Windows XP or Vista?

[eternal_spirit]

Users force Dell to resurrect XP

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/42825000/jpg/_42825199_dell-pa203.jpg Windows XP made its debut in 2001

Responding to customer demand Dell has restarted selling new PCs with Windows XP installed on them.
The decision reverses a policy begun in January that meant Windows Vista was the only operating system available on almost all new home machines.
The change came after Dell's feedback site was swamped with calls for the return of the venerable software.
Now customers can opt for the Home or Professional version of XP on six models of Dell machines.
Customer clamour
The four consumer versions of Windows Vista went on sale on 30 January and since then many PC makers have sold most of their machines with the software pre-loaded.
Since January Dell has been gradually phasing out the XP option on new PCs. By March Dell only sold two models in its extensive range with the XP operating system installed.
Dell is currently the second-largest PC seller in the world and has a 15.2% share of the overall PC market.
Dell changed the policy in response to pleas posted on its Ideastorm website which invites customers to post suggestions about how the PC maker can meet their needs.
The suggestion saying "Don't eliminate XP just yet" got almost 11,000 votes. In response Dell said it would offer the operating system on four models of Inspiron notebooks and two Dimension desktop PCs.
"This is really odd," said Michael Silver, research vice president at analysts Gartner. "On new PCs, consumers usually do want the latest and greatest."
Other analysts speculated that the reason consumers were keen on XP was because it was familiar and it worked well with many of the digital peripherals they owned.
In response Microsoft said that Dell was responding to a "small minority" of customers who had a very "specific" request. It is not clear how long Dell will be able to keep its offer to install XP going. From the end of January 2008 PC makers will no longer be able to buy new licences for the operating system.

[aznality]

I'm personally sticking with Windows XP.

[indigo]

Windows XP definately! My mate has vista and I hate it.

[auron]

I use windows server 2003.

[Anders Lindman]

Vista or XP? You don't get it. It doesn't matter.

Conversation in the 1980s or something:

Steve Jobs (talking to Bill Gates): We have a better OS.

Bill Gates: You don't get it. It doesn't matter.

[mada88]

xp for the mo.

[auron]

Vista or XP? You don't get it. It doesn't matter.

Conversation in the 1980s or something:

Steve Jobs (talking to Bill Gates): We have a better OS.

Bill Gates: You don't get it. It doesn't matter.

Hmm. I know exactly what you mean there mate.

[graflok]

Linux!

[umbrex]

from what ive read and seen, microsoft is trying to puch vista on ordinary people since the industry has laughed it out the door.

U simply dont get much value for money. Besides that i havent really read anything good about it, more nag, nag and more nag.
I recently got a new system and had to choose: XP or Vista. Guess what, i stuck with XP and i would encourage u all to do the same.

[eternal_spirit]

XP service pack2 more secure :D So they say.

[umbrex]

XP service pack2 more secure :D So they say.

It's like buying cars:

U allways go for the latest model of an old series rather then the first model of a new series.

If i wanted pages i could browse i wuould go for the linux cubes.

[chattanova]

XP is good enough for me

[digitalmuzik]

from what i have read and heard, vista is just a massive back door and the NSA have the key

[thirdwave]

for now im sticking with XP, but cant have that for ever as the nature of computers is to advance and grow.... more ram.... so on... and XP is limited where Vista.... Vista 2.... Vista 3 or what ever will keep getting more powerful to work with more powerfull software... so i cant see hoe it wont work at some point... unless of course another company comes out with a rival which has as much software...

for example... XP can only have about 3-4 GIGs RAM.... and only use about 2GIG for programs....

in time this will not be powerful enough for some programs... music... video... and games.... so on.... with my music programs I allready am needing more RAM with 1 or 2 bits of software I have...

Vista will be able to run about 9Gigs...or somthing like that....

I have no plans to change just yet though, that being said I know 3 people who are useing it and have had no problems at all..

[amadeus]

Linux! I use Kubuntu (KDE desktop) and wouldn't switch back to Windows for anything. All that waiting for programs to load...

http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/7812/aetiredhp5.gif

naah, not for me.

[the infinite one]

If its not broken, then why fix it?

[pumma]

XP service pack2 more secure :D So they say.
Don't believe what you are told =)

In SP2 are more restricted rules. Nothing special...

Windows is for those who don't care how things work (Close/Source) and like to deal with viruses, trojans, rootkits, bugs, etc... In one of my posts I've added a link where it shows hidden files in the system for spying on users - NSA.

With Unix/Linux you have 101% control over your system... ;)

[baron von lotsov]

from what i have read and heard, vista is just a massive back door and the NSA have the key


That's why I browse the Internet on a Windows 98 machine not connected to my other machine.

[baron von lotsov]

for now im sticking with XP, but cant have that for ever as the nature of computers is to advance and grow.... more ram.... so on... and XP is limited where Vista.... Vista 2.... Vista 3 or what ever will keep getting more powerful to work with more powerfull software... so i cant see hoe it wont work at some point... unless of course another company comes out with a rival which has as much software...

for example... XP can only have about 3-4 GIGs RAM.... and only use about 2GIG for programs....

in time this will not be powerful enough for some programs... music... video... and games.... so on.... with my music programs I allready am needing more RAM with 1 or 2 bits of software I have...

Vista will be able to run about 9Gigs...or somthing like that....

I have no plans to change just yet though, that being said I know 3 people who are useing it and have had no problems at all..


Whereas you would expect by now they would use 64 bit addressing. How many gigs is 2^64. More than you will ever need. Why do they restrict it to 9GB? Obvious really isn't it.

[Anders Lindman]

Whereas you would expect by now they would use 64 bit addressing. How many gigs is 2^64. More than you will ever need. Why do they restrict it to 9GB? Obvious really isn't it.

I get it! So that they can launch Windows Vista Server Edition that can handle more memory. The Server Edition will cost a LOT of dollar$/mon€y and many, many companies that now are superglued to Microsoft products will more or less be forced to buy that edition for their servers.

[baron von lotsov]

I get it! So that they can launch Windows Vista Server Edition that can handle more memory. The Server Edition will cost a LOT of dollar$/mon€y and many, many companies that now are superglued to Microsoft products will more or less be forced to buy that edition for their servers.



Yes exactly.

However from a computer point of view the most efficient thing to do is just standardise the addressing to 64 bits. What they appear to be doing is 32 bits = 4gb and then keep adding an extra bit to double it on each edition. Even weirder than this though is 9GB is not a round number in binary since 33bits is 8 GB not 9

[king]

trusted computing -- what does it mean?


who decides who is to be trusted?

"trusted computing" sounds great, but why would you trust those who do not trust you?



http://www.lafkon.net/tc/TC_HIGH_mirror03.html

[king]

10 reasons not to get Vista
http://apcmag.com/5049/10_reasons_not_to_get_vista


It's all too easy to get caught up in the million dollar marketing engine as we approach the consumer release of Windows Vista, so lets not forget that it isn't the second coming, and by all counts is an upgrade you can do without.

There are many lists out there on why to get Vista, so here's ours on why not to.



1. You don't actually need it -- No, think about this. Vista doesn't do anything you can't already do with XP. About the only significant shift requiring Vista is DirextX10, but as no titles support it yet and, according to John Carmack (the godfather of modern gaming) there's no need to yet either.



2. Cost $$ -- It's so blindingly obvious, most people will be blinded to it. You already have XP, and alternatives like Linux are free. If you really want to throw money away, go give it to a local charity.



3. On that note, it's outrageously overpriced -- at least in Australia. As revealed in the current APC, even after taking into account the profit margin Microsoft Australia previously applied to XP (as well as exchange rates, as you would expect), Australians are paying hundreds of dollars more for their copies than in the US. In fact, it's cheaper for Australians to buy Vista direct by mail order from the States. If you think Microsoft Australia is reaming us, vote with your wallet.



4. Upgrading hardware -- XP was demanding at release, but Vista more so. If you have an older machine that struggles with XP at the best of times, Vista is out of your ballpark unless you spend even more money to upgrade. If this is you, see point 1.



5. Driver support -- Key hardware like video and sound is crippled at the moment -- while Nvidia is working furiously to get a stable driver for the 8800 out by the 30th, there's still no SLI support for any of the Nvidia range. And thanks to the removal of hardware accelerated 3D sound in Vista, Creative's popular DirectSound based EAX no longer works at all, muting this feature for just about all gaming titles on the market today. Creative is in the process of coding a layer for its drivers to translate EAX calls to the OpenAL API which is seperate from Vista, but going by past experience with Creative drivers we won't see these any time soon.



6. Applications that don't work -- there's been plenty of coverage about applications that won't work without a vendor update. These include anti-virus, backup and security software such as those from Symantec, Sophos and ilk; CD and DVD burning tools like the suite from Nero need updated versions to work; and even basic disk management and partitioning tools such as Paragon's Hard Disk Manager are awaiting an update for Vista to be compatible. How many more will fail as Vista enters mainstream? Even Firefox has issues with Vista.



7. It's a big fat target -- with a new and untested in the global wild architecture, virus and malware authors are going to work overtime exploiting the holes Microsoft missed. In fact it's already happening. Loath though I am to use the word 'security' and 'Windows' in the same sentence, Windows XP has at least been patched to the hilt and can be used with a plethora of reasonably effective security tools that work now, without waiting for an update down the track.



8. UAC -- Oh yes, the Microsoft solution for an operating system where mutli-user was an afterthought. Sure, you can disable it, but the OS then makes it clear then that the onus is on the user for any damaging programs that got to run with permissions, rather than with Windows in the first place. If you do have it on, it is going to annoy the hell out of you. It pops up far too frequently, and even on a fast PC, the UAC screen takes too long to come up and disappear.



9. DRM -- And to a lesser degree TPM -- were made for the RIAAs and MPAAs of this world, and the even tighter integration of copy protection mechanisms and 'Windows Rights Management' into vista are nothing more than a liability to you, the user. This ComputerWorld piece says is succinctly: 'it's hard to sing the praises of technology designed to make life harder for its users.' As for TPM, this short animated video shows just how far the rabbit hole goes. And to think you pay for the privilege of having the use of media you purchased and own dictated by third parties, even on your own system.



10. The draconian license -- somehow, Microsoft has forgotten that it built its business from products that empowered its customers, not hampered them. Of course, we forget that Microsoft's customers aren't you and I, afterall (see point 9). Aside from the backward thinking that is licensing, and not actually owning, your software new terms with Vista include being able to transfer the license only once; half the limit compared to XP for Home Basic and Premium on how many machines can connect to yours for sharing, printing and accessing the Internet; limits on the number of devices that can use Vista's Media Center features; activation and validation governing your ability to upgrade hardware and use Windows itself; and outlawing the use of Home Basic and Premium with virtualisation software, and Ultimate only if DRM enabled content and applications aren't used. But then again, who reads these anyway?


-------
wait until people figure out that # 9 is designed to protect Hollywood, RIAAs and MPAA mofos. once people figure out that video subsystem in vista is encrypted for benefit of same video/mussic Illuminati RIAAs and MPAA.

those who need more than 3 Gb ram should just get 64 bit Win2003 OS,
or they can use multiple PCs to load share say video rendering.
32 bit vista is as limited by native memory architecture as previous server OS's like 2000 and NT. You need 64 bit OS if you are to access all memory above 4Gb natively.


for example, Vegas Video allows you t use power of few PC to offload mainpc and spead up the rendering of the videos.

that is lot better approach than buying vista that 10 times slower than XP or win2003 server.


here is the chart from that Redmond company that compares 64 vs 32 bit .

Comparison of 32-bit and 64-bit memory architecture for 64-bit editions of Windows XP and Windows Server 2003
View products that this article applies to.

Architectural component 64-bit Windows 32-bit Windows
Virtual memory 16 terabytes 4 GB
Paging file size 512 terabytes 16 terabytes


see, there is no way that 32 bit vista memory subsystem is much better than previous OSs because same computer logic of memory addressing still applies.

it is simply impossible to make vista see more than 4gb of ram natively
because 2^32 =4Gb.

Now, if you really want -- you can get a hardware based memory controller that is used in servers and using that controller add lot more RAM to your system, but on 32 bit system it is still not a native solution.

http://support.microsoft.com/kb/294418

[iro_]

vista is bloated, big brother software

xp is the last operating system from m$ that is even partially controlled by the user - make the most of it whilst its still around and secure.

don't fall for vistas nice looks (which i think are terrible - black on green.. yuk..please!) and funky bells and whistles - all of those can be implemented freely on xp with clever apps like yahoo widgets, using the free IE7 and media player 11 updates for xp, even better using firefox.

i haven't seen a good review of vista from a non biased site. Theres a new version of windows coming out in a few years- stick to xp until then and all the vista users will realise how shit their vista turns out to be in hindsight

an industry expert peter gutmann called vista 'the longest suicide note in history' and he's not going to be wrong methinks

[king]

4 "Reasons" to Dump Linux
http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,2074985,00.asp
Okay, so I love Linux, but maybe when you think about switching from XP, you should consider Vista. Here are my top four reasons you should move to Vista instead of Linux.


Reason number one: Linux is boring. When I run Linux, I don't have the excitement of wondering whether an e-mail, IM, or Web page is going to give my system the latest worm or virus. Where's the fun in that? I know Microsoft promises Vista represents significant and noticeable changes to the operating system, locking it down in the interest of security . . . Oh, wait, I'm quoting from a 2003 story about XP SP2. Silly me.

I'm sure Microsoft will turn in a secure OS this time. Just look at Internet *Explorer 7—it's much more secure! It took almost a whole day before the security company Secunia found that a hacker could trick IE7 into showing malicious content by spoofing a pop-up window opened on a trusted site.

I know some of you think that the only reason Windows gets all the neat malware is because it's so popular. Why would anyone attack Linux? Just because 60 percent of the world's 100 million Web sites run Linux, that's no reason to try to crack Linux. No, it's not that Windows has historically been as secure as a papier-mâché fortress; it must be because Linux just isn't very popular.

Reason number two: Linux is a pain to set up. With Linux, you need to put in a CD or DVD, hit the enter button, give your computer a name, and enter a password for the administrator account. Heck, you could break a nail that way! Almost all early customers of Vista will need to redeem their upgrade coupons and then replace their new PC's XP with Vista. That'll be loads of fun.

Reason number three: Linux is expensive. Linux is often free, but look at all that time you spend setting it up. Most people will end up buying new PCs with Vista preinstalled. Doesn't everyone and every business have the money to buy new systems? Why, just now I went over to Dell and priced out an OptiPlex 745 minitower with a 1.8-GHz Duo, a DVD±RW and 48X CD-ROM SATA drive, an 80GB SATA hard drive and 2GB of RAM, and a 256MB ATI Radeon X1300 Pro graphics card for an "enhanced Vista Experience." It'll run me only $1,375. Of course, I won't get a keyboard, mouse, or monitor at that price.

With Linux, unless I buy one of those less-than-$1,000 boxes with the OS preinstalled, I have to set it up myself! It took me at least half an hour to set up Linux on a 2.8-GHz Pentium IV PC with 512MB of RAM, a 60GB Ultra ATA/100 hard drive, and an nVidia GeForce4 MX 440 AGP graphics board with 64MB of DDR memory. That system cost me $499.

Reason number four: Linux doesn't have enough apps. Most Linux systems come only with secure Web browsers, like Firefox 2.0; e-mail clients, like Evolution 2.6 and Thunderbird 2.0; IM clients, like Gaim 1.5; office suites, like Open*Office.org 2.0.4; and so on. By my count, my copy of SUSE Linux has only more than 100 apps. Microsoft gives you Internet Explorer and Outlook *Express, the most popular Web browser and e-mail client around...even though they do have a few teeny-weeny security problems. Microsoft also has Office, which . . . oh, wait: You don't get that with Vista, do you?

Just because some apps such as the Juniper Networks' Odyssey wireless LAN client WLAN, Cisco Systems' VPN client, and Norton AntiVirus 10 don't work right with Vista is no reason to think many of your current apps either won't work or will need to be upgraded.

Still, as long as you want to run Microsoft programs at Microsoft prices, Windows is the OS for you! If you really think about it, you can find lots of reasons to run Vista instead of Linux. There just aren't any good ones.

[king]

With Change Comes Conflict

As with any other Windows upgrade, Vista is sure to conflict with all sorts of existing hardware and software. In fact, Microsoft is practically predicting it, at least for the early days of Vista availabil*ity. That means an upswing in support calls across the industry—and thousands of software and hardware makers working overtime to churn out new drivers and new applications. You'll also see the usual number of software makers struggling to compete with new and improved applications built into the OS. Now that Microsoft bundles the spruced-up Internet Explorer 7, to name just one, Web browsers like Firefox and *Opera have it that much harder.


But things are even trickier this time around. With Vista, Bill and the boys have made particularly big changes to the user interface and have completely overhauled system security. As end users struggle to become familiar with the new landscape, they'll make even more support calls. And as software apps break down in the face of new security restrictions, developers will work even harder to revise their code. Then there's the dilemma facing companies such as McAfee and Symantec. Thanks to Microsoft's new security measures, they aren't just competing with Gates & Co., they're fighting for the right to compete. Top-tier hardware and software vendors have spent at least a year preparing for Vista's launch, and that's just the first step. They didn't see the final OS until mid-November—which means *incompatibilities are far from fixed. Smaller companies that didn't have access to the Vista beta? Their work hasn't even started.

Vendors will struggle with the new OS for months—if not years—and as they do, the world's IT departments will struggle as well. First, they'll be tackling the big question: Do we upgrade now or do we wait? Then they'll grapple with the *upgrade itself. In the end, Vista is a big improvement for almost everyone. For IT departments. For end users. For all but a few hardware and software vendors. But getting there won't be easy

Security Insecurity

No one has it tougher than the leading security makers. Not only is Microsoft offering its own security suite for Vista, including antivirus and antispam engines, but its hard-line stance on system security actually threatens the effectiveness of existing suites from McAfee, Symantec, and others (see "Microsoft Locks Down Security ... and Roils Security Vendors," page 89). After months of argument—in private and in the press—these companies have finally persuaded Microsoft to make a few concessions, though they're still fighting for access to the Vista kernel, essential to combating malware.


Symantec and McAfee insist Vista will not hurt sales (see "Security Vendors Speak Out," page 96). But that's what software makers always say when Microsoft suddenly becomes a competitor. According to Lee Nicholls, a senior technology adviser at Getronics, a $3.1 billion IT consultant, old-school security vendors are sure to struggle. "Over the next 18 to 24 months, we're definitely going to see a big downturn in spending on security products like Symantec's," Nicholls says. "Most businesses are going to invest in protection that supports Vista's internal security tools."

The same is true for all sorts of other software makers, particularly the smaller guys (see "Top 5...Er, 7: Who's Screwed?"). Some have revamped their business models. Now that Vista offers new and improved photo management tools, Preclick is licensing its photo app to big names such as Wal-Mart and Hewlett-*Packard. Yes, it still *offers Preclick Gold to end users, but now there's *another source of revenue. "If we didn't have the deal with Wal-Mart, I'd be worried," says Preclick CEO Brian Smiga


New OS, New Sales

The good news is, these vendors are in the *minority. For the industry as a whole Vista is a plus. Inevitably, a new version of Windows sparks the sale of more PCs, more peripherals, and more software. Sun Microsystems even argues that Vista is a boon to its Solaris—a competing operating system. "Anytime there's a major transition in the marketplace, like a new OS from Microsoft, it's an opportunity for customers to reexamine the choices they're making," says Chris Ratcliffe, Sun's director of system software. "Since they'll eventually have to make a change anyway, they're likely to evaluate all their options."


Even so, Vista means a fair amount of addi*tional work for tech companies. Consider Phoenix, the industry's primary BIOS writer: Charged with writing the firmware that sits between the OS and PC motherboards, Phoenix started preparations nearly 24 months ago, and the road is nearly as long for the big desktop and notebook makers. Vista marks the debut of a new Windows licensing arrangement, requiring manufacturers to grab digital keys from Microsoft each time they install the OS. That means a whole new infrastructure on the assembly line.

As we went to press, third-party hardware *developers had finished over 16,000 drivers for the new OS, and more than 50 software companies had officially updated more than 200 applications under Microsoft's Vista logo program. That's a *serious overhaul—and it's nothing compared with what's on the way. Microsoft anticipated that, in the two months leading up to the launch, another 14,000 drivers would be in place, with tens of thousands more still on the way.

No matter how well they've prepared for the Vista launch, the big vendors still face incompatibility problems—and the smaller vendors face even more. Big PC companies such as HP and Gateway have spent months prepping their call centers for the onslaught, and SupportSoft, a company that provides support services for vendors across the industry, anticipates the biggest uptick in calls since Windows 95. In fact, SupportSoft sees the arrival of Vista as a prime opportunity to launch its very own help portal. Support.com, offering help to any consumer with PC problems, goes live just as Vista hits the streets

The Choice

Somewhere in the middle of all this you'll find the IT manager, wondering when his business should adopt Windows Vista. When a new version of Windows arrives, businesses usually take their sweet time with the upgrade, waiting for Microsoft and the rest to iron out all the kinks. More than a year after its debut, according to IDC, Windows XP was running only 10 percent of the world's office PCs.


Yes, Vista is a bigger leap forward than Windows XP. The new security tools alone make it a compelling proposition. But at the same time, it requires a bigger hardware boost. In the end, one cancels out the other (see "View from the Trenches," page 94). IDC says businesses will adopt Vista at about the same rate they adopted XP (see graph). And in some cases, the businesses that purchase new Vista machines will actually *remove the OS before rolling the systems out. "Some businesses won't be ready to support Vista," says Al Gillen, IDC's operating-systems analyst.

Vista is sure to turn the industry upside down. But it may take a while


Top 5 ... er, 7: Who's Screwed?

Sage TV
Sage does what TiVo does but on a PC. But that's now a less-than-ideal place: The Home Premium and Ultimate versions of Vista include a built-in digital video *recorder.


Preclick
Preclick provides slick, simple, free photo management software. And so does Vista.

CyberLink
Its *PowerDirector video-*editing app is dog slow. Now CyberLink is also up against the new-and-improved Windows Movie Maker, bundled with Vista.

Copernic, X1, et al.
With Vista, Windows finally offers very useful desktop search tools. That's great news—unless you're the maker of a desktop search product.

RealNetworks
The competition stiffens for RealPlayer and its Rhapsody online music service. Windows Media Player now dovetails with MTV's URGE store.

McAfee, Symantec, et al.
Yes, Microsoft will share the Vista kernel with these security vendors, to fight malware. But the fact remains: As of this month, Microsoft is a secu*rity vendor, too, offering a security suite for Vista


http://www.pcmag.com/article2/0,1895,2075009,00.asp

[baron von lotsov]

Windows 2000 professional is the best in my opinion. It's stable, it works reasonably fast and besides I don't like the XP graphics much. Too much like a kids toy with lots of stupid messages and slow.

[Anders Lindman]

U allways go for the latest model of an old series rather then the first model of a new series.


That's often a good strategy. Only, the problem is that many companies have become so utterly dependent so they can only choose between Microsoft and.....Microsoft. Imagine that you could buy whatever car model you wanted as long as it was a Ford.

[nessa felagund]

I use Windows 2000 professional, and it works great. I see no reason to change it at this point. My computer runs 24/7, and it rarely ever has any problems.

My husband owns and operates a computer business, and he runs Ubuntu Linux with Apache webserver. He also hosts websites on this server including one for his business. We use open source software as much as possible.

Open Office is an excellent program, and it's free. Microsoft office is just too expensive even for just the basic package.

[baron von lotsov]

Ah yes but you know nothing is free in this life. Open source is like a communist model in that the only people who can really take the time to develop it are working for an institution where you pay for it out of your taxes. Why is this bad? Well lets suppose all software is funded out of your taxes and your money did not mean anything, how much choice would you have then? It's like being between the devil and the deep blue sea except you are sampling introductory offers to the next scam, called socialism.

I'm a software developer and there is no way I will put it out open source. If you think that a bit mean then consider me suggesting to you that you give away your last seven years of salary to people you don't even know. No way and the problem I have is that I'm competing in a market subsidized by your taxes and you can't compete with free. You can't go into a food shop and say I'd like you to make your vegetables open source!

[Anders Lindman]

I agree that developers creating open source software should be able to get money for what they produce. Maybe in the future there will emerge distributed companies, sort of dynamic business networks where a large number of open source developers can participate. These business networks would potentially be able to compete with traditional monolithic companies. Externally, for the consumer, the business network would be the same as an ordinary company, with a brand name and so on, but internally it would operate with an entirely different business model.

[jinjo5]

Windows XP definately! My mate has vista and I hate it.
....couldnt care less....

[adimon]

I've always been a Linux man, and when I used Vista before it seemed awful, but now that I have a PC with a good specification, I decided to dual-boot Linux and Vista, and Vista ain't bad at all IMO. The new SP makes a lot of improvements, and having used Vista nearly constantly for the last 3 weeks, I can definitely vouch for it being an improvement on XP which I always thought was pump, no matter how many SPs they released for it. :D

[cheeney1]

What About Windows 3.11 ,95 98 and 2000
i had Friends rush out and buy these Upgrades when they first came out.........waste of fuckin money

As for Windows Xp And Vista, Vista is full of Bugs And Glitches

But Saying that Xp Freezes Quite abit as well.......:mad:
been suckered in once not going to happen again.........:o

[jungle jim]

Windows XP or Vista?

Theres some talk on the net that after 911 the CIA made Microsoft rig Vista so the CIA can look into anyones PC through Vista OS and people wouldn't even know.

I'm sticking with XP!

Windows XP is dam good OS and IMO its just as good as VISTA is.

[times7]

Vista has a back door and Nasa holds the key

[megafish33]

Os X. :)

www.apple.com

[steppewar]

I bought a new computer a few months ago. It only has Vista installed on it and I can honestly say the software is a pile of shit.

Also see this link ... http://www.vistaisrubbish.com/index.html

[father ted]

Vista is the biggest pile of shit, windows gets worse with every version.

[tothestars]

win 98 se is still the best windows os imo :D (altho i dont have it anymore)

[steevo]

win 98 se is still the best windows os imo :D (altho i dont have it anymore)

Here here :D
I had Windows 98 since 1999 and only got rid of it in 2007 and that was cos I was FORCED to cos Microsoft ensured that nothing was compatible with it.

I have Vista now but have a spare computer with 98 on which I use in the bedroom to watch the Simpsons and stuff on when I go to bed.

I bought a computer from Dell last year, it was a beauty but it had VISTA on it so I sent it back and got a full refund. I had tried to put XP on it but it would not let me....the motherboards are LOCKED :eek: in a similar way that mobiles are locked to one paricular company like Orange or Vodaphone etc.

[amar7]

Vista has a back door and Nasa holds the key

Thats not provabale, although I can imagine that being true.

Win Vista and also Win XP is co-programmed by the NSA!

[astral_girl]

im on xp but my sons had a pc recently and hes on vista-its dead slow -this might be cause hes getting the net through be on a wirless thing.....but takes forever doing things on it -is this normal?

also i cant fathom it out at all.......im no expert on pcs ....but i get by on mine but his is awful to get round on....is this normal too?:)

[pumma]

Windows XP or Vista?
None of them... Maybe for games and that's it.

[somewarez]

Just a small PC tip for running with windows (windoze) if you want to keep your system clean and running well always use these three programs, there are other ways and other stuff but if I get enough PMs I'll make a post on good PC usage. I don't want to derail the thread though.

ok the three programs you should use are :-

AVG anti virus - by grisoft
Ad-aware - by lavasoft
Spy-Bot search and destroy

all can be found by using google. Most importantly all are FREE!!

If you are unsure of the links please just PM me and I will link it, I am not going to link them direct in the post as I know that the mods are against advertising. These programs will help you keep your PC free from spy ware and viruses. Its your PC and you need to clean it just like a surface you use for chopping veg etc it needs to be cleaned and looked after. Its your data!

:) keep it clean and free from all the bumfluff that it picks up on the journey through the net and it will serve you well :)

BTW this is just XP tips I havent tried Vista so I will not try comment upon that

SW

[somewarez]

OH!! meh silly me, if you are gonna use any form of web browser use FIREFOX!

sorry forgot to add that :)

happy PC browsing

SW

[siscid]

My 2p:

I've never used vista and never will, There are too many things wrong with it for me to use it. XP is OK but if your confident enough you can use LINUX (Ubuntu is very easy to setup and use.) That would be the best choice. I currently use XP because I like playing games once in a while as LINUX supports very few titles.

So my recommendation would be to go with XP or better LINUX.

I had tried to put XP on it but it would not let me....the motherboards are LOCKED

Thats also another problem with Vista as well as the resource hogging. ;)

Siscid.

[cruise4]

"That's why I browse the Internet on a Windows 98 machine not connected to my other machine."

Very sensible. I use another machine or two also that are never connected.

This machine I'm using now for the net has Vista on it, 512Megs ram and its a Pentium 3 - 1.4Ghz. It is a bit slow for sure, but adequate. Once I found out about IBM and the Eugenics links I couldn't face staying in the purchasing arena for this kit.

Win2K Pro is the best of the bunch. XP is OK. Vista is terrible. Reminds me of Windows ME in its awfulness. Bugs galore and the updates never fix them.

XP MediaCentre is a quality interface though. Must have slipped past the censors. Better than the Vista MediaCentre.

We get really screwed !

[deliciously_fresh]

I have Vista (I bought my computer last year) and it works well for me. I haven't had any problems with it as of yet. *Knocks on wood*

[raul bloodworth]

windows xp dark edition (very fast os) (ya can find it on most wa£ez sites)
also i find the live cd's to be handy, im useing knoppix at the moment (linux) very nice:) and portable:D

[megafish33]

ok the three programs you should use are :-

AVG anti virus - by grisoft
Ad-aware - by lavasoft
Spy-Bot search and destroy

all can be found by using google. Most importantly all are FREE!!



Yes!! Preach brotha/sista! I love that word... "free..." ahhhhh

I feel MSFT finally did a great job on the latest Office suite, but if anyone needs a free word processor, spreadsheet, etc. I recommend OpenOffice. It works really well. http://www.openoffice.org/

While it's not free, I still think this (http://www.apple.com/macosx/) is just a beautiful, solid, high performance product. (I do not work them, seriously, I just think it's that good)

[kriss_crow]

ok the three programs you should use are :-

AVG anti virus - by grisoft
Ad-aware - by lavasoft
Spy-Bot search and destroy

SW

I agree. AVG seems to work good enough, although it's not a top one according to some antivirus rankings.
That's why I always have two running on my system.
The second I would recommend is Avast [free for home use]. I dont remember last time I catched a virus or trojan on my pc.
Both use very little resources, essential for slower machines; factually they are almost invisible working together.
As firewall I use Comodo - reliable, sophisticated, but easy to work with.
I'm very surprised how many still rely on built-in windows firewall, imo it's useless crap.

About browser - I won't be original - Firefox, for security reasons and amazing plugins.

I use modyfied version xp, after installation I remove useless for me apps- like games, wmp, movie maker, outlook express, msn messenger, unnecessary drivers, libraries and a lot of trash installed by default
with xp.
In this way the system occupies less than 1GB.

I also close many services, that my pc doesn't use
which run without reason and are only open gates for eventual hacking.

all this above make my machine safe, efficient and fast for years.

[whitenight639]

I have windwos XP and Ubuntu on my desktop and vista on my laptop, Vista is shit and ive been using ubuntu for about 6 months and i cringe everytime i have to boot into windows even after i edited the registry to stop the annoying pop ups, IE crashed withing seconds of using it, and you have to load it with crap like anti virus, pdf reader, flash movie plugins, office suite, ftp client, bittorren, all the basics you get with ubuntu only thing is ubuntu is free and fast!

microsoft seem to be on a mission to develop OS's that consume more and more of your PCs ram and CPU time, whats the point of buying a new pc if your going to slap vista on it and it be just as slow as your old pc??

the ONLY reason I have installed XP (no i didnt pay for it!!) again is for photoshop (for which there is a linux equivelent- gimp) dreamweaver, and swishmax (flash movie maker)
if i could just get a swishmax equivelent in ubuntu id format the HDD straight away!

baron i can understand you personally not releasing your apps open source but dont bad mouth it, Its a great idea, the by the people for the people software is awesome if everyone writes a few scripts or lines of code then its not alot of work and collectively everyone benifits, its better than having over worked coders slaving away at redmond.

[father ted]

You get chess with vista. That's about it.

[logic bomb]

I had compatibility issues when I used Vista Premium last year but I may give Vista another go now the SP1 Pack is out. Looking to buy a laptop this week and it looks like it may be one of these.

Comments appreciated...


Option 1 - Vostro 1400 - £439 Ex-VAT

Intel® Core™ 2 Duo Processor T7250 (2.00 GHz, 800 MHz FSB, 2 MB L2-cache) edit
Genuine Windows® XP Professional - English edit
1Yr Basic Warranty - Next Business Day Included - No Upgrade Selected edit
14.1" Wide Screen WXGA (1280x800) TFT Display edit
Matte Jet Black with 2.0 mega pixel camera edit
2048MB 667MHz Dual Channel DDR2 SDRAM (2x1024) edit
250GB (5400RPM) SATA Hard Drive edit
128 MB NVIDIA GeForce 8400M GS edit
Fixed Internal 8X DVD+/-RW Drive including Software edit
Primary 9-cell Lithium-Ion Battery (85 WHr)


Option 2 - Vostro 1700

CORE 2 DUO T7500 2.20GHz, 800, 4M
Fixed Internal 8X DVD+/-RW Drive
Hard Drive 320GB Serial ATA (5400RPM)
V1700 Matte Jet Black with 2.0 MP camera
Intel 3945 WLAN Mini-Card EUR
Primary 9-cell 85WHr Li-Ion Battery
Roxio Vista - Creator / MYDVD 9.0
3.0GB, 667MHz DDR2 SDRAM Memory (1 x 1024
Internal 56K Modem Notebook - UK
1700 17 WXGA+ (1440 x 900)
256 MB NVIDIA GeForce 8600M GT
English - Vista Ultimate (32Bit OS)

[eternal_spirit]

Just a small PC tip for running with windows (windoze) if you want to keep your system clean and running well always use these three programs, there are other ways and other stuff but if I get enough PMs I'll make a post on good PC usage. I don't want to derail the thread though.

ok the three programs you should use are :-

AVG anti virus - by grisoft
Ad-aware - by lavasoft
Spy-Bot search and destroy



.................................................. .............

AVG and Spybot are good...Lavasoft isn't so good. Try this it picks up stuff Lavasoft doesn't and takes about 5 mins to do a scan :)

http://www.download.com/Advanced-WindowsCare-Personal/3000-2086_4-10407614.html?tag=pop.software

[somewarez]

.................................................. .............

AVG and Spybot are good...Lavasoft isn't so good. Try this it picks up stuff Lavasoft doesn't and takes about 5 mins to do a scan :)

http://www.download.com/Advanced-WindowsCare-Personal/3000-2086_4-10407614.html?tag=pop.software

Checking it :) I agree that lavasoft aint the best but in combination with spybot the pair seem to be pretty good at clearing most of the fluff picked up while browsing.

Oh and on a side note, I should add that Firefox should be used with NoScript
https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/722
It will stop alot of pages from loading stuff and makes general surfing ALOT safer, takes some time to get used to though, as it requires you to accept sites and scripts etc but it wont let them just run like IE and others do. Well worth the extra safety ;)

Thanks ES for the link :)

SW

[chinchilla]

I've used Vista for almost a year, currently I'm using service pack 1 with it too. I've never had a problem!

[LasseMaja]

Try Ubuntu Linux, it's one of the best (or at least, the easiest) Linux systems I've tried so far. No need for pirated software anymore, the Ubuntu download program is so very easy and fast to use! (their system is Debian's apt-get). You can get free CD-burning tools, painting tools, music editing, as free alternative to MS office, fun games and so on with an easy click)

It's free, intuitive, secure and fast. Download from ubuntu.com

If you are a gamer however, you will still need to run windows (XP preferably) paralell with the Linux system (you choose which system to run when you start the computer)

Windows is a part of the whole illuminati scam, I tend to believe...

[auron]

I saw this in someones signature on another forum.....

Microsoft Vista stands for - Viruses Infections Spyware Trojans Adware...

:D

[free_soul]

vista with my own modified anti trojan spyware and anti virus

its great with them i find out who sent it what ip (goes through all routers)

and has a defensive atack mechagnism

who said learning to hack is pointles without reaking the law ;)

[tootrue]

The company is establishing digital security checks that could even shut off a computer's connections to some monitors or televisions if antipiracy procedures that stop high-quality video copying aren't in place.

WTF?

So you would own something that imposes regulations on you?
http://www.news.com/Hollywood,%20Microsoft%20align%20on%20new%20Window s/2100-1025_3-5844393.html?part=rss&tag=5844393&subj=news