Freemasonry - Secret Society, or not?

[meridiansun]

It is often claimed that Freemasonry is a "secret society". With the advent of the internet and google search, there is very little in life these days that can be considered a true secret.

Freemasonry literally has opened it's doors in recent years. It's now possible for non masons to go into the masonic temple at the United Grand Lodge of England and walk around, admiring the wonderful architecture this building has to offer. There's also the publicly accessible library and museum.

Why then do people still consider Freemasonry to be a society more secret than, for example, gentleman's clubs, the Womans Institute, or the Institute of Directors?

What do people see as being the secrets of freemasonry that people cannot find out for themselves?

[thelonious]

Personally, I'm not very keen on the ignoring of the importance of secrecy that has been filling our Lodges lately. It seems to me that if Masons are offended by secrecy, they probably shouldn't be Masons.

Brother Joshua Gunn, 32°, has written an excellent article called "The Importance of Secrecy", which appeared in the latest edition of the Scottish Rite Journal. It can be read in full here:

http://www.scottishrite.org/ee.php?/journal/articles/the_importance_of_secrecy/

[motox]

It is often claimed that Freemasonry is a "secret society". With the advent of the internet and google search, there is very little in life these days that can be considered a true secret.

Freemasonry literally has opened it's doors in recent years. It's now possible for non masons to go into the masonic temple at the United Grand Lodge of England and walk around, admiring the wonderful architecture this building has to offer. There's also the publicly accessible library and museum.

Why then do people still consider Freemasonry to be a society more secret than, for example, gentleman's clubs, the Womans Institute, or the Institute of Directors?

What do people see as being the secrets of freemasonry that people cannot find out for themselves?

beyond the 33rd degree till that door opens i dont think you would even know :D:D

[jacob sladder]

beyond the 33rd degree till that door opens i dont think you would even know :D:D

Motox, are you saying that you are a Mason above the '33rd' degree then?

I assume you are in the USA as only 3 Degrees are apparently recognised by the Grand Lodge of England.

[motox]

Motox, are you saying that you are a Mason above the '33rd' degree then?

I assume you are in the USA as only 3 Degrees are apparently recognised by the Grand Lodge of England.

yes i am 33rd degree and beyond david icke realist:D:D

[jacob sladder]

yes i am 33rd degree and beyond david icke realist:D:D

Ah, I see - you know all the answers already then!!

;)

[thelonious]

Motox, are you saying that you are a Mason above the '33rd' degree then?

I assume you are in the USA as only 3 Degrees are apparently recognised by the Grand Lodge of England.

Motox isn't a Mason.

Also, here in the USA, it's the same as in England, no Grand Lodge recognizes any degree above the third.

[montag]

beyond the 33rd degree till that door opens i dont think you would even know :D:D
I've heard that life begins at 40..;)

[damagedbrainn]

If Freemasonry no longer has any secrets (and I don't think it really does), then what's the point of its continued existence?

The answer to that question is why lodges are opening their doors to the public, and why you see more recruiting ads and "documentaries" (also just ads)...because membership is declining. Too little too late, in my opinion. This is typically what happens when a group or organization chooses tradition over progress...it dies a slow death.

[kweli]

It is often claimed that Freemasonry is a "secret society". With the advent of the internet and google search, there is very little in life these days that can be considered a true secret.

Freemasonry literally has opened it's doors in recent years. It's now possible for non masons to go into the masonic temple at the United Grand Lodge of England and walk around, admiring the wonderful architecture this building has to offer. There's also the publicly accessible library and museum.

Why then do people still consider Freemasonry to be a society more secret than, for example, gentleman's clubs, the Womans Institute, or the Institute of Directors?
What do people see as being the secrets of freemasonry that people cannot find out for themselves?

Maybe because these people don't actually hide what they do?

Why do Freemasons keep it so secret, if everything is above board? I'm not talking about you guys here, I'm talking about the people we allow to be in power: Royalty, Politicians, Milatary officials, etc. etc. If it's not a secret, why not just openly declare it? I have never heard anyone in authority, speak out and say 'I'm A Freemason' If it is just an innocent, benevolent society, then what's the problem? Surely we have a right to know 'who's in bed with who' so to speak? Perhaps, if there was more transparency in this area, folk wouldn't be so mistrusting and suspect the whole movement of conspriracy.

[perry_mason]

Maybe because these people don't actually hide what they do?

Why do Freemasons keep it so secret, if everything is above board? I'm not talking about you guys here, I'm talking about the people we allow to be in power: Royalty, Politicians, Milatary officials, etc. etc. If it's not a secret, why not just openly declare it? I have never heard anyone in authority, speak out and say 'I'm A Freemason' If it is just an innocent, benevolent society, then what's the problem? Surely we have a right to know 'who's in bed with who' so to speak? Perhaps, if there was more transparency in this area, folk wouldn't be so mistrusting and suspect the whole movement of conspriracy.

I think one reason people don't stand up and declare it is that it is personnal and part of your private life, it's not somthing that has any relevence to your job. Another reason would be the attitude of certain people to Freemasons, see some other forumites posts for examples of groundless and insulting accusations. I'm proud to be a Mason and talk to my friends and colleagues about it.

Anyway, members of the Police force are encouraged to declare their membership when they join, so to help increase transparancy. It would be more effective if people declared what golf club they belonged to etc. this is where the real networking goes on but then this also would be an infringement of peoples personnel lives.

As for royalty, they do openly declare it:

http://www.ugle.org.uk/ugle/whos-who.htm

[perry_mason]

If Freemasonry no longer has any secrets (and I don't think it really does), then what's the point of its continued existence?

The answer to that question is why lodges are opening their doors to the public, and why you see more recruiting ads and "documentaries" (also just ads)...because membership is declining. Too little too late, in my opinion. This is typically what happens when a group or organization chooses tradition over progress...it dies a slow death.

In a way you're right, the modes of recognition are all over the net, and these are the only secrets. But Secrets dont equal Masonry. The modes of recogntion and intiations are simply what ties everyone together. Everyone gets something different out of Masonry, but generally it serves to help you become a better person and to work in greater harmony with the world, the secrets do not help you improve yourself IMHO, there simply a common experience that all Masons share.

One of the reasons for Masonic Halls opening their doors and there being a move to show how transparent things are is because we're constantly being accused of things we'd never do ie; devil worship! Under UGLE I don't beleive there are any recruitment adds, but if you choose to take open days and docs in that way thats fair enough.

You're right, membership is declining but I wouldn't call 300,000 members in Britain a precurser to death! The main reason for the decline in numbers is because of the massive expansion in memebership after WW2, where the brotherly love and an all male atmosphere aspects appealed deepley to ex-servicemen who joined in droves. Sadly, these members are now being 'called to higher service' or not able to attend lodge more and more frequently and this has been the case for the last 20-30 years. There are other reasons but the theory is that the current decline is a natural contraction after the unsuiatainable numbers that joined in the middle of the last century. Expansion and contraction of memership has been common trait of speculative Masonry since it's inception.

[mike martin]

beyond the 33rd degree till that door opens i dont think you would even know :D:D

Errm, well amongst my books I have a copy of "the Egyptian Masonic History of the Original and Unabridged Ancient And 96 Degree Rite of Memphis" (1879) and i'm not a member, I bought it off Ebay

Mike

[mike martin]

If Freemasonry no longer has any secrets (and I don't think it really does), then what's the point of its continued existence?
The first Masonic Ritual exposure was published about 10 years after the first Grand Lodge of England set up shop in 1717. The thing about Freemasonry is not knowing the words but actually experiencing the Ritual and the fellowship of a Lodge. It doesn't actually matter that the secrets are out there they aren't what's important in Freemasonry.

The answer to that question is why lodges are opening their doors to the public, and why you see more recruiting ads and "documentaries" (also just ads)...because membership is declining. Too little too late, in my opinion. This is typically what happens when a group or organization chooses tradition over progress...it dies a slow death.

It is true that Freemasonry is going through a down-size at the moment but that is nature at work rather than its death throes. After WWII the UGLE saw a massive influx of guys coming home after war and looking to continue the cameraderie they had found in the Services. This caused a blip in membership, what we are now seeing is nature taking its course as these guys are reaching their 80s an 90s and shuffling off the mortal coil.

However, that is not why Freemasonry is being more open about itself. Before WWII Freemasonry was a common facet of British life and parades and stone laying ceremonies were common fare. Unlike today, Freemasons were looked at as "pillars of Society" not as rogues and thieves. The War and Hitler's attitude to Freemasons changed all that, as he was being very successful cross Europe and Britain did expect to fall. That was when Freemasonry became "secret", unfortunately the "secrecy" remained until the 1980s until martin short's book showed the UGLE what a stupid idea it was to try and hide away.

Mike

[synergy777]

i say why waste energy on masons, illuminati etc. these are factions.

we give them more attention than they deserve to be frank.

focus on the real players, the vatican/jesuits/smom, the bilderbergers, the financial/industrial families.

the monarchies of this world, the saxe coburg gothas, the saudi royal family, the zionists, the wahabbis, the british israelies etc.

learn the history of empres/religions and maybe you will see how this all fits together.

also learn the basics of science, and then delve into wave/particle duality, electric universe etc.

[perry_mason]

i say why waste energy on masons, illuminati etc. these are factions.

we give them more attention than they deserve to be frank.


You mean why waste energy trying to fit together an actual cogent argument with evidence to back it up. It is much more fun to just make things up.

[3ill]

tenchar.

[kweli]

You mean why waste energy trying to fit together an actual cogent argument with evidence to back it up. It is much more fun to just make things up.

I think you're being a little condescending there. There is PLENTY of evidence to back up what Synergy is talking about; have you done any research in these areas?

[perry_mason]

A little frustrated maybe, I've not seen any evidence or real motive for any of the allegations that have been made against Freemasonry on this site. Yet I am constantly called a liar/drone/tacit accessory to murder for simply presenting my opinion.

[mike martin]

I think you're being a little condescending there. There is PLENTY of evidence to back up what Synergy is talking about; have you done any research in these areas?

The problem with this question is addressed by asking you what research you have done on Freemasonry from Masonic sources. The answer will, of course, be none.

If you research a subject with information only coming from a source which is against it you will come up with negative concusions about it. However, if you research from a broad base you will come up with inconsistencies that must be addressed. This is the problem!

Your info, so far, is uniformly telling you one thing about Freemasonry if you were to investigate using different sources you too would see that there are inconsistencies in that information.

Here's an example: Of the hundreds of Masons who have written about Freemasonry in the last 300 years how many do your sources quote from?

I'll give you a clue:

Albert Pike, Manly Palmer Hall, J D Buck, Albert Mackey and CW Leadbetter.

Why is this?

It's because it is only in some of the books these guys wrote that Anti-Masons have been able to find material that can be misquoted to support their claims.

So where are the quotes from the many books by the likes of Bernard E Jones, JSM Ward, Colin Dyer, George Oliver, W Kirk Macnulty, Harry Carr, George Martin, JT Lawrence, Dudley Wright, Joseph Fort Newton just to name a tiny handful who have written books that are more readily read by actual Freemasons.

Mike