Terrible Nutrition and Youth Degradation?

[endlessvista]

I am really starting to wonder if this massive surge in youth violence, suicides and binge drinking all stems from poor diet and lack of proper nourishment during formative years?

I could be wrong by I know longer buy this "break up of traditional families...violence on movies" and all the other lame excuses the media and politicians put out there as an excuse. These things have been always with us and even kids from these so called respectable middle class families are just as fucked-up as kids from inner cities. It has to be something else.

What makes me think it is diet is seeing something like a McDonalds ad here on the buses in Ireland (and worldwide) were one can get (if you want it) a Double Cheese Burger, Large Fries and Large Soft Drink for 4 Euros. Even the poorest kid can afford that and as McDonalds has become a place where young people are forced to socialise having been driven away from everywhere else, it is handy for their parents who are working constantly to give them 4 Euros (or whatever the Sterling amount is in NI/UK) so they can have their meal with their friends.

On a superficial level that much 'food' would appear a bargain for 4 euros, but in reality apart from the nominal protein in the meat, the rest of it is mainly soya, empty carbs and masses of sugar and salt. There is little it any real nourishment in these fast foods. In terms of hydration the combination of fizzy sugary drinks and salt is a joke.

So the kids metabolism is destroyed during formative years and the sugar destroys their minds leading to mood swings and all kinds of depression and need for wild behaviour to try and relive it. If this isn't a recipe for either killing oneself at 15, or running around with knives (looking for Blood*) then what else is? We always had teen violence/negative behaviour, but not on this insane scale we have now have today.

I also suspect a lot of a massive binge drinking among teens and college students may be something as simple as getting nourishment. Beer and Cider are fairly good for providing some vitamins and nutriants. They could be getting wasted simply to deal with empty calories from their food and mood swings from their high sugar/carb intakes.

* I find it interesting that knives are the weapon and blood is involved. Are these youth being subconciously being driven to "hunt" and "slaughter" prey as their bodies think they are starving and hence are really looking for sustenance rather than violence and this is how it is being expressed by their biology/psychology?

Beyond the media platitudes about "kids need real food" by TV celeb cooks, there is a real crisis out there caused by the fast food industry which I think is leading to much more than chubby teens. That's the least of the problem (as bad as that is), but the only one the media concentrates on as they need the McDonalds, Pizza Hut, etc advertising.

I suspect the fast food modern diet is destroying young people today.

[godspeed]

violence breeds violence....alcohol breeds alcoholics....drug addiction breeds chaos and all available in a free society so therefor society breeds violence.......fight war not wars

[redhead]

I suspect the fast food modern diet is destroying young people today.

You are quite correct, it is ONE of the variables, but not the whole of the problem

[fuggles]

Of all crime, maybe 20 per cent is caused by diet. Excluding drugs, and alcohol.

So theoretically, 60 per cent of crime is because of what people are eating and drinking, including lack of sun exposure and chemicals in environment.

Those arent correct figures, but just examples of what the figures could look like if a scientist got to work on it.

I do agree with people who say that Mcdonalds etc wont exist in 50 years, too many people will wake up and say ' we used to eat like that, oh my god'.

The rastafarians , in their religion, believe the body is a temple. which is why they eat pure food and avoid red meat.
They say godliness IS cleanliness, and cleanliness is next to godliness. and when that is applied to your diet, a healthy diet makes sense, that is pure and healthy. Many rastafarians justify smoking cannabis because Jesus christ spoke a lot about hemp and cannabis, but anyway, my point is, the body should stay pure and you will have a pure mind that brings you closer to God.



Those arent my views, just the views of eating a healthy way. And it makes sense.

[northern_light]

Yes, diet definatley has a part to play. It's making their minds foggy and chaotic. However, the whole modern society is structured in such a way that can make anyone lose their mind. The total disconnection from nature can't be doing them much good either.

[endlessvista]

Yes, diet definatley has a part to play. It's making their minds foggy and chaotic.

Was listening to the radio just today and it was about how breakfasts of cereal and toast puts children's brains to sleep for the day and they are just not engaged in learning as a result. Yet you still get the likes of that rhinoplasty, max-factored, finger-wagging ratbag Gillian McKeith staunchly defending a carb only breakfast as it "feeds the brain" - this is complete bullshit and yet parents are falling for this crap and their kids are whacked out in a sugar daze all day (which is what carbs are) and their brains are half asleep by lunchtime.

I read of a survey were they took 100 kids and split them into three groups. One group got a boiled egg and toast, another group got yougurt and fruit and another group whole grain breakfast cereals. The results were amazing. The kids who had the cereals for breakfast showed no increase in leaning ability while the ones who had the boiled egg or yougurt and fruit did. The ones on the "healthy" whole grain breakfast cereals also piled on weight and needed food all day. The others were fine for learning and sports just on one egg or a pot of natural yougut and some fresh fruit.

If you look at what teens are eating today almost exclusively carbs in massive amounts which convert to sugar and are stored as the body think there is a famine due to no real nourishment from these empty carbs. Result: fat dopes with mood swings. (not their fault, but that's what they become)

The total disconnection from nature can't be doing them much good either.

Go out picking blackberries from the country lanes and the sheeple driving past you in their cars with shopping bags filled with frozen pizza and a small container of blackberries they bought for 5 Euros will look at you like you have something wrong with you even though you are carrying a container of free blackberries worth about 100 euros which took you about 20 mins to collect while you were surrounded by fresh air and birdsong. But it is you who is the idiot to be looked at as if you have something wrong with you.

as the man says "crazy world..."

[endlessvista]

You are quite correct, it is ONE of the variables, but not the whole of the problem

Yes, but diet seems to be epicenter of the earthquake for children as it impacts every aspect of their lives from TV to socialising.

Till they are old enough to get drink/drugs and that takes over.

Wasn't Gruel (carbs again) designed to keep people alive enough to work, but not to make them strong? Sounds a lot like Pop tarts and Oven Chips when you think about it.

[fuggles]

Soylent Green

[thenightmare]

Mest up teens these days, and i should know, cause im only 15. Nutrition is a factor in the way they act because they dont even know or care to know what they are eating. They just eat and eat. The body is obviously influenced by what you take in so if you insert trash into your 'temple' you will give out trash in the way you act, behave, and think.

Looks like the Illuminati did a good job. I have talked to a bunch of friends and they are all oblivious as to what is really going on in this world. I go to an exemplary school and all they care about is perfect grades, they really just cry over B's. Sometimes i believe they are just organic robots. I try to share my knowledge with them but most dont accept it, they listen but then they just end up being there same old selves. One of the things i mention is the fast food chain, and almost everyone eats Mcdonalds. I warn them about the dangers but they still eat it anyway.

Its sad what the future adults are going to be. A bunch of machines programmed to work their whole lives. Me and my gf are always being different from everyone. We lie on the grass and people look at us like we are crazy. We smell flowers and people laugh at our love of nature. We stay in the rain, drink the rain and people just shake their heads. We have a lot of fun and laugh and smile most of the time, and people look at us as if we committed a crime. Its unbelievable how lost these teens are.

Sorry if i got of topic, had to let some stuff out. :)

(Remember, age is just a number. I may be 15 but i am also human and deserve to be treated like everyone else.)

[fuggles]

The front page of the sun newspaper on January 1st, 2008 , was,

2000 and hate.

They replaced the 8 with hate, and the story below was of teenage stabbings.

is it slightly possible they had an agenda for 2008 ?? on the very first Sun newspaper of the year ???????? Definitely.

The agenda was to increase knife crime to get more cctv cameras up.
They either exaggerate knife crime to an extreme, or promote it by a bad diet and phone masts etc.

[delamo1999]

Mest up teens these days, and i should know, cause im only 15. Nutrition is a factor in the way they act because they dont even know or care to know what they are eating. They just eat and eat. The body is obviously influenced by what you take in so if you insert trash into your 'temple' you will give out trash in the way you act, behave, and think.

Looks like the Illuminati did a good job. I have talked to a bunch of friends and they are all oblivious as to what is really going on in this world. I go to an exemplary school and all they care about is perfect grades, they really just cry over B's. Sometimes i believe they are just organic robots. I try to share my knowledge with them but most dont accept it, they listen but then they just end up being there same old selves. One of the things i mention is the fast food chain, and almost everyone eats Mcdonalds. I warn them about the dangers but they still eat it anyway.

Its sad what the future adults are going to be. A bunch of machines programmed to work their whole lives. Me and my gf are always being different from everyone. We lie on the grass and people look at us like we are crazy. We smell flowers and people laugh at our love of nature. We stay in the rain, drink the rain and people just shake their heads. We have a lot of fun and laugh and smile most of the time, and people look at us as if we committed a crime. Its unbelievable how lost these teens are.

Sorry if i got of topic, had to let some stuff out. :)

(Remember, age is just a number. I may be 15 but i am also human and deserve to be treated like everyone else.)



I found your post to be very sincere and full of truth. Age to me does not matter and I hope to see more of your posts here on the board. Welcome to the board and thanks for your post.

:):):)

[fransetter]

http://www.re-vitalise.org/attachments/1178788370QI.pdf

[pacoquerak]

I really really recomend sally fallons book nourishing traditions

i think there is so much misinformation out there, so many foods that can even be found in "health" food stores are potential poisons and so many of the nesisary whole foods are almost always absent. Nourishing Traditions gives you almost (there are many extremely important foods which have almost fallen off the food spectrum alltogether world wide) as much information on real healthy food as i believe anyone needs and is also an amazing cookbook that i can't beleive the results. In fact almost every time i make one of the recepies (using organic foods of course) people are amazed at how delicious my cooking is and many times have claimed it was the best meal they have ever eaten

I feel that the vegan movement while it has it's great qualities in many ways is doing more harm than good. For one, it just isn't natural. There are very very few old vegan societies, many of which are rather unhealthy and all of which still consume a great deal of insects in the form of eggs and small creatures attached to plants. I don't think people need lots of animal proteins like they say, but a small amount of them mixed with other proteins makes the other proteins much more useful to your body. I also believe that the war on saturated fats is strait conspiracy, infact in most cases it's the unsaturated fats which are toxic and cause cancer, but of course any fat heated to extreme tempuratures and pressures or even simply cooked degrades into a less than food quality substance! I really think saturated fats is of upmost importance to our brains esspecialy when we are growing and mother's milk is something that can not be done without, but we should recive animal fats all the way to adult hood in the least if we really want to reach our full potential.

I find the worst part of veganism, not actualy how it effects those who follow it, but how it effects the conciousness of other people. Like some people want to eat healthier but when they are given the idea that meat is unhealthy they give up on the idea...

of course i am the last person to support non organic farming, factory farms of any kind (including "organic" ones) and i believe in treating animals right, with compassion and dignity and with only the best intent. We must create the conditions most condusive to life, half assing it aint good enough.

I think the food conspiracy is probobly the most harmful and worst one for all our lives. Though in this vast conspiracy our control to govern ourselves is limited in many ways, at least we do decide how we set our quality of living and food is the most important part!

READ IN DEFFENSE OF FOOD BY MICHAEL POLLAN
It starts off with this simply guidline "eat real food, not too much, mostly vegetables". And Nourishing Traditions by Sally Fallon "The cookbook that chalenges the diet dictocrats!

[lizzy]

Yes, but diet seems to be epicenter of the earthquake for children as it impacts every aspect of their lives from TV to socialising.

Till they are old enough to get drink/drugs and that takes over.

Wasn't Gruel (carbs again) designed to keep people alive enough to work, but not to make them strong? Sounds a lot like Pop tarts and Oven Chips when you think about it.


Greats posts endlessvista ;) and pacoquerak I will look for your book recommendation. Thankyou both...

Finding the healthest food in the future , deviod of tampering will be a challenge......

(there is talk that at some point growing your own will be considered anti-social.....now if this ever becomes a reality, THIS has to when people start to wake up)

[Ratiocinator]

I was just reading about this in the book Conscious Eating, by Gabriel Cousens MD.

Cousens writes how behaviour, health, and etcetera, all decline with each generation because of poor eating habits / nutrient deficient diet. This could very well be a significant reason for the current state of dumbed-down plebs and violent yobs.

Gabriel Coiusens laments that he dreads to think what people, following such injurious eating habits (cooked and animal foods), will eventually become.

[Ratiocinator]

I really really recomend sally fallons book nourishing traditions

i think there is so much misinformation out there, so many foods that can even be found in "health" food stores are potential poisons and so many of the nesisary whole foods are almost always absent. Nourishing Traditions gives you almost (there are many extremely important foods which have almost fallen off the food spectrum alltogether world wide) as much information on real healthy food as i believe anyone needs and is also an amazing cookbook that i can't beleive the results. In fact almost every time i make one of the recepies (using organic foods of course) people are amazed at how delicious my cooking is and many times have claimed it was the best meal they have ever eaten

I feel that the vegan movement while it has it's great qualities in many ways is doing more harm than good. For one, it just isn't natural. There are very very few old vegan societies, many of which are rather unhealthy and all of which still consume a great deal of insects in the form of eggs and small creatures attached to plants. I don't think people need lots of animal proteins like they say, but a small amount of them mixed with other proteins makes the other proteins much more useful to your body. I also believe that the war on saturated fats is strait conspiracy, infact in most cases it's the unsaturated fats which are toxic and cause cancer, but of course any fat heated to extreme tempuratures and pressures or even simply cooked degrades into a less than food quality substance! I really think saturated fats is of upmost importance to our brains esspecialy when we are growing and mother's milk is something that can not be done without, but we should recive animal fats all the way to adult hood in the least if we really want to reach our full potential.

I find the worst part of veganism, not actualy how it effects those who follow it, but how it effects the conciousness of other people. Like some people want to eat healthier but when they are given the idea that meat is unhealthy they give up on the idea...

of course i am the last person to support non organic farming, factory farms of any kind (including "organic" ones) and i believe in treating animals right, with compassion and dignity and with only the best intent. We must create the conditions most condusive to life, half assing it aint good enough.

I think the food conspiracy is probobly the most harmful and worst one for all our lives. Though in this vast conspiracy our control to govern ourselves is limited in many ways, at least we do decide how we set our quality of living and food is the most important part!

READ IN DEFFENSE OF FOOD BY MICHAEL POLLAN
It starts off with this simply guidline "eat real food, not too much, mostly vegetables". And Nourishing Traditions by Sally Fallon "The cookbook that chalenges the diet dictocrats!

What a lot of absolute crap. The opposite is true. Obviously you receive cheques from the Western A. Price Foundation (anti veg propaganda outfit with vested interests in animal agriculture)? Sally Fallon, the founder of the Western A. Price Foundation, has no formal nutrition training and is not a reliable source for health information. Her despicable WAP Foundation is shown for the BS outfit that it is via the following links:

http://www.diseaseproof.com/archives/diet-myths-weston-a-price-foundation-stupid-traditions.html

http://www.diseaseproof.com/archives/dr-fuhrmans-responses-weston-price-take-your-pseudoscience-elsewhere.html

[pacoquerak]

What a lot of absolute crap. The opposite is true. Obviously you receive cheques from the Western A. Price Foundation (anti veg propaganda outfit with vested interests in animal agriculture)? Sally Fallon, the founder of the Western A. Price Foundation, has no formal nutrition training and is not a reliable source for health information. Her despicable WAP Foundation is shown for the BS outfit that it is via the following links:

http://www.diseaseproof.com/archives/diet-myths-weston-a-price-foundation-stupid-traditions.html

http://www.diseaseproof.com/archives/dr-fuhrmans-responses-weston-price-take-your-pseudoscience-elsewhere.html
holy crap i don't know where to start, i guess i have to read all of it but i just found many many problems with that this guy is claiming right from the freaking start.

first off the research this guy is sourcing is not making any distinction in saturated fat, it is only stating saturated fat, which is inherently invalid because not all saturated fat is the same. Everyone knows fried foods and processed foods are bad for you but these research documents are making no distinction of what type of saturated fat is being used in the control.


ok ok look, from the very start this guy says something slanderous. "Imagine being told to feed your child meat broth and sea salt and limiting their intake of fruits and vegetables—crazy, right? " they never ever ever EVER tell you to limit vegetables, almost all of her book is vegetable recepies, most of the meat dishes that are provided in the book... contain far less meat than other ingredients, the meat section of the book is only about an a eigth of the entire book... IT is most definatly not "Fortunately we have a comprehensive body of knowledge today with over 15,000 articles written since the 1950's documenting the link between a diet high in saturated fat and low in fresh fruits, nuts, seeds, vegetable and beans and the increase risk of cancer and heart disease. Thousands of research scientists don't agree with Barry Groves' meat-centered diet recommendations and the platform of the Weston Price Foundation."

this is misinformation, because it isn't even what they advocate, this guy is playing pretend and considering them as he choses to view them, not what they actualy are.

also, the study about eskimos in thar... is extremely flawed because it never once mentions the native diet. Why do you think eskimos get more cancer than the rest of alaskans? because they are poor as fuck and the government is giving them poisonous food for free with their "help native american plans"
Eskimos who eat the native diet almost never ever get cancer. Of course eskimos of old died early and the reason for this is evident if you know anything about their culture. They spent most of their free time chewing on carribou hides and eventuly their teeth wore down to nothing. When this happened it was their tradition that they walk by themselves out onto the ice and freeze to death.

Even you say they are anti veg, have you ever read any of it? Your position is bunk, they stress the importance of diets consisting mainly of vegetables and limiting meat intake.

and i'm not just angry about this because i read what sally fallon and weston price said, i'm angry because i have experience living from their diet recomendations for a year and this is the first year of my life that i have actualy felt healthy after being very sick for most of my life, being a vegetarian for 6 years.

I eat very very little meat, less than once a week which is really less than i would like to be eating, they are not at all pushing meat this is just a bunk argument plain and simple.

also the notion that they pull factoids from random research is also bunk, if you read the book you would find that this simply isn't true. At this time i can't waist any more of my energy debating this but i will be back.


"I know these red-meat loving nuts will claim that those statistics are of the modern Maasai, not those of years gone by, but the data is also damaging even if you bring up statistics from 20 or more years ago, when good data was collected." this guy must be joking, is he really trying to argue about something and calling his counterpart a red meat loving nut? this reminds me a lot of
david ray griffin

"I am here using the term "myth" in two senses. In one sense, a myth is an idea that, while widely believed, is false, failing to correspond with reality.

In a deeper sense, which is employed by students of religion, a myth serves as an orienting and mobilizing story for a people, a story that reminds them who they are and why they do what they do. When a story is called as a myth in this sense---which we can call Myth with a capital M---the focus is not on the story's relation to reality but on its function. This orienting and mobilizing function is possible, moreover, only because Myths with a capital M have religious overtones. Such a Myth is a Sacred Story.

However, although to note that a story functions as a Myth in the religious sense is not necessarily to deny its truth, a story cannot function as a Sacred Myth within a community or nation unless it is believed to be true. In most cases, moreover, the truth of the Myth is taken on faith. It is not a matter of debate. If some people have the bad taste to question the truth of the Sacred Story, the keepers of the faith do not enter into debate with them. Rather, they ignore them or denounce them as blasphemers."

another point, the idea that they are supporting the meat industry... they just plain don't they suggest not buying meat that isn't pastured and their is no meat industry selling pastured organic meat, it's not an industry, that's just honest working families and people.

I wonder, what industry is this man supporting? got any links to that? i am not sure how i could figure it out easily, but i wouldn't be surprised if it included whole foods or trader joes which when you really examine them closely, while atleast their providing a much higher quality food product they are also guilty in being extremely harmful to the enviroment

[fuggles]

I was just reading about this in the book Conscious Eating, by Gabriel Cousens MD.

Cousens writes how behaviour, health, and etcetera, all decline with each generation because of poor eating habits / nutrient deficient diet. This could very well be a significant reason for the current state of dumbed-down plebs and violent yobs.

Gabriel Coiusens laments that he dreads to think what people, following such injurious eating habits (cooked and animal foods), will eventually become.

How can they explain the Bible killings ? Some killing and crime is natural, its just that some of it probably is solely caused by what people have eaten.

[pacoquerak]

thinking everyone should become vegan will dumb down a serious percentage of our population, we have been eating meat since the freakin dawn of time and we have been cooking it since we had fire. Some people have adapted to get by without it while others haven't. If you try to give an eskimo a traditional western europe diet he will simply not flourish.

[Ratiocinator]

thinking everyone should become vegan will dumb down a serious percentage of our population

What an insanely bloody ignorant thing to write. The opposite is true.

we have been eating meat since the freakin dawn of time

Quite a claim. Prove it.

[pacoquerak]

What an insanely bloody ignorant thing to write. The opposite is true.



Quite a claim. Prove it.

The earliest records of vegetarianism as a concept and practice amongst a significant number of people concern ancient India[21] and the ancient Greek civilisation in Southern Italy and in Greece in the 6th century BCE.[22] In both instances the diet was closely connected with the idea of nonviolence towards animals (called ahimsa in India) and was promoted by religious groups and philosophers.[23] Following the Christianisation of the Roman Empire in late antiquity, vegetarianism practically disappeared from Europe.[24] Several orders of monks in medieval Europe restricted or banned the consumption of meat for ascetic reasons, but none of them eschewed fish.[25] Vegetarianism re-emerged somewhat in Europe during the Renaissance.[26] It became a more widespread practice in the 19th and 20th centuries.

In 1847 the first Vegetarian Society was founded in England;[27] Germany, the Netherlands and other countries followed. The International Vegetarian Union, a union of the national societies, was founded in 1908. In the Western world, the popularity of vegetarianism grew during the 20th century as a result of nutritional, ethical, and more recently, environmental and economic concerns. Today, Indian vegetarians, primarily lacto vegetarians, are estimated to make up more than 70% of the world's vegetarians. They make up 20–42% of the population in India, while less than 30% are regular meat-eaters.[28][29][30] Surveys in the U.S. have found that roughly 1–2.8% of adults eat no meat (including poultry or fish)
thanks wiki

humans have thrived on all sorts of diets, but variety is the spice of life, not extruding one particular thing.

[Ratiocinator]

Was that meant to be proof? Try harder. Actually, give up. You clearly have no idea.

[al209]

You guys should read "The metabolic Typing Diet" by william woolcot. One mans food is another mans poison, its an old saying, but basically, we are adapted to eat whatever our local environment provides

I think the current state of youth behaviour is more down to alcohol, trans fats, chemical additives and refined sugars than the meat vs vegan debate

[pacoquerak]

Was that meant to be proof? Try harder. Actually, give up. You clearly have no idea.

I will give up, your not providing an argument, you don't have ears and you won't converse. Go ahead and blindly follow without taking the whole picture into consideration.

You guys should read "The metabolic Typing Diet" by william woolcot. One mans food is another mans poison, its an old saying, but basically, we are adapted to eat whatever our local environment provides

I think the current state of youth behaviour is more down to alcohol, trans fats, chemical additives and refined sugars than the meat vs vegan debate

Determine your Metabolic Type® and receive a diet customized for your own unique metabolism in just minutes — for only $39.95

... yeah thanks i looked it up and found the website for it and i'm not so down with that but i am still interested, does this book have information on determining your own metabolic type?

I agree to some extent what you said there, but i think there has been a lot of problems with the human diet before those things came into existence. And you left out what i believe to be the worst overarching enemy of all, processed foods in general.

I would say that Sally Fallon's book if directed in one way more than most cookbooks it is leaning torwards fermenting much of the food we eat. I think this is extremely important, all of our ansesters all over the world fermented a good deal of their food and fermented foods i belive have miraculous healing properties.

cheers

[al209]

Yeah the book has a basic test, 65 questions if i remember. I know it seems a con when you can take the online test and have your results in minutes, and there are some jokers out there, but the book explains to some extent how its possible to build a picture of someones nutritional requirements from questions alone, and how blood tests etc can be misleading.

Its not really a diet book, more a science book dumbed down a bit. Wish they would write a more thorough book on the subject, but definitely worth reading. "Nutrition and physical degeneration" is another worth looking at

In the book The Naked Ape, the idea is put forward that when apes began to eat meat and fish, the fats contained within it helped the brain to grow and evolve. Not sure if its true, but it makes a good case against veganism. There are tons of arguments against meat, but most of them can be forgotten if the meat is produced naturally or are religion based. Ultimately, i think that choosing not to eat meat based on religious grounds is ridiculous, and is putting unproven belief before ones health. There are virtually no cases of vegan hunter gatherer tribes recorded. Those who ate very little meat did so because it was not readily available, and ate it when the could.

[krakhead]

I suspect the fast food modern diet is destroying young people today.

Haven't read the whole thread so I apologise if this has been mentioned.

I used to work in a prison and remember seeing some studies about violence and aggression in prisons with regards Y.O.'s

The results of the studies showed that multi-vitamins and fish-oils dramatically reduced the instances of violence.

I'd feel pretty confident in saying that the modern (Western) diet definitely has an effect for the worse in all aspects of our beings - physical, mental, spiritual.

[pacoquerak]

Yeah the book has a basic test, 65 questions if i remember. I know it seems a con when you can take the online test and have your results in minutes, and there are some jokers out there, but the book explains to some extent how its possible to build a picture of someones nutritional requirements from questions alone, and how blood tests etc can be misleading.

Its not really a diet book, more a science book dumbed down a bit. Wish they would write a more thorough book on the subject, but definitely worth reading. "Nutrition and physical degeneration" is another worth looking at

In the book The Naked Ape, the idea is put forward that when apes began to eat meat and fish, the fats contained within it helped the brain to grow and evolve. Not sure if its true, but it makes a good case against veganism. There are tons of arguments against meat, but most of them can be forgotten if the meat is produced naturally or are religion based. Ultimately, i think that choosing not to eat meat based on religious grounds is ridiculous, and is putting unproven belief before ones health. There are virtually no cases of vegan hunter gatherer tribes recorded. Those who ate very little meat did so because it was not readily available, and ate it when the could.


i have a vegan coworker and i understand a lot of where he is coming from. He did a lot of work with animals and he explains a lot about what it is like raising them. They are in many ways scimilar to people and they suffer from all the same ailments. But the difference is that say a cow lost her child in birth. The owner of the cow and the cow are going to be greatly negatively effected, but unlike with humans there is no system to help the cow, no one who is buying the milk really cares and the person raising the animal could become quite callous or extremely deperessed.

I am extremely against the meat industry and the consumption of large amounts of meat, but i think it's important that we do work with animals as they are part of our ecosystem just as much as we are. I think not having a relationship with animals is akin to removing ourselves from nature and letting go of a responsibility that we have. It's pretty hard for me to express my ideas about it.. but i really think that even eating animals can still be positive experience for both the human and the animal, it's not all horrible like so many vegans stake the claim.

i am really interested in that nutrition book, science doesnt' seem to think what we eat has to do with our genes, i don't see how they could possibly draw that conclusion. Also, I think that some people don't have to eat meat. Some people will be able to thrive without it, some can simply consume milk or eggs or even just insects, which we do allready! i believe i read that we can eat up to a gallon of spider eggs within a year, there is plenty of maggots in most canned foods, etc...etc...

animals deserve a place on this planet just as much as we do.

[al209]

i believe i read that we can eat up to a gallon of spider eggs within a year, there is plenty of maggots in most canned foods, etc...etc...

animals deserve a place on this planet just as much as we do.

LOL! where do you go shopping??

Sure animals have their place, theres no need to be cruel to them, its just that some of us are adapted to eat them. Not our fault or theirs, just the way of things.

[pacoquerak]

LOL! where do you go shopping??

Sure animals have their place, theres no need to be cruel to them, its just that some of us are adapted to eat them. Not our fault or theirs, just the way of things.

I don't shop, i grow most of my food and trade for milk and meat with people i know who raise it themselves. The usda has a legal requirment for the maximum amount of insects in canned food and believe me it's not 0. If god didn't want us to eat animals he wouldn't have made them out of meat lol...

that's a joke not serious lol

[Ratiocinator]

There are virtually no cases of vegan hunter gatherer tribes recorded.

Well there wouldn't be, would there! The clue is in the description; vegan hunter gatherer!

If what you actually mean is tribes that lived on a plant based diet, then there are plenty. You just have not looked properly.

Here is a hint: The mainstream is not going to provide you with a proper education on certain things. This is one of those things. Look deeper, and learn to clear a path through the BS.

[pacoquerak]

Well there wouldn't be, would there! The clue is in the description; vegan hunter gatherer!

If what you actually mean is tribes that lived on a plant based diet, then there are plenty. You just have not looked properly.

Here is a hint: The mainstream is not going to provide you with a proper education on certain things. This is one of those things. Look deeper, and learn to clear a path through the BS.

My lord you don't fucking get it. Most humans throughout time lived and still live on a plant based diet. He didn't say plant based diet, he said vegan...
I think theirs something fishy about vegans and the way their always trying to shut down other people pursuing health, just because your not vegan doesn't mean you can't be a health freak kk?

[Ratiocinator]

My lord you don't fucking get it. Most humans throughout time lived and still live on a plant based diet. He didn't say plant based diet, he said vegan...

And in the context of this discussion, what exactly is the difference?

So there were plenty of tribes that had a 100% plant based diet, but they would still purchase shampoo that was tested on animals?

just because your not vegan doesn't mean you can't be a health freak kk?

A pretty much inept health freak.

[pacoquerak]

And in the context of this discussion, what exactly is the difference?

So there were plenty of tribes that had a 100% plant based diet, but they would still purchase shampoo that was tested on animals?



A pretty much inept health freak.

I'M INEPT??? READ THIS WORD AGAIN PLEASE. [B]BASED[/B

base1 /beɪs/ Pronunciation Key - Show Spelled Pronunciation[beys] Pronunciation Key - Show IPA Pronunciation noun, adjective, verb, based, bas·ing.
–noun
1. the bottom support of anything; that on which a thing stands or rests: a metal base for the table.
2. a fundamental principle or groundwork; foundation; basis: the base of needed reforms.
3. the bottom layer or coating, as of makeup or paint.
4. Architecture.
a. the distinctively treated portion of a column or pier below the shaft or shafts.
b. the distinctively treated lowermost portion of any construction, as a monument, exterior wall, etc.
5. Botany, Zoology.
a. the part of an organ nearest its point of attachment.
b. the point of attachment.
6. the principal element or ingredient of anything, considered as its fundamental part: face cream with a lanolin base; paint with a lead base.
7. that from which a commencement, as of action or reckoning, is made; a starting point or point of departure.


Please try to learn the meaning of words before you use them while calling other people inept. Plant based means that most of what you eat is plants, you can be plant based and still eat meat... You argumentative ignoramus.

Realize what i am advocating, instead of making shit up to back yourself, your simply no longer stating a case.

[endlessvista]

Vegans are nearly always nasty, intolerant, closed-minded people from the ones I have encountered. Vegan women tend to have dry brittle hair, poor skin and sexual intercourse always requires using a lubricant as their vaginas tend to be always dry.

They always have wild mood swings around their menstrual cycles which usually results in why vegan women having no successful relationships for the most part.

Vegans tend to live in this deluded world were their own personal and emotional lives falling to bits and they always have colds that never end and other health issues, but at the same time constantly lecture all others on how meat is destroying our lives and health. It's really weird. I have seen no proof that vegans, live longer happier and more successful live than people who eat some meat. Very much the opposite from what I have come across.

I think eating some whole grains, some free range meat and LOTS of organic veg is the best diet for humans.

[Ratiocinator]

This forum used to be so much better, before the infiltration.

[deafbred]

food

i heard talk of soul food

i think thats what were lacking

[pacoquerak]

Vegans are nearly always nasty, intolerant, closed-minded people from the ones I have encountered. Vegan women tend to have dry brittle hair, poor skin and sexual intercourse always requires using a lubricant as their vaginas tend to be always dry.

They always have wild mood swings around their menstrual cycles which usually results in why vegan women having no successful relationships for the most part.

Vegans tend to live in this deluded world were their own personal and emotional lives falling to bits and they always have colds that never end and other health issues, but at the same time constantly lecture all others on how meat is destroying our lives and health. It's really weird. I have seen no proof that vegans, live longer happier and more successful live than people who eat some meat. Very much the opposite from what I have come across.


I think eating some whole grains, some free range meat and LOTS of organic veg is the best diet for humans.

I do know 3 rather healthy vegans that don't fit that extremely scathing description by any long shot perfectly but i definatly think they do fit in their a bit. I have met many who are far closer to your description. I think some people must be suited atleast to an almost vegan diet and some people can handle it much better than others, also that to be vegan even in people who possibly could be healthily takes a great amount of effort to get everything your body needs including living in a tropical climate with lots of plant based saturated fats available or by shipping them overseas.

thanks for your remarks, i kinda think that the marketing of our diet is pretty much one of the biggest conspiracies out there and i was fear most of the people pursuing the truth are missing this thing altogether! Appreciated!


food

i heard talk of soul food

i think thats what were lacking

what exactly do you mean?

I for one get a great feeling from eating the fruits of my labor, is that soulful enough?

[al209]

Vegan women tend to have dry brittle hair, poor skin and sexual intercourse always requires using a lubricant as their vaginas tend to be always dry.

Hahahaha thats some funny shit! You must have a lot of experience of vegan vaginas then yeah?


Paco, this is the only test you want to be doing for Metabolic Typing: https://www.metabolictypingonline.com/Default.aspx
I would really recommend you research it as much as you can, and dont be swayed by the sites which jump on the bandwagon

personally, i can eat fruit and veg and grain til its coming out my ears and still be hungry. Vegan diets simply do not work for me, what my body craves is fat and protein, and theres no better source than good old murder. I have no problem with that, my problem is with the mistreating of the animals while alive. There is a difference.

[krakhead]

Vegans are nearly always nasty, intolerant, closed-minded people from the ones I have encountered. Vegan women tend to have dry brittle hair, poor skin and sexual intercourse always requires using a lubricant as their vaginas tend to be always dry.

They always have wild mood swings around their menstrual cycles which usually results in why vegan women having no successful relationships for the most part.

Vegans tend to live in this deluded world were their own personal and emotional lives falling to bits and they always have colds that never end and other health issues, but at the same time constantly lecture all others on how meat is destroying our lives and health. It's really weird. I have seen no proof that vegans, live longer happier and more successful live than people who eat some meat. Very much the opposite from what I have come across.

I think eating some whole grains, some free range meat and LOTS of organic veg is the best diet for humans.

So, let me get this clear - you're not a vegan are you?

And neither's your missus?

Wow! Check me! The new Derek Acora!

"Thank you Sam"

:D

[northern_light]

Vegans are nearly always nasty
Well, I'm not.

intolerant
I'm not in most cases. ( I support the saying: "Do what you like as long as it doesn't hurt anyone else")
closed-minded people
Pretty sure I wouldn't be here if I was.
Vegan women tend to have dry brittle hair, poor skin and sexual intercourse always requires using a lubricant as their vaginas tend to be always dry.
Well, I'm no woman, but I have pretty nice hair, ok skin and my package is more than fine.
They always have wild mood swings around their menstrual cycles which usually results in why vegan women having no successful relationships for the most part. I know a lady who doesn't eat meat, been happily married for over 10 years.

Vegans tend to live in this deluded world were their own personal and emotional lives falling to bits
How ironic, sounds like Bill O'Reilly when he's talking about "conspiracy nuts".

and they always have colds that never end and other health issues
Haven't had a cold, a headache or any other illness since I stopped eating meat. Only improved health, a more balanced mood and a clearer mind. Wierd huh?

but at the same time constantly lecture all others on how meat is destroying our lives and health.
I have never lectured anyone, maybe pointed to some documentaries and answered some questions for some curious people. In fact, when someone finds out I don't eat animals, it is I who get lectured. Friends, family and the random internet warrior, all want to tell me about protein, traditions, the circle of life etc. Because, guess what? It's just "NOT NORMAL" to not eat meat.

destroying our lives
I can't talk for all vegans/vegetarians, (as I don't believe an individual can speak for other people just because they happen to be given the same label by someone else.) but my motivation comes mainly from the unwilligness to destroy others lives. I.e The billions of animals being treated as mere commodities while enduring terrible pain in places resembling concentration camps. I find the view that animals are resources to be consumed extremely grotesque, not to mention the enormous paradox that becomes evident when I spend time with animals and wish them nothing but the best, while at the same time another animal's dead body is being presented to me as food.

It's really weird. I have seen no proof that vegans, live longer happier and more successful live than people who eat some meat. Very much the opposite from what I have come across. I don't know about life longevity, as I haven't looked into much research on the area, but it is a proven fact that avoiding animal flesh prevents and even reverses heart disease, wich is one of the most common death causes in todays society. Personally I don't want to live 100 years in this body just so I can end up lieing in a bed crapping in diapers, relying on pills and nurses to do my daily activities.

happier and more successful
This cannot be measured, it is totally subjective.

I think eating some whole grains, some free range meat and LOTS of organic veg is the best diet for humans
http://www.humanemyth.org/

There are all sorts of different people within the same "groups".
Stereotyping simply has no validity.

[pacoquerak]

I don't know about life longevity, as I haven't looked into much research on the area, but it is a proven fact that avoiding animal flesh prevents and even reverses heart disease, wich is one of the most common death causes in todays society. Personally I don't want to live 100 years in this body just so I can end up lieing in a bed crapping in diapers, relying on pills and nurses to do my daily activities.


that's not really true, but your close. It has been shown in studies that reducing animal intake lowers the risk of heart disease however. There are also studies that point to vegetable oils increasing the risk of heart disease.
I agree just as much if not more about the horrors of the animal production system, but it's not just the way they are treated, but how they are purpously raised in such a way to make their product harmful and even toxic to our bodies.

Anyone should know by now that it is untrue that you need animal protein, i contend there are other things people need from animal products. People used to live far older than 100 without nurses and diapers or pills and believe you me, those people ate meat. I don't think it's impossible at all to be vegan, but i do agree with endlessvista to a great extent about a lot of vegans i have met and to a small extent all of them i have met. I think the most critical time for animal products is the younger you are, please please people don't think you can give your child a vegan alternative to breast milk, this is simply untrue. If you can't give your child breast milk, the only possible healthy alternative is a raw milk based formula. It really is true that much of our minds require animal fats in their development, most especialy in infancy.

I do think their is something fishy about many vegans and vegetarians, they seem to make up a large percentage of the health food community and spread the myth that you can only aquire perfect health in the absence of meat. This is just untrue. In fact i find it to be the opposite of the truth.

ima just throw a random example out there for the shit of it. John the baptist was suposed to have not eaten animals, though he ate locusts. Perfectly great solution in my humble opinion, who the heck cares about bugs that much they can't eat them? I think people are just grosed out by the idea of eating insects, I really gotta say i feel just as bad picking and eating a plant or a mushroom as i do a grasshopper i find eating my crops...