Zeitgeist The Movie

[celtic isis]

hello all!

sorry if this has all been talked about before and i'm late to the Zeitgeist partay...BUT WE JUST WATCHED THE MOVIE TODAY AND FOOK ME IT'S FANTASTIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Ok there wasn't much new to me info wise on the hole (but this is me lol) and i guess not to any of you on here but it's all packaged in such a kickass way for the sheeple! I FOOKING LOVE THIS MOVIE!!!!!!

The way they tie Religon, 9/11, the whole banking fraud, explaining true terrorism and what it's all about, showing how the elite have been /creating hoaxing disasters and killing tonnes of innocent people for profits etc it's just perfection.

Any ideas on how to get this movie around? I want dvds to send around to sheeple who don't even bother with internet lolz...some serious catholic sheeple need to be shifted lol :D

What's everyone think of the movie, are you passing it on etc?

YAY FOR ZEITGEIST!!!!:D

oh it's here by the way!

www.zeitgeistmovie.com

[lizzy]

glad u saw it. brilliant is'nt it.
yes, it is here,
u did mean the 4th Reich...1984
Happy New Year .

[alice1111]

I loved the movie myself and had one person watch it with me.
Unfortunately, I have done my best to share information with people and they go, "Oh no, not that conspiracy crap again." I have bought videos for people, made cd's and then asked even months later, "have you watched it?" "Oh no, haven't had the time yet, etc." I have sent a few of David's books out and get the same thing.
I have even gotten people truly pissed at me for suggesting such a thing. And for gawd's sake, don't mention the reptiles.
I don't mean to sound like a defeatest, but I give up.
Hopefully, you will have better luck.

Alice

[lizzy]

I loved the movie myself and had one person watch it with me.
Unfortunately, I have done my best to share information with people and they go, "Oh no, not that conspiracy crap again." I have bought videos for people, made cd's and then asked even months later, "have you watched it?" "Oh no, haven't had the time yet, etc." I have sent a few of David's books out and get the same thing.
I have even gotten people truly pissed at me for suggesting such a thing. And for gawd's sake, don't mention the reptiles.
I don't mean to sound like a defeatest, but I give up.
Hopefully, you will have better luck.

Alice

hi Alice,
I think we all have and will still will have many rejections from friends ect about the NWO. I have a son who refuses to see their agenda.
In all honesty I don't run with the reptile theory but I cke has still shown us the problem - reaction - solution .....global domination of us.
Try ......AlanWatt at............<cuttingthroughthematrix> for hours of great factual listening .
Happy New Year .

[alice1111]

Yeah, I have downloaded all of Alan Watt's audios and will listen to them. Sometimes need more time, you know?

Thank you,

Alice

[celtic isis]

glad u saw it. brilliant is'nt it.
yes, it is here,
u did mean the 4th Reich...1984
Happy New Year .

happy new year to you too lizzy :)

hehe i actually meant that the link is here but both are equally true!

darn it i'm late to the partay! better late than never!

[celtic isis]

Yeah, I have downloaded all of Alan Watt's audios and will listen to them. Sometimes need more time, you know?

Thank you,

Alice

hi alice and happy new year, oh yes totally understand that, need more time just for time itself to fit all the new stuff in and also need more time just to get head around it all! been there done that and still doing it! hehe

zeitgeist has cheered me up :)

take care :)

[celtic isis]

I loved the movie myself and had one person watch it with me.
Unfortunately, I have done my best to share information with people and they go, "Oh no, not that conspiracy crap again." I have bought videos for people, made cd's and then asked even months later, "have you watched it?" "Oh no, haven't had the time yet, etc." I have sent a few of David's books out and get the same thing.I have even gotten people truly pissed at me for suggesting such a thing. And for gawd's sake, don't mention the reptiles.
I don't mean to sound like a defeatest, but I give up.
Hopefully, you will have better luck.

Alice

alice you're a real crusader! :) i'm well impressed! don't give up! i feel that too so many times, we all do and at the end of the day, fook them, it's up to them themselves to wake up...you can plant seeds but can't force them, they believe they are right...:rolleyes::D it's their reality...

i know it's beyond frustrating, you've done so much already from what you said...same here take a deep breath, focus on your own journey, the rest will just have to catch up, at least we're already ahead and prepared for what's to come.
No one wants to know/face the truth you see. :)

we appreciate you! :)

[blue]

the movie is brilliant no doubt about it. but one thing they took without finding out is the link between krishna, christ and other similar gods. well krishna as it has been told was born in a jail (basically he was a jailhouse rocker) and he had some 7 or 8 siblings who had been killed by the cruel king. so when krishna was born the parents escaped the jail. and krishna was not born on dec 25. i felt the credibility of the movie would hurt by this.

[celtic isis]

the movie is brilliant no doubt about it. but one thing they took without finding out is the link between krishna, christ and other similar gods. well krishna as it has been told was born in a jail (basically he was a jailhouse rocker) and he had some 7 or 8 siblings who had been killed by the cruel king. so when krishna was born the parents escaped the jail. and krishna was not born on dec 25. i felt the credibility of the movie would hurt by this.

wow i didn't know that blue, must look into it further. still i think the movie really blasts catholicism, i mean it shows how it's basically paganism lol the very thing it portrays as devil worship...oh the irony! so funny to see the "pagan" crosses having pride of place atop most catherdrals and churches lol :D i bet old pope benedict is shaking in his big nimrodian fish hat lol

the movie doesn't even go as far as to point that most of the symbols, traditions customs fables etc come out of babylon and that the vatican itself is full of symbolism originating from there.

hopefully people won't look to far into the krishna thing...

[thirdwave]

Very good video....

this also give people an incite into how there is much knowledge that people just don't get....

the sun and stars are for us all... not a certain group.

[kasalt]

Here's a rebuttal...

ZEITGEIST SPIRIT OF THE AGE REFUTED:

http://video.google.com/googleplayer.swf?docId=7572663630528394775

[gorgeousbutterfly]

anybody heard of this movie being disinfo??

[celtic isis]

anybody heard of this movie being disinfo??

yeah i've seen the comments but nothing in it is disinfo! that's the thing!

i've researched this stuff for 2 years now, it's all just the way it is. Plus in france which is a hugely esoteric country, people are more open about it in society, since coming to live here i've been awoken to so much stuff and found it to be spot on.

only people who can't handle the infomation in the film pipe up that it's disinfo to put doubt in everyone elses's minds.

you want to see disinfo watch the news :)

think about it, a film like this is released, of course they have to jump on it and make it look bad. Also if a film like this is allowed to be released, the elite know about it, but they know how stupid the human race is anyway and they know we won't rebel so they've nothing to worry about. Look at what the media do to icke and tsarion and all the rest, take things they say out of conext and make them look nuts and the masses swallow it.

[celtic isis]

Here's a rebuttal...

ZEITGEIST SPIRIT OF THE AGE REFUTED:

http://video.google.com/googleplayer.swf?docId=7572663630528394775

the link didn't work for me kasalt but my connection is dodgy anyhow so maybe it's me!

[thirdwave]

anybody heard of this movie being disinfo??

Like any film that exposes allot of things, there will of course be a big dis info campaign thrown back at it....

But the meat of it is very correct.

Its not as if Religious people or others with stiff beliefs systems will watch it and say...

"mmmmm shit!, I was wrong! ...damn thanks for letting me know man!... i got to go and find something else to follow now...bugger!" :)

[wolfchild]

Hi Guys!
Everyone Talks On This Forum About ZEITGEIST! How' Comes No One Talks About DAVID'S (FREEDOM OR FASCISM DVD!
Now Thats Mind Blowing'' He Stands There Explaining & Showing Us How This Was Done From The Start!
Has Anyone Seen Or Purchased This DVD?
Trying to AWAKEN Friends Or Family Is Very Hard With Lending Out Our Own Books On DAVID ICKE' As Most Of The Time They Never Read Them.
Trying To Get Your Books Back' Now Thats Even Harder!
Personaly I have However Copied This DVD And Lashed Them Out' And Boy Does This Get The Message Across!
For The Sceptics This Is FAR More Effective Than Lending Out Your Book That You Might Not Get Back and 9 TIMES out of 10 they never Read Them!
If Anyone Has Not Seen David's DVD Then I suggest You See This DVD.
I Have Around 7 Of DAVIDS Best Selling Books (The Big Ones) And Like I say I prefer To Watch Him Rather Than Read him, He Puts It Over So Easy People Can Relate To What He Is Trying To Get Across.
I Tell You Now FREEDOM or FASCISM DVD If It Was FINANCED And Posted Out To UK Homes For Free It Would Have A DEVASTATING Effect On The Goverments & Elite!
I Also Posted This On YOUTUBE When I Was Commenting On ALEX COLLIER!
i Replied And Posted It Around 30 times To See This DVD And Every Single One Has VANISHED!

(yes that's How EFFECTIVE & Dangerous DAVID'S DVD is)

[drakul]

hello all!

sorry if this has all been talked about before and i'm late to the Zeitgeist partay...BUT WE JUST WATCHED THE MOVIE TODAY AND FOOK ME IT'S FANTASTIC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!


Ok there wasn't much new to me info wise on the hole (but this is me lol) and i guess not to any of you on here but it's all packaged in such a kickass way for the sheeple! I FOOKING LOVE THIS MOVIE!!!!!!

The way they tie Religon, 9/11, the whole banking fraud, explaining true terrorism and what it's all about, showing how the elite have been /creating hoaxing disasters and killing tonnes of innocent people for profits etc it's just perfection.

Any ideas on how to get this movie around? I want dvds to send around to sheeple who don't even bother with internet lolz...some serious catholic sheeple need to be shifted lol :D

What's everyone think of the movie, are you passing it on etc?

YAY FOR ZEITGEIST!!!!:D

oh it's here by the way!

www.zeitgeistmovie.com


Zeitgeist is first and foremost an attack on Christianity based on PURE DISinformation which can be EASILY PROVED by simple google checks.


The basis of Zeitgeist's attack on the `myth' of Jesus Christ is from a book pub in 1875, called `The World's 16 Crucified Saviors' by Kersey Graves. Graves was a self-educated former Quaker who lived in Indiana and Ohio. Kersey just simply LIED in order to support his thesis that the stories of all the world's `saviors' were based on the same solar myth. Everyone knows Kersey lied but so-called `scholars' keep repeating his lies and you have the results before you in Zeitgeist - lies repeated as if they were absolute truth.

*According to Zeitgeist - the ancient Egyptian god HORUS was CRUCIFIED. Where is the proof?

Horus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

*There are literally thousands of pictures of Horus from ancient Egypt. Have you ever seen a pic of Horus crucified? If so, why didn't they put it in the video?

*Horus mother Isis was a VIRGIN? Maybe but Isis was ALREADY MARRIED to Osiris when he was killed by Set.

*Krishna's birthday is celebrated on Dec 25?? Where is the proof?
In fact - Krishna's birthday has been celebrated on July 21 for 3,000 YEARS.

*Krishna was born of a VIRGIN? Where is the proof? In fact, Krishna was the 8th child of his mother Devaki.

It's no secret, except to those naieve people who can't lift a finger to do a simple google search.

Krishna - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

*Attis was crucified?
NOT.

Attis - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Attis CASTRATED HIMSELF - how inspiring, (apparently dying from loss of blood) or he was killed by a boar sent by a jealous god - take your pick.

And on and on.....ad infinitum.

As D. Icke recently said - Don't open one mind box only to climb into another. That's exactly what Zeitgeist attempts to do.

[celtic isis]

Zeitgeist is first and foremost an attack on Christianity based on PURE DISinformation which can be EASILY PROVED by simple google checks.


The basis of Zeitgeist's attack on the `myth' of Jesus Christ is from a book pub in 1875, called `The World's 16 Crucified Saviors' by Kersey Graves. Graves was a self-educated former Quaker who lived in Indiana and Ohio. Kersey just simply LIED in order to support his thesis that the stories of all the world's `saviors' were based on the same solar myth. Everyone knows Kersey lied but so-called `scholars' keep repeating his lies and you have the results before you in Zeitgeist - lies repeated as if they were absolute truth.

*According to Zeitgeist - the ancient Egyptian god HORUS was CRUCIFIED. Where is the proof?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horus

*There are literally thousands of pictures of Horus from ancient Egypt. Have you ever seen a pic of Horus crucified? If so, why didn't they put it in the video?

*Horus mother Isis was a VIRGIN? Maybe but Isis was ALREADY MARRIED to Osiris when he was killed by Set.

*Krishna's birthday is celebrated on Dec 25?? Where is the proof?
In fact - Krishna's birthday has been celebrated on July 21 for 3,000 YEARS.

*Krishna was born of a VIRGIN? Where is the proof? In fact, Krishna was the 8th child of his mother Devaki.

It's no secret, except to those naieve people who can't lift a finger to do a simple google search.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Krishna

*Attis was crucified?
NOT.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attis

Attis CASTRATED HIMSELF - how inspiring, (apparently dying from loss of blood) or he was killed by a boar sent by a jealous god - take your pick.

And on and on.....ad infinitum.

As D. Icke recently said - Don't open one mind box only to climb into another. That's exactly what Zeitgeist attempts to do.

you're just nit picking on things that can't be proven, all the esoteric sun worship stuff is bang on. Everyone awakened in france knows this is the real deal.

Christianity is paganism, get over it.

and BTW NOTHING IS MORE DISINFO THAN WIKIPEDIA!!!!

hehe google and wikipeadia hold all the secrets folks! the divine gospel truth! course even the gospels are full of lies lol

i'm sorry i don't want to fight with you drakul, i feel sorry for you :) i don't see how zeitgeist could cause anyone to climb into another box...

i think you're missing the point...the similarities don't have to be like the exact same cause as the stories get passed down from civilisation to civilisation, generation to generation some facts get changed...the whole cross symbolism is bang on and that's allthat matters. Jesus is a fraud the way it's sold to the sheeple, i'm not saying jesus never existed just that the literal religions crap is rubbish. Gnosticism is the only truth or at least the closest.

[celtic isis]

Hi Guys!
Everyone Talks On This Forum About ZEITGEIST! How' Comes No One Talks About DAVID'S (FREEDOM OR FASCISM DVD!Now Thats Mind Blowing'' He Stands There Explaining & Showing Us How This Was Done From The Start!
Has Anyone Seen Or Purchased This DVD?
Trying to AWAKEN Friends Or Family Is Very Hard With Lending Out Our Own Books On DAVID ICKE' As Most Of The Time They Never Read Them.
Trying To Get Your Books Back' Now Thats Even Harder!
Personaly I have However Copied This DVD And Lashed Them Out' And Boy Does This Get The Message Across!
For The Sceptics This Is FAR More Effective Than Lending Out Your Book That You Might Not Get Back and 9 TIMES out of 10 they never Read Them!
If Anyone Has Not Seen David's DVD Then I suggest You See This DVD.
I Have Around 7 Of DAVIDS Best Selling Books (The Big Ones) And Like I say I prefer To Watch Him Rather Than Read him, He Puts It Over So Easy People Can Relate To What He Is Trying To Get Across.
I Tell You Now FREEDOM or FASCISM DVD If It Was FINANCED And Posted Out To UK Homes For Free It Would Have A DEVASTATING Effect On The Goverments & Elite!
I Also Posted This On YOUTUBE When I Was Commenting On ALEX COLLIER!
i Replied And Posted It Around 30 times To See This DVD And Every Single One Has VANISHED!

(yes that's How EFFECTIVE & Dangerous DAVID'S DVD is)

of course we've seen it, i used to spend hours watching it on youtube.

the reason why we don't talk about it (it has been talked about duh at some point) is cause we all know about it, we know icke, don't need to talk about it anymore thank you. and this is a thread about zeitgeist ;)


and icke has a reputation! you give a sheeple an icke dvd to watch they'll tell you to fuck off, he's a fruitcake, or as i have had said to me they ought to name a fruitcake after that man...

icke has tainted himself, people were not ready to learn of the reptilian stuff and it's going too far too fast, plus there's no way of knowing if these reptilian sightings are just projections the elite have made to fool him, they have the power to do that.

As much as i love icke, he's ruined his credibilty in the minds of the sheeple, he played into the media or "medes" (michael tsarion :)) hands and they doctored his persona in the public mind goodo.

zeitgeist is bang on, and not an icke in sight, only his voice at the end, i love icke but he's not a good person to name when trying to awaken people to this. they throw it right back at you.

i know he's amazing to stand up there for 7 hours wiht his arthritis and all without a break...i'd die to go see him in may...but the fact is, people hear icke, they think nutter. sad but true.

[drakul]

you're just nit picking on things that can't be proven, all the esoteric sun worship stuff is bang on. Everyone awakened in france knows this is the real deal.

Christianity is paganism, get over it.

and BTW NOTHING IS MORE DISINFO THAN WIKIPEDIA!!!!

hehe google and wikipeadia hold all the secrets folks! the divine gospel truth! course even the gospels are full of lies lol

i'm sorry i don't want to fight with you drakul, i feel sorry for you :) i don't see how zeitgeist could cause anyone to climb into another box...

i think you're missing the point...the similarities don't have to be like the exact same cause as the stories get passed down from civilisation to civilisation, generation to generation some facts get changed...the whole cross symbolism is bang on and that's allthat matters. Jesus is a fraud the way it's sold to the sheeple, i'm not saying jesus never existed just that the literal religions crap is rubbish. Gnosticism is the only truth or at least the closest.

`the similarities don't have to be like the exact same cause as the stories get passed down from civilisation to civilisation, generation to generation some facts get changed'...

OK so basically what you're saying in essence that 3,000 years ago, Krishna was born of a virgin on Dec 25, even though the Bagavad Gita and the Vedas which are also thousands of years old say something completely different? We are talking about FIRST HAND SOURCES here - the Hindu/Indian people their ancient writings - Hinduism is not a dead religion that is difficult to trace, the records are there for anyone to see.

Does the TRUTH doesn't matter to you? I mean isn't that one of the opening statements in the Zeitgeist doc - `The Truth shall set you free?'

If the truth DOES matter then provide first hand reliable evidence that KRISHNA was born of a virgin on Dec. 25. There are one BILLION Indians in the world, most of them Hindu, so it should be no problem. The Vedas and the Bagavad Gita have been translated into English and are available in any bookstore. And You can easily check online.

Think about it - have you EVER seen a picture or statue of a crucified man in Egyptian or Hindu art?

Show that YOU are not a simple sheople - you seem to get off calling others sheeple. Provide some firsthand EVIDENCE to support any of the Zeitgeist assertions I named above concerning Horus, Krishna, or Attis. I used wikipedia but you don't have to - as long as it is from a verifiable first hand source not some other `alternative' historian who is just quoting another 2nd hand account that goes back to Kersey Graves or his ilk.

I'll bet you can't do it.

[celtic isis]

`the similarities don't have to be like the exact same cause as the stories get passed down from civilisation to civilisation, generation to generation some facts get changed'...

OK so basically what you're saying in essence that 3,000 years ago, Krishna was born of a virgin on Dec 25, even though the Bagavad Gita and the Vedas which are also thousands of years old say something completely different? We are talking about FIRST HAND SOURCES here - the Hindu/Indian people their ancient writings - Hinduism is not a dead religion that is difficult to trace, the records are there for anyone to see.

Does the TRUTH doesn't matter to you? I mean isn't that one of the opening statements in the Zeitgeist doc - `The Truth shall set you free?'

If the truth DOES matter then provide first hand reliable evidence that KRISHNA was born of a virgin on Dec. 25. There are one BILLION Indians in the world, most of them Hindu, so it should be no problem. The Vedas and the Bagavad Gita have been translated into English and are available in any bookstore. And You can easily check online.

Think about it - have you EVER seen a picture or statue of a crucified man in Egyptian or Hindu art?

Show that YOU are not a simple sheople - you seem to get off calling others sheeple. Provide some firsthand EVIDENCE to support any of the Zeitgeist assertions I named above concerning Horus, Krishna, or Attis. I used wikipedia but you don't have to - as long as it is from a verifiable first hand source not some other `alternative' historian who is just quoting another 2nd hand account that goes back to Kersey Graves or his ilk.

I'll bet you can't do it.

i will look into it but i still think the elite probably allowed this film to be put out there cause they knew people like yourself would spend time mulling over ancient details that don't matter really.

look the film gets the word out, i feel it as truth, i've been studying esoteric concepts for 2 years now, i'm no sheeple thank you very much. I awakened about up to 20, 000 people one time to all this stuff and nearly gave myself a stroke with all the abuse i got at the time from said sheeple.

these little details don't matter, i know they do essentially but like are you so picky over the details, the knowledge about our universe and our own humble planet here that all get left out of the textbooks? Or the details thta get left out of the 9/11 commisson etc, all the details blair, bush, rumsfeld, cheney and co leave out?
i will look further into this, i was excited by this film and i still am, i will still be fucking engraving it and sending it around to as many as i can. i believe in it, in its message.

[celtic isis]

god, you start a thread about an inspiring film you've seen that could go places and people have to have some sort of problem with it. :rolleyes:

you might find this interesting drakul

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16437

[kasalt]

Since you've been studying this for years, Celtic, what's your opinion on this:

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=16462

[thirdwave]

Zeitgeist is first and foremost an attack on Christianity based on PURE DISinformation which can be EASILY PROVED by simple google checks.

lol, good old google.... stick a website up and boom! you got your self some facts for people to check out :)

It is not an attack on Christianity at all... It simply explains what the bible is really about and explains why there are so many flaws to it... and also why every religion allthough declears its self indavidual is actualy the same and its leader lived the same as the rest... its explains how it all ties into symbolisem from many years ago..


The basis of Zeitgeist's attack on the `myth' of Jesus Christ is from a book pub in 1875, called `The World's 16 Crucified Saviors' by Kersey Graves.
the messahe was not really that Jesus was a myth... it was more a case of it not being how the bible says and that it is possible that he could not have exsisted....

Graves was a self-educated former Quaker who lived in Indiana and Ohio. Kersey just simply LIED in order to support his thesis that the stories of all the world's `saviors' were based on the same solar myth. Everyone knows Kersey lied but so-called `scholars' keep repeating his lies and you have the results before you in Zeitgeist - lies repeated as if they were absolute truth.
but this info comes from valid info... just like the video explains.... its not made up... its not false... if you don't want to believe it then fine... but it does not mean its lies....

*According to Zeitgeist - the ancient Egyptian god HORUS was CRUCIFIED. Where is the proof?
well how did he die then? ... I heard he was nailed to a tree which was how they crucified people way back then.... im sure there have a been a few people who have cooked up another story to suit their ideals.... but you dont get smoke without fire.


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Horus
goog old google... but that website is not exactly free info is it?.. any website that pops up with just about any word you hit into google has got to be quote powerful....

there are plenty of sources that have Horus being crucified and it has been around for years...

*There are literally thousands of pictures of Horus from ancient Egypt. Have you ever seen a pic of Horus crucified? If so, why didn't they put it in the video? because that wa not how the people that worshipped him wished to ptray him.... the thought of worshipping a person hanging deal with nails smashed in his hands and feet were not really an image worth remembering... Im sure if you fished around you would find some of the more gruesome images... the only reason the church chow Jesus dead on the cross is because its a fear based Religion made to make people kneel and submit..


*Horus mother Isis was a VIRGIN? Maybe but Isis was ALREADY MARRIED to Osiris when he was killed by Set.
More research would tell you that back in those day Virgin did not mean somone who had not had sex.... it actually mean that you were a strong enough women to raise a child on your own.... you were single.


*Krishna's birthday is celebrated on Dec 25?? Where is the proof?
In fact - Krishna's birthday has been celebrated on July 21 for 3,000 YEARS.
I dont belive he said what day his birth was celebrated... he was talking about when he was meant to have been born. its actually quite hard to research this date.. I guess this video is good encouragement for people to dig deep and research these things... of course in the knowledge that many like to cover it up to support there religious beliefs and make sure that they do not become exposed at all.... especially those who benefit from the division they create.

*Krishna was born of a VIRGIN? Where is the proof? In fact, Krishna was the 8th child of his mother Devaki.

Like I say Many years ago virgin did not mean the same thing as today...


It's no secret, except to those naieve people who can't lift a finger to do a simple google search.
not really naive... I don't think this video has convinced anyone... just confirmed to the people who already know how constructed and man made religion is.... not only does it make perfect sense but it is also from genuine research and everything within it can be backup with your own research... and not just quitting after finding a few websites on google trying to cover the huge amount of holes there are to find.

Krishna - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/QUOTE]


*Attis was crucified?
NOT.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Attis
you love your official websites!! :)

Do you think we should take "wikipedia"'s word for it.. or do a little more research?

Attis CASTRATED HIMSELF - how inspiring, (apparently dying from loss of blood) or he was killed by a boar sent by a jealous god - take your pick.
So you admit that no one knows how he really died... but for some odd reason crucifixion was thrown in there!! :)


As D. Icke recently said - Don't open one mind box only to climb into another. That's exactly what Zeitgeist attempts to do.
or just worship "Wikipedia" and be done with it

:rolleyes:

[drakul]

THIRD WAVE - Are you saying you don't have the intellectual moxy to do a little simple research and find out for YOURSELF??? Who cares about Wikipedia as a source - use any first hand source you want.

Do you have any idea who made Zeitgeist? Strange that no one has claimed authorship. But one voice on that video, the voice pushing the anti-Christian agenda is unmistakeable - that of JORDAN MAXWELL. Probably Zeitgeist was produced by Maxwell and or his fellow atheists - the `Truthseekers'. Jordan Maxwell calls himself the dean of conspiracy theorists and has done videos for `Truthseekers' since the mid 90's.

Truthseekers is a small group calling themselves `free thinkers' (atheists) founded in 1873. Truthseekers are funded by? Who knows? Jordan Maxwell was religion editor of the Truthseeker magazine for a few years.
Truthseekers have loo-ong been promoting Kersey Graves' book - `The World's 16 Crucified Saviors' published 1871. Many of the claims in Graves book have been proven to be falsified (such as some of the examples I mentioned above).

My point - Much of Maxwell's claims against Christianity are based on this book. But if his case is that good why write such easily refutable lies?

Acharya S also uses `16 Crucified Saviors' this book as one of her main sources.

Truthseekers is funded by? Who knows?

[kasalt]

Perhaps we are agreeing on the general conclusion but disagreeing on the specifics, but it doesn't help matters much to rely on one mythical source in an attempt to discredit another. The following quotes sum up my views on this debate quite nicely:

"Skeptics sometimes cite Kersey Graves in Sixteen Crucified Saviors or Godfrey Higgins' Anacalypsis (which Graves drew from) in asserting that Krishna was a crucified deity. No such event occurred in the Gita or in any recognized Hindu scripture. Given the pronounced syncretic tendency of Hinduism, it is safe to assume that any odd tales of Krishna's being crucified arose only after the existence of Christian proselytism, in imitation of the Christian narrative. It is neither authentic to Hinduism nor is Hinduism the source of that portion of the Christian narrative. The same may be said for most of the purported nativity stories. In my opinion, both Higgins and Graves are highly unreliable sources..." http://www.tektonics.org/copycat/krishna02.html


"One final note: I'd like to compliment Van Eck on his criticism of the assertions made by some authors about the similarities between Krishna and Jesus. For example, some have said Krishna was "crucified," but the Upanishads say he "disappeared" and is waiting for us in a spiritual abode that appears as boring as heaven. I'd like to add my criticism to those writers who perpetuate the myth that Krishna was born on December 25th. This is not Krishna's birthday according to scripture, nor is it when Hindus celebrate Krishna's "appearance." This is the birthday that Christians stole from the Persian sun god, Mythra, and adopted for Jesus! It seems that some authors, in their attempt to show a common origin for religious myths, tenaciously adopt misinformation to make their case. We must remember to be critical and always check our sources." http://www.infidels.org/library/magazines/tsr/1996/1/1hindu96.html


Claim: Jesus' and Krishna's mothers had similar names: Miriam (Mary) and Maia

Reality: Krishna's mother may have been referred to as Maia, but only because this is the Hindi word for "mother." His mother's actual name was Devaki; his foster mother's name was Yashoda. http://www.religioustolerance.org/chr_jckr1.htm

[kasalt]

"It is my hope that people will not take what is said in the film as the truth, but find out for themselves, for truth is not told, it is realized."

- a quote from the Statement (http://zeitgeistmovie.com/statement.htm) of Peter Joseph, producer of the film "Zeitgeist, the Movie"

[thirdwave]

THIRD WAVE - Are you saying you don't have the intellectual moxy to do a little simple research and find out for YOURSELF??? Who cares about Wikipedia as a source - use any first hand source you want. No, Im saying that if one is to research then they will come across the info found in this video.... as well as info found which represents what Wikipedia think.... but at the end of the day its up to an individual to put all the parts together and see what makes more sense .... obviously a religious person would look for what Wikipedia will say as that would secure the religious belief that they treasure so much... I have not got the time to do a thorough research of it all.... but over time I have come across the same info as in this video from different sources.... many years back I remember being told it.... and like I say the truth will have to be down to ones own view on it all


Do you have any idea who made Zeitgeist? Strange that no one has claimed authorship.
Im not really bothered who made it.... fruit, not the tree.


But one voice on that video, the voice pushing the anti-Christian agenda is unmistakeable
Its clear you are a Christian and more concerned about that staying un tarnished... He is not Anti Christian he exposes and highlights all Religions... the reason Christiansity is often highlighted as currently it is the most dominant Religion... so is more relevant.. at least in these parts of the world anyway.


- that of JORDAN MAXWELL. Probably Zeitgeist was produced by Maxwell and or his fellow atheists - the `Truthseekers'. Jordan Maxwell calls himself the dean of conspiracy theorists and has done videos for `Truthseekers' since the mid 90's.
Maxwell has lots of research under his belt... If Christianity is there to be exposed it does not mean that anyone who does so is disinfo.... Its quite clear that there are huge holes in all religions... and Christianity being the most powerful at the moment will always take the hit.

Truthseekers is a small group calling themselves `free thinkers' (atheists) founded in 1873. Truthseekers are funded by? Who knows? Jordan Maxwell was religion editor of the Truthseeker magazine for a few years.
Truthseekers have loo-ong been promoting Kersey Graves' book - `The World's 16 Crucified Saviors' published 1871. Many of the claims in Graves book have been proven to be falsified (such as some of the examples I mentioned above).
I would not say Maxwell is the most spiritual enlightened person.... but He is not a lier and is a truth seeker as far as I am concerned.

My point - Much of Maxwell's claims against Christianity are based on this book. But if his case is that good why write such easily refutable lies? Well maybe they are not lies? .. its not only him who has come to the conclusion that religion is a hoax...misunderstood and used to divide control and concur people today.

Acharya S also uses `16 Crucified Saviors' this book as one of her main sources.

Truthseekers is funded by? Who knows?
If you think what your saying is true and makes sense to you.... then I wont try and stop you..... But I really don't feel the need to bust my arse and research this as I'm pretty happy with my views on it.... This video may have one or two holes.... drawn up by the makers conclusion... but the facts he uses to come to these conclusions are very interesting IMO.

[drakul]

THIRDWAVE - Funny you spent more time crafting answers to my posts than it would have taken you to check for yourself concerning some of the blatant Zeitgeist lies concerning the `world's crucified saviors' - Krishna, Horus, Attis, etc. David is right - some people climb out of one mindbox and right into another yet they consider themselves `enlightened' and everyone else is `sheeple'.

BTW - I call myself a CHRISTIAN Suffi/Buddhist, however I don't even go to church. I recently returned from Thailand/Singapore/Cambodia-AngkorWat. In N. Thailand I spent hours talking to Buddhist priests in the temples about the existence of GOD and the Immortal Soul. The most outstanding spiritual teacher I ever worked with was a Sufi master. So don't try to write me off as a simple Bible thumper. Be a little more sophisticated than that.

Furthermore I have been visiting ancient ruins and temples since childhood including:

* Pramids and sphinx - Egypt
*Valley of the Dead - Egypt
*Angkor Wat - Cambodia
*Tikal - Guatemala
*Chichen Itza, Cobal, Uxmal, etc - Mexico

and more, including in Ethiopia, Japan & Thailand.

But you don't have to go there to find the answers. It's a flick of a finger away. Ancient Egyptian and Hindu art are probabably the most prolific and re-produced art in the world. Ask yourself - Have you EVER seen a picture of a CRUCIFIED HORUS in Egyptian art? Of ANY crucified person in Egyptian art? In Hindu art? That's the first hand source - the ANCIENT ART and WRITINGS of the people.

So where is it? Where are the pictures, the translations, the PROOF of Zeitgeists allegations concerning all these `crucified saviors'? That's all I'm asking. Where's the BEEF? Simple enough isn't it?

[marmadukehussy]

hi if you found that movie interesting then watch this http://www.pharmacratic-inquisition.com/main/

[thirdwave]

THIRDWAVE - Funny you spent more time crafting answers to my posts than it would have taken you to check for yourself concerning some of the blatant Zeitgeist lies concerning the `world's crucified saviors' - Krishna, Horus, Attis, etc. David is right - some people climb out of one mindbox and right into another yet they consider themselves `enlightened' and everyone else is `sheeple'.

If you only go as a far as wikipedia then yes it would have only take me a while.... but to have a battle of websites and info with you about which website is telling the truth and which one is a bunch of people trying to crush Christianity would take allot longer than me just speaking my mind while reading your post.... and like I say I allready posses the knowledge so don't need to research it... if religion makes one feel better about life then I wont stop them or try too....

I think one of the biggest "mind box's" are religion... and I actually think the guys who created Monty Python although they were creating a comedy they were actually very good at exposing religion.... and I don't mean this as a way of dissing the people who are religious... but the way they really think a belief over a tiny amount of time in the Huge Universe is really so final and correct and also the fact that religion has never found peace I would have thought that would have got a few minds ticking...


BTW - I call myself a CHRISTIAN Suffi/Buddhist, however I don't even go to church. I recently returned from Thailand/Singapore/Cambodia-AngkorWat. In N. Thailand I spent hours talking to Buddhist priests in the temples about the existence of GOD and the Immortal Soul. The most outstanding spiritual teacher I ever worked with was a Sufi master. So don't try to write me off as a simple Bible thumper. Be a little more sophisticated than that.
I don't mind what beliefs and religions you have.... what every you feel makes you a better person... But I and others are also free to have our own views on it and if we choose to think that videos like this tell truth, then that's our cross to bare.... But It makes a hell of a lot more sense than all these religions rolled in to one.... You should not care what I think...



Furthermore I have been visiting ancient ruins and temples since childhood including:

* Pramids and sphinx - Egypt
*Valley of the Dead - Egypt
*Angkor Wat - Cambodia
*Tikal - Guatemala
*Chichen Itza, Cobal, Uxmal, etc - Mexico

and more, including in Ethiopia, Japan & Thailand.
that's great, something I am yet to do.... and something I believe would only enhance the way I feel... I believe the concept of religion has come because of how we were created... it was not a natural process and we needed answers.... those answers have been the thawn in our side you as long as we have been.... and many have benefited from that thawn... and still do today.

But you don't have to go there to find the answers. It's a flick of a finger away. Ancient Egyptian and Hindu art are probabably the most prolific and re-produced art in the world. Ask yourself - Have you EVER seen a picture of a CRUCIFIED HORUS in Egyptian art? Of ANY crucified person in Egyptian art? In Hindu art? That's the first hand source - the ANCIENT ART and WRITINGS of the people. I actually think I have seen an image of him hanging ooff a tree yes... a couple years back and im not sure where.... but its not something you would do anyway and why many think a cross with Jesus on it is a horrid way to remember someone.. especially those who are so afraid of the darkness...

The info in this video is not something that's easy to come by as of course it makes a huge statement.... but ask your self this... if you think the powers that be are trying to crush religion using methods like this video.... then they could do allot more and create allot more!...

So where is it? Where are the pictures, the translations, the PROOF of Zeitgeists allegations concerning all these `crucified saviors'? That's all I'm asking. Where's the BEEF? Simple enough isn't it? Good question.... why have the powers that be not created any?

[thirdwave]

Here

If anyone wants to do more research read this book, it was recommended to me..


Gerald Massey: Ancient Egypt Light of the World.

[phreedom]

I saw Zeitgeist. And it was very interesting.

Then I saw the movie that someone linked to earlier in here. Also very interesting.

I warn you all not to be fooled by either of these films. Pitting believers and non-believers against one another has always been the ways of the ruling elite.

Which is right? It does not matter.

Please utilize Zeitgeist as a form of mindless entertainment. It provides you no answers. It may be awe inspiring but awe has always been the way to entrance one's mind. To say, "Ohhhh, I see!" shows that your mind has been influenced, and you are now open to more influence, no matter what it is.

But you must realize, no one can give you the information you seek. Though it has been sitting in front of you all along, it is up to you to realize which is "righteous" and which will be the means to a "desireable" end...

[kblood]

There is the Antichrist will be a shapeshifting reptillian series that tries to make up for the Zeitgeist story a bit, but adds Odin as a crucified god. It is full of errors though, Odin in nordic mythology dies in a fight with a great wolf, which swallows him whole in the great battle at Ragnarok (apocalypse of the gods or something like that). I have never heard of Odin being crucified, but I guess I could have misunderstood it, because there are similarities between Odin and Horus, which is some of the claims in that series. Since there is the ressurection to take into account, I guess I could have just missed that part, but I kind of doubt it. As far as I know, I have been through all the the nordic mythology, and I do not remember anything about Odin dying or being ressurrected before Ragnaroc.

So yes, as I see it, it is a bit sad to see loose ends being tied up like this to make things fit better in the bigger picture. Also the Antichrist series says Odin is from germanic mythology, so I guess they are mixing it up alot. It is a mythology for vikings, and they resided in Scandinavia and Iceland. So unless there is any better proof than the unclear picture shown there, I do not believe it much.

So, what Icke and others is saying, that all these religions are exactly the same just altered a bit doesnt seem all true, although I believe all religions are mostly the same, but having their followers making them differ from each other to better know when or when not someone was worshipping some other god or religion and not their own.

[drakul]

I saw Zeitgeist. And it was very interesting.

Then I saw the movie that someone linked to earlier in here. Also very interesting.

I warn you all not to be fooled by either of these films. Pitting believers and non-believers against one another has always been the ways of the ruling elite.

Which is right? It does not matter.

Please utilize Zeitgeist as a form of mindless entertainment. It provides you no answers. It may be awe inspiring but awe has always been the way to entrance one's mind. To say, "Ohhhh, I see!" shows that your mind has been influenced, and you are now open to more influence, no matter what it is.

But you must realize, no one can give you the information you seek. Though it has been sitting in front of you all along, it is up to you to realize which is "righteous" and which will be the means to a "desireable" end...


As the Lord Buddha said - Don't BELIEVE what I say. Question what I say. TEST what I say. Absorb from my teachings what works for you. The same for Zeitgeist. It starts out by saying `The Truth shall set you free' and then goes into a series of deliberate falsities concerning the `Worlds Crucified Saviors'.

I would love to see these people like Jordan Maxwell who narrates part of the religion section of the Zeitgeist doc actually go to INDIA and tell all the 1 billion Hindus that Krishna was actually born on Dec. 25 when for 3,000 years they have been celebrating Krishna's birthday on July 21. Or send Jordan to Thailand and let him tell the Buddhists that Vesak (Buddhas birthday) is all wrong for the last 2,500 years - `It's not May 8th it's Dec 25'. Lets see how the Hindus and Buddhists respond.

If Zeitgeist has such powerful insights on the `myth' of Jesus Christ, why do they feel compelled to LIE about it??? It's an insult to the intelligence of some of the people on this board.

[thirdwave]

There is the Antichrist will be a shapeshifting reptillian series that tries to make up for the Zeitgeist story a bit

the thing is there is documentation and texts that can be studied going back 5000 years or so... so its very easy to get conflicting view points and have people come across alternatives... especially when you are looking at people who used so much symbolism.. so much so that they used 2 Gods fighting as an image of night and day.... so on.... so you can imagine how easy it is to "dubunk" so to speak....

I think Zeitgeist pretty much makes its point...

I have not seen all of that "shapeshifting reptilian" one.. but what I have seen it looks very interesting... although like any video, it will tilt things towards the views they have...

over all I think we can all get the bigger picture by watching them ...:)

[thirdwave]

I would also like to add

I dont think its very nice to aggressively try and debunk any religion... as at the end of the day your talking about really messing with peoples feelings... and its not nice to be smug about it....

I genuinely would like these people just to stop.... try and take a broader look at it all.... as all it is really doing is taking away the pictures and making things more realistic... and starting to understand we are responsible ... and take that little step.... at the end of the day you will benefit.

[otto vollov]

I downloaded the video and burned it to DVD's so I could share them with people. I fully excluded the first part on religion because for those who think their religion is real its just too much to handle and you loose their attention. The 9/11 and Bankster Fraud is really a good eye opener for most folks and they have to see it over a few times. I also sent out From Freedom to Fasicsm as it drives home the message.

[marmadukehussy]

jesus was a mushroom just like krishna and buddha !!!!!!!!
if you want the truth you will have to ask the only person who knows the truth and it is your self. take a load of magic mushrooms and then you will find out any thing you want to know ever! and it doesn't stop at mushrooms, mother nature has a bounty full of sacred plants for you to be enlightened which is another word for psychedelic.
peace love and harmony

[thirdwave]

jesus was a mushroom just like krishna and buddha !!!!!!!!
if you want the truth you will have to ask the only person who knows the truth and it is your self. take a load of magic mushrooms and then you will find out any thing you want to know ever! and it doesn't stop at mushrooms, mother nature has a bounty full of sacred plants for you to be enlightened which is another word for psychedelic.
peace love and harmony

yeah I agree.... the first time someone takes stuff like that , they have one of the most amazing experiences they will have..... its just a shame the more you do them it is not quite the same... they are there for food of thought... not for food :)

[drakul]

the thing is there is documentation and texts that can be studied going back 5000 years or so... so its very easy to get conflicting view points and have people come across alternatives... especially when you are looking at people who used so much symbolism.. so much so that they used 2 Gods fighting as an image of night and day.... so on.... so you can imagine how easy it is to "dubunk" so to speak....

I think Zeitgeist pretty much makes its point...




If Zeitgeist research actually went back 5,000 years then they would be dealing with PRIMARY SOURCES. First hand sources such as the Egyptian Book of the Dead, the Indian Bagavad Gita, the Vedas, etc. Zeitgeist researchers obviously did not do that because there is no reference or pics in these sources of Horus CRUCIFIED or Krishna born on Dec 25 of the `virgin' Devaki, etc etc as I have already pointed out and provided links.

The further back in history you go the more you have to deal with the writings and art of the actual population of the time and not the 2nd, 3rd, 4th 5th hand recent sources of people who were theorizing or had an agenda.

[thirdwave]

The point was, there has been a long time in collecting info.... and very much down to who people trust.

But to be honest, nit picking at various points in it does not really debunk it any way as there is still allot of meat there.... I think people just like to try and debunk as much as possible and believe as much alternative info as possible to sustain an illusion.

Its like 9/11 .. you can give them a manuscript of Facts that show holes.. but if one of the holes is managed to cover up with tape, then the case is closed.

How many religions have got pictures all over the place with an image if their idol dead and how they died? .. not many... Christianity do it and why? ... why are they showing the dead body on the cross? its disrespectful to "Jesus" for a start, and it is only remembering what was supposed to be the most agonising and desperate moment of his life.... this is not a philosophy that has naturally come from human nature... when your family members pass away and you morn them...will you wear a chain with a car that hit them around your neck... or of the life support machine? ... no.. you have a nice picture of them on your bedside table with them smiling at you.... or you stick the key ring from the car they loved to drive on your key ring..... so on..

I will have a search for that image I once saw of Horus hanging dead from a tree... I'm not sure if it was from a book or the internet but If I find it I will post it....



http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/zeitgeist.html

Amazon.com: ANCIENT EGYPT: The Light of the World (2 volumes in 1 book) (9781602060869): Gerald Massey: Books@@AMEPARAM@@http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51Re5gDvL5L.@@AMEPARAM@@51Re5gDvL5L

[drakul]

You don't have to depend on an IMAGE to prove Zeitgist presents the truth. The Egyptians and ancient Hindus were prolific WRITERS - Egyptian Book of the Dead, plus literally MILES of temple inscriptions (and images). Hindus had the Bagavad Gita and the Vedas. Should be absolutely no problemo coming up with the ancient evidence to support Zeitgeist, a mere flick of the google finger should do it....

[thirdwave]

So suppose the "Illuminati" did not want people to know about how it all came about... and about Horus... would they make it easy for people to research this?

Info like this is trying to burst through a shell that has been here for years and years.... any of the lies they have can be supported....

look at the pyramid and the eye of Horus on the top.... they have info saying that is about America being a new country bla bla bla... nothing to do with Horus ..so on... is that correct?

I belive that the "illuminti" are trying to move away Christianity... but not because the fear it... its because they no longer need it... not how they used to anyway... they are preparing for a 1 world religion.

you only need to look at a Mas exposure and over hype of "The Devinci Code" to see they are not afraid of trying to raise suspicion ....

Im not so sure they want people to know too much though.... just to loose a little faith....

I will not count out that the philosophy behind Christianity has not been around for a long time... its just it has been long miss understood... it is not about a man.... a lord.... it is about conciousness.... individual and collective conciousness...

If supporting a religion makes someone a better person then Im all for them doing that... but as long as they have really made sure it is actually doing that. And that its not making them fear so many other things that are not wrong...

[celtic isis]

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=17187

i've put more info here of disinfo whtever you want to call it :rolleyes:

but this is my own interpretation so be gentle!

[celtic isis]

So suppose the "Illuminati" did not want people to know about how it all came about... and about Horus... would they make it easy for people to research this?

Info like this is trying to burst through a shell that has been here for years and years.... any of the lies they have can be supported....

look at the pyramid and the eye of Horus on the top.... they have info saying that is about America being a new country bla bla bla... nothing to do with Horus ..so on... is that correct?

I belive that the "illuminti" are trying to move away Christianity... but not because the fear it... its because they no longer need it... not how they used to anyway... they are preparing for a 1 world religion.

you only need to look at a Mas exposure and over hype of "The Devinci Code" to see they are not afraid of trying to raise suspicion ....

Im not so sure they want people to know too much though.... just to loose a little faith....

I will not count out that the philosophy behind Christianity has not been around for a long time... its just it has been long miss understood... it is not about a man.... a lord.... it is about conciousness.... individual and collective conciousness...

If supporting a religion makes someone a better person then Im all for them doing that... but as long as they have really made sure it is actually doing that. And that its not making them fear so many other things that are not wrong...

well said thirdwave :) you're damn right too.

doing some research the last few days (not what drakul asked my to look up though) it's actually not that easy to find the conections, you really have to know what you're looking for and trying to piece together....

yeah it's not about knocking "faith", as i've tried to say on the other thread above, that is what THEY want to do, to leave the masses even more disillusioned...it's about showing religion for what it really is, and awakening people to the other world of knowledge that's been hidden from them.

[bigus_dickus]

anybody heard of this movie being disinfo??

it's not disinfo, it's plain bullshit made for retarded people.

and the "pharmacratic inquisition" docu is stretching the limits of retardation so much that even Dan Brown's books can't compete.

[mr_pixie]

The only problem is that that it has Real Planes and Steven E Jones Molten Metal disinfo in it.:mad:

[thirdwave]

Of course what makes me laugh

is the people who are shouting out that this movie is dis info...even though large amount of it is not...

It is really quite odd... As we are talking about comparing all of these Gods who are meant to be our saviours...

Well we already know that only 1 of them can really be right? other wise they are all wrong and contradict them selves....

either that or they are the same person.... or they were not aware of eachother??


The thing is.... people here are saying.... "no he did not do this he done that.... he did not do this he done that...." .... Well is this not confirming that they were all real?... and there for still exposing your own God as getting it wrong, or not in the full picture?... you should not be shocked that the stories of these people have been messed about with right?, but yet you are here defending their stories...

It seems to suit and support ones own religion the "official" "wikipidia" info is what we should go by......

It only goes to show how people will dig their heels in and support a blind faith even though there is no longer any ground bellow them.

We have Christians here who claim that Christianity has been attacked and corrupted.... yet at the same time they insist that the others have not been and are completely correct to the official stories of them... and any other info that arises is......Guess what? ....An Attack on Christianity....

Im Sorry folks... I know Christian people and I don't dislike them.... but I have to be honest and say its very hard to have an honest open chat to them... because you have to dance around allot of stuff.... and cant really tell it how it is... Im not asking for Christianity to come to an end... I think they should go back and do some real thinking about it all and re asses things.

[kasalt]

Of course what makes me laugh

is the people who are shouting out that this movie is dis info...even though large amount of it is not...

The thing is.... people here are saying.... "no he did not do this he done that.... he did not do this he done that...." .... Well is this not confirming that they were all real?... and there for still exposing your own God as getting it wrong, or not in the full picture?... you should not be shocked that the stories of these people have been messed about with right?, but yet you are here defending their stories...

It seems to suit and support ones own religion the "official" "wikipidia" info is what we should go by......

It only goes to show how people will dig their heels in and support a blind faith even though there is no longer any ground bellow them.

I tend to agree with the overall theme of the first third of Zeitgeist; I am simply bothered by the errant claims that it makes in the process. Krishna was never referred to as "the Son of God", nor did he go about with a group of 12 disciples, nor was he ever known for having a "healing ministry", and so on. Where did they get this stuff from? Correct it. If someone is going to draw parallels between religions in order to prove a common origin, then at least draw accurate, factual parallels. God knows there are plenty to draw from.

[thirdwave]

I tend to agree with the overall theme of the first third of Zeitgeist; I am simply bothered by the errant claims that it makes in the process. Krishna was never referred to as "the Son of God", nor did he go about with a group of 12 disciples, nor was he ever known for having a "healing ministry", and so on. Where did they get this stuff from? Correct it. If someone is going to draw parallels between religions in order to prove a common origin, then at least draw accurate, factual parallels. God knows there are plenty to draw from.

I have actually contacted the maker of the film and he pointed me towards their sources page and book of which contains the some of the sources.... which I have posted in this thread.

I don't think its a case of lies or deception... or even mistakes... it is down to alternative sources of info..... and this boils down to what the individual thinks...

there is no doubt that the "truths" people speak about regarding some of the gods...and the stories are more easy to find and are genuily seen as official... but we are also aware that the word "official" is a funny word.

like I say ...there is no smoke without fire.... if one chooses to think all this is just mistakes or deception.. then they are free to do so... if one chooses to think that it is a discovery of a hidden truth, then they are as well...

[drakul]

I will have a search for that image I once saw of Horus hanging dead from a tree... I'm not sure if it was from a book or the internet but If I find it I will post it....

http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/zeitgeist.html

http://www.amazon.com/ANCIENT-EGYPT-Light-Gerald-Massey/dp/160206086X


So are these the `SOURCES' for Zeitgeist's claims re: Christianity - Acharya S and Gerald Massey?

I have Acharya S' breakthrough book - The Christ Conspiracy - An interesting read but FULL of DIS-Information and outright LIES. I can provide a list of Acharya's easily verifiable lies in Christ Conspiracy, some of which are claimed as `The TRUTH shall set you FREEEEE' in Zeitgeist and which I have already listed in this thread.

Gerald Massey died in 1907, he was a selftaught Egyptologist who taught himself to read hieroglyphs at the British Museum and never visited Egypt.
Massey was not just a DRUID - he was the CHOSEN CHIEF of the Most Ancient Order of Druids from 1880-1906. Massey clearly had an anti-Christian agenda. Massey's books are promoted by Helen Blavatsky's Theosophical Society. Blavatsky was an avowed Luciferian who openly equated SATAN with Lucifer.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jesus

http://www.theosophical.ca/AncientEgyptIntroduction.htm

:rolleyes:

[texdallas]

Sorry to but in but I wanted to point out how much I've come to hate the term sheeple ever thought thats how the NWO view you? you love and respect everybody simple as

[drakul]

Sorry to but in but I wanted to point out how much I've come to hate the term sheeple ever thought thats how the NWO view you? you love and respect everybody simple as

YES. The term `SHEEPLE' is a way of feeling superior, when you may actually just exchanged one mindbox for another. And isn't that what the Illuminatis WANT?!

New Mindbox - `Based on evidence in Zeitgeist I don't believe in God or Jesus Christ anymore'

`OK we understand, being the All Compassionate ET Beings that we are and have Always Been - Here's the REAL God - Meet LUCIFER'.

[drakul]

Lift up the corner of Zeitgeist, find `Acharya S' (real name D.M. Murdoch), lift up the corner of Acharya and find - The Theosophical Society - lift up the corner of that and find - The LUCIS Trust (located on Rockefeller Plaza in NY with the UN and recipient of $$$$$ BILLIONS from the elite). Lift up the corner of the Lucis Trust and you have - The LUCIFER Soc. founded by admitted Satanist, Helen Blavatsky.

Follow the $$$$$ money trail. Think these people don't have major illuminati backing?

http://www.rense.com/general72/GATES.HTM

http://www.realnews247.com/the_lucis_trust_satanism_and_the_nwo.htm

[adimon]

Sorry to but in but I wanted to point out how much I've come to hate the term sheeple ever thought thats how the NWO view you? you love and respect everybody simple as

LOL. Yeah I was saying the exact same thing yesterday. I hate the word.

[celtic isis]

YES. The term `SHEEPLE' is a way of feeling superior, when you may actually just exchanged one mindbox for another. And isn't that what the Illuminatis WANT?!

New Mindbox - `Based on evidence in Zeitgeist I don't believe in God or Jesus Christ anymore'

`OK we understand, being the All Compassionate ET Beings that we are and have Always Been - Here's the REAL God - Meet LUCIFER'.

i've talked about this on the serpent and the sun thread.

i even transcribed Zeitgeist the other night.

We're not exchanging one mind box for another, i know we have to be careful when talking about religion cause they want people to lost their faith and have nothing to hold on to, even though that is the opposite of how it really is in reality!

And the sheeple term...look they deserve that term, some people don't know what's really going on in the world just out of innocence but some are so conditioned and so arrogant and egotistical it's unbelievable the abuse you get from them! i know cause i've suffered it!!!

I call them sheeple cause it makes me feel less stressed that's all, i'm trying to help them to see the truth!!! give us some slack here, and at the end of the say sheeple is just a word, it means nothing.

Anyone person who will not wake up and stand up for wat is right is a waste of space as a human being and is a sheeple. Too busy, too selfish, too caught up in their own lives, too afraid to see the truth and act upon it. And not only that abuse the people who are trying to make a change in the world and wake said sheeple up to reality. they won't even listen to you, just turn away and duck their heads in the sand.

P
A
T
H
E
T
I
C
:)

[celtic isis]

LOL. Yeah I was saying the exact same thing yesterday. I hate the word.

I LOVE IT. They deserve it.

[drakul]

I LOVE IT. They deserve it.


IMO YOU are a SHEOPLE - How do you like that?

You are. No mistake about it. You're willing to swallow any LIE as long as it supports your agenda.

You are not an independent thinker because you don't ask for firsthand original EVIDENCE or PROOF.

Trying to discuss religion/politics with you is like trying to talk to a Chinese `Young Pioneer' waving Mao's Little Red Book.

New Mindboxes Anyone? New Mindbox - Get your new Mindbox right here - CHEAP.

[texdallas]

I LOVE IT. They deserve it.

Very keen to compartmentalize those around you. You have a little knowledge and look down at others who don't you remind me of the Pope!

[splinterg]

Truth or Lie..this film goes along way to turn the sheep black..which in my book is a very good thing..Anyone who comes away from viewing this film with a belief we have been lied to is operating an open mind..and so to Drakul I say .. Celtic Isis may well be sheople in your opinion..but did you ever stop to ask yourself what colour sheople really are?

[drakul]

Truth or Lie..this film goes along way to turn the sheep black..which in my book is a very good thing..Anyone who comes away from viewing this film with a belief we have been lied to is operating an open mind..and so to Drakul I say .. Celtic Isis may well be sheople in your opinion..but did you ever stop to ask yourself what colour sheople really are?

This is a direct quote of Celtic Isis from her opening post on her Serpent and the Sun thread -

Any Christian trolls on here read this chapter in Icke’s new book and shut the hell up. Get over it your religion is paganism and originates out of Babylon (church of Babylon) just like all the other religions round the globe.

Does this sound like a logical objective thinker to you? Someone who believes in Free Speech/Open Discussion?

The Lord Buddha said - `TEST EVERYTHING I say. Don't just BELIEVE what I say. Test it. If it works for you, if it makes sense in your experience, then use it'.

I like David Icke's political commentary because it works with what I have experienced and observed over the years. Even so - if Icke makes radical statements - I am going to demand PROOF. That means first-hand original primary sources. Particularly with Icke's claims concerning `The World's 16 Crucified Saviours' (written by Kersey Graves, pub 1871).

Icke's religious declarations are simply rehashes of 100+ year old theosophical society/LUCIFERIAN doctrines (there is no Christ). Icke pretends they are new research and they are not - they are the same damn thing. The same lies these people have been promoting since 1875. Examples of lies based on `16 Crucified Saviors' from Zeitgeist, Jordan Maxwell, Acharya, M Tsarion, Theosophical Soc, etc:

*Krishna was born Dec 25 of a Virgin

Wrong - Krishna was born July 21 the 8th child of Devaki

*Horus was crucified

Wrong - Egyptologists can find no hieroglyphs or art to support that Horus was crucified - so why are the theosophists and people like Icke claiming it?

*Attis was crucified

Wrong - Greek lore and art says nothing about Attis crucified.

*Buddha was Dec 25 of a virgin

Wrong - Buddha was born May 8. His mother was MARRIED to King Suddodhana.

*Buddha was crucified

Wrong nowhere in Buddhist religion are there pics or statements that Buddha was crucified

etc etc

[splinterg]

It doesnt matter..the exercise was to open minds..and it achieved this..

"Any Christian trolls on here read this chapter in Icke’s new book and shut the hell up. Get over it your religion is paganism and originates out of Babylon (church of Babylon) just like all the other religions round the globe. "

Yes this does actually sound like free speech to me:) The freedom to say whatever they want

[drakul]

It doesnt matter..the exercise was to open minds..and it achieved this..

"Any Christian trolls on here read this chapter in Icke’s new book and shut the hell up. Get over it your religion is paganism and originates out of Babylon (church of Babylon) just like all the other religions round the globe. "

Yes this does actually sound like free speech to me:) The freedom to say whatever they want

Uhuh. Brilliant. The Master has spoken, now `shut the hell up'. Alot of NWO elites have been using that phrase lately, like Clinton, et al.

[splinterg]

Uhuh. Brilliant. The Master has spoken, now `shut the hell up'. Alot of NWO elites have been using that phrase lately, like Clinton, et al.
lol..then you of all people should understand its meaning:)

[drakul]

lol..then you of all people should understand its meaning:)


Oh I understand the meaning alright - but then I'm not telling people to `shut the hell up', am I?

[splinterg]

Oh I understand the meaning alright - but then I'm not telling people to `shut the hell up', am I?

No your not..but you know better..which is my point

The fact this person has decided to use the language they did is their prerogative..the fact you know better is yours

Either way Im happy for the reason that Celtic Isis is free to say whatever

[jimijams]

Uhuh. Brilliant. The Master has spoken, now `shut the hell up'. Alot of NWO elites have been using that phrase lately, like Clinton, et al.
I was listening to Bill Coopers Mystery Babylon series yesterday and he seemed to think that there is a deliberate campaign by the freemasons to destroy Christianity to make way for their new mystery religion which will be the new one world religion for the 'new age'.

He suggested that many of the authors out there that are pushing this new 'mystery religion' are themselves freemasons contributing to the 'Great Work'..

Personally I'm for freedom of expression and diversity when it comes to spirituality, attitudes like the one quoted above are not helpful at all and show a great deal of ignorance IMO.

[drakul]

I was listening to Bill Coopers Mystery Babylon series yesterday and he seemed to think that there is a deliberate campaign by the freemasons to destroy Christianity to make way for their new mystery religion which will be the new one world religion for the 'new age'.

He suggested that many of the authors out there that are pushing this new 'mystery religion' are themselves freemasons contributing to the 'Great Work'..

Personally I'm for freedom of expression and diversity when it comes to spirituality, attitudes like the one quoted above are not helpful at all and show a great deal of ignorance IMO.


Yes this concerns me deeply too. They want to destroy Christianity but what are they offering in its place - drugs/Ayauasca, tarot, diviniation, magic (black and white), superstition, voodoo? LUCIFER?

The free masons worship Lucifer. So do the Theosophists. All these people, Jordan Maxwell (Zeitgeist), M. Tsarion, Acharya, etc are linked to the Theosophical Soc. which owns the LUCIS Trust - follow the money trail. Lucis Trust has $$$ Billions with a swank office next to the UN on Rockefeller Plaza. Lucis Trust was originally founded as the LUCIFER Trust (talk about being right out in the open). It was founded by Helen Blavatsky an open Luciferian who equated Lucifer with SATAN. M. Tsarion called Blavatsky `the purest soul born on this earth'. Now What does that tell you???

[drakul]

No your not..but you know better..which is my point

The fact this person has decided to use the language they did is their prerogative..the fact you know better is yours

Either way Im happy for the reason that Celtic Isis is free to say whatever

This argument is so stupid I can't believe it. You're just so happy that Celtic Isis has freedom of speech `to say whatever'. But she doesn't want to give others the same priviledge. Isis is telling me to - `shut the fuck up'. And that's your idea of free speech?

Don't bother to answer, I won't read your post. I'm done with you.

[adimon]

And the sheeple term...look they deserve that term, some people don't know what's really going on in the world just out of innocence but some are so conditioned and so arrogant and egotistical it's unbelievable the abuse you get from them! i know cause i've suffered it!!!


So you know what's right and wrong but condone eye for an eye on the subject of abuse or hostility?

I think most people would agree that any change in the world will have to involve a mass informing of the masses. And you have such negative thoughts towards the masses. They are the same as you, and you are the same as me, just with different information and different stimulus.

I call them sheeple cause it makes me feel less stressed that's all, i'm trying to help them to see the truth!!! give us some slack here, and at the end of the say sheeple is just a word, it means nothing.

Anyone person who will not wake up and stand up for wat is right is a waste of space as a human being and is a sheeple. Too busy, too selfish, too caught up in their own lives, too afraid to see the truth and act upon it. And not only that abuse the people who are trying to make a change in the world and wake said sheeple up to reality. they won't even listen to you, just turn away and duck their heads in the sand.

If you want to take out your stress, you can call me nasty names by PM if you want. Or take up jogging.

I LOVE IT. They deserve it.

Please explain how any person(s) deserve anything? Do you believe in karma?

Do you think the public, who you refer to as sheeple, DESERVE harsh things because they did bad things in past lives?

Explain yourself please.

And welcome back, long time no see. Good to see you, despite the shitty comment. ;)

[bigus_dickus]

*Horus was crucified
*Attis was crucified


people today hear "crucifixion" and they immediately think about jesus and they perceive it in a religious sense, something that has to do with religion and stuff.

the truth is, hundreds of thousands of people have been executed by crucifixion, on crosses, 'T' shape crosses, 'X' shape crosses, upside down on crosses, any way you can think.

the idea was, that the person's muscles would gradually weaken and the person would slowly collapse on the cross and his lungs were no longer able to support the body weight. then the person died a horrible death by slowly suffocating. sometimes, they would cut the feet from the ankles to accelerate the process, especially if someone was strong enough to hold his body upright for a long time. this practice and many others, were done publicly, so every citizen would view them, women and children also. many people actually enjoyed all this violence towards the marginalized criminals of society and they still do. people want to kill the criminals, harm them and watch them suffer, especially when they have gotten hurt themselves by people who they perceive and classify as criminals. most importantly, many people enjoy watching other people who oppose their ideas suffer, or they simply enjoy watching raw violence.

if the cross 'should' symbolize something for mankind, that would probably be mankind's 'self' suffering and dying on it for a long long time from its own hand.

[drakul]

people today hear "crucifixion" and they immediately think about jesus and they perceive it in a religious sense, something that has to do with religion and stuff.

the truth is, hundreds of thousands of people have been executed by crucifixion, on crosses, 'T' shape crosses, 'X' shape crosses, upside down on crosses, any way you can think.

the idea was, that the person's muscles would gradually weaken and the person would slowly collapse on the cross and his lungs were no longer able to support the body weight. then the person died a horrible death by slowly suffocating. sometimes, they would cut the feet from the ankles to accelerate the process, especially if someone was strong enough to hold his body upright for a long time. this practice and many others, were done publicly, so every citizen would view them, women and children also. many people actually enjoyed all this violence towards the marginalized criminals of society and they still do. people want to kill the criminals, harm them and watch them suffer, especially when they have gotten hurt themselves by people who they perceive and classify as criminals. most importantly, many people enjoy watching other people who oppose their ideas suffer, or they simply enjoy watching raw violence.

if the cross 'should' symbolize something for mankind, that would probably be mankind's 'self' suffering and dying on it for a long long time from its own hand.

And your point IS???


Was Attis crucified? No.

Was Horus crucified? No.

But Zeitgeist says they were. That is my point.

[adimon]

“You think if Jesus ever comes back he’s gonna want to see another fucking cross?!”

BILL HICKS

[bigus_dickus]

And your point IS???


Was Attis crucified? No.

Was Horus crucified? No.

But Zeitgeist says they were. That is my point.

i didn't attack your point, i merely said that we put so much value on the cross and crucifixion, that we think we can make a valid argument by using it to distinguish religions. i am saying that even if other myths were claiming crucifixion, as those authors say and suggest as a valid argument, that would be a minor argument to support their claims. that's because crucifixion was not exclusive to christianity and obvisouly it existed before christ was convicted to crucifixion. i am saying that even if horus and attis were crucified as they claim, that's a weak argument to begin with. get it now?

[drakul]

i didn't attack your point, i merely said that we put so much value on the cross and crucifixion, that we think we can make a valid argument by using it to distinguish religions. i am saying that even if other myths were claiming crucifixion, as those authors say and suggest as a valid argument, that would be a minor argument to support their claims. that's because crucifixion was not exclusive to christianity and obvisouly it existed before christ was convicted to crucifixion. i am saying that even if horus and attis were crucified as they claim, that's a weak argument to begin with. get it now?

Yes.

Although Crucifixion was a notoriously Roman punishment.

[kblood]

“You think if Jesus ever comes back he’s gonna want to see another fucking cross?!”

BILL HICKS

lol :) Nice quote there. He could be an SM kind of guy though, just comming back for more :D

[damagedbrainn]

Though I mostly agree with the general point that the first part of Zeitgeist is trying to make, it does do a profoundly shit job of making that point.

Much of it (and other conspiracy material) is based on grossly outdated information and misinterpretations from the book The World's Sixteen Crucified Saviors by Kersey Graves, published in 1875:

http://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/cv/wscs/index.htm

The book isn't completely worthless, however, nothing in it should be taken directly as fact unless it can be verified by more modern sources.

The rest of the information contained in Part One is mostly just speculative and moronic. Like, "Sunset comes from the Egyptian god Set." That's just dumb.

[drakul]

Though I mostly agree with the general point that the first part of Zeitgeist is trying to make, it does do a profoundly shit job of making that point.

Much of it (and other conspiracy material) is based on grossly outdated information and misinterpretations from the book The World's Sixteen Crucified Saviors by Kersey Graves, published in 1875:

http://www.sacred-texts.com/bib/cv/wscs/index.htm

The book isn't completely worthless, however, nothing in it should be taken directly as fact unless it can be verified by more modern sources.

The rest of the information contained in Part One is mostly just speculative and moronic. Like, "Sunset comes from the Egyptian god Set." That's just dumb.


If you look at all these `alternative history' writers/speakers - they all specialize in just a rehash of old disinformation, while pretending it is new research but offering no new proof. This all goes back to the Luciferian Theosophical Society - founded in 1875 by the Luciferian Helen Blavatsky. Blavatsky's Luciferian Trust is now the multimillion dollar LUCIS Trust to which Bill Gates recently gave a huge donation.

[drakul]

If Zeitgeist, Acharya, Jordan Maxwell, Tsarion have such a strong case regarding `The World's 16 Crucified aviors'/`The Son of the Sun' - why do they have to LIE it?

[celtic isis]

If Zeitgeist, Acharya, Jordan Maxwell, Tsarion have such a strong case regarding `The World's 16 Crucified aviors'/`The Son of the Sun' - why do they have to LIE it?

i transcribed zeitgeist, the narrator never says they were all crucified, he says that thee various sun gods/ religious figures share the crucifixion, 3 day death and resurrection concepts, not that ALL of them experience each or all of those concepts, but that they share the common themes.

all of them share some kind of death and then resurrection. not that all of them were crucified. :rolleyes:

[celtic isis]

So you know what's right and wrong but condone eye for an eye on the subject of abuse or hostility?

I think most people would agree that any change in the world will have to involve a mass informing of the masses. And you have such negative thoughts towards the masses. They are the same as you, and you are the same as me, just with different information and different stimulus.


If you want to take out your stress, you can call me nasty names by PM if you want. Or take up jogging.



Please explain how any person(s) deserve anything? Do you believe in karma?

Do you think the public, who you refer to as sheeple, DESERVE harsh things because they did bad things in past lives?

Explain yourself please.

And welcome back, long time no see. Good to see you, despite the shitty comment. ;)


i don't have to explain myself to anyone let alone you.

:)

[lottie]

Just thought i'd say- i watched this movie finally and WOW- it blew me away!!

Although i knew all the info produced in a round about way from researching over the last two years, it kinda joined up all the dots for me and made it a lot clearer in my head- i was even able to go to work the next morning in a great mood btw and explain to my friend (who's so asleep she may aswell be wheeled round in a her bed all day long bless her!!lol) the info regarding the Federal Reserve and the illegal taxes that the U.S. citizens are paying etc....and i actually knew what i was talking about!! :D and she understood me....although it may have gone in one ear and out the other :rolleyes::D
It is easy going enough for anyone to watch and understand!!

Loved the film....well done to those who put it together- i shall be burning it to disc asap (when i buy a new burner coz mines broke) and distributing to as many of my friends family and colleagues as possible!! :)

[drakul]

i transcribed zeitgeist, the narrator never says they were all crucified, he says that thee various sun gods/ religious figures share the crucifixion, 3 day death and resurrection concepts, not that ALL of them experience each or all of those concepts, but that they share the common themes.

all of them share some kind of death and then resurrection. not that all of them were crucified. :rolleyes:


I NEVER said ALL OF THEM WERE CRUCIFIED. NEVER and you know it. I was very specific about the false claims Zeitgeist attributed to different `Sons of the Sun'. Go back and read my posts.

[celtic isis]

Just thought i'd say- i watched this movie finally and WOW- it blew me away!!

Although i knew all the info produced in a round about way from researching over the last two years, it kinda joined up all the dots for me and made it a lot clearer in my head- i was even able to go to work the next morning in a great mood btw and explain to my friend (who's so asleep she may aswell be wheeled round in a her bed all day long bless her!!lol) the info regarding the Federal Reserve and the illegal taxes that the U.S. citizens are paying etc....and i actually knew what i was talking about!! :D and she understood me....although it may have gone in one ear and out the other :rolleyes::D
It is easy going enough for anyone to watch and understand!!

Loved the film....well done to those who put it together- i shall be burning it to disc asap (when i buy a new burner coz mines broke) and distributing to as many of my friends family and colleagues as possible!! :)


I LOOOOOOVE YOU LOTTIE!!!! :D

aww i'm so happy you watched it :)

we already tried to burn it but we were missing some code so all i had was the sound :( feck! good on ya!

yeah i don't know what the discreditors on here are barking about, it's a brilliant film, ok the guy (narrator) should have been a bit more careful in wording things but there really is no disinfo in it. :confused:

same here, it's two years for me since i started researching this too and zeitgeist just ties up the main concepts all together in such a clever way, really hard hitting.

And it didn't even go into Christianity etc being babylonian religions as far as it could have...

[lottie]

Hey celtic baby!! :D

How you doin?!!

I thought it was fascinating- you know when you have a reallly vivid dream and it 'affects ' you for a few days after?-- i got that with Zeitgeist- its still afftecting me now!! that was days ago!! lol!! Like i say i woke up in such a good mood the next day, it seems to me the more clarifyed my mind is the better mood im in....

But i'd advocate the movie all day long.....:)

[drakul]

Hey celtic baby!! :D

How you doin?!!

I thought it was fascinating- you know when you have a reallly vivid dream and it 'affects ' you for a few days after?-- i got that with Zeitgeist- its still afftecting me now!! that was days ago!! lol!! Like i say i woke up in such a good mood the next day, it seems to me the more clarifyed my mind is the better mood im in....

But i'd advocate the movie all day long.....:)

Zeitgeist is based on LIES:

Zeitgeist claims Krishna was born on Dec 25 of a virgin, etc etc

Truth - Krishna was born on July 21 the EIGHTH child of his mother Devaki

Zeitgeist claims Horus was crucified, Attis crucified, etc etc.

Truth - Not one shred of evidence Horus or Attis were crucified

Like I said - If Zeitgeist has such a strong case re: `The Sons of the Sun' - WHY does it make such blatantly false claims???

And all in the name of `The Truth shall make you FREE'? (talk about chutzpah)

How long does any edifice last built on feet of clay? Zeitgeist is for the SHEOPLE. SHEOPLE are the people who think they are so vastly superior `awakened' compared to the SHEEPLE.

New MINDBOXES anyone?

[lottie]

Zeitgeist is based on LIES:

Zeitgeist claims Krishna was born on Dec 25 of a virgin, etc etc

Truth - Krishna was born on July 21 the EIGHTH child of his mother Devaki

Zeitgeist claims Horus was crucified, Attis crucified, etc etc.

Truth - Not one shred of evidence Horus or Attis were crucified

Like I said - If Zeitgeist has such a strong case re: `The Sons of the Sun' - WHY does it make such blatantly false claims???

And all in the name of `The Truth shall make you FREE'? (talk about chutzpah)

How long does any edifice last built on feet of clay? Zeitgeist is for the SHEOPLE. SHEOPLE are the people who think they are so vastly superior `awakened' compared to the SHEEPLE.

New MINDBOXES anyone?

Thats YOUR opinion and you are fully entitled to it- MINE is different but something i'm not prepared to debate with you- i do not have to justify my beliefs to you!
AND i find the word SHEOPLE extremely derogatory!

[sensimillia]

don´t know if anyone noticed this, but about 5 min into the docu, when jordan maxwell is speaking in the background, there are some visual effects across the screen for a while. staring at those effects for a while, i noticed patterns forming, pentagrams to be specific. i find that odd and somewhat disturbing. i could be misstaken, mind you i had smoked a fatty just prior.:D
anybody else who´s seen it?

[splinterg]

Just thought i'd say- i watched this movie finally and WOW- it blew me away!!

Although i knew all the info produced in a round about way from researching over the last two years, it kinda joined up all the dots for me and made it a lot clearer in my head- i was even able to go to work the next morning in a great mood btw and explain to my friend (who's so asleep she may aswell be wheeled round in a her bed all day long bless her!!lol) the info regarding the Federal Reserve and the illegal taxes that the U.S. citizens are paying etc....and i actually knew what i was talking about!! :D and she understood me....although it may have gone in one ear and out the other :rolleyes::D
It is easy going enough for anyone to watch and understand!!

Loved the film....well done to those who put it together- i shall be burning it to disc asap (when i buy a new burner coz mines broke) and distributing to as many of my friends family and colleagues as possible!! :)

You can watch Zeitgeist for free here..if you dont have a cd burner:)

http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=5547481422995115331

[lottie]

Thanks splinterg- so kind of you :)- but i had downloaded it from a torrent and so watched it on pc- just would realy like the comfort of lounging on the sofa and watching it on widescreen!! :D

[splinterg]

Thanks splinterg- so kind of you :)- but i had downloaded it from a torrent and so watched it on pc- just would realy like the comfort of lounging on the sofa and watching it on widescreen!! :D
Your welcome no problem..Im wondering if they'd of made it in HD whether it may of come across a bit clearer for Drakul? who knows? Im only messin with ya Drak:)

[drakul]

Your welcome no problem..Im wondering if they'd of made it in HD whether it may of come across a bit clearer for Drakul? who knows? Im only messin with ya Drak:)


It's OK splint.

[shodan]

Zeitgeist is based on LIES:

Zeitgeist claims Krishna was born on Dec 25 of a virgin, etc etc

Truth - Krishna was born on July 21 the EIGHTH child of his mother Devaki

Zeitgeist claims Horus was crucified, Attis crucified, etc etc.

Truth - Not one shred of evidence Horus or Attis were crucified

Like I said - If Zeitgeist has such a strong case re: `The Sons of the Sun' - WHY does it make such blatantly false claims???

And all in the name of `The Truth shall make you FREE'? (talk about chutzpah)

How long does any edifice last built on feet of clay? Zeitgeist is for the SHEOPLE. SHEOPLE are the people who think they are so vastly superior `awakened' compared to the SHEEPLE.

New MINDBOXES anyone?

Your missing the point Drakul, the ordinary people out there that havn't got a clue whats going on, that do end up wathching Zeitgeist are DEBATING it, Zeitgeist is hugely popular now and has got people talking. The bits you are contesting are up for debate anyway and need an awful lot of research. And they are a fraction of the whole film in its entirety.

Zeitgeist should be on the school curriculum to stimulate DEBATE.

[drakul]

Your missing the point Drakul, the ordinary people out there that havn't got a clue whats going on, that do end up wathching Zeitgeist are DEBATING it, Zeitgeist is hugely popular now and has got people talking. The bits you are contesting are up for debate anyway and need an awful lot of research. And they are a fraction of the whole film in its entirety.

Zeitgeist should be on the school curriculum to stimulate DEBATE.

Maybe you are missing the POINT. Maybe the real target is is to destroy Christianity, to destroy the MORAL CODE, the underpinnings of society including the nuclear family. ORDER AB CHAOS - The CHAOS BUILDERS want to destroy `religion' (read CHRISTIANITY) which they HATE, just like the Bolsheviks did in Russia for 70 years. Without Christianity USSR was supposed to be a UTOPIA and what did the Russian people get out of it?

Sure the elites threw some stuff into Zeitgeist about 9/11 and the cause of wars and stuff that, because they know we are not gonna be able to do anything about it. Just like no one in America believes anymore that Oswald was the `lone nutter' that shot Prez Kennedy. The Kennedy assassination (all three of the Kennedys) was in fact a COUP, a govt takeover. But does anyone do a gawdamn thing about it? Hell no. Its been 45 years now and everyone just keeps going along to get along.

Don't you think debate should be based on EVIDENCE? These Zeitgeist producers are pretending to have done all this new in-depth RESEARCH PROVING that Jesus is just a fake, a poor imitation of Krishna, Buddha, Mithra, Attis, Horus, etc etc (I notice they don't included Muhammed though).

Do you think I should just get up on the debating platform - make a big announcement - `THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREEEE!' And then knowingly base my premise on deliberate falsifications? Especially to a bunch of naive, impressionable (captive audience) SCHOOLCHILDREN??? (As you suggest).

Zeitgeist producers know DAMN WELL most of their statements concerning the `World's 16 Crucified Saviors' are not true. All it takes is a flick of the google finger. Are YOU willing to find out?

[shodan]

Maybe you are missing the POINT. Maybe the real target is is to destroy Christianity, to destroy the MORAL CODE, the underpinnings of society including the nuclear family. ORDER AB CHAOS - The CHAOS BUILDERS want to destroy `religion' (read CHRISTIANITY) which they HATE, just like the Bolsheviks did in Russia for 70 years. Without Christianity USSR was supposed to be a UTOPIA and what did the Russian people get out of it?

I agree that Christianity has been the target of TPTB, but I don't agree that this is the aim of Zeitgeist. Zeitgeist has got people asking questions who would otherwise continue to be spoonfed. I could be wrong, the search continues, and I am open-minded enough to change my mind as information continues to be unconvered.

Sure the elites threw some stuff into Zeitgeist about 9/11 and the cause of wars and stuff that, because they know we are not gonna be able to do anything about it. Just like no one in America believes anymore that Oswald was the `lone nutter' that shot Prez Kennedy. The Kennedy assassination (all three of the Kennedys) was in fact a COUP, a govt takeover. But does anyone do a gawdamn thing about it? Hell no. Its been 45 years now and everyone just keeps going along to get along.

911 is still fresh, although time is running out, and the orwellian state is unfolding right now and war continues because of that day. Its critical to get this info to the massess. The Kennedy truth is not dead and buried yet, its interwoven with the whole treachery web. Not everyone has given up on it.

Don't you think debate should be based on EVIDENCE? These Zeitgeist producers are pretending to have done all this new in-depth RESEARCH PROVING that Jesus is just a fake, a poor imitation of Krishna, Buddha, Mithra, Attis, Horus, etc etc (I notice they don't included Muhammed though).

I think the debate is on many levels, including a debate about the evidence.
The Zeitgeist producers made a film and threw it out into the ether, here we are now discussing it, fantastic.

Do you think I should just get up on the debating platform - make a big announcement - `THE TRUTH SHALL SET YOU FREEEE!' And then knowingly base my premise on deliberate falsifications? Especially to a bunch of naive, impressionable (captive audience) SCHOOLCHILDREN??? (As you suggest).

I think you should carry on what you are doing, providing opposing points of view and we will all get closer to the truth together.
I think that school children should be given both sides of the argument to make up their own minds.

Zeitgeist producers know DAMN WELL most of their statements concerning the `World's 16 Crucified Saviors' are not true.

You don't know that, and nothing is concrete, the rabbit hole is very very deep.

All it takes is a flick of the google finger. Are YOU willing to find out?

Yes, thats why I'm here.

[drakul]

Yes, thats why I'm here.

OK so what did you find out.

(BTW Zeitgeist claims Buddha's birthday is celebrated on Dec. 25. It's NOT. Buddha's birthday is celebrated May 8 - Veshak Day and has been for the last 2,500 years. How could Zeitgeist producers NOT know that? How could they NOT check to find out if they did not know??? These are not stupid people. Of course they knew damn well Buddha's birthday is celebrated in May, but then that doesn't go along with their Jesus is a copy of all the other `crucified saviors agenda does it? Just like Zeitgiest producers know Krishna's birthday is celebrated July 21, not Dec. 25. And there are how many Hindus in the world - a BILLION?

You heard one of the main narrators for the religion section - JORDAN MAXWELL - the self-proclaimed `Dean of Astro-theology'. Maxwell claims to have been researching this subject for over 30 years. 30 years. And yet he claims that both Krishna and Buddha's birthday are celebrated on Dec. 25???

Maxwell is not stupid. Clearly he knows that a large percentage of the people who watch Zeitgeist will just take it on (oddly enough) FAITH. They won't check his sources. That's right they are Blind Believers just like the Free Masons and the Fundamentalist Christians. Only here's the funny part - they are actually convinced that they are SUPERIOR - They call themselves the AWAKENED ONES - Everyone else is just SHEEPLE. In fact all the Awakened Ones have done is climbed up to the next mindblock in the pyramid. Now they are SHEOPLE. That's all.

Like a mason going from 1st to 2nd degree -

`Well you have to swallow a few half-truths with your oath of allegiance.'

`OK sir, I don't mind because I understand - THE MEANS JUSTIFYS THE END'. (now where have we heard that one before - Bolshevik Commintern International anyone?)

[adimon]

Maybe you are missing the POINT. Maybe the real target is is to destroy Christianity, to destroy the MORAL CODE, the underpinnings of society including the nuclear family. ORDER AB CHAOS - The CHAOS BUILDERS want to destroy `religion' (read CHRISTIANITY) which they HATE

So Christianity is synonymous with order? I'd rather have NWO than another French Inquisition.

[crazed]

(I notice they don't included Muhammed though).

Yep, I also noticed they didn't say anything about Islam.

Still though, the reason why the movie is good is because some people will realize that there's something crooked going on. That will lead them to reading other things.

[adimon]

Yep well said.

[bigus_dickus]

Still though, the reason why the movie is good is because some people will realize that there's something crooked going on. That will lead them to reading other things.

yeah.. acharya, maxwell, tsarion, bushby, alegro and all the rest stupid nonsense until after some years they realize it is nonsense and "wake up" again.

why would they have to go through all this trouble?

because they are idiots. (not my conclusion, it is implied)

[drakul]

So Christianity is synonymous with order? I'd rather have NWO than another French Inquisition.

Here you are falling into another trap which equating Vatican policies with Christianity. Vatican is NOT Christianity. Vatican is a political entity, an independent city state with its own seat at the UN. Another example of how the `astro-theologists' like Jordan Maxwell, Acharya, Tsarion, etc who pretend to have done all this research, yet they IGNORE the history of Orthodox Christianity as if it never existed.

While the rest of Europe was in the `Dark Ages', for over 1,000 years Byzantium/Constantinople was the richest city in the world, the center of civilization. The `Roman' emperor Constantine, who was born in Serbia of Non-Roman parents, hated Rome so much he actually moved the capitol of Rome to Constantinople, which was in fact GREEK-speaking. Constantine immediately followed that up by BANNING BLOOD SACRIFICE which was practiced by nearly every pagan European and Mediteranean religion, including Druidism. But the `Astro-Theologists NEVER talk about pagan human/blood sacrifice do they? No paganism has to be superior to Christianity in every way.

Orthodoxy was in fact it was the first Christian church. Vatican split off from Orthodoxy in 1054 and right from that date the Crusades, the Inquisitions, the burnings began. Orthodox Christianity is today the 2nd largest Christian denomination. It does not practice evangelization or forced conversions. Orthodox priests can marry and they do not have a Pope.

[bigus_dickus]

Orthodoxy was in fact it was the first Christian church. Vatican split off from Orthodoxy in 1054 and right from that date the Crusades, the Inquisitions, the burnings began. Orthodox Christianity is today the 2nd largest Christian denomination. It does not practice evangelization or forced conversions. Orthodox priests can marry and they do not have a Pope.

not only that, but people in general are ignorant about the inquisition and the crusades. what they believe about them, is what they have heard from here and there, they have never studied the history and found out what it really was, how it happened and why it happened, never examined the context and the historical events that led there. ignorant people believe that it was all decided by the leaders to enslave and kill people. but that's not what it was and that's not what have happened.

all they have to do is pick up a history (maybe many not just one) book written by real historians.. but no.. lazy ass people prefer to believe what's against their parents.

[adimon]

Here you are falling into another trap which equating Vatican policies with Christianity. Vatican is NOT Christianity.

To be honest, all 'blends' of Christianity I have encountered are distasteful to me.

Most Christians are moral conservatives and would impinge on the freedoms of other people, based on a lowest-common-denominator argument. If the Church got their way we'd see regression/repression of social and sexual freedoms, and when taken a way down the line we'd be back to drowning witches and the French inquisition.

Q: What right has anyone got to tell me I can't have anal sex with my wife, or watch pornography, or listen to music with swear words? (to name but a few examples that very few Christians can handle)

[celtic isis]

Here you are falling into another trap which equating Vatican policies with Christianity. Vatican is NOT Christianity. Vatican is a political entity, an independent city state with its own seat at the UN. Another example of how the `astro-theologists' like Jordan Maxwell, Acharya, Tsarion, etc who pretend to have done all this research, yet they IGNORE the history of Orthodox Christianity as if it never existed.

While the rest of Europe was in the `Dark Ages', for over 1,000 years Byzantium/Constantinople was the richest city in the world, the center of civilization. The `Roman' emperor Constantine, who was born in Serbia of Non-Roman parents, hated Rome so much he actually moved the capitol of Rome to Constantinople, which was in fact GREEK-speaking. Constantine immediately followed that up by BANNING BLOOD SACRIFICE which was practiced by nearly every pagan European and Mediteranean religion, including Druidism. But the `Astro-Theologists NEVER talk about pagan human/blood sacrifice do they? No paganism has to be superior to Christianity in every way.

Orthodoxy was in fact it was the first Christian church. Vatican split off from Orthodoxy in 1054 and right from that date the Crusades, the Inquisitions, the burnings began. Orthodox Christianity is today the 2nd largest Christian denomination. It does not practice evangelization or forced conversions. Orthodox priests can marry and they do not have a Pope.

and Christianity is PAGANISM. :)

[celtic isis]

Your welcome no problem..Im wondering if they'd of made it in HD whether it may of come across a bit clearer for Drakul? who knows? Im only messin with ya Drak:)

hehe snicker :)

[celtic isis]

Thanks splinterg- so kind of you :)- but i had downloaded it from a torrent and so watched it on pc- just would realy like the comfort of lounging on the sofa and watching it on widescreen!! :D

how come ours didn't work when we did that? we're missing some damn code.

is that link splinterg gave the same as the one i first posted on here?

that's where we watched it :)
it's the official movie site no?


jesus, you guys adimon bigus dickus drakul etc, you're REALLY MISSING THE POINT, all you do is try and gather info to fit your beliefs, it's sad.

:rolleyes:

stop pissing about on this little birthdate etc is wrong in zeitgeist who cares, the elite insiders want you to be debating insignificant things like that rahter then belting out the mesage, which is what is important at the end of the day.

We're not missing any point, i'm being really careful not to destroy religion christianity until i have everything worded perfectly so that the proles won't just think omg, so then there is really NOTHING...they have zero spiritual backup so cannot just trample on their religious beliefs with zeitgeist without giving them something else to lean on.


i know that the ones in the know are trying to destroy people's religious faith, we're just trying to seperate religion as a manmade social tool and spirituality and faith which is completely unrelated to religion and the dogma that goes with it.

[celtic isis]

I agree that Christianity has been the target of TPTB, but I don't agree that this is the aim of Zeitgeist. Zeitgeist has got people asking questions who would otherwise continue to be spoonfed. I could be wrong, the search continues, and I am open-minded enough to change my mind as information continues to be unconvered.



911 is still fresh, although time is running out, and the orwellian state is unfolding right now and war continues because of that day. Its critical to get this info to the massess. The Kennedy truth is not dead and buried yet, its interwoven with the whole treachery web. Not everyone has given up on it.



I think the debate is on many levels, including a debate about the evidence.
The Zeitgeist producers made a film and threw it out into the ether, here we are now discussing it, fantastic.



I think you should carry on what you are doing, providing opposing points of view and we will all get closer to the truth together.
I think that school children should be given both sides of the argument to make up their own minds.



You don't know that, and nothing is concrete, the rabbit hole is very very deep.



Yes, thats why I'm here.

THANK "GOD" FOR SHODAN :)

[adimon]

What I'm referring to in particular is conversations I have had with a large number of Christians regarding social and sexual freedoms.

I always get told stories of how marriages and relationships have been damaged by sex or pornography or prostitution.

STORY 1: A man starts watching S&M porn, and wants to force his wife to do some of the things he has seen on screen. She won't. They argue. There's a big fight, lot of emotion, and they divorce.

STORY 2: A man starts visiting prostitutes. His wife finds out. They argue, big fight, lot of emotion, divorce..blah blah

GENERAL CHRISTIAN VIEWPOINT OF STORY 1: If nobody watched S&M porn, nobody would be deviated by it, and the nuclear family remains strong.

GENERAL CHRISTIAN VIEWPOINT OF STORY 2: If there were no prostitutes, nobody would be deviated by it, and the nuclear family remains strong.

MY VIEWPOINT OF STORY 1: Choice & responsibility. The man has a choice - which does he care more about - the love of his wife, or the desire to pursue an interest in S&M sex? The wife has a choice - which does she care more about - the love of her husband, or her not wanting to try S&M. There are many alternatives here to divorce depending on the individuals choices. He could just leave the issue, and resign himself to experiencing that world only through fantasy, and go on living his life and loving his wife. She could try it, and like it. She could try it and not like it, and then they leave it. They could even have an open relationship for a short time so he could get it out of his system with someone else. The choices are endless. The point is that we should take individual responsibility for our own lives, and there is no need for conservative moralistic dogma to control these situations. Strength of character is what will make your family strong, not prohibitive laws.

The exact same thing applies to STORY 2.

[thirdwave]

I dont think its a case of Christianity being a target.... it has always been used by them full stop...

now they want to create 1 world religion, this is apart of the NWO ...so they do not mind if the holes in religion are shown... just as long as their lies are still hidden its all ok.... as if they get their way it will be their religion....

the the thing is, when "Christianity" I don't think it was a religion... just a continuousness.... I think that is where the word came from....

so if people really want to be Christians, then they need to find that conciousness and stop following a book that has been and will continue to be updated over and over....

[adimon]

so if people really want to be Christians, then they need to find that conciousness and stop following a book that has been and will continue to be updated over and over....

Wise words TW. If I meet someone who believes in a God, I ask them why.

If I meet someone who believes in JC, I ask them 'WHY?'

[celtic isis]

I dont think its a case of Christianity being a target.... it has always been used by them full stop...

now they want to create 1 world religion, this is apart of the NWO ...so they do not mind if the holes in religion are shown... just as long as their lies are still hidden its all ok.... as if they get their way it will be their religion....

the the thing is, when "Christianity" I don't think it was a religion... just a continuousness.... I think that is where the word came from....

so if people really want to be Christians, then they need to find that conciousness and stop following a book that has been and will continue to be updated over and over....


yep that's it exactly.

If we would just realise that we are all spiritual beings (in material bodies to experience this life) and if we always remained close to nature and its vibrations which are our vibrations and energies also, and if the esoteric knowledge was given back to humanity then everything would be perfection. everyone would instinctively know what was truth and what wasn't, there would be no fighting, no seperation as we would all understand that we are all one and humanity would have the tools to make them better equipped to lead better lives and evolve sucessfully :)

no need for manmade religion.

I was brought up a "good christian irish catholic", my mam was a nun, i realised whne i ws 12 that the whole mass, church, religion in textbooks dictated and rammed down our throats just didn't resinate with me...but i am a good christian, even though i have no reigion, i just am, a spiritual/material being.

I have no disrespect for christians, just for the institution itself cause it's based on lies and false truths and misleading the masses for a global political agenda.

[kweli]

Just thought i'd say- i watched this movie finally and WOW- it blew me away!!

Although i knew all the info produced in a round about way from researching over the last two years, it kinda joined up all the dots for me and made it a lot clearer in my head- i was even able to go to work the next morning in a great mood btw and explain to my friend (who's so asleep she may aswell be wheeled round in a her bed all day long bless her!!lol) the info regarding the Federal Reserve and the illegal taxes that the U.S. citizens are paying etc....and i actually knew what i was talking about!! :D and she understood me....although it may have gone in one ear and out the other :rolleyes::D
It is easy going enough for anyone to watch and understand!!

Loved the film....well done to those who put it together- i shall be burning it to disc asap (when i buy a new burner coz mines broke) and distributing to as many of my friends family and colleagues as possible!! :)

I bought this off ebay a few months ago, not sure if the seller's a member of this forum but there was a list of conspiracy sites included in the package, that's how I came to be here. So thankyou if it was any of you :D I thought that was a cool idea to get the message out. You can get tonnes of 'Truth' dvds on there for just 99p each.

That's what I did with it lottie, I have a multi disc burner, so I copied it and passed it around. It was really well received, like you say it's easy going, and anyone can understand it, even those that haven't thought about these things before. I do however, tell them that some of the first part is heavily disputed by some in the truth seeking movement and it's maybe a good idea to do their own research in this area if they're interested.

[thirdwave]

yeah my Dads side are Italian Catholic .... they are not even overly religious but I would still get an evil eye if I was to disrespect Juses to them.... because they fear it would be a unwise thing to do....


your right.... if people all just got on with whats inside then things would change...

but they fear a thing called hell... created by this guy called the Devil.... who will take them there unless they do as they are told..... and when you think like that... well you are not free...

we take our selves to "hell" or "heaven" ..our choice.

but you cant create hell on earth and expect to create heaven when you die..... bottom line is people need to learn that it is smarter and pays off more to be a good person than a bad person.... not be good because they are terrified of being "bad"......

[adimon]

no need for manmade religion.

All religion is manmade, but you are right.

You can get tonnes of 'Truth' dvds on there for just 99p each.

Or on BitTyrant for free.

[kweli]

All religion is manmade, but you are right.



Or on BitTyrant for free.

Aye, but I prefer to have a hard copy, (can't burn from my pc) and who knows how much longer we're going to be able to view this stuff online?

[adimon]

I understand your concerns kweli, but let me assure you that the hackers are always ten steps ahead of the controllers. They literally run them in circles.

www.demonoid.com got shut down, but there are so many torrent sites, they'd need a team of 30 agents to keep track of all of them.

[kweli]

I understand your concerns kweli, but let me assure you that the hackers are always ten steps ahead of the controllers. They literally run them in circles.

www.demonoid.com got shut down, but there are so many torrent sites, they'd need a team of 30 agents to keep track of all of them.

That is indeed good to know. :D

[lizzy]

Lift up the corner of Zeitgeist, find `Acharya S' (real name D.M. Murdoch), lift up the corner of Acharya and find - The Theosophical Society - lift up the corner of that and find - The LUCIS Trust (located on Rockefeller Plaza in NY with the UN and recipient of $$$$$ BILLIONS from the elite). Lift up the corner of the Lucis Trust and you have - The LUCIFER Soc. founded by admitted Satanist, Helen Blavatsky.

Follow the $$$$$ money trail. Think these people don't have major illuminati backing?

http://www.rense.com/general72/GATES.HTM

http://www.realnews247.com/the_lucis_trust_satanism_and_the_nwo.htm


Always follow the money.........you are SO right.
and the links say it ALL.

[bigus_dickus]

jesus, you guys adimon bigus dickus drakul etc, you're REALLY MISSING THE POINT, all you do is try and gather info to fit your beliefs, it's sad.

i am not missing the point, i am MAKING A point.

i watched only the first part of the movie, so i can't say anything about the rest. but the part that i watched, didn't challenge my beliefs. it challenged what i know from years of research on all religions and especially Christianity, which is the religion of my family and my country. i didn't have to "dig up" info to deliberately oppose to the maker of the movie. i don't know who he is and i don't care. i only put forward the results of my personal research and that's it. if it was talking against another religion, i would do the same so the truth be told, not to defend the other religion, but for the sake of the truth.

if i see someone lie deliberately and deceive people, i say it. then you do what you want. believe it, or research it more, up to you. no hard feelings, no worries, no sadness.

[lizzy]

Yes this concerns me deeply too. They want to destroy Christianity but what are they offering in its place - drugs/Ayauasca, tarot, diviniation, magic (black and white), superstition, voodoo? LUCIFER?

The free masons worship Lucifer. So do the Theosophists. All these people, Jordan Maxwell (Zeitgeist), M. Tsarion, Acharya, etc are linked to the Theosophical Soc. which owns the LUCIS Trust - follow the money trail. Lucis Trust has $$$ Billions with a swank office next to the UN on Rockefeller Plaza. Lucis Trust was originally founded as the LUCIFER Trust (talk about being right out in the open). It was founded by Helen Blavatsky an open Luciferian who equated Lucifer with SATAN. M. Tsarion called Blavatsky `the purest soul born on this earth'. Now What does that tell you???


I voice of reason. My sentiments EXACTLY.

[lizzy]

Here you are falling into another trap which equating Vatican policies with Christianity. Vatican is NOT Christianity. Vatican is a political entity, an independent city state with its own seat at the UN. Another example of how the `astro-theologists' like Jordan Maxwell, Acharya, Tsarion, etc who pretend to have done all this research, yet they IGNORE the history of Orthodox Christianity as if it never existed.

While the rest of Europe was in the `Dark Ages', for over 1,000 years Byzantium/Constantinople was the richest city in the world, the center of civilization. The `Roman' emperor Constantine, who was born in Serbia of Non-Roman parents, hated Rome so much he actually moved the capitol of Rome to Constantinople, which was in fact GREEK-speaking. Constantine immediately followed that up by BANNING BLOOD SACRIFICE which was practiced by nearly every pagan European and Mediteranean religion, including Druidism. But the `Astro-Theologists NEVER talk about pagan human/blood sacrifice do they? No paganism has to be superior to Christianity in every way.

Orthodoxy was in fact it was the first Christian church. Vatican split off from Orthodoxy in 1054 and right from that date the Crusades, the Inquisitions, the burnings began. Orthodox Christianity is today the 2nd largest Christian denomination. It does not practice evangelization or forced conversions. Orthodox priests can marry and they do not have a Pope.

AGAIN.....
Reading through this thread. THIS is MY understanding
WELL SAID, DRUKAL

[lottie]

I bought this off ebay a few months ago, not sure if the seller's a member of this forum but there was a list of conspiracy sites included in the package, that's how I came to be here. So thankyou if it was any of you :D I thought that was a cool idea to get the message out. You can get tonnes of 'Truth' dvds on there for just 99p each.

That's what I did with it lottie, I have a multi disc burner, so I copied it and passed it around. It was really well received, like you say it's easy going, and anyone can understand it, even those that haven't thought about these things before. I do however, tell them that some of the first part is heavily disputed by some in the truth seeking movement and it's maybe a good idea to do their own research in this area if they're interested.

Yeah, i shall get a little production line going soon, just gotta get a new burner the other one's gone 'kaputt'!!
I always tell people to do their own research....you gotta find your own truth.

Something thats shocked me over the last couple of years is how much ive learned and how friends and family are aware of this but still after knowing me all my life, can't bring themselves to trust me enough to even take a look at what im trying to say is life-changing/concerns everyone!! :rolleyes: BUT Zeitgeist might just change all that....LOL!!!:D

[drakul]

not only that, but people in general are ignorant about the inquisition and the crusades. what they believe about them, is what they have heard from here and there, they have never studied the history and found out what it really was, how it happened and why it happened, never examined the context and the historical events that led there. ignorant people believe that it was all decided by the leaders to enslave and kill people. but that's not what it was and that's not what have happened.

all they have to do is pick up a history (maybe many not just one) book written by real historians.. but no.. lazy ass people prefer to believe what's against their parents.


Would you expand on the history of the inquisition and the crusades?

[drakul]

AGAIN.....
Reading through this thread. THIS is MY understanding
WELL SAID, DRUKAL

Thanks Lizzy for taking the time to read my posts. I would also ad that in Constantinople and over the entire Roman empire, Emperor Constantine also banned the GLADIATOR GAMES in 325AD. However in Rome these `games' went on until at least 404 and historians say these sacrificial blood fests were held in Rome as late as 681.

There are also inscriptions on Vatican Hill as late as the end of the end of the 4th century (nearly 200 years AFTER Constantine banned blood sacrifice) in which it is stated that leading Roman politicians held sacrifices of bulls. These sacrifices, called TAUROBOLIUMS resulted in the supplicants being drenched in the blood of the dying bull. Pure MITHRAISM, (the Roman cult which was popular during the first centuries of Christianity in which the `crucified savior god' is always pictured sacrificing a bull). And Zeitgist has the chutzpah to equate Mithra to Jesus Christ?

Taurboliums were also practiced in the worship of Attis, another `crucified savior god' Zeitgeist equates to Jesus.


http://books.google.com/books?id=qHxV-YHpG4MC&pg=PA199&lpg=PA199&dq=blood+sacrifice+banned+by+rome&source=web&ots=vC3EPWPtqr&sig=3dEK3jgKah0DBEcDx2XjxDK5gOc

[bigus_dickus]

Would you expand on the history of the inquisition and the crusades?

i'd love to.. but it's too much and i don't remember everything in detail. maybe i will post in outline form some time later when i get some free time, i am a little tight right now.

[dave31]

...The free masons worship Lucifer. So do the Theosophists. All these people, Jordan Maxwell (Zeitgeist), M. Tsarion, Acharya, etc are linked to the Theosophical Soc. which owns the LUCIS Trust - follow the money trail...

This comment is about as dumb as it gets. First, Tekton is used in the NT to describe Jesus as a carpenter (it isn't defined as "carpenter") - meanwhile, TODAY modern Greek defines it as "FREEMASON" - look it up.

Second, Jordan Maxwell and Acharya are not wealthy so to suggest that we need to follow the money is so funny that I can't keep a straight face while I type this. Thanks for the laugh though...

[drakul]

This comment is about as dumb as it gets. First, Tekton is used in the NT to describe Jesus as a carpenter (it isn't defined as "carpenter") - meanwhile, TODAY modern Greek defines it as "FREEMASON" - look it up.

Second, Jordan Maxwell and Acharya are not wealthy so to suggest that we need to follow the money is so funny that I can't keep a straight face while I type this. Thanks for the laugh though...


Keep on smirking. And while you're sniveling go to Jordan Maxwell's website and check out 2 letters on his site which claim Maxwell gave $100,000 CASH AND an apartment to D. Icke when he first came to the US. Maxwell is furious because Icke now shuns him. So who has $100,000 to throw around? And to an unknown? A rich man? Or maybe an AGENT OF INFLUENCE? Got to be one or the other.

As for Acharya S - do you even know her real name? Her books are selling aren't they? Someone is publishing them.

[lisaw]

Hi i must be stupid or something but i can't find the thread for the antichrist Dajjal will be a Reptilian Shapeshifter, has that been taken off ? is nothing safe these days?

[celtic isis]

i am not missing the point, i am MAKING A point.

i watched only the first part of the movie, so i can't say anything about the rest. but the part that i watched, didn't challenge my beliefs. it challenged what i know from years of research on all religions and especially Christianity, which is the religion of my family and my country. i didn't have to "dig up" info to deliberately oppose to the maker of the movie. i don't know who he is and i don't care. i only put forward the results of my personal research and that's it. if it was talking against another religion, i would do the same so the truth be told, not to defend the other religion, but for the sake of the truth.

if i see someone lie deliberately and deceive people, i say it. then you do what you want. believe it, or research it more, up to you. no hard feelings, no worries, no sadness.


well that says it all right there then!

watch the rest!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! don't just assume the whole film is like that cause it isn't.

everyone who has seen this movie has said that movie is feckin fantastic! it's being passed around on facebook. It was released in june and i couldn't be bothered watching it, then i did and well...nuff said.

Also you may have researched this stuff before bigus, but the majority of people have never even heard this stuff before and they are the people this is aimed at, not people like you. :)

and drakul, i'm a christian, i was brought up a christian by my mum who was a nun for years...i know what it's about that you very much.


I may not be in the christian box now but i'm still a good person! stop saying we're mixing what christianity means cause i'm not, i know what it means!

:rolleyes:

[celtic isis]

anyone coming on this thread only seeing arguing go here :)

http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?p=251338&posted=1#post251338

i understand drakul now! peace ;)

[celtic isis]

just for the record...i only posted about Zeitgeist because it is such a brilliant movie and really good for introducing people to the whole web/agenda etc....and it has just the right shock value, including the farce of a war on terror and on how the media really operate and its true purpose/role in the overall game.

Don't think it's just about religion! it weaves everything into the film, it's really really a good effort!

Please give it a chance if you haven't yet.

I waited months (since june) to watch it and i only did cause a fellow icker had it on her facebook profile and then i saw that it was the top video clip being pased around the Irish network on facebook.

OH and i set aside a sunday afternoon to finally watch it and well, it was well worth it!!!!!

But for the ones who aren't new to this, no need to discredit it, it's a great movie, really. I've been looking into thsi stuff for 2 years now, just like lottie to name one and she loved it too.


give us some credit lol

[dave31]

Keep on smirking. And while you're sniveling go to Jordan Maxwell's website and check out 2 letters on his site which claim Maxwell gave $100,000 CASH AND an apartment to D. Icke when he first came to the US. Maxwell is furious because Icke now shuns him. So who has $100,000 to throw around? And to an unknown? A rich man? Or maybe an AGENT OF INFLUENCE? Got to be one or the other.

As for Acharya S - do you even know her real name? Her books are selling aren't they? Someone is publishing them.

I'm not smirking drakul - the comments simply aren't accurate.

As I said, Tekton is used in the NT to describe Jesus as a carpenter (it isn't defined as "carpenter") - meanwhile, TODAY modern Greek defines it as "FREEMASON" - look it up.

Jordan Maxwell and Acharya are not wealthy so to suggest that we need to follow the money is so funny that I can't keep a straight face while I type this. Thanks for the laugh though...

Do you know anything about the being an author or the book business? One is lucky to get more than a whole $1 from each book. One would have to sell around a million copies and be on the "best sellers list" to actually make serious money from a book.

What I'm responding to are just rumors with no truth to them at all.

[bigus_dickus]

watch the rest!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! don't just assume the whole film is like that cause it isn't.

i will some time. but i don't criticize the whole film, only the part about christianity. i have written more and longer posts about this before in which i have pointed out the mistakes in the story and in language, the biases and the assumptions that are not backed up by anything but speculation and about the orientation and agendas of the people who make those claims. i already knew those people because i have read and seen them before, so there was nothing new to me in zeitgeist part one. if you want to read about religions and stuff, pick up real books by real scholars, the amateurs will for the most part mislead you. also if there's an agenda behind, which in some cases i think there is, we are talking about propaganda here. and i don't care about whose beliefs get attacked, propaganda is propaganda.

also, if you read my posts, i am being careful not to make outrageous speculations myself or talk about matters of belief, i am more interested in the historical inaccuracies and also in the mistranslations and misinterpretations of languages and the very biased correlation of popular myths.

everyone who has seen this movie has said that movie is feckin fantastic! it's being passed around on facebook. It was released in june and i couldn't be bothered watching it, then i did and well...nuff said.

and why do i care what "everyone" thinks?

in our case "everyone" is a group of people with certain common characteristics, so it's not really everyone. maybe i am not one of those "everyone".

Also you may have researched this stuff before bigus, but the majority of people have never even heard this stuff before and they are the people this is aimed at, not people like you. :)

you actually mean that it's aimed at ignorant people.

well, that's what i am here for. why would i normally bother?

i could have said "fuck it" and close the forum.

or maybe it would be better for me to remain ignorant. i don't know, time will tell.

[bigus_dickus]

As I said, Tekton is used in the NT to describe Jesus as a carpenter (it isn't defined as "carpenter") - meanwhile, TODAY modern Greek defines it as "FREEMASON" - look it up.

tekton means carpenter, or builder.

that's the word where the "tect-" comes from.

words derived:
architect (chief (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=architect) tekton)
tectonic (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=tectonic&searchmode=none)
texture (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=texture)
text (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=text)

read all the above links.

it is from the base "tek-", which means "to make".

and now, look at the word mason (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=mason)

do you see how someone can easily confuse things? if anyone didn't understand ask me to explain more.

[shodan]

just for the record...i only posted about Zeitgeist because it is such a brilliant movie and really good for introducing people to the whole web/agenda etc....and it has just the right shock value, including the farce of a war on terror and on how the media really operate and its true purpose/role in the overall game

exactly Celtic, exactly :) check this out, think you'll like it :)

http://zeitgeistmovie.com/zday.htm

In an effort to increase public awareness of the important social issues addressed in ‘Zeitgeist’, along with our belief that human unity is the key to ending the exploitation of humanity, we are working to have ‘Zeitgeist’ shown in as many colleges / theatres and meet-up groups as possible on:

March 15th 2008
This will be “Z-Day”
A day of Awareness and Activism

[dave31]

tekton means carpenter, or builder.

that's the word where the "tect-" comes from.

words derived:
architect (chief (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=architect) tekton)
tectonic (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?search=tectonic&searchmode=none)
texture (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=texture)
text (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=text)

read all the above links.

it is from the base "tek-", which means "to make".

and now, look at the word mason (http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=mason)

do you see how someone can easily confuse things? if anyone didn't understand ask me to explain more.

You can read ancient and modern Greek, or no?

[dave31]

"Acharya S also uses `16 Crucified Saviors' this book as one of her main sources."

- Has anyone here actually read Acharya's work - it doesn't seem like it because this is another completely false statement. Acharya uses Graves only 7 times in "Christ Conspiracy" and in "Suns of God" she mentions him only to discuss the fracas surrounding him - she always investigates where he was getting his sources and where they lead to.

Enjoy "The Companion Guide to ZEITGEIST Part 1" E-Book
http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/zeitgeist.html

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d125/solarsky22/ZGcover.jpg

"Maybe the real target is is to destroy Christianity, to destroy the MORAL CODE, the underpinnings of society..."

- This is a joke, right? What is so moral about Christianity? From where I stand it is Christianity and other religious frauds pushed onto the masses usually through violence that is at the root of many of the worlds problems today.

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d125/solarsky22/invisibleJewishguy.jpg

[bigus_dickus]

You can read ancient and modern Greek, or no?

i do my best... after all i am Greek.

[dave31]

i do my best... after all i am Greek.

In that case you should know better than to use that etymological dictionary. If you want to get the original languages use Strong's or the blue letter bible.

"...when the texts are examined closely it is clear that characterizing Jesus as a "carpenter"—a widely held belief—has very little basis in the literary record, and none in the historical or archaeological records. In the first place, the Greek word commonly translated as "carpenter"—tekton—could refer to an artisan or worker in other trades as well, such as a smith, builder or mason. Per Strong's (G5045), tekton means the following:

1) a worker in wood, a carpenter, joiner, builder
a) a ship's carpenter or builder
2) any craftsman, or workman
a) the art of poetry, maker of songs
3) a planner, contriver, plotter
a) an author

We have no description in the New Testament of Jesus sawing wood or doing any other carpentry work specifically. In fact, this designation of Christ as a tekton can be found in the Bible only once, at Mark 6:3..."

"...Matthew (13:55) calls Jesus the "son of the tekton,"

Furthermore, tekton as an appellation of Jesus does not appear in the earliest manuscript of Mark.
~ Who Was Jesus?" page 176-7 ********************/2fa8aw

The word for "stonemason" in Greek is "ktistes." Tekton was used in reference to a member of a Masonic Brotherhood rather than a carpenter or a simple stone-cutting workman.
~ "Suns of God" page 547-8 http://www.truthbeknown.com/sunsofgod.htm

[bigus_dickus]

In that case you should know better than to use that etymological dictionary. If you want to get the original languages use Strong's or the blue letter bible.

i know much better than that. i have better dictionaries in book hard cover form.
blue letter bible? i don't think so. etymonline comes handy for use on an english forum, it's pretty accurate.

below is the full meaning and etymology. keep in mind that the word was used in ancient writings, therefore its usage corresponds to the ancient context and meaning of the word and not to the modern usage and meaning, which was coined in the 18th century, 1,700 years after the scriptures were written.

τέκτων (tekton)

meaning: someone occupied with wood works, the maker of works based on timber, carpenter, joiner, cabinetmaker, but also builder, stonemason, maker, worker, architect, naval architect.
2) every worker, hand craftsman, creator of works of art (eg. sculpture)
|| referring to poets: tectons of epos or hymns = poets, versificators

II metaphorically: deviser, machinator, plotter, conspirator
|| generally: creator, demiurge, causative, source, author.

etymology:

sanskrit:
tάkSan-, zend. tasan- (creator), tάSkati, taStiC (some strange symbols there, i can't type them) = work with wood, build, construct

taStar- (tecton) = latin textor, zend. tas- (cut, snip, clip), tasa (axe), lat. texo (weave, knit, construct), tela (fabric, textile) < *teksia, subtemen (weft), testa (kitchen utensils), old irish tal (hammer), old german dehsala (axe), dahs (brush), middle german dehsen (flail linum), lithuanian taszy'ti (trim, chop), old slavic tesatl (= latin caedere), tesla (axe), tesu (rafter) from iapet. *teko (chop wood, be a carpenter).

derivations: female τέκταινα (tektena), τεκταίνω, τέχνη (techne = art)

take the last word that derives τέχνη (techne)

this is the word where all the tech- words derive from, namely technology, technician, technical, etc.

here are 2 more references
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=technology
http://www.etymonline.com/index.php?term=techno-



you directed me to a book by Acharya S?

please...

[drakul]

I'm not smirking drakul - the comments simply aren't accurate.

As I said, Tekton is used in the NT to describe Jesus as a carpenter (it isn't defined as "carpenter") - meanwhile, TODAY modern Greek defines it as "FREEMASON" - look it up.

Jordan Maxwell and Acharya are not wealthy so to suggest that we need to follow the money is so funny that I can't keep a straight face while I type this. Thanks for the laugh though...

Do you know anything about the being an author or the book business? One is lucky to get more than a whole $1 from each book. One would have to sell around a million copies and be on the "best sellers list" to actually make serious money from a book.

What I'm responding to are just rumors with no truth to them at all.


Lift up the corner of Zeitgeist, find `Acharya S' (real name D.M. Murdoch), lift up the corner of Acharya and find - The Theosophical Society - lift up the corner of that and find - The LUCIS Trust (located on Rockefeller Plaza in NY with the UN and recipient of $$$$$ BILLIONS from the elite). Lift up the corner of the Lucis Trust and you have - The LUCIFER Soc. founded by admitted Satanist, Helen Blavatsky.

Follow the $$$$$ money trail. Think these people don't have major illuminati backing?

http://www.rense.com/general72/GATES.HTM

http://www.realnews247.com/the_lucis...nd_the_nwo.htm


And yes I have Achary's book - `Christ Conspiracy'.

And yes I am somewhat familiar with the book trade. I wrote a hardcover reference book on horses, also published a magazine for an association for several years and produced videos for the assn.

[celtic isis]

exactly Celtic, exactly :) check this out, think you'll like it :)

http://zeitgeistmovie.com/zday.htm

thank you shodan :);)

the famous Z day!

[celtic isis]

- Has anyone here actually read Acharya's work - it doesn't seem like it because this is another completely false statement. Acharya uses Graves only 7 times in "Christ Conspiracy" and in "Suns of God" she mentions him only to discuss the fracas surrounding him - she always investigates where he was getting his sources and where they lead to.

Enjoy "The Companion Guide to ZEITGEIST Part 1" E-Book
http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/zeitgeist.html

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d125/solarsky22/ZGcover.jpg



- This is a joke, right? What is so moral about Christianity? From where I stand it is Christianity and other religious frauds pushed onto the masses usually through violence that is at the root of many of the worlds problems today.

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d125/solarsky22/invisibleJewishguy.jpg


good work dave, cheers for posting that, i've lost the plot of this thread lately :o

[celtic isis]

i will some time. but i don't criticize the whole film, only the part about christianity. i have written more and longer posts about this before in which i have pointed out the mistakes in the story and in language, the biases and the assumptions that are not backed up by anything but speculation and about the orientation and agendas of the people who make those claims. i already knew those people because i have read and seen them before, so there was nothing new to me in zeitgeist part one. if you want to read about religions and stuff, pick up real books by real scholars, the amateurs will for the most part mislead you. also if there's an agenda behind, which in some cases i think there is, we are talking about propaganda here. and i don't care about whose beliefs get attacked, propaganda is propaganda.

also, if you read my posts, i am being careful not to make outrageous speculations myself or talk about matters of belief, i am more interested in the historical inaccuracies and also in the mistranslations and misinterpretations of languages and the very biased correlation of popular myths.



and why do i care what "everyone" thinks?

in our case "everyone" is a group of people with certain common characteristics, so it's not really everyone. maybe i am not one of those "everyone".



you actually mean that it's aimed at ignorant people.

well, that's what i am here for. why would i normally bother?

i could have said "fuck it" and close the forum.

or maybe it would be better for me to remain ignorant. i don't know, time will tell.

once again, what i said i didn't mean in that way...and to be honest i can't be bothered explaining again now so watch it or don't watch it, agree or don't agree, you're really clever and have a bigus dickus to boot, have a nice life dude :)

:D

[jim fear]

I’ve Seen zeitgeist The movie and thought it was well presented, apart from the music, which was a little to loud all the way though and gets really irritating and repetitive after a while, specially when your trying to listen to what’s been said in the back ground.

The start about Christianity is interesting but it all happened was so long ago who really knows what really happened? Its so hard to get to the truth and wit hthings like this how will we know what the truth actually is? when someone thinks they’ve found new evidence for their version of events there’s someone else saying something completely different and every one argument has a counter argument and unless we can go back in time we will never be able to get to the truth with any real degree of accuracy

The bit about Horus didn’t add up when I checked it out until I looked up Ra on wiki and found this:

In later Egyptian dynastic times, Ra was subsumed into the god Horus, as Re-Horakhty (and many variant spellings). He commanded sky, earth, underworld. He was associated with the falcon.

Which made it more believable. I think that the ancient people tracking the stars is a lot more realistic than a guy who can walk on water etc.

Theres probably a lot of incarrate information on zeitgeist and when ever something seems to confirm all the stuff which we here at DI.com seem to be interested in, it becomes our responsibility to research and check things out! Don’t swallow everything your given.

I’m not a Christian but I think that the bible contains a lot of wisdom within its stories and myths, however it should be taken with a pinch of salt and not as a accurate historical reference book as we know that it edited by the Romans and that there will be various translation errors and it should NEVER BE TAKEN LITERALLY!!. I get so angry at religious nuts on Alex Jones videos on Youtube, telling everyone to pray and then quote the bible instead of been proactive and encouraging people to stand up for what they believe in. By the way is Alex Jones a Christian? Because the Christians love him! And they lap up his information; they seem to like the way he presents his information, with that over dramatic Americanised “We are all doomed!” act. He does a lot of good work and reports a lot of interesting information but does he need to be so dramatic about it all? I think not.

However I consider myself a highly evolved begin so instead of mocking them and leaving nasty messages I tolerate & accept them and state my disagreement but also that I respect there right to believe whatever they want, as long at it doesn’t effect or harm another persons way of life or there choices.

[amercury]

[QUOTE=drakul;252564]Lift up the corner of Zeitgeist, find `Acharya S' (real name D.M. Murdoch), lift up the corner of Acharya and find - The Theosophical Society - lift up the corner of that and find - The LUCIS Trust (located on Rockefeller Plaza in NY with the UN and recipient of $$$$$ BILLIONS from the elite). Lift up the corner of the Lucis Trust and you have - The LUCIFER Soc. founded by admitted Satanist, Helen Blavatsky.

Follow the $$$$$ money trail. Think these people don't have major illuminati backing?



But why would the elite/illuminati want to educate the masses about the Federal Reserve? Or the microchip? Or taxation?
I don't see how that helps their agenda

[dave31]

Originally Posted by drakul
Lift up the corner of Zeitgeist, find `Acharya S' (real name D.M. Murdoch), lift up the corner of Acharya and find - The Theosophical Society - lift up the corner of that and find - The LUCIS Trust (located on Rockefeller Plaza in NY with the UN and recipient of $$$$$ BILLIONS from the elite). Lift up the corner of the Lucis Trust and you have - The LUCIFER Soc. founded by admitted Satanist, Helen Blavatsky.

Follow the $$$$$ money trail. Think these people don't have major illuminati backing?

[QUOTE]But why would the elite/illuminati want to educate the masses about the Federal Reserve? Or the microchip? Or taxation? I don't see how that helps their agenda

That's right amercury...it doesn't make any sense because the quote you're responding to by drakul is complete utter bullshit. He has absolutely no Idea what the hell he's talking about here. This is just a paranoid view. These are lies with no basis in reality or fact whatsoever.

1st. Acharya's real name is on her latest damn book for all to see. It means nothing that she has a real name and once used a pen name like so many other authors.

2. Suggesting that Acharya is a member of the "Theosophical Society" demonstrates the absurdity here. She hasn't got a damn thing to do with that. And it goes down hill from there. None of this is true.

3. She keeps herself as private as possible because her 3 year old son was ABDUCTED FROM HER ARMS BY 3 STRANGERS.

4. She makes JUST enough money to pay bills. She drives a car that is a decade old and she's another one of the 50 million Americans who can't afford insurance for herself or her child - hows that for these stupid ass rumors?

5. Neither of those links drakul shared even mentioned Acharya at all.

Just stop these GOD DAMN LIES

[morphix]

Just finished watching this movie and have to say it was excellent!

The way the information is layed out (as im sure said before now in this thread) is perfect for those that are new to the truth.

I've watched a few other movies about the Illuminati, 9/11 and other topics but I have to say that as someone that is just starting out on the path to the truth this film is excellent. The whole presentation of the information throughout this was brilliant!

I've got friends that are the biggest sceptics in the world when it comes to any conspiracy type theory usually but I know when they see this film they are going to have questions that they wont be able to just forget about.

I'm going to burn this onto the discs I have at the moment and give it to at least 10 different people i know today / tomorrow, these are the kind of people that properbly dont even know who David Icke is and hopefully they will benefit from it as much as I have just have.

That being said I've had a quick read through some of the previous pages in this thread and I see a lot of discussion but haven't noticed any plans for March 15th Zeitgiest day is any one planning a showing anywhere? I'm in the UK north west not far from Manchester wondering if theres anything going on in the area?

Can you imagine the reaction if they played this video at Old Trafford (home to Manchester Utd FC for those outside the UK :P ) to a packed crowd or in every pub in the area at the same time.

Roll on Z day!

[drakul]

[QUOTE=amercury;252941]

That's right amercury...it doesn't make any sense because the quote you're responding to by drakul is complete utter bullshit. He has absolutely no Idea what the hell he's talking about here. This is just a paranoid view. These are lies with no basis in reality or fact whatsoever.

1st. Acharya's real name is on her latest damn book for all to see. It means nothing that she has a real name and once used a pen name like so many other authors.

2. Suggesting that Acharya is a member of the "Theosophical Society" demonstrates the absurdity here. She hasn't got a damn thing to do with that. And it goes down hill from there. None of this is true.

3. She keeps herself as private as possible because her 3 year old son was ABDUCTED FROM HER ARMS BY 3 STRANGERS.

4. She makes JUST enough money to pay bills. She drives a car that is a decade old and she's another one of the 50 million Americans who can't afford insurance for herself or her child - hows that for these stupid ass rumors?

5. Neither of those links drakul shared even mentioned Acharya at all.

Just stop these GOD DAMN LIES

The links I posted were not supposed to mention Acharya - they are about the Theosophical Society's LUCIS TRUST.

Illuminati Free Masons have been promoting and FUNDING atheism since the 1800s - one of the early very influential - `Christ is just a myth' books - `ANACALYPSIS' written 1833 by Royal Arch Master Mason Godfrey Higgins.

Acharya S quotes extensively from Anacalypsis in the `Christ Conspiracy' which went straight into the Zeitgeist film. (That's all these people do is cite each others work - they don't use primary first hand sources).

Acharya also quotes from Albert Pike - The Grand Guru of All Time, 33rd Degree Mason - `Morals and Dogma', PLUS The books of the Master Mason CHURCHWARD brothers AND Richard Baigent - editor FREE MASONRY TODAY.

I wonder WHY? Why does Acharya feel compelled to use discredited 3rd and 4th rate Masonic sources instead of creditable primary sources? She calls herself an `archeologist'. Where is the archeology in her books?

Masonic Illuminati agenda - ORDER AB CHAOS - Destroy the foundations of Western society - marriage/morals/GOD/religion to create the NWO.

Show me PRIMARY SOURCES stating that Horus was CRUCIFIED, ATTIS was CRUCIFIED, KRISHNA was CRUCIFIED, BUDDHA was CRUCIFIED. Talk about pure LIES. Any schoolchild in India would be laughing their head off at the crap Acharya puts out and the new SHEOPLE believe it without even checking. New MINDBOXES anyone?

[drakul]

[QUOTE]



But why would the elite/illuminati want to educate the masses about the Federal Reserve? Or the microchip? Or taxation?
I don't see how that helps their agenda

Have you ever heard of DIS-Information???

Disinformation is an art the Communists perfected. You feed people info that is true, at the same time you feed them the LIES concerning your REAL target which in the case of Zeitgeist is Christianity.

You see the Masonic Illuminati know that you and the rest of the public are never gonna do a damn thing about the Federal Reserve, or 9/11, etc. And If there is a popular political surge, they already have their AGENTS OF INFLUENCE in place to make sure it goes their way. Look at the JFK assassination - for 40 years the media has been telling the US public that there is no way Oswald was the `lone nutter' who killed JFK - there's a new TV program, a new book on it every month. Hardly anyone in America really believes the govt's `Lone Assassin' story anymore. But is anything being done about it? Hell no.

But the Masonic Illuminati know there's something that every individual CAN DO - they can make the personal decision to turn away from FAMILY, from MORALITY, from GOD and THAT is what the elites want to destroy the foundation of society.

ORDER AB CHAOS

DIVIDE ET IMPEARA

[dave31]

drakul, you don't have a fucking clue what you're talking about when it comes to Acharya's work. You've never even read her books have you. Here's what she says about "Christ Conspiracy"

It should be kept in mind that the author had no assistance with this book, as she researched, wrote, typed, edited, proofread, typeset and did the illustrations and cover design and execution by herself. All of this work was done without any funding and with only the author's personal library.

drakul "Illuminati Free Masons have been promoting and FUNDING atheism since the 1800s"

- LOL, complete utter BULLSHIT. They would get much more out of promoting the religious fraud that they've enjoyed doing for so long - like Christianity.

Have you ever actually read "Anacalypsis"? I have volume 1 & 2. When it comes to religion you clearly are clueless. If you would like to discuss PRIMARY SOURCES lets give it a go ... where are the primary sources for Jesus being CRUCIFIED? Where are the PRIMARY SOURCES for the witness testimony? In fact, where are the PRIMARY SOURCES for the existence of Jesus at all?

The "laughing Indian children" are hardly in any position to be making educated commentary on research outside of what their primary school teachers have taught them. Your argument has been babbled by incoherent idiots for many years now.
http://forums.truthbeknown.com/viewtopic.php?t=1597

If you want to discuss the Illuminati or Freemasons, have it but, when you try to bring Acharya into it you begin to show that you need to get back on your medications. You're just another typical Christian drakul. It won't fly and you make yourself look ridiculous in the process.

[drakul]

Acharya also cites Helena Blavatsky - `The Secret Doctrine' as a source for her case against Christ.

Blavatsky was an open LUCIFERIAN. Her magazine was called LUCIFER. Blavatsky founded the LUCIFER Trust, now the multi-million dollar LUCIS Trust. Not exactly an objective scholarly source but oh well we do the best we can when first we practice to deceive.

Don't believe in Jesus anymore? We've got someone we want you to meet - LUCIFER.

[drakul]

drakul, you don't have a fucking clue what you're talking about when it comes to Acharya's work. You've never even read her books have you. Here's what she says about "Christ Conspiracy"

- LOL, complete utter BULLSHIT. They would get much more out of promoting the religious fraud that they've enjoyed doing for so long - like Christianity.

Have you ever actually read "Anacalypsis"? I have volume 1 & 2. When it comes to religion you clearly are clueless. If you would like to discuss PRIMARY SOURCES lets give it a go ... where are the primary sources for Jesus being CRUCIFIED? Where are the PRIMARY SOURCES for the witness testimony? In fact, where are the PRIMARY SOURCES for the existence of Jesus at all?

The "laughing Indian children" are hardly in any position to be making educated commentary on research outside of what their primary school teachers have taught them. Your argument has been babbled by incoherent idiots for many years now.
http://forums.truthbeknown.com/viewtopic.php?t=1597

If you want to discuss the Illuminati or Freemasons, have it but, when you try to bring Acharya into it you begin to show that you need to get back on your medications. You're just another typical Christian drakul. It won't fly and you make yourself look ridiculous in the process.


It takes alot of slithering around to make Krishna's mother Devaki, a woman who had SEVEN CHILDREN into a VIRGIN and Acharya is compelled to quote among others - MASTER MASON Godfrey Higgins' `Anacalypsis' pub 1833 to prove her point. Acharya also quotes some `swami' who claims that `at that time ALL women were born of virgins no matter how many children their mothers had'. I figured Acharya would have to come up with a LAME EXSCUSE like that because it's the ONLY WAY around such a DECEPTION.

That's just one example - the vast majority of what Acharya states regarding similarities between all the `world's 16 crucified saviors' is based on lies, half truths, twisting the truth and outright deceptions and omissions. I have already given MANY EXAMPLES of this with links in this thread. Anyone can do a google check to find out for themselves.

And if anyone thinks that I don't have Acharya's book - `The Christ Conspiracy' ASK FOR A QUOTE FROM ANY PAGE AND I WILL PROVIDE IT.

A FEW of the MASONIC SOURCES (mostly out of date and very antiquated) that Acharya is compelled to cite to `prove' her case against Christianity:

* Albert Pike - THE All Time GRAND GURU 33+++ degree Freemason - `Morals and Dogma'. Albert Pike is the VERY FIRST source Acharya cites. What does that tell you? Pike was an open LUCIFERIAN.

* Godfrey Higgins - Master Mason - `Anacalypsis' pub 1833! (really up to date stuff here). Higgins even openly refers to `my Masonic Friends who will understand perfectly' the double meanings in the book.

* Albert Churchward - Master Mason - `Origin and Evolution of Religion' pub 1924

* James Churchward - Royal Arch Master Mason - `The Lost Children of Mu' pub 1926

* Michael Baigent - Editor Free Masonry Today (right out of the serpents mouth!) - `Dead Sea Scroll Deception'

And those are just SOME of Acharya's sources for Christ Conspiracy that are easily identifiable Freemasons using a google search. You can bet there are more!

[dave31]

As I said, you've never actually read her books. Clearly, you don't get it - IT WAS TITLED "CHRIST CONSPIRACY" FOR A REASON. You didn't get it because you've obviously never actually read the book.

drakul "those are just SOME of Acharya's sources for Christ Conspiracy that are easily identifiable Freemasons"

- And what could one imagine she'd discuss there in "Christ Conspiracy" - a CONSPIRACY maybe? In "Suns of God" Acharya has an entire chapter titled "THE MYSTERIOUS BROTHERHOOD." Now, what can one guess what that's about, humm? Maybe you could try & actually READ the book, drakul?

A case can be made that *YOU* are a Freemason and involved in the Illuminati and are spreading these lies because the fact is, Acharya spells out how the masons/brotherhood were involved in the CREATION of Christianity and other religious frauds similar to what David Icke points out through his own work.

drakul "It takes alot of slithering around to make Krishna's mother Devaki, a woman who had SEVEN CHILDREN into a VIRGIN"

- LOL, and that's different from Jesus's mother Mary having 7 children how? If you read Acharya's work you'd know that they are not real historical people, they are MYTHS. Mythology being another topic you're clueless on.

drakul "because it's the ONLY WAY around such a DECEPTION"

- Or maybe you're just totally ignorant on the issues? You didn't even look at the sources there did you. Most of Indian professors or scholars, many read and write Sanskrit some have translated the Indian texts into English. Still, Acharya made up NONE of it as you try to imply very dishonestly I might add - a cowardice tactic which demonstrates the weakness of your fallacious misrepresentations about Acharya. drakul, you simply cannot be trusted at all.
http://forums.truthbeknown.com/viewtopic.php?t=1597

drakul "That's just one example"

- Yes, an example that you don't have a clue what you're talking about. Either you are purposely spreading lies and rumors or you are just a dimwit who is simply clueless.

Look up "Mason" and you'll find it says "Masonry, Freemasonry" with 19 references. Now, read them - ALL OF THEM. In "Suns of God" she has 22 references.

Of course, I couldn't help but notice you offered no PRIMARY SOURCES backing up Jesus/Christianity (fraud) surrounding the crucifixion/resurrection.

[dave31]

Acharya also cites Helena Blavatsky - `The Secret Doctrine' as a source for her case against Christ.

Blavatsky was an open LUCIFERIAN. Her magazine was called LUCIFER. Blavatsky founded the LUCIFER Trust, now the multi-million dollar LUCIS Trust. Not exactly an objective scholarly source but oh well we do the best we can when first we practice to deceive.

Don't believe in Jesus anymore? We've got someone we want you to meet - LUCIFER.

Again you demonstrate your cluelessness drakul. Just because you claim to be Greek doesn't mean you can speak the Greek language.

""Heylel," translated as Lucifer, the "Light-Bearer." Per Strong's (H1966), however, Heylel or Helel could also refer either to a king of Babylon or to the "morning star," i.e., the planet Venus. In fact, one of Venus's epithets in Greek was "Phosphoros," or "Light bearer." The RSV translates the term "Helel" at Isaiah 14:12 as, "O Day Star, son of Dawn!" In the Septuagint (3rd-1st cent. BCE), the word "Helel" is rendered as "(H)eosphoros," which just happens to be the name of a very old Greek god/titan who served as one aspect of the planet Venus. This god Eosphoros is mentioned in Homer's Iliad (23:226) and in Hesiod's Theogony (378), dating to the 9th and 8th centuries BCE, respectively."

From "Who Was Jesus?" page 251
Amazon - ********************/2fa8aw

There is no Satan/ Lucifer as the bible would lead us to believe and there never has been.

[drakul]

Acharya uses HIGH LEVEL MASONIC AUTHORS as SOURCES to SUPPORT her claims that Jesus Christ is a myth. SUPPORT being the key word. Acharya is not criticizing these people she is citing them as authorities in the field.

Acharya obviously THINKS ALBERT PIKE the GRAND GURU of Freemasonry IS GREAT because she quotes PIKE DIRECTLY from the FREE MASONIC BIBLE - MORALS AND DOGMA.

How much more obvious can you get? Acharya does not criticize Pike or any of the other high-ranking Masons that she uses as sources. Acharya holds them up as sources of wisdom and knowledge.

MORALS and DOGMA is the first source Acharya uses - PAGE 2 in the Christ Conspiracy . So Acharya is telling you right off the bat whose camp she's really in. Let those who have eyes to see SEE.


BTW I never ever claimed to be GREEK. Maybe you have me mixed with someone else?

[dave31]

So What drakul? She also uses top Christian authorities, evangelicals as well as New Testament Scholars as sources too. Are you going to freak out of those too? Your paranoia is misguided and misplaced.

"...Few believe in any religion because they have examined the evidences of its authenticity, and made up a formal judgment, upon weighing the testimony. Not one man in ten thousand knows anything about the proofs of his faith. We believe what we are taught; and those are most fanatical who know least of the evidences on which their creed is based"

- This is your evidence that Acharya is an Illuminati / Freemason member? (Maybe you weren't aware that they didn't allow women in) Rather, it seems to me that she is simply pointing out the OBVIOUS. Do you disagree with that statement? I totally agree with it. Does that now make me another Illuminati/ Free masonic parrot?

drakul "So Acharya is telling you right off the bat whose camp she's really in. Let those who have eyes to see SEE."

- Yeah, the same camp I'm in, the one with the most common sense, logic and reason. What then exactly is your camp drakul - the Christian camp? Where are the proofs of your Christian faith? You couldn't even provide any Primary sources for the existence of Jesus at all. Why should anyone here believe anything you have to say?

[drakul]

So What drakul? She also uses top Christian authorities, evangelicals as well as New Testament Scholars as sources too. Are you going to freak out of those too? Your paranoia is misguided and misplaced.

- This is your evidence that Acharya is an Illuminati / Freemason member? (Maybe you weren't aware that they didn't allow women in) Rather, it seems to me that she is simply pointing out the OBVIOUS. Do you disagree with that statement? I totally agree with it. Does that now make me another Illuminati/ Free masonic parrot?

- Yeah, the same camp I'm in, the one with the most common sense, logic and reason. What then exactly is your camp drakul - the Christian camp? Where are the proofs of your Christian faith? You couldn't even provide any Primary sources for the existence of Jesus at all. Why should anyone here believe anything you have to say?

The vast majoirity of sources that Acharya cites in Christ Conspiracy are ANTI-CHRISTIAN POLEMICS. Most of them are atheists, masons or anti-Christian or all of the above. Very few of Acharya's sources are objective scholars who are recognized experts in the field of archeology or comparative religion etc.

Example - Acharya consistently quotes KERSEY GRAVES author of - `World's 16 Crucified Saviors' pub 1875! And who is Kersey Graves? Basically a backwoods exQuaker, atheist schoolteacher who spent most of his life farming in Ohio. Kersey never traveled overseas, never received a higher education. Kersey simply copies the ideas from Masonic auther G. Higgins' `Anacalypsis' (pub 1833) and that's how they do it - use each other as `sources' just keep passing along the proverbial bull, when in fact most of them are coming from a completely biased viewpoint and are unqualified to begin with.

BTW - FREEMASONS DO ALLOW WOMEN. Check your sources.

Does Acharya have a graduate degree in the field?

[dave31]

And once again, just more of your total ignorance and BULLSHIT drakul.

drakul "Example - Acharya consistently quotes KERSEY GRAVES author of - `World's 16 Crucified Saviors' pub 1875!

- LOL, she uses Graves 7 times. You over-exaggerate everything out of proportion.

"BTW - FREEMASONS DO ALLOW WOMEN. Check your sources."

No, sir check yours. There were no women allowed until recently. Acharya has no part in it. You are a GOD DAMN LIAR

Answer the questions:

What then exactly is your camp drakul - the Christian camp? Where are the proofs of your Christian faith? You couldn't even provide any Primary sources for the existence of Jesus at all. Why should anyone here believe anything you have to say?

[drakul]

And once again, just more of your total ignorance and BULLSHIT drakul.



- LOL, she uses Graves 7 times. You over-exaggerate everything out of proportion.

No, sir check yours. There were no women allowed until recently. Acharya has no part in it. You are a GOD DAMN LIAR

Answer the questions:

What then exactly is your camp drakul - the Christian camp? Where are the proofs of your Christian faith? You couldn't even provide any Primary sources for the existence of Jesus at all. Why should anyone here believe anything you have to say?

`No women allowed (into Freemasonry) until recently you're a gawdam liar'.

He calls me a liar while admitting I am absolutely RIGHT. Women ARE allowed into Freemasonry with the men. Furthermore the Freemasons have always had Masonic orders for women such as the ORDER OF THE EASTERN STAR.

Order of the Eastern Star - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

As far as what I believe in - that's not the point. I don't even attend church. If there was no Jesus, I am prepared to accept that, which is why I bought Achary's book. But puleeeze don't take a serious subject like the existence of Jesus Christ and then insult my intelligence with ridiculous easily provable false hoods, omissions and deceits. And that is exactly what Acharya does in the Christ Conspiracy.

As I was reading the Christ Conspiracy with its stunning statements about the world's 16 crucified saviors, all born on Dec 25 of a virgin, crucified, ressurected etc etc and I looked at Acharya's sources thinking - oh these people like Higgins and Churchward and Kersey and Jackson they must be specialists with new information up to date info. University professors, recognized archeologists who can read primary sources - Egyptian hieroglyphics and sanscrit, sumerian etc etc. I gave Acharya the benefit of the doubt.

Imagine my shock to find out that most of Acharya's sources are a bunch of unqualified masonic atheists and Luciferians many of whom wrote 50 - 150+ years ago!

That takes chutzpah.

[dave31]

Your research as per usual drakul is nothing. The "Order of the Eastern Star" was established in 1850 as it states in the wiki link you provided.

drakul "don't take a serious subject like the existence of Jesus Christ and then insult my intelligence with ridiculous easily provable false hoods, omissions and deceits"

- You haven't proven anything except that you haven no clue what you're talking about when it comes to Acharya or religion.

drakul "sources are a bunch of unqualified masonic atheists and Luciferians"

- Another one of your lies drakul. You have no clue what the hell you're talking about. As I've already told you but you refuse to listen due to your preconceived conclusions Acharya used Christian authorities, apologists and evangelicals, as well as New Testament scholars but you just ignore that. Also, it has been made clear to you that Acharya only used Graves 7 times. Her work is stand or fall on any of the people you mentioned.

"...Gerald Massey utilized the work of the best minds of the time, including that of Champollion, as well as that of Dr. Budge; Sir Renouf; famed Egyptologist Sir William Flinders Petrie; noted Egyptologist Sir John Gardner Wilkinson, the "Father of British Egyptology"; Egyptologist and professor at the University of Berlin, Dr. Heinrich Brugsch; French Egyptologist and curator of the Egyptian section at the Louvre, le vicomte de Rougé; and expert on Egyptian mummies, Dr. Thomas Joseph Pettigrew, among many other scholars in a wide variety of fields. For example, Massey also utilized the work of Sir J. Norman Lockyer, the famous royal English astronomer who was friends with Budge and knew Egypt well, and of Dr. Charles Piazzi Smyth, royal Scottish astronomer and professor of Astronomy at the University of Edinburgh. Massey further studied the work of Reverend Archibald Sayce, professor of Comparative Philology at Oxford..."

So drakul you claim you're not a Christan now yet you still imply that Lucifer is real and that you believe in him - a very Christian belief. You can't have it both ways. Are you also lying about being a Christian?

Why should anyone here believe anything you have to say drakul?

[dave31]

Pay no attention to this review of Acharya's work by a professor ... nothing to see here just move along. Stay paranoid and ill informed.

"The Companion Guide to Zeitgeist, Part 1, by Acharya S is an absolute must for anyone who wishes to fully understand the significance of the movie."

"Well-referenced, with numerous quotations from renowned Egyptologists and classical scholars, Acharya's penetrating research clearly lays out the very ancient pre-Christian basis of modern Christianity. Those who espouse Christianity beware! After digesting the evidence, you will never again view your religion in the same light."

Robert M. Schoch, Ph.D.
Professor of Natural Science
College of General Studies at Boston University
Author, Pyramid Quest, Voyages of the Pyramid Builders and Voices of the Rocks
http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/zeitgeist.html

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d125/solarsky22/ZGcover.jpg

[drakul]

Your research as per usual drakul is nothing. The "Order of the Eastern Star" was established in 1850 as it states in the wiki link you provided.

[/B]


So??? Again I am RIGHT. I said the Masons have always had orders for women. I posted the link for The Order of the Eastern Star - estab 1850. You are contradicting yourself as usual.

And quoting Kersey Graves 7 times is a signifigant amount. Besides, Graves just parrots Master Mason Godfrey Higgins' `Anacalypsis'. Different name, same deceptions. Blavatsky also parrots Higgins. They parrot each other right down the line from 1833.

[dave31]

No, no drakul you're still just full of it. You have yet to be right and you're just making this up as you go along. Having Orders for women is *NOT* the same as allowing women to be members within the all male organization. Eastern Star does not prove your case except maybe in your own mind. You're just squirming desperately that's all. Same as you have been all along.

drakul "quoting Kersey Graves 7 times is a signifigant amount.'

- Oh, now 7 times is significant before it was "Acharya consistently quotes KERSEY GRAVES" in post 160. So which is it? I think we know what is, you're making this up as you go drakul.

Do you or do you not agree with this quote:

"...Few believe in any religion because they have examined the evidences of its authenticity, and made up a formal judgment, upon weighing the testimony. Not one man in ten thousand knows anything about the proofs of his faith. We believe what we are taught; and those are most fanatical who know least of the evidences on which their creed is based"

LOL, how do you explain these quotes which came long before the 19th century writers you so despise yet, know so little about? Who were these guys parroting - please show us your erudition on this history -

"Now when the ancient Egyptians, awestruck and wondering, turned their eyes to the heavens, they concluded that two gods, the sun and the moon, were primeval and eternal; and they called the former Osiris, the latter Isis..."
~ Diodorus Siculus (90-21 BCE), Greek Historian,
"Suns of God" 89

Early Church Father Tertullian (160-220 C.E.), an "ex-Pagan", ironically admits the true origins of the Christ story and of all other such godmen by stating in refutation of his critics, "You say we worship the sun; so do you."
(paraphrase from the Catholic Encyclopedia)
~ "Christ Conspiracy" 158

"...All the gods of the Greek and Roman mythology represent the attributes of the one supreme divine power - the SUN."
~ Macrobius Roman scholar around 400ce
"Suns of God" 67-68

So drakul you claim you're not a Christan yet you still imply that Lucifer is real and that you believe in him - a very Christian belief. You can't have it both ways. Are you also lying about being a Christian? Why should anyone here believe anything you have to say drakul?

[esowteric]

WE JUST WATCHED THE MOVIE TODAY AND FOOK ME IT'S FANTASTIC

If you're interested in really well researched facts, the guy to look out for is Joseph Campbell:

Joseph Campbell - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Regards,

[drakul]

No, no drakul you're still just full of it. You have yet to be right and you're just making this up as you go along. Having Orders for women is *NOT* the same as allowing women to be members within the all male organization. Eastern Star does not prove your case except maybe in your own mind. You're just squirming desperately that's all. Same as you have been all along.

- Oh, now 7 times is significant before it was "Acharya consistently quotes KERSEY GRAVES" in post 160. So which is it? I think we know what is, you're making this up as you go drakul.

So drakul you claim you're not a Christan yet you still imply that Lucifer is real and that you believe in him - a very Christian belief. You can't have it both ways. Are you also lying about being a Christian? Why should anyone here believe anything you have to say drakul?


1. You already admitted above that Freemasonry `recently' admitted women. you are CONTRADICTING yourself.

2. Checking Acharya's citations chapter by chapter - she uses Kersey Graves (worlds 16 crucified saviors pub 1875) FOURTEEN TIMES not 7 as you claim.

3. Acharya BEGINS and ENDS The Christ Conspiracy with supporting quotes from 33 degree Supreme Commander of Freemasonry ALBERT PIKE (Luciferian) whom Acharya cites TWENTY-FIVE TIMES.

Doesn't that seem a little STRANGE???

Why would a `scholar' and `archeologist' want to quote Albert Pike as a signifigant supporting source??? Why Feel compelled to do that???

David Icke in `Children of the Matrix' calls Albert Pike the `Infamous Freemasonic God' (pg 93).

On pg 174 Icke says - `Freemasonry is a wonderful example of how the Illuminatis have always hidden truth in a complex mass of degree levels,
mystique, CONTRADICTION (my caps) and lies'

On page 176 Icke says - `Freemasonry is a cesspit of DECEIT (my caps) and hypocrisy and the oaths to the secret societies and your fellow initiates override any oath you may have made to your country or people'. And further - `This has always been the way of the Illuminati serpent cult in all its forms'.

[kasalt]

I've done some digging on the internet and found these quotes from various authorities relating to this subject, well worth taking a look at:

EUSEBIUS

Eusebius, in his Church History, tells us that Justin, in his Dialogue with Trypho, says "there exists not a people, civilized or semi-civilized, who have not offered up prayers in the name of a crucified Savior to the Father and Creator of all things" (Hist. Eccl. lib i. ch. iv).

Eusebius says that "the names of Jesus and Christ were both known and honored by the ancients" (Hist. Eccl. lib. i. ch. iv).

Eusebius, the great champion of Christianity, admits in his book: "that which is called the Christian religion is neither new nor strange, but-if it be lawful to testify the truth-was known to the ancients" (Hist. Eccl. lib. 2, ch. v.).

CELSUS

Celsus, the Epicurean philosopher, wrote that "the Christian religion contains nothing but what Christians hold in common with heathen; nothing new" (Justin, Apol 2.).

SAINT AUGUSTINE

Augustine is quoted as saying: "That which is known as the Christian religion existed among the ancients, and never did not exist; from the beginning of the human race until the time when Christ came in the flesh, at which time the true religion, which already existed began to be called Christianity" (Retractt. I, xiii, cited by Dr. Alvin Boyd Kuhn in his Shadow of The Third Century, Elizabeth N.J.: Academy Press, 1949, p.3).

AMMONIUS SACCUS

Ammonius Saccus, a Greek philosopher, founder of the Neoplatonic school, taught that Christianity and Paganism when rightly understood, differ in no essential points, but had a common origin, and are really one and the same religion (Taylor, Diegesis, p. 329).

THOMAS PAINE

“The Christian religion is a parody on the worship of the Sun, in which they put a man whom they call Christ, in the place of the Sun, and pay him the same adoration which was originally paid to the Sun.”

http://paganizingfaithofyeshua.netfirms.com/disturbing_quotes.htm

[grenadene]

I've only joined the forum tonight so i'm amazed that you in the midst of discussing what i was reading in the bath earlier.... is it me or is there something very strange in air? Jung must have been bang on with his collective consciousness theory ;)

I took up my vigorous independent research into everything that has happened in the world since the beginning of time... mostly because there's so much bullshit being banded around! All my friends think i've gone totally mad..which is cool ...i'm starting to view them as poor little pits ponys that have lost their vision!

oooh i'm so happy to have found some fellow 'weirdos' :D

[siscid]

I've only joined the forum tonight so i'm amazed that you in the midst of discussing what i was reading in the bath earlier.... is it me or is there something very strange in air? Jung must have been bang on with his collective consciousness theory ;)

I took up my vigorous independent research into everything that has happened in the world since the beginning of time... mostly because there's so much bullshit being banded around! All my friends think i've gone totally mad..which is cool ...i'm starting to view them as poor little pits ponys that have lost their vision!

oooh i'm so happy to have found some fellow 'weirdos' :D

Welcome Grenadene!

I hope you enjoy your stay at the forums and learn lots of interesting things! :)
Also about what you said, coincidences aren't really coincidences deep down in detail. (From what I know).

Anyways Welcome and Have fun!

Regards

Siscid

[drakul]

I've only joined the forum tonight so i'm amazed that you in the midst of discussing what i was reading in the bath earlier.... is it me or is there something very strange in air? Jung must have been bang on with his collective consciousness theory ;)

I took up my vigorous independent research into everything that has happened in the world since the beginning of time... mostly because there's so much bullshit being banded around! All my friends think i've gone totally mad..which is cool ...i'm starting to view them as poor little pits ponys that have lost their vision!

oooh i'm so happy to have found some fellow 'weirdos' :D

HI GRENADENE welcome aboard.

[drakul]

I've done some digging on the internet and found these quotes from various authorities relating to this subject, well worth taking a look at:

EUSEBIUS

Eusebius, in his Church History, tells us that Justin, in his Dialogue with Trypho, says "there exists not a people, civilized or semi-civilized, who have not offered up prayers in the name of a crucified Savior to the Father and Creator of all things" (Hist. Eccl. lib i. ch. iv).

Eusebius says that "the names of Jesus and Christ were both known and honored by the ancients" (Hist. Eccl. lib. i. ch. iv).

Eusebius, the great champion of Christianity, admits in his book: "that which is called the Christian religion is neither new nor strange, but-if it be lawful to testify the truth-was known to the ancients" (Hist. Eccl. lib. 2, ch. v.).

CELSUS

Celsus, the Epicurean philosopher, wrote that "the Christian religion contains nothing but what Christians hold in common with heathen; nothing new" (Justin, Apol 2.).

SAINT AUGUSTINE

Augustine is quoted as saying: "That which is known as the Christian religion existed among the ancients, and never did not exist; from the beginning of the human race until the time when Christ came in the flesh, at which time the true religion, which already existed began to be called Christianity" (Retractt. I, xiii, cited by Dr. Alvin Boyd Kuhn in his Shadow of The Third Century, Elizabeth N.J.: Academy Press, 1949, p.3).

AMMONIUS SACCUS

Ammonius Saccus, a Greek philosopher, founder of the Neoplatonic school, taught that Christianity and Paganism when rightly understood, differ in no essential points, but had a common origin, and are really one and the same religion (Taylor, Diegesis, p. 329).

THOMAS PAINE

“The Christian religion is a parody on the worship of the Sun, in which they put a man whom they call Christ, in the place of the Sun, and pay him the same adoration which was originally paid to the Sun.”

http://paganizingfaithofyeshua.netfirms.com/disturbing_quotes.htm

Thomas Paine was an avowed anti-Christian `Deist' (Luciferian?) and a freemason.

Of the other writers, mostly they are saying that the ideas and principles behind Christianity have been around for a long time, long before Jesus Christ arrived on the scene and I can't argue with that. Why should I? Look at Buddhism - 500BC. But for the most part the statements you quote do NOT deny the existence of Christ. They are basically just saying that Jesus' philosophy did not come out of a VOID. And I agree with that.

However I take issue with SACCUS whom you quote because there was and is a huge difference between the vast majority of pagan religions practiced at the time of Jesus and CHRISTIANITY. That difference is the pagan practice of BLOOD/HUMAN SACRIFICE. Blood Sacrifice was BANNED by emperor Constantine from his capitol in Constantinople along with the gladiatorial games (more ritual blood sacrifice) in 325 AD. Our friends who constantly tell us how wonderful it was during the age of Paganism always neglect to tell us about the RULE OF FEAR under the SERPENTS.

[drakul]

1. You already admitted above that Freemasonry `recently' admitted women. you are CONTRADICTING yourself.

2. Checking Acharya's citations chapter by chapter - she uses Kersey Graves (worlds 16 crucified saviors pub 1875) FOURTEEN TIMES not 7 as you claim.

3. Acharya BEGINS and ENDS The Christ Conspiracy with supporting quotes from 33 degree Supreme Commander of Freemasonry ALBERT PIKE (Luciferian) whom Acharya cites TWENTY-FIVE TIMES.

Doesn't that seem a little STRANGE???

Why would a `scholar' and `archeologist' want to quote Albert Pike as a signifigant supporting source??? Why Feel compelled to do that???

David Icke in `Children of the Matrix' calls Albert Pike the `Infamous Freemasonic God' (pg 93).

On pg 174 Icke says - `Freemasonry is a wonderful example of how the Illuminatis have always hidden truth in a complex mass of degree levels,
mystique, CONTRADICTION (my caps) and lies'

On page 176 Icke says - `Freemasonry is a cesspit of DECEIT (my caps) and hypocrisy and the oaths to the secret societies and your fellow initiates override any oath you may have made to your country or people'. And further - `This has always been the way of the Illuminati serpent cult in all its forms'.

There is an abundance of info on the net about the `GRAND DRAGON' (literally) of the Klu Klux KlaN and Supreme Commander of Freemasonry - Albert Pike. From Pike's book - Morals and Dogma (1871)

“The Blue Degrees are but the outer court…of the temple. Part of the symbols are displayed there to the initiate, but he is intentionally misled by false interpretation. It is not intended that he shall understand them, but it is intended that he shall imagine that he understands them…The true explanation is reserved for the Adepts, the Princes of Masonry (those of the 32nd and 33rd degrees)”
(Here Pike is telling the reader right of the bat that it is Masonic POLICY to LIE and DECEIVE. D. Icke also includes this quote in Children of the Matrix). Another of Pike's Luciferian/Satanic quotes -

"The true name of Satan, the Kabalists say, is that of Yahveh reversed; for Satan is not a black god... Lucifer, the Light-bearer! Strange and mysterious name to give to the Spirit of Darkness! Lucifer, the Son of the Morning! Is it he who bears the Light, and with its splendors intolerable blinds feeble, sensual, or selfish Souls? Doubt it not!"

Now WHY would Acharya cite this `Grand Dragon' of Free Masonry 25 times as a `SOURCE'??? A source of WHAT? By citing Pike, who died in 1891, as her very first reference in the Intro and twice in the Conclusion of Christ Conspiracy PLUS 22 times in between, it strikes one that Acharya is paying HOMAGE TO PIKE. Why?

1+1=???

There is so much interesting info on this `evil scoundrel' Albert Pike on line. Stunning. I am going post more links on him.

[dave31]

drakul "there was and is a huge difference between the vast majority of pagan religions practiced at the time of Jesus and CHRISTIANITY. That difference is the pagan practice of BLOOD/HUMAN SACRIFICE."

- You're right(sarcasm), so God allowed his only begotten sun (whoops son) to be crucified - a blood ritual, human sacrifice. Thanks for clearing that up drakul. Why do you sound so Christian?

drakul "Blood Sacrifice was BANNED by emperor Constantine"

- Really, why didn't Jesus put an end to that or at least Christians at the time if Jesus was truly crucified and resurrected one would think it would've stopped then if it really happened. Why did it take 300 years? It didn't stop because Jesus never existed.

drakul "1. you are CONTRADICTING yourself"

- No, drakul post 160 "BTW - FREEMASONS DO ALLOW WOMEN." Then you went on to say in post 162 "Freemasons have always had Masonic orders for women such as the ORDER OF THE EASTERN STAR"

Well that is not the Freemason organization. It's not the same. You're just once again making this up as you go.

2. "using Graves 14 times"

- No, 7 as I said. You're using google books to look it up and you're getting the 7 footnotes plus, the 7 references for them in the index = 14. Stop being dishonest.

3. LOL, she actually only cites Pike 7 times too. And she should, writing a book about religious conspiracies hence, the name of the book. You still haven't figured this out yet because you've never actually read the book. All you would have to do is read the back cover but you've clearly never even done that.

drakul "Doesn't that seem a little STRANGE?"

- No, it's not strange to any person who is not mental that an author would write a book about religious conspiracies and include a discussion about freemasons, the brotherhood mysteries etc, similar to David Icke - as I've already made clear. Having read both Icke and Acharya, they tend to complement each other very well. Acharya's focus was specifically on religion while Icke went into other directions like government.

David Icke writes about Freemasons and he includes references to Acharya in the Matrix - WHY THEN DIDN'T ICKE CLEARLY STATE THAT ACHARYA IS A FREEMASON? Maybe because they know each other and Icke knows better? Ever think of that one? Why don't you ask him instead of just making up LIES and RUMORS about Acharya? Have a free-for-all about the Illuminati and Freemasons all you want. But when you bring Acharya into it trying to claim she is one them you have no Idea what you're talking about, PERIOD.

Do you or do you not agree with this quote:

"...Few believe in any religion because they have examined the evidences of its authenticity, and made up a formal judgment, upon weighing the testimony. Not one man in ten thousand knows anything about the proofs of his faith. We believe what we are taught; and those are most fanatical who know least of the evidences on which their creed is based"

drakul you claim you're not a Christan yet you still imply that Lucifer/Satan is real and that you believe in him - a very Christian belief. Where are your primary sources proving the existence of Jesus and that he was crucified and resurrected from the dead?

[grenadene]

I thinks its extremely difficult to examine that which is on the periphery of human consciousness without using the term God/Gods. I think it was Michael Foucault who pointed out how we think in terms of the discourse/language of the culture we inhabit.... so what chance we have i'm not sure? ;) Western civilisation is shot through with Christian hellmongering!

I don't doubt for a minute that Jesus (son of Mr LG Almighty) is just another reinvention of the ancient Osiris/Dionysis. For me, it isn't wether or not he actually lived..perhaps he did and perhaps there are teachings yet to discovered which will illumination our stairway to heaven....or maybe the Monte Python team were pretty spot on in 'The Life of Brian'?!?

Personally, i believe Satan/Lucifer and other personifications of our darker sides are borrowed from existing/opposing systems of faith, forgive me if i'm stating the obvious here? I'm quite happy to leave this discussion in the middle american bible belt where is belongs:p

The questions are quite simple for me.... are human beings capable of receiving divine inspiration, from the stars or from within? What are the essential truths to the Jesus myth.... and was GOD an astronaught?

The mind truly boggles :confused:

[drakul]

-
3. LOL, she actually only cites Pike 7 times too. And she should, writing a book about religious conspiracies hence, the name of the book. You still haven't figured this out yet because you've never actually read the book. All you would have to do is read the back cover but you've clearly never even done that.
[/B].


1. Icke does what he does and says what he says I don't always agree with him BUT one thing Icke does NOT do is use `Grand Dragon' KKK/Mason Albert Pike to support his claims.

2. Acharya's indexing system is very poor. For example authors that she references to frequently don't even APPEAR in the index. Such as WHELESS whom she credits with being the greatest on her, yet her footnotes citing Wheless appear all over the book.

3. Obviously YOU haven't read Christ Conspiracy or you are just deliberately falsifying. ALL the Pike citations support Acharyas' case against Christ. Here is Chapter by Chapter footnote by footnote CITED REVERENCES (oops meant references), to Albert Pike used by Acharya:

1. Pg 1 - Introduction - #1
2. pg 88 - Myth of Hebrew Montheism #2
3. Pg 110 - The Characters #24
4. pg 113 - " " #46
5. pg 117 - " " #71
6. pg 119 - #87
7. pg 132 Archeology and the Bible - #6
8. pg 149 - The Son of God is the Sun of God - #1
9. pg 149 - " " #2
10. pg 149 - " " #3
11. pg 150 - " " #4
12. 150 - " " #5
13. pg151 - " " #7
14. pg 155 - #18 (priceless Pike quote from C. Conspiracy) -

`The sun triumphantly rides an ass and her foal into the city of peace when it enters the sign of cancer which contains 2 stars called little ASSES...'

15. pg 186 - The Gospel Story - #12
16. pg 187 - #13
17. pg 189 - #25
18. pg 224 - Other Elements and Symbols of Christian Myth - #37
19. pg 228 - #51
20. pg 243 - The Patriarchal Saints are Gods of other Cultures - #31
21. pg 266 - Meaning of Revelation - #6
22. pg 385 - Out of Egypt or India - #23
23. Pg 386 " " - #27
24. pg 386 " " - #30
25. pg 412 Conclusion - # 13
26. pg 414 - " " - #17

Face it people Christ Conspiracy is right from the proverbial Grand Dragon's mouth. Even though the Supreme Commander, the `infamous God of Freemasonry' (Icke) died in 1891, maybe he's still is making an `ASS' out of US?

[celtic isis]

Welcome Grenadene!

I hope you enjoy your stay at the forums and learn lots of interesting things! :)
Also about what you said, coincidences aren't really coincidences deep down in detail. (From what I know).

Anyways Welcome and Have fun!

Regards

Siscid

well said siscid and i join you in welcoming grenadene also :)

[celtic isis]

i just found this vid i posted on the serpent and the sun thread...

not sure if i can post it here, is it spamming if i do?

:confused:

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

feck it, you can delete it if it is :D

[drakul]

The info on the web about Albert Pike, Feemason Supreme Commander for 32 years, is nothing short of STUNNING. Here is a copy of a letter Pike wrote in 1871 to Mazinni head of Italian Freemasonry. The letter was published in 1895 by an Italian historian. In the letter Pike outlined his NWO takeover plan for THREE WORLD WARS - TWO of which have already taken place:


Giuseppe Mazzini sent a letter to Albert Pike on 22 January 1870,

in which he described to Pike the new superior organization created

by all freemasonry to achieve the Aim: "We must allow all of the

federations to continue just as they are, with their systems, their central

authorities and diverse modes of correspondence between high grades of

the same rite, organized as they are at present, but we must create a

super rite, which will remain unknown, to which we will call those Masons

of high degree whom we shall select. With regard to our brothers in Masonry,


these men must be pledged to the strictest secrecy. Through this supreme rite, we will govern all Freemasonry which will become the one International

Centre, the more powerful because its direction will be unknown." (Lady

Queenborough, "Occult Theocracy", 1933, pp. 208-209)


Albert Pike (his Illuminatus name was Limud Enhoff), who was

called the Devil of the 19th century, was very obsessed with the idea

of world supremacy. When he became a mason of the 33rd degree, and

as a top Illuminatus in his mansion in Little Rock, Arkansas, he

developed plans to take control of the world by means of three world

wars and several great revolutions.


Pike wrote a letter to Giuseppe Mazzini (whose alias was Emunach

Memed), dated 15 August 1871 (or as he wrote it 0871). The historian

Domenico Margiotta published the letter in his book "Le Palladisme:

Culte de Satan-Lucifer" ("Palladism: Cult of Satan-Lucifer",

Grenoble, 1895, p. 186).


"The inherent antagonism between different ideologies was to be

stirred up and made to explode in three world wars and three revolutions.

The First World War was to destroy the three European empires,

at that time being the last remaining bulwarks against illuminism.

One of these (Russia) was to be made a centre of atheist totalitarianism

(communism). The Second World War was to erupt from

heightened tensions between the Jews (and Zionism)

and extreme European nationalism (Nazism and fascism). This

war would weaken Europe economically and politically and communism

would expand and become as strong as all Christianity, but not

stronger, until the time was ripe for the final destruction of all

society. A third reason for the Second World War was to create a

Jewish state in Palestine. Gradually, it would be possible thereby to

heighten the tensions between Judaism and Islam until it broke out

in a war [yet to come?], which would involve all of the world powers.

The three revolutions, which would aid this carefully

planned dissolution of all human civilization, were the Russian, the

Chinese and the Indo-Chinese [Vietnam]."


Someone seems to have implemented most of this evil scheme,

despite the fact that it was announced as early as 1895. Concerning

the last stage, General Pike wrote the following:


"We shall unleash the NIHILISTS and ATHEISTS and provoke a formidable

social cataclysm which in all its horror will show clearly to the nations the

effect of absolute atheism, origin of savagery and of the most bloody

turmoil. Then everywhere, the citizens, obliged to defend themselves

against the world minority of revolutionaries, will exterminate those

destroyers of civilization, and the multitude, disillusioned with Christianity,

whose deistic spirits will from that moment on be without

compass (direction), anxious for an ideal, but without knowing where to

render its adoration, will receive the true light through the universal

manifestation of the pure doctrine of LUCIFER, brought finally out in the

public view, a manifestation which will result from the general reactionary

movement which will follow the destruction of Christianity and atheism,

both conquered and exterminated at the same time."


[I]Based on this available information, it is clear that knowledge about Albert Pike is very crucial to understanding not only the modern history of the occult, but history in general. You must be the judge of what is accurate and what is conspiratorial conjecture.

http://rochester92.vox.com/library/post/the-infamous-albert-pike-pt-2.html


This infamous letter outlining the plan for WORLD DESTRUCTION and masonic takeover was written by the Grand Dragon of the Kluklux Klan, Supreme Commander of Freemasonry ALBERT PIKE - the same Albert Pike that Acharya quotes as a valuable reference source 26 times in her book - Christ Conspiracy and the basis for the religion section of ZEITGEIST.

WAKE UP PEOPLE.


http://rochester92.vox.com/library/post/the-infamous-albert-pike-pt-2.html

[drakul]

I FOUND IT -

Pg 348 - The Christ Conspiracy - direct quote from Acharya -

"Thus we have seen the remarkable history of Christianity and Free Masonry. Both are `Brotherhoods of the Sun'. The former exoteric (open) and VULGAR, the latter esoteric (secretive) and REFINED".

Christianity is open to the public and therefore `VULGAR' while Free Masonry is secretive and therefore `REFINED'.

Does this sound like someone who is condemning the ILLUMINATI/FREE MASONRY???

What does this tell you about Acharya and Zeitgeist's true agenda?

[drakul]

Pg 343 - The Christ Conspiracy - Chapter - `Enter Rome'

Acharya waxes on endlessly about the wonders of Freemasonry - the masons were the great BUILDERS of invented all the great monuments. the masons have been here since the beginning the masons built everything the masons invented writing the masons controlled all the religions they were `the first priests'.

wow. No wonder Acharya quotes the Grand Dragon of Freemasonry, Albert Pike, and other free masons so extensively - she clearly supports their agenda. I counted 195 cited references from free masons in the Christ Conspiracy - and that's just from the 4 that I know about!

Pg 343 - Acharya claims that Christianity was BUILT by Freemasonry. To prove this she quotes the Bible - "Jesus is called the `very stone which the BUILDERS's rejected', the head of the corner'. Acharya goes on - "The chief cornerstone that the builders rejected is an obvious Masonic symbol referring to the peak of a pyramid which is also the all-seeing eye of Horus"...

But wait a minute - isn't the key word from that Bible quote - `REJECTED'?

`The stone that the (Masonic) builders REJECTED'. Therefore isn't the Bible saying - The Masons REJECTED Jesus???

[jim fear]

David Icke, Jordan Maxwell and Zeitgeist are all saying similar things, so are they using the same sources? Jordan Maxwell’s “the book the church doesn’t want you to read” is one of DI sources (In the biggest secret chapter 4). So it leaves you wondering about the credibility of the rest of their information why don’t they look into it instead of adding it to there own work?

Its hard to find the truth with all the holes in the information we’re receiving, but does this mean that most of the “conspiracy” is bullshit? . Most of the symbolic meaning behind the symbolism we see all around us is said to date back to these ancient times and that the illumati are obsessed with this symbolism. But if these basic facts, which the researchers have uncovered, aren’t true then how much of the story holds water?

I’ve not had time to research all the claims in Zeitgeist but a have had a brief look at the myths of Horus. There are many different forms of horus and somethings do add up from zeitgeist, but i was not able to find all of the statements on there and i found that there are alot of websites out there all saying the same thing quoting simular sources, so i didn't bother adding information of there. I just searched any websites with informaiton on egyption gods, I have a few books of this stuff so i may add to it but below are my findings, and the sources are all there as wel incase you want to back it up

, let me know how accurate you find my work. also I may add to it if I look into it further:


1. Horus born of a virgin

Here are two different versions of Horus’s conception.

“She fashioned a substitute penis after seeing the condition it was in once she had found it and proceeded to have intercourse with the dead Osiris which resulted in the conception of Horus the child”

Horus - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The late form of the legend goes on to say that Isis fanned the body with her feathers, and produced air, and that at length she caused the inert members of Osiris to move, and drew from him his essence, wherefrom she produced her child Horus.
http://www.sacred-texts.com/egy/leg/leg08.htm
With her magical powers, she was able to bring her husband back to life, when he had been torn apart by his brother Set. She then fashioned a replacement for Osiris' missing penis, and blew life - with the appropriate magic words, intonations and rituals... and a little help from Thoth - back into husband. Sharing a night of passion, the deities conceived Horus and Osiris died again, and went on to become Lord of the Underworld.
http://www.thekeep.org/~kunoichi/kunoichi/themestream/isis.html



2.horus wasn’t crusified:

I've spent most the day trying to find anything to do with horus been crusified and all I found out was that he was aparently bit by a snake.

At this point on the Stele the spells are interrupted by a long narrative put into the mouth of Isis, which supplies us with some account of the troubles that she suffered, and describes the death of Horus through the sting of a scorpion.

http://www.sacred-texts.com/egy/leg/leg11.htm

More Snake bite stuff..

It is interesting to note here that this power was said not to extend over natural hazards. Thus, if it had been simply a poisonous snake bite, Horus may have died, but because it was Set’s evil in disguise, the gods were able to cure Horus.

http://www.touregypt.net/DeltaCy.htm

Raising her voice, she cried to the Boat of a Million Years with a cry so great that it stopped the sun boat in its course and shook the earth, because Isis knew the secret name of Ra. Looking down at the grieving goddess, Ra sent Thoth to find out what happened. When he heard, Thoth consoled the goddess:
"What is the matter, O Isis, you who are so divine and skilful and know your spell? Surely nothing has gone amiss with Horus? An assurance of his safety is in the boat of Ra. I have just come from the barge. The sun is in its place of yesterday so that all has become dark and the light has been driven away until Horus recovers his health - to the delight of his mother Isis."
http://www.thekeep.org/~kunoichi/kunoichi/themestream/isis.html



3.Horus was resurrected

Well occurding to this anyway:

In answer to these words Thoth, turning to Isis and Nephthys, bade them to fear not, and to have no anxiety about Horus, "For," said he, "I have come from heaven to heal the child for his mother." He then pointed out that Horus was under protection as the Dweller in his Disk (Aten), the Great Dwarf, the Mighty Ram, the Great Hawk, the Holy Beetle, the Hidden Body, the Divine Bennu, etc., and proceeded
p. lxxviii
To utter the great spell which restored Horus to life. By his words of power Thoth transferred the "fluid of life" of Ra, and as soon as this came upon the child's body the poison of the scorpion flowed out of him, and he once more breathed and lived. When this was done Thoth returned to the Boat of Ra, the gods who formed its crew resumed their rowing, and the Disk passed on its way to make its daily journey across the sky. The gods in heaven, who were amazed and uttered cries of terror when they heard of the death of Horus, were made happy once more, and sang songs of joy over his recovery.
http://www.sacred-texts.com/egy/leg/leg11.htm
The osiris and isis cult infulanced christianity with its teaching of death and ressurection
(pg169 rose-marie & rainer hagan Egypt)


4. personified the rising sun

as Harmakhis, "Horus in the Horizon", he personified the rising sun and was associated with Khepera as a symbol of resurrection or eternal life. The Great Sphinx at the Giza Plateau is an example of this form of Horus.
http://www.egyptianmyths.net/horus.htm

More information on the many forms of horus
http://www.ancientegyptonline.co.uk/horemakhet.html

[kasalt]

David Icke, Jordan Maxwell and Zeitgeist are all saying similar things, so are they using the same sources? Jordan Maxwell’s “the book the church doesn’t want you to read” is one of DI sources (In the biggest secret chapter 4). So it leaves you wondering about the credibility of the rest of their information why don’t they look into it instead of adding it to there own work?

Its hard to find the truth with all the holes in the information we’re receiving, but does this mean that most of the “conspiracy” is bullshit?

No...

Let's put this in perspective, taking David Icke's latest book for example. The issues you raise amount to little more than maybe a few paragraphs in a 600+ page book. Even if I cut them out I still have 600 pages worth of material that is rock-solid, and that's the bottom line.

I've heard David Icke say that he is just putting information out there, and it's up to you to think of it what you will. You have to find out what is true for yourself; you can't just blindly follow any source. "Fact-checking" is a very necessary thing in this world. While no one is perfect, I think David Icke comes closer to the truth than anyone else I'm aware of, and that's why I'm here.

P.S.: Good job on the Horus stuff, btw. Interesting.

[astral_girl]

well i cant seem to get it to work -as i have yet to see it.................any one help ?:confused:

[marmadukehussy]

well i cant seem to get it to work -as i have yet to see it.................any one help ?:confused:

http://video.google.co.uk/videoplay?docid=5547481422995115331&q=ZEITGEIST&total=3328&start=0&num=10&so=0&type=search&plindex=0

[ownedtbh]

i have seen Zeitgeist The Movie yes theres some good parts init i dont know if its an attack on christians or the person who made it was misled. i am at the moment watching HashemsFilms "The Antichrist Dajjal will be a Reptilian Shapeshifter" its very interesting and also tells you about the zeitgeist (the christian part)as being false and misleading. also this film "The Antichrist Dajjal will be a Reptilian Shapeshifter" is being deleted off every video site its being uploaded onto and the persons uploading it there accounts suspended why is this? you can still watch it on youtube as many people are uploading it. it has over 170 parts so finding them all is hard i am currently upto part 48 what do you people think of this film and its claims against Zeitgiest The Movie?

[astral_girl]

nope still isnt doing it-starts off ok then cuts out :confused:

[beldazar]

I watched about 50 of the hashem films, I found them quite informative BUT also I found that it seemed like he was trying to instill a lot of fear, I got really pissed off when he kept saying 'be careful dorothy'. I havent studied the facts behind zeitgeists claims about the resemblances of jesus, mohammed, horus etc... but as certain peole have suggested, the possible 'real' jesus was possibly born in the autumn not xmas so the other famous figures like krishna may have been born at a different date also and other people have discovered that, its just that they may all have been manipulated at some time so that they were all thought of at saturnalia (satan) maybe

[kweli]

From David Icke's 'Latest Headlines' page 6/2/08 - via: http://www.infowarsforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=2952

"Zeitgeist The Movie Lies Exposed

This suspected propaganda film contains over 50 factual errors and has been thoroughly debunked"

[drakul]

From David Icke's 'Latest Headlines' page 6/2/08 - via: http://www.infowarsforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=2952

"Zeitgeist The Movie Lies Exposed

This suspected propaganda film contains over 50 factual errors and has been thoroughly debunked"

I read it. Excellent post Kwelli.
Thanks.

[dave31]

From David Icke's 'Latest Headlines' page 6/2/08 - via: http://www.infowarsforum.com/viewtopic.php?t=2952

"Zeitgeist The Movie Lies Exposed

This suspected propaganda film contains over 50 factual errors and has been thoroughly debunked"

Actually, this is laughable. Have you gone to this forum? It is a joke, Alex Jones - another Christian, refuses to investigate the claims behind Christianity. He's just a believer, *NOT* a thinker. The so-called "50 factual errors" isn't accurate. What they really mean is that they couldn't find it in wikipedia and other encyclopedia entries so they therefore claim - "factual error" when in reality they are just ignorant on the facts.

The original poster of that thread claims that there are "50 factual errors" in Zeitgeist while toward the bottom, this person also claims "The bible has been 100% accurate."

The link takes you to the Alex Jones (another Christian) "infowars" forum which was posted on "Jul 08, 2007" - how is that late breaking headline news? Plus, that forum only had 688 members when posted on Icke's website it at the time I looked at it.

Thing is, much of David Ickes work is in Zeitgeist too so the webmaster probably never checked into this and has obviously made a critical error in posting it like this. It should be removed.

Now, the best sources they can come up with there are old JP Holding crap. JP Holding has absolutely no biblical credentials whatsoever.

Here are just a few links about the dishonesty of JP Holding (another Christian) exposing why he & his entourage cannot be trusted & why anyone claiming to hold any credibility while using him as a source can't be trusted either. Anyone who uses JP Holding as a source or reference for anything deserves absolutely no credibility whatsoever & should be humiliated & embarrassed for it.

JP Holding has no qualifications whatsoever in any Biblical field, knows no Biblical languages, and has no relevant training, yet has the temerity to presume that his OPINION is enough, and that his personal FAITH is all that he needs, to offer a vicious and vitriolic critique of credible credentialed scholars who are trained in this area of expertise. JP Holding has no training in comparative religion. No training in mythology. No training in archaeoastronomy. No training in astrotheology. Nothing relevant.

So, don't take my word for it...see it for yourself.

TEKTONICS.ORG: EXPOSED!
http://the-anointed-one.com/exposed.html

'James Patrick Holding, the Want-to-Be Apologist'
http://www.infidels.org/library/magazines/tsr/2002/4/024jph.html

JP Holding Exposed
http://the-anointed-one.com/search2.htm

'Dishonesty by Robert Turkel (J.P. Holding)'
http://www.discord.org/~lippard/turkeldishonesty.html

A Reply to J. P. Holding
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/g_a_wells/holding.html

"Writing James P Holding Off!"
http://debunkingchristianity.blogspot.com/2006/06/writing-james-p-holding-off.html

"Prove Jesus Existed, Please!"
http://www.truthbeknown.com/holding.htm

James Patrick Holding: Another Apostate With Selective Education
http://www.darrellwconder.com/debate1.html

Do a google for JP Holding and his alt. "Sheila Rangslinger" -

"DISCLOSURE FROM ADMIN: "Sheila Rangslinger" was discovered to be a sock puppet identity created by J.P. Holding. Any statements about J.P. Holding in this post were written by J.P. Holding himself."

That post in the Icke "Latest News Headines" is clearly a critical error. It is diametrically opposed to the work of David Icke and other sources he cites throughout his work. It needs to be removed IMMEDIATELY.

Meanwhile, maybe the webmaster would be better off posting this instead - much more appropriate for the David Icke readers such as myself.

"The Companion Guide to ZEITGEIST Part 1" E-Book
http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/zeitgeist.html

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d125/solarsky22/ZGcover.jpg

[ownedtbh]

the thing that gets me is....if there's no such thing as gods/higher powers and all that kind of stuff why do the world elites worship things like this in the grove and all the symbols they use ect?? :confused: :confused:

[dave31]

drakul in his accusations against Acharya of being a Freemason and in the Illuminati (LOL - ROTFLMAO) because she quotes some of them in her book "Christ Conspiracy" is purely a demonstration of your very selective perception. Icke writes about them too and Icke cites Acharya yet, nowhere does he ever accuse her of being a Freemason or anything else, probably because he knows her and he knows better.

drakul has never seen the back cover to "Christ Conspiracy" where it explains how the secret societies, mystery schools played a role in the creation of Christianity. Quotes from them admitting the truth about this is far from being one of them.

"Christ Conspiracy" back cover excerpt

"... Acharya marshals an enormous amount of startling evidence to demonstrate that Christianity and the story of Jesus Christ were created by members of various secret societies, mystery schools and religions in order to unify the Roman empire under one state religion. In making such a fabrication, this multinational cabal drew upon a multitude of myths and rituals that already existed long before the Christian era, and reworked them for centuries into the story and religion passed down today"

In WWJ - Acharya quotes mostly from Christians - are you now going to claim that she's a Christian?

Who Was Jesus? Fingerprints of The Christ contains quotes from the following Christian authorities, apologists and evangelicals, as well as New Testament scholars:

* John Ankerberg
* Craig L. Blomberg
* F.F. Bruce
* William Lane Craig
* John Dominic Crossan
* Bart Ehrman
* Norman Geisler
* Gary Habermas
* Josh McDowell
* John P. Meier
* Bruce M. Metzger
* J.P. Moreland
* Ronald H. Nash
* Lee Strobel
* Merrill C. Tenney
* Ben Witherington
* Edwin Yamauchi
* And more!

http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/wwjpaperback.html

Amazon - ********************/2fa8aw

Borders - ********************/32w9la

Barnes & Noble - ********************/2lyuym

http://forums.truthbeknown.com/viewtopic.php?t=1563

[celtic isis]

the thing that gets me is....if there's no such thing as gods/higher powers and all that kind of stuff why do the world elites worship things like this in the grove and all the symbols they use ect?? :confused: :confused:

they do exist just not in the way they're told to the masses...you know i used to think it was all BS until i came to france and had a whole world of esotericism opened up to me. :eek:

the world's elite, secret societies, religious hierarchies, politicians grovers etc know what it's all about and know what they're worshipping.

ah it's so darn complicated...

[celtic isis]

Actually, this is laughable. Have you gone to this forum? It is a joke, Alex Jones - another Christian, refuses to investigate the claims behind Christianity. He's just a believer, *NOT* a thinker. The so-called "50 factual errors" isn't accurate. What they really mean is that they couldn't find it in wikipedia and other encyclopedia entries so they therefore claim - "factual error" when in reality they are just ignorant on the facts.

The original poster of that thread claims that there are "50 factual errors" in Zeitgeist while toward the bottom, this person also claims

The link takes you to the Alex Jones (another Christian) "infowars" forum which was posted on "Jul 08, 2007" - how is that late breaking headline news? Plus, that forum only had 688 members when posted on Icke's website it at the time I looked at it.

Thing is, much of David Ickes work is in Zeitgeist too so the webmaster probably never checked into this and has obviously made a critical error in posting it like this. It should be removed.

Now, the best sources they can come up with there are old JP Holding crap. JP Holding has absolutely no biblical credentials whatsoever.

Here are just a few links about the dishonesty of JP Holding (another Christian) exposing why he & his entourage cannot be trusted & why anyone claiming to hold any credibility while using him as a source can't be trusted either. Anyone who uses JP Holding as a source or reference for anything deserves absolutely no credibility whatsoever & should be humiliated & embarrassed for it.

JP Holding has no qualifications whatsoever in any Biblical field, knows no Biblical languages, and has no relevant training, yet has the temerity to presume that his OPINION is enough, and that his personal FAITH is all that he needs, to offer a vicious and vitriolic critique of credible credentialed scholars who are trained in this area of expertise. JP Holding has no training in comparative religion. No training in mythology. No training in archaeoastronomy. No training in astrotheology. Nothing relevant.

So, don't take my word for it...see it for yourself.

TEKTONICS.ORG: EXPOSED!
http://the-anointed-one.com/exposed.html

'James Patrick Holding, the Want-to-Be Apologist'
http://www.infidels.org/library/magazines/tsr/2002/4/024jph.html

JP Holding Exposed
http://the-anointed-one.com/search2.htm

'Dishonesty by Robert Turkel (J.P. Holding)'
http://www.discord.org/~lippard/turkeldishonesty.html

A Reply to J. P. Holding
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/g_a_wells/holding.html

"Writing James P Holding Off!"
http://debunkingchristianity.blogspot.com/2006/06/writing-james-p-holding-off.html

"Prove Jesus Existed, Please!"
http://www.truthbeknown.com/holding.htm

James Patrick Holding: Another Apostate With Selective Education
http://www.darrellwconder.com/debate1.html

Do a google for JP Holding and his alt. "Sheila Rangslinger" -

"DISCLOSURE FROM ADMIN: "Sheila Rangslinger" was discovered to be a sock puppet identity created by J.P. Holding. Any statements about J.P. Holding in this post were written by J.P. Holding himself."

That post in the Icke "Latest News Headines" is clearly a critical error. It is diametrically opposed to the work of David Icke and other sources he cites throughout his work. It needs to be removed IMMEDIATELY.

Meanwhile, maybe the webmaster would be better off posting this instead - much more appropriate for the David Icke readers such as myself.

"The Companion Guide to ZEITGEIST Part 1" E-Book
http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/zeitgeist.html

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d125/solarsky22/ZGcover.jpg

great post dave :)

Z-Day is a coming and nothing will stop it!

i can't even be bothered battling on here now, Zeitgeist is a brilliant movie, watch it folks, the narrator may word a few things badly but not in a dis info way, this movie is the way it is. It's as simple as that. A full 2 years i've been looking researching trying to fit all the pieces together, and Zeitgeist brings it all together beautifully.

There was nothing new in Zeitgeist on the whole that i hadn't come to know already elsewhere well beforehand.

Just let it be! It's either your thing or it's not. But i wouldn't give thumbs up to it if i wasn't sure it was a safe bet, and suitable for putting it out there as a starting point to awaken others.

[thirdwave]

Actually, this is laughable. Have you gone to this forum? It is a joke, Alex Jones - another Christian, refuses to investigate the claims behind Christianity. He's just a believer, *NOT* a thinker. The so-called "50 factual errors" isn't accurate. What they really mean is that they couldn't find it in wikipedia and other encyclopedia entries so they therefore claim - "factual error" when in reality they are just ignorant on the facts.

The original poster of that thread claims that there are "50 factual errors" in Zeitgeist while toward the bottom, this person also claims

The link takes you to the Alex Jones (another Christian) "infowars" forum which was posted on "Jul 08, 2007" - how is that late breaking headline news? Plus, that forum only had 688 members when posted on Icke's website it at the time I looked at it.

Thing is, much of David Ickes work is in Zeitgeist too so the webmaster probably never checked into this and has obviously made a critical error in posting it like this. It should be removed.

Now, the best sources they can come up with there are old JP Holding crap. JP Holding has absolutely no biblical credentials whatsoever.

Here are just a few links about the dishonesty of JP Holding (another Christian) exposing why he & his entourage cannot be trusted & why anyone claiming to hold any credibility while using him as a source can't be trusted either. Anyone who uses JP Holding as a source or reference for anything deserves absolutely no credibility whatsoever & should be humiliated & embarrassed for it.

JP Holding has no qualifications whatsoever in any Biblical field, knows no Biblical languages, and has no relevant training, yet has the temerity to presume that his OPINION is enough, and that his personal FAITH is all that he needs, to offer a vicious and vitriolic critique of credible credentialed scholars who are trained in this area of expertise. JP Holding has no training in comparative religion. No training in mythology. No training in archaeoastronomy. No training in astrotheology. Nothing relevant.

So, don't take my word for it...see it for yourself.

TEKTONICS.ORG: EXPOSED!
http://the-anointed-one.com/exposed.html

'James Patrick Holding, the Want-to-Be Apologist'
http://www.infidels.org/library/magazines/tsr/2002/4/024jph.html

JP Holding Exposed
http://the-anointed-one.com/search2.htm

'Dishonesty by Robert Turkel (J.P. Holding)'
http://www.discord.org/~lippard/turkeldishonesty.html

A Reply to J. P. Holding
http://www.infidels.org/library/modern/g_a_wells/holding.html

"Writing James P Holding Off!"
http://debunkingchristianity.blogspot.com/2006/06/writing-james-p-holding-off.html

"Prove Jesus Existed, Please!"
http://www.truthbeknown.com/holding.htm

James Patrick Holding: Another Apostate With Selective Education
http://www.darrellwconder.com/debate1.html

Do a google for JP Holding and his alt. "Sheila Rangslinger" -

"DISCLOSURE FROM ADMIN: "Sheila Rangslinger" was discovered to be a sock puppet identity created by J.P. Holding. Any statements about J.P. Holding in this post were written by J.P. Holding himself."

That post in the Icke "Latest News Headines" is clearly a critical error. It is diametrically opposed to the work of David Icke and other sources he cites throughout his work. It needs to be removed IMMEDIATELY.

Meanwhile, maybe the webmaster would be better off posting this instead - much more appropriate for the David Icke readers such as myself.

"The Companion Guide to ZEITGEIST Part 1" E-Book
http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/zeitgeist.html

http://i34.photobucket.com/albums/d125/solarsky22/ZGcover.jpg



To be honest

I was quite surprised to see it up on Davids headline page... mmmmm .. but maybe there are some points we are not aware of... I have put the questions forward...

I wont rule out that some facts might be wrong. but many relevant facts are clearly right and the last person you would ask about a movie exposing Christianity is Alex Jones or Chris White ..... as Christians do not intend on debunking anything to do with Christianity and that has been made perfectly clear for a very long time.

[celtic isis]

To be honest

I was quite surprised to see it up on Davids headline page... mmmmm .. but maybe there are some points we are not aware of... I have put the questions forward...

I wont rule out that some facts might be wrong. but many relevant facts are clearly right and the last person you would ask about a movie exposing Christianity is Alex Jones or Chris White ..... as Christians do not intend on debunking anything to do with Christianity and that has been made perfectly clear for a very long time.

well put thirdwave :)

[yvonne]

All I can say is WOW what a movie...I loved it!

[celtic isis]

All I can say is WOW what a movie...I loved it!

awwwwwwww YAAAAAAAAAAAAY!!!!!!!!!!!


yay yvonne! :D and do you think yourself now that you have seen it that it's all disinfo and such?

you see i wouldn't put something here that was rubbish! i respect you guys, i was amazed that more of the members on here hadn't already seen it.

and your avatar really fits the bill also!

[drakul]

Over and over I have listed some of the GLARING inaccuracies in the religion section of Zeitgeist and SOME of you guys are so tightly shut in your new little mindboxes you wouldn't even bother to check Acharya's sources. Suddenly Zeitgeist gets criticized on Icke's site and you're all SHOCKED SHOCKED.

Where? what who how could that possibly happen - gee our marching formation is all broken up now - where are our orders? Orders please!


* Krishna was not born on Dec 25 of a vigin or crucified
* Buddha was not born on Dec 25. As a child, Buddha's life was not threatened by a king. He did not teach in the temple at the age of 12, nor did he have 12 disciples. Buddha or crucified or ressurected
* Horus was not crucified
* Attis was not crucified
* Mithra was not crucified
etc etc

[dave31]

drakul "Over and over I have listed some of the GLARING inaccuracies in the religion section of Zeitgeist"

Actually, you haven't you just think you have. Rather, you've demonstrated your rigid adherence to your bigoted selective perception and you demand everyone else agree with you to believe what you believe.

* Krishna was not born on Dec 25 of a vigin or crucified
* Buddha was not born on Dec 25. As a child, Buddha's life was not threatened by a king. He did not teach in the temple at the age of 12, nor did he have 12 disciples. Buddha or crucified or ressurected
* Horus was not crucified
* Attis was not crucified
* Mithra was not crucified

What are your credentials to make such a claim? What Seminary training have you had? Do you have a Masters in Divinity? A theology degree? What comparative religion training have you had? What other languages do you read, write and speak? Do you have an archeology degree?

Where are the primary sources for the existence of Jesus?

[grenadene]

I think the film was largely made to get people thinking (there isn't a lot of it about if you hadn't noticed!!)... granted its a bit OTT in places and perhaps some truths were bent to fit, but i think the idea was for it to appeal to a wider audience than just us geeks :p
Its pretty accessible and hopefully it will encourage a bit of further reading?

I've even got my mum to watch it!!:)

[ownedtbh]

they do exist just not in the way they're told to the masses...you know i used to think it was all BS until i came to france and had a whole world of esotericism opened up to me. :eek:

the world's elite, secret societies, religious hierarchies, politicians grovers etc know what it's all about and know what they're worshipping.

ah it's so darn complicated...


i kinda see what you mean.... its got me thinking :)

[thirdwave]

Over and over I have listed some of the GLARING inaccuracies in the religion section of Zeitgeist and SOME of you guys are so tightly shut in your new little mindboxes you wouldn't even bother to check Acharya's sources. Suddenly Zeitgeist gets criticized on Icke's site and you're all SHOCKED SHOCKED.

Where? what who how could that possibly happen - gee our marching formation is all broken up now - where are our orders? Orders please!


* Krishna was not born on Dec 25 of a vigin or crucified
* Buddha was not born on Dec 25. As a child, Buddha's life was not threatened by a king. He did not teach in the temple at the age of 12, nor did he have 12 disciples. Buddha or crucified or ressurected
* Horus was not crucified
* Attis was not crucified
* Mithra was not crucified
etc etc


I think its not a case of not hearing you.... your text is very clear.... but the sources from where you got the text and your promotion of ignorance towards other sources of info is what people do not go in harmony with.

You could also research that we are the results of an evolution process from Monkeys..... but I would still think you would be talking rubbish no matter how many links you posted me.

are you aware the chruch has changed the bible many times?.... are you aware other texts/books have been burnt by the church? .... are you aware that history has been manipulated...

Yes you are...

but you are happy for all lies that has kept certain religions in place to stay un noticed it seems??

No... we know kids are not taught that the facts in this movie are true... we know that the general research is very clear .....

but in order to find truth you must dig deeper.... now regarding this subject... are you happy to do that?

[drakul]

I think its not a case of not hearing you.... your text is very clear.... but the sources from where you got the text and your promotion of ignorance towards other sources of info is what people do not go in harmony with.

You could also research that we are the results of an evolution process from Monkeys..... but I would still think you would be talking rubbish no matter how many links you posted me.

are you aware the chruch has changed the bible many times?.... are you aware other texts/books have been burnt by the church? .... are you aware that history has been manipulated...

Yes you are...

but you are happy for all lies that has kept certain religions in place to stay un noticed it seems??

No... we know kids are not taught that the facts in this movie are true... we know that the general research is very clear .....

but in order to find truth you must dig deeper.... now regarding this subject... are you happy to do that?


GET REAL - Have you bothered to do any simple RESEARCH on line? Have you found the primary sources to prove that the above claims by Acharya are true? That's all. That's all I'm asking where's the fricken BEEF?

[thirdwave]

GET REAL - Have you bothered to do any simple RESEARCH on line? Have you found the primary sources to prove that the above claims by Acharya are true? That's all. That's all I'm asking where's the fricken BEEF?

I have directed you to a book that contains the info.... as are there other links here...

where is the BEEF that Jesus existed?

[drakul]

I have directed you to a book that contains the info.... as are there other links here...

where is the BEEF that Jesus existed?



Sorry - this thread is getting really long. What is the name of the book you reccommended again? I missed that.

As for whether Jesus existed - that's not my point - I am addressing the blatant inaccuracies of Zeitgeist (all said in the name of TRUTH of course).

[thirdwave]

Sorry - this thread is getting really long. What is the name of the book you reccommended again? I missed that.

As for whether Jesus existed - that's not my point - I am addressing the blatant inaccuracies of Zeitgeist (all said in the name of TRUTH of course).




http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/zeitgeist.html

http://www.amazon.com/ANCIENT-EGYPT-.../dp/160206086X

these are the sources the makers direct you towards... and urge you to begin your own research..

My point about Evidence of Jesus existing is to express that often relating to religion anything that confronts it is brushed away as not fact.... lies.... but yet Jesus could also be not Fact and lies and has no more solid evidence than those who have alternative theories....infact the whole bible does not... yet you can look it all up on Wiki and it will confirm much for you!

why does it get the head start?

We know that there is lots that is hard to prove about many things related to the government and religion.... because they have always been hidden and covered up.... our education has been hugely manipulated.

So it is quite easy to see that something as powerful as this movie can not be easily proven to be %100 correct by sifting through google.... deeper research has to be done in order to discover more truth, more info is required... Im not say the makers of this film have everything spot on... I dont know, but they are hitting a very valid point that can be backed up with research......

this is where many of the views in the movie comes from... alternative and deeper research.. NOT relying on the "official" info which is promoted.

Andy Jones would not debunk Christianity even if it was there to be debunked.. he would just think it was Satan's poison.... and I think Chris White is about as reliable an under water umbrella... as all his "facts" are very much stuck t a view point that relys on official info from the people he claims to want to also expose along with the NWO ....which is pretty odd.

[thirdwave]

David Icke is in Jepan at the moment and did not post up the link on his headlines page... it seems to have been a mistake or crossfires and has been removed....

[bigus_dickus]

listen to these

http://youtube.com/watch?v=b5yIwjStqR8
http://youtube.com/watch?v=keZdNgXf5yU
http://youtube.com/watch?v=t8omG3FrxQ4

[kasalt]

David Icke is in Jepan at the moment and did not post up the link on his headlines page... it seems to have been a mistake or crossfires and has been removed....

It has been replaced with this one:

Saturday, 09 February 2008
Zeitgeist disproven by factual errors:

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

[grenadene]

Oh yes a thorough debunking???:confused:

And utterly disproved... i must have missed that bit??

The guy on the video looked a bit too crazy for me.... the sort you'd see in the park burning books!!

Beware they will take your faith!!! Aarrgghhhh!!!! We'll all go to Hell!!!!

Its enough to send you back to bed ...:eek:

[sensimillia]

dont know if anyone posted this, but there´s a remastered edition out now. with some corrected misstakes...

http://conspiracycentral.net:6969/stats.html?info_hash=214680f3e3d551003ed9e0c35f65f 8bb3fe67161

:)

[kasalt]

http://zeitgeistmovie.com/clarifications.htm

Corrections / Clarifications

[ Regarding the "Official Release" on Google Video ]


15:25-15:27
The December 25th birthday denoted to Jesus Christ, as stated by the narration, is not written in the Bible, although it is practiced traditionally. However, this date, known in the Pagan world for the birth of the 'Sun God' at the Winter Solstice, is in fact implied by the astronomical symbolism during the birth sequence.
More on this point is addressed in the Interactive Transcript.

53:56-53:59
The text reads:
["Collapse Characteristics of World T. Center 1, 2 & 7 fit the Controlled Demolition Model Exactly"]
-WTC 7 fits the C.D. model exactly, however Towers 1 and 2 were, in fact, EXPLOSIONS rather than implosions. The means of the demolition of Towers 1 and 2 would be considered "unconventional". The free fall speed; collapse "into its own footprint" and other such goals of controlled demolition, are however confluent.


1:04:09 -1:04:16
The video here is of the Madrid Bombings of 2004, not the London Bombings of 2005.
It is used as a creative expression and example.

1:09:22- 1:11:05
These extracts from the JFK speech entitled "The President and the Press" from April 27, 1961,
are used as a dramatized introduction to Part 3, and are not exactly in context with the original intent
of JFK's speech. Though President Kennedy does indeed address the peril of secrecy, denouncing
"secret societies", "secret oaths" and "secret proceedings" in his statements, the latter section is
related to his views on Communism and not these societies.

1:17:14-1:17:20:
The narration states regarding W.Wilson and the Federal Reserve Act:
"Years Later Woodrow Wilson wrote in regret..."
- The notion of "years later" is incorrect. The quote is taken from his book
"The New Freedom" and it was written the same year he signed the Federal Reserve Act.

1:23:35 -1:23:38
There are 2 errors stated in the narration, one computational, the other technical.
1) It should say: (correction in italics) "Roughly 25% of the average worker's income is taken via this tax"
[According the Bureau of Labor Statistics, the average US salary is about $36,000
which translates to a 25% Federal Income Tax. * 35% is the high tax bracket ]
2) This 25% is not a flat tax against the entire income of that single person for the year.
Rather, the tax is "graduated". In other words, it is a generalization to say "25% is taxed", where as there are 2 tax rate brackets under this one, and income is taxed based on each bracket combined, in a graduated manner. Consequently, the statement "you work 3 months out of the year..." is not accurate as it would be less than that in light of the "graduated" nature.

1:27.35-1:27:40:
There is a statement error in the narration. It should say: (correction in italics)
-"J.D. Rockefeller made 200 million dollars off of it [WWI]. That's about 1.9 Billion by today's standards"
[It was stated as "1.9 Trillion", which was misspoken and intended to have been read "Billion", not "Trillion".
Note: Based on the Consumer Price Index (not the GDP used initially), this conversion can also be figured
at about 3 Billion dollars]

[madthumbs]

Wow, some religious nutters think this video is an actual attack on their faith. This is very much to the contrary. Intentional miss-info about religion is constantly circulated so the religious nuts can point and say "see, we're right!", as well as just go around in circles and miss the real challenges to their faith.

Here's some nonsense attacks on the New King James version of the Bible I debunked (http://www.opposingdigits.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=4476) as an example.

Basically they quoted verses that didn't even exist, complained about them changing words to be more accurate, and changing names to have consistent spelling from the OT to the NT. -Should someone reading it have to discern for themselves that Noeh is Noah?

A good start to debunking the Bible:
The False Apostle, which the Bible itself testifies against (http://www.opposingdigits.com/FalseApostle/).

This false apostle who didn't even see Jesus in human form by his own admission is credited with writing most of the NT. IOW's: the Bible shows itself to be fallible. A good question to ask Christians is "who replaced Judas as the 12th Apostle?"

Acts 1:26
26 And they gave forth their lots; and the lot fell upon Matthias; and he was numbered with the eleven apostles.

[dave31]

"Headline News:
Zeitgeist disproven by factual errors" 09 February 2008

It has just been removed as well

It linked to a youtube video viewed 693 times created by another Christian website?

This again? Seriously? What in the world are these guys thinking? Why are they posting false information that is against the interests of David Icke's work in the first place?

It would appear that the webmaster for David Icke has a problem with Zeitgeist part 1 or the work of Acharya or the entire movie Zeigeist. Icke's work supports all 3 parts so this makes no sense whatsoever. I'd say it was time for Icke to find himself a NEW WEBMASTER

That video is, once again laughable, and an embarrassment for whoever that Nickolas guy is in it and the organization he represents. Who is this guy and what exactly are his credentials for making such claims? Does he have any seminary training? Does he have a Masters in Divinity? Does he have a degree in comparative religion or mythology? Is he an Egyptologist? An archaeologist? A historian or ancient text expert? No, he is none of these things. He's just another Christian believer. He has *NOT* debunked anything only highlighted his ignorance on the issues.

People can run around claiming "factual errors" all they want but that doesn't make it so. If the Icke webmasters can post Christian propaganda crap like that in the "Latest Headline News" they can also post a scholarly work substantiating Zeitgeist part 1:

Here's what someone with real credentials says about Acharya's companion guide:

"The Companion Guide to Zeitgeist, Part 1, by Acharya S is an absolute must for anyone who wishes to fully understand the significance of the movie."

"Well-referenced, with numerous quotations from renowned Egyptologists and classical scholars, Acharya's penetrating research clearly lays out the very ancient pre-Christian basis of modern Christianity. Those who espouse Christianity beware! After digesting the evidence, you will never again view your religion in the same light."

Robert M. Schoch, Ph.D.
Professor of Natural Science
College of General Studies at Boston University
Author, Pyramid Quest, Voyages of the Pyramid Builders and Voices of the Rocks

"The Companion Guide to ZEITGEIST Part 1" E-Book
http://www.stellarhousepublishing.com/zeitgeist.html

[drakul]

David Icke is in Jepan at the moment and did not post up the link on his headlines page... it seems to have been a mistake or crossfires and has been removed....

Oh thank you GOD. (It was so-oooo embarassing and confusing to have Zeitgeist dennounced as a `PROPAGANDA FILM' on David's site of all places!)

The reference `books' you linked to - one was simply a compendium to Zeitgeist written by Acharya so Acharya is basically using HERSELF as a reference source - works well.

The 2nd book by Gerald Massey - Ancient Egypt: The Light of the World - Massey was only a self-taught Egyptologist. Not exactly an impeccable source. More important, Massey was CHIEF DRUID of the Druidic Order in UK. Massey was in NO WAY an objective scholar. As you know the FREE MASONS claim Masonry is the successor to Druidism (AND the Templars), which is why so many Druids (and sorcerers like Aleister Crowley) were also Freemasons.

[drakul]

Actually, you haven't you just think you have. Rather, you've demonstrated your rigid adherence to your bigoted selective perception and you demand everyone else agree with you to believe what you believe.

What are your credentials to make such a claim? What Seminary training have you had? Do you have a Masters in Divinity? A theology degree? What comparative religion training have you had? What other languages do you read, write and speak? Do you have an archeology degree?

Where are the primary sources for the existence of Jesus?

Kind of ironic you should be asking about my `credentials' for daring to question Acharya's ludicrous OPINIONS which she presents as `fact'. Particularly since Acharya hereself doesn't even have a graduate degree in ANYTHING and that according to her autobiography. Not only that Acharya does double backflips in her auto to prove her case that she doesn't NEED any graduate degrees to prove her point.

Remember it's Acharya, not I, who is making all these ridiculous claims about Buddha Krishna, etc having the same `mythical' life story as Jesus. And to make these ludicrous claims like `Krishna was born of a virgin', when in fact a simple google check will verify that Krishna was the 8th child' of his married parents, is just nothing short of laughable. Written Strictly for the `sheople' who are very happy in their new mindboxes, having so recently been released from being classified as straight `sheeple'. (The `o' now substituted for `e' denotes they are ONE DEGREE higher in the Great Pyramid of Unknowing).

[dave31]

So we've established that drakul has no credentials to speak of.

Also drakul knows absolutely NOTHING about Gerald Massey either. From the Zeigeist companion guide:

"Gerald Massey utilized the work of the best minds of the time, including that of Champollion, as well as that of Dr. Budge; Sir Renouf; famed Egyptologist Sir William Flinders Petrie; noted Egyptologist Sir John Gardner Wilkinson, the "Father of British Egyptology"; Egyptologist and professor at the University of Berlin, Dr. Heinrich Brugsch; French Egyptologist and curator of the Egyptian section at the Louvre, le vicomte de Rougé; and expert on Egyptian mummies, Dr. Thomas Joseph Pettigrew, among many other scholars in a wide variety of fields. For example, Massey also utilized the work of Sir J. Norman Lockyer, the famous royal English astronomer who was friends with Budge and knew Egypt well, and of Dr. Charles Piazzi Smyth, royal Scottish astronomer and professor of Astronomy at the University of Edinburgh. Massey further studied the work of Reverend Archibald Sayce, professor of Comparative Philology at Oxford, as well as that of famous mythologist Sir James Frazer, although he did not agree with their conclusions. He likewise cited the work of Francois Lenormant, professor of Archaeology at the National Library of France, as well as that of noted philologist and comparative theologian Oxford professor Dr. Max Müller. Massey was very influenced by the work of Dr. Samuel Birch (1813-1885), famous archaeologist, Egyptologist and Keeper of the Department of Oriental Antiquities in the British Museum. Dr. Birch also was the founder of the very prestigious and influential Society of Biblical Archaeology, to which belonged many other notables in the fields of archaeology, Assyriology, Egyptology, etc. Much of this eye-opening work on comparative religion, in fact, emanated from this august body of erudite and credentialed individuals. Birch held many other titles and honors, including from Cambridge and Oxford Universities. His numerous works on Egypt are cited to this day in scholarly publications."

As one can easily see, Gerald Massey was peer reviewed to a much higher degree than most. Massey relied upon the works of top experts in their field.

[thirdwave]

Massey was only a self-taught Egyptologist. Not exactly an impeccable source.

lol! .. Yes, that's why its worth reading.... of course you would be more happy if he was taught by the system. Because then he would be up holding the truth they want in place...


More important, Massey was CHIEF DRUID of the Druidic Order in UK. Massey was in NO WAY an objective scholar.
the bible was objective????


As you know the FREE MASONS claim Masonry is the successor to Druidism (AND the Templars), which is why so many Druids (and sorcerers like Aleister Crowley) were also Freemasons.

completely irelivent .. you are just trying to discredit the source.... the Freemasons stake claim to alot of things.... and for some reason in this case you choose to trust them.

[thirdwave]

I remember a while back someone said something along the lines of... "I bet you if Icke said this was disinfo then you would all be saying it was disinfo".... it was about a film or something..

But its interesting how that has been proven not to be the case here and in fact people have helped David to point out an error on his website.

just thought that was worth pointing out...

[drakul]

completely irelivent .. you are just trying to discredit the source.... the Freemasons stake claim to alot of things.... and for some reason in this case you choose to trust them.

I am `trying to discredit the source' - Isn't that the POINT?

Funny how the Freemasons just LOVE those Druidic sorceror WITCHES:

Leading Freemasons who were also Druidic Sorceror/Witches:

•Gerald B. Gardner—founder of the modern Wiccan (white Witchcraft) revival. Gardner lifted most of the Wicca rituals straight from Crowley's writings.

•Aleister Crowley—master Satanist of this century.

•L. MacGregor Mathers—co-founder of OTO - Order of the Golden Dawn.

•Dr. Theodore Reuss—head of the O.T.O., a German occult/satanic society which made Crowley its head for the British Isles.

•George Pickingill—the Grand Master Witch of 19th century England, leader of the "Pickingill covens."

•Alex Sanders—self-styled "King of the Witches" in London and one of the most influential leaders of Wicca after Gardner.

[thirdwave]

I am `trying to discredit the source' - Isn't that the POINT?

Funny how the Freemasons just LOVE those Druidic sorceror WITCHES:

Leading Freemasons who were also Druidic Sorceror/Witches:

•Gerald B. Gardner—founder of the modern Wiccan (white Witchcraft) revival. Gardner lifted most of the Wicca rituals straight from Crowley's writings.

•Aleister Crowley—master Satanist of this century.

•L. MacGregor Mathers—co-founder of OTO - Order of the Golden Dawn.

•Dr. Theodore Reuss—head of the O.T.O., a German occult/satanic society which made Crowley its head for the British Isles.

•George Pickingill—the Grand Master Witch of 19th century England, leader of the "Pickingill covens."

•Alex Sanders—self-styled "King of the Witches" in London and one of the most influential leaders of Wicca after Gardner.

but all this shows you are ignorant about that subject as you simply come from a Christian view point which un educates people on these matters.... Just how the F masons want you!

anything that is associated with what you would call Witchcraft or the occult is evil and not to be trusted... and that is all based on no info other than what Christianity wants you to believe.... even though your saviour used "Witchcraft" him self.... also if anyone does anything bad with the occult then its evil.... no!, wrong!. Look how much evil has been done by Christians ... does that mean you are evil?

same old thing.. anything outside of the Christian box is satan!

No its not.

this person has done his own research and all you have convinced me of is that its highly likely he is on the ball as he appears to be very broad in his knowledge, and not limited.

[drakul]

but all this shows you are ignorant about that subject as you simply come from a Christian view point which un educates people on these matters.... Just how the F masons want you!

anything that is associated with what you would call Witchcraft or the occult is evil and not to be trusted... and that is all based on no info other than what Christianity wants you to believe.... even though your saviour used "Witchcraft" him self.... also if anyone does anything bad with the occult then its evil.... no!, wrong!. Look how much evil has been done by Christians ... does that mean you are evil?

same old thing.. anything outside of the Christian box is satan!

No its not.

this person has done his own research and all you have convinced me of is that its highly likely he is on the ball as he appears to be very broad in his knowledge, and not limited.


What has Icke been saying for 10 years? The power source for Illuminati is worldwide FREEMASONRY.

So I am merely pointing out that there is a clear INTERLOCK betw DRUIDIC SORCERORS AND FREEMASONS. So does that tell you anything?

[thirdwave]

What has Icke been saying for 10 years? The power source for Illuminati is worldwide FREEMASONRY.

So I am merely pointing out that there is a clear INTERLOCK betw DRUIDIC SORCERORS AND FREEMASONS. So does that tell you anything?


there is also a Interlok between DRUIDIC SORCERERS AND CHRISTIANITY.

I think before you get into who is interlocked with who.. you need to get a full understanding on what and who the Druids were!

THEN, do the assessing.

[drakul]

there is also a Interlok between DRUIDIC SORCERERS AND CHRISTIANITY.

I think before you get into who is interlocked with who.. you need to get a full understanding on what and who the Druids were!

THEN, do the assessing.


OK Educate me. I'm listening. Give me a list of leading Druids and or witches who are also Christians.

[thirdwave]

OK Educate me. I'm listening. Give me a list of leading Druids and or witches who are also Christians.

President Bush.

[thirdwave]

I did not notice this... a more detailed listing of the movie sources...

http://zeitgeistmovie.com/sources.htm

[montag]

President Bush.
George Bush is not a Christian..

[thirdwave]

George Bush is not a Christian..


Yes he is. What KIND of "Christian" is up for debate...

but that's my point.

[montag]

Yes he is. What KIND of "Christian" is up for debate...

but that's my point.
His Christianity is a front, he was 'born again' in to Skull and bones which is incompatible with any form of Christianity.

[thirdwave]

His Christianity is a front, he was 'born again' in to Skull and bones which is incompatible with any form of Christianity.

He would claim he used to be in S&B and is now Christian... but thats not the point..

My point is .. you cant judge something because of a certain group.

Just the same as you cant view anything Druid in a negative light just because some negative people have been inspired by them...

[montag]

He would claim he used to be in S&B and is now Christian... but thats not the point..
That is the point I was making which is that George Bush's claimed Christianity is a lie, he is a bonesman who lies, cheats, steals and kills.

My point is .. you cant judge something because of a certain group.

Just the same as you cant view anything Druid in a negative light just because some negative people have been inspired by them...
You've lost me there, maybe you ought to take that up with the previous poster who made that claim..

[thirdwave]

That is the point I was making which is that George Bush's claimed Christianity is a lie, he is a bonesman who lies, cheats, steals and kills.


It does not matter if he is lieing.... the Fact is he is "officially" a Christian... and known as someone who is also involved in the occult... means he was a valid answer... the facts you have raised are exactly the point! and why I brought his name up..

I agree that the two dont go hand in hand, but I think Christianity is not what it is deemed to be anyway.....

point being that drakul is happy to listen to the official Facts with things that promote Christianity despite clear indications that there are smoke and mirrors everywhere...

If I was to have given a normal answer to drakul I would have said his question was like asking ..how many Muslims do you know who are Christians.... or if he wants to talk about years and years back then Jesus could have been an answer.


You've lost me there, maybe you ought to take that up with the previous poster who made that claim..

that's exactly what I was doing :)

[bigus_dickus]

It does not matter if he is lieing.... the Fact is he is "officially" a Christian...

oh! great! hahaha

let's see, what else can bushie boy be. oh yeah, i got an idea! let's ask him!

butofcourse.. how silly i am. all we have to do is go ask these people what they really are and then believe them. wow dude, life is just so so wonderful.

[thirdwave]

oh! great! hahaha

let's see, what else can bushie boy be. oh yeah, i got an idea! let's ask him!

butofcourse.. how silly i am. all we have to do is go ask these people what they really are and then believe them. wow dude, life is just so so wonderful.

Of course he is not a genuine Christian... he knows that religion is all man made to suit an agenda he is involved in!

[dave31]

ZEITGEIST DAY MARCH 15TH 2008

- EVENT LIST -

- Up to date as of Feb 7th -

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/zdayevents.htm

Are there any event holders here? What's going on with your event? Fill us in...

[bigus_dickus]

Of course he is not a genuine Christian... he knows that religion is all man made to suit an agenda he is involved in!

you mean he really knows that eh.. he is so wise.

[montag]

Of course he is not a genuine Christian...
Ding!

It took you a while TW, but you finally got there..:D

[thirdwave]

ZEITGEIST DAY MARCH 15TH 2008

- EVENT LIST -

- Up to date as of Feb 7th -

http://www.zeitgeistmovie.com/zdayevents.htm

Are there any event holders here? What's going on with your event? Fill us in...



blimey that's a big list there! ....

[thirdwave]

you mean he really knows that eh.. he is so wise.

would not say wise is the word.... knowledgeable would be better...

[thirdwave]

Ding!

It took you a while TW, but you finally got there..:D


Mmmm not so sure... im feeling a bit lost now! :eek:

[bigus_dickus]

would not say wise is the world.... knowledgeable would be better...

EVERY administration / government ever existed in ALL religious denominations has claimed to have God by their side supporting them. all the wars ever happened, happened with the people believing that God sides with them and against the "others" who were rendered "evil".

but, was God ever on their side or one side alone? but of course they would say that and you know why. when you have war, you don't get information, all you get is propaganda. of course Bush and whoever else becomes a leader is going to claim to be favored by God, he would have no other choice. politicians are not made to be honest, or else they wouldn't be politicians.

on a side note, they claim (americans) that they have democracy. any version of democracy is not democracy. it's just a cover up name, it could be "democratic-like business administration". same goes for their "christianity".

[bigus_dickus]

God Bless America (fuck the rest)

[drakul]

George Bush is not a Christian..


1. That's a LIST??? It's only got one illuminati/Christian? on it. I gave you at least 6 famous Druidic witches who were also Freemasons.

2. The closest Bush ever got to Christianity was during the Prez debates in 2000 when they asked - Who do you admire the most in History? Bush said `Jesus Christ'. And that's the last we ever heard about it. Bush NEVER attends church or has spoken of God or Jesus ever since. It was PURELY just 2 words spoken as a right wing election ploy to get the Christians to vote for him and campaign for him.

Bush does admit however that he is STILL member of Skull and Bones. When asked about it he famously said - `It's so secret I can't talk about it'. (Kinda like those Freemason oaths you take never to reveal their secrets or your tongue gets torn out while they are cutting your throat and disembowling you at the same time).

[drakul]

OOPS - sorry Montag - that was supposed to go to Third Wave.

[thirdwave]

1. That's a LIST??? It's only got one illuminati/Christian? on it. I gave you at least 6 famous Druidic witches who were also Freemasons.

No your missing the point....

Your question was like asking how many Muslims do you know who are Christians.... No one who is into the "occult" will call them selves a Christian...
and I felt my answer covered that... and it was not just one name as such... it kind of covered quite a few people.... allthough I could give you another answer... how about JESUS!.

The fact is , if you think you can class people as evil who have links or inspiration from druids, then the same can be done for people like the Bush family who also share the same name as people like your self... or the church who are also Christians and over the years have done hideous things to people...

there are good "Christians" and bad ones right??..right ones and wrong ones?


Bush does admit however that he is STILL member of Skull and Bones. When asked about it he famously said - `It's so secret I can't talk about it'. (Kinda like those Freemason oaths you take never to reveal their secrets or your tongue gets torn out while they are cutting your throat and disembowling you at the same time).

I don't think the scull and bones are even going now and he would have climbed up way past them by now.... I got the impression they were like an introduction into the illuminati...

You cant get away from the fact that you like to ignore all the negative aspects of Christianity that has appeared throughout History...

But you will label others under the same "evil" bracket because evil people have taken knowledge from them.... knowledge is not evil.... knowledge is power... people are evil.

the system that the Bush family have so much power in is the same system thay up holds the beliefs of Christianity and make it all "official" so you can go to wiki and look it up... which is why they can pretend to be "Christians" so easily! ..they may not be as genuine as people like your self, but you can bet they know allot more about it than you.... ever wonder why Bush is always smirking?

[drakul]

No your missing the point....

Your question was like asking how many Muslims do you know who are Christians.... No one who is into the "occult" will call them selves a Christian...


Exactly because they CANNOT - the occult is anti-christian to the core. At its heart the occult worships the old gods of blood sacrifice - which Christianity banned.

So where's the LIST of leading Christian Druidic witches you promised? Remember the Druids PROUDLY claim membership as FREEMASONS there is absolutely no conflict in belonging to both. They don't have to HIDE.

[thirdwave]

Exactly because they CANNOT - the occult is anti-christian to the core.
No, The occult (hidden knowledge) is not anti Christian... Christianity is simply not relevant to it... it has been known for some people who practice the occult use the knowledge for negative purpose and some of them do not like the concept of Christianity... but that does not mean that the hidden knowledge is evil..or anti Christian.... Its simply not the case.

At its heart the occult worships the old gods of blood sacrifice - which Christianity banned.

lol, They banned it? ... you ever heard of "Problem reaction solution?" ..the people who killed the "evil occultists" where the evil occultists!... and they are still doing it today! only now its not "witches" or "satan" they are attacking its "terrorists"

So where's the LIST of leading Christian Druidic witches you promised?

well its an unanswerable question... if you are a Druid or a Witch then you are not a Christian are you?? .. its like asking me to give you a list of leading Muslims who are Christian.... can you give me the info you have that proves all people who practice in the occult are evil?

My point about Bush family is they are "Christian" and into the "occult"... you say "but they do not represent genuine Christians" .. but in the same breath say they represent all occultists .... why?

tell me about the history of Christianity....


Remember the Druids PROUDLY claim membership as FREEMASONS there is absolutely no conflict in belonging to both. They don't have to HIDE. No, not all Druids do that. and Druids do not stake claim to Magick either.... its not a religion... its a knowledge....

and its shocking people don't see this.... its been pushed under our noses for YEARS.... look at Films like Star Wars.. Lord or the rings.... Superman.... so on... how it all works.... there is Magick, and there is good and these is evil....Evil want as much control of it as possible and Good use it to stop them....

Very simple.... Christianity has only been around for a speck of the time this stuff has been going on and before 2000 years ago things have been much better and much worse.

And please note, I'm not saying we should all jump in and start getting involved in the occult... if you don't know what you are doing then it is extremely dangerous... like a 3 years old kid going to a fun fair on their own... But to fear it simply effects your growth.

why do you think that "God" gave evil people magick and left the good with sticks and stones??? ...its simply not the case