Define Satanism

[empyblessing]

What is Satanism? Is it the LaVey, Church of Satan definition? Is there a difference between Satanism and Luciferianism? What is YOUR personal definition of a Satanist?

[eternal_spirit]

Someone who follows the teachings of Crowley? ( labeled by some as the father of modern day satanism ) Who thinks they'll gain enlightenment, may actually find themselves in some very dark places....
EDIT

Lavey uses much of Crowley's ideas. High Freemasonry worship lucifer so do the sinogogue of Satan

[eternal_spirit]

From SATANIC EXTRACTS, by Aleister Crowley:

The Oath of Fealty

I bind my blood in Satan's hands,

All this that lieth betwixt my hands

To thee, the Beast, and thy control,

I pledge me; body, mind, and soul.

does that seem to imply that Crowley not only believed SATAN but he also served him?[/quote]

.............
Pledge

I swear to work my Work abhorred,

Careless of all but one reward,

The pleasure of the Devil our Lord

[eternal_spirit]

quote:king ( a man who knew the score )

let me illustrate this for you:



this entity http://www.bob-wonderland.supanet.com/aiwass.jpg
Aiwass

dictated The Book of the Law to

http://library.thinkquest.org/05aug/00158/images/crowley1.jpg

this man

then

http://media.dare2share.org/images/worldviews/satanist.jpg
http://i23.photobucket.com/albums/b371/heksenland/x1pAdjo0uCo2H27ZZ22lO7P5P6A4BVwlQDg.jpg

those who dabble in to satanism and witchcraft



follow their blind leader thinking that they will see

Quote:
http://www.firstscience.com/home/images/legacygallery/light.jpg (http://www.firstscience.com/home/images/legacygallery/light.jpg)

the light

but, it does not work that way

they are not only deceived, but they are mocked by Crowley, because he hates their guts, as they are just the followers.

meanwhile Crowley dies as

http://www.addictionca.com/images/Heroin12.jpg


a heroin addict

but thousands of new followers keep following
http://www.halfmassive.com/images/images/MIndless-Sightless-Cover-72.gif

and defend Crowley without even understanding that he hated their guts

Quote:



The Book of the Law is the central sacred text of Thelema, written (or received) by Aleister Crowley in Cairo, Egypt in the year 1904. It contains three chapters, each of which was written down in one hour, beginning at noon, on April 8, April 9, and April 10. [1] Crowley claims that the author was an entity named Aiwass, whom he later referred to as his personal Holy Guardian Angel (or "Secret Self").
would you love to have "personal Holy Guardian Angel " that looks like this:
http://www.bob-wonderland.supanet.com/aiwass.jpg (http://www.bob-wonderland.supanet.com/aiwass.jpg)

[marpat]

Someone who follows the teachings of Crowley? ( labeled by some as the father of modern day satanism ) Who thinks they'll gain enlightenment, may actually find themselves in some very dark places....
EDIT

Lavey uses much of Crowley's ideas. High Freemasonry worship lucifer so do the sinogogue of Satan


Poor, really poor. Again you try to make a statement without using any knowledge. First you have to define what satan is in itself before you accuse people of being evil satanists.

Give us an actual definition from it's roots.

I would say that satan is not the source of evil but that man is. Satan tests souls for weakness. Read the book of Job if you can take five minutes to look at the Old Testament.
The trouble is that people don't want to admit their own evil doing and it is too convenient to blame it on the devil, to have a scapegoat.

ES, you speak of people dabbling in occultism but you admitted that you yourself dabbled in occultism, so I detect double standards here. Also, in this forum you will find many 'truthseekers' who admit using drugs often (there are some threads on it) so by condemning Crowley for drug use you are also condemning your fellow 'truthseekers'. I don't know if your pic of a heroine addict is relevant to Crowley as I don't think people were injecting it back then.

I see you have put some work into that post in order to make it as negative as possible but you only show your own bias.

[eternal_spirit]

It's most probable that Crowley made up the story about LAM ( the alien ) and Aiwas the channelings and automatic writings which where the basis of the Book of Law. It's part of the New Age religion and the culture creators games, which they want you us to follow, because this stuff comes from the top and is pushed on us as part of our culture.

Michael Aquino X member of church of Satan he formed the Temple of SET, he was head of psychological warfare department in the USA Military and bragged about mind control via electronic devices one way was TV, and there's a load of pro satanic propaganda sites on the Internet and books to programme you, this would relate to his role and title in the Military.

[eternal_spirit]

Synagogue ( original spelling) of Satan maybe related to the Jewish ritual sacrafices in the Synogogues.
Although there is a modern day Satanic sinogogue of Satan

our High Priest,
Rev. Michael S. Margolin
The Mad Poet Acbhb
Frater Inferior
Baphomet Rex 666

http://www.sosatan.org/rex.jpg (http://www.sosatan.org/rex.jpg)

“The true name of Satan, the Kabalists say, is that of Yahveh reversed; for Satan is not a black God, but the negation of God. The Devil is the personification of Atheism or Idolatry. For the Initiates, this is not a person, but a force, created for good, but which may serve for evil. It is the instrument of Liberty or free will. They represent this Force, which presides over the physical generation, under the mythologic and horned form of the God Pan; thence the he-goat of the Sabbat, brother of the Ancient Serpent, and the light bearer or Phosphor, of which the poets have made the false Lucifer of the legend.”
- Albert Pike “Morals and Dogma“ Ancient and Accepted Rite of Free Masonry written and published in 1875.


"Hate those that earn it, as you would love those that earn it, As Above, so below."
"When the world is viewed with no set reality, the lies of society are revealed and the bonds of slavery, broken."
- Rev. Michael S. Margolin
They have website link below



In the interview Rosenthal admits that their God is Lucifer, There's another connection to Satanism, Satan being Lucifer on Earth, with his dominion of Fallen Angels who became the Demons of Demonology of the Kabbalah.
Like I've been pointing out in some other posts, is anti-christ.

[marpat]

It's most probable that Crowley made up the story about LAM ( the alien ) and Aiwas the channelings and automatic writings which where the basis of the Book of Law. It's part of the New Age religion and the culture creators games, which they want you us to follow, because this stuff comes from the top and is pushed on us as part of our culture.
Michael Aquino X member of church of Satan he formed the Temple of SET, he was head of psychological warfare department in the USA Military and bragged about mind control via electronic devices one way was TV, and there's a load of pro satanic propaganda sites on the Internet and books to programme you, this would relate to his role and title in the Military.

You could easily say that it is probably that David Icke made up his channeled information, or David Wilcock. Everything you say as an attack on Crowley there could be used against David Icke.

I see you are still incapable of giving a good definition of satanism. Instead you still just post up information of what other people are calling satanism. Get off the fence and let us hear your definition.

[eternal_spirit]

I hereby promise the Great Spirit Lucifer, Prince of Demons, that each year I will bring unto him a human soul to do with as as it may please him, and in return Lucifer promises to bestow upon me the treasures of the earth and fulfil my every desire for the length of my natural life. If I fail to bring him each year the offering specified above, then my own soul shall be forfeit to him. Signed..... { Invocant signs pact with his own blood }"--the "Illustrious" Manly Palmer Hall 33°, _The Secret Teachings of All Ages_

quoting a ritual from the book The Complete Book of Magic Science by Francis Barrett:

[marpat]

I hereby promise the Great Spirit Lucifer, Prince of Demons, that each year I will bring unto him a human soul to do with as as it may please him, and in return Lucifer promises to bestow upon me the treasures of the earth and fulfil my every desire for the length of my natural life. If I fail to bring him each year the offering specified above, then my own soul shall be forfeit to him. Signed..... { Invocant signs pact with his own blood }"--the "Illustrious" Manly Palmer Hall 33°, _The Secret Teachings of All Ages_

quoting a ritual from the book The Complete Book of Magic Science by Francis Barrett:

Still lacking a definition. Perhaps you should read the thread title. I suspect that you cannot actually define what satan is and therefore all of your posts mean nothing. Isn't Lucifer the light bringer? I thought Lucifuge was the baddy.

[eternal_spirit]

You could easily say that it is probably that David Icke made up his channeled information, or David Wilcock. Everything you say as an attack on Crowley there could be used against David Icke.

I see you are still incapable of giving a good definition of satanism. Instead you still just post up information of what other people are calling satanism. Get off the fence and let us hear your definition.

..................

Showing your true colours ( black no light ) all the people you named don't tell us to do sick magick rituals etc etc etc, nor do they worship satan/lucifer, or try summons up demons. BIG difference to what Crowley high ranked Freemason was and advocates his followers to do!

No I actually tell it like it is and don't lie, that's the difference. You wanna push some lies and paint a pretty picture about what you want us to believe it is about, then you're in the wrong place.

Afterall maybe you have more in common with Aquino, don't you work for the military ( electronics/engineer? ) Mind control? If not....you're pushing the satanic agenda and scum like Crowley et al, which is what Aquino does (psychological warfare) in part is about implanting beliefs in the minds of the people/victims.

Much of what I've posted so far in this thread comes from Crowley's and other NWO players own books and words. So, if that's not proof, and you whine like the sissy you are it proof you're a liar.

[eternal_spirit]

The gods of the mystery schools were invariably connected to human sacrifice and it was these very schools which have, via the now global Brotherhood and Satanism networks, carried the knowledge and the rituals into the present day. The Incas of Peru sacrificed children and human sacrifice was practiced from the earliest days in Europe. One Druid ritual was to bury a child under the foundations of a new building or to sprinkle the child’s blood on the site.

quote: David Icke
The ritual names for the ‘demons’ are still the same today as those used in the ancient world and by later groups like the Templars. Confirmation of this comes from a stream of accounts by modern victims of Satanism. A friend of mine, the British therapist, Vera Diamond, has been working for nearly 20 years with people who have been subjected to Satanic and mind control abuse. She says:
“Children say the word Satan is used more frequently than any other, but other demons include Baphomet and Behemoth. Molech (Moloch) seems to be one particularly associated with eating babies, and one called Choronzon. These do seem to be particularly involved with sacrificing babies.”10

[krakhead]

Well done ES for hi-jacking a thread that could have been interesting :(

I don't know if your pic of a heroine addict is relevant to Crowley as I don't think people were injecting it back then.

Just FYI, morphine was used IV following the invention of the the hypodermic needle in 1853, I think it'd be safe to assume that IV heroin use was quickly undertaken following it's synthesis in 1874.

And in answer to the thread (well someone has to!) Satan, for me, has no more power or relevance than a 'boogie-man' character in a bed-time story.

An interesting archetype, he can have power if you choose to give it to him, same as any other archetypal figure.

But he does make the best music! ;)

[marpat]

..................

Showing your true colours ( black no light ) all the people you named don't tell us to do sick magick rituals etc etc etc, nor do they worship satan/lucifer, or try summons up demons. BIG difference to what Crowley high ranked Freemason was and advocates his followers to do!

No I actually tell it like it is and don't lie, that's the difference. You wanna push some lies and paint a pretty picture about what you want us to believe it is about, then you're in the wrong place.

Afterall maybe you have more in common with Aquino, don't you work for the military ( electronics/engineer? ) Mind control? If not....you're pushing the satanic agenda and scum like Crowley et al, which is what Aquino does (psychological warfare) in part is about implanting beliefs in the minds of the people/victims.

Much of what I've posted so far in this thread comes from Crowley's and other NWO players own books and words. So, if that's not proof, and you whine like the sissy you are it proof you're a liar.



So what is your definition of satan and satanism? you're still on the fence here.

How do you know what the difference between Crowley and Icke are? have you met either? all you have to go on are loads of links, and some really biased ones at that.

The thing is that even if you took a direct quote from Crowley you could put it into the wrong context, or there is a good chance that because you don't know what he is saying that you will misunderstand, which is not uncommon.

Crowley can't be that bad, he got onto a Beattles album cover.

Do you know what Crowley was trying to achieve when summoning demons? do you know what his definition of a demon is? you can't be bothered to define what satan is let alone what a demon is, so how can you be expected to show any knowledge on a subject when you have no knowledge or experience.

[marpat]

The gods of the mystery schools were invariably connected to human sacrifice and it was these very schools which have, via the now global Brotherhood and Satanism networks, carried the knowledge and the rituals into the present day. The Incas of Peru sacrificed children and human sacrifice was practiced from the earliest days in Europe. One Druid ritual was to bury a child under the foundations of a new building or to sprinkle the child’s blood on the site.

quote: David Icke
The ritual names for the ‘demons’ are still the same today as those used in the ancient world and by later groups like the Templars. Confirmation of this comes from a stream of accounts by modern victims of Satanism. A friend of mine, the British therapist, Vera Diamond, has been working for nearly 20 years with people who have been subjected to Satanic and mind control abuse. She says:
“Children say the word Satan is used more frequently than any other, but other demons include Baphomet and Behemoth. Molech (Moloch) seems to be one particularly associated with eating babies, and one called Choronzon. These do seem to be particularly involved with sacrificing babies.”10









I think the quotes you are using here are crap. David Icke has a 'friend' who apparently worked in that field and the weird thing is that all the stuff they come up with is just so stereotypical.

A lot of the stereotype stuff comes from people like the church who demonised every country and culture so that they could impose their 'nice' religion onto those people. The reports of Druid practices were from Julius Ceaser, who was their enemy so he would hardly say nice things. The Romans tried to make their enemies look bad so that they could go and 'civilise' them

[meave]

i thought when it come to it there is no evil and good to different side of the same coin, matter antimatter, personal choice each to thier own path and no own path is wrong as it all comes from the same source:confused:

[marpat]

i thought when it come to it there is no evil and good to different side of the same coin, matter antimatter, personal choice each to thier own path and no own path is wrong as it all comes from the same source:confused:


Exactly, but some people are completely unable to grasp such a simple concept.

[meave]

Exactly, but some people are completely unable to grasp such a simple concept.

it sad and very negitive i'm feed up with i'm right your wrong and i have to admit i have done this it just distrating from learning from one another

[eternal_spirit]

Exactly, but some people are completely unable to grasp such a simple concept.

.......................

So why are there many documented cases of the most foul murders committed in the honour and name of Satan and his minions of demons? Some lying idots just can't seem to get a grasp of reality.

[marpat]

.......................

So why are there many documented cases of the most foul murders committed in the honour and name of Satan and his minions of demons? Some lying idots just can't seem to get a grasp of reality.



I could kill somebody in the name of Jimmy Hendrix but that does not mean the ghost of Mr Hendrix had any part in the killing. Get the point?

I think you are too easily swayed by the MSM

[eternal_spirit]

quote: David Icke


Chronos was the father of Zeus who survived because his mother hid him from her child-killing husband. Zeus later waged a victorious war against his father and other Titans and then ruled as the King of Gods over a dynasty awash with child sacrifice. As you connect the different peoples across the generations, so you find the same themes of human sacrifice. The Cannanite-Hebrews were seriously into the sacrifice of humans and animals, much as their spin doctors have tried to deny it over the years.

The Satanists among the ‘Jewish’ hierarchy today still perform the same rituals while the mass of the Jewish people worldwide have no idea that this is so. Stories throughout the centuries to the present day of the sacrifice of children by Jewish fanatics at the time of the Passover can be seen to have an historical basis when you realize the true meaning of the Passover.

It had nothing to do with ‘God ’ passing over the homes of Israelite children and killing only the first born Egyptians. This is more symbolism that only an initiate or a determined researcher would understand. Records from the 8th and 7th centuries BC, show that the Israelites burned their sons on sacrificial fires in the Valley of Gehinnon outside Jerusalem.11 The infants were said to have been “passed over” or “passed through” the fire in sacrifice to Moloch-Baal.

In the Book of Leviticus we find the line: “Thou shalt not let any of thy seed pass through the fire to Moloch”. The prophet Jeremiah talks of the people: “burning their sons in the fire as burnt offerings unto Baal” and also in the Book of Jeremiah we are told that:
“They have built the high places of Tophet, which is in the Valley of Hinnon, to burn their sons and daughters in the fire...”
John Milton also wrote of Moloch in his Paradise Lost:
“First Moloch, horrid king, besmirched with blood,
Of human sacrifice, and parent’s tears,
Though, for the noise of drums and timbrels loud,
Their children’s cries unheard, that passed through fire,
To his grim idol.”
The Old Testament abounds with stories of animal and human sacrifice. The same symbolism can be seen in a stream of ancient texts about the sacrifice of the first born or young children. The Jesus story includes this theme also, of course. At it’s most extreme, the Jewish dogma is deeply sacrificial. Their temples were slaughterhouses with a constant supply of animals taken there for ritual murder and sacrifice.

Look at the Jewish form of killing animals to this today. Meat is only considered ‘kosher’ if the animal has its throat cut and dies by being bled dry. The same with the ‘halal ’ meat of the Muslims. Through the Brotherhood bloodlines the ancient rituals have been strictly maintained and the ruling Elite today are sacrificing children and drinking blood the same as they did in the ancient world.

[krakhead]

.......................

So why are there many documented cases of the most foul murders committed in the honour and name of Satan and his minions of demons? Some lying idots just can't seem to get a grasp of reality.


Satan's just the name they use, the scapegoat to excuse their actions! I could murder someone in in the honour and name of Jerry Garcia - does that make him evil?

[eternal_spirit]

Well done ES for hi-jacking a thread that could have been interesting :(

...................

It's most interesting to see the satanists ( or pro Satanists and Crowley followers ) crawl out the wood work. If you support scum and follow evil sock minds you may soon become alike.

[krakhead]

Satan's just the name they use, the scapegoat to excuse their actions! I could murder someone in in the honour and name of Jerry Garcia - does that make him evil?

I could kill somebody in the name of Jimmy Hendrix but that does not mean the ghost of Mr Hendrix had any part in the killing. Get the point?

Lol! Classic Rock guitarist overload! ;)

[marpat]

quote: David Icke


Chronos was the father of Zeus who survived because his mother hid him from her child-killing husband. Zeus later waged a victorious war against his father and other Titans and then ruled as the King of Gods over a dynasty awash with child sacrifice. As you connect the different peoples across the generations, so you find the same themes of human sacrifice. The Cannanite-Hebrews were seriously into the sacrifice of humans and animals, much as their spin doctors have tried to deny it over the years.

The Satanists among the ‘Jewish’ hierarchy today still perform the same rituals while the mass of the Jewish people worldwide have no idea that this is so. Stories throughout the centuries to the present day of the sacrifice of children by Jewish fanatics at the time of the Passover can be seen to have an historical basis when you realize the true meaning of the Passover.

It had nothing to do with ‘God ’ passing over the homes of Israelite children and killing only the first born Egyptians. This is more symbolism that only an initiate or a determined researcher would understand. Records from the 8th and 7th centuries BC, show that the Israelites burned their sons on sacrificial fires in the Valley of Gehinnon outside Jerusalem.11 The infants were said to have been “passed over” or “passed through” the fire in sacrifice to Moloch-Baal.

In the Book of Leviticus we find the line: “Thou shalt not let any of thy seed pass through the fire to Moloch”. The prophet Jeremiah talks of the people: “burning their sons in the fire as burnt offerings unto Baal” and also in the Book of Jeremiah we are told that:
“They have built the high places of Tophet, which is in the Valley of Hinnon, to burn their sons and daughters in the fire...”
John Milton also wrote of Moloch in his Paradise Lost:
“First Moloch, horrid king, besmirched with blood,
Of human sacrifice, and parent’s tears,
Though, for the noise of drums and timbrels loud,
Their children’s cries unheard, that passed through fire,
To his grim idol.”
The Old Testament abounds with stories of animal and human sacrifice. The same symbolism can be seen in a stream of ancient texts about the sacrifice of the first born or young children. The Jesus story includes this theme also, of course. At it’s most extreme, the Jewish dogma is deeply sacrificial. Their temples were slaughterhouses with a constant supply of animals taken there for ritual murder and sacrifice.

Look at the Jewish form of killing animals to this today. Meat is only considered ‘kosher’ if the animal has its throat cut and dies by being bled dry. The same with the ‘halal ’ meat of the Muslims. Through the Brotherhood bloodlines the ancient rituals have been strictly maintained and the ruling Elite today are sacrificing children and drinking blood the same as they did in the ancient world.


Are you quoting mythology and the bible as if it were facts?

Don't you think they may bleed the meat as some old form of food hygiene?

You are still sitting on the fence an refusing to give a definition. Is that beyond your ability?

[krakhead]

If you support scum and follow evil sock minds you may soon become alike.

You mean sock minds like -

http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/7460/sockux2.th.jpg (http://img237.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sockux2.jpg)

;)

Sorry! Just being facetious. :p

[marpat]

You mean sock minds like -

http://img237.imageshack.us/img237/7460/sockux2.th.jpg (http://img237.imageshack.us/my.php?image=sockux2.jpg)

;)

Sorry! Just being facetious. :p

Reptilian sock puppet, love it :D

[empyblessing]

It's not as simple as saying this is Satanism here. There appear many schools of thought of Satanism. After reading some of the Synagogue of Satan's website (and having a freak power outage part way through) I found that their denouncement of all religion to be compelling. I was lead to the idea that SOS was not so much worship of dark spiritual beings but anti-religion, including their own.

I believe that there is a sect of what could be defined as Satanism in what the Elite and Masons practice. Or it is perhaps that they are the true Satanists and the Church of Satan would just be a front organizations, something akin to the Blue Degrees in Freemasonry.

I know that Crowley studied the Tao Te Ching. I too have studied the text at length in both English and Mandarin and have found it the most compelling book I've ever read. Wise as anything I've seen. It's as beautiful as poetry. Many of the principles and philosophies support my own and apparently Crowley borrowed from it and in turn so too did the Church of Satan.

David Wilcock described a non-dualistic philosophy as what the Elite practice and called it Luciferianism. It is not however, as Taoism is not a dualistic belief. This can be argued as there are many forms of Taoism and many interpretations of Tao Te Ching, but I'm not going into them here. The point being that some of the beliefs of Satanism aren't of Satanism.

We can see obviously that there is a huge separation between the Satanism portrayed openly and what is actually practiced. They are so distinct as to be completely different. While the Church of Satan and Synagogue of Satan appear to be strictly anti-religion, what is called the Temple of Set is just another religion. Luciferianism is not Satanism. Luciferianism has it's own gods, rituals, and forms of worship. The hierarchal workings may have established the COS and SOS as potential recruiting grounds into the higher religions. It's possible though that the two may be completely separate entities.

Satanism is a paradox it seems. The definition needs readjusted. It's so far obscured that I don't think ES and Marpat are even discussing the same thing.

[eternal_spirit]

1985 San Francisco, CA On 6-15-85 police recovered the body of “John Doe #60" from an auto salvage yard. The man had been tortured and sexually abused over a period of several days before his killers finally cut a gash in his perineal area causing him to slowly bleed to death. A pentagram had been carved into his chest and there was black candle wax present in his hair and right eye socket. The break in the case came from responding to a disturbing the peace call 9 days later. Two patrolmen arrived at the residence of Clifford St. Joseph in the middle of a homosexual S & M Satanic ritual with 3 friends. Clifford St. Joseph had no apparent connection to the Church of Satan, but did have connections to the O.T.O., (which had an 11th homosexual degree). Rather than a nude female altar, a 19 y.o. male was bound and stripped naked inside a circle of black candles on the floor & being whipped and assaulted, and fortunately the cops arrival prevented him from being John Doe #61. Paramedics rushed him to a rape center where he later recounted Clifford had met him at a gay bar, later drugged him and held him prisoner, where he was repeatedly assaulted by he and Maurice Bork, and other Satanists who dropped by for the event. The participants were all dressed in black robes, a human skull with a black candle adorned the mantel, and The Satanic Bible was being used in the proceedings. Bork later jumped bail, but was recaptured after an armed robbery in 1987. Bork admitted to participating in the killing of John Doe #60 during a Satanic Ritual, in which the victim’s blood was collected in a gold chalice and drunk as a toast to Satan. Clifford St. Joseph was convicted of first degree murder and received 25 years to life. The other unidentified participants were never caught, and still remain at large. Anyone with any information should contact the SFPD.

[meave]

Are you quoting mythology and the bible as if it were facts?

Don't you think they may bleed the meat as some old form of food hygiene?

You are still sitting on the fence an refusing to give a definition. Is that beyond your ability?

yes but es has appolgised so let get back to the discussion

is satan the same as lucifer as my under standing of lucifer is the brightest star in heaven the morning star venus

[empyblessing]

FFS! ES, RESIZE your fucking text before you copy and paste your arguments.

[marpat]

1985 San Francisco, CA On 6-15-85 police recovered the body of “John Doe #60" from an auto salvage yard. The man had been tortured and sexually abused over a period of several days before his killers finally cut a gash in his perineal area causing him to slowly bleed to death. A pentagram had been carved into his chest and there was black candle wax present in his hair and right eye socket. The break in the case came from responding to a disturbing the peace call 9 days later. Two patrolmen arrived at the residence of Clifford St. Joseph in the middle of a homosexual S & M Satanic ritual with 3 friends. Clifford St. Joseph had no apparent connection to the Church of Satan, but did have connections to the O.T.O., (which had an 11th homosexual degree). Rather than a nude female altar, a 19 y.o. male was bound and stripped naked inside a circle of black candles on the floor & being whipped and assaulted, and fortunately the cops arrival prevented him from being John Doe #61. Paramedics rushed him to a rape center where he later recounted Clifford had met him at a gay bar, later drugged him and held him prisoner, where he was repeatedly assaulted by he and Maurice Bork, and other Satanists who dropped by for the event. The participants were all dressed in black robes, a human skull with a black candle adorned the mantel, and The Satanic Bible was being used in the proceedings. Bork later jumped bail, but was recaptured after an armed robbery in 1987. Bork admitted to participating in the killing of John Doe #60 during a Satanic Ritual, in which the victim’s blood was collected in a gold chalice and drunk as a toast to Satan. Clifford St. Joseph was convicted of first degree murder and received 25 years to life. The other unidentified participants were never caught, and still remain at large. Anyone with any information should contact the SFPD.


This is false because the 11th degree is not specifically homoerotic. This is what fools think it is but the facts are different.

And what were the connections to the OTO? perhaps he had applied for membership but was rejected or just happened to know a member. See what I mean you post a link with crap but all it shows is how the press use hysteria to get make money. You are a real puppet.

Oh they got the skulls and everything, sounds nasty. I think this is just hype.

Do you get your news articles from the Sport?

[krakhead]

1985 San Francisco, CA On 6-15-85 police recovered the body of “John Doe #60" from an auto salvage yard. The man had been tortured and sexually abused over a period of several days before his killers finally cut a gash in his perineal area causing him to slowly bleed to death. A pentagram had been carved into his chest and there was black candle wax present in his hair and right eye socket. The break in the case came from responding to a disturbing the peace call 9 days later. Two patrolmen arrived at the residence of Clifford St. Joseph in the middle of a homosexual S & M Satanic ritual with 3 friends. Clifford St. Joseph had no apparent connection to the Church of Satan, but did have connections to the O.T.O., (which had an 11th homosexual degree). Rather than a nude female altar, a 19 y.o. male was bound and stripped naked inside a circle of black candles on the floor & being whipped and assaulted, and fortunately the cops arrival prevented him from being John Doe #61. Paramedics rushed him to a rape center where he later recounted Clifford had met him at a gay bar, later drugged him and held him prisoner, where he was repeatedly assaulted by he and Maurice Bork, and other Satanists who dropped by for the event. The participants were all dressed in black robes, a human skull with a black candle adorned the mantel, and The Satanic Bible was being used in the proceedings. Bork later jumped bail, but was recaptured after an armed robbery in 1987. Bork admitted to participating in the killing of John Doe #60 during a Satanic Ritual, in which the victim’s blood was collected in a gold chalice and drunk as a toast to Satan. Clifford St. Joseph was convicted of first degree murder and received 25 years to life. The other unidentified participants were never caught, and still remain at large. Anyone with any information should contact the SFPD.

Cut and paste away, stories of idiots who wear black robes and commit murder are all well and good but, WHAT DOES SATAN MEAN TO YOU? Not - What do you think of Aleister Crowley and how many stories can you find regarding fools committing crimes in the name of an idea theyhad?

[eternal_spirit]

quote: David Icke

Also, as many of the victims have said, they themselves are drugged and programmed to take part in the ritual murder and torture of other children. This is videoed and played back to them when they are in a conscious state. They are so horrified at what they have done and so terrified of the consequences that they dare not speak to the authorities. Other techniques to prevent exposure include abusing children while wearing a Mickey Mouse face or a Devil’s head.
When little children say they were abused by Mickey Mouse or the Devil it makes them even less likely to be believed. One woman who contacted me said that her father sexually abused her while wearing a Devil’s head and it was a long time before she realized that her father was responsible. The stories of the people I have talked to, and the accounts of others I have read, tell of events that are beyond comprehension or, at least, they would be if they were not actually happening.

Drinking blood, eating the flesh of dead bodies, thousands of adults and children buried in deep graves, the murder of people on camera for the so-called ‘snuff’ videos, the story is just appalling. One mother told a television documentary in the Dispatches series on Channel Four in the UK, of how she was forced to place her new-born baby on a Satanic altar and push a knife through its heart. A Satanist then had sex with the dead body. This is happening in your country NOW!

Many of the victims are born into Satanic families and others are bred for sacrifice through the use of breeders: women kept in captivity to give birth to one child after another which are never formerly registered and so, according to official records, they don’t exist. You can’t murder someone who doesn’t exist and so these children and foetuses are sacrificed without anyone outside the circle knowing the children have even been born.

The Ku Klux Klan, the Aryan master race fanatics created by the Freemason Satanist, Albert Pike, are one of the endless groups who keep women under lock and key for this purpose.41 These groups have their own midwives who supervise the births and they are also born in hospitals under the supervision of staff loyal to the Brotherhood and their Satanic ritual offshoots.42

[meave]

this is false because the 11th degree is not specifically homoerotic. This is what fools think it is but the facts are different.

Oh they got the skulls and everything, sounds nasty. I think this is just hype.

Do you get your news articles from the Sport?

please stop this backlashing and move on it only takes one of you lets get back to the topic

[marpat]

quote: David Icke

Also, as many of the victims have said, they themselves are drugged and programmed to take part in the ritual murder and torture of other children. This is videoed and played back to them when they are in a conscious state. They are so horrified at what they have done and so terrified of the consequences that they dare not speak to the authorities. Other techniques to prevent exposure include abusing children while wearing a Mickey Mouse face or a Devil’s head.
When little children say they were abused by Mickey Mouse or the Devil it makes them even less likely to be believed. One woman who contacted me said that her father sexually abused her while wearing a Devil’s head and it was a long time before she realized that her father was responsible. The stories of the people I have talked to, and the accounts of others I have read, tell of events that are beyond comprehension or, at least, they would be if they were not actually happening.

Drinking blood, eating the flesh of dead bodies, thousands of adults and children buried in deep graves, the murder of people on camera for the so-called ‘snuff’ videos, the story is just appalling. One mother told a television documentary in the Dispatches series on Channel Four in the UK, of how she was forced to place her new-born baby on a Satanic altar and push a knife through its heart. A Satanist then had sex with the dead body. This is happening in your country NOW!

Many of the victims are born into Satanic families and others are bred for sacrifice through the use of breeders: women kept in captivity to give birth to one child after another which are never formerly registered and so, according to official records, they don’t exist. You can’t murder someone who doesn’t exist and so these children and foetuses are sacrificed without anyone outside the circle knowing the children have even been born.

The Ku Klux Klan, the Aryan master race fanatics created by the Freemason Satanist, Albert Pike, are one of the endless groups who keep women under lock and key for this purpose.41 These groups have their own midwives who supervise the births and they are also born in hospitals under the supervision of staff loyal to the Brotherhood and their Satanic ritual offshoots.42

No definition. I guess you are incapable.

And it is not like David Icke has any bias :)

[cruise4]

What is your definition Marpat?

"Satanism is a paradox it seems. The definition needs readjusted. It's so far obscured that I don't think ES and Marpat are even discussing the same thing."

This is the trouble with words. They are also part of the conspiracy :D

[meave]

What is your definition Marpat?

"Satanism is a paradox it seems. The definition needs readjusted. It's so far obscured that I don't think ES and Marpat are even discussing the same thing."

This is the trouble with words. They are also part of the conspiracy :D

your so right the just fling i'm right at each other without listening

[empyblessing]

Cut and paste away, stories of idiots who wear black robes and commit murder are all well and good but, WHAT DOES SATAN MEAN TO YOU? Not - What do you think of Aleister Crowley and how many stories can you find regarding fools committing crimes in the name of an idea theyhad?

Exactly. While it's fine to make those links available, it's also important to give an accurate interpretation of what has been found through research.

I'm no sympathizer of Satanism but I know for an understanding of Satanism it is important to know (define) what Satanism is. Copy and pasting what others have written is just making yourself a "repeater."

[eternal_spirit]

FFS! ES, RESIZE your fucking text before you copy and paste your arguments.

LOL I did that's the smallest it would go.

[cruise4]

"your so right the just fling i'm right at each other without listening"

It's a non answerable question. You could say define 'Religion' and get the same. There's many word's like this. The fact is they are meaning-less. Because it only gets meaning via opinion. There is no definition. You could define an 'Orange' or an 'Apple' because they are nouns. But Satanism is subjective. It applies to no specific, rather it's a generalisation.

[marpat]

What is your definition Marpat?

"Satanism is a paradox it seems. The definition needs readjusted. It's so far obscured that I don't think ES and Marpat are even discussing the same thing."

This is the trouble with words. They are also part of the conspiracy :D

Satan is the adversary. He/it is the spirit that tests the human soul for weakness in order that it may grow in strength and light. All endeavours require effort and satan is the archetypal force that will make a soul aware of its flaws so that they can be rectified.

Satanism in the modern sense is an invention of the church used to demonise and marginalise their enemies as well as a label used against old religions in order to justify genocide and persecution.

That is how I look at it. Part of my idea is based on the book of Job, so if you have time take a peek.

You could argue that satanism is a subjective, but that would mean that few people agree on what it is. The problem is that people start using such a term but it is then misunderstood by everybdy else, which just causes confusion. If it is so subjective and people cannot decide on a common term of use then I would have to say that people should stop using the term as it is so inprecise.

[empyblessing]

It's hard to read. Evil Satanists are defined by c/ping in tiny text. :p

[krakhead]

You could argue that satanism is a subjective, but that would mean that few people agree on what it is. The problem is that people start using such a term but it is then misunderstood by everybdy else, which just causes confusion. If it is so subjective and people cannot decide on a common term of use then I would have to say that people should stop using the term as it is so inprecise.

Spot-fucking-on (IMHO of course!)

[krakhead]

It's hard to read. Evil Satanists are defined by c/ping in tiny text. :p

He he he, sarky bastard! :D

[cruise4]

"I would have to say that people should stop using the term as it is so inprecise."

I would tentatively agree, but then it goes further, like evil/good and many others. I'm fast coming to the conclusion words are totally inadequate these days. When this event happened exactly I am unsure. They used to seem more useable than they are today. Maybe telepathic ability is arising and this 'word' trouble is a symptom :D

[meave]

"I would have to say that people should stop using the term as it is so inprecise."

I would tentatively agree, but then it goes further, like evil/good and many others. I'm fast coming to the conclusion words are totally inadequate these days. When this event happened exactly I am unsure. They used to seem more useable than they are today. Maybe telepathic ability is arising and this 'word' trouble is a symptom :D

i think the problem is people pigeon hole everything rather than seeing things in there own meret or context

[empyblessing]

I'm all for avoiding labels as it tends to create an US and Them atmosphere. Often for communication it is important to label and define certain words. Until we can develop advanced telepathy, we'll need to continue misinterpreting each other in this crude thing we call language.

I feel as though many Satanists are people with a powerful rebel personality. Most would appear to join it out of spite of Christianity over some appeal to dark forces.

Satan is nothing if not interesting though. In literature, books, movies it is the villains, the beings of darkness which are the most interesting. It's the conflict which gives rise to drama both internal and external. Watch The Passion of the Christ and tell me that the few seconds of the Satanic image on screen aren't the most interesting piece of the film.

[empyblessing]

"I would have to say that people should stop using the term as it is so inprecise."

I would tentatively agree, but then it goes further, like evil/good and many others. I'm fast coming to the conclusion words are totally inadequate these days. When this event happened exactly I am unsure. They used to seem more useable than they are today. Maybe telepathic ability is arising and this 'word' trouble is a symptom :D

OMG :eek: I think we're linked telepathically...

[eternal_spirit]

"your so right the just fling i'm right at each other without listening"

It's a non answerable question. You could say define 'Religion' and get the same. There's many word's like this. The fact is they are meaning-less. Because it only gets meaning via opinion. There is no definition. You could define an 'Orange' or an 'Apple' because they are nouns. But Satanism is subjective. It applies to no specific, rather it's a generalisation.

......................

Truth is people get their meanings from what they read, so it's not really their own thoughts or conclusions. So, not one person here has an original opinion. Anyone who thinks Satanism/Luciferianism is good, are on the wrong path/side.

A picture speaks a thousand words, more in this instance. Prometheus also known as the light bearer/bringer ( another version of Lucifer )

http://cache.virtualtourist.com/2300162-Prometheus_at_Rockefeller_Center-New_York_City.jpgPrometheus at Rockefeller Center

[marpat]

"I would have to say that people should stop using the term as it is so inprecise."

I would tentatively agree, but then it goes further, like evil/good and many others. I'm fast coming to the conclusion words are totally inadequate these days. When this event happened exactly I am unsure. They used to seem more useable than they are today. Maybe telepathic ability is arising and this 'word' trouble is a symptom :D

Funny that as Crowley used to say that words are an evil invention that limit the expression of the mind.

[marpat]

......................

Truth is people get their meanings from what they read, so it's not really their own thoughts or conclusions. So, not one person here has an original opinion. Anyone who thinks Satanism/Luciferianism is good, are on the wrong path/side.

A picture speaks a thousand words, more in this instance. Prometheus also known as the light bearer/bringer ( another version of Lucifer )

http://cache.virtualtourist.com/2300162-Prometheus_at_Rockefeller_Center-New_York_City.jpgPrometheus at Rockefeller Center

So you admit you don't have your own opinion. Nice to have you out of the closet at last.

To some degree we are all conditioned by the ideas we come across but how we synthesise and develop those ideas does become our own. This is how you end up with a subjective opinion.

[eternal_spirit]

How do you know what the difference between Crowley and Icke are? have you met either? all you have to go on are loads of links, and some really biased ones at that.

The thing is that even if you took a direct quote from Crowley you could put it into the wrong context, or there is a good chance that because you don't know what he is saying that you will misunderstand, which is not uncommon.

Crowley can't be that bad, he got onto a Beattles album cover.

Do you know what Crowley was trying to achieve when summoning demons? do you know what his definition of a demon is? you can't be bothered to define what satan is let alone what a demon is, so how can you be expected to show any knowledge on a subject when you have no knowledge or experience.

......................

Are you serious?

Links and quotes from Crowley and other NWO players.
No I understand perfectly what he's saying and what he was about. And I reckon I know much more than you do or ever will.

Beatles another topic you obviously know nothing about.
They and the Rolling Stones also got offered and some of them accepted Knight hoods. Because the played their role and followed their masters orders ( pushing the drug culture LSD TAVISTOCK creation, Crowley Hare Krishna) Go research "Culture Creators" Or maybe you're just spreading disinfo....

I've defined more than you, on many threads, so cut the crap.

You've either got much to learn because you haven't a clue about these topics or you're just here to spread disinfo...

So, Mr knowitall ( who really knows fuck all ) tell us all something instead of name calling if you claim to know anything at all?

[eternal_spirit]

I could kill somebody in the name of Jimmy Hendrix but that does not mean the ghost of Mr Hendrix had any part in the killing. Get the point?

I think you are too easily swayed by the MSM
.............
Are you serious, if so you're one sick minded individual.

That's rich coming from you, who trolls the chemtrails threads screaming it's "just contrails." And takes the official freemasons lines as Gospel truth.


Tell that to the familys of the victims of these very real well documented murders in honour to your God Satan.

[marpat]

.............
Are you serious, if so you're one sick minded individual.

That's rich coming from you, who trolls the chemtrails threads screaming it's "just contrails." And takes the official freemasons lines as Gospel truth.


Tell that to the familys of the victims of these very real well documented murders in honour to your God Satan.

Well your arguement is really poor again.

I have my own opnions on contrails/ chemtrails but that is another matter. Get me real proof and then I will agree.

Satan is not my God. Satan is not even a god. All of those victims fell prey to sick humans not satan or any god. It was people who killed them. If they killed them in the name of satan it just shows how deluded they were not that satan made them do it. Unless you know the true inner motive for any killing then you can't make such judgements, even if you think the answer is clear in a very superficial sense.

[marpat]

......................

Are you serious?

Links and quotes from Crowley and other NWO players.
No I understand perfectly what he's saying and what he was about. And I reckon I know much more than you do or ever will.

Beatles another topic you obviously know nothing about.
They and the Rolling Stones also got offered and some of them accepted Knight hoods. Because the played their role and followed their masters orders ( pushing the drug culture LSD TAVISTOCK creation, Crowley Hare Krishna) Go research "Culture Creators" Or maybe you're just spreading disinfo....

I've defined more than you, on many threads, so cut the crap.

You've either got much to learn because you haven't a clue about these topics or you're just here to spread disinfo...

So, Mr knowitall ( who really knows fuck all ) tell us all something instead of name calling if you claim to know anything at all?









Don't you like Crowleys stance of individual freedom? do you think the quotes I use in my signature are evil?

Crowley is only a NWO player to those who WANT TO BELIEVE IT.

Links and quotes are your only weapon and not a sharp weapon at that. The trouble is that links can be biased any way the writer wants to put them and quotes can easily be taken out of context by the ignorant.


Crowley is one of the very few people who teach spiritual studies who actually acknowledged his wrongs and failing, which is obvious if you actually read his diaries. Nearly every other so called teacher tries to give you the glossy nice side of their character and suppress and hint that they have failings. This is why Crowley is superior to so many.

What sort of person do you prefer, one who is conscious of their own faults and who strives to overcome them and understand them, or a person who makes you think they are very nice but never lets you know anything about them that could be used against them?

Did I call you any names there?

[thirdwave]

If there is any chance of salvaging this thread that ES has decided to use as his, Shit your self with anything Crowley related campaign...

I think the world Satanism has so many different perspectives to it that the world in its self is pointless...

there are people who do horrendous things within the occult and are not Satanists... and there are people who do call them selves Satanists who dont do horrendous things... and visa versa

But Satan is really a christian tag that was created to demonise other gods.... Pan.... so on on...

many religions have had gods for certain things.... and this is how it all started.. you had god of night... god of war.... god of love... god of water.... and so on....

so you can have gods that rule a certain things....

I think even some Satanists come across as silly as they are just creating a religion them selves, but many do not hurt anyone at all... so let them be I say....

there has been FAR more deaths to do with religion than there has been the occult.... FAR MORE.... and the reason that is, is because there are bad occultist useing magick and not letting the masses learn about it and the depth of it all..... not only do they create the religions that create the wars... but they get those religions to attack those who look to learn about the very tool that is being used to crush humanity!... they are laughing.

I am very much interested in the occult... but would never make a religion out of it... and would never become a Satanist...

the ignorance around this subject only goes to show..... and is probably why many people get in over the heads with it and make a mess...

[marpat]

If there is any chance of salvaging this thread that ES has decided to use as his, Shit your self with anything Crowley related campaign...

I think the world Satanism has so many different perspectives to it that the world in its self is pointless...

there are people who do horrendous things within the occult and are not Satanists... and there are people who do call them selves Satanists who dont do horrendous things... and visa versa

But Satan is really a christian tag that was created to demonise other gods.... Pan.... so on on...

many religions have had gods for certain things.... and this is how it all started.. you had god of night... god of war.... god of love... god of water.... and so on....

so you can have gods that rule a certain things....

I think even some Satanists come across as silly as they are just creating a religion them selves, but many do not hurt anyone at all... so let them be I say....

there has been FAR more deaths to do with religion than there has been the occult.... FAR MORE.... and the reason that is, is because there are bad occultist useing magick and not letting the masses learn about it and the depth of it all..... not only do they create the religions that create the wars... but they get those religions to attack those who look to learn about the very tool that is being used to crush humanity!... they are laughing.

I am very much interested in the occult... but would never make a religion out of it... and would never become a Satanist...

the ignorance around this subject only goes to show..... and is probably why many people get in over the heads with it and make a mess...

Well said. It is a pity there are not more people out there who have enough clarity of mind to see through all the negative propoganda.

[cruise4]

"there has been FAR more deaths to do with religion than there has been the occult"

Occult could just as easily have given rise to religion, so how you can say this and know it to be true is the question.

[meave]

no i'm feed up with this if people want to talk about what ever let them who the fuck knows hows right or wrong so i'm going to bring this post back to what its about

orginal post
What is Satanism? Is it the LaVey, Church of Satan definition? Is there a difference between Satanism and Luciferianism? What is YOUR personal definition of a Satanist?

[marpat]

[quote=marpat;389483]Well said. It is a pity there are not more people out there who have enough clarity of mind to see through all the negative propoganda.[/quo

.......................

Kep spinning your spiel and lies you show yourself for what you are one who follows a satanists teachings makes you a satanist.

But as I have said many time before, I am not a satanist. To me satan is an archetype of the inner adversary, not some force of evil whose only purpose is to destroy humans. You have the religious understanding of a born again christian.

[marpat]

no i'm feed up with this if people want to talk about what ever let them who the fuck knows hows right or wrong so i'm going to bring this post back to what its about

orginal post


don't worry meave I'll back you up.

[cruise4]

How about 'embracing the dark side'?

[eternal_spirit]

[quote=eternal_spirit;389502]

But as I have said many time before, I am not a satanist. To me satan is an archetype of the inner adversary, not some force of evil whose only purpose is to destroy humans. You have the religious understanding of a born again christian.
...................

That's right attack Christians that what your guru Crowley did and want's you to do.

People who follow the teachings of the bible are known as Christians. People who follow the teachings of Crowley are known as practicing Satanists.

I am me I am free.

[meave]

don't worry meave I'll back you up.

thats cool but i can fight my own battles i cant be doing with the bullshit

[QUOTE=eternal_spirit;389502]

But as I have said many time before, I am not a satanist. To me satan is an archetype of the inner adversary, not some force of evil whose only purpose is to destroy humans. You have the religious understanding of a born again christian.

[quote=marpat;389519]
...................

That's right attack Christians that what your guru Crowley did and want's you to do.

People who follow the teachings of the bible are known as Christians. People who follow the teachings of Crowley are known as practicing Satanists.

I am me I am free.


are you's two the same person?

[marpat]

[quote=marpat;389519]
...................

That's right attack Christians that what your guru Crowley did and want's you to do.

People who follow the teachings of the bible are known as Christians. People who follow the teachings of Crowley are known as practicing Satanists.

I am me I am free.



Can you define how exactly people who follow Crowley are satanists? it sounds really illogical, especially when the true term would be thelemite. A thelemite is a person who strives to do their own will, not follow Crowley. Bit subtle for you I guess, but I am sure you get a rough idea.

I never attacked the christians, just said you act like one. Their religion is dead now anyway.

[marpat]

you mean nuit, get it right.:D your being played, LOL

lizzy, this is not the first time you have gone down this route.

You deluded people with stuff like this in other threads, you will not be influencing me.

[marpat]

All one big happy family again? :D:D:D

Geez, even TW knows it's true. LOL..........:eek::eek::eek:

Personally, even if it was true I am just not interested. All you are doing is derailing the thread so you might as well forget about it.

[eternal_spirit]

If there is any chance of salvaging this thread that ES has decided to use as his, Shit your self with anything Crowley related campaign...

I think the world Satanism has so many different perspectives to it that the world in its self is pointless...

there are people who do horrendous things within the occult and are not Satanists... and there are people who do call them selves Satanists who dont do horrendous things... and visa versa

But Satan is really a christian tag that was created to demonise other gods.... Pan.... so on on...

many religions have had gods for certain things.... and this is how it all started.. you had god of night... god of war.... god of love... god of water.... and so on....

so you can have gods that rule a certain things....

I think even some Satanists come across as silly as they are just creating a religion them selves, but many do not hurt anyone at all... so let them be I say....

there has been FAR more deaths to do with religion than there has been the occult.... FAR MORE.... and the reason that is, is because there are bad occultist useing magick and not letting the masses learn about it and the depth of it all..... not only do they create the religions that create the wars... but they get those religions to attack those who look to learn about the very tool that is being used to crush humanity!... they are laughing.

I am very much interested in the occult... but would never make a religion out of it... and would never become a Satanist...

the ignorance around this subject only goes to show..... and is probably why many people get in over the heads with it and make a mess...


...................

Wrong as usual. I tell it like it is and what he was, you believe the pro satanists lies. I'll believe Icke and many other good people who expose the sick satanists. And the victims of thes sickos, what about them and their familys, you think they are lying to, guess you do.

You and mupet troll and spam and call me names on every thread I start about your Guru Crowley, so don't be such a hypocrite. Most of my posts are on topic. Go read the first page or two and then carry on reading see who starts on who.

Yes, but doesn't excuse the Satanists who do bad. Still waiting for you to prove to us all that Crowley and co did any good?

There have been millions more deaths of innocent Christians/Buddhists and religious people by none religious people ( the boshevik Russian communists/satanists for instance) So, what you say isn't true.


Politicians/Parallel Governments/None Govermental organisations, make the laws. Bankers/stock markets/lawyers and financiers hold the World to ransom. Big mutil national companies who own the commodities/food etc the Military Industrial complex are far more guilty of creating the evils in this World. Who do they worship Lucifer.
A picture speaks a thousand words, more in this instance. Prometheus also known as the light bearer/bringer ( another version of Lucifer )

http://cache.virtualtourist.com/2300162-Prometheus_at_Rockefeller_Center-New_York_City.jpgPrometheus at the rockeffeler buildings New York, the leaders of the Bolshevik revolution in Russia were 200 families sent from the USA funded by the bankers to start this War, same bankers that funded both sides in the second World War.

ah so you're seeing the bigger picture maybe
Yes, they are very silly. Good luck with that dabbling, you'll need it.

[eternal_spirit]

[quote=eternal_spirit;389536]


Can you define how exactly people who follow Crowley are satanists? it sounds really illogical, especially when the true term would be thelemite. A thelemite is a person who strives to do their own will, not follow Crowley. Bit subtle for you I guess, but I am sure you get a rough idea.

I never attacked the christians, just said you act like one. Their religion is dead now anyway.

........................


Have done on many occasions in the Satanism forums and on this thread.

Only in your deluded mind, so going by your logic anyone who speaks the truth and exposes the evil deeds of satanists is acting like a Christian.:rolleyes:
There's more Christians than Satanists, so you're wrong.

[marpat]

...................

Wrong as usual. I tell it like it is and what he was, you believe the pro satanists lies. I'll believe Icke and many other good people who expose the sick satanists. And the victims of thes sickos, what about them and their familys, you think they are lying to, guess you do.

You and mupet troll and spam and call me names on every thread I start about your Guru Crowley, so don't be such a hypocrite. Most of my posts are on topic. Go read the first page or two and then carry on reading see who starts on who.

Yes, but doesn't excuse the Satanists who do bad. Still waiting for you to prove to us all that Crowley and co did any good?

There have been millions more deaths of innocent Christians/Buddhists and religious people by none religious people ( the boshevik Russian communists/satanists for instance) So, what you say isn't true.


Politicians/Parallel Governments/None Govermental organisations, make the laws. Bankers/stock markets/lawyers and financiers hold the World to ransom. Big mutil national companies who own the commodities/food etc the Military Industrial complex are far more guilty of creating the evils in this World. Who do they worship Lucifer.
A picture speaks a thousand words, more in this instance. Prometheus also known as the light bearer/bringer ( another version of Lucifer )

http://cache.virtualtourist.com/2300162-Prometheus_at_Rockefeller_Center-New_York_City.jpgPrometheus at the rockeffeler buildings New York, the leaders of the Bolshevik revolution in Russia were 200 families sent from the USA funded by the bankers to start this War, same bankers that funded both sides in the second World War.

ah so you're seeing the bigger picture maybe
Yes, they are very silly. Good luck with that dabbling, you'll need it.





So the christians are thos who have suffered. Wow, maybe it was karma for all their genocide.

You have an obsession with attacking Crowley. I guess it is easy to attack a person who is long dead and who was hated by many people for breaking out of the stuffy moral codes of his day, invoking the anger of the nation and the hostility of the press. Even that Illuminati stooge Mussolini booted him out of Italy.

ES, you admitted dabbling before. Perhaps if you tell us how you burnt your fingers then we will change our minds.

[thirdwave]

"there has been FAR more deaths to do with religion than there has been the occult"

Occult could just as easily have given rise to religion, so how you can say this and know it to be true is the question.

but you cant say occult done that... because occult us a tool used by humans... it only works through human intent.

and if people have been tricked into starting wars for religion... because occultists trick them into doing so... then its bloody hide time people learn about the occult I say!

the point is that anyone passionate about religion and pointing the finger at the occult as creating deaths... well they are just a tad off the ball.

[eternal_spirit]

So the christians are thos who have suffered. Wow, maybe it was karma for all their genocide.

You have an obsession with attacking Crowley. I guess it is easy to attack a person who is long dead and who was hated by many people for breaking out of the stuffy moral codes of his day, invoking the anger of the nation and the hostility of the press. Even that Illuminati stooge Mussolini booted him out of Italy.

ES, you admitted dabbling before. Perhaps if you tell us how you burnt your fingers then we will change our minds.

Mussolini booted him for sacraficing children and the goat fucking ritual murders. One of his coven died from drinking a sacrficed cat's blood. Enough said.

How many sick rituals advocated by Crowley have you tried?

[marpat]

Mussolini booted him for sacraficing children and the goat fucking ritual murders. One of his coven died from drinking a sacrficed cat's blood. Enough said.

How many sick rituals advocated by Crowley have you tried?

Well I would have to say that is a lie. If he had been sacrificing children don't you think he would have been executed? the death penality existed then and I doubt if somebody caught him in the act that they would just let him walk away. Try using some logic and reason instead of being ruled by blind emotion. Bit of a 30's tabloid man yourself?

Raoul Loveday died after drinking contaminated water. His wife made money when she returned to England by claiming all sorts of things were going on, but not enough to stop here going to live with Crowley and his group in Cefalu. Again you use badly distorted facts to no avail.

I have used a few rituals from Crowleys work but I would have to add that none of them invovled blood drinking or killing cats, or any other wierd perversion that you seem to be fixated by. The fact is that most of them are only adaptation of Golden Dawn rituals.

Did you do any sick rituals? you did dabble and burn your fingers, but not enough to tell us what happened so that we may change our minds.

[lizzy]

Personally, even if it was true I am just not interested. All you are doing is derailing the thread so you might as well forget about it.

Define satan.......IT comes in all guises. An evil putridness that prevades the soul, not always obvious , as it it cunning but also stupid , in some cases it is manifestly so. LOL.!!!!!!!

Enjoy your pentagram parties with all your new and refound fellow satanists.LOL:eek::eek::eek:

[marpat]

Define satan.......IT comes in all guises. An evil putridness that prevades the soul, not always obvious , as it it cunning but also stupid , in some cases it is manifestly so. LOL.!!!!!!!

Enjoy your pentagram parties with all your new and refound fellow satanists.LOL:eek::eek::eek:

That is not even a definition. I guess you are out of your depth here.

Just for the record Liz, I am not a satanist. Such a thing does not work with my definition of satanism.

How can something be cunning and stupid? you would think that if satan has been around trapping humans for millenia then he would be a complete master of it by now and there would be little room for mistakes.

[lizzy]

That is not even a definition. I guess you are out of your depth here.

Just for the record Liz, I am not a satanist. Such a thing does not work with my definition of satanism.

How can something be cunning and stupid? you would think that if satan has been around trapping humans for millenia then he would be a complete master of it by now and there would be little room for mistakes.

It's called 'out-smarting' yourself , something you are getting good at:D:D:D

HOW you define 'IT' is up to the individual, but I do know WHAT it attracts.

CORRUPTION and LIES that rule the world but NOT MY MIND ..................

[marpat]

It's called 'out-smarting' yourself , something you are getting good at:D:D:D

HOW you define 'IT' is up to the individual, but I do know WHAT it attracts.

CORRUPTION and LIES that rule the world but NOT MY MIND ..................



Well it's nice to see that you are above all that negativity. Satan means adversary. It can imply anything that bars your progress, the idea being to develop your strength by giving you something to push against. If you have nothing to struggle against then you don't learn anything. An example of this is weight training, the weights are the adversary and the more you struggle against them the stronger you become. The fact is that Satan is part of our being not some external evil force, although in some ways it has been externalised by the belief of many people.

Still you refuse to commit to a definition though. Even if the individual defines it you can still tell us what you mean by satan in an accurate way. You don't need satan for lies and corruption as people can do that without some negative spirit helping them. To blame satan for lies and corruption is to remove responsibility away from the people who are bad and shifting the blame to a spiritual archetype. How many people kill somebody then say the devil made them do it, as if that will get them off the hook? people want a scapegoat for their evil because they don't want to admit that the bad things they do are the products of their own minds.

[eternal_spirit]

Zion/Sion is the sun in Hebrew, which is the light ( Lucifer ) hence Zionism.

It's not Venus. It's the Brightest star that rises in the morning ( the morning star-the sun ) It's negative sun worship, they reverse meanings - black is white and white is black...hence human and animal sacrafices.

[thelucifer]

Satan means adversary. It can imply anything that bars your progress, the idea being to develop your strength by giving you something to push against.

Necassary evil.
I asked the masons (without a reply) if thats what the DC beast is.
I asked, is the DC beast the necassary evil so good has something to overcome ?
i.e. no evil/advesary means nothing for good to overcome.

The fact is that Satan is part of our being not some external evil force, although in some ways it has been externalised by the belief of many people.

I dont see Satan as a part of our being per se but I do see bad as a part of our being.
I say people are both good and bad, that no one is perfect one way or the other.

I say the external Satan is the DC beast, a inanimate symbol for a religion/agenda.

You don't need satan for lies and corruption as people can do that without some negative spirit helping them. To blame satan for lies and corruption is to remove responsibility away from the people who are bad and shifting the blame to a spiritual archetype. How many people kill somebody then say the devil made them do it, as if that will get them off the hook? people want a scapegoat for their evil because they don't want to admit that the bad things they do are the products of their own minds.

I marvel at people wanting to use an inanimate, non concsious, non freewill thing (Satan), to right/justify/make void, the wrongs/evil acts of animate freewill concsious beings/humans.
Might as well blame a rock.

[thelucifer]

Zion/Sion is the sun in Hebrew, which is the light ( Lucifer ) hence Zionism.

It's not Venus. It's the Brightest star that rises in the morning ( the morning star-the sun ) It's negative sun worship, they reverse meanings - black is white and white is black...hence human and animal sacrafices.

Its both venus and the sun.

Yes the morning sun is brighter than the setting sun.

I say the morning and setting suns are one.

[empyblessing]

Satanism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

C/Ped from the wiki:

"Satanism can refer to a number of belief systems depending on the user and context. Common use of the word generally refers to the worship of Satan as described in the Christian Bible or the practice of ritual magic. [1] However, by the actual adherents, the suffix -ism is used by some groups to suggest the definition as an act or practice,[clarify] as opposed to the oft-assumed definition as the doctrine or philosophy behind an act or practice.[2]
Generally, the word "Satanism" is used by scholars to describe several distinct spiritual practices and beliefs; the two most significant seem to be LaVeyan Satanism and Theistic Satanism. Ideas about Satan come from essentially these two sources.[2] It is often the practice of any given Satanist not to refer to themselves with a hyphenated prefix. Each "type" of Satanist will usually refer to themselves only as Satanists."

[thirdwave]

the thing is

we have people here like ES who are dogmatic about going on about how evil the occult is and so forth.... and with there being so many who do not oppose it and who claim they do not have evil intentions..

What would people like ES do if they have the power....

what would the solution be?

[eternal_spirit]

the thing is

we have people here like ES who are dogmatic about going on about how evil the occult is and so forth.... and with there being so many who do not oppose it and who claim they do not have evil intentions..

What would people like ES do if they have the power....

what would the solution be?

....................

Exposing satanism, the dark side isn't dogmatic. People need to know this stuff.

they reverse meanings - black is white and white is black...

This is one reason it's not clear cut. It's the source (who's pushing the occult and why) Much of it is created by the Elite and it's tied in with Religions.

Ah but I do have powers. But don't claim to be able to teach, some of my music is part of my attempt to give people a positive spiritual experience and affect their electromagentic field/aura... and consciousness. I've given instructions how to make your own spirit board on the ouija board threads.

It's up to each individual to find their own powers. I could tell you about Kundalini and chakras etc,(this info can be found in texts) but like I said, you need to research and try things yourself and draw your own conclusions.

[eternal_spirit]

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=380464&postcount=42
quote: marpat
I am a member of the OTO and think the statement about control is ridiculous. How can an organisation be promoting that people should discover their true will and then try and control them? is it just contradictory. I have never seen any examples of this myself. I think if this sort of thing was happening then people would be asking why.

.....................

If this is true....his attitude and mocking posts all over the forum maybe a reflection in part of his participation of OTO rituals. He's batting for the other side and I know many here will agree with this. edit Marpat doesn't believe in any of the conspiracies ( which many are proven realities ) the list is endless.

[thirdwave]

....................

Exposing satanism, the dark side isn't dogmatic. People need to know this stuff.

they reverse meanings - black is white and white is black...

This is one reason it's not clear cut. It's the source (who's pushing the occult and why) Much of it is created by the Elite and it's tied in with Religions.

Ah but I do have powers. But don't claim to be able to teach, some of my music is part of my attempt to give people a positive spiritual experience and affect their electromagentic field/aura... and consciousness. I've given instructions how to make your own spirit board on the ouija board threads.

It's up to each individual to find their own powers. I could tell you about Kundalini and chakras etc,(this info can be found in texts) but like I said, you need to research and try things yourself and draw your own conclusions.






but what if somone finds your methods negative?

for there personal preference... but find other methods you dont like inspirational... despite what they may have done to others...

?

[marpat]

Zion/Sion is the sun in Hebrew, which is the light ( Lucifer ) hence Zionism.

It's not Venus. It's the Brightest star that rises in the morning ( the morning star-the sun ) It's negative sun worship, they reverse meanings - black is white and white is black...hence human and animal sacrafices.


That is utter rubbish. No logic and no meaning. The Hebrew name for the sun is Shemesh.

Venus has always been known as the morning star.

How convenient that they reverse the meanings. What this really means is that you cannot make anything evil out of it so you say something like that to twist the facts.

You post is utter rubbish and shows a real lack of knowledge or understanding and a tendency to follow the silliest methods to try and deliberately explain something in wrong terms. You just pervert things which have consituted an ancient body of knowledge by reversing the meaning so that anything good means something bad.

[marpat]

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showpost.php?p=380464&postcount=42
quote: marpat
I am a member of the OTO and think the statement about control is ridiculous. How can an organisation be promoting that people should discover their true will and then try and control them? is it just contradictory. I have never seen any examples of this myself. I think if this sort of thing was happening then people would be asking why.

.....................

If this is true....his attitude and mocking posts all over the forum maybe a reflection in part of his participation of OTO rituals. He's batting for the other side and I know many here will agree with this. edit Marpat doesn't believe in any of the conspiracies ( which many are proven realities ) the list is endless.

Conpiracies should be proven, not believed in so you are right, I don't BELIEVE in them. Prove me wrong if they are proven realities and I mean with good evidence not some ridiculous youtube vids.

As a free man I am entitled to join the OTO if it is my will, so what. Although I am a member I haven't been to any meetings for well over a year as it would involve to much travel, so I haven't been to any orgies recently :D

I think you are a little confused in your post. You say I don't believe in conspiracies, which means they are based on belief, then you say that they are proven realitis, which means they are not based on belief. Make your mind up.

[eternal_spirit]

http://www.cremationofcare.com/images/london/bracken_house1.JPG Almost directly across from Fidelity Investments is Bracken House (the former office of the Financial Times) on Friday Street which displays an interesting but dark occultic zodiac monument, which is also pictured in the controversial book 'The Biggest Secret'. As is noted in that book, you can see the face of Winston Churchill in the center of a 'Black Sun' which stands in front of a larger Golden Sun.
To the Illuminati who believe that they can 'draw' power from the negative Solar energy of the Sun and it many cycles, this sundial type calendar conveys symbolism and a message of that belief, (whether scientifically practiced or not).
The monument itself is quite beautiful in its general appearance, as is often the case with such occultic items. They need to be, so to appeal to the corruptible mindset of humanity. http://www.cremationofcare.com/images/london/bracken_house2.JPG

[krakhead]

so I haven't been to any orgies recently :D

"I've just got back from an orgy!" :p

[cruise4]

"He's batting for the other side and I know many here will agree with this."

There's no doubt about it.

[eternal_spirit]

That is utter rubbish. No logic and no meaning. The Hebrew name for the sun is Shemesh.

Venus has always been known as the morning star.

How convenient that they reverse the meanings. What this really means is that you cannot make anything evil out of it so you say something like that to twist the facts.

You post is utter rubbish and shows a real lack of knowledge or understanding and a tendency to follow the silliest methods to try and deliberately explain something in wrong terms. You just pervert things which have consituted an ancient body of knowledge by reversing the meaning so that anything good means something bad.


..................

Zion (Hebrew (http://www.amazines.com/Hebrew_language_related.html) ???????, tziyyon; Tiberian vocalization (http://www.amazines.com/Tiberian_vocalization_related.html) tsiyyôn; transliterated (http://www.amazines.com/Hebrew_transliteration) Zion or Sion) is a term that most often designates the Land of Israel (http://www.amazines.com/Land_of_Israel_related.html) and its capital, Jerusalem (http://www.amazines.com/Jerusalem_related.html). The word is found in texts dating (http://www.amazines.com/ZION_related.html#) back almost three millennia. It commonly referred to a specific mountain near Jerusalem (http://www.amazines.com/Jerusalem_related.html) (Mount Zion (http://www.amazines.com/Mount_Zion_related.html)), on which stood a Jebusite (http://www.amazines.com/Jebusite_related.html) fortress of the same name that was conquered by David (http://www.amazines.com/David_related.html) and was named the City of David.The term Zion came to designate the area of Jerusalem (http://www.amazines.com/ZION_related.html#) where the fortress stood, and later became a metonym (http://www.amazines.com/Metonymy_related.html) for Solomon (http://www.amazines.com/Solomon_related.html)'s Temple in Jerusalem (http://www.amazines.com/Temple_in_Jerusalem_related.html), the city of Jerusalem (http://www.amazines.com/Jerusalem_related.html) and the entire Promised Land (http://www.amazines.com/Promised_Land_related.html) to come, in which, according to the Hebrew Bible (http://www.amazines.com/Hebrew_Bible_related.html), God (http://www.amazines.com/God_related.html) dwells among his chosen people (http://www.amazines.com/Jews_as_a_chosen_people_related.html).
The name Zion appears 154 times in the Tanakh (http://www.amazines.com/Tanakh_related.html) (Hebrew Bible).

[marpat]

"He's batting for the other side and I know many here will agree with this."

There's no doubt about it.

The reality is that I am not on any side. Why do I have to be on the believers or non-believers side? even if a thousand people agreed with what you say that does not make it true, just a big falsehood.

The problem is that when you take sides you bind yourself to the conditions of that side, which I am no prepared to do. I like to have the option of deciding for myself what I think is right or wrong. I don't need to be on a side that promotes one view over the other.

Anyway, is this thread about me?

[marpat]

..................

Zion (Hebrew (http://www.amazines.com/Hebrew_language_related.html) ???????, tziyyon; Tiberian vocalization (http://www.amazines.com/Tiberian_vocalization_related.html) tsiyyôn; transliterated (http://www.amazines.com/Hebrew_transliteration) Zion or Sion) is a term that most often designates the Land of Israel (http://www.amazines.com/Land_of_Israel_related.html) and its capital, Jerusalem (http://www.amazines.com/Jerusalem_related.html). The word is found in texts dating (http://www.amazines.com/ZION_related.html#) back almost three millennia. It commonly referred to a specific mountain near Jerusalem (http://www.amazines.com/Jerusalem_related.html) (Mount Zion (http://www.amazines.com/Mount_Zion_related.html)), on which stood a Jebusite (http://www.amazines.com/Jebusite_related.html) fortress of the same name that was conquered by David (http://www.amazines.com/David_related.html) and was named the City of David.The term Zion came to designate the area of Jerusalem (http://www.amazines.com/ZION_related.html#) where the fortress stood, and later became a metonym (http://www.amazines.com/Metonymy_related.html) for Solomon (http://www.amazines.com/Solomon_related.html)'s Temple in Jerusalem (http://www.amazines.com/Temple_in_Jerusalem_related.html), the city of Jerusalem (http://www.amazines.com/Jerusalem_related.html) and the entire Promised Land (http://www.amazines.com/Promised_Land_related.html) to come, in which, according to the Hebrew Bible (http://www.amazines.com/Hebrew_Bible_related.html), God (http://www.amazines.com/God_related.html) dwells among his chosen people (http://www.amazines.com/Jews_as_a_chosen_people_related.html).
The name Zion appears 154 times in the Tanakh (http://www.amazines.com/Tanakh_related.html) (Hebrew Bible). Some examples from the book of Psalms (http://www.amazines.com/Psalms_related.html), which have been frequently recited and memorized by Jews for centuries, state
Zionism is a political movement (http://www.amazines.com/Jewish_political_movements_related.html) and an ideology (http://www.amazines.com/Ideology_related.html) that supports a homeland (http://www.amazines.com/Homeland_related.html) for the Jewish (http://www.amazines.com/Jew_related.html) people in the Land of Israel (http://www.amazines.com/Land_of_Israel_related.html),



Again you post information which has no bearing on the thread. Again you show no understanding of the subject and resort to the ideas of other people, and if they don't fit you just take those ideas and say that the reverse is true. Your logic is perverse.

What is the source of your quote?

[eternal_spirit]

Originally Posted by marpat http://www.davidicke.com/forum/images/buttons_green/viewpost.gif (http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?p=390578#post390578)
That is utter rubbish. No logic and no meaning. The Hebrew name for the sun is Shemesh.

...................
Too say the word zion/sion is sun in hebrew like I said previously. source
http://www.amazines.com/ZION_related.html

Another clue Sol om on mean the sun in three different laguages.

[marpat]

Originally Posted by marpat http://www.davidicke.com/forum/images/buttons_green/viewpost.gif (http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?p=390578#post390578)
That is utter rubbish. No logic and no meaning. The Hebrew name for the sun is Shemesh.

...................
Too say the word zion/sion is sun in hebrew like I said previously. source
http://www.amazines.com/ZION_related.html

Another clue Sol om on mean the sun in three different laguages.

wrong again. Your sources are poor. You information is anti-Zionist material that has been twisted to give a corrupt meaning.

So what if Sol means sun in three languages. It just means the word has a common root. This proves absolutely nothing. You can find many words that are common to other languages.

http://www.wildbranch.org/WOTW/54sun.htm

I think you are taking the thread away from it's topic

[eternal_spirit]

wrong again. Your sources are poor. You information is anti-Zionist material that has been twisted to give a corrupt meaning.

http://www.wildbranch.org/WOTW/54sun.htm

So, your quote is from a pro Zionist Jewish site, I'd say that's disinfo.
Although.....it's how a word is pronouced and sounds that's important. Sion/Zion/sun all sound the same when spoken. There's an old trick of removing the vowels like YWH (Yahwe) played by the Elite priesthoods, now say those words with the vowels taken out, they sound the same. :D


Al Freemasons are Zionists.

[empyblessing]

"I've just got back from an orgy!" :p
:eek: Details plx

[marpat]

So, your quote is from a pro Zionist Jewish site, I'd say that's disinfo.
Although.....it's how a word is pronouced and sounds that's important. Sion/Zion/sun all sound the same when spoken. There's an old trick of removing the vowels like YWH (Yahwe) played by the Elite priesthoods, now say those words with the vowels taken out, they sound the same. :D


Al Freemasons are Zionists.

You were wrong, admit it. Don't try and take away the fact that you are using sources that twist the meaning to suit your ideas.

How is that site pro-Zionist? explain. Dis-info to you means that it does not agree with what you are pushing.

Your explanation is really poor again. In Hebrew the vowels are missing but you are using words that are not Hebrew, then saying remove the vowels. You are just trying to twist something into something that it is not. In Hebrew there are markers to show when to pronounce a vowel so that are not completely missing, just not written.

What you are trying to push is that Zion means sun when what you explain is that they sound the same if you remove the vowels. Not really the same thing!!!!!

Believe that stuff if you want but you are just leading yourself into deception.

[eternal_spirit]

So what if Sol means sun in three languages. It just means the word has a common root. This proves absolutely nothing. You can find many words that are common to other languages.

http://www.wildbranch.org/WOTW/54sun.htm

I think you are taking the thread away from it's topic


No, it's the common link between the three languages and the old mystery religion (which is now Freemasonry) meaning:The perenial mystery religion is behind the new religions and still controls them and it's based on sun worship, always was...and still is that's why the three become one ( one word solomon "sun" they like their trinitys, this is why solomon is part of Freemasonry, it shows it's a universal religion, that controls all religions. Is Ra El is another trinity.

[marpat]

No, it's the common link between the three languages and the old mystery religion (which is now Freemasonry) meaning:The perenial mystery religion is behind the new religions and still controls them and it's based on sun worship, always was...and still is that's why the three become one ( one word solomon "sun" they like their trinitys, this is why solomon is part of Freemasonry, it shows it's a universal religion, that controls all religions. Is Ra El is another trinity.

Or it could be that the word was imported by common use, such as when Latin was spoken by many people and exported to many nations.

That explanation is poor again.

Trinities indicate balance, two opposing forces balanced by a third equalising force. What is wrong with that? such concepts are ancient and are nothing to do with Solomon or freemasonry, even if they use the same ideas.

Is Ra El is not a trinity. All that has happened here is that three deities have been lumped together to produce the name Israel. If you know anything about ancient religions you would know that Ra is generally depicted as self existing, although some texts suggets a relationship with the sky goddess Hathor. El is another name for God in Hebrew, a certain function or aspect of God.

Anybody can alter such things to create false ideas, which is what you are doing, but all that you do is blind people and prevent them understanding the true nature of these forces. You play with the words but what they are remains untouched.

[eternal_spirit]

Bit off topic but leave you this to think about

Thoth of the Egyptians and most of the God's the Elite worship and have worshiped are seen as hemaphrodites. The priesthoods wear womens clothes.

The babylonian ( literally baby lion , all masons called lions ) priest has his own secret agenda. He was a dog priest, having anal sex during ceromonies. The symbology was ( is ) that through his works ( accumulation of knowlege ) Man would become God having complete ability to self create.

Religion comes from the Latin "Ligamen a tie, a string or cord. It means to be re-bound, to re-tied. In the ancient Egyptian Intiation ceremonies, a tie was placed around the neck to symbolise the noose, the penalty being obvious for disclosure.

A red cord was also tied around "the lower head" or genitals. This tied one to Amon. The novice was then a child ( Moses, Mesis ) of Amon/Amen-Ra. The popular title being Ra-Moses, Ra's child. "Amen, our father which art in heaven" begins a polular praise to the deity, painted on numerous tomb walls.


At bursiris every year, the Pharoah went through an elaborate ritual emulating the death and resurrection of Osiris or Son of the Sun. Priests lowered him to the ground representing death. They then lifted him to a 45 degree angle which they called "the lame attempting to walk" then to a standing position of 90 degree. In this pose he was addressed as Dad.

A blindfold was removed allowing him to "see". This death and re-birth of Osiris represented the death and resurrection of the sun at mid-winter. At least, that is what the masses were told.

The top priests were named after the female deity. They, in every country wore women's clothing. In Egypt(E=goal, JiiPithi,as it sounds which is Jupiter) they were the priests of I(sis) This however is the Greek rendition. The Egyptian term was Iris. They recruited from the "brighter boys" of the aristocracy. Today we use scholarships. As the sun's arc is measured in degress, the managers (sons) of Today earn degress, the ceremony ( Ceres, another term for the goddess Isis, and Mon,man) requires the wearing of a woman's gown. The students are called pupils

Think of an eye; Eye Ball-I Baal, Iris-pupil.

[cruise4]

"The reality is that I am not on any side."

That position IS a side.

[marpat]

Bit off topic but leave you this to think about

Thoth of the Egyptians and most of the God's the Elite worship and have worshiped are seen as hemaphrodites. The priesthoods wear womens clothes.

The babylonian ( literally baby lion , all masons called lions ) priest has his own secret agenda. He was a dog priest, having anal sex during ceromonies. The symbology was ( is ) that through his works ( accumulation of knowlege ) Man would become God having complete ability to self create. ( God made man in his own image )

Religion comes from the Latin "Ligamen a tie, a string or cord. It means to be re-bound, to re-tied. In the ancient Egyptian Intiation ceremonies, a tie was placed around the neck to symbolise the noose, the penalty being obvious for disclosure.

A red cord was also tied around "the lower head" or genitals. This tied one to Amon. The novice was then a child ( Moses, Mesis ) of Amon/Amen-Ra. The popular title being Ra-Moses, Ra's child. "Amen, our father which art in heaven" begins a polular praise to the deity, painted on numerous tomb walls.


At bursiris every year, the Pharoah went through an elaborate ritual emulating the death and resurrection of Osiris or Son of the Sun. Priests lowered him to the ground representing death. They then lifted him to a 45 degree angle which they called "the lame attempting to walk" then to a standing position of 90 degree. In this pose he was addressed as Dad.

A blindfold was removed allowing him to "see". This death and re-birth of Osiris represented the death and resurrection of the sun at mid-winter. At least, that is what the masses were told.

The top priests were named after the female deity. They, in every country wore women's clothing. In Egypt(E=goal, JiiPithi,as it sounds which is Jupiter) they were the priests of I(sis) This however is the Greek rendition. The Egyptian term was Iris. They recruited from the "brighter boys" of the aristocracy. Today we use scholarships. As the sun's arc is measured in degress, the managers (sons) of Today earn degress, the ceremony ( Ceres, another term for the goddess Isis, and Mon,man) requires the wearing of a woman's gown. The students are called pupils

Think of an eye; Eye Ball-I Baal, Iris-pupil.

Some of this is true but so out of context as to present a lie. Can you show some sources so we can see what you are quoting. Only in certain cults did priests where womans clothes, something which was considered wrong by the Hebrew law.

Well I thought our souls where hermaphrodite, having both masculine and feminine expressions. Should that be an issue?

Fact is that you ideas are not only wrong or distorted but you are spamming this thread with stuff not related to the topic. If you want to discuss those ideas in particular then start a thread on the subject rather than hijacking this one.

[marpat]

"The reality is that I am not on any side."

That position IS a side.

Whatever, I guess it is my own independant side, not 'your' side.

Lets not take this thread off topic.

[empyblessing]

My feelings on Crowley are that he was attempting to obtain the highest form of freedom, freedom of all restrictions. What he found with "do what thou wilt" though was that it was indeed another form of entrapment as one was restricted by the will. Much of his work seems to both rebel against Christianity and embrace his true nature. He was trying to smash down the dogma which influenced his life. Which is valid. As how many non-Christians still live by a morality of Christian indoctrination?

My belief is that most people are terrified of freedom, they believe they need to be guided by something. There are too many who will willingly guide them as well.

To free the mind one must be willing to neither be guided or to guide others. A non-dualistic, non-judgmental, non-interference paradigm with an understanding of both intrinsic nature and Oneness

[marpat]

My feelings on Crowley are that he was attempting to obtain the highest form of freedom, freedom of all restrictions. What he found with "do what thou wilt" though was that it was indeed another form of entrapment as one was restricted by the will. Much of his work seems to both rebel against Christianity and embrace his true nature. He was trying to smash down the dogma which influenced his life. Which is valid. As how many non-Christians still live by a morality of Christian indoctrination?

My belief is that most people are terrified of freedom, they believe they need to be guided by something. There are too many who will willingly guide them as well.

To free the mind one must be willing to neither be guided or to guide others. A non-dualistic, non-judgmental, non-interference paradigm with an understanding of both intrinsic nature and Oneness

How can do what thou wilt be an entrapment? the idea is to find your true inner will and carry that out.

I wonder if the problem is what people think freedom is. Most people think it is to do with being able to make choices but in spiritual terms having lots of choices does not make one free. To be free in spiritual terms is to be unbound by the limitations of the mind and emotions. This does not necessarily require people to have unlimited choices and a person who is physically a slave could really be free in spirit, although they might have problems expressing that freedom.

[empyblessing]

One is then bound and restricted by their will, a slave to their own will.

Icke talks about spontaneous action derivative of pure consciousness, action beyond thought. Very much like a zen state or wu wei, action through no-action.

This brings up other questions though. Such as, what is the will? Would the true will be beyond thought? Is the will the desire of the body and mind? I want a million dollars. I want to fuck a hooker. I want to get married.

It's my belief that the ego was formed chiefly as a means of protection but then became a dominant force. It would be required to survive but at some point it became too powerful. The idea is that too often someone believes the ego, a formation of the body, is who they are. So is the will the ego, that which thinks?

[marpat]

One is then bound and restricted by their will, a slave to their own will.

Icke talks about spontaneous action derivative of pure consciousness, action beyond thought. Very much like a zen state or wu wei, action through no-action.

This brings up other questions though. Such as, what is the will? Would the true will be beyond thought? Is the will the desire of the body and mind? I want a million dollars. I want to fuck a hooker. I want to get married.

It's my belief that the ego was formed chiefly as a means of protection but then became a dominant force. It would be required to survive but at some point it became too powerful. The idea is that too often someone believes the ego, a formation of the body, is who they are. So is the will the ego, that which thinks?

What Icke is talking about is a similar thing anyway, just described in different terms. The true will is the expression of that consciousness. His idea is not original nor unique.

I think that you are confusing desire with the will of self expression. Desire is bound up with existence and duality, and is bound to the ego. The true will is that which is beyond rational though, it is the creative instinct that is not limited by the ideas of man, the unmanifest coming forth into creation, whole pure and spontaneous. Desire is inherently selfish but the true will is far beyond selfishness and is therefore selfless. Well, thats how I see it anyway.

[empyblessing]

I'm curious where the Satanic salute fits into this. There must be some organization that all of these people belong to. Is there some hidden meaning, message to this hand sign. I realize the mass interpretation of it is for hookem horns and some bands use it. Are these the groups at Bohemian Grove and the like?

Empyblessing <------is confused. :confused:

[cruise4]

"A non-dualistic, non-judgmental, non-interference paradigm with an understanding of both intrinsic nature and Oneness"

How can you not see the total contradiction here?

[cruise4]

http://piratenews.org/deesbohemian.jpg

[empyblessing]

"A non-dualistic, non-judgmental, non-interference paradigm with an understanding of both intrinsic nature and Oneness"

How can you not see the total contradiction here?

OK. I don't see it. Inner self and Oneness contradict non-interference?

Well if that's the case then fine. The way is both left and right.

[marpat]

It seems this thread has gone from define satanism to describe the true will.

[empyblessing]

It seems this thread has gone from define satanism to describe the true will.

Yeah, but I'm not one to judge.