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john white
06-10-2008, 01:55 PM
Now here's some hardcore 9/11 Truth to get into: 24,000 words of real debate

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The Ultimate 9/11 'Truth' Showdown:
David Ray Griffin vs. Matt Taibbi

AlterNet.org (http://www.alternet.org/story/100688/the_ultimate_9_11_%27truth%27_showdown%3A_david_ra y_griffin_vs._matt_taibbi/)

By Matt Taibbi and David Ray Griffin, AlterNet. Posted October 6, 2008.

The two writers lock horns over the accuracy of Griffin's recent book, 9/11 Contradictions.

A poll of 17 countries that came out September of this year revealed that majorities in only nine of them "believe that al Qaeda was behind the 9/11 terrorist attacks on the United States." A Zogby poll from 2006 found that in America, 42% of respondents believed the US government and 9/11 Commission "covered up" the events of 9/11. It's safe to say that at least tens of millions of Americans don't believe anything close to the official account offered by the 9/11 Commission, and that much of the outside world remains skeptical.

Over the years, AlterNet has run dozens of stories, mostly critical, of the 9/11 Movement. Matt Taibbi has taken on the 9/11 Truth Movement head on in a series of articles, and most recently in his new book, The Great Derangement.

In April, I asked Taibbi if he would be interested in interviewing David Ray Griffin, a leading member of Scholars for 9/11 Truth & Justice, Emeritus Professor of Philosophy of Religion and Theology at Claremont School of Theology and Claremont Graduate University and author of seven of books on 9/11, about his recent book, 9/11 Contradictions. After months of back and forths between them and some editorial delays, I'm pleased to share their written exchange -- all 24,000 words of it. What we have here are the preeminent writers on both sides of the 9/11 Truth argument; a one-of-a-kind debate. Because the questions and responses are quite long, I've woven them together in order. Enjoy.

Jan Frel, AlterNet Senior Editor.

LINK:


http://www.alternet.org/story/100688/the_ultimate_9_11_%27truth%27_showdown%3A_david_ra y_griffin_vs._matt_taibbi/

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banoyes
06-10-2008, 03:23 PM
This is the greatest weakness in the 911 Movement
Freeking debates
like it was something that CAN BE DOUBTED
The idiots who stand opposite each other are part of the plot
Facts are facts
Present them
you cannot debate facts
David Ray Griffin vs. Matt Taibbi = BULLSHIT

thematrix
06-10-2008, 04:37 PM
This is the greatest weakness in the 911 Movement
Freeking debates

This is an internet forum. Internet forums are designed for debate.

Why are you posting here - if you think debates are the "greatest weakness"
Surely it's not to bash people into believing your own brand of dubious dogma?

The idiots who stand opposite each other are part of the plot

So let me see - is there anyone apart from yourself on the entire planet whom you consider was NOT part of the plot?

And is there anyone anywhere who you will not insult?

John: great article - thanks for posting :)

john white
06-10-2008, 05:10 PM
John: great article - thanks for posting

Your Welcome :)

banoyes
06-10-2008, 05:33 PM
This is an internet forum. Internet forums are designed for debate.

Why are you posting here - if you think debates are the "greatest weakness"
Surely it's not to bash people into believing your own brand of dubious dogma?



So let me see - is there anyone apart from yourself on the entire planet whom you consider was NOT part of the plot?

And is there anyone anywhere who you will not insult?

John: great article - thanks for posting :)
I am here to present evidence.
I rale against those who come with words,words,words
Like you and your pal White,who posted this weak shit
To my knowlwdge you have presented nothing but words, same as White
Just words
Who says "Internet forums are designed for debate." You
these are the kind of blanket statement you are full of
I say Internet forums are designed to exchange information
so there
About this there can be debate,as it is opinion
There is no debate about facts,which you attack with words only
neither you or White has presented one bit of fact
just words...thats what you're good at

klinker
06-10-2008, 06:13 PM
Interesting but nothing I have not seen before and at this stage in the game it is pointless debate imo.

thematrix
06-10-2008, 06:47 PM
neither you or White has presented one bit of fact
just words...thats what you're good at

Wrong.

I have in fact posted facts, links to sources to support my evidence, pictures, links to articles from people qualified to talk about that relevant subject in a good number of the posts I have made to this forum on 911.

Would you like me to list some of the posts containing these things - or will you for once admit you are wrong and "neither you or White has presented one bit of fact" is in fact a lie.

Please quit trying to disrupt threads with childish insults and juvenile behaviour

at this stage in the game it is pointless debate imo

I don't agree. The fact that there are these kinds of debates that will be read by people in MainstreamMedia land is a good thing I think.

It plants seeds in peoples minds. If "they" try to pull some other false flag operation in the future if those seeds are planted then the next event has a much lower chance of succeeding.

john white
06-10-2008, 07:51 PM
The fact that there are these kinds of debates that will be read by people in MainstreamMedia land is a good thing I think.

YES

It is, in fact, the front of the wave actually changing the consensus view of the people: and breaking the consensus trance: whether on 9/11 or any other subject

People reading, thinking and talking

ukor
06-10-2008, 08:48 PM
YES
People reading, thinking and talking

You might need to translate that bit for Mr. Banoyes.

I suspect ol' Banoyes is impatient for someone to issue him a nice brown shirt, a pair of jackboots and a sense of inclusion

informationx
06-10-2008, 08:58 PM
From an extremely superficial reading of that debate it seems like Matt Taibbi is essentially saying -

"Oh please, this shit cant be true. I just cant fucking deal with it."

lol :D

john white
06-10-2008, 09:46 PM
From an extremely superficial reading of that debate it seems like Matt Taibbi is essentially saying -

"Oh please, this shit cant be true. I just cant fucking deal with it."

lol :D

Well, you know, that is the essence of the 9/11 truth denial position: at least as far as the solid evidence goes

The rest, of course, they effortlessly treat with derision

bryan
06-10-2008, 11:35 PM
In part two of this staged debate, DRG says:

Because you are here simply repeating a charge made by Alexander Cockburn, I will refer you to my response to him, in which I pointed out that "The Truly Distracting 9/11 Conspiracy Theory" is the government's account of 9/11, which has been used to justify the so-called war on terror, because it has distracted us from the overarching problem of our time: the threat that global climate change may bring civilization to an end.

So what's Mr Griffin's solution to the overarching problem of our time?

http://uk.youtube.com/watch?v=m-TZypcH9eg