better the chance humanity has. Here in the UK, probably the best we can do is go on the demos outside the Israeli embassy, boycott Israeli products, write to our MPs demanding they oppose the war in the Middle East and so on.

I've been pessimistic about avoiding the conflicts because it seems such an uphill struggle, not because I want them to happen. But that doesn't mean I think people should stop trying to prevent them. On the contrary, it's the only chance we have of a future.

Let's quit while we're in agreement...

The more we expose the lies and hypocrisy of most "ideals", the more chance we have of avoiding unnecessary suffering in places like Gaza and Afghanistan.

octopusrex

20-01-2009, 04:21 PM

Identify the true problem and you begin to unravel the false one.

The true problem we have here is that a few influential persons on both sides of the fence desire to keep their power through the hatred which is so easy to make.

Identify these people and you begin to see that hatred of the Jew, the Muslim, the Black or the Illuminati is just hatred.

Keep hating folks and you will only get nowhere fast.

picha

20-01-2009, 09:03 PM

OP: Sure it is, get the elites out of power and the war with Islam will start to lose it's steam. Muslims only got radicalized as a response to the way the West has been pushing them around.

Do you think we (the West) hate them, or they hate us for any other reason than fear? They're very afraid that we'll wipe them off the map in our wars of conquest (I don't blame them), and we're (the West) afraid that they're going to go "jihad" on major city centers.

The people of the entire world want peace. Peace doesn't serve the elite plan...so the wars keep rolling along. They'll only allow peace if it is to their gain and the expense of the "peasants".

When you refer to radical muslims there actually just good muslims. It is obligatory for all muslims to wage jihad of whatever form untill the whole world has been made islamic. Find out what kind of a man mohammed was (who is the example for all muslims) and then you will have a better understanding of the true nature of islam and what it really wants, which is to subjugate the whole of the world under sharia law.

danster82

20-01-2009, 10:00 PM

Its avoidable but it takes one side to have the courage to turn the other cheek, then the judgment of the aggressive side will come upon them by other means.

arten

20-01-2009, 10:28 PM

Its avoidable but it takes one side to have the courage to turn the other cheek, then the judgment of the aggressive side will come upon them by other means.

i HAVE DONE THAT IN MY LIFE AND NOW THINK IT IS BOLLOCKS THIS IS JUST A MANTRA OF THE WEAK.

Oh dear did I really write that crap lol of course it takes more strength to walK away from a fight, and I did that the other week even when I could have easily laid the idiot out after he assaulted a girl at a party. Yet I chose to play peacemaker and just booted him out with a verbal threat.

runciter

21-01-2009, 08:02 AM

When you refer to radical muslims there actually just good muslims. It is obligatory for all muslims to wage jihad of whatever form untill the whole world has been made islamic. Find out what kind of a man mohammed was (who is the example for all muslims) and then you will have a better understanding of the true nature of islam and what it really wants, which is to subjugate the whole of the world under sharia law.

change islam with zionism and sharia with talmudic law, and you're facing the truth.

arten

21-01-2009, 08:12 AM

Hello Arten,

This post gives us the chance to find some common ground! :)

I wholeheartedly agree with much of what you write here.

I did read Bramley's book. It was recommended to me by someone whose views I value highly. An interesting read.

Unfortunately there are nutters of all flavours, not just religious, but their arguments are usually (always) flawed. We can help to stop negative mainpulation if we stay cool and highlight the key facts that destroy their bogus claims.

I hope that some of the radical muslims in the UK, for example, will realize that they they are playing into the hands of their true enemies.

There is a lot of wisdom in the muslim world. Let's keep on pushing for peace! :)

Hi Anthony
I agree with you if we see through our differences, many of which are superficial constructs played up by the elites then we can and more importantly will get on of that I am sure.
I often say this on here and it is always worth repeating because it is true, there ARE GOOD AND BAD IN ALL RACES, RELIGIONS AND CREEDS.
The minority are really spoiling this planet for the majority of us who want to co-exist. I often think I wish God would pick up all these nutters who want to war and dump them on another earth like planet, where they can tear one and other to pieces and leave the rest of us here to heal the planet and create a utopian society, where every Man, Woman and child is Loved and Cherished by All of US.

runciter

21-01-2009, 08:15 AM

The minority are really spoiling this planet for the majority of us who want to co-exist.

exactly, and zionist central bankers are the most powerful members of the elite.

picha

21-01-2009, 09:00 PM

change islam with zionism and sharia with talmudic law, and you're facing the truth.

I partly agree with you, but I suspect you are thinking along the lines of the enemy of my enemy is my friend. In the case of islam, the only reason they are against the NWO is because they have their own one world government agenda.

picha

21-01-2009, 09:43 PM

change islam with zionism and sharia with talmudic law, and you're facing the truth.

Are you aware that the punishment for leaving islam is death? Im curious as to how you reconcile that with the teachings of Icke, because thats just pure evil IMO.

eternal_spirit

21-01-2009, 10:02 PM

octopusrex

21-01-2009, 10:26 PM

When two religions preaching/following/living by their laws both from the middle ages clash.

Then they've become a major problem for any humanity who gets caught up in the crossfire.

Gentiles/goyim and kaffirs/infidels as they like to label us. I prefer the label none brainwashed humans.

Islam and Judaism should have been banned from USA and UK many years ago. Problem now is there's too many of them infesting positions of power, and others funding power and owning amounts of these Countries - real estate and business etc.

Talmudic law or Shariah law either way many will suffer even including some of those who are members of these religions.

The problem with "banning" religions is that you send them underground where their destructive power is multiplied tenfold.

zarah

21-01-2009, 10:48 PM

Are you aware that the punishment for leaving islam is death? Im curious as to how you reconcile that with the teachings of Icke, because thats just pure evil IMO.

No it isn't. That's a common misperception, which I imagine has been propagated by the same groups(s) responsible for the systematic denigration of Islam for the last few decades. Apostasy is not punishable by death because the belief is that God will punish the apostate if He chooses.

zarah

21-01-2009, 10:50 PM

Islam and Judaism should have been banned from USA and UK many years ago. Problem now is there's too many of them infesting positions of power, and others funding power and owning amounts of these Countries - real estate and business etc.

Talmudic law or Shariah law either way many will suffer even including some of those who are members of these religions.

Why would you 'ban' anything? Surely a reactive state is the last thing someone who believes in individual autonomy would want.

eternal_spirit

21-01-2009, 11:07 PM

Why would you 'ban' anything? Surely a reactive state is the last thing someone who believes in individual autonomy would want.

Look what happened when the Jews were allowed back into Britain. The Rothschild banking dynasty for one thing happened.

I've seen too much evil (documented facts) from both Judaism and Islam.

Even if you take the good bits (if there are any) you're still left with the bad stuff.

Humanity does not need these religions they hinder any progress that would be made without them.

Born into Islam, and you want to leave the religion, what happens? You die at the hands of Islam.

octopusrex

22-01-2009, 01:51 AM

Look what happened when the Jews were allowed back into Britain. The Rothschild banking dynasty for one thing happened.

I've seen too much evil (documented facts) from both Judaism and Islam.

Even if you take the good bits (if there are any) you're still left with the bad stuff.

Humanity does not need these religions they hinder any progress that would be made without them.

Born into Islam, and you want to leave the religion, what happens? You die at the hands of Islam.

Then why don't you become a Muslim and reform the religion? Bring back tolerance, guidance and light into the Koran.

To be a Muslim there are only 2 requirements.

1. To believe that there is only ONE GOD.
2. To believe that Mohammad is a prophet of that God.

These do not seem particularly difficult philosophically to adjunct into your working life view. For instance, I noticed you have Celtic designs in your avatar. So I assume you are at least friendly with the Lord and the Lady. If you figure the Lord to be the "one", then you've won. All you need to do then is to further believe that Mohammad spoke a message of that being to his people during his time. Bingo. You have become an instant Muslim. Now you are inmune from Muslim attacks unless you attack another Muslim first.

cheeb

22-01-2009, 02:06 AM

Then why don't you become a Muslim and reform the religion? Bring back tolerance, guidance and light into the Koran.

To be a Muslim there are only 2 requirements.

1. To believe that there is only ONE GOD.
2. To believe that Mohammad is a prophet of that God.

There Are 5 Obligations In Islam...

The Five Pillars of Islam

The most important Muslim practices are the Five Pillars of Islam.

The Five Pillars of Islam are the five obligations that every Muslim must satisfy in order to live a good and responsible life according to Islam.

The Five Pillars consist of:

* Shahadah: sincerely reciting the Muslim profession of faith
* Salat: performing ritual prayers in the proper way five times each day
* Zakat: paying an alms (or charity) tax to benefit the poor and the needy
* Sawm: fasting during the month of Ramadan
* Hajj: pilgrimage to Mecca

http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/8288/pillarsqa5.gif

It's A Traditional Pyramid Of Power Structure...!!!

:rolleyes:

scooby85

22-01-2009, 03:00 AM

Are you aware that the punishment for leaving islam is death? Im curious as to how you reconcile that with the teachings of Icke, because thats just pure evil IMO.

Are you also aware that the punishment for leaving judaism and christianity is also death? its just not practised..

so dont be so ignorant, iv noticed you try and make islam look bad in a lot of ur posts by either lying or twisting the truth.. where does the hatred come from man? just chill

017.077 ''(This was Our) way with the apostles We sent before thee: thou wilt find no change in Our ways.''

bowtiedaddy

22-01-2009, 05:33 AM

Look what happened when the Jews were allowed back into Britain. The Rothschild banking dynasty for one thing happened.

The Rothschilds aren't real Jews. They funded Hitler's final solution. You fall for the diversion.

bowtiedaddy

22-01-2009, 05:35 AM

There Are 5 Obligations In Islam...

The Five Pillars of Islam

The most important Muslim practices are the Five Pillars of Islam.

The Five Pillars of Islam are the five obligations that every Muslim must satisfy in order to live a good and responsible life according to Islam.

The Five Pillars consist of:

* Shahadah: sincerely reciting the Muslim profession of faith
* Salat: performing ritual prayers in the proper way five times each day
* Zakat: paying an alms (or charity) tax to benefit the poor and the needy
* Sawm: fasting during the month of Ramadan
* Hajj: pilgrimage to Mecca

http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/8288/pillarsqa5.gif

It's A Traditional Pyramid Of Power Structure...!!!

:rolleyes:

Sounds particularly evil, doesn't it. GIVING TO THE POOR?!?! PRAYING?!?! VISITING HOLY SITES?!?! HOLY SHIT! LOCK THE DOORS! :rolleyes:

bowtiedaddy

22-01-2009, 05:40 AM

Are you also aware that the punishment for leaving judaism and christianity is also death? its just not practised..

so dont be so ignorant, iv noticed you try and make islam look bad in a lot of ur posts by either lying or twisting the truth.. where does the hatred come from man? just chill

017.077 ''(This was Our) way with the apostles We sent before thee: thou wilt find no change in Our ways.''

yes, exactly. The Christian/Jewish bible talks about stoning people for all sorts of mundane things, including being disrespectful to your parents.

I could pick any of the three major world religions and make it sound absolutely frightening if I spun it in the right way. I could rise in shock and horror at the part where Abraham committed incest, or hell, even the popular Christian mantra "the wages of sin is death"... you hear a preacher say that on average 10 times a day. In reality, it's always a small minority of religious people who are fanatical, and even violent in the name of their religion.

If your local mosque was saying "the wages of sin is death", the anti-terror world police would be "liberating" them all the way to Guantanimo.

runciter

22-01-2009, 08:22 AM

the radicalization of islam is clearly part of the bankers' orwellian plan for world domination.

runciter

22-01-2009, 08:26 AM

I partly agree with you, but I suspect you are thinking along the lines of the enemy of my enemy is my friend. In the case of islam, the only reason they are against the NWO is because they have their own one world government agenda.

islamic fundamentalism is manipulated by the elite, the 'clash of civilizations' was planned long ago.

runciter

22-01-2009, 08:28 AM

Are you aware that the punishment for leaving islam is death? Im curious as to how you reconcile that with the teachings of Icke, because thats just pure evil IMO.

i'm sure you're using unbiased sources, and that all islamic world fits your description.

runciter

22-01-2009, 08:32 AM

zarah

22-01-2009, 09:41 AM

dreamweaver

22-01-2009, 09:51 AM

thank you zarah, it's no surprise that anti-muslim propaganda starts spreading again in coincidence with zionist war crimes against the palestinian people: rothschild's little helpers never sleep, and maybe they're even unaware of what they're doing.
Or maybe it's just that when issues involving Zionism and Islam come to the fore, then people who are interested in those issues tend to post more about them.

Of course it could be the case that the Rothschilds and their minions are targeting this relatively minor forum day and night. Or maybe some people just have a highly exaggerated sense of their own importance in the grand scheme of things...

runciter

22-01-2009, 09:54 AM

Or maybe it's just that when issues involving Zionism and Islam come to the fore, then people who are interested in those issues tend to post more about them.

Of course it could be the case that the Rothschilds and their minions are targeting this relatively minor forum day and night. Or maybe some people just have a highly exaggerated sense of their own importance in the grand scheme of things...

shills do not exist, islam is evil and war is inevitable.

zion will prevail!

zarah

22-01-2009, 09:59 AM

Of course it could be the case that the Rothschilds and their minions are targeting this relatively minor forum day and night. Or maybe some people just have a highly exaggerated sense of their own importance in the grand scheme of things...

Someone from here had a link to a programme which provides links to anti Israel comments on sites like this, in order that people who support Israel can defend it when necessary.

octopusrex

22-01-2009, 02:21 PM

There Are 5 Obligations In Islam...

The Five Pillars of Islam

The most important Muslim practices are the Five Pillars of Islam.

The Five Pillars of Islam are the five obligations that every Muslim must satisfy in order to live a good and responsible life according to Islam.

The Five Pillars consist of:

* Shahadah: sincerely reciting the Muslim profession of faith
* Salat: performing ritual prayers in the proper way five times each day
* Zakat: paying an alms (or charity) tax to benefit the poor and the needy
* Sawm: fasting during the month of Ramadan
* Hajj: pilgrimage to Mecca

http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/8288/pillarsqa5.gif

It's A Traditional Pyramid Of Power Structure...!!!

:rolleyes:

Many Mulsims are never able to perform Hajj and they are still Muslims. Many other Muslims are not able to perform Salat and they are sitill Muslims.

Careful.

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 02:50 PM

The Rothschilds aren't real Jews. They funded Hitler's final solution. You fall for the diversion.

Oh dear what is a real Jew then?
And the quote from the Bible doesn't wash with me - Biblical quote "They who call themselves Jews, but are not Jews, but are of the Synogogue of Satan."

Can't wait for the answer:rolleyes:
Heard the story Hilter was a Rothschild?

octopusrex

22-01-2009, 02:55 PM

Oh dear what is a real Jew then?
And the quote from the Bible doesn't wash with me - Biblical quote "They who call themselves Jews, but are not Jews, but are of the Synogogue of Satan."

Can't wait for the answer:rolleyes:
Heard the story Hilter was a Rothschild?

Lets leave our speculations and prejudices aside and focus on what is really important: putting and end to WWIII.

free_soul

22-01-2009, 03:09 PM

all war is avoidable

what would happen if no-one turned up?

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 03:14 PM

[quote]yes, exactly. The Christian/Jewish bible talks about stoning people for all sorts of mundane things, including being disrespectful to your parents.True, but do Christian's still do that where you live? Sure don't were I live. Islam needs to reform it's laws/teachings if it's going to be accepted in Today's world, same as Christianity reformed.

I do not trust Muslims or Jews. Some may appear to have reformed and practice a moderate none fundamentalist ideological form of their religions.

But in secret they still believe the fundamentalist mindset. And await the right time to have their Jihad, and force Shariah Law on us (convert or die) or Zionist/Talmudic laws. The more you study these topics, I think many will reach the same conclusions.

(I do hope I am wrong and there are many moderate none extremist people of these religions who can live peacefully alongside us Kaffirs and Goyim like they have done in the past.)

Judaism/Islam/Christianity are foreign religions, designed by the foreign Elite.

Can I go up to the hill top, the woods now and worship my trees, sun, moon and stars? Worship myself and people I like without some invented man made external God/deity. Because I've had enough of their nonsense.

Muslims and Jews can go fight it out in Jerusalem and all the other places they war. Just leave us none religious people out of it.

I am so tired of this topic Jews v Muslims. And will be trying to avoid it from now on.

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 03:21 PM

Scenario

Your sister marries a Rich Muslim living in Britain means she also has to convert to his religion. They both go to live in Saudi Arabi, or some other like Country where Shariah Law and the hadiths are the law of the land/Country.

A phone call would go something like - "Hi sis, been to any stonings, whippings, be headings, genital mutilations recently?"

"Oh, what's that your booked in for stoning next Tuesday!"

jesuitsdidit

22-01-2009, 03:47 PM

the rothschilds were Khazari Jews
they agreed to work for the Jesuits a long time ago - under duress? who knows?

if someone does not follow the religion of their birth theres no point mentioning it

Zionism was created about 100 yrs ago with sole purpose of bringing Jerusalem under the control of Rome

if you believe anything else you do not have the complete picture..

Israel was founded on a lie and for that reason must be dismantled
that is what Ahmedinajad and other Muslim scholars are talking about.

They know its a fraud and so do I.

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 04:00 PM

The first Jesuits were Jews. Jews where the people who formed the Illuminati. Khazars converted to Judaism, the Rothschilds are Jewish . The hexagram they/Zionism use is the identity of the Jewish people.

The Pope is Ashkenazi Jew.

Ask why Islam and Judaism instructs in their religious laws and practises genital mutilation.

The ritual goes back before both religions started. Originally both boys and girls would be circumcised to honour/appease the Gods/fertility Godessess. The whole penis was cut off.

But later it was changed to circumcision. Guess the priesthood figured their religions would multiply more if they didn't kill/sacrifice their own people. To Jews it is the sign of being initiated into the Covenant and becoming a child of Israel.

http://www.jewsagainstcircumcision.org/

We are a group of educated and enlightened Jews who realize that the barbaric, primitive, torturous, and mutilating practice of circumcision has no place in modern Judaism.

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 04:05 PM

B'nai B'rith means "Sons of the Covenant" or "the Cut" (Circumcision Covenant) B'nai B'rith is Hebrew for Sons of the Covenant, and the covenant that God made with Abraham, the first Jew, and afterward renewed with Moses, is the central and deathless theme and constitution of Judaism. --B'NAI B'RITH: The Story of a Covenant, by Edward E. Grusd, Editor of National Jewish Monthly, Appleton-Century/Affiliate of Meredith Press, 1966, New York, p. 19.
This Covenant is repeated several times in the Bible, notably in Deuteronomy 5: 1-3: "And Moses called unto all Israel, and said unto them . . . The Lord our God made a covenant with us in Horeb. The Lord made not this covenant with our fathers, but with us, even us, who are all of us here alive this day." And again, in Isaiah 59:21: "As for me, this is my covenant with them, saith the Lord; My Spirit that is upon thee, and my words which I have put in thy mouth, shall not de-part out of thy mouth, nor out of the mouth of thy seed, nor out of the mouth of thy seed's seed, saith the Lord, from henceforth and forever." --B'NAI B'RITH: The Story of a Covenant, by Edward E. Grusd, Editor of National Jewish Monthly, Appleton-Century/Affiliate of Meredith Press, 1966, New York, p. 19.

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=49064

more here

jesuitsdidit

22-01-2009, 04:10 PM

discussing the specifics of Jewish Religious Practice may be relevant at another time; right now we r concerned with avoiding Total Global War and the Enslavement of Mankind.

jesuitsdidit

22-01-2009, 04:12 PM

have u found yr source for the Jewish popes yet, eternal spirit, or hav u decided 2 ignore that post??

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 04:32 PM

have u found yr source for the Jewish popes yet, eternal spirit, or hav u decided 2 ignore that post??

make your mind up Islam or Jews Jesuits?
Two sources for now

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=549123&postcount=30
http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=472145&postcount=20

How do the extremists unbrainwash themselves? They see their families killed and it becomes revenge and so on and so on.

If it's true the majority of people of all religions want peace then the future relys on these people to live in peace.

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 04:38 PM

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=OBRiWcqMX6M&feature=related

jesuitsdidit

22-01-2009, 04:43 PM

make your mind up Islam or Jews Jesuits?
Two sources for now

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=549123&postcount=30
http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=472145&postcount=20

How do the extremists unbrainwash themselves? They see their families killed and it becomes revenge and so on and so on.

If it's true the majority of people of all religions want peace then the future relys on these people to live in peace.

it always takes me some time to adjust to the level of some of yr questions, i will deal with yr points but for now, will say this, wes penre is an agent acc 2 Phelps.

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 04:49 PM

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=2v_4CuJBjnY&feature=related

You tube user comments

the hamas literally means the islamic resistance

and their laws are all based off of sharia law

do some research, they all want you dead

muslims will do anything to make jews look bad.
i mean ANYTHING.
here in israel its nothing new.
LONG LIVE ISRAEL!

Jews need to reintegrate into the greater arab community and strive to gain positions of authority in the coming arab united state i would accept something like that they are close to us in nearly every way other than the border...but to exist in thier own self made illigal entity they will jsut bring death upon thier whole people!

We're not interested in being second class citizens in Arab Muslim dictatorships. We have our own country and we intend to keep it.

Israel is more legitimate of a country than manufactured Arab monarchies such as the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan or Saudi Arabia.

So... you're saying that Israel cannot exist except under muslim rule, eh??

Pssst... just to remind you... you manly muslims have been trying to kill the jews off for 60 years now. The only thing you've actually attained is having to beg for your land back. Enjoy your war in Gaza. You wanted it, you have it now. Enjoy!

Arabs in Israel are in the government, in the Knesset. They vote, they are citizens.

I think this guys arabic is too good to be a Jew.
Blond people can't survive in the desert? Australians are doing just fine in the outback.
What a maroon this neo-nerd is.

"And Arabs under Zionism have more rights than under Islam "

LOL!!!!!
How can i make the font bigger on the LOL???
LOL!!!

Really, you don't have a problem with that? Because back when Jews lived under Arab control they were routinely massacred and persecuted.

Live in unity? No one lives in unity with Arabs and Muslims. Just ask the Christians of Sudan or the Copts of Egypt or the Zoroastrians of Iran.

Or the Jews and Christians of Saudi Arabia...oh wait Mohammed wiped them all out long ago.

Tell you what you can keep your countries and we'll keep ours. And Arabs under Zionism have more rights than under Islam

its clear to me that u never read it, and u know nothing about Islam or prophet Mohammad...

what do I need to know about Mohammed?

A. He was a robber.

B. He was illiterate.

C. He was a rapist

D. He was a pedophile

E. He founded a religion based on a mix of what he stole from Judaism, Christianity and local tribal pagan beliefs and customs.

F. His name was Mohammed.

Anything else I need to know?

Hell is Saudi Arabia, especially Mecca. No alcohol, women dressed in hefty bags, and everyone is a Muslim, except for their Filipino slaves.

And so on. Who's telling the truth....

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 04:56 PM

And here we have a nice Jewish boy :rolleyes:

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=hefIti-uFUo&feature=related

2 and a half mins vid

runciter

22-01-2009, 04:58 PM

the rothschilds were Khazari Jews

if they are the descendants of sabbetai, and i think they are, they may be non-ashkenazi.

runciter

22-01-2009, 05:10 PM

Early years

Sabbatai's family came from Patras, presently in Greece, and descended from the Greek-speaking Jews of the Ottoman Empire. They were neither Sephardi nor Ashkenazi, but belonged to a distinctive group known as Romaniotes.

http://www.newworldencyclopedia.org/entry/Shabbetai_Zevi#Early_years

runciter

22-01-2009, 05:14 PM

jesuitsdidit

22-01-2009, 05:26 PM

if they are the descendants of sabbetai, and i think they are, they may be non-ashkenazi.

yes, there r many different groupings under the 'Jewish' banner
my point is Rothschild is a Court Jew/hofjuden, he works 4 the Pope as do all Zionists..

jesuitsdidit

22-01-2009, 05:31 PM

make your mind up Islam or Jews Jesuits?
Two sources for now

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=549123&postcount=30
http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=472145&postcount=20

How do the extremists unbrainwash themselves? They see their families killed and it becomes revenge and so on and so on.

If it's true the majority of people of all religions want peace then the future relys on these people to live in peace.

if u examine my thread Concentration Gas Camps in the USA

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=30489

you will find i deal with the theory that Islam was created by the Catholic Church..

jesuitsdidit

22-01-2009, 05:36 PM

the hamas literally means the islamic resistance

as far as I'm aware, Hamas was 'created' by Mossad/CIA/ptb to prevent a settlement, coz... Israel duznt want a settlement, it wants to push the Palestinians into the sea and take their gas fields, land and water..
its pretty obvious isnt it??

runciter

22-01-2009, 05:46 PM

yes, there r many different groupings under the 'Jewish' banner
my point is Rothschild is a Court Jew/hofjuden, he works 4 the Pope as do all Zionists..

nein, from my point of view they are the hidden gods of the cult of the all seeing eye.

there's no man above them.

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 06:00 PM

as far as I'm aware, Hamas was 'created' by Mossad/CIA/ptb to prevent a settlement, coz... Israel duznt want a settlement, it wants to push the Palestinians into the sea and take their gas fields, land and water..
its pretty obvious isnt it??

Even if the CIA/mossad connections are true, doesn't account for all the other atrocities being committed by Muslims in other places.

It's time to stop blaming the CIA etc for the problems created by other religions and foreigners.

These wars between Arabs and Jews have been going on thousands of years. Many of both of them are the same races.

Yahweh commanded the Israelites to kill and destroy, same as Mohamed did.

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 06:19 PM

The Romaniotes (Greek: Ρωμανιώτες, Rōmaniōtes) are a Jewish population who have lived in the territory of today's Greece and neighboring areas with large Greek populations for more than 2,000 years. Their language is Greek and they derive their name from the old name for the Greek people, Rhomaioi. Large communities were located in Thebes, Ioannina, Chalcis, Corfu, Arta, Corinth and on the islands of Lesbos, Chios, Samos, Rhodes and Cyprus, among others. The Romaniotes are historically distinct from the Sephardim, who settled in Greece after the 1492 expulsion of the Jews from Spain.

History

The earliest reference to a Greek Jew is in an inscription, dated c. 300-250 BCE found in Oropos, a small coastal town between Athens and Boeotia, and refers to him as "Moschos, son of Moschion the Jew" who may have been a slave. The Romaniotes are Greek Jews, distinct from both Ashkenazim and Sephardim. Jews have lived in Greece possibly as early as the Babylonian exile. A Romaniote oral tradition traces the first Jews to arrive in Ioannina to shortly after the destruction of the Second Temple in 70.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Romaniotes

That's interesting may account for the Greek deity Lucifer being a God of some Jews. Also Prince Philip a Greek (Queen of England's husband)

The Babylonian exile LOL. The longest running lie in the Torah (OT Bible)

I'd go for the version that's seldom told. The Egpytian's booted the Elite Jewish priesthood out of Babylon. The Jews brought the Kabbalah and Talmud out of babylon with them, this was the beginning of Judaism.

Jackie: And the world Hebrew is the word Habiru?

Alan: Habiru is the term that came up by the Egyptians of an invading people who came in from the highland areas to the northeast and invaded and took over Egypt for a period. They were vicious mercenaries basically.

Jackie: The Habiru? And that was the Hebrew, right?

Alan: That's what historians today think they must be and they do know that some of them had Semitic names, not all of them, though, but the Habiru was a conglomeration of different peoples. It wasn't just one race of people and they were all nomadic initially, until they settled within Egypt, and they were the most tyrannical rulers Egypt ever had and there was a General eventually who started an uprising to kick them out.

Jackie: The Hyksos are mentioned that way. Is that one in the same people?

Alan: It's the same thing. The Hyksos refers to another term they went by, and that was shepherd kings.

Jackie: Okay. This is still the same Habiru?

Alan: Yes.

Jackie: So they weren't taken into Egypt and enslaved, that they actually went in to and enslaved Egyptians?

Alan: There were two forces that came into Egypt at the same time. One from the Mediterranean Sea and they were called the Boat People, and another bunch came by land driving their animals before them and with them. The Hyksos, they often say shepherd kings, but 'Hyks' really refers to cattle, that they drove cattle ahead of them, and Habiru was the mercenaries who backed them up, basically, armed forces.

Jackie: So the more things change, the more they stay the same because they were the mercenaries.

Alan: Yes and so they took over Egypt. They slaughtered thousands of the Egyptians and then the Habiru nobility made themselves pharaohs for a couple of hundred years until they were eventually kicked out again.

Jackie: And the story of the Exodus. Isn't it amazing how they took that worldwide conflagration and wove it into a story around these special chosen people of Jehovah?

Alan: It's more than that. Again, it's an esoteric story of a group coming out of Egypt, but the real story was to do with Akhenaten priesthood. He was the pharaoh who they claim was the first guy to say that all gods are one and Aton was the god.

Jackie: And he closed down all of the temples, didn't he?

Alan: All the Amons and so on.

Jackie: We're getting to take that break at the half hour.

Alan: I guess I'll just talk about the Peoples of the Sea and the Hyksos in the meantime and the Peoples of the Sea may have come from the Grecian Islands at the same time as the land invaders were coming across from the east.

more here
http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=483554&postcount=6

jesuitsdidit

22-01-2009, 07:00 PM

Israel is more legitimate of a country than manufactured Arab monarchies such as the Hashemite Kingdom of Jordan or Saudi Arabia.

israel was built on a lie and therefore must be dismantled..

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 07:31 PM

israel was built on a lie and therefore must be dismantled..

Tell them on you tube I posted comments by them. Here's another comment
Live in unity? No one lives in unity with Arabs and Muslims. Just ask the Christians of Sudan or the Copts of Egypt or the Zoroastrians of Iran.

Or the Jews and Christians of Saudi Arabia...oh wait Mohammed wiped them all out long ago.

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=749121&postcount=194

jesuitsdidit

22-01-2009, 07:36 PM

Even if the CIA/mossad connections are true, doesn't account for all the other atrocities being committed by Muslims in other places.

It's time to stop blaming the CIA etc for the problems created by other religions and foreigners.

These wars between Arabs and Jews have been going on thousands of years. Many of both of them are the same races.

Yahweh commanded the Israelites to kill and destroy, same as Mohamed did.

ATTENTION: Israel recruits 'army of bloggers'
http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=50549

These wars between Arabs and Jews have been going on thousands of years. Many of both of them are the same races..

Wrong. Jews and Arabs have co-existed peacefully for centuries and millenia.
True Torah believing Jews totally reject Zionism and the State of Israel as un-biblical. They believe it is God's will that they must remain in 'exile' until the return of the Messiah.

Zionism is not based on Judaism it is based on the Pope's desire to rule the world.

see my posts at the end of Anti-Zionism and Anti-Semitism

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=40137

jesuitsdidit

22-01-2009, 07:45 PM

No one lives in unity with Arabs and Muslims. Just ask the Christians of Sudan or the Copts of Egypt or the Zoroastrians of Iran.

source??

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 09:27 PM

True Torah believing Jews totally reject Zionism and the State of Israel as un-biblical. They believe it is God's will that they must remain in 'exile' until the return of the Messiah.

Zionism is not based on Judaism it is based on the Pope's desire to rule the world.

Eric John Phelps (in his own words) is a Biblical Zionist who believes only Jews should be allowed to live in Israel/Jerusalem. And no gentiles, or Arabs should be allowed to live there.

When you gonna wake up and realise he is a crackpot racist and full of disinfo.

Craig Oxley also claims Yahweh is his God. Two peas in a pod anti-Catholics. And preach the OT angry God Yahweh spiel.

Zionism is not a Catholic or the Pope's creation. Zionism is all about Judaism, created by Jews!

jesuitsdiditsource?? I've just given it a few posts back (You tube)
Tell them on you tube I posted comments by them. Here's another comment
Live in unity? No one lives in unity with Arabs and Muslims. Just ask the Christians of Sudan or the Copts of Egypt or the Zoroastrians of Iran.

Or the Jews and Christians of Saudi Arabia...oh wait Mohammed wiped them all out long ago.

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showp...&postcount=194 (http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=749121&postcount=194)

picha

22-01-2009, 09:29 PM

No it isn't. That's a common misperception, which I imagine has been propagated by the same groups(s) responsible for the systematic denigration of Islam for the last few decades. Apostasy is not punishable by death because the belief is that God will punish the apostate if He chooses.

Sorry zarah, youre wrong.

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=ZMAZR8YIhxI

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apostasy_in_Islam#Punishment_for_apostasy

Legal opinion on apostasy by a Fatwa committee concerning the case of a man who converted to Christianity: "Since he left the Islam, he will be invited to express his regret. If he does not regret, he will be killed pertaining to rights and obligations of the Islamic law."In Islamic law (sharia), the consensus view is that a male apostate must be put to death unless he suffers from a mental disorder or converted under duress, for example, due to an imminent danger of being killed. A female apostate must be either executed, according to Shafi'i, Maliki, and Hanbali schools of Sunni Islamic jurisprudence (fiqh), or imprisoned until she reverts to Islam as advocated by the Sunni Hanafi school and by Shi'a scholars.[15]

A minority of medieval Islamic jurists, notably the Hanafi jurist Sarakhsi (d. 1090),[4] Maliki jurist Ibn al-Walid al-Baji (d. 494 AH) and Hanbali jurist Ibn Taymiyyah (1263-1328), held that apostasy carries no legal punishment.[5] Some contemporary Islamic Shafi`i jurists, such as the Grand Mufti Ali Gomaa,[6][7] some Shi'a jurists such as Grand Ayatollah Hossein-Ali Montazeri,[8] and some jurists, scholars and writers of other Islamic sects, have argued or issued fatwas that either the changing of religion is not punishable or is only punishable under restricted circumstances, but these minority opinions have not found broad acceptance among the majority of Islamic scholars.[16][17][18][19]

[edit] Preferred form of execution
Most Islamic scholars agree that the appropriate punishment for apostasy is beheading.[citation needed] Mamluk Sultan Baybars II also practiced torture of apostates. A case is recorded when a woman who had apostatised was led through the streets of Cairo on an ass, then strangled in a boat in the middle of the Nile and thrown into the river. In modern times, followers of the Ahmadiyya sect in Afghanistan were stoned to death. The execution for apostasy was abolished in most Muslim lands in the 19th century either through European pressure or through the direct European rule; however, cases of imprisonment and deportation of apostates still occurred. Nevertheless, even nowadays apostates are not sure of their lives, as their Muslim relatives frequently try to kill them.[15]

Ideally, the one performing the execution of an apostate must be an imam.[15] At the same time, all schools of Islamic jurisprudence agree that any Muslim can kill an apostate without punishment.[20]

We even have scooby admitting that the punishment is death on this thread.

picha

22-01-2009, 09:34 PM

zarah

22-01-2009, 09:52 PM

Sorry zarah, youre wrong.

I would suggest you do a tad more research than searching 'Apostasy punishable by death in Islam'.

There are only two hadiths, which I won't source for you as you obvioulsy know how to google, which indicate anything of the sort, and execution of apostates isn't referred to in the Qur'an. When you do research, you will find that is entirely probable that the Hadith was added after the Prophet's death, for political reasons in the 8th century - mainly to ensure justification for the slaughtering of opponants.

Of course, as with all religions, Islam has been infiltrated by those with subversive agendas, whose purpose is to twist the main tenets of the faith. Whether you choose to untangle the web and gain a level of independent understanding is up to you.

zarah

22-01-2009, 09:58 PM

Scooby, I dont hate you as a person. I do however sincerely hope you will one day realise Islam is an utterly false religion just like most of the other organised religions are, then youll be able to accept something closer to the truth like that which Icke promotes for example.

Omg, you're just as brainwashed as those you think you lord your athiesm over!

Do you not accept that to some, your belief system in erroneous and 'utterly false'? You seem to spend an inordinate amount of time copy pasting crap from the internet which you imagine supports your agenda, but which actually highlights nothing more than your obvious distaste for Islam. Is there a religion which suits you a little better? I suspect there might be.

I would suggest you study David's work a little harder, especially the parts about the importance of respecting others.

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 09:59 PM

For jesuitsdidit

quote Kasalt

The book of Isaiah was written as far back as the 8th century B.C. Why is this fact significant? It is significant because the following quotes are found within the book of Isaiah:Isaiah 2.2, 3b:
"And it shall come to pass in the last days, that the mountain of the LORD's house shall be established in the top of the mountains, and shall be exalted above the hills; and all nations shall flow unto it...For out of Zion shall go forth the law, and the word of the LORD from Jerusalem."

Isaiah 34.8:
"For it is the day of the LORD's vengeance, and the year of recompences for the controversy of Zion."
Zionism did not start in 1880, as you say--it was only the modern incarnation of Zionism that got started in the late 1800s, by Theodore Herzl. But the fact is that Zionism goes back for thousands of years, as the quotes from Isaiah prove. Zionism predates popery.

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=688892&postcount=274

jesuitsdidit

22-01-2009, 10:05 PM

Eric John Phelps (in his own words) is a Biblical Zionist who believes only Jews should be allowed to live in Israel/Jerusalem. And no gentiles, or Arabs should be allowed to live there.

where does he say this?

jesuitsdidit

22-01-2009, 10:08 PM

eternal_spirit

22-01-2009, 10:14 PM

where does he say this?

5. Anti-Jesuit/anti-Vatican Christian Zionists—led by anti-Jesuit, biblical futurists holding to a literal reading of the prophets, maintaining that the beloved Hebrew/Jewish/Israelitic people have a right to live in their promised land apart from obedience to the law of Moses, now done away. They abhor the government of Israel as being totally controlled by Rome through the pope’s New York City-based Council on Foreign Relations to the detriment of the Jewish people living in Israel. They oppose the government of Israel, but defend the Jewish people’s right to live in the promised land of Israel to the exclusion of all Arabs and non-racial Jews.

These are the six Zionists. I am of the fifth catagory.

Sincerely in faith,

Brother Eric "

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=475093&postcount=9

picha

22-01-2009, 10:20 PM

I would suggest you do a tad more research than searching 'Apostasy punishable by death in Islam'.

There are only two hadiths, which I won't source for you as you obvioulsy know how to google, which indicate anything of the sort, and execution of apostates isn't referred to in the Qur'an. When you do research, you will find that is entirely probable that the Hadith was added after the Prophet's death, for political reasons in the 8th century - mainly to ensure justification for the slaughtering of opponants.

Of course, as with all religions, Islam has been infiltrated by those with subversive agendas, whose purpose is to twist the main tenets of the faith. Whether you choose to untangle the web and gain a level of independent understanding is up to you.

Do you really believe that a mass murdering, lying, theiving, sex slave keeping paedo like mohammed was a prophet?

picha

22-01-2009, 10:22 PM

can u summarise which parts of Icke's work are closer to the truth than "most of the other organised religions are" please?

I would say the infinite love part is for example.

zarah

22-01-2009, 10:35 PM

Do you really believe that a mass murdering, lying, theiving, sex slave keeping paedo like mohammed was a prophet?

Vile mouthed thing aren't you?

So all you have now are abstract insults which I imagine I'm meant to act defensively about.

Either do research or be a good little repeater..up to you.

zarah

22-01-2009, 10:36 PM

I would say the infinite love part is for example.

Practice what you preach, eh? :rolleyes:

arten

23-01-2009, 12:36 AM

Zionism is not a Catholic or the Pope's creation. Zionism is all about Judaism, created by Jews!

This is where the elites have been very clever, those who created modern day Israel which Torah loving jews say is against God's plans. Were Atheist, I would not mind betting that Herzl and Ben Gurion et al were also Satanist. There intention is to destroy Christendom, Islam and Judaism through Zionism. People fighting overs who God is best are playing into their hands. Zionist don't care about the Jews they never have.

"One Cow in Palestine is worth more than all the Jews in Poland"

....Izaak Greenbaum

octopusrex

23-01-2009, 01:04 AM

zarah

23-01-2009, 07:09 AM

This is getting us nowhere.

We are left with 2 options.

1. Jews anihilate all Arabs.
2. Arabs anihilate all Jews.

Not good enough. We desperately need a third option: Jews and Arabs stop fighting and learn to get along.

And you came to this conclusion how exactly?

Palestinians (they are from Palestine, ergo they are Palestinians, they're not from Arabia) have a right to self defense. When one looks at the situation objectively, it is clear to see that the Palestinians have had horrific crimes perpetrated against them by Israel and its cronies.

This is what should happen: The first option is that there should be a viable Palestinian state created; siutated in the present areas of Gaza and the West Bank, which includes Jerusalem as its capital. The Palestinians refugees worldwide should be permitted the right to return and paid restituition, in accordance with international law. All illegal settlements should be disbanded and the apartheid wall dismantled. Israel must stop its continuous breaches of international and humanarian law and recognise Palestine as a state, rather than stomping its foot and demanding recognition from everyone else.

The second alternative is that one harmonious, egalitarian state is created for all faiths and races within the current land mass of Palestine and Israel. This would mean that Israel can no longer operate an apartheid state within its borders and give equal rights to Christians and Israeli Arabs as well as to the indigenous people of Palestine.

Of course, even though Hamas accepted the idea of a two-state soloution in principal recently, Israel will play no part in such a resolution as it desires nothing less than the total eradication of Palestine and the Palestinian people. It wants Israel to exist from the Euphrates to the Nile, and will stop at nothing to achieve its aims.

arten

23-01-2009, 10:05 AM

This is getting us nowhere.

We are left with 2 options.

1. Jews anihilate all Arabs.
2. Arabs anihilate all Jews.

Not good enough. We desperately need a third option: Jews and Arabs stop fighting and learn to get along.

I agree with you and I was shocked to learn from a friend who was born in Israel when she told me that Jews and Arabs not only live in peace over there, they even fall in Love and Marry. So it can be done, the problem we have is that the evil amongst us is manipulating the extreme radical religious zealots on both sides and that is causing all the problems for everyone else.

stelios

23-01-2009, 10:14 AM

This is getting us nowhere.

We are left with 2 options.

1. Jews anihilate all Arabs.
2. Arabs anihilate all Jews.

Not good enough. We desperately need a third option: Jews and Arabs stop fighting and learn to get along.

This is utter rubbish.
Firstly most Israelis are NOT Jews. They do not follow the teachings of the Torah.
Israelis are followers of a form of APARTHEID known as ZIONISM.
Everyone is their enemy, Christians, Muslims, Jews, Arabs, Africans, everyone.
Zionists believe they are the master race.

Arabs are not constantly fighting. Thye are struggling for freedom, none of them have democracy and most of them live in utter poverty.
The fact that the Zionists slaughter Arabs regularly simply to train up their troops and to test out the latest American weapons can hardly be described as Arabs anihilate all Jews.

http://www.vivapalestina.org/images/website/stolemyland_425.jpg

zarah

23-01-2009, 10:30 AM

This is utter rubbish.
Firstly most Israelis are NOT Jews. They do not follow the teachings of the Torah.
Israelis are followers of a form of APARTHEID known as ZIONISM.
Everyone is their enemy, Christians, Muslims, Jews, Arabs, Africans, everyone.
Zionists believe they are the master race.

I agree with you. The problem is though that they identify themselves as Jews, therefore intertwining the two.

stelios

23-01-2009, 10:38 AM

I agree with you and I was shocked to learn from a friend who was born in Israel when she told me that Jews and Arabs not only live in peace over there, they even fall in Love and Marry. So it can be done, the problem we have is that the evil amongst us is manipulating the extreme radical religious zealots on both sides and that is causing all the problems for everyone else.
Again a misleading statement.
Jews and Arabs live in peace over here too. In fact they live in peace in most parts of the world.
Indeed over 1 million Jews are in fact Arabs.
More if you include those living inthe UK and in the USA
So there is certainly no problem with Jews and Arabs marrying especially those Jews who are themselves Arabs.
The problem i repeat is ZIONISTS. These people are pure racists and certainly are only interested in slaughter and massacres and are not interested in peace let alone marrying Arabs.
You mention religious zealots. I assume you are refering to religious Jews who in fact oppose the Zionist state known as Israel.
http//:www.nkusa.org

http://www.vivapalestina.org/images/website/stolemyland_425.jpg

jesuitsdidit

23-01-2009, 05:50 PM

Do you really believe that a mass murdering, lying, theiving, sex slave keeping paedo like mohammed was a prophet?

wots yr evidence for this pls?

jesuitsdidit

23-01-2009, 05:53 PM

This is getting us nowhere.

We are left with 2 options.

1. Jews anihilate all Arabs.
2. Arabs anihilate all Jews.

Not good enough. We desperately need a third option: Jews and Arabs stop fighting and learn to get along.

The One-State Solution
By MUAMMAR QADDAFI
Published: January 21, 2009

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/22/opinion/22qaddafi.html?_r=1&scp=1&sq=The%20One-State%20Solution&st=cse

jesuitsdidit

23-01-2009, 05:55 PM

Zionism is not a Catholic or the Pope's creation.

it is, but u cant see it. the rest of wot u say is correct..

orbandsceptre27

23-01-2009, 06:53 PM

Is War with Islam Avoidable at all?

Yes

arten

23-01-2009, 09:13 PM

it is, but u cant see it. the rest of wot u say is correct..

If you could see, you would have noticed that I did not make that statement, which you accreddited to me :mad:

In the land of the blind the one eyed man is KING.

bowtiedaddy

24-01-2009, 10:01 AM

When two religions preaching/following/living by their laws both from the middle ages clash.

Then they've become a major problem for any humanity who gets caught up in the crossfire.

Gentiles/goyim and kaffirs/infidels as they like to label us. I prefer the label none brainwashed humans.

Islam and Judaism should have been banned from USA and UK many years ago. Problem now is there's too many of them infesting positions of power, and others funding power and owning amounts of these Countries - real estate and business etc.

Talmudic law or Shariah law either way many will suffer even including some of those who are members of these religions.

What the fuck are you on? We, the west, have been stirring up the third world against each other. It's the new Inquisition, only they let the people do it to themselves and each other.

If left to their own devices, Jews would have lived harmoniously with Muslims, and vice versa. They only start to get radicalized because they've been bombed and impoverished over and over and over.

bowtiedaddy

24-01-2009, 10:07 AM

Oh dear what is a real Jew then?
And the quote from the Bible doesn't wash with me - Biblical quote "They who call themselves Jews, but are not Jews, but are of the Synogogue of Satan."

Can't wait for the answer:rolleyes:
Heard the story Hilter was a Rothschild?

I don't really want to spend a lot of time going into it at great length, but the Rothschilds are part of a group of people who latched onto Judaism and attempted to use it to their own ends. I'm not speaking of a biblical quote. While I've read the bible, I hardly have the thing memorized. Religion itself is a very small part of my life.

It is very possible that Hitler was a descendent from a bastard child of one of the Rothschilds. It's not entirely possible to confirm one way or another, in reality. Hitler made great effort to cover up his family tree.

bowtiedaddy

24-01-2009, 10:12 AM

[quote=bowtiedaddy;748111]True, but do Christian's still do that where you live? Sure don't were I live. Islam needs to reform it's laws/teachings if it's going to be accepted in Today's world, same as Christianity reformed.

I do not trust Muslims or Jews. Some may appear to have reformed and practice a moderate none fundamentalist ideological form of their religions.

But in secret they still believe the fundamentalist mindset. And await the right time to have their Jihad, and force Shariah Law on us (convert or die) or Zionist/Talmudic laws. The more you study these topics, I think many will reach the same conclusions.

(I do hope I am wrong and there are many moderate none extremist people of these religions who can live peacefully alongside us Kaffirs and Goyim like they have done in the past.)

Judaism/Islam/Christianity are foreign religions, designed by the foreign Elite.

Can I go up to the hill top, the woods now and worship my trees, sun, moon and stars? Worship myself and people I like without some invented man made external God/deity. Because I've had enough of their nonsense.

Muslims and Jews can go fight it out in Jerusalem and all the other places they war. Just leave us none religious people out of it.

I am so tired of this topic Jews v Muslims. And will be trying to avoid it from now on.

There is not a Jew on the planet that follows modern Judaism that believes in killing anyone for any reason as a result of their religion. Judaism IS actually very reformed. Hell, most Jews are about as religious as the average Catholic... they do their little dance, say their little prayer and then go on with their lives. Jews have no desire whatsoever to inflict their own laws on anyone. Radical Islam is a new development.

You do a great job of believing the elite lies. Do you believe Bin Laden is sitting in a cave plotting the destruction of freedom also?

bowtiedaddy

24-01-2009, 10:18 AM

This is getting us nowhere.

We are left with 2 options.

1. Jews anihilate all Arabs.
2. Arabs anihilate all Jews.

Not good enough. We desperately need a third option: Jews and Arabs stop fighting and learn to get along.

Well, let's just put it this way. I am an ethnic Jew. I love my Muslim brothers, just as anyone on earth. I see the beauty that exists in different ways of life. There is a lot of evil in the world, but so much beauty as well.

I can say that the average Jew is brainwashed into being scared of Arabs killing them. They pray for peace, not for hurting Arabs (Israel is not the Jewish people).

Arabs, I am fully convinced are the same way. The average person does not want conflict. The average person just wants to get on with their lives and live in peace and prosperity. There are bad apples in any group, but every race, religion or nationality has it's fair share of them. Throw the evil fuckers away from the rest of us and let us live in peace, is what I say.

arten

24-01-2009, 10:20 AM

ES wants to blame everything on the Jews and he seems to be unable to separate Jews From Zionism. There are in fact many more Christian Zionist than there are Jewish Zionist. Like I have said on this forum before you have Good and Bad in all Races, Religions and Creeds.
ES's hatred of all Jews is borne out of Ignorance imo all racial hatred is.
Obviously someone probably a parent poisoned his young mind years ago.
The Jews are themselves once again in a dangerous predicament of being Scapegoated and the sensible ones know this is because of Zionism, which is why they reightly speak out against it. IMO we should be encouraging these people to do just that and we should be embracing their HUMANITY, not isolating them. And Jews have proven in the past they can live in harmony with Muslims and Christians, they have a live and let live ethos!

runciter

24-01-2009, 11:00 AM

The Satanist Banker Conspiracy

October 27, 2008

by Henry Makow Ph.D.

"Economic crises have been produced by us for the goyim by no other means than the withdrawal of money from circulation."
-Protocols of Zion -20

Recently, on his internet radio show, Alan Stang asked me if there is such a thing as a Jewish conspiracy. He gets email from people blaming Jews, Jesuits, the Vatican, Freemasons etc.

I replied that the central banking cartel is the only group that has both the motive and the means to take over the world. Consisting mainly of Cabala-believing Jews and Freemasons, it is the head of the octopus. Zionism, Freemasonry, organized Jewry, Western Imperialism, Jesuits,Vatican, Intelligence agencies, mass media etc. are among countless octopus arms.

The "motive" is to protect its fraudulent private monopoly over public (government) credit (money creation) which is worth trillions and trillions. They need a "world government" to ensure that no nation creates its own money or defaults on the loans the bankers created out of nothing.

The "means" of course is unlimited money funneled through their network of cartels, which allows them to own the government, mass media, education etc. Anyone who succeeds in public life is their puppet or unconsciously serves their agenda. Their Zionist-Freemason-Communist-Socialist-MI-5/6 network allows them to exercise covert control on the ground.

About 1770, a syndicate of bankers led by Mayer Rothschild started the "Illuminati", a satanic cult designed to subvert society. According to Edith Starr Miller, the Rothschild syndicate included Jewish financiers such as Daniel Itzig, Friedlander, the Goldsmids and Mosses Mocatta. ("Occult Theocracy" p. 184.)

According to Miller, the goals of the Illuminati (Communism and the NWO) were the destruction of Christianity, monarchies, nation-states (in favor of their world government or "internationalism"), the abolition of family ties and marriage by means of promoting homosexuality and promiscuity; the end of inheritance and private property; and the suppression of any collective identity in the spurious name of "universal human brotherhood" i.e. "diversity." (p.185)

SATANISM

The ideology behind this world tyranny, Illuminism, derives from the Jewish Cabala which conveniently preaches that man (i.e. the bankers) can usurp the place of God and redefine reality. Thus, the goal of world banker conspiracy is to enshrine Satan as God. The Illuminati uses revolution, war and financial turmoil to inaugurate their "New World Order."

The world government tyranny is the only conquest to take place without the knowledge of the conquered. In the First Protocol of the "Protocols of the Elders of Zion," the author says three times, our "countersign" is "Force and Make-believe." By "Make-believe" he means mass deception or "magic."

When alien bankers control the national purse strings, inevitably the State becomes synonymous with these bankers. The State is a ruse used to manipulate the masses, "public" in name only. This is the truth behind the "make-believe" face of the Communist NWO.

This tyranny is also the first in history which people cannot mention for fear of being labeled "anti Semitic" and a "hater." Trust me, the hatred is entirely on the Cabalist side.

This ruse is achieved by blaming all Jews for the machinations of a relative few. It's as though all Italians were blamed for the Mafia. As a Jew, I can testify that very few Jews are aware of how they are used by Illuminati-sponsored movements such as the B'nai Brith (Freemasonry); Zionism; Communism; Socialism, Neo-conservatism, Feminism and Liberalism.

Blaming all Jews naturally makes them run interference for the Rothschilds, thus confirming they are all in collusion. Talk about walking into the line of fire! What would we think of Italians if they defended Al Capone and organized crime on a racial basis? The bankers have always run organized Jewry and used Jews as their pawns and pitchmen.

"Anti-Semite" and "hate" are used like a witch doctor's curse from which all shrink in horror. To neutralize this voodoo, we should wear the badge of anti-Semite with pride, by asserting that it stands for opposition to the disproportionate Jewish (and crypto-Jewish) role in advancing the New World Order. (No one is advocating or condoning genocide.) Thus, anti-Semitism will become a legitimate political (not racial) movement directed against specific Jewish (and non-Jewish) Illuminati-pawns and policies.

Like everyone else, Jews are kept in a bubble and told anti-Semitism is an irrational Gentile sickness. They have been brainwashed to see themselves as innocent victims. Most have suffered from the machinations of their Zionist "leaders." But many others were Bolshevik murderers and oppressors. And Jews and Masons are the administrators of the New World Order.

THE BIGGEST REVELATION

The biggest revelation for me was realizing that Judaism is not a religion but a pagan racial creed at best, and a Satanic secret society at worst. The nature of a secret society is that the membership is fed idealistic platitudes and not told the real agenda. I expand on this discovery in my forthcoming Illuminati-The Cult that Hijacked the World.

Most Jews are unaware that Judaism largely eschews the Old Testament (Torah) in favor of the Talmud and Cabala. Very few Jews read these books. If they did, they might realize that the Talmud is full of hate and contempt for non-Jews. They would discover that the Cabala is the basis of modern witchcraft, astrology, numerology, tarot cards, black magic, androgyny, and much of the New Age movement. It is the basis of Illuminism which teaches that good and evil are one and that black is white and vice-versa. They operate by doing evil while espousing good.

The Cabala is the basis of the cult of sex worship that has engulfed the world. Cabalistic Jews can't do anything mundane on the Lord's Day but conjugal sex is a prescribed ritual. Physical desire supposedly increases a man's love for God, and intercourse is an instrument for uniting with God. (This, of course, is rubbish. You unite with God by doing His Will seven days a week. Sex is a physical function like eating.)

Cabalist Jews tell this joke privately: "An orthodox Jew is interviewing three applicants for a job. He asks them, 'What is 2 plus 2?' The first two answer 4 and 22. He kicks them out. The third answers "What ever you want it to be.' He is hired." This is what we are up against in the NWO, an attempt to reshape truth itself according to self-interest.

The arc of Western Civilization has been from worship-of-God (rise) to worship-of-Satan (fall.) I suspect the Cabala is the blueprint of post-Christian civilization, the reason we are drowning in media-generated filth, violence, occultism and fear. The apex was the so-called "Enlightenment" when men were taught they could use "reason" (i.e. expedience) and ignore God's natural and spiritual (moral) order. Typically, the consequent decline into moral darkness is represented by Luciferians as light, sunrise (i.e. Obama's logo.)

According to Texe Marrs, the Cabala teaches that the "holy serpent is the true God; that all the evil that a person does, through alchemy is magically transformed into righteousness; and that yes, Lucifer is Lord. Satan is the true and only god. That is the essential doctrine of Cabalism." (Codex Magica p. 426.)

PUBLIC LIFE

The fraudulent nature of our public life all stems from the fundamental fraud, private Illuminati control of public credit. Thus we have a government-sponsored depopulation program in the guise of feminism and gay rights. Thus we have the spectacle of two mind-controlled Illuminati puppets vying for the US Presidency. The case of Barack Obama is the most egregeous. He cannot even prove he is an American citizen. His real father, Communist activist Frank Marshall Davis, was a rapist and pedophile who probably sexually abused his son. Bill Ayers ghostwrote Obama's 1995 autobiography "Dreams of My Father." Did a promising Harvard Law Review President warrant a six-figure advance from the Illuminati Jewish Simon & Schuster?

Larry Sinclair claims he has had sex and smoked crack with Obama in the late 1990's. Oddly, this resume is perfect for the Illuminati. Obama can be easily controlled or the Illuminati media will stop ignoring these stories. (To see a puppet malfunctioning, check out the You Tubes of Obama without a teleprompter.)

Now Joe Biden is prophesying that Obama will be severely tested after coming to office and will betray his supporters and plummet in the polls. He seems to be describing something like martial law. An odd thing to say before the election. (Notice the Republicans are ignoring all this- suggesting they are in collusion.)

CONCLUSION

If your ethnic or religious group is being used secretly for evil, you had better distance yourself from it or you will be left holding the bag. This applies to almost everyone, not just Jews. As an ethnic Jew, I ask, does the Jewish god represent a universal moral order or a primitive tribal egregore (i.e. projection of group psyche?) Is the Jewish egregore now Lucifer?

The world has been taken over by a satanic cult. We are under constant occult attack. Instead of fighting among ourselves like they want, we must recognize that there are only two sides --God's and Satan's.

http://www.henrymakow.com/the_banker_conspiracy.html

arten

24-01-2009, 11:48 AM

Again a misleading statement.
Jews and Arabs live in peace over here too. In fact they live in peace in most parts of the world.
Indeed over 1 million Jews are in fact Arabs.
More if you include those living inthe UK and in the USA
So there is certainly no problem with Jews and Arabs marrying especially those Jews who are themselves Arabs.
The problem i repeat is ZIONISTS. These people are pure racists and certainly are only interested in slaughter and massacres and are not interested in peace let alone marrying Arabs.
You mention religious zealots. I assume you are refering to religious Jews who in fact oppose the Zionist state known as Israel.
http//:www.nkusa.org

http://www.vivapalestina.org/images/website/stolemyland_425.jpg

First of all there was nothing in my Statement that was Misleading at all.
The fact is the general perception in the West is that Jews and Arabs Hate one and other and that is simply not true.
Secondly, regarding the Zealots I was specifically Meaning those Nutters from Christendom, who call for Armageddon. And the equally Psychotic Jihadist who mirror their psychosis in Islam. Add the Zionist Psychotics in from amongst the Jews and we have a recipe for total disater.

zarah

24-01-2009, 11:52 AM

jesuitsdidit

24-01-2009, 11:56 AM

If you could see, you would have noticed that I did not make that statement, which you accreddited to me :mad:

In the land of the blind the one eyed man is KING.

well if its a quote y dont u use """""?

arten

24-01-2009, 12:04 PM

well if its a quote y dont u use """""?

Because sometimes I just prefer to copy and past into my post. If you were following the flow of the thread you would know who said what.

Hi Zarah If ES don't hate all Jews then why is he blaming All Jews and not making the distinction between Zionism and Judaism it is not the same thing. I also believe that organised religion is Mind Control :D

runciter

24-01-2009, 12:18 PM

Hi Zarah If ES don't hate all Jews then why is he blaming All Jews and not making the distinction between Zionism and Judaism it is not the same thing.

maybe because judaism is a supremacist religion, based on separation from the rest of mankind.

jesuitsdidit

24-01-2009, 12:41 PM

Because sometimes I just prefer to copy and past into my post. If you were following the flow of the thread you would know who said what.

as it happens i've found the source - suggest if u r quoting from a post on this forum, u use the 'quote' button and if u dont want to quote the whole post, delete irrelevant parts pls..

jesuitsdidit

24-01-2009, 12:48 PM

5. Anti-Jesuit/anti-Vatican Christian Zionists—led by anti-Jesuit, biblical futurists holding to a literal reading of the prophets, maintaining that the beloved Hebrew/Jewish/Israelitic people have a right to live in their promised land apart from obedience to the law of Moses, now done away. They abhor the government of Israel as being totally controlled by Rome through the pope’s New York City-based Council on Foreign Relations to the detriment of the Jewish people living in Israel. They oppose the government of Israel, but defend the Jewish people’s right to live in the promised land of Israel to the exclusion of all Arabs and non-racial Jews.

These are the six Zionists. I am of the fifth catagory.

Sincerely in faith,

Brother Eric "

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=475093&postcount=9

ok thank you, i dont know his reasoning for this but i'm sure its well thought-out. i'm usually willing 2 view favourably his opinions on most things as they are well-researched. and i shd say he's impeccable on the Jesuits.

jesuitsdidit

24-01-2009, 12:50 PM

ok thank you, i dont know his reasoning for this but i'm sure its well thought-out. i'm usually willing 2 accept his opinions on most things as they are well-researched and he's impeccable on the Jesuits.

just so people understand the context of this quote i will post the WHOLE article-

From
http://troyspace2.wordpress.com/2008...-six-zionisms/

"Dear Brother Troy,

The six Zionisms are:

1. Masonic Jewish Labor Zionists—who worked for the pope during WWI, WWII and the founding of Israel which Rome considers to be its revived Latin Kingdom of Jerusalem.

2. Revisionist Zionists—led by Jabotinsky who was murdered in Hunter, New York, and whose followers were neutralized or murdered by the Labor Zionists. The classic on Vladimir Jabotinsky is Lone Wolf in two volumes.

3. Orthodox Talmudic Zionists—led by extreme Orthodox rabbis who believe that the racial/religious Jewish people have no right to live in the land of Israel until the Messiah arrives. Thus, they are ignorant of their own Hebrew Scriptures which clearly state that when Messiah appears there must be a nation of Israel and a Jerusalem inhabited by Jews to save from invading Gentile armies.

4. Christian Zionists—led by pro-Jesuit futurists who back both the government of Israel and the right of the Jewish people to the land of Israel. They refuse to distinguish between the government of Israel (which is evil and ruled from Rome via the Order’s Masonic Jewish Labor Zionists) and the Lord’s beloved Hebrew/Jewish/Israelitic people living in the land promised to Abraham and his seed forever in Genesis 15:18.

5. Anti-Jesuit/anti-Vatican Christian Zionists—led by anti-Jesuit, biblical futurists holding to a literal reading of the prophets, maintaining that the beloved Hebrew/Jewish/Israelitic people have a right to live in their promised land apart from obedience to the law of Moses, now done away. They abhor the government of Israel as being totally controlled by Rome through the pope’s New York City-based Council on Foreign Relations to the detriment of the Jewish people living in Israel. They oppose the government of Israel, but defend the Jewish people’s right to live in the promised land of Israel to the exclusion of all Arabs and non-racial Jews.

6. The Lord Jesus Christ—the foremost Biblical Zionist who will restore the Kingdom of David upon his return, will smash all Gentile political and military power, and will rule the world bringing comfort to Zion (Jerusalem).

These are the six Zionists. I am of the fifth catagory.

Sincerely in faith,

Brother Eric "

jesuitsdidit

24-01-2009, 12:53 PM

Zionism is not a Catholic or the Pope's creation. Zionism is all about Judaism, created by Jews!

ref arten - for those who dont know, here it is..

runciter

24-01-2009, 12:57 PM

it seems quite obvious to me that zionism was created by the jewish elite.

arten

24-01-2009, 01:16 PM

it seems quite obvious to me that zionism was created by the jewish elite.

First of all you would have to define what a Jew is, then you would have to ask yourself were these people really Jews or are they really masquerading as Jews. I am not convinced they are Jews I would pin the label Satanist on them, and don't Satanist not care about what happens to anyone but themselves. It's a religion that people deeply buried in the ego, ego maniacs get drawn to.

I will make those who are of the synagogue of Satan, who claim to be Jews though they are not, but are liars%u2014I will make them come and fall down at your feet and acknowledge that I have loved you.
Revelation 3:9 (New International Version)