My Freemasonry dilemma

[michael christopher]

I would like advice from people that have personally dealt with Freemasons or been involved in Freemasonry please, as I don't really think it's wise to just trust a bunch of hear-say and bullshit on the internet. What I'm going to post is probably going to make a lot of people dislike me off the bat, but I am merely in a state of confusion. People are quick to judge but their judgments are pretty useless in the end.

Over the last few months I have been intrigued by Freemasonry. As I began to realize how much of the stuff that I was taking so seriously in regards to conspiracy theories was utter bullshit, I started trying to think outside the box once again. It makes more sense to me now that there would be endless numbers of groups all vying for dominance than one massive, organized conspiracy. Drawing this conclusion, I began to wonder how much in particular was bullshit in regard to Freemasonry. Is the Bohemian Grove really a gathering of Freemasons? If there is any proof of this I would love to see it (I'm not being sarcastic, I am genuinely curious). Could it be a gathering of something else? I mean, it's not exactly like they publicize what they are doing... I know that there are forces for good and evil in all aspects of reality, and I assume there are probably Freemasons that have good intentions as well as Masons that have bad intentions. I am really confused on the subject to be honest because I really don't know where I can go to find accurate information short of subjecting myself to an experience with as Masonic temple, which I am extremely hesitant to do. I would love to know what is true and what isn't, but I feel like my reaching out to these people could be a mistake. One reason I am so skeptical of the propaganda is because the Catholic Church and large Christian organizations have throughout history funded and reproduced extreme propaganda to make any groups that opposed them look bad. A lot of people want to say that Freemasons and Catholics are in the same bed, but I honestly just don't get that feeling. They completely oppose each other philosophically, and while I understand that such a thing could merely be an illusion, I still know what I know about the Catholic Church and I know that they want to keep the secrets of the universe a secret, while the Freemasons will gradually share their knowledge with anyone who is interested and who has the motivation to learn it.

One reason I am so interested is because as I progress spiritually, I find myself coming to more and more of what appear to be the same spiritual conclusions as high-level Masons. No, I am not talking about thinking it's okay to murder or steal or lie to anyone. I am talking about karmic laws and philosophical ideas regarding reincarnation and energy. I don't find myself coming to negative conclusions however, and I have a pretty clear conscience when it comes to know the difference between a destructive and a constructive idea.

I know many people will respond with "don't trust them no matter what!" but I am interested in hearing from people who actually know them, who have dealt with them, who have had encounters with them... not people who indoctrinate themselves with propaganda that they purposely search for on the internet every day.

[banoyes]

I would like advice from people that have personally dealt with Freemasons or been involved in Freemasonry please, as I don't really think it's wise to just trust a bunch of hear-say and bullshit on the internet. What I'm going to post is probably going to make a lot of people dislike me off the bat, but I am merely in a state of confusion. People are quick to judge but their judgments are pretty useless in the end.

Over the last few months I have been intrigued by Freemasonry. As I began to realize how much of the stuff that I was taking so seriously in regards to conspiracy theories was utter bullshit, I started trying to think outside the box once again. It makes more sense to me now that there would be endless numbers of groups all vying for dominance than one massive, organized conspiracy. Drawing this conclusion, I began to wonder how much in particular was bullshit in regard to Freemasonry. Is the Bohemian Grove really a gathering of Freemasons? If there is any proof of this I would love to see it (I'm not being sarcastic, I am genuinely curious). Could it be a gathering of something else? I mean, it's not exactly like they publicize what they are doing... I know that there are forces for good and evil in all aspects of reality, and I assume there are probably Freemasons that have good intentions as well as Masons that have bad intentions. I am really confused on the subject to be honest because I really don't know where I can go to find accurate information short of subjecting myself to an experience with as Masonic temple, which I am extremely hesitant to do. I would love to know what is true and what isn't, but I feel like my reaching out to these people could be a mistake. One reason I am so skeptical of the propaganda is because the Catholic Church and large Christian organizations have throughout history funded and reproduced extreme propaganda to make any groups that opposed them look bad. A lot of people want to say that Freemasons and Catholics are in the same bed, but I honestly just don't get that feeling. They completely oppose each other philosophically, and while I understand that such a thing could merely be an illusion, I still know what I know about the Catholic Church and I know that they want to keep the secrets of the universe a secret, while the Freemasons will gradually share their knowledge with anyone who is interested and who has the motivation to learn it.

One reason I am so interested is because as I progress spiritually, I find myself coming to more and more of what appear to be the same spiritual conclusions as high-level Masons. No, I am not talking about thinking it's okay to murder or steal or lie to anyone. I am talking about karmic laws and philosophical ideas regarding reincarnation and energy. I don't find myself coming to negative conclusions however, and I have a pretty clear conscience when it comes to know the difference between a destructive and a constructive idea.

I know many people will respond with "don't trust them no matter what!" but I am interested in hearing from people who actually know them, who have dealt with them, who have had encounters with them... not people who indoctrinate themselves with propaganda that they purposely search for on the internet every day.
Join
If at this stage you cannot see the evil
you never will
so go put on your maison garb and admit you have no soul

[michael christopher]

Join
If at this stage you cannot see the evil
you never will
so go put on your maison garb and admit you have no soul

Why should I take people like you seriously at all? You don't even know me. You are acting like a fool.

[banoyes]

Why should I take people like you seriously at all? You don't even know me. You are acting like a fool.
LOL
You are joining maisons
and say I am acting like a fool
LOL
That's rich

[thetonic]

'There are two different levels to these organizations, the Anarchy level at the bottom appears very disjointed with many different groups expressing different beliefs etc. (freemasons, OTO, Rosicrucian, Satanists) these are all Anarchy level organizations...

Above the Anarchy level is a very discreet and select group that manage all of the puppet level groups and there intentions and goals are unified... " - Fritz Springmeir

This is how it works plain and simple, so dont bother asking any stupid fucking freemasons on this forum to clue you in because they are not clued in and wouldnt believe somebody who was clued in if they came here and posted a picture of them wearing freemason garb drinking the blood from a babys dick

end of

[michael christopher]

LOL
You are joining maisons
and say I am acting like a fool
LOL
That's rich

Did you even read my post? Clearly you didn't.

Can the people who are going to attack me please not fucking bother. Thanks.

[michael christopher]

I wish that before people were quick to judge they would take the content of my post more seriously and see that I am seriously just on the fence, and would like additional information from people who have interacted with or been involved in the group. You would think I came on here saying I wanted to suck David Rockefeller off.

[mike martin]

With all due respect you have chosen the most bizarre place on the Net to ask such things!

Did you really expect different?

Mike

[noobcybot]

I would like advice from people that have personally dealt with Freemasons or been involved in Freemasonry please, as I don't really think it's wise to just trust a bunch of hear-say and bullshit on the internet.

Probably wise. I have met a few and know one in real life and they seem pretty normal people. In all social/work groups etc... we tend to see a microcosm of the overall population whatever. Some will be evil some good and most a mixture of both. I have not met anyone above 30 degrees.
But getting to my point MC how would this accomplish your goal?
If I posted you a convincing answer saying mate they are the tops would you be inclined to believe me? What if I gave a convincing story that I saw a whole Lodge performing a Satanic ritual?
Its still like getting any info. The only way to know for yourself would be to be a Mason and reach a very high level.
I think its besides the point. The point is that an organisation like the Masons could greatly help facilitate something like the NWO and the general public arent able to find out.

What I'm going to post is probably going to make a lot of people dislike me off the bat, but I am merely in a state of confusion. People are quick to judge but their judgments are pretty useless in the end.

I dont think a lot of people on this forum are unfair to the Masons and there will always be people who read anti-masonic material a lot who will outright hate them. Nothing is going to change this. I agree quick judgements are often lame, funny considering we should have all the time in the world with this type of communication but its a forum so things are gonna be a bit laissez-faire.

Over the last few months I have been intrigued by Freemasonry. As I began to realize how much of the stuff that I was taking so seriously in regards to conspiracy theories was utter bullshit, I started trying to think outside the box once again.

I think a lot of us who became "awake" reach barriers to our teaching. I was lucky because the real-world conspiracy stuff merged well with the spiritual angles for me. It surely couldant hurt to check out freemasonry as a way to get round the barrier. I did not think much to the spiritual musings of Freemasons to be honest, or perhaps I just didnt understand them enough. But they do not feel right to me, and I trust my intuition. Either way if you follow this idea up I am pretty sure most everyone here will be interested to see if you glean anything important.

It makes more sense to me now that there would be endless numbers of groups all vying for dominance than one massive, organized conspiracy.

Then where are we? We are in the same world with the same assholes we always thought ruled the world. If we follow the Taoist angle ( which seems pretty simular to some Masonic writings I have come across ) then this is just part of existance, posative and negative energies trading and jostling enlessly. We fight at every level of our existance continously atoms, molecules, white blood cells vs foreign bodies, sibling vs sibling, neighbor agaisnt neighber, street, town, county, country, alliances, companies, lobbyists species and this magnificant waste of energy is existance in the holographic universe.
The one at the top of any level though,always holds this strategy dear, divide and conquer.

Drawing this conclusion, I began to wonder how much in particular was bullshit in regard to Freemasonry. Is the Bohemian Grove really a gathering of Freemasons? If there is any proof of this I would love to see it (I'm not being sarcastic, I am genuinely curious). Could it be a gathering of something else? I mean, it's not exactly like they publicize what they are doing...

It is indeed a gathering place for some very influential people. Some of who are likely to have or are freemasons. The logical link between Bohemian Grove and the Freemasons is the giant owl statue, as the owl is a symbol of the Masons.
In terms of proof there have been various private investigations of varying quality, a famous one being the Alex Jones investigation. A quick look will bring up a lot of stuff.
Could it be a gathering of something else? Its pretty much accepted to be an invite only party place for Americas male high society. The fact that they dont publicize what they are doing is the whole problem. I personally dont give a shit if a bunch of VIPs want to fuck around wearing capes getting gay or whatever, what people should care about is that an exclusive club like this is a place where the few can make deals and decisions that affect the many without their knowledge.

I know that there are forces for good and evil in all aspects of reality, and I assume there are probably Freemasons that have good intentions as well as Masons that have bad intentions. I am really confused on the subject to be honest because I really don't know where I can go to find accurate information short of subjecting myself to an experience with as Masonic temple, which I am extremely hesitant to do. I would love to know what is true and what isn't, but I feel like my reaching out to these people could be a mistake. One reason I am so skeptical of the propaganda is because the Catholic Church and large Christian organizations have throughout history funded and reproduced extreme propaganda to make any groups that opposed them look bad. A lot of people want to say that Freemasons and Catholics are in the same bed, but I honestly just don't get that feeling. They completely oppose each other philosophically, and while I understand that such a thing could merely be an illusion, I still know what I know about the Catholic Church and I know that they want to keep the secrets of the universe a secret, while the Freemasons will gradually share their knowledge with anyone who is interested and who has the motivation to learn it.


If they have the key to the universe but havent told us for this long you think they give a shit about us?
It doesant end with the Masons or the Catholic Church, it doesant even begin with them. They are an arm of the prison warder, pawns just like me and you.

One reason I am so interested is because as I progress spiritually, I find myself coming to more and more of what appear to be the same spiritual conclusions as high-level Masons. No, I am not talking about thinking it's okay to murder or steal or lie to anyone. I am talking about karmic laws and philosophical ideas regarding reincarnation and energy. I don't find myself coming to negative conclusions however, and I have a pretty clear conscience when it comes to know the difference between a destructive and a constructive idea.

Again the Masons seem to rehash the Indian and chinese religions to me but wrap it up in a secret society. They are the most refined mainstream religions so this is no surprise and most likely because they are the closest to the truth we can get in normal consciousnes. I think you will find most people seriously into the agenda generally echo the same sentiments.

I know many people will respond with "don't trust them no matter what!" but I am interested in hearing from people who actually know them, who have dealt with them, who have had encounters with them... not people who indoctrinate themselves with propaganda that they purposely search for on the internet every day.

I dont think they are the whole picture by an inconcievably long way, they are just a facilitator.

[noobcybot]

With all due respect you have chosen the most bizarre place on the Net to ask such things!

Did you really expect different?

Mike

With all due respect you have chosen the most bizarre place on the Net to ask such things!

Did you really expect different?

[michael christopher]

Thank you for your in-depth and friendly response noobcybot, I really appreciate it.

[banoyes]

Did you even read my post? Clearly you didn't.

Can the people who are going to attack me please not fucking bother. Thanks.
Join
You are already there in you "mind"
You pretend ignorance, but you are not.you may already be a maison
note:

conspiracy theories was utter bullshit,

so this fine fellow not only knows the "conspiracy theories"
he has come to the conclusion they are BS

bullshit in regard to Freemasonry.

Seems upset at the BS .. well...don't that just tell you something

I find myself coming to more and more of what appear to be the same spiritual conclusions as high-level Masons.
This is real strange
How does this happen??
Let's see...hhmm..???
When's the last time I discussed " spiritual conclusions"
with "high-level Masons"
That would be never
There are a myriad of "spiritual" sources
Freemasonry ain't one of them
My conclusion
You are here to shill maisons
Your post is a sales pitch

[michael christopher]

Well, all I can say is that your power of intuition must not be working very properly because I have not misrepresented myself in any way and I think you look like a total jackass for attacking me the way you have. Your paranoia must keep you up at night.

EDIT: BTW, I probably know a great deal more about "conspiracy theories" and esoteric knowledge than you would probably ever expect. Not all individuals come to the same conclusions that you have. You are quite a bully.

[banoyes]

Well, all I can say is that your power of intuition must not be working very properly because I have not misrepresented myself in any way and I think you look like a total jackass for attacking me the way you have. Your paranoia must keep you up at night.

EDIT: BTW, I probably know a great deal more about "conspiracy theories" and esoteric knowledge than you would probably ever expect. Not all individuals come to the same conclusions that you have. You are quite a bully.

Yup
I am 100% right
You have already come to a conclusion.
Yet
you come here pretending confusion
"Oh what should I do"

You are quite a fake

[michael christopher]

Yup
I am 100% right
You have already come to a conclusion.
Yet
you come here pretending confusion
"Oh what should I do"

You are quite a fake

Who are you to come on here accusing me of being a fake? I am very real, I have been posting here since May or June and I used to be extremely against Freemasons and the Illuminati. You don't have any idea what you are talking about.

[grandsecretary]

Who are you to come on here accusing me of being a fake? I am very real, I have been posting here since May or June and I used to be extremely against Freemasons and the Illuminati. You don't have any idea what you are talking about.

Another sensible person who has twigged the noise.

[banoyes]

Who are you to come on here accusing me of being a fake? I am very real, I have been posting here since May or June and I used to be extremely against Freemasons and the Illuminati. You don't have any idea what you are talking about.
I know exactly what I am talking about
I stand by what I said
and I am not confused
LOL
edit
just saw Grand Peter come to your side
Birds of a feather and all that

[michael christopher]

I know exactly what I am talking about
I stand by what I said
and I am not confused
LOL
edit
just saw Grand Peter come to your side
Birds of a feather and all that

When you are wrong, you are wrong. I don't have to prove it nor would I waste my time trying to do so. There are plenty of people who remember me as MCThompson2x. And if a Mason wants to defend me then maybe it's because he agrees with me. Someone like you might assume that any time two people who agree disagree with you, then they must be in on some grand conspiracy.

[banoyes]

When you are wrong, you are wrong. I don't have to prove it nor would I waste my time trying to do so. There are plenty of people who remember me as MCThompson2x. And if a Mason wants to defend me then maybe it's because he agrees with me. Someone like you might assume that any time two people who agree disagree with you, then they must be in on some grand conspiracy.
You know what you know
You are what you are
You have already proved me right
If you agree with a maison,maybe it's because you agree with them
There is no confusion
Your post is a sham
Now all know what I think of you and your distress

[grandsecretary]

You know what you know
You are what you are
You have already proved me right
If you agree with a maison,maybe it's because you agree with them
There is no confusion
Your post is a sham
Now all know what I think of you and your distress

PERSONAL INSULT REMOVED has let it be known that he worked as a Structural Engineer. Even so, he does not appreciate the contribution made by Freemasonry to the world's major structures, including the Seven Wonders of the World.

Let us know what structures you are responsible for PERSONAL INSULT REMOVED so that we can make sure we don't walk too near them before they fall down!

[keystone]

Oh dear Ben wrecks yet another thread.

Drink up me hearties Yo Ho!

[element]

Even so, he does not appreciate the contribution made by Freemasonry to the world's major structures, including the Seven Wonders of the World.



Do you have evidence for this, Peter?

[banoyes]

Oh dear Ben wrecks yet another thread.

Drink up me hearties Yo Ho!
LOL
These Masons are turning this forum into a Freemason discussion forum
go to the freemaison spots to yack about your evil cult, who gives a fart about the distinctions of the cult,who wants to hear maison convincing some fake almost a mason into the wonders of freekmasonry

This forum allows you gangsters here, but it ain't your forum

[keystone]

LOL
These Masons are turning this forum into a Freemason discussion forum
go to the freemaison spots to yack about your evil cult, who gives a fart about the distinctions of the cult,who wants to hear maison convincing some fake almost a mason into the wonders of freekmasonry

This forum allows you gangsters here, but it ain't your forumBloody well isn't your's either bud.

[meksar]

Masonic lodges are reptilian/luciferian brainwashing camps and the very peak of it so deeply concealed that any exposure or interesting speculation will be instantly dismissed by its unaware/in denial members. The religions are just bad as they have all been used to safeguard the Illuminati/Masonic infiltration of society. Most masons could not possibly imagine killing an innocent child during a satanic ritual because they are not in the mental or emotional state to be able to do so.

[keystone]

Masonic lodges are reptilian/luciferian brainwashing camps and the very peak of it so deeply concealed that any exposure or interesting speculation will be instantly dismissed by its unaware/in denial members. The religions are just bad as they have all been used to safeguard the Illuminati/Masonic infiltration of society. Most masons could not possibly imagine killing an innocent child during a satanic ritual because they are not in the mental or emotional state to be able to do so.How many are you a member of then?

[michael christopher]

There is such an immediate fear reaction that it's hard for me to take seriously these accusations of Satanic worship. Christians have been accusing "pagans" of worshiping Satan for centuries, and these immediate attacks and massive generalizations seem like exactly the same thing. It is exactly because of people like banoyes (interesting name) and others who are quick to judge my innocent curiosity about the subject who make me doubt the anti-Masons in the first place. Zealots are zealots. I am sure there are powerful, evil Freemasons just as there are powerful, evil Christians, powerful + evil Muslims, powerful + evil Mormons, etc. etc. etc. Just because there are evil elements of a massive spiritual school does not make every aspect of that teaching wrong or evil. Typical throwing out the baby with the bathwater on here...

It is the rabid attack-dog attitude that undermines your own integrity.

[element]

There is such an immediate fear reaction that it's hard for me to take seriously these accusations of Satanic worship. Christians have been accusing "pagans" of worshiping Satan for centuries, and these immediate attacks and massive generalizations seem like exactly the same thing. It is exactly because of people like banoyes (interesting name) and others who are quick to judge my innocent curiosity about the subject who make me doubt the anti-Masons in the first place. Zealots are zealots.

Sharp.
That's why I said some days ago, Banoyes (Ban'yoe's) might actually make people more curious about freemasonry. Just like the other Joe posts anti-mason stuff with jesus and satan referances, they make theirselves so transparant. There seem to be more forms of Freemasonry out there, so who knows there are some who have high power and influential careers. But we can't put them all under the same label. Some are good, and likely some are bad. Just like Icke's beliefs, some are true, others could be false.
Black/white thinking is a very dangerous thing.

[banoyes]

It is exactly because of people like banoyes (interesting name) and others who are quick to judge my innocent curiosity
Yah sure, your sales pitch failed

[banoyes]

Sharp.
That's why I said some days ago, Banoyes (Ban'yoe's) might actually make people more curious about freemasonry. Just like the other Joe posts anti-mason stuff with jesus and satan referances, they make theirselves so transparant. There seem to be more forms of Freemasonry out there, so who knows there are some who have high power and influential careers. But we can't put them all under the same label. Some are good, and likely some are bad. Just like Icke's beliefs, some are true, others could be false.
Black/white thinking is a very dangerous thing.
Ever get tired sitting on that fence??

[keystone]

Ever get tired sitting on that fence??

Yah sure, your sales pitch failed

Oh dear Ben wrecks yet another thread

See what I mean? Blah, Blah, Blah.

[meksar]

Freemasonry is most blatant form of corruption in society, 1 in 6 cops are Freemasons and judges/lawyers/politicians are connected through masonry. The Khazars have a perfect system to determine the outcome of society and the expansion of the big brother global state.

[michael christopher]

I have made use of my ignore feature.

[localidiot]

Freemasonry is most blatant form of corruption in society, 1 in 6 cops are Freemasons and judges/lawyers/politicians are connected through masonry. The Khazars have a perfect system to determine the outcome of society and the expansion of the big brother global state.

Interesting, I have a fairly good idea of the members of one of the two local lodges, to my knowledge none of them are police officers, s'matter of fact most of them are well over retirement age. The most you could accuse them of is driving to slow on the highway.
I know a few officers, none of whom are Masons. So, where do you get these stats?
I have from a fairly good source that 98% of statistics are made up on the spot.

[meksar]

Scotland Yard-Scottish Rite Freemasonry

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=y_PmSDA1HNc

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=YhlLKLxnb7o

[yeshua]

One reason I am so interested is because as I progress spiritually, I find myself coming to more and more of what appear to be the same spiritual conclusions as high-level Masons. No, I am not talking about thinking it's okay to murder or steal or lie to anyone. I am talking about karmic laws and philosophical ideas regarding reincarnation and energy. I don't find myself coming to negative conclusions however, and I have a pretty clear conscience when it comes to know the difference between a destructive and a constructive idea.

I think that's the main reason many people are conned into Freemasonry. As someone else pointed out, those spiritual conclusions are not synonymous with Freemasonry. Those are common spiritual truths that have been passed down through various philosophies and doctrines. I see no reason why you would need to go through initiation processes and learn idiotic hand signs and "secret" rituals just to come to conclusions you claim you've already arrived at. Why not cut out the bullshit and just live? You say you've come to the conclusion that most conspiracy theories are bullshit and now you're thinking outside the box, but to me it sounds like you've just jumped into another box. Stop thinking about it so much and just be.

[grandsecretary]

I think that's the main reason many people are conned into Freemasonry. As someone else pointed out, those spiritual conclusions are not synonymous with Freemasonry. Those are common spiritual truths that have been passed down through various philosophies and doctrines. I see no reason why you would need to go through initiation processes and learn idiotic hand signs and "secret" rituals just to come to conclusions you claim you've already arrived at. Why not cut out the bullshit and just live? You say you've come to the conclusion that most conspiracy theories are bullshit and now you're thinking outside the box, but to me it sounds like you've just jumped into another box. Stop thinking about it so much and just be.

That is because you have not taken the trouble to research the importance of initiation signifying a transformation or a re-birth. Initiation ceremones are as old as time itself.

[banoyes]

That is because you have not taken the trouble to research the importance of initiation signifying a transformation or a re-birth. Initiation ceremones are as old as time itself.
Freemasons,desperate lonely men wanting to belong,needing help, lost in the world,clinging to false gods for help
what a sad bunch of stooges

[strt]

I am bit confused, who really wants to see this thread in the rant room soon, masons or anti-masons? You are going in right direction if that's your goal.

[banoyes]

I am bit confused, who really wants to see this thread in the rant room soon, masons or anti-masons? You are going in right direction if that's your goal.
Figures

[grandsecretary]

Freemasons,desperate lonely men wanting to belong,needing help, lost in the world,clinging to false gods for help
what a sad bunch of stooges

Do you have any intellect at all? I will answer that one - NO.

[banoyes]

Do you have any intellect at all? I will answer that one - NO.
I am simply a cowan, Grand Peter, struggling to help the world be rid of parasite maisons, whos history on the world stage is well documented
and well denied by the parasite maison

[unusual_suspect]

That is because you have not taken the trouble to research the importance of initiation signifying a transformation or a re-birth. Initiation ceremones are as old as time itself.

Good post!

[michael christopher]

I am simply a cowan, Grand Peter, struggling to help the world be rid of parasite maisons, whos history on the world stage is well documented
and well denied by the parasite maison

You can't make massive generalizations about a large group of people with millions of individual different beliefs. You say they believe in false gods, but the truth is that while there are Christian and Jewish Freemasons, there are also Freemasons who believe that God is a higher version of the self. Are you saying these people worship false gods?

Wait, why am I trying to reason with a troll? You don't really know anything about Freemasonry except conspiracy theories which you don't even bother to fact-check. You are quite annoying.

EDIT: I've noticed a lot of people think Freemasons all believe in the same things. They seriously do not.

[michael christopher]

I am bit confused, who really wants to see this thread in the rant room soon, masons or anti-masons? You are going in right direction if that's your goal.

It is the goal of posters like banoyes (ban-o-yes) to derail threads like this anyway. He has nothing better to do than hate strangers.

I think that's the main reason many people are conned into Freemasonry. As someone else pointed out, those spiritual conclusions are not synonymous with Freemasonry. Those are common spiritual truths that have been passed down through various philosophies and doctrines. I see no reason why you would need to go through initiation processes and learn idiotic hand signs and "secret" rituals just to come to conclusions you claim you've already arrived at. Why not cut out the bullshit and just live? You say you've come to the conclusion that most conspiracy theories are bullshit and now you're thinking outside the box, but to me it sounds like you've just jumped into another box. Stop thinking about it so much and just be.

I really hate when people tell me that I am coming to the wrong conclusions, and therefore I should just come to the conclusions that they have. This is obviously a lot deeper thinking for me than a few paragraphs on the David Icke forum. You say I'm jumping into another box which may be so, but by that logic it is impossible to ever truly think outside of the box. Perhaps it truly is impossible. But all I asked for with this thread was personal experiences with Masons, which I have yet to receive one. Only idle speculations and negative judgments, none of which offer me anymore evidence than I had when I came to the conclusions the negativity was bullshit in the first place. Although some people on this forum have graciously taken the time to help me out through PMs which I truly appreciate.

[banoyes]

You can't make massive generalizations about a large group of people with millions of individual different beliefs. You say they believe in false gods, but the truth is that while there are Christian and Jewish Freemasons, there are also Freemasons who believe that God is a higher version of the self. Are you saying these people worship false gods?

Wait, why am I trying to reason with a troll? You don't really know anything about Freemasonry except conspiracy theories which you don't even bother to fact-check. You are quite annoying.

EDIT: I've noticed a lot of people think Freemasons all believe in the same things. They seriously do not.
Guess you made your mind up , hey fake

[michael christopher]

Guess you made your mind up , hey fake

Do you realize what an ass you make yourself look like accusing me of being a fake so repeatedly when there are plenty of people here who have talked to me and who know otherwise?

No. Why am I giving you my energy? You are acting more like an energy vampire than any Mason I've ever interacted with. I'm done fooling with you.

EDIT: What kills me about you, ban-o-yes, is that you don't even care that you might potentially be wrong. You probably think that whether I am am a Mason shill or not, I might as well be one, and so you are going to go around screaming "burn the witch" regardless of the truth. Funny, considering you probably think of yourself as a "truthseeker" yet you have been going around making incorrect accusations based on false assumptions about someone who is a complete and utter stranger to you for this whole post, simply because I expressed that I am not 100% sure that Masons are as evil as traditionally depicted. I would advise you to consider that you are applying this same fallacious standard to your entire worldview, but you are probably not smart enough to think in such a broad manner. Intelligent people would not seek out your approval anyway, for you are quite hateful and ignorant.

[banoyes]

It is the goal of posters like banoyes (ban-o-yes) to derail threads like this anyway. He has nothing better to do than hate strangers.
Yah
I will definitely fuck with the criminal Freemaison cult
I hate dishonesty and lies
the very foundation of the cult you are so enamored with
You are the fake
You are a shill
you thought to fool the naive with your phony post
but maison
I am not naive

[unusual_suspect]

Yah
I will definitely fuck with the criminal Freemaison cult
I hate dishonesty and lies
the very foundation of the cult you are so enamored with
You are the fake
You are a shill
you thought to fool the naive with your phony post
but maison
I am not naive

Are you a Mason?

[michael christopher]

Are you a Mason?

I think he must definitely be a Mason. The way he is arranging such intellectually bankrupt attacks on Masons, he is trying to make anti-Masons look bad, which is JUST WHAT A MASON WOULD DO.

I am going to follow him around in every post he makes from now on telling people he is a Mason.

EDIT: for the stupid, I'm joking

[unusual_suspect]

I think he must definitely be a Mason. The way he is arranging such intellectually bankrupt attacks on Masons, he is trying to make anti-Masons look bad, which is JUST WHAT A MASON WOULD DO.

I am going to follow him around in every post he makes from now on telling people he is a Mason.

EDIT: for the stupid, I'm joking

I reckon you have uncovered a conspiracy there :D

[grandsecretary]

I am simply a cowan, Grand Peter, struggling to help the world be rid of parasite maisons, whos history on the world stage is well documented
and well denied by the parasite maison

But you are a Structural Engineer, an Operative Mason. :eek:

[mike martin]

I think that's the main reason many people are conned into Freemasonry. As someone else pointed out, those spiritual conclusions are not synonymous with Freemasonry. Those are common spiritual truths that have been passed down through various philosophies and doctrines.
A very valid point. Some people do indeed expect to find more than there is in Freemasonry and are disappointed others find more than they expected and are intimidated by it.

However, your point that it does not contain anything that can be found elsewhere is spot on. I think its popularity hinges more on the traditional way it imparts its lessons rather than their content.

I see no reason why you would need to go through initiation processes and learn idiotic hand signs and "secret" rituals just to come to conclusions you claim you've already arrived at.
I have to agree with Peter here, initiation is a very very old part of the human experience, so far predating Freemasonry that it just continues it. However, the initiatic experience is missing from nearly all aspects of life today and that is a sad thing.

Why not cut out the bullshit and just live? You say you've come to the conclusion that most conspiracy theories are bullshit and now you're thinking outside the box, but to me it sounds like you've just jumped into another box. Stop thinking about it so much and just be.
Well that's his choice just like everyone else on the planet. I personally would neither steer him toward or away from it.

Mike

[banoyes]

But you are a Structural Engineer, an Operative Mason. :eek:
No Grand Peter
I am/was a Structural Designer
I have been to maison functions,some in my ex family were maisons, I went to dances,award dinners,craplike that,one thing I liked about the maisons was
they always had a good bar.
I never wanted to join maisons
after joining the military, I joined no other group.Periord
I made a mistake and learned from it.

Far as I could tell the maisons were just a bunch of drunks who loved patting each other on the back.
This is IMO , the general perspective of the public
To many maisons this may be the whole idea
but
made men,you know, like freemaisons,mafioso,have given up there souls
they are subjects to rules ,they have made blood oaths to masters
and they agree to take part in criminal activity.

You may pompously propound of maisonry
but you ignore the volumes of evidence detailing masions involved in plots and subterfuge world wide
you do not equate the contradiction of you,a commoner, in league with criminal royals
You are sworn to protect your maison brothers,be they criminal or not

The double speak world of maisons
They talk of morality
but have none

[smoking oceanus]

I know whats going on here.......... you guys are ALL Freemasons pretending to be in conflict, tricking the rest of us to take sides whilst luring us into your sinful dens of darkness!!

Its the old divide and conquer strategy and Banoyes is the controlled opposition!

YOU DONT FOOL ME!

[kasalt]

Freemasons,desperate lonely men wanting to belong,needing help, lost in the world,clinging to false gods for help
what a sad bunch of stooges

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me that all you have to offer is bile. No sum or substance, just bile.

Sharp.
That's why I said some days ago, Banoyes (Ban'yoe's) might actually make people more curious about freemasonry.

If I were of a more conspiratorial mentality, I would begin to suspect that this was his actual purpose here. Just have a look back on this thread and it's plain to see who comes off looking good and who doesn't.

[keystone]

I know whats going on here.......... you guys are ALL Freemasons pretending to be in conflict, tricking the rest of us to take sides whilst luring us into your sinful dens of darkness!!

Its the old divide and conquer strategy and Banoyes is the controlled opposition!

YOU DONT FOOL ME!

Thats an interesting conclusion indeed. I hadn't thought that it could look that way mind you I'm nowhere that devious.

[banoyes]

I know whats going on here.......... you guys are ALL Freemasons pretending to be in conflict, tricking the rest of us to take sides whilst luring us into your sinful dens of darkness!!

Its the old divide and conquer strategy and Banoyes is the controlled opposition!

YOU DONT FOOL ME!
You know something is happening but you don't know what it is ,do you
ms oceanus
All one has to do is search my name
they will see what i am about
can the same be said of you?

[banoyes]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but it seems to me that all you have to offer is bile. No sum or substance, just bile.



If I were of a more conspiratorial mentality, I would begin to suspect that this was his actual purpose here. Just have a look back on this thread and it's plain to see who comes off looking good and who doesn't.
This is cool
a cowan being call a maison
I love
LOL
you know- it means I am getting to them
This fine fellow has no idea of the information I have posted
..yup theres a bunch in the "rant room"..
so
I pick you as the hidden maison of the week

yah, you got all that deceptive training, but
that ain't gonna beat the truth
PS
man there's a lot of maisons on this site

[keystone]

You know something is happening but you don't know what it is ,do you
ms oceanus
All one has to do is search my name
they will see what i am about
can the same be said of you?I think there's a teensy little possibility that oceanus might have been havin' a larf! Of course I may be wrong.

[eternal_spirit]

To the newbies and those who haven't read many of Banoyes threads and ones he's posted on.

He has posted some good info at times about Freemasons IMO.

I also used to engage the Masons here in lenghty debates and at times it turned into slanging matches. So, what you are seeing in a thread like this is the effect of months of debates between Banoyes and Masons. Tempers have flared and frayed.

Something similar would be the religious debates, between me and snoopsnuffelophagus, Kasalt knows all about that. Or another fundamentalist religious type mentality example the Crowley brigade. Who'd probably lynch me if they could.

[kasalt]

This fine fellow has no idea of the information I have posted
..yup theres a bunch in the "rant room"..

Oh, it's in the "rant room" is it? I wonder why that is.

I pick you as the hidden maison of the week

LOL. I just knew you were going to something like that.

Even David Icke has said that most Freemasons are decent, well intentioned people who joined Freemasonry for the betterment of society/themselves, and they have no knowledge of the conspiracy. I wish I could find where I read that, so I could provide you with the direct source and quote, but I haven't been able to as yet (can anyone else find that?).

In case you don't realize it, you come off in most of your posts as personally vindictive. I'm not going to condemn you for that because I have no idea of the past experiences you may have had that made you that way. The impression that I get from you is that you have some sort of deep-seated, personal vendetta against Freemasonry that goes beyond ordinary conspiracy research. Have you been personally harmed in any way by it? Would you care to enlighten us?

[grandsecretary]

No Grand Peter
I am/was a Structural Designer
I have been to maison functions,some in my ex family were maisons, I went to dances,award dinners,craplike that,one thing I liked about the maisons was
they always had a good bar.
I never wanted to join maisons
after joining the military, I joined no other group.Periord
I made a mistake and learned from it.

Far as I could tell the maisons were just a bunch of drunks who loved patting each other on the back.
This is IMO , the general perspective of the public
To many maisons this may be the whole idea
but
made men,you know, like freemaisons,mafioso,have given up there souls
they are subjects to rules ,they have made blood oaths to masters
and they agree to take part in criminal activity.

You may pompously propound of maisonry
but you ignore the volumes of evidence detailing masions involved in plots and subterfuge world wide
you do not equate the contradiction of you,a commoner, in league with criminal royals
You are sworn to protect your maison brothers,be they criminal or not

The double speak world of maisons
They talk of morality
but have none

You obviously had a bad experience banoyes. Did you say things like this to your ex-family before you parted company, or is it a question of hindsight?

[banoyes]

Oh, it's in the "rant room" is it? I wonder why that is.



LOL. I just knew you were going to something like that.

Even David Icke has said that most Freemasons are decent, well intentioned people who joined Freemasonry for the betterment of society/themselves, and they have no knowledge of the conspiracy. I wish I could find where I read that, so I could provide you with the direct source and quote, but I haven't been able to as yet (can anyone else find that?).

In case you don't realize it, you come off in most of your posts as personally vindictive. I'm not going to condemn you for that because I have no idea of the past experiences you may have had that made you that way. The impression that I get from you is that you have some sort of deep-seated, personal vendetta against Freemasonry that goes beyond ordinary conspiracy research. Have you been personally harmed in any way by it? Would you care to enlighten us?

He didn't deny being a maison, did he?
Say.. Are you a Freemason?
yes or no will do

[banoyes]

You obviously had a bad experience banoyes. Did you say things like this to your ex-family before you parted company, or is it a question of hindsight?
Every sentence from you drips of dishonesty

[kasalt]

To the newbies and those who haven't read many of Banoyes threads and ones he's posted on.

He has posted some good info at times about Freemasons IMO.

I also used to engage the Masons here in lenghty debates and at times it turned into slanging matches. So, what you are seeing in a thread like this is the effect of months of debates between Banoyes and Masons. Tempers have flared and frayed.

Thanks, ES, that does make sense. I've been out of the loop on most of this debate over Freemasonry. I haven't chased threads to the rant room in a long time, but I have been there and done that in the past, so I can relate. Brave forum warriors that we are...:rolleyes:

I think we can all agree that cooler heads should be allowed to prevail--which is why I haven't found many of 'banoyes' contributions to be very helpful.

[kasalt]

He didn't deny being a maison, did he?
Say.. Are you a Freemason?
yes or no will do

No.

Edit: No, but whether I am or not has nothing to do with the substance of my posted message to you...

[grandsecretary]

Every sentence from you drips of dishonesty

I was just trying to find out whether your opinion of Freemasons is based upon whatever happened between you and your ex-family.

It obviously had a profound effect on you, because you do not wish to discuss it. That is your private business, of course, but it is an interesting insight.

[w1nstonsm1th84]

Just another reminder- please, no personal insults against fellow forum members.

Thanks,

w1nstonsm1th84.

[marpat]

LOL
These Masons are turning this forum into a Freemason discussion forum
go to the freemaison spots to yack about your evil cult, who gives a fart about the distinctions of the cult,who wants to hear maison convincing some fake almost a mason into the wonders of freekmasonry

This forum allows you gangsters here, but it ain't your forum

But your the one who keeps having a go at them so in essence it is you who are discussing their beliefs.

[mike martin]

I know whats going on here.......... you guys are ALL Freemasons pretending to be in conflict, tricking the rest of us to take sides whilst luring us into your sinful dens of darkness!!

Its the old divide and conquer strategy and Banoyes is the controlled opposition!

YOU DONT FOOL ME!

At first I thought this was pretty funny. Then I stopped and thought you might be serious and it didn't seem so funny any more.

I can categorically state that the user banoyes is not a Freemason.

Mike

[banoyes]

But your the one who keeps having a go at them so in essence it is you who are discussing their beliefs.
Another speaks without knowledge

[banoyes]

Count the MASONS
and those like "mynameis" and such
who defend Freemasonry against all
Count Them
Notice how they post
What is hidden,will be reveled

[kweli]

I think he must definitely be a Mason. The way he is arranging such intellectually bankrupt attacks on Masons, he is trying to make anti-Masons look bad, which is JUST WHAT A MASON WOULD DO.

I am going to follow him around in every post he makes from now on telling people he is a Mason.

EDIT: for the stupid, I'm joking

So if people don't realise you're joking, you brand them stupid? Ok.. I best start taking everything you say with a pinch of salt just in case eh? :rolleyes:

[michael christopher]

So if people don't realise you're joking, you brand them stupid? Ok.. I best start taking everything you say with a pinch of salt just in case eh? :rolleyes:

I'm saying it would be stupid not to realize that I'm making a joke, which I obviously was. Take it however you desire.

[netta]

How do you know if your views are the same as higher up masons if they keep their real points of view a secret? That means you agree with a lot of what you think that they believe in, but in truth you really don't know what they think at all.

But I am not attacking you, I am just trying to make a point. I don't care if you want to be a mason or not. You said that you didn't agree with some of the negative aspects, so I don't see a problem with it. If that's the way that you want to learn things then fine. Go for it.

Anyone else who attacks you just needs to calm down because everyone has the right to their own path. Some of the people on these boards attack each other because of the most stupid reasons.

[smoking oceanus]

Then I stopped and thought you might be serious and it didn't seem so funny any more.



I dont blame you for thinking that. This place is riddled with paranoia.

[banoyes]

I dont blame you for thinking that. This place is riddled with paranoia.
The purpose of you being here?
Seems little,unless writing trite crap is an art form

[marpat]

Another speaks without knowledge

Makes two of us then

[marpat]

The purpose of you being here?
Seems little,unless writing trite crap is an art form


Why did you respond to his post like that? I take it you feel his reference to paranoia is too close for comfort?

[grandsecretary]

Why did you respond to his post like that? I take it you feel his reference to paranoia is too close for comfort?

From his responses elsewhere banoyes has suffered from some very bad experiences at the hands of some Freemasons. Using his words, members of his "ex-family". He has obviously been affected by the experience and we must have sympathy with him, whilst at the same time not allowing him to generalise, from what he perceives to be a Masonic conspiracy, whatever may have happened.

This is his private business.

[mynameis]

Makes two of us then

Nope. He's a infraction collector trying to get threads sent to the rant room so users don't get proper knowledge; otherwise known as white noise.

[mynameis]

Count the MASONS
and those like "mynameis" and such
who defend Freemasonry against all
Count Them
Notice how they post
What is hidden,will be reveled

Notice how he tries to tie my name into anything his pretty heart desires? It's almost laughable at this point. Isn't this just asinine?

[grandsecretary]

Notice how he tries to tie my name into anything his pretty heart desires? It's almost laughable at this point. Isn't this just asinine?

As I said, these are not the actions of a whole or rational person. I am sure that he has suffered somewhere along the line.