ID cards have already been issued to UK subjects.

[baron von lotsov]

You can order one here.

http://thehornytoad.blogspot.com/

[december]

And as you can see - nobody cares! :(

It seems to me that the Brits turned into good obedient puppets - they even go to Iraq to DIE FOR ISRAEL...

I wonder what are we going to see next?... :rolleyes:

[december]

ID cards have already been issued to UK subjects.

http://thehornytoad.blogspot.com/

And what do the British people plan to do about it, if they actually care?

:)

[joy division]

And what do the British people plan to do about it, if they actually care?

:)

I dont know what got up your arse today but reading some of your post today you seem to have found a bad attitude in my opinion, i dont know maybe you just down today or on the blob or something.

I care, but there aint much i can do at this time.

[baron von lotsov]

And as you can see - nobody cares! :(

It seems to me that the Brits turned into good obedient puppets - they even go to Iraq to DIE FOR ISRAEL...

I wonder what are we going to see next?... :rolleyes:

Some do and some don't. Same in your country I guess. It feels like the calm before the storm, people are poised to stick the boot in the moment the government make a move on it but so far they have chickened out. Who knows what will happen next but this is your freedom at stake. You think America can just sit there and smile, well, have you checked the news lately?

[december]

I dont know what got up your arse today but reading some of your post today you seem to have found a bad attitude in my opinion, i dont know maybe you just down today or on the blob or something.

I care, but there aint much i can do at this time.

I am sorry, but I don't quite understand why did you got upset, Joy Division.
Should I start some sort of FEEL GOOD thread and insert beautiful pictures in it?




Some do and some don't. Same in your country I guess.

Yes, it is just the same way in America AND Australia as well...
We do know who run (own) the USA (the Fed), and the owners would like to keep it that way of course...

I started related threads before, by the way, and didn't get the answer...
I think american people just don't see America as their country, that's why they allow USA to be destroyed.

The so-called Americans won't fight for "their land" the same way Indians did.

Why? Because it's not theirs...

Here's what other people say -


I agree with you December, American's complain but they do nothing. Why? I don't know, I guess it's because the system is so established that people feel powerless, and when they do wan't to rebel, in what form should they? What effective action can you really take? Does protesting actually work?

It's not just Americans that complain about things but do nothing to change them. It's the same in England.

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3812


And for many people this very subject is just a form of entertainment I think -

Is NWO is a form of entertainment for you?

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=4089

[december]

It feels like the calm before the storm, people are poised to stick the boot in the moment the government make a move on it but so far they have chickened out.

Maybe it is you who feel it that way, but most people don't know or just don't care about the unfolding events.

The situation in todays UK and US is the same as it was in Russia before the coup de’teat of 1917. The surtain forces were grabbing the power slowly and people couldn't see it untill it was TOO LATE...


Here's what we can find in Antony C. Sutton's "WALL STREET AND THE BOLSHEVIK REVOLUTION":

Winston Churchill traces this movement back to Spartacus-Weishaupt, throws his literary net around Trotsky, Bela Kun, Rosa Luxemburg, and Emma Goldman, and charges: "This world-wide conspiracy for the overthrow of civilisation and for the reconstitution of society on the basis of arrested development, of envious malevolence, and impossible equality, has been steadily growing."

http://reformed-theology.org/html/books/bolshevik_revolution/appendix_02.htm

[eternal_spirit]

And what do the British people plan to do about it, if they actually care?

:)


Well I've been saying this for some time. We I us here in the UK should all go on strike and demand what we wan't from the Government ! But as usual not many have the balls or the guts to do this, I'm willing to.

[december]

Well I've been saying this for some time. We I us here in the UK should all go on strike and demand what we wan't from the Government ! But as usual not many have the balls or the guts to do this, I'm willing to.

Before you go on strike and demand something, you need to foresee the outcome of it. You need to know if it can actually work. :)
But the best way to get real results is to find people within the government or/and influential people who can turn things around...

[eternal_spirit]

Yes december a plan to put into action, before it's too late. It's numbers that would count the more people involved then the more chance of making a change. they can't throw thousands or millions into prison fo havinf a verbal peacfull protest. I don't thnk the rich peole would wan't to prostest somehow though.

[investigations]

Yes december a plan to put into action, before it's too late. It's numbers that would count the more people involved then the more chance of making a change. they can't throw thousands or millions into prison fo havinf a verbal peacfull protest. I don't thnk the rich peole would wan't to prostest somehow though.

I'm rich and i would be up for some protest against id cards

[baron von lotsov]

Before you go on strike and demand something, you need to foresee the outcome of it. You need to know if it can actually work. :)
But the best way to get real results is to find people within the government or/and influential people who can turn things around...

Exactly. That's what I would call the intelligent approach, to get to the people who control it and get them on your side while they still show the system their 100% loyalty. When push comes to shove the orders will not be carried out because the system thinks it has loyal servants but in fact they have subterfuge. The stupid way is to wave lots of banners around and get arrested by the police.

[december]

I'm rich and i would be up for some protest against id cards

And how do you plan to do that?...

[zircon]

The most important thing is the inner rebellion that we know that we are free Of course they want to trick us with the illusion of needing them Yes Really!! to be free and safe. When we give our holy spirit away to them then we've lost... and sadly people are doing that in multiple ways, economically and by following some other kind of group slavery or cult of obedience... but the true rebel knows that the mind control doesn't work because it is only mind control - look at "The Prisoner" or read Camus. We are what we make ourselves. We own ourselves. And by knowing that we have won half the battle, and they have lost - of course they will try more and more extreme ways to trick us - until everyone sees the reality. One way is just to laugh at their antics - enjoy the ridiculous show they put on. (Not the sickening bits of course, greed, arrogance, love of the ego and fear trips, inhumanity, cruelty). Anyone who truly understands the truth of real godliness and that we do not belong to this or that state or country or fashion, who is not a victim of lack engineered by the sickness that wants to rule us, knows that I/D cards are nothing, (quite apart from doing the opposite of what they claim they are needed for!). Ridiculous.

[john white]

The most important thing is the inner rebellion that we know that we are free Of course they want to trick us with the illusion of needing them Yes Really!! to be free and safe. When we give our holy spirit away to them then we've lost... and sadly people are doing that in multiple ways, economically and by following some other kind of group slavery or cult of obedience... but the true rebel knows that the mind control doesn't work because it is only mind control - look at "The Prisoner" or read Camus. We are what we make ourselves. We own ourselves. And by knowing that we have won half the battle, and they have lost - of course they will try more and more extreme ways to trick us - until everyone sees the reality. One way is just to laugh at their antics - enjoy the ridiculous show they put on. (Not the sickening bits of course, greed, arrogance, love of the ego and fear trips, inhumanity, cruelty). Anyone who truly understands the truth of real godliness and that we do not belong to this or that state or country or fashion, who is not a victim of lack engineered by the sickness that wants to rule us, knows that I/D cards are nothing, (quite apart from doing the opposite of what they claim they are needed for!). Ridiculous.

Very very nice post :)

[baron von lotsov]

Yeh

Just sit there, meditate, do the new age rituals and it will all vanish.

IDIOTS!!!!!

[baron von lotsov]

Before you go on strike and demand something, you need to foresee the outcome of it. You need to know if it can actually work. :)
But the best way to get real results is to find people within the government or/and influential people who can turn things around...


This needs repeating for those who have short attention spans.

[zircon]

Yeh

Just sit there, meditate, do the new age rituals and it will all vanish.

IDIOTS!!!!!

No-one said meditate. I for one will resist having an I/D card.

You didn't say how you think the people "with influence" are going to stop this either... they're just mouthing opposition. At present there are a few groups opposed to the introduction of I/D cards, I support those groups in general, and have signed petitions obviously... doesn't mean it will prevent it. But even if I'm forced to be given one - which I still think is a waste of time and money and serves no useful purpose, and which I'm prepared to argue in court - I may still be forced. But having to force me / or anyone just proves that they are wrong and exposes them.
Also, I/D cards that are compulsory in other countries haven't prevented many people in those countries from understanding that they are free, and from being determined that they want to be free to think their own thoughts, and not be sheeple.

[baron von lotsov]

Councils are beginning to sign pledges to their people that no council services will be dependent on the production of an ID card. They have to vote on these motions at council meetings and only councillors can vote. Just one of the millions of things that are being done.

[zircon]

Can you tell me (and for the benefit of others who'd like to do the same) how I can support that or the many other things you are thinking of, directly through writing or contacting? That would be great.

[baron von lotsov]

Can you tell me (and for the benefit of others who'd like to do the same) how I can support that or the many other things you are thinking of, directly through writing or contacting? That would be great.


Well this all comes back to the issue of NO2ID. If you go to their forum and politely ask the question you will get lots of help from experienced political people who can advise. I have not done it myself except a letter I wrote to the Conservatives in my area suggesting it.

[zircon]

Thanks, I'll go back to hav a look at the NO2ID forum, and see where that leads. The more the better!

[december]

Yeh

Just sit there, meditate, do the new age rituals and it will all vanish.

IDIOTS!!!!!

You know...

If I were the Illuminati guy I would want people to spend most of their time meditating and expressing Infinite Love while I'll be sticking microchips under their skin and issuing ID Cards...

This is the kind of people Illuminati need actually...


http://www.madore.org/~david/images/meditating-guru.jpg

http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20050501/images/curr_microchips.jpg

[john white]

You know...

If I were the Illuminati guy I would want people to spend most of their time meditating and expressing Infinite Love while I'll be sticking microchips under their skin and issuing ID Cards...

This is the kind of people Illuminati need actually...


Well being as your in complete denial that the country you are such an unceasing fanboy for is an illuminati project through and through, I'm forced to question if you have even understand what the illuminati need. Far easier just to blame the Jews, isnt it? Icke's work is clearly way over your head. You did read the section on Love in "The truth will set you free?" The very concept of courage is based on Love. What does hatred get you?

[december]

Well being as your in complete denial that the country you are such an unceasing fanboy for is an illuminati project through and through, I'm forced to question if you have even understand what the illuminati need. Far easier just to blame the Jews, isnt it? Icke's work is clearly way over your head. You did read the section on Love in "The truth will set you free?" The very concept of courage is based on Love. What does hatred get you?


John White, what do the Jews have to do with this thread or my post?
That's right. Nothing.

So, let me ask you two quetsions -

1. Do you see things when there are not there because you have been meditating for too long so you forgot to eat and now you cannot think straight?

Or...

2. Is it because you are just very skilfull manipulator who wants to change the subject?

[john white]

Quid pro quo December. If you think I'm giving to you when you act like a stone, you arnt ready to have a worthwhile conversation

You know the balance of your posting as well as I do: it is you who is attempting to avoid the subject

Fine, your avoidance says plenty

You did read the section on Love in "The truth will set you free?" The very concept of courage is based on Love. What does hatred get you?

[december]

Quid pro quo December. If you think I'm giving to you when you act like a stone, you arnt ready to have a worthwhile conversation

You know the balance of your posting as well as I do: it is you who is attempting to avoid the subject

Fine, your avoidance says plenty

John White, you are a man with TWO faces.

http://pekingduck.org/archives/twofacesofbush.jpg

Here - on this forum, you play a guy who is into Spiritual Awakening and Infinite Love, but on your forum (where you are an administrator) you allow your members to express hate and post filthy messages.

So, take off your mask and show who you REALLY are.

[december]

Before we go on strike and demand something, we need to foresee the outcome of it. We need to know if it can actually work.
But the best way to get real results is to find people within the government or/and influential people who can turn things around...


Exactly. That's what I would call the intelligent approach, to get to the people who control it and get them on your side while they still show the system their 100% loyalty. When push comes to shove the orders will not be carried out because the system thinks it has loyal servants but in fact they have subterfuge. The stupid way is to wave lots of banners around and get arrested by the police.


Baron von lotsov, what if we e-mail a letter to the members of both houses of the British Parliament with a link to this site?

http://thehornytoad.blogspot.com/


Members have been asked to supply details of the preferred form of their names, titles and qualifications; these have been included in this list where known. Links to email and websites are also given where available. Where an email address is not available details of postal and telephone contact points are given. A selective biography is provided by Dod’s Parliamentary Communications for each Member of Parliament. * Indicates a new Member, + indicates Member has previous service but not in the last Parliament.


Member Constituency

A

Abbott, Ms Diane (Lab) Hackney North & Stoke Newington Email Website Biog
Adams, Mr Gerry (SF) Belfast West No email Biog
Afriyie, Adam (Con) * Windsor No email Website Biog
Ainger, Nick (Lab) Carmarthen West & South Pembrokeshire Email Website Biog
Ainsworth, Mr Peter (Con) East Surrey No email Website Biog
Ainsworth, Rt Hon Bob (Lab) Coventry North East Email Biog
Alexander, Danny (LD) * Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch & Strathspey Email Website Biog
Alexander, Rt Hon Douglas (Lab) Paisley & Renfrewshire South Email Website Biog
Allen, Mr Graham (Lab) Nottingham North No email Website Biog
Amess, Mr David (Con) Southend West Email Website Biog
Ancram, Earl of,, Rt Hon Michael (Con) Devizes Email Website Biog
Anderson, Mr David (Lab) * Blaydon Email Website Biog
Anderson, Janet (Lab) Rossendale & Darwen Email Website Biog
Arbuthnot, Rt Hon James (Con) North East Hampshire Email Website Biog
Armstrong, Rt Hon Hilary (Lab) North West Durham Email Website Biog
Atkins, Charlotte (Lab) Staffordshire Moorlands No email Biog
Atkinson, Mr Peter (Con) Hexham Email Website Biog
Austin, Mr Ian (Lab) * Dudley North Email Biog
Austin, John (Lab) Erith & Thamesmead Email Website Biog

Top

B

Bacon, Mr Richard (Con) South Norfolk Email Website Biog
Bailey, Mr Adrian (Lab/Co-op) West Bromwich West Email Website Biog
Baird, Vera (Lab) Redcar Email Website Biog
Baker, Norman (LD) Lewes Email Website Biog
Baldry, Tony (Con) Banbury Email Website Biog
Balls, Ed (Lab/Co-op) * Normanton Email Website Biog
Banks, Gordon (Lab) * Ochil & South Perthshire Email Website Biog
Barker, Gregory (Con) Bexhill & Battle Email Website Biog
Barlow, Ms Celia (Lab) * Hove No email Website Biog
Baron, Mr John (Con) Billericay Email Biog
Barrett, John (LD) Edinburgh West Email Website Biog
Barron, Rt Hon Kevin (Lab) Rother Valley Email Website Biog
...
....
.....

http://www.parliament.uk/directories/hciolists/alms.cfm

[john white]

John White, you are a man with TWO faces.

http://pekingduck.org/archives/twofacesofbush.jpg

Here - on this forum, you play a guy who is into Spiritual Awakening and Infinite Love, but on your forum (where you are an administrator) you allow your members to express hate and post filthy messages.

So, take off your mask and show who you REALLY are.

Well, I'll give you another chance to get your head round the fact that I am neither mod nor admin at illusions anymore... which is entirely consistant with not seeing the site in the same way as the rest of the team right now. Given the nature of your own posts at illusions, your certainly displaying a quality called hypocrasy... somewhat Janus-like of yourself there....so you appear to be presenting a self-portait. If you have a post by me from Illusions showing qualities of "hate and filthy messages" you only have to post it here to thoroughly pwn me... we both know you can't

And lets try that question again, shall we?

You did read the section on Love in "The truth will set you free?" The very concept of courage is based on Love. What does hatred get you?

(Thats re: Your avoidance says plenty: avoiding showing your own face perhaps? Mine is naked for all to see)

[baron von lotsov]

Baron von lotsov, what if we e-mail a letter to the members of both houses of the British Parliament with a link to this site?




It would be entirely unproductive because some guy who got famous started to believe infinite love was the only truth and everything else an illusion.

Even so we did email the House of Lords some while back, or at least some people did. That was a coup and a half. Result: 5 rejections and denouncement by the highest authority in this country. That was like a turning point for the scheme, after that every journalist figured that if the Rt Hon Lords knew it was bad then it was bad and hence gave then a licence to print. At least 30% was knocked off that all-important public opinion and millions have declared that they will not cooperate with the scheme.

[december]

Well, I'll give you another chance to get your head round the fact that I am neither mod nor admin at illusions anymore... which is entirely consistant with not seeing the site in the same way as the rest of the team right now. Given the nature of your own posts at illusions, your certainly displaying a quality called hypocrasy... somewhat Janus-like of yourself there....so you appear to be presenting a self-portait. If you have a post by me from Illusions showing qualities of "hate and filthy messages" you only have to post it here to thoroughly pwn me... we both know you can't

And lets try that question again, shall we?



(Thats re: Your avoidance says plenty: avoiding showing your own face perhaps? Mine is naked for all to see)

Well....

After reading this post I can say with certainty that you are not only skilfull manipulator, but also, John White, you are a very skilfull liar as well.

You are reeeeeeeeeeeeeeeally good at it.

[john white]

I'm a liar becuase you can't answer a question?

You did read the section on Love in "The truth will set you free?" The very concept of courage is based on Love. What does hatred get you?

Too silly for words December. Its almost like your trying to prevent yourself admiting something

[december]

I'm a liar becuase you can't answer a question?



Too silly for words December. Its almost like your trying to prevent yourself admiting something


john white, I am sorry, but you are like a girl who enjoys this sort of discussion. But I am not.

http://illusionsforum.jconserv.net/www/illusionsforum/logos/GenElectroIllusions2.jpg

And just to answer your question. Yes. I did read that book four times or so.

[john white]

john white, I am sorry, but you are like a girl who enjoys this sort of discussion. But I am not.

http://illusionsforum.jconserv.net/www/illusionsforum/logos/GenElectroIllusions2.jpg

And just to answer your question. Yes. I did read that book four times or so.

A half answer at best December. I'm obviously too kind to you

So, did you agree with what Icke said about the power of Love, or did you not?

(and thanks for the compliment about me being in touch with the feminie aspects of my nature. To a real man, its certainly no insult)

[baron von lotsov]

December

I can say that I have had many arguments with this man. Some can go on for pages and by the time they're finished no one can remember what the topic was about. He gets into legitimate discussions like a spanner in the works. Always he has far more time than anyone else and a boredom threshold that I have never seen in the likes of with anyone else. It is virtually impossible to out argue this man. Logic has no relevance to him, he will just bore you to death. Indeed if I were the establishment I'd actively employ people like him to firstly discredit researchers and secondly to screw up any forum he gets his little fingers on.

[john white]

December

I can say that I have had many arguments with this man. Some can go on for pages and by the time they're finished no one can remember what the topic was about. He gets into legitimate discussions like a spanner in the works. Always he has far more time than anyone else and a boredom threshold that I have never seen in the likes of with anyone else. It is virtually impossible to out argue this man. Logic has no relevance to him, he will just bore you to death. Indeed if I were the establishment I'd actively employ people like him to firstly discredit researchers and secondly to screw up any forum he gets his little fingers on.

Sure Baron: I question you and have a different perspective on certain issues so you steer as close as you can to insinuating I must be working for "them" rather than answer a straight question. In that way, your quite similar to December: you both think in polarities

[john white]

And btw: how wonderfully "Elite" of you!

[baron von lotsov]

http://www.onehumanity.org/Oneness_Meditation.gif
http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20050501/images/curr_microchips.jpg

[december]

http://www.onehumanity.org/Oneness_Meditation.gif
http://www.signonsandiego.com/uniontrib/20050501/images/curr_microchips.jpg



If I were the Illuminati guy I would open as many FEEL GOOD threads on this forum as possible...

This is what actually the Illuminati want to do - they want to hypnotize British people...

http://www.geocities.com/cut2thechase_ca/chphand2.jpg

http://www.madore.org/~david/images/meditating-guru.jpg

http://www.tldm.org/News4/VeriChipInserted.jpg

http://altrap.com/editorialpics/hypnotize.gif

FEEL GOOD....FEEL GOOD........FEEL GOOD...............

http://www.theage.com.au/ffximage/2005/07/22/id_card1_gallery__502x329,0.jpg

[baron von lotsov]

Did you read the latest on UK ID cards? Does this sound like desperation or what?

Quote Metro Page 5 Monday 4th June

Civil servants have been ordered to destroy documents giving details of costly Governments computer upgrades, it is claimed today.

The orders were reportedly given to officials dealing with schemes such as id cards and the £12.4 billions NHS patient records database.

The allegedly came from the Office of Government Commerce (OGC), a branch of GB's Treasury, which is trying to stop internal assessments of computers schemes being published.

The OGC has appealed against an Information Tribunal ruling that inital reports on the £5.3 billion ID cards scheme should be made public.

Studies by its independant specialists should be kept secret to improve efficiency, it says. However, newspapers yesterday published leaked orders allegedly from the office which told review teams to 'securely dispose of the report' immediately after delivery

[december]

Did you read the latest on UK ID cards? Does this sound like desperation or what?

I didn't... But it looks like the rest of the forum members - uncluding moderators - don't even care about it.
I think the Illumiati people are reading this forum and smiling...

[zircon]

I didn't... But it looks like the rest of the forum members - uncluding moderators - don't even care about it.
I think the Illumiati people are reading this forum and smiling...

I don't think that's true, not for me anyway, but the ongoing feud between december, bvl and johnwhite seemed to have taken over this thread somewhat. What was that about?

[december]

I don't think that's true, not for me anyway.


zircon, what do you think about my idea - what if we e-mail a letter to the members of both houses of the British Parliament with a link to this site?

http://thehornytoad.blogspot.com/


Members have been asked to supply details of the preferred form of their names, titles and qualifications; these have been included in this list where known. Links to email and websites are also given where available. Where an email address is not available details of postal and telephone contact points are given. A selective biography is provided by Dod’s Parliamentary Communications for each Member of Parliament. * Indicates a new Member, + indicates Member has previous service but not in the last Parliament.


Member Constituency

A

Abbott, Ms Diane (Lab) Hackney North & Stoke Newington Email Website Biog
Adams, Mr Gerry (SF) Belfast West No email Biog
Afriyie, Adam (Con) * Windsor No email Website Biog
Ainger, Nick (Lab) Carmarthen West & South Pembrokeshire Email Website Biog
Ainsworth, Mr Peter (Con) East Surrey No email Website Biog
Ainsworth, Rt Hon Bob (Lab) Coventry North East Email Biog
Alexander, Danny (LD) * Inverness, Nairn, Badenoch & Strathspey Email Website Biog
Alexander, Rt Hon Douglas (Lab) Paisley & Renfrewshire South Email Website Biog
Allen, Mr Graham (Lab) Nottingham North No email Website Biog
Amess, Mr David (Con) Southend West Email Website Biog
Ancram, Earl of,, Rt Hon Michael (Con) Devizes Email Website Biog
Anderson, Mr David (Lab) * Blaydon Email Website Biog
Anderson, Janet (Lab) Rossendale & Darwen Email Website Biog
Arbuthnot, Rt Hon James (Con) North East Hampshire Email Website Biog
Armstrong, Rt Hon Hilary (Lab) North West Durham Email Website Biog
Atkins, Charlotte (Lab) Staffordshire Moorlands No email Biog
Atkinson, Mr Peter (Con) Hexham Email Website Biog
Austin, Mr Ian (Lab) * Dudley North Email Biog
Austin, John (Lab) Erith & Thamesmead Email Website Biog

Top

B

Bacon, Mr Richard (Con) South Norfolk Email Website Biog
Bailey, Mr Adrian (Lab/Co-op) West Bromwich West Email Website Biog
Baird, Vera (Lab) Redcar Email Website Biog
Baker, Norman (LD) Lewes Email Website Biog
Baldry, Tony (Con) Banbury Email Website Biog
Balls, Ed (Lab/Co-op) * Normanton Email Website Biog
Banks, Gordon (Lab) * Ochil & South Perthshire Email Website Biog
Barker, Gregory (Con) Bexhill & Battle Email Website Biog
Barlow, Ms Celia (Lab) * Hove No email Website Biog
Baron, Mr John (Con) Billericay Email Biog
Barrett, John (LD) Edinburgh West Email Website Biog
Barron, Rt Hon Kevin (Lab) Rother Valley Email Website Biog
...
....
.....

http://www.parliament.uk/directories/hciolists/alms.cfm

[john white]

I don't think that's true, not for me anyway, but the ongoing feud between december, bvl and johnwhite seemed to have taken over this thread somewhat. What was that about?

Apologies: I may have pushed December a little hard: Its difficult to get the right balance with his kind of mind. But IMO there is a good reason for confronting a man who sees humanity as weakness and Jews and homosexuals as his mortal enemy, becuase if we are not prepared to challenge those views on this board, what does it say about us? As for the Baron, exactly what he thinks is never easy to assertain, but it certainly includes the rigid opinion that any form of consciousness expansion is to be dominated by evil (unless a vicar is the one thinking the thoughts in ones stead)

Of course the trouble with confronting anyone on an internet forum is it never looks the same on the outside of the exchange as it does on the inside: and neither the Baron or December have shown any meaningful change in the best part of two years. Thats free will in action of course

Yet the paradox is, if views in general harmony with David Ickes works are not expressed on the David Icke forum, its not a David Icke forum at all: and Icke himself is most certainly confrontational

[zircon]

Hi just seen your msg. I'm happy to send it to my own MP right now using my real name and explaining that I disagree with the whole concept. Doing a mass email from one person's personal address I feel would register as not being a serious letter, for the majority of MPs.. it might be disregarded.. but I'll start with mine right now.

[baron von lotsov]

The Times April 8, 2007


"The government is predicting that some 15m people will revolt against Tony Blair’s controversial ID card scheme by refusing to produce the new cards or provide personal data on demand. "

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1626768.ece

Not working hey! The only thing that will not work is the government's scheme. We are winning, that's why the government have gone so quiet.

[december]

The Times April 8, 2007
"The government is predicting that some 15m people will revolt against Tony Blair’s controversial ID card scheme by refusing to produce the new cards...

What does it mean? Who is going to produce the new cards - 15m people or government?



...or provide personal data on demand. "
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/news/uk/article1626768.ece


What information do people need to provide?

[december]

Official: Cheney Urged Wiretaps


http://rense.com/1.imagesH/chencard_dees.jpg

Stand-In for Ashcroft Alleges Interference

By Dan Eggen
Washington Post Staff Writer

Thursday, June 7, 2007

Vice President Cheney told Justice Department officials that he disagreed
with their objections to a secret surveillance program during a high-level
White House meeting in March 2004, a former senior Justice official told
senators yesterday.

The meeting came one day before White House officials tried to get approval
for the same program from then-Attorney General John D. Ashcroft, who lay
recovering from surgery in a hospital, according to former deputy attorney
general James B. Comey.

Comey's disclosures, made in response to written questions from the Senate
Judiciary Committee, indicate that Cheney and his aides were more closely
involved than previously known in a fierce internal battle over the legality
of the warrantless surveillance program. The program allowed the National
Security Agency to monitor phone calls and e-mails between the United States and overseas.

Comey said that Cheney's office later blocked the promotion of a senior
Justice Department lawyer, Patrick Philbin, because of his role in raising
concerns about the surveillance.

The disclosures also provide further details about the role played by
then-White House counsel Alberto R. Gonzales. He visited Ashcroft in his
hospital room and wrote an internal memorandum on the surveillance program
shortly afterward, according to Comey's responses. Gonzales is now the
attorney general. He faces possible congressional votes of no-confidence
because of his handling of the firings of nine U.S. attorneys last year.

[misscpb]

That card/picture made me laugh.

[zircon]

I haven't had a reply from my MP yet since my letter expressing my opposition in principle to I/D cards in the UK. I'll leave it a while then write again. But frankly I'm not really surprised even though my letter was very carefully worded and argued... (or because it was...?)

[space monkey]

You can order one here.

http://thehornytoad.blogspot.com/

The DSS beat you to it: http://socialscrutiny.org/doss1er-index.php