Zeitgeist The Movie

[drakul]

No, not all Druids do that. and Druids do not stake claim to Magick either.... its not a religion... its a knowledge....



WICCA is a religion.

[thirdwave]

WICCA is a religion.

WICCA might be but Magick is not... this is what Im saying.... Magick is a knowledge, a tool.. a way to interact with the spirit world.... how to line your body to it.....so on.... it has many aspects to it.... meditation is a kind of like Magick... praying (if it works) is Magick.... there are all kinds of people around the world who use Magick.... some people use it to curse people and for negative evil means... others use to to clean people from negative beings... so on... Hell, making love is a ritual.

its simply a case of Obi wan Kanobi VS Darth Vadar.... simple as that. a Jedi or a Syth .... but both use "The Force" ... you could say that Obi wan was an original "Christian".

Please note, I don't believe in "Debunking" Christianity... if people feel they are better people for it then good on them.... but I believe its in their interests to start looking at a bigger picture to what the bible says....

ignoring the powers of Magick wont stop them they are always going on ever second of the day.

the only reason "occultists" though time have been killed is because the people that killed them wanted the knowledge all for them selves so they can do what we are seeing today. the reason there is so much negativity is because most of the people who have the knowledge in accessing this powers are evil.... not enough good people accessing them....

[jose]

"LATEST HEADLINES" Wednesday, 13 February 2008

Zeitgeist statement from David Icke

Zeitgeist

Just one other thing ... while I was away apparently there was a posting about the Zeitgeist documentary being debunked and discredited with regard to its assertions about the true background to Christianity. In response to a number of emails waiting for me on my return I just want to make it clear that I do not agree with that posted story and do not accept that Zeitgeist is incorrect about the origins of Christianity.

However, I do accept that there are many conspiracy researchers who come from a Christian perspective who would love to think it had been debunked. One day they might see that Christianity is part of the conspiracy, not the solution to it.

all the best,

David Icke

[bigus_dickus]

One day they might see that Christianity is part of the conspiracy, not the solution to it.

when there is a universal conspiracy (IF there is a universal conspiracy), then everything is a part of it.

in other words, if there was a conspiracy, why would it leave christianity alone if christianity wasn't a part of it but a solution?

[bigtimeweb]

While I DO believe the church as an institute is corrupt, there is no doubt that the first part of this movie is a direct attack on Christianity, and the story of Jesus.

There are many videos of people pointing out a multitude of fallacious statements in this portion of the movie yet some still cling to it because Icke tells you to...ewww. Drakul is right in saying you have traded mindboxes. Horray, our commander in chief has spoken it must be true! No need to research or listen to anyone who exposes the faulty statements cause Icke says it’s true! How about the multitude of historical theologians that point out the same falsehoods? They aren’t good enough either? It is a fallacy to reason that just because two things exist side by side, one of them must have caused the other...mere coincidence does not prove causal connection. Nor does similarity prove dependence. This is basic logic. But more importantly, the chronology is all wrong. Almost all of the sources of information about the pagan religions influence on early Christianity are dated very late. Historical research sows:

There is little mentioned of Mithra up until 136AD onward, long after the time of Jesus.

Edwin Yamauchi, a historian and author of the 578 page Persia and the Bible says, ‘We don’t know anything about the death of Mithras’.

Not one clear case of any alleged resurrection teaching appears in any pagan text before the late second century A.D., almost one hundred years after the New Testament was written.

Not to mention the slew of errors regarding birthdates, virgins etc…which are still open to debate….and on that fact the Dec 25th thing for Jesus was a conspiracy of the church to overwrite a very popular Pagan celebration, the birth of the Sun, which you are all familiar with. They did indeed want it stopped, maybe this helps your cause maybe not…but again I’ve always believed the institute of church to be corrupt…and again using pure logic, just because the church is corrupt does not lend a dependency to the fact that Jesus never existed. The church being corrupt and Jesus being real can exist in the same algorithm.

But I pose to you - if "Sun Gods" is true then why incorporate even one bit of misinformation?

When receiving information you must ALWAYS consider the source. If falsehoods are found then you have to question intention. The mere fact that the creators of the film have chosen to stay hidden is a blatant flag to me. ..even their domain name is registered under Domains by Proxy. Yet these mysterious hidden being are bleeding the truth to the masses! pfft….

As Drakul has said many times over the majority of the supporting evidence information draws from Freemason / Theosophical / Druidic / Shamanistic / Freethinker writings (although he states that Blavatsky founded Lucis it was indeed a leading disciple of hers named Bailey)...and they all tag onto eachother using eachother as source of truth. Still no ancient writings that are backing up the assertions and those that are fail the chronology test. A lot of the "new age" philosophy is also drawn from many people who channeled spirits to find the truth....but AGAIN I say you must always scrutinize the source. How does one know the intention of that channeled spirit?

It’s frightening to me that this place is like an Icke worshipping altar. What he says is taken as truth. Icke isn’t so clean himself, and Ill post more information on that later. Before you blindly hold someone’s hand and travel down their path of truth, you should scrutinize deeply, and I’m sad that some just take it because it fits their mindbox rather than do this. Perhaps it is not as important. You claim the only ones researching to push it back is Christians….well they have to, because it directly affects them. Perhaps you choose not to because you abandoned the notion years ago and it does not affect you. Who would you expect to be researching it? Gnostics? Atheists? Why would they care to when it fits snuggly into their existing mindbox “as is”?

There is an underlying message in ALL religion and that is of love. Is that such a horrible message? While you all struggle for “enlightment” I assert to you that at the same time you are climbing the ladder of greed for power, while you are leaving LOVE and respect in the dust for a self absorbed ME existence.

In any case, I do not intend to insult or flame. I have spent a lot of time researching the same thing that Drakul asserts…and that is the tie between the many entities that brought the first part of that movie about and the INTENTION behind all of it.

It can be found here, if you care to watch it:
YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

[shodan]

Hi Bigtimeweb and welcome to the fourm. :)

What do you think about the fact that Zeitgeist has got people talking about these things and questioning christianity/religion - people who have never read anything more than the official line on God, 911 or the debt slavery scam? do you think it does a good job of waking people up who have never questioned anything in their lives? do you think the movie should be watched or do you think it should be avoided?

It’s frightening to me that this place is like an Icke worshipping altar. What he says is taken as truth. Icke isn’t so clean himself, and Ill post more information on that later. Before you blindly hold someone’s hand and travel down their path of truth, you should scrutinize deeply, and I’m sad that some just take it because it fits their mindbox rather than do this.

Please take a good look around the forum (and enjoy it!), I think you'll find its nothing like an Icke worshipping alter. There are all walks of life/nationalities/age groups and wildly differing opinions on here.

cheers Shodan.

[drakul]

Hi Bigtimeweb and welcome to the fourm. :)

What do you think about the fact that Zeitgeist has got people talking about these things and questioning christianity/religion - people who have never read anything more than the official line on God, 911 or the debt slavery scam? do you think it does a good job of waking people up who have never questioned anything in their lives? do you think the movie should be watched or do you think it should be avoided?



SHODAN - Regarding the Religion section of Zeitgeist - and only that - Should you LIE and call it TRUTH?

Should you LIE for the SAKE of TRUTH?

Should you LIE to `get people talking?'

Zeitgeist commences with the statement -THE TRUTH SHALL MAKE YOU FREE - and then it immediately begins to LIE - Krishna was NOT born on Dec. 25 of a virgin and was crucified. And there's no way you can prove that using primary references sources. Krishna's birthday is traditionally celebrated on July 21, he was the EIGHTH CHILD of his MARRIED mother Devaki and he was NOT crucified. etc etc etc on and on and on.....so many innacuracies.

Why should people tolerate that? Where's the integrity? Where's the proverbial SACRED GROUND?

[bigtimeweb]

What do you think about the fact that Zeitgeist has got people talking about these things and questioning christianity/religion - people who have never read anything more than the official line on God, 911 or the debt slavery scam? do you think it does a good job of waking people up who have never questioned anything in their lives? do you think the movie should be watched or do you think it should be avoided?

Thank you Shodan

I think its wake up is BRILLIANT. The last segment of it (the conclusion if you will) is the most beautiful piece of art and words put into a film...When its just a black screen with a little flame in the center all the way to the end. Just BEAUTIFUL!

I particularly liked the whole Fed Res stuff, which has got me digging deeper into that crew.

But in the same - one MUST consider source and intention of information presented...ALWAYS! And even more so when there are intentional falsehoods included right off the bat, like Drakul just said.

Edit:
========
And I'll take your word on the diversity here. I found this forum originally looking for more in depth information on this exact subject a month ago and landed in this thread...havent been much further although Im prepared to put my exploring shoes on. :)

[drakul]

Thank you Shodan

I think its wake up is BRILLIANT. The last segment of it (the conclusion if you will) is the most beautiful piece of art and words put into a film...When its just a black screen with a little flame in the center all the way to the end. Just BEAUTIFUL!

I particularly liked the whole Fed Res stuff, which has got me digging deeper into that crew.

But in the same - one MUST consider source and intention of information presented...ALWAYS! And even more so when there are intentional falsehoods included right off the bat, like Drakul just said.



I saw your video on the Religion section of Zeitgeist and it an OUTSTANDING investigative piece. Really shows the HISTORY OF ASTRO-THEOLOGY, right back to MADAME BLAVATSKY, the phoney 19th century Russian mystic. The video format is visually stunning, excellent music. It's well-paced, NOT preachy but a very incisive and informative investigation into the philosophy of the Luciferian Freemasons behind Zeitgeist's `religion' of Astro-theology.

[shodan]

SHODAN - Regarding the Religion section of Zeitgeist - and only that - Should you LIE and call it TRUTH?

Should you LIE for the SAKE of TRUTH?

Should you LIE to `get people talking?'

They are good questions, part of me says no you shouldn't, but in the context of Zeitgeist I don't believe its black and white like that. My view of Zeitgeist is that in such critical times waking people up is more important than putting people off. When I burn copies for random strangers which I do from time to time I say 'Please watch this, and with an open mind, there is a fierce debate going on at the moment, primarily about the first section on religion, and please don't take everything as verbatim, please go and find out your own beliefs and conclusions'

I am also not convinced they intentionally lied, they may have believed 100% in what they had researched, and I have not researched it fully myself yet, thats for the whole of the human race to do together some time in the future.
Will all the facts and resources ever known laid out on the table for all to see and digest.

Zeitgeist commences with the statement -THE TRUTH SHALL MAKE YOU FREE - and then it immediately begins to LIE - Krishna was NOT born on Dec. 25 of a virgin and was crucified. And there's no way you can prove that using primary references sources. Krishna's birthday is traditionally celebrated on July 21, he was the EIGHTH CHILD of his MARRIED mother Devaki and he was NOT crucified. etc etc etc on and on and on.....so many innacuracies.

I can't comment other than nothing is concrete, its all down to resources and whats hidden from us. e.g. God knows what info was lost when the museum in Iraq was left for the pillagers to destroy.

Why should people tolerate that? Where's the integrity? Where's the proverbial SACRED GROUND?

If it makes people think 'my god this can't be true I will have to find out more' then fantastic! they will find their own truth.

If they think 'I totally believe everything I've just seen' then its no different than believing anything else they watch and are spoonfed.

The integrity lies within the viewer imo

[celtic isis]

While I DO believe the church as an institute is corrupt, there is no doubt that the first part of this movie is a direct attack on Christianity, and the story of Jesus.

There are many videos of people pointing out a multitude of fallacious statements in this portion of the movie yet some still cling to it because Icke tells you to...ewww. Drakul is right in saying you have traded mindboxes. Horray, our commander in chief has spoken it must be true! No need to research or listen to anyone who exposes the faulty statements cause Icke says it’s true! How about the multitude of historical theologians that point out the same falsehoods? They aren’t good enough either? It is a fallacy to reason that just because two things exist side by side, one of them must have caused the other...mere coincidence does not prove causal connection. Nor does similarity prove dependence. This is basic logic. But more importantly, the chronology is all wrong. Almost all of the sources of information about the pagan religions influence on early Christianity are dated very late. Historical research sows:

There is little mentioned of Mithra up until 136AD onward, long after the time of Jesus.

Edwin Yamauchi, a historian and author of the 578 page Persia and the Bible says, ‘We don’t know anything about the death of Mithras’.

Not one clear case of any alleged resurrection teaching appears in any pagan text before the late second century A.D., almost one hundred years after the New Testament was written.

Not to mention the slew of errors regarding birthdates, virgins etc…which are still open to debate….and on that fact the Dec 25th thing for Jesus was a conspiracy of the church to overwrite a very popular Pagan celebration, the birth of the Sun, which you are all familiar with. They did indeed want it stopped, maybe this helps your cause maybe not…but again I’ve always believed the institute of church to be corrupt…and again using pure logic, just because the church is corrupt does not lend a dependency to the fact that Jesus never existed. The church being corrupt and Jesus being real can exist in the same algorithm.

But I pose to you - if "Sun Gods" is true then why incorporate even one bit of misinformation?

When receiving information you must ALWAYS consider the source. If falsehoods are found then you have to question intention. The mere fact that the creators of the film have chosen to stay hidden is a blatant flag to me. ..even their domain name is registered under Domains by Proxy. Yet these mysterious hidden being are bleeding the truth to the masses! pfft….

As Drakul has said many times over the majority of the supporting evidence information draws from Freemason / Theosophical / Druidic / Shamanistic / Freethinker writings (although he states that Blavatsky founded Lucis it was indeed a leading disciple of hers named Bailey)...and they all tag onto eachother using eachother as source of truth. Still no ancient writings that are backing up the assertions and those that are fail the chronology test. A lot of the "new age" philosophy is also drawn from many people who channeled spirits to find the truth....but AGAIN I say you must always scrutinize the source. How does one know the intention of that channeled spirit?

It’s frightening to me that this place is like an Icke worshipping altar. What he says is taken as truth. Icke isn’t so clean himself, and Ill post more information on that later. Before you blindly hold someone’s hand and travel down their path of truth, you should scrutinize deeply, and I’m sad that some just take it because it fits their mindbox rather than do this. Perhaps it is not as important. You claim the only ones researching to push it back is Christians….well they have to, because it directly affects them. Perhaps you choose not to because you abandoned the notion years ago and it does not affect you. Who would you expect to be researching it? Gnostics? Atheists? Why would they care to when it fits snuggly into their existing mindbox “as is”?

There is an underlying message in ALL religion and that is of love. Is that such a horrible message? While you all struggle for “enlightment” I assert to you that at the same time you are climbing the ladder of greed for power, while you are leaving LOVE and respect in the dust for a self absorbed ME existence.

In any case, I do not intend to insult or flame. I have spent a lot of time researching the same thing that Drakul asserts…and that is the tie between the many entities that brought the first part of that movie about and the INTENTION behind all of it.

It can be found here, if you care to watch it:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vPXc1QcmYDY

WRONG yet again, i'm so sick of "members" on here attacking us all the while. You people have clearly learnt nothing that is for sure as to who us members on here truly are. You don't even respect us for a start.

I couldn't care less what icke tells us, i don't agree with what he said in his little statement for a start. I doubt icke even wrote it.

how many times have i said, as thirdwave did, we are not attacking christianity, just trying to wake people up to te fact that religon, MANMADE religion is a tool of control and divide. How high has your soul ascended while following your religion huh? Not far from reading your post.

if you're a christian and you're happy clap your hands and get on with it. Good for you, just stop imposing crap here when you don't understand what it is you're saying.

I know we have to be careful when enlightning people to the truth about organised religion and dogma because otherwise they'll all lost their faith, and they'll sink into agnosticism, which is even worse.

Humans are sooooooooooo stupid.

[bigus_dickus]

Humans are sooooooooooo stupid.

compared to who?

[drakul]

Isis just wants to keep her thread going by throwing out some more insults see if she can raise some hackles.

Isis you claim you are not attacking Christianity when you/Zeitgeist deny the existence of Jesus Christ

HOW is denying the existence of Jesus Christ NOT an attack on Christianity?

duh SOME people are `sooooo stoopid'...

[bigtimeweb]

Celtic Isis, quite strange. This thread was indeed created to discuss the movie, no? Pardon me for posting on topic.

Respect is earned Isis. And moaning about not getting it displays greed for power.

Im not sure you are qualified to judge how far my soul is ascended, as your deep lust for confrontation and anger is thwarting yours. Words carry vibrations that affect your state of being. Look inside. As once you realize every finger you point turns 3 at you, you might find that you are not emitting an energy that is worthy of respect.

I still LOVE you, Celtic Isis...in all your irish turned frenchy being. I AM LOVE. Love is the key. I will not be goated into hate mongering. I will still love you if you chose do so, however, but do not expect me to respond in kind. There is no confrontation to be had here. I AM LOVE. I AM ME. Move along. :)

[celtic isis]

Celtic Isis, quite strange. This thread was indeed created to discuss the movie, no? Pardon me for posting on topic.

Respect is earned Isis. And moaning about not getting it displays greed for power.

Im not sure you are qualified to judge how far my soul is ascended, as your deep lust for confrontation and anger is thwarting yours. Words carry vibrations that affect your state of being. Look inside. As once you realize every finger you point turns 3 at you, you might find that you are not emitting an energy that is worthy of respect.

I still **** you, Celtic Isis...in all your irish turned frenchy being. I AM ****. **** is the key. I will not be goated into hate mongering. I will still **** you if you chose do so, however, but do not expect me to respond in kind. There is no confrontation to be had here. I AM ****. I AM ME. Move along. :)


lol you don't even know me dude, i am female and have my off days, i just don't like to be talked at in a condescending i'm sending a bad vibe into the world sort of manner...

cause i don't!

i've only ever done good things, i was on a higer vibe ever since i was a kid without being aware of it i mean. You know i've been sexually abused and had every kind of shit happen to me and i deserve to be respected for the life i have now, and coming through all that i did. It was all that that has made me who i am today.

I may have been a bit pissed off the other day, that doesn't mean i seek confrontation etc in my everyday life, it is quite the opposite.

i'm not perfect lol

and drakul i am never on here! i couldn't give a shit if my thread keeps going or not really i'm amazed it still is and it's all down to you my friend!

:rolleyes:

how can zeitgeist be attacking christianity, it is merely trying to wake people up to religion being false, and it doesn't just focus on christianity, it focuses on religion in general from what i saw anyway.


you have your religion, so be happy ok

[thirdwave]

compared to who?

other animals?..other beings?

[bigtimeweb]

lol you don't even know me dude, i am female and have my off days, i just don't like to be talked at in a condescending i'm sending a bad vibe into the world sort of manner...

cause i don't!

i've only ever done good things, i was on a higer vibe ever since i was a kid without being aware of it i mean. You know i've been sexually abused and had every kind of shit happen to me and i deserve to be respected for the life i have now, and coming through all that i did. It was all that that has made me who i am today.

I may have been a bit pissed off the other day, that doesn't mean i seek confrontation etc in my everyday life, it is quite the opposite.

...

how can zeitgeist be attacking christianity, it is merely trying to wake people up to religion being false, and it doesn't just focus on christianity, it focuses on religion in general from what i saw anyway.


you have your religion, so be happy ok

how odd that someone has turned the word LOVE into **** in my post?? Thirdwave is that you? I see you in here now....and I sense you are the almighty hater of LOVE.

I LOVE YOU ISIS! Mods can censor me all they want Ill still say it! LOVE LOVE LOVE!

Overcoming hardships in life is what ALL of us do. That strength and ability to overscome translates into respect for self to get out of the hole, and does not demand respect from others, although I agree its worthy. Respect from others is usually a result of magetisim of energy. People flock to be near you because they feel good around you. You can not effectively make people feel good around you if you chose to spend your energy telling them how wrong and awful and lower they are than you for not carrying the same belief system. That energy is devoid of LOVE and compassion.

While religion, to you (and to Thirdwave since hes here now), might be the root of evil, I pose that it is the taking up swords, the wanting of the self to feel superior than others by pointing out difference to elevate itself rather than the simple and most delicate universal message of LOVE that exists in ALL religion.

You must know that we are raised to immediately look at others and begin to judge ourselves in comparison. We're older, we're smarter, we're richer, we're more worthy. THIS IS NOT THE CASE! We are all worthy, we are all rich, we all have something to contribute! The soul shows growth when you can release these models unabashadly and permeate LOVE no matter what the situation, no matter what the differences! We are all one, we all believe in love.

One must only look to molecular and quantum biological studies on the effect of conscious thought on DNA to see the power of love. LOVE IS THE KEY!

You say I dont know you, but I lurked here for a long time before I posted. My knowledge of you is limited to your posted words, indeed. We choose our words. Passive or agressive. With a message of love and compassion or otherwise. We all know of the karmic properties in life. What goes around comes around. IF you do not want to be treated in a certain way, then you must not put that same negative energy out to others.

Im not sure how my very well thought out post was condecending to you. There is no 'us' here there is a whole lot of YOUs and MEs. And if you take my words as directed at you when I use words like 'some' then that is in your own heart and not mine. Perhaps subconscoiusly you felt the truth reflect in your own heart and actions and it hurt you. For that I am sorry.

On Zeitgeist & Jesus: There is no other global religion that claims crucifixtion and ressurection as salvation....none. And that is indeed what it is trying to undermine. There is no other member of any other global religion that would feel their belief system directly attacked other that believing Christians. As a result, they are the only ones who feel they need to defend there religion.

And...psst...Isis....Im not a dude!

And thirdwave...PSST...I LOVE you too! I believe in the goodness inside everyone even though they have set it aside in their egotistical quest for glory in knowledge to serve the self. Watch me go edit my other post and put the LOVE back in it!

-------
AH HA! Someone was gracious enough to put the LOVE back in for me! (thank you)

[bigus_dickus]

other animals?..other beings?

did you just say that Celtic Isis might be some kind of "other" animal, or being?

[thirdwave]

did you just say that Celtic Isis might be some kind of "other" animal, or being?

mmmmmm no.

I said Humans my be stupid if compared to other animals or beings...

[bigus_dickus]

mmmmmm no.

I said Humans my be stupid if compared to other animals or beings...

coming from a human, it's not very valid though.

here is the truth: i am a liar. <- makes sense

don't worry i 'm just kidding. :)

[celtic isis]

how odd that someone has turned the word LOVE into **** in my post?? Thirdwave is that you? I see you in here now....and I sense you are the almighty hater of LOVE.

I LOVE YOU ISIS! Mods can censor me all they want Ill still say it! LOVE LOVE LOVE!

Overcoming hardships in life is what ALL of us do. That strength and ability to overscome translates into respect for self to get out of the hole, and does not demand respect from others, although I agree its worthy. Respect from others is usually a result of magetisim of energy. People flock to be near you because they feel good around you. You can not effectively make people feel good around you if you chose to spend your energy telling them how wrong and awful and lower they are than you for not carrying the same belief system. That energy is devoid of LOVE and compassion.

While religion, to you (and to Thirdwave since hes here now), might be the root of evil, I pose that it is the taking up swords, the wanting of the self to feel superior than others by pointing out difference to elevate itself rather than the simple and most delicate universal message of LOVE that exists in ALL religion.

You must know that we are raised to immediately look at others and begin to judge ourselves in comparison. We're older, we're smarter, we're richer, we're more worthy. THIS IS NOT THE CASE! We are all worthy, we are all rich, we all have something to contribute! The soul shows growth when you can release these models unabashadly and permeate LOVE no matter what the situation, no matter what the differences! We are all one, we all believe in love.

One must only look to molecular and quantum biological studies on the effect of conscious thought on DNA to see the power of love. LOVE IS THE KEY!

You say I dont know you, but I lurked here for a long time before I posted. My knowledge of you is limited to your posted words, indeed. We choose our words. Passive or agressive. With a message of love and compassion or otherwise. We all know of the karmic properties in life. What goes around comes around. IF you do not want to be treated in a certain way, then you must not put that same negative energy out to others.

Im not sure how my very well thought out post was condecending to you. There is no 'us' here there is a whole lot of YOUs and MEs. And if you take my words as directed at you when I use words like 'some' then that is in your own heart and not mine. Perhaps subconscoiusly you felt the truth reflect in your own heart and actions and it hurt you. For that I am sorry.

On Zeitgeist & Jesus: There is no other global religion that claims crucifixtion and ressurection as salvation....none. And that is indeed what it is trying to undermine. There is no other member of any other global religion that would feel their belief system directly attacked other that believing Christians. As a result, they are the only ones who feel they need to defend there religion.

And...psst...Isis....Im not a dude!

And thirdwave...PSST...I LOVE you too! I believe in the goodness inside everyone even though they have set it aside in their egotistical quest for glory in knowledge to serve the self. Watch me go edit my other post and put the LOVE back in it!

-------
AH HA! Someone was gracious enough to put the LOVE back in for me! (thank you)

nice post, but how wrong is that quote of yours i bolded up there!

that is just hilarious and explains so much to me!

i won't be wasting anymore time :)

and it has nothing to do with somehow rubbishing religion to glorify ourselves!
I really just can't believe the stuff you guys come up with, i mean really.

Religion is manmade, you were saying i am me, i am free in your other post to me all the time but have you actually read it? The chapter where Icke mimicks all the "different" gods of the "different" religions, old god up there in his big cloud, pitching all the various people's of earth up against eachother to fight in the name of the holy and the dvine, in his name...there is no love in religion, only divide, self loathing, self righteousness, jugdement, WAR, BLOODSHED on a global scale, this is against the will of the church, that is against the will of the church...how can you be into any religion that says it is a sin to be gay and that AIDs was god's way of making them pay for their sins etc etc.

It's a MIND PRISON!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Just thinking of all my celtic ancestors who were slaughtered and labelled as pagans in the name of religious nutters with god on their side.

Once again my mam was a nun, and a true true Christian. Her time on earth was spent caring for people, and making everyone smile, both friends and strangers...the thing was, it was always her spirit that made her this way, not the religion that was created and spoon fed. My mam knew the truth, she had the truth already in her soul though she didn't fully realise it until she left us and passed on.

I have that truth in my soul now and i always had it, i just didn't know it until i found out the real deal about life, about the truths and nature of everything that is. It's not about being new agey, as i am not, it's not about being agnostic, or athiest or what not. It's just about being.

Religion destroys spirituality. That's part of the reason why the world is such a mess beause ok, so the younger generation have been encouraged away from the church and into a life of selfishness and materialism to feed their empty souls, but that isn't because people have turned their backs on the church, it's because people have turned their backs on themselves.

[bigus_dickus]

Religion destroys spirituality.

stupidity (humans are sooooo stupid, remember) and misunderstanding religion (hence devising thousands of versions to suit your needs), destroys spirituality.

for, if "religion destroys spirituality" as you stated, name something that doesn't.