"The Truth About Islam" blog

[dave31]

Have you guys viewed these videos yet?

"The Truth About Islam" blog
http://islamwatchers.blogspot.com

Enjoy these VIDEOS of Muslim clerics speaking to other Muslims spreading hate speech - they've been doing this long BEFORE 9-11.
http://islamwatchers.blogspot.com/

Send your own copy of this open letter to state & local representatives:

"An Open Letter to Politicians and Lawmakers in the United States"
http://nodhimmi.9f.com/

Dhimwit:

"A non-Muslim member of a free society that abets the stated cause of Islamic domination with remarkable gullibility. A dhimwit is always quick to extend sympathy to the very enemy that would take away his or her own freedom (or life) if given the opportunity."
http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/Pages/Dhimwits.htm

"Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant. The Koran, the Muslim book of scripture, should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on Earth."

-- Omar M. Ahmad, founder of Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR)

[blue]

bastards, they want to rule the world.

[optimus pigpot]

more blue, more!!!!!!!!!

[dave31]

VIDEOS

"Make Way for the Monster Mosque in Londonistan"
YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

"Islam: The Culture of Hatred"
Islam: The Culture of Hatred - YouTube

Sexual Abuse of Children Authorized by Islamic Clerics
YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

"Muslim Mickey Mouse Calls for Muslim World Domination"
YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

"CNN "The war within" - Part 1"
CNN documentary "The war within" - Part 1 - YouTube

"A Worldwide Islamic State"
http://www.islamic-world.net/videos/state.htm

[zarah]

Christian and Jewish preachers also spout the same divisive rhetoric, so why focus on one particular faith? Is it because msm is using this kind of rubbish to propagate the same image in an attempt to gain justification for the illegal attacks on Islamic countries, so therefore, just as a sheep does, you follow?

The website your advertising doesn't seem to be anything more than the usual anti Islamic tripe seen all over the televison at the moment. The creator of the blog doesn't identify him or herself but I wouldn't be surprised if they were either a fundy Christian or Ashkenezi Jew, probably the former.

Rather than post such biased bilge, why not post both sides to a tenacious and complicated argument. Or would that be too much to ask?

[dave31]

Well, lets see, first of all, this is the religion section where folks discuss religion, right? And Islam is a religion so it seems to me that this is in fact the place to discuss Islam.

When folks discuss Christianity or Judaism here or elsewhere do you give them a hard time for not bringing in Islam? No, you don't. "Tu quoque" or "you too" will not work here as I do not support Christianity or any other religion either. This is a tactic Muslims use to distract from the issues at hand and to censor discussion about Islam. You can learn a bit about it by viewing the "Taqqiyah & Jihad (Deception & Holy War)" video in the blog. http://islamwatchers.blogspot.com

Zarah "attempt to gain justification for the illegal attacks on Islamic countries"

- I never supported the war in Iraq nor do I trust the US gov't so again, you're barking up the wrong tree with false assumptions. I do however, absolutely refuse to be just another "Dhimwit" and lie down to be run over by fascist Islam so that they may achieve worldwide dominion. Since 9-11 though, I've seen nothing done to stop the illegal or legal immigration of Muslims into countries like Sweden, Brittan, France and elsewhere where Muslims are taking over.

Z "creator of the blog doesn't identify him or herself..."

- Probably not stupid enough to run the risk of getting them self murdered. Good on them, I say.

Z "...either a fundy Christian or Ashkenezi Jew"

- Nice ad hom fallacy. Don't address the fact that those videos are of Muslims speaking to other Muslims, instead treat it as if it were created by a Christian or Jew, blaming them instead. Okay, Whatever you say Hitler.

Z "Rather than post such biased bilge, why not post both sides to a tenacious and complicated argument. Or would that be too much to ask?"

- See here's the problem, most of the videos are of MUSLIMS speaking to thousands of other MUSLIMS. The other videos are of ex-Muslims. Was *I* in those videos speaking to thousands of Muslims making comments like:

"Muslims Will Rule America, Britain...and the Entire World; Israel is a Cancer; Jews are a Virus Resembling AIDS; Muslims Will Finish Them Off."

"The Mufti of Egypt explains that "women in some cultures are not averse to beatings."Allah permits wife beating as a means to preserve the family."

"Islam isn't in America to be equal to any other faith, but to become dominant. The Koran, the Muslim book of scripture, should be the highest authority in America, and Islam the only accepted religion on Earth."

-- Omar M. Ahmad, founder of Council on American-Islamic Relations (CAIR)

No, they were MUSLIM CLERICS. So rather than try to blame all of this on me, your time would be better spent addressing those Muslims in your own backyard and garden.

Islam: Governing Under Sharia
http://www.cfr.org/publication/8034/

International Campaign Against Sharia Law
http://www.nosharia.com

[dave31]

A post from a friend ...

"Sharia law 'unavoidable' in Britain: leader of Anglican church"
- yahoo news
http://news.yahoo.com/s/afp/20080207/wl_afp/britainreligionchristianislamlaw;_ylt=Aq3RKHTXCgIe yid7hs.Gk_x0bBAF

For all of this wretched, pathetic, accommodationist attitude, there are a lot of tolerant, liberal Europeans that are increasingly pissed off about this; I personally know several. If this kind of BS continues, there will be a culture war, and probably a violent one.

The absolute refusal of certain Muslim groups to integrate into European society is a problem that must be addressed, and the current burying-the-heads-in-sand attitude of European governments will have disastrous consequences.

Appeasement of toxic ideologies never works: just ask Neville Chamberlain...

UK to extradite Islamic preacher -

"LONDON - Britain's Home Office on Thursday approved the extradition of an Islamic preacher who is accused of trying to establish a terrorist training camp in Oregon, a spokesman said."

"Al-Masri already has been sentenced to seven years' imprisonment in Britain for fomenting racial hatred and urging his followers to kill non-Muslims."
http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20080207/ap_on_re_eu/britain_us_radical_preacher;_ylt=A0WTUZo2U6tHPYsAB A.ROrgF

"Tolerance of intolerance is cowardice"
http://ayaanhirsiali.org

[zarah]

You don't know what I say in other topics about other religions. If you bothered to look, you'd see I say the same kinda thing.

Care to define what 'facist Islam' is and just how it's trying to 'achieve world domination'?

Fundamentalists exist in all religions, that's not to suggest that all religion is fundamentalist...see the difference? Rather than focus on the negatives in Islam, why not look at the positives? Do you not think there could be anything positive within its tenets?

[dave31]

G'day Zarah,

I'm still new here so I'm not going to pretend to be familiar with your views. But I'm willing to listen to what you have to say.

I cannot and will not just focus on the positives of any religion without also investigating the negatives. I think there are positive tenets but that does not excuse all the negative done in its name.

Over and over again, I'm failing to see any moderation or democracy in religion be it Christianity or Islam. I am much more familiar with Christianity but what I've learned about Islam makes me not trust it either.

Moderate, Democratic Christianity, Islam?

What yard stick can we use to determine if a religion is truly moderate and democratic or not? What is the standard against which a religion can be measured. In this case, Christianity and Islam.

I'm just gonna toss out a few thoughts off the top of my melon just to get us started:

* First, we would need to have agreement on the definition of moderate and the same with a definition of democratic.

* Second, we need to separate the texts which have not really changed, from society and people who do and have changed.

* Third, check the scriptures pushing for a moderate, democratic Islam vs. scriptures declaring the opposite. Maybe this will help us out a bit, we'll just need to find all of the moderate and democratic scriptures and tally them up - "Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?" (http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2006/06/which-is-more-violent-bible-or-quran.html)

* Fourth, has Islam made necessary adjustments and corrections in its scripture where it was found to be non-authentic?

* Fifth, the areas to begin our investigation to see if any moderate or democratic changes have occurred would be the popular long-time tenets of the faith. Such as the Nicene Creed, 10 Commandments, and End Times prophecies which we are told predict the mass genocide of 2/3rds of the planets human population i.e., all of the non-believers.

* Sixth, where is the observable and verifiable evidence demonstrating Christianity or Islam as a whole to be moving in a moderate, democratic direction? Where is the evidence demonstrating that God, Jesus, Allah and Muhammad have asked them to do so?

Anything else to add? I'm sure there is but so much could be left up to interpretation. Lets try to keep it as simple and scientific as possible.

[zarah]

Hi Dave,


I cannot and will not just focus on the positives of any religion without also investigating the negatives. I think there are positive tenets but that does not excuse all the negative done in its name.

I just asked if you thought there could be any positives. What do you think the positive aspects are? How do they conflict with what you perceive are its negatives?

Over and over again, I'm failing to see any moderation or democracy in religion be it Christianity or Islam. I am much more familiar with Christianity but what I've learned about Islam makes me not trust it either.

Or Judaism, right?

Moderate, Democratic Christianity, Islam?

What yard stick can we use to determine if a religion is truly moderate and democratic or not? What is the standard against which a religion can be measured. In this case, Christianity and Islam.

How about we use the ability to fit in with mainstream society and to conform to its laws? It's not perfect but I think it would be an adequate measure.

I'm just gonna toss out a few thoughts off the top of my melon just to get us started:

* First, we would need to have agreement on the definition of moderate and the same with a definition of democratic.

Or we could just agree that the general definition for each is appropriate otherwise we'll be overcomplicating.

* Second, we need to separate the texts which have not really changed, from society and people who do and have changed.

True. As you know the arabic Qu'ran's text hasn't changed in 1400 years. The Bible, it's generally accepted, has been altered through translation. I believe that the Torah hasn't changed either.
Obviously society evolves which means that followers of faith have to adapt their interpretation of their holy books to suit the present culture. In Islam (apologies for the constant reference, but it's the faith Im most familiar with from the three) there's a great deal of debate regarding how relevent the Qu'ran's text in within today's society. The general consensus is that Muslims must comply with the law of the land they reside in.

* Third, check the scriptures pushing for a moderate, democratic Islam vs. scriptures declaring the opposite. Maybe this will help us out a bit, we'll just need to find all of the moderate and democratic scriptures and tally them up - "Which is more violent, the Bible or the Quran?" (http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.com/2006/06/which-is-more-violent-bible-or-quran.html)

I don't understand your point here, you'll have to clarify for me. Why do you think this is necessary?

* Fourth, has Islam made necessary adjustments and corrections in its scripture where it was found to be non-authentic?

Muslims believe that the Qu'ran, which means 'recitation', was recorded by Muhammed as dicated by God, therefore, there can be no mistakes.

* Fifth, the areas to begin our investigation to see if any moderate or democratic changes have occurred would be the popular long-time tenets of the faith. Such as the Nicene Creed, 10 Commandments, and End Times prophecies which we are told predict the mass genocide of 2/3rds of the planets human population i.e., all of the non-believers.

All monothesitic religions basically believe the same 'end of times' story. They just disagree on what the purpose is and who will be 'saved'.

* Sixth, where is the observable and verifiable evidence demonstrating Christianity or Islam as a whole to be moving in a moderate, democratic direction? Where is the evidence demonstrating that God, Jesus, Allah and Muhammad have asked them to do so?

Your initial argument was you believe that 'facist Islam's' aim is 'worldwide domination'.

The problem I have with religion, including Islam, is that a text is open to personal interpretation, and whilst millions of people use their faith as a moral guide and live in peace and harmony, others use it to further their own political aims and ideals. From Bush and his hegonmistic goals in the Middle East, claiming that God speaks to him, to Jews in Israel and Muslims in Saudi Arabia.

Just to clarify a point, you quote from some Egyptian cleric who claims that the Qu'ran supports wife beating. It doesn't. It states that one's wife doesn't listen then it's permissible to tap them lightly, which is awful enough, but hardly wife beating.

Anything else to add? I'm sure there is but so much could be left up to interpretation. Lets try to keep it as simple and scientific as possible.

Personal interpretation makes that almost impossible.

[john white]

Some RC Priest get caught kiddie fiddling = all christians are peadophiles

See how that works?

Don't give in to fear of Islam: when we de-humanise each other becuase of propoganda, we allow the temporary "power" of a handful of men to disconnect us from God

[optimus pigpot]

Some RC Priest get caught kiddie fiddling = all christians are peadophiles

See how that works?

Don't give in to fear of Islam: when we de-humanise each other becuase of propoganda, we allow the temporary "power" of a handful of men to disconnect us from God

But also, do not give in to Christianity or any organised religion or non-organised religion or any religion.

Hey John, did you not used to be a moderator on this site?

Kind regards, Optimus pigpot...........

[zarah]

Don't give in to fear of Islam: when we de-humanise each other becuase of propoganda, we allow the temporary "power" of a handful of men to disconnect us from God


Agreed.

[jose]

Ever heard of Pat Condell? This just in ... "Sharia fiasco" video - http://blog.myspace.com/index.cfm?fuseaction=blog.view&friendID=119389495&blogID=356577142

[zarah]

In my opinion he's a plant who's being used as a mouthpriece to continue creating and maintaining divisions.

[elirien]

We here in Turkey are facing the same problems with the "mild Islamic" government. We have now the headscarf in universities issue blah blah blah.

Well the only thing I can see is this. I was born into a faithful Islamic family like much of you were born into a faithful Christian family. My family still believes in Islam and its sufis and I admit there are very beautiful things to learn from it, like there is in all religions IMHO.

But that doesn't mean that there are no bastards in this religion. These brutal (as my mother would call them) lower then animal beings are the representation of everything that is wrong in the world, and not only in Islam. These guys are awful and by giving them the attention they don't deserve we are as awful as they are because that is counter-advertisement IMHO.

Take what you like in religions but don't play into their game.
Love all dudes and dudettes out there :D

[jose]

Love all dudes and dudettes out there

What, like in this video "Muslims supporting terror in London Protest"
The Real Islam? Muslims supporting terror in London Protest - YouTube

[elirien]

What, like in this video "Muslims supporting terror in London Protest"
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UufTBjgEE5Q

Did you read what I have written?
Please read the whole post once more. Thank you.

[deliciously_fresh]

Some RC Priest get caught kiddie fiddling = all christians are peadophiles

See how that works?

Don't give in to fear of Islam: when we de-humanise each other becuase of propoganda, we allow the temporary "power" of a handful of men to disconnect us from God

I couldn't agree with you more.

[angelmoon]

Christian and Jewish preachers also spout the same divisive rhetoric, so why focus on one particular faith? Is it because msm is using this kind of rubbish to propagate the same image in an attempt to gain justification for the illegal attacks on Islamic countries, so therefore, just as a sheep does, you follow?

The website your advertising doesn't seem to be anything more than the usual anti Islamic tripe seen all over the televison at the moment. The creator of the blog doesn't identify him or herself but I wouldn't be surprised if they were either a fundy Christian or Ashkenezi Jew, probably the former.

Rather than post such biased bilge, why not post both sides to a tenacious and complicated argument. Or would that be too much to ask?

Well said zarah

bastards, they want to rule the world.
__________________
I am in harmony and balance in all aspects of my life. I find the time to do everything I need to do easily and effortlessly.

the quote here does not reflect the statement Blue

more blue, more!!!!!!!!! optimus pigpot agrees

well i don't see a difference from the people you are speaking about and the racial stirring up you are doing posting this thread
and as you see by the comments above in red it doesnt take much to incite racial hatred x x

[blue]

Well said zarah

bastards, they want to rule the world.
__________________
I am in harmony and balance in all aspects of my life. I find the time to do everything I need to do easily and effortlessly.

the quote here does not reflect the statement Blue

more blue, more!!!!!!!!! optimus pigpot agrees

well i don't see a difference from the people you are speaking about and the racial stirring up you are doing posting this thread
and as you see by the comments above in red it doesnt take much to incite racial hatred x x
you want me to change my signature?

and what do you think of my avatar angelmoon?

[angelmoon]

you want me to change my signature?

and what do you think of my avatar angelmoon?


it's very fetching i am sure,

"suits you sir" x x

[blue]

it's very fetching i am sure,

"suits you sir" x x

blushes

[optimus pigpot]

Christian and Jewish preachers also spout the same divisive rhetoric, so why focus on one particular faith? Is it because msm is using this kind of rubbish to propagate the same image in an attempt to gain justification for the illegal attacks on Islamic countries, so therefore, just as a sheep does, you follow?

The website your advertising doesn't seem to be anything more than the usual anti Islamic tripe seen all over the televison at the moment. The creator of the blog doesn't identify him or herself but I wouldn't be surprised if they were either a fundy Christian or Ashkenezi Jew, probably the former.

Rather than post such biased bilge, why not post both sides to a tenacious and complicated argument. Or would that be too much to ask?

..... you are promoting which side???????

God bless!!!!!