View Full Version : hopi /sumerian creation myths
Some interesting parallels here .Especially the sumarian stuff icke exposes
http://www.crystalinks.com/hopicreation.html
Hopi Creation Myths
By Robert Morningside
The Hopi believe the Creator of Man is a woman.
The Sumerians believed the Creator of Man was a woman.
The Hopi believe the Father Creator is KA.
The Sumerians believed the Father Essence was KA.
The Hopi believe Taiowa, the Sun God, is the Creator of the Earth.
The Sumerians believe TA.EA was the Creator.
The Hopi believe two brothers had guardianship of the Earth.
The Sumerians believed two brothers had dominion over the Earth.
The Hopi believe Alo to be spiritual guides.
The Sumerians believed AL.U to be beings of Heaven.
The Hopi believe Kachinas (Kat'sinas) are the spirits of nature
and the messengers and teachers sent by the Great Spirit.
The Sumerians believed KAT.SI.NA were righteous ones sent of God.
The Hopi believe Eototo is the Father of Katsinas.
The Sumerians believed EA.TA was the Father of all beings.
The Hopi believe Chakwaina is the Chief of Warriors.
The Sumerians believed TAK.AN.U was the Heavenly Destroyer.
The Hopi believe Nan-ga-Sohu is the Chasing Star Katsina.
The Sumerians believed NIN.GIR.SU to be the Master of Starships.
The Hopi believe Akush to be the Dawn Katsina.
The Sumerians believed AK.U to be Beings of light.
The Hopi believe Danik to be Guardians in the Clouds.
The Sumerians believed DAK.AN to be Sky Warriors.
The Hopi believe Sotunangu is a Sky Katsina.
The Sumerians believed TAK.AN.IKU were Sky Warriors.
The Hopi name for the Pleaides is ChooChookam.
The Sumerians believed SHU. SHU.KHEM were the supreme Stars.
The Hopi believe Tapuat is the name of Earth.
The Sumerians believed Tiamat was the name of Earth.
The Hopi call a snake Chu'a.
The Sumerians called a snake SHU.
The Hopi word for "dead" is Mokee.
The Sumerians used KI. MAH to mean "dead."
The Hopi use Omiq to mean above, up.
The Sumerians used AM.IK to mean looking to Heaven.
The Hopi believe Tuawta is One Who Sees Magic.
The Sumerians believed TUAT.U was One from the Other World.
The Hopi believe Pahana was the Lost Brother who would
one day return to assist the Hopi and humankind.
The Sumerians would recognize PA.HA.NA
as an Ancestor from heaven who would return.
octopusrex
22-03-2008, 03:54 PM
Hopi = Hope!
y'know if the mormons are right then that means all the stuff about the hopis and the sumerians are plausable. and anyways the hopi don't write shit down its an oral tradition, so what was to stop some hopi indian being told about sumerian legends 100 years ago and him thinking "cool i'll nick that"? i'm not pouring cold water i'm tring to go through possibilities that nobody else seems to want to think about.
octopusrex
08-04-2008, 08:59 PM
I'll put it to you this way:
There is hope in the four corners.
y'know if the mormons are right then that means all the stuff about the hopis and the sumerians are plausable. and anyways the hopi don't write shit down its an oral tradition, so what was to stop some hopi indian being told about sumerian legends 100 years ago and him thinking "cool i'll nick that"? i'm not pouring cold water i'm tring to go through possibilities that nobody else seems to want to think about.
Thats what I'm trying to figure as we usually think short hair suit and tie bad long hair tribal good .So many of the native legends and myths contain similar stories like the ant people who live underground but came from the stars .They are Grey with large heads and small bodies .There are other legends that link the same .presuming that they have good and bad factions within them like humans do .:D
I'll put it to you this way:
There is hope in the four corners.
huh?
Thats what I'm trying to figure as we usually think short hair suit and tie bad long hair tribal good .So many of the native legends and myths contain similar stories like the ant people who live underground but came from the stars .They are Grey with large heads and small bodies .There are other legends that link the same .presuming that they have good and bad factions within them like humans do .:D
yeah but where do we get these stories from? who tells us? i'm not having a go but have you met any hopi indians? or have you found out 2nd or 3rd maybe even 4th hand from someone else? i don't really know the point i'm trying to make.
huh?
yeah but where do we get these stories from? who tells us? i'm not having a go but have you met any hopi indians? or have you found out 2nd or 3rd maybe even 4th hand from someone else? i don't really know the point i'm trying to make.
I haven't met any first hand ,but have a friend who stayed with various tribes in America .Her other half at the time was an adopted Hopi , he was doing some shamanic type work .building medicine wheels in different countries .She has friends still who are native Americans and has told me a few stories of her time with them and their legends etc . I haven't really had the opportunity to speak to them as yet , but I'm told the elders aren't ones for casual chat and dont give much away .Another friend of the same woman has just gone back to America to finish work on a documentary film he is producing concerning the creation of the sacred pipe ceremony .I will chat to him some more when he has finished it and maybe post some links when it is available :D
I haven't met any first hand ,but have a friend who stayed with various tribes in America .Her other half at the time was an adopted Hopi , he was doing some shamanic type work .building medicine wheels in different countries .She has friends still who are native Americans and has told me a few stories of her time with them and their legends etc . I haven't really had the opportunity to speak to them as yet , but I'm told the elders aren't ones for casual chat and dont give much away .Another friend of the same woman has just gone back to America to finish work on a documentary film he is producing concerning the creation of the sacred pipe ceremony .I will chat to him some more when he has finished it and maybe post some links when it is available :D
i'm not disbelieving you, but its a bit handy isn't it? not you but a friend. again i want to stress that i'm not calling you a liar or anything.
i'm not disbelieving you, but its a bit handy isn't it? not you but a friend. again i want to stress that i'm not calling you a liar or anything.
Even if i spoke to them personally it doesnt prove anything though does it .
Unless you experience it yourself first hand and then it could be misinterpreted or implaneted thru drugs or technology .In this day and age nothing is miraculous any more and stories are just stories true or not .If we both witnessed the same event and told our versions of it they would differ so go figure :D
true. i guess we're fucked.
true. i guess we're fucked.
LOL i guess we just have to be at peace with ourselves and dont worry about a thing , really when it comes down to it no use worrying what if .What if may never happen and if it does deal with it then . Everyone else will be in the same boat so we shouldnt be trying to cope alone .
Like you say the legends are oral traditions passed on and prophecy can be interpreted in many ways , each generation probably tries to make them fit the times they live in .There will always be wars and disasters , Hopefully we can progress beyond that :D
amethyst
13-04-2008, 07:05 PM
I haven't met any first hand ,but have a friend who stayed with various tribes in America .Her other half at the time was an adopted Hopi , he was doing some shamanic type work .building medicine wheels in different countries .She has friends still who are native Americans and has told me a few stories of her time with them and their legends etc . I haven't really had the opportunity to speak to them as yet , but I'm told the elders aren't ones for casual chat and dont give much away .Another friend of the same woman has just gone back to America to finish work on a documentary film he is producing concerning the creation of the sacred pipe ceremony .I will chat to him some more when he has finished it and maybe post some links when it is available :D
I put this in my "animal " thread but want to post it here.....
I recently found out that my great grandmother on my father's side, was from the Cheyenne Indian tribe.
I've recently been researching a lot of history of the native American Indians. I came across this and thought it fits well here since it's a thread on animals. I think it is a beautiful story.
http://www.indigenouspeople.net/yellowst.htm
Yellowstone Valley and the Great Flood
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"I have heard it told on the Cheyenne Reservation in Montana and the Seminole camps in the Florida Everglades, I have heard it from the Eskimos north of the Arctic Circle and the Indians south of the equator. The legend of the flood is the most universal of all legends. It is told in Asia, Africa, and Europe, in North America and the South Pacific." Professor Hap Gilliland of Eastern Montana College was the first to record this legend of the great flood.
This is one of the fifteen legends of the flood that he himself recorded in various parts of the world:
He was an old Indian. his face was weather beaten, but his eyes were still bright. I never knew what tribe he was from, though I could guess. Yet others from the tribe whom I talked to later had never heard his story.
We had been talking of the visions of the young men. He sat for a long time, looking out across the Yellowstone Valley through the pouring rain, before he spoke. "They are beginning to come back," he said.
"Who is coming back?" I asked.
"The animals," he said. "It has happened before."
"Tell me about it.'
He thought for a long while before he lifted his hands and his eyes. "The Great Spirit smiled on this land when he made it. There were mountains and plains, forests and grasslands. There were animals of many kinds--and men."
The old man's hands moved smoothly, telling the story more clearly than his voice.
The Great Spirit told the people, "These animals are your brothers. Share the land with them. They will give you food and clothing. Live with them and protect them.
"Protect especially the buffalo, for the buffalo will give you food and shelter. The hide of the buffalo will keep you from the cold, from the heat, and from the rain. As long as you have the buffalo, you will never need to suffer."
For many winters the people lived at peace with the animals and with the land. When they killed a buffalo, they thanked the Great Spirit, and they used every part of the buffalo. It took care of every need.
Then other people came. They did not think of the animals as brothers. They killed, even when they did not need food. They burned and cut the forests, and the animals died. They shot the buffalo and called it sport. They killed the fish in the streams.
When the Great Spirit looked down, he was sad. He let the smoke of the fires lie in the valleys. The people coughed and choked. But still they burned and they killed.
So the Great Spirit sent rains to put out the fires and to destroy the people.
The rains fell, and the waters rose. The people moved from the flooded valleys to the higher land.
Spotted Bear, the medicine man, gathered together his people. He said to them, "The Great Spirit has told us that as long as we have the buffalo we will be safe from heat and cold and rain. But there are no longer any buffalo. Unless we can find buffalo and live at peace with nature, we will all die."
Still the rains fell, and the waters rose. The people moved from the flooded plains to the hills.
The young men went out and hunted for the buffalo. As they went they put out the fires. They made friends with the animals once more. They cleaned out the streams.
Still the rains fell, and the waters rose. The people moved from the flooded hills to the mountains.
Two young men came to Spotted Bear. "We have found the buffalo," they said. "There was a cow, a calf, and a great white bull. The cow and the calf climbed up to the safety of the mountains. They should be back when the rain stops. But the bank gave way, and the bull was swept away by the floodwaters. We followed and got him to shore, but he had drowned. We have brought you his hide."
They unfolded a huge white buffalo skin.
Spotted Bear took the white buffalo hide. "Many people have been drowned," he said. "Our food has been carried away. But our young people are no longer destroying the world that was created for them. They have found the white buffalo. It will save those who are left."
Still the rains fell, and the waters rose. The people moved from the flooded mountains to the highest peaks.
Spotted Bear spread the white buffalo skin on the ground. He and the other medicine men scraped it and stretched it, and scraped it and stretched it.
Still the rains fell. Like all rawhide, the buffalo skin stretched when it was wet. Spotted Bear stretched it out over the village. All the people who were left crowded under it.
As the rains fell, the medicine men stretched the buffalo skin across the mountains. Each day they stretched it farther.
Then Spotted Bear tied one corner to the top of the Big Horn Mountains. That side, he fastened to the Pryors. The next corner he tied to the Bear Tooth Mountains. Crossing the Yellowstone Valley, he tied one corner to the Crazy Mountains, and the other to Signal Butte in the Bull Mountains.
The whole Yellowstone Valley was covered by the white buffalo skin. Though the rains still fell above, it did not fall in the Yellowstone Valley.
The waters sank away. Animals from the outside moved into the valley, under the white buffalo skin. The people shared the valley with them.
Still the rains fell above the buffalo skin. The skin stretched and began to sag.
Spotted Bear stood on the Bridger Mountains and raised the west end of the buffalo skin to catch the West Wind. The West Wind rushed in and was caught under the buffalo skin. The wind lifted the skin until it formed a great dome over the valley.
The Great Spirit saw that the people were living at peace with the earth. The rains stopped, and the sun shone. As the sun shone on the white buffalo skin, it gleamed with colours of red and yellow and blue.
As the sun shone on the rawhide, it began to shrink. The ends of the dome shrank away until all that was left was one great arch across the valley.
The old man's voice faded away; but his hands said "Look," and his arms moved toward the valley.
The rain had stopped and a rainbow arched across the Yellowstone Valley. A buffalo calf and its mother grazed beneath it."