Masons=Magicians?

[fatal]

Hey im just wondering whether the Freemasons are capable of doing magic. When i was a kid i had an encounter with a mason where i noticed his eyes changed colour from grey to blood red, they stayed red for around 2 seconds and then went back to grey. Could he have been trying to intimidate me? And no, it wasnt a trick of the light....

[subhuman]

Hey im just wondering whether the Freemasons are capable of doing magic. When i was a kid i had an encounter with a mason where i noticed his eyes changed colour from grey to blood red, they stayed red for around 2 seconds and then went back to grey. Could he have been trying to intimidate me? And no, it wasnt a trick of the light....

I would have thought anyone is capable of doing magic.

[rhydra]

Magick is the harnessing of energy.

Magic is pulling rabbits out of hats.

[j_cool2010]

Hey im just wondering whether the Freemasons are capable of doing magic. When i was a kid i had an encounter with a mason where i noticed his eyes changed colour from grey to blood red, they stayed red for around 2 seconds and then went back to grey. Could he have been trying to intimidate me? And no, it wasnt a trick of the light....

satan teaches them the magic, since they worship satan

alone and only our lord who created us and the whole univers is worthy of worship. we must worship only our Alimighty Creator the God
so anyone who worships other than the almighty creator wil end up in great torment. so following satan and all his teachings is strictl forbidden by the Almighty God. satan and his followers will burn in hell.:)
so do not be deluded by satan and his teachings because our life in this world is temporary and a test. one who listens to hi conscience can find the truth

need more information about the truth visit http://www.hyahya.org/en.m_book_index.php

good luck God bliss:)

[petrified]

I am a 33rd and a half degree mason, half step from the 34th and final degree. I can assure you that masons do not practice magick, they are just a friendly fraternity of good people trying to help others.

[phildee3]

Masonry is based on magic, although most members have nothing to do with it - only the mystics (degree level is no indication of whether one is a mystic or not).
There is confusion about what magic is though.
Jesus was a magician, imo. As a baby he was adored by three magicians who recognised him as the master-magician. So-called miracles = magic.

[petrified]

It is true, because there is no 33rd 1/2 degree. At least as far as you know.

[marpat]

satan teaches them the magic, since they worship satan

alone and only our lord who created us and the whole univers is worthy of worship. we must worship only our Alimighty Creator the God
so anyone who worships other than the almighty creator wil end up in great torment. so following satan and all his teachings is strictl forbidden by the Almighty God. satan and his followers will burn in hell.:)
so do not be deluded by satan and his teachings because our life in this world is temporary and a test. one who listens to hi conscience can find the truth

need more information about the truth visit http://www.hyahya.org/en.m_book_index.php

good luck God bliss:)

Prove they worship satan. Actually satan sits with the sons of god and the book of Job reveals this

[rhydra]

Prove they worship satan. Actually satan sits with the sons of god and the book of Job reveals this

Satan is God and God is Satan, it is the same thing. It isn't a conscious entity but an energy which can be used for whatever purpose.

[boots]

I am a 33rd and a half degree mason, half step from the 34th and final degree. I can assure you that masons do not practice magick, they are just a friendly fraternity of good people trying to help others.


Good riddance shit for brains.

I just checked through your posts and was about to reply. Now I dont have too.

:cool:


.

[aurelia]

Will someone give me a good, quality definition of magic so we continue this thread?

What is this, Spanish inquisition?

Come on, people. Everything that happens in this world IS MAGIC. words are magic, sound is magic, music is magic...magic(k)ians simply KNOW what's happening there, or they are trying to comprehend the nature and God itself by practicing magic(k).

You know what, first inform yourself than judge. And only God can judge. It's just that it's none of "His" business, so neither any of us should do it.

Masons are not generally evil, it's illuminati we're fighting against, they are not HUMANS, they are fucking reptilians, they are ABOVE the 33th degree, they have their own policy...please, let someone who knows about these things better correct me if I'm wrong...

[marpat]

Satan is God and God is Satan, it is the same thing. It isn't a conscious entity but an energy which can be used for whatever purpose.

Satan is the adversary and represents intelligent spiritual barriers that need to be overcome. In this respect it is not god. It is just an aspect of being

[scorpio]

It is true, because there is no 33rd 1/2 degree. At least as far as you know.

And no 35th degree:):p

[marpat]

Will someone give me a good, quality definition of magic so we continue this thread?

What is this, Spanish inquisition?

Come on, people. Everything that happens in this world IS MAGIC. words are magic, sound is magic, music is magic...magic(k)ians simply KNOW what's happening there, or they are trying to comprehend the nature and God itself by practicing magic(k).

You know what, first inform yourself than judge. And only God can judge. It's just that it's none of "His" business, so neither any of us should do it.

Masons are not generally evil, it's illuminati we're fighting against, they are not HUMANS, they are fucking reptilians, they are ABOVE the 33th degree, they have their own policy...please, let someone who knows about these things better correct me if I'm wrong...


Why should there be anything above 33 degrees? those degrees are only rellevant to the scottish rite and there are other masonic bodies which have many degress, such as the memphis and mizraim.

Good is its own reward and many masons do a lot of good work. If some do evil then they will reap that, as you say.

The simplest formula of magic is desire-will-mainfestation. You desire something within your mind, you concentrate upon achieving it by whatever means required and the successful conclusion is the manifestation of the original idea in the outer world, or sometimes the inner

[phildee3]

Will someone give me a good, quality definition of magic so we continue this thread?



It's using our higher bodies to accomplish things in higher realms, the way we do in the physical world by using our physical bodies.

[j_cool2010]

Prove they worship satan. Actually satan sits with the sons of god and the book of Job reveals this

Note: Allah in arabic or God in english the concept is the same ok

let this be a reveletion for you guys, think deep with the presence of your conscience. God may guild you.

What Is "The Religion of Worshipping People?"

Throughout history, the most important thing in some societies has not been what Allah expects from people, but what people expect from one another. With no awareness of the Qur'an's decrees or of the way of life enjoined in that book, people have strived to fulfill the expectations of the societies and social environments in which they live.

When we look at our present social environment, we can easily see that people are not fully aware of what Allah has commanded and forbidden, and so do not practice these precepts in their lives. More importantly, none of them feels uncomfortable about such a situation. Almost no one considers the power of Allah, the importance of winning His favor, or the penalty they will receive from Him for not obeying His commands. Most people do not let these thoughts even cross their minds. Instead, they wonder what other people think about them and expect of them, and they are most interested in doing everything they can to ingratiate themselves with others. These individuals live in a system that directs more love and devotion toward their fellow men than toward Allah, and they cannot even imagine how this may be wrong.

This ingrained and very distorted way of thinking and living leads some individuals to squander their material and spiritual resources, even spending their lives in this pursuit. This worldly way of thinking develops into a kind of false religion with its own commandments and prohibitions, truths and falsehoods, obliging everyone to conform to them. Every individual is required to accept the ready-made program of what society expects of him. Only in this way can he live among others without being rejected and humiliated. Any individual who does not conform to what is expected of him gets a clear sense from the way others speak to him and behave that they look down on him.

In order not to get themselves into this situation, people hold in mind a few slogans that they are careful to repeat to themselves every day. For example, "They can call me smart (or intelligent, good-looking, happy, talkative or successful). But don't let them call me selfish (or naïve or ignorant…)" Those who believe in such "commandments" treat their fulfillment like an act of worship and apply their principles without fail. They put forth every effort into developing the sort of character that their associates will admire. As a result of these carefully studied schemes, they reach the point where they value other human beings more than Allah, accepting every proposal that will please those around them and focusing on them all their attention and devotion. From then on, they are caught up in a system of false beliefs in which one individual becomes the slave of others and become a devoted adherent of this secret religion.

This cult encourages you to abandon Allah and worship people instead-which false religion is the theme of this book. This passionate attachment to other human beings we call "The Religion of Worshipping People." In many places in the Qur'an, Allah invites humans to save themselves from this errant belief and serve only Him. In one of these verses, He says:

[Ibrahim said,] "Instead of Allah you worship only idols. You are inventing a lie. Those you worship besides Allah have no power to provide for you. So seek your provision from Allah and worship Him and give thanks to Him. It is to Him you will be returned." (Qura'n - chapter, al-'Ankabut, verse 17)

This book will show how this satanic system puts people in great danger, both in this world and in terms of their eternal life to come. We will explain how it coerces them into rejecting Allah, Who created them, and deifies people in His place. In various examples from daily life, we will demonstrate how people fall under the control of this system. Using verses from the Qur'an, we will explain what people must do to save themselves from the spell of this false religion while they still have time.

No matter how great this distorted religion's influence on society, it must be remembered that a person with willpower and intelligence will find it very easy to renounce this superstitious system. The solution is simple: Have sincere faith in Allah and believe in no other gods besides Him. For His faithful servants, Allah opens the way and guides them along the right path. He has made the Qur'an the means by which they can escape the darkness of their lives. In many verses like this, Allah gives good tidings to those who believe in Him:

[j_cool2010]

Magick is the harnessing of energy.

Magic is pulling rabbits out of hats.

magic is forbiden, satan leads it

SATAN THE SWORN ENEMY OF MANKIND

Whoever you may be, there is an enemy who is a devoted threat to you, who wishes for you eternal torment, having dedicated his whole existence to that end. That enemy is Satan. That is, Satan whom Allah cursed and expelled from His presence. He is your greatest foe. Nor is he a mere myth or legend, but a real being.

He has been in existence throughout human history. Millions who lived and died have succumbed to his wiles and been thrown into the flames, and continue to do so. He makes no distinctions among his victims: young or old, male or female, a head of state or beggar... He is against all human beings.

He is watching from afar and hatching his plots, even as you are reading this text. He has but one desire: to lure you, and as many people as possible, to Hell.

For him to succeed in his aim, it is not necessary that he succeed in tempting people to worship him, or to engage in outrageous acts of perversions. Neither does he necessarily wish to lead people to deny Allah. He himself has not done so. His only wish is to keep human beings away from the truth of the religion of Allah, as espoused in the Qur'an; to prevent them from worshipping Allah sincerely; and, as a result, to ensure they will ultimately have been doomed to eternal torment. Even, at times, by employing the guise of piety, he will make reference to the name of Allah, that he may lead people astray from the truth of the religion. That ruse alone is sufficient for him to drag people with him into the pit of Hell. And, no matter what means he employs, that is the inevitable end for those who choose to follow him:

It is written of him that if anyone takes him as a confidant, he will mislead him and guide him to the punishment of the Searing Blaze. (QURA'N CHAPTER al-Hajj, VERSE 4)

[phildee3]

magic is forbiden, satan leads it



Satan leads anything that is done with mean, cruel or selfish intent - or with deceit and deception.

Nothing is good or evil in itself.
It's all in the intent/motivation.

[marpat]

magic is forbiden, satan leads it

SATAN THE SWORN ENEMY OF MANKIND

Whoever you may be, there is an enemy who is a devoted threat to you, who wishes for you eternal torment, having dedicated his whole existence to that end. That enemy is Satan. That is, Satan whom Allah cursed and expelled from His presence. He is your greatest foe. Nor is he a mere myth or legend, but a real being.

He has been in existence throughout human history. Millions who lived and died have succumbed to his wiles and been thrown into the flames, and continue to do so. He makes no distinctions among his victims: young or old, male or female, a head of state or beggar... He is against all human beings.

He is watching from afar and hatching his plots, even as you are reading this text. He has but one desire: to lure you, and as many people as possible, to Hell.

For him to succeed in his aim, it is not necessary that he succeed in tempting people to worship him, or to engage in outrageous acts of perversions. Neither does he necessarily wish to lead people to deny Allah. He himself has not done so. His only wish is to keep human beings away from the truth of the religion of Allah, as espoused in the Qur'an; to prevent them from worshipping Allah sincerely; and, as a result, to ensure they will ultimately have been doomed to eternal torment. Even, at times, by employing the guise of piety, he will make reference to the name of Allah, that he may lead people astray from the truth of the religion. That ruse alone is sufficient for him to drag people with him into the pit of Hell. And, no matter what means he employs, that is the inevitable end for those who choose to follow him:

It is written of him that if anyone takes him as a confidant, he will mislead him and guide him to the punishment of the Searing Blaze. (QURA'N CHAPTER al-Hajj, VERSE 4)

So its evil because the koran says it? Im not a muslim so dont really accept that

[j_cool2010]

So its evil because the koran says it? Im not a muslim so dont really accept that

doesn't matter who you are or which religion you follow, it is evil and God has informed us humans by sending prophets and books. for example prophet Moses (pbuh) and his book, in his book magic is considered evil and the doer is commiting a great sin for which he will be accounted in hearafter. another example is prophet jesus (pbuh) in his book the majic is forbidden. in both these books God has mention the name of his last and final messanger prophet Mohammad (pbuh) to whom he has sent the final revelaion the Qura'n. it is for the whole humanity and Qura'n by nature is a mirracle itself whih proofs that it is the word of God.

so you better get yourself informed about the truth of magic. it is an evil act, and whoever commits it will be the looser in the long term.

[theperceivingeye]

Qura'n by nature is a mirracle itself whih proofs that it is the word of God.

so you better get yourself informed about the truth of magic. it is an evil act, and whoever commits it will be the looser in the long term.

With logic like that, you can't lose... :rolleyes:

[j_cool2010]

With logic like that, you can't lose... :rolleyes:

do you worship lucifer? if you do be sure thats the greatest mistake/sin your ever making.

there is a verse in the holly Qura'n it is so powerfull if you read it in front of a jinn or so called fallen angel or satan, they will burn and turn into ashes. they are terrified of all holly scriptures.

[bougz]

Why yes it seems we are magicians! :DI've been a magician for over 15 years now and here is the Logo for the invisible lodge! A Masonic lodge for magicians only!
http://i857.photobucket.com/albums/ab136/MMiam/d630be8d.jpg

[phildee3]

there is a verse in the holly Qura'n it is so powerfull if you read it in front of a jinn or so called fallen angel or satan, they will burn and turn into ashes.



That's some powerful magic right there!

[j_cool2010]

That's some powerful magic right there!

thats what the lucifer wants you to believe. satan is the sworn enemy of mankind, wants to pervert your mind, maybe he already has done his job, but u can repent while u still have.

[mara]

And no 35th degree:):p

Maybe there's 33 and 1/3 :)

[marpat]

do you worship lucifer? if you do be sure thats the greatest mistake/sin your ever making.

there is a verse in the holly Qura'n it is so powerfull if you read it in front of a jinn or so called fallen angel or satan, they will burn and turn into ashes. they are terrified of all holly scriptures.

Lol, what a stupid, ignorant question and a ridiculous, fear packed, brainwashed attitude.

Lucifer means light bringer. Perhaps you mean lucifuge.

If evil spirits are afraid of the koran then why do you have cases of muslims committing evil acts? surely all they would have to do is read the koran and that would fix it.

[phildee3]

Shiva is a demon that smokes marijuana, the most dangerous neurotoxin known to man.

I think it's time to move this forum to the "Have a Laugh" section!

[mara]

I think it's time to move this forum to the "Have a Laugh" section!

Agree :)

[j_cool2010]

Lol, what a stupid, ignorant question and a ridiculous, fear packed, brainwashed attitude.

Lucifer means light bringer. Perhaps you mean lucifuge.

If evil spirits are afraid of the koran then why do you have cases of muslims committing evil acts? surely all they would have to do is read the koran and that would fix it.

you are so misguilded, you think the lucifere brings you light? the lucifere is another name of satan, he will never bring you light in fact he would like to make sure you burn in hell alongside with him. you are the one who is brainwashed and deviated from the truth. as i mentioned satan is a sworn enemy of mankind, he will appear in different shapes, forms, names and titles in orders to decieve people.

muslimes who are commiting evil act are only muslim by names, they are actualy far from the teachings of Islam and Holy Qura'n. because one who take Qura'n as his guild cannot commit evil act. thos people who you are addressing as muslim commiting evil acts are actualy on the same path as you are, ASTRAYED BY SATAN.

[j_cool2010]

Lol, what a stupid, ignorant question and a ridiculous, fear packed, brainwashed attitude.

Lucifer means light bringer. Perhaps you mean lucifuge.

If evil spirits are afraid of the koran then why do you have cases of muslims committing evil acts? surely all they would have to do is read the koran and that would fix it.

ok, i give you an example. think about it ok

the icon that appear on your profile, whatever you think it is most people think that is the image of god (God forbid) the truth about that image is that satan has created it by man himself, behind that image is satan. whoever worship it actualy worships satan. Almighy God will never forgive someone who take partner with him, it is a great sin and the doer of such a act will face eternal torment in hearafter.

[marpat]

you are so misguilded, you think the lucifere brings you light? the lucifere is another name of satan, he will never bring you light in fact he would like to make sure you burn in hell alongside with him. you are the one who is brainwashed and deviated from the truth. as i mentioned satan is a sworn enemy of mankind, he will appear in different shapes, forms, names and titles in orders to decieve people.

muslimes who are commiting evil act are only muslim by names, they are actualy far from the teachings of Islam and Holy Qura'n. because one who take Qura'n as his guild cannot commit evil act. thos people who you are addressing as muslim commiting evil acts are actualy on the same path as you are, ASTRAYED BY SATAN.

lol. You make me laugh. ancient holy books are full of stories of people having visions of god and being guided as to what to do, etc. If my life is so wrong then I will be happy to change it if I get a vision from god telling me so. At the end of the day I dont put my faith in a book. A powerul visionary experience might make me listen though and Im sure that god could easily hustle one up.

Why dont you do some reading on what lucifer actually means instead of parroting a book.

Lucifer - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

[marpat]

ok, i give you an example. think about it ok

the icon that appear on your profile, whatever you think it is most people think that is the image of god (God forbid) the truth about that image is that satan has created it by man himself, behind that image is satan. whoever worship it actualy worships satan. Almighy God will never forgive someone who take partner with him, it is a great sin and the doer of such a act will face eternal torment in hearafter.

If you say so :rolleyes:

[j_cool2010]

lol. You make me laugh. ancient holy books are full of stories of people having visions of god and being guided as to what to do, etc. If my life is so wrong then I will be happy to change it if I get a vision from god telling me so. At the end of the day I dont put my faith in a book. A powerul visionary experience might make me listen though and Im sure that god could easily hustle one up.

Why dont you do some reading on what lucifer actually means instead of parroting a book.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer

I already knew what a lucifer is but as you recommended, i did some research and did not find anything different to what i knew. it means literaly light bearer, or some refer to fallen angels, or morning stars etc. but in general it applies to satan, the illumenati and occult beleifs and rituals are all satanic. you are follwoing knowingly or unknowingly the teachings of satan. i feel realy sorry for you. you refered to holly Qura'n as old stories, you are wrong
you should do some research on Holly Qura'n and you will find out it is a devine book from Allah, it has prooven it through all ages and times. God has send this book for the guildence of all mankind. whoever grasps t will be the guilded and whoever refuse it will be the looser.
the life of this world will pass so quick, and be sure that death is not the end.

[marpat]

I already knew what a lucifer is but as you recommended, i did some research and did not find anything different to what i knew. it means literaly light bearer, or some refer to fallen angels, or morning stars etc. but in general it applies to satan, the illumenati and occult beleifs and rituals are all satanic. you are follwoing knowingly or unknowingly the teachings of satan. i feel realy sorry for you. you refered to holly Qura'n as old stories, you are wrong
you should do some research on Holly Qura'n and you will find out it is a devine book from Allah, it has prooven it through all ages and times. God has send this book for the guildence of all mankind. whoever grasps t will be the guilded and whoever refuse it will be the looser.
the life of this world will pass so quick, and be sure that death is not the end.

I actually have a copy of the koran so spare me your bullshit. If god wants to guide me then let him. I dont see why I need to be dictated to by a book, or or by a bunch of violent minded clerics. Do you think the patriarchs had books to tell them how to act? I feel sorry for you because you lack the spirit of wisdom and discernment and rely on the pages of a book to tell you what to believe. It is the dependency of material books that is the true mark or satanic slavery because satan knows that words can be manipulated whereas the spirit of god is something within each person that can reveal inner truth, so you stick to your book, you slave.

[phildee3]

I already knew what a lucifer is but as you recommended, i did some research and did not find anything different to what i knew. it means literaly light bearer, or some refer to fallen angels, or morning stars etc. but in general it applies to satan,



Lucifer is not Satan.
Satan was always Satan.
Lucifer was once God's, but is now Satan's - but only until that glorious day when Satan will become completely impotent and dissolve into the illusory shadow that he really is.



the illumenati and occult beleifs and rituals are all satanic.



This is untrue.
The Eucharist was given to us by Christ himself.

A rite is just a rite - a dead piece of text.
It does nothing unless it's performed, and then it becomes satanic or holy depending on the intent.

[j_cool2010]

I actually have a copy of the koran so spare me your bullshit. If god wants to guide me then let him. I dont see why I need to be dictated to by a book, or or by a bunch of violent minded clerics. Do you think the patriarchs had books to tell them how to act? I feel sorry for you because you lack the spirit of wisdom and discernment and rely on the pages of a book to tell you what to believe. It is the dependency of material books that is the true mark or satanic slavery because satan knows that words can be manipulated whereas the spirit of god is something within each person that can reveal inner truth, so you stick to your book, you slave.

first of all calmown plz
secondly the holy Quran is not just any book ok, it is the word of God, and it is preserved by God becasue it is the last reveltion to humanity. the books before Quran the Bible and the torah were as well devine books but they were not preserved. thats why we have so many different versions of bibles and torahs. but Quran cannot be altered or changed even by a dot. Quran is a mirracle, it can be proved. people who are expert in arabic language all has confirmed that this is a devine book for the way it is structured. Keep in mind that Qura'n was reveled to an illetrated man 1400 years ago to a nation who were the most astrayed and the most ignorant on earth and idolators. i am a salve but not to satan i am a slave to almighty god who created me and the whole univers. and i am glad i am not a slave of my enemy satan. you are right God is very close to you. closer than your jagular vein. this is a fact and is revealed in the Quran.
again my friend don't be tricked by satan. satan is the enemy of all mankind.

[j_cool2010]

Lucifer is not Satan.
Satan was always Satan.
Lucifer was once God's, but is now Satan's - but only until that glorious day when Satan will become completely impotent and dissolve into the illusory shadow that he really is.



This is untrue.
The Eucharist was given to us by Christ himself.

A rite is just a rite - a dead piece of text.
It does nothing unless it's performed, and then it becomes satanic or holy depending on the intent.

satan will not be desolved nor impotent. satan will be materialised in judgement day and will be acounted for what he did on earth. every single soul will be accounted for what they did on earth. then the lucky will be those who carried out God's cammonds and obayed his messangers God will reward his rightiouse servants with paradise. and unlucky will be satan and his followers, they will burn in hell for ever.
plz don't be the followers of satan, try to search for the truth. God has created man with conscience which always guild him to the right path if he listens to it. so listen to your conscience you maybe guilded..

[bougz]

My consciousness says buckle up and stand your ground!

[j_cool2010]

Lucifer is not Satan.
Satan was always Satan.
Lucifer was once God's, but is now Satan's - but only until that glorious day when Satan will become completely impotent and dissolve into the illusory shadow that he really is.



This is untrue.
The Eucharist was given to us by Christ himself.

A rite is just a rite - a dead piece of text.
It does nothing unless it's performed, and then it becomes satanic or holy depending on the intent.

sorry don't take me wrong plz, when you use the term christ what do you mean, who is christ? did jesus (pbuh) say to call him christ? or where the word christianity is comming from, did jesus (pbuh) tell his followers that christianity is the name of his relegion?
i am very curiouse to better underestand what you mean. i would appreciat if you could explain to me. many thanks bro

[marpat]

first of all calmown plz
secondly the holy Quran is not just any book ok, it is the word of God, and it is preserved by God becasue it is the last reveltion to humanity. the books before Quran the Bible and the torah were as well devine books but they were not preserved. thats why we have so many different versions of bibles and torahs. but Quran cannot be altered or changed even by a dot. Quran is a mirracle, it can be proved. people who are expert in arabic language all has confirmed that this is a devine book for the way it is structured. Keep in mind that Qura'n was reveled to an illetrated man 1400 years ago to a nation who were the most astrayed and the most ignorant on earth and idolators. i am a salve but not to satan i am a slave to almighty god who created me and the whole univers. and i am glad i am not a slave of my enemy satan. you are right God is very close to you. closer than your jagular vein. this is a fact and is revealed in the Quran.
again my friend don't be tricked by satan. satan is the enemy of all mankind.


So if there is only one koran then why are they many muslim setcs then? is this where you tell me that only one muslim sect is true and the other follow false doctrines?

How is the torah not preserved when it still exists in some form? are you trying to tell me that there was only ever one version of the koran in existance?

To be honest, if I was going to take a religion then I would prefer to be jewish rather than be a muslim.

[phildee3]

satan will not be desolved nor impotent. satan will be materialised in judgement day and will be acounted for what he did on earth. every single soul will be accounted for what they did on earth. then the lucky will be those who carried out God's cammonds and obayed his messangers God will reward his rightiouse servants with paradise. and unlucky will be satan and his followers, they will burn in hell for ever.



Do you know the origin of the word "lucky"?
It's from the word "Lucifer."

[phildee3]

sorry don't take me wrong plz, when you use the term christ what do you mean, who is christ?



Christ = the anointed one, the Messiah, the King of Kings, the supreme authority.



did jesus (pbuh) say to call him christ?



I doubt it. It's an English word.



or where the word christianity is comming from, did jesus (pbuh) tell his followers that christianity is the name of his relegion?



- ditto -
You're straining at a gnat, dude.
It's not about a label, it's about an experience.

[j_cool2010]

So if there is only one koran then why are they many muslim setcs then? is this where you tell me that only one muslim sect is true and the other follow false doctrines?

How is the torah not preserved when it still exists in some form? are you trying to tell me that there was only ever one version of the koran in existance?

To be honest, if I was going to take a religion then I would prefer to be jewish rather than be a muslim.

i agree with you muslims are divided into many sects and they feel proud to be known by their sects instead of just as Muslims. This is indeed a sad situation because Quran and Hadith are strongly against Making sects and dividing the religion. Today Muslims calls themselves Shafi, Maliki, Hanafi, Deo Bandi, Belvi, Sunni, Shia, Ahle Hadeeth and many other sects but my question to those muslims who are divided into sects that what was the Prophet Jesus, Moses, Joseph, Adam and most importantly Prophet Muammad (pbuh)? They where just Muslims. What where Hazrat Abu Bakar, Umar, Usman and Ali {the successors after prophet mohhamad (pbuh) passed away? They where just muslims. then why you are not just Muslims why you are divided into sects and feel proud to be known by your sect instead of just as Muslim?

Even more Sad thing is that many sects gives Fatwa's of Kufar against other Sects, feels it right to kill Muslims of other sects and don,t offer Prayer in Masjid of other sects. Allah (swt) says in the Holy Quran "Don,t be divided into sects and hold the Rope of Allah strongly. Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) said whoever divides our religion is not from us. There are several Verses of the Holy Quran and Hadiths of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh) against dividing the religion into sects.

anti islamists has tried to create sectarian violence among Muslims to make them weak and then defeat them. we have example of Iraq and Iran how these two Muslim countries continued to fight for several years and millions of Muslims from both sides where killed in this fight. anti islamist always tried hard to devide muslims and creat misconception about islam to distort islam to the eye of the world.

by the way only 5% of muslims are devided into different sect and 95% is ahle sunnah and jamaat. but the 5% are the richest and mostly supported by the west.

yeah Quran has only one version from the begining of the revelation until today. i am not saying no one has attempted to alter its content. lots of attemp were made even to totally distroy Qura'n but since Allah has promised to preserve Qura'n. all the attemps were in vein. for the Bible and Torah Allah did not make such a promise hense there are hundreds of different version contradictory versions of each book the bible and torah all claiming to be true.
choose any relegion you wish you the free will. there has only one relegion since the begining of man kind. people get confused with the name of Islam because they think its an arabic name. if you transulate Islam in english it means peacefull submission to our creator. the relegion of all the prophets were the same. people chese different name for it. Islam is mentioned in the Quran while if you check bible you won't find the name CHRISTIANITY because it is a man made name. also if check the whole torah you won't find the name JUDAISM because again it is a man made name.
the relegion of all the prophets since the beguning were PEACEFULL SUBMESSION TO GOD = ISLAM

[j_cool2010]

Christ = the anointed one, the Messiah, the King of Kings, the supreme authority.



I doubt it. It's an English word.



- ditto -
You're straining at a gnat, dude.
It's not about a label, it's about an experience.

you did not answer my question dude. we are communicating in plain english. i asked you a very straight forward question. you are straining my question.

[phildee3]

did jesus (pbuh) say to call him christ?



Chew on Matthew 27:11 for a bit.

[phildee3]

i asked you a very straight forward question.



You asked me three.
Which answer didn't you like?

Your second and third questions were completely irrelevent to your understanding what I meant in msg #36.
My answer to your first one was as straight-forward as it gets.

[kronoix]

satan will not be desolved nor impotent. satan will be materialised in judgement day and will be acounted for what he did on earth. every single soul will be accounted for what they did on earth. then the lucky will be those who carried out God's cammonds and obayed his messangers God will reward his rightiouse servants with paradise. and unlucky will be satan and his followers, they will burn in hell for ever.
plz don't be the followers of satan, try to search for the truth. God has created man with conscience which always guild him to the right path if he listens to it. so listen to your conscience you maybe guilded..


Just a message out for everyone NOT to listen to this.

You are human beings, who have a right to a wonderful eternal life.

You will NOT burn in hell.


This guy claims to be against TPTB yet follows religion..

[marpat]

the relegion of all the prophets since the beguning were PEACEFULL SUBMESSION TO GOD = ISLAM

So what you are saying here is that you dont need to be muslim or follow the koran but just submit yourself to god. And what if, by this submission, you learn things that are different to the written books of organised religions?

[j_cool2010]

So what you are saying here is that you dont need to be muslim or follow the koran but just submit yourself to god. And what if, by this submission, you learn things that are different to the written books of organised religions?

hey you almost got me confused too
if you totaly and peacefuly submit yourself to God i mean sincerely and by heart, and obey God's cammond and his revelations which is Qura'n then your a muslim.

you cannot submit yourself to God while you refuse his revlation, it is contredictory. it doesn't work that way. Islam is a very sincere relegion, it purefys one or prepares one for the eternal life of paradise. paradise is a beautifull place that Almighty God has promised to his obydient and sincere servants. people who preferes the temperory life of this world over the eternal life of hearafter they donnot deserve paradise.
check this video might interests you
Cat Stevens' transition to Yusuf Islam - YouTube

[j_cool2010]

Do you know the origin of the word "lucky"?
It's from the word "Lucifer."

one can say then, do you know the word donkey? it is originated from word doncan

[phildee3]

one can say then, do you know the word donkey? it is originated from word doncan

One could say it, but one would be lying.

[purplepebble]

I have been told firsthand that some, not all masons are sorcerers, obviously not all of them can be or are even aware of such stuff, that would be ridiculous. First off not everyone is capable of sorcery, especially when it comes to creation/destruction. That takes years of training. See my post on Dugpas if you haven't already. You might find some answers.

[marpat]

I have been told firsthand that some, not all masons are sorcerers, obviously not all of them can be or are even aware of such stuff, that would be ridiculous. First off not everyone is capable of sorcery, especially when it comes to creation/destruction. That takes years of training. See my post on Dugpas if you haven't already. You might find some answers.

Its an absolute fact that many masons have no capacity for magic at all.

[purplepebble]

Its an absolute fact that many masons have no capacity for magic at all.

edited - I misread what you wrote - by saying many, that means some....are capable.

[j_cool2010]

Just a message out for everyone NOT to listen to this.

You are human beings, who have a right to a wonderful eternal life.

You will NOT burn in hell.


This guy claims to be against TPTB yet follows religion..

what the hell are u talking about? and what does this mean tbtp?

[bougz]

The powers that be???? Idk?:confused:

[j_cool2010]

One could say it, but one would be lying.

exactly so stop lying then. the word lucifere has nothing to do with the word luck the same as the word donkey has nothing to do with doncan.

[marpat]

edited - I misread what you wrote - by saying many, that means some....are capable.

I would say that there are probably just as many people who have capability but have no interest in the subject at any level either. Psychic means 'of the soul' so every person has the potential to manifest some ability. I am sure there are many people with no magical or mystical interest who have some form of ability, even if they dont recognise it.

I guess a big question is also what do you mean by magical ability. I dont mean that some can be invisible or levitate or anything extreme. Real magic can be very subtle and hard to notice without making constant and accurate observations as it does not occur within linear timeframes.

The essence of magic is that you become a channel for a spiritual force so a prophet is performing magic by manifesting a vision from a deity or spirit, such as is claimed by mohammed. The only real difference is the intent

[kronoix]

what the hell are u talking about? and what does this mean tbtp?

The powers that be.



Also this talk of hell is just fear mongering.

NOBODY is going to 'hell'.


The concept of hell was used to instill fear into people to get them to convert to a certain religion.

[ufochick]

I would have thought anyone is capable of doing magic.

yes they are, it's just energy manipulation

[ufochick]

I would say that there are probably just as many people who have capability but have no interest in the subject at any level either. Psychic means 'of the soul' so every person has the potential to manifest some ability. I am sure there are many people with no magical or mystical interest who have some form of ability, even if they dont recognise it.

I guess a big question is also what do you mean by magical ability. I dont mean that some can be invisible or levitate or anything extreme. Real magic can be very subtle and hard to notice without making constant and accurate observations as it does not occur within linear timeframes.

The essence of magic is that you become a channel for a spiritual force so a prophet is performing magic by manifesting a vision from a deity or spirit, such as is claimed by mohammed. The only real difference is the intent

No NO!! one does not have to channel to use magic, we all have our own power to pull from.

[ufochick]

Will someone give me a good, quality definition of magic so we continue this thread?

What is this, Spanish inquisition?

Come on, people. Everything that happens in this world IS MAGIC. words are magic, sound is magic, music is magic...magic(k)ians simply KNOW what's happening there, or they are trying to comprehend the nature and God itself by practicing magic(k).

You know what, first inform yourself than judge. And only God can judge. It's just that it's none of "His" business, so neither any of us should do it.

Masons are not generally evil, it's illuminati we're fighting against, they are not HUMANS, they are fucking reptilians, they are ABOVE the 33th degree, they have their own policy...please, let someone who knows about these things better correct me if I'm wrong...

Magic is the attempt to change a situation, person, object or outcome by the use of energy manipulation. Calling down of spirits is a different thing. Prayer is a type of magic only you are asking another entity to make the changes and use their power for your request.

[ufochick]

doesn't matter who you are or which religion you follow, it is evil and God has informed us humans by sending prophets and books. for example prophet Moses (pbuh) and his book, in his book magic is considered evil and the doer is commiting a great sin for which he will be accounted in hearafter. another example is prophet jesus (pbuh) in his book the majic is forbidden. in both these books God has mention the name of his last and final messanger prophet Mohammad (pbuh) to whom he has sent the final revelaion the Qura'n. it is for the whole humanity and Qura'n by nature is a mirracle itself whih proofs that it is the word of God.

so you better get yourself informed about the truth of magic. it is an evil act, and whoever commits it will be the looser in the long term.

silly silly silly... and fear based. Living in a state of fear lowers your vibration not a good thing. Dropping a child's fever, or sending energy to a friend who is down or many other acts are quite positive. It's about intend of the enrgy used. Every time you WISH for something or pray for something you are attmting to use magic.

[ufochick]

do you worship lucifer? if you do be sure thats the greatest mistake/sin your ever making.

there is a verse in the holly Qura'n it is so powerfull if you read it in front of a jinn or so called fallen angel or satan, they will burn and turn into ashes. they are terrified of all holly scriptures.

Have you ever dealt with a jinn? any interdimensiona entity? they use technology, reading something does nothing.. I KNOW.

[ufochick]

you are so misguilded, you think the lucifere brings you light? the lucifere is another name of satan, he will never bring you light in fact he would like to make sure you burn in hell alongside with him. you are the one who is brainwashed and deviated from the truth. as i mentioned satan is a sworn enemy of mankind, he will appear in different shapes, forms, names and titles in orders to decieve people.

muslimes who are commiting evil act are only muslim by names, they are actualy far from the teachings of Islam and Holy Qura'n. because one who take Qura'n as his guild cannot commit evil act. thos people who you are addressing as muslim commiting evil acts are actualy on the same path as you are, ASTRAYED BY SATAN.

The only power the "devil" has (use any name for it you want) is that people like you give him YOUR power. Your fear takes shape and turns into an energy pool for evil to function within. Stop giving this your power and it will be weakened.

[phildee3]

Magic is the attempt to change a situation, person, object or outcome by the use of energy manipulation.

Ufochick - I very much like all of your latest comments.
I'd like to add to the above, though, by suggesting that the manipulation of energy (which happens in the etheric) is not necessarily in order to effect changes in the mundane, physical world. It can also be to effect changes in the etheric realm itself, in fact, I would suggest that this is a purer form of magic.

[phildee3]

the word lucifere (sic) has nothing to do with the word luck the same as the word donkey has nothing to do with doncan.



I've just reaserched this and found that, apart from one whacko, evangelical, fudamentalist website that agrees with you, all linguist authorities say that the origin of the word "luck" is unknown.

I take back what I said - that the word luck has it's origin in the word Lucifer.
We simply don't know.

However, I would still rather depend on grace than luck for my salvation!!

[marpat]

No NO!! one does not have to channel to use magic, we all have our own power to pull from.

To my mind all energy comes from one source and it depends on what you relationship is to that source as to whether you channel the energy or manifest it directly.

[j_cool2010]

Have you ever dealt with a jinn? any interdimensiona entity? they use technology, reading something does nothing.. I KNOW.

I did not deal with a jinn directly but an experience i remember when i was about 13nish. my step mom was posssed by some jinn. why i beleived she was posesed is because my step mom was an illeterate lady, never gone school nor follwoed any course of education and also she only spoke one native language (dari). but surprisingly while she was posessed, first of all she was extremely very strong that 5 people hardly could hold her during that state she spoke different languages fluently and her tone of voice was different than her real one.
i remember that an elderly member of the family was comunicating and kind of compremising with the jinns. asking them what they want from her and why they don't leave her alone. they replyed that they were harmed by my step mom, I don't remember the detail of how they were harmed, so then the elderly member of mmy family started reciting the verses of holly Qura'n then my step mom started to calm down and went to sleep. after she woke up she did not remember anything. when we talked about what happened to her she didn't beleive us she took it as we are joking.

do you know it is illegal for them to get in contact with human. God has fobidden cross dimensional travel for jinns as well as for humans. if someon is trying to make jinn to help them by magic it is totally forbidden.

there are good jinns and bad jinns, strong and powerfull and weaks.
but they are all terrified of the holly scriptures. because they are aware that there is only one God that created the whole universe and his power is infinite, and they also can distinguish between the holy scriptures and man made scriptures. they are terrified of the words of God.

[j_cool2010]

Ufochick - I very much like all of your latest comments.
I'd like to add to the above, though, by suggesting that the manipulation of energy (which happens in the etheric) is not necessarily in order to effect changes in the mundane, physical world. It can also be to effect changes in the etheric realm itself, in fact, I would suggest that this is a purer form of magic.

magic is a cross dimesional travel, that a humans make a jinn to help them out. the jinns that gets involved in this act is a bad jinns not a good one. because a good jinns knows that cross dimensional travel and comunication is forbidden by Allah (God). the bad jinns are all the slaves of their master (satan). satan is an enemy of mankind allways want human to commit sin. so magic hasn't got a purer form. it is an evil act.

[j_cool2010]

silly silly silly... and fear based. Living in a state of fear lowers your vibration not a good thing. Dropping a child's fever, or sending energy to a friend who is down or many other acts are quite positive. It's about intend of the enrgy used. Every time you WISH for something or pray for something you are attmting to use magic.

God is greater than all his creatures. why not ask God directly for help rather to turn to his creatures. jinns are God's creatures they indeed can not fulfil what God can. yeah i fear God alot. i always ask him for guildence cos he created us and he knows best how to guild us.

[phildee3]

magic is a cross dimesional travel, that a humans make a jinn to help them out.



This is a very low form of "magic."
I can understand how you would see this as "evil."

We are talking about working with energy ourselves, not employing another entity to do it for us.
There would certainly be a price to pay for that.

It is not forbidden to move an object from point A to point B in the physical world (unless it is to do harm). Why should the same not apply in the etheric realm?

[j_cool2010]

The only power the "devil" has (use any name for it you want) is that people like you give him YOUR power. Your fear takes i shape and turns into an energy pool for evil to function within. Stop giving this your power and it will be weakened.

DEAR ufochick

i dono what to say. no offences but i think you are lost in delusion, you are far from the truth, well i am not saying your expeirences are not true, i actualy beleive them and are true and realy are happening to you, but you fail to grasp the true meaning. why it is happening. i visited your website and i read most of your statements etc. i saw the pic of that alien looking creature. check this link and most of your questions will be answered i guess

please check them with open mind and without prejudice

YouTube - Broadcast Yourself.

also check this link and see what you thinking
The Arrivals - Part 31 (The Great Deception) - YouTube

ou can check these serries from the beguning if you like it is a total of 51 series each series is 10 minutes.

cheers

[j_cool2010]

lol. You make me laugh. ancient holy books are full of stories of people having visions of god and being guided as to what to do, etc. If my life is so wrong then I will be happy to change it if I get a vision from god telling me so. At the end of the day I dont put my faith in a book. A powerul visionary experience might make me listen though and Im sure that god could easily hustle one up.

Why dont you do some reading on what lucifer actually means instead of parroting a book.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucifer

hi
chech this link to find out more about lucifere, you might find it interesting. it has many parts. ach part is 10 minutes. The Arrivals pt.31 (The Great Deception) - YouTube
The Arrivals pt.29 (The Truth About The Gods) - YouTube
The Arrivals pt. 30 (The Checkered Floor and The "Gods") - YouTube

[the harbinger]

This world is doomed as the destroyer of the world is presently occupying all the earth with wars, greed, corruption, chaos, death, oil spills, volanic eruptions, earthquakes, and a great many signs.. Be prepared because we are headed towards a cataclysmic disaster and the world economy will crash , and then the people will elect a leader over them who appears to bring peace but will bring about the destruction of our entire planet. Be prepared because Apollyon has risen.

[j_cool2010]

This is a very low form of "magic."
I can understand how you would see this as "evil."

We are talking about working with energy ourselves, not employing another entity to do it for us.
There would certainly be a price to pay for that.

It is not forbidden to move an object from point A to point B in the physical world (unless it is to do harm). Why should the same not apply in the etheric realm?

do you know the originator of the magic? check this link
and see what you think. but this is the truth about the magic

Prophet Sulayman - jinns and magic (1-4).mp4 - YouTube

as muslims we only accept information based on proof and truth.

[marpat]

do you know the originator of the magic? check this link
and see what you think. but this is the truth about the magic

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GoOHigwRTII&feature=related

as muslims we only accept information based on proof and truth.

You mean your own proofs and truths, not universal ones. Dont you think that Moses did magic when his staff turned into a snake, or when he made water come froma rock? God may have told him to do it but the end result is still magic. Magic is nothing more than a change brought about by spiritual effort, so if you read the koran, do your prayers, and then develop an understanding of god you have basically carried out a magical ritual as I see it. Are there no accounts of people doing miraculous things in Islam?

[j_cool2010]

You mean your own proofs and truths, not universal ones. Dont you think that Moses did magic when his staff turned into a snake, or when he made water come froma rock? God may have told him to do it but the end result is still magic. Magic is nothing more than a change brought about by spiritual effort, so if you read the koran, do your prayers, and then develop an understanding of god you have basically carried out a magical ritual as I see it. Are there no accounts of people doing miraculous things in Islam?

prophet Mosa (pbuh) never did the act of magic. it is great sin to link the act of magic to the great messengers of Allah. prophet Mosa was a mighty messenger of Allah and he was blissed with a mirracle. there is huge difference between magic and mirracles. when pheroun ( pherous) rejected the message of Allah which was sent to Pheroun and his people by prophet Mosa (pbuh). he also accused prophet Mosa (pbuh) of being a smart magician. then he gathered all the famouse magician of the time to perform magic against prophet Mosa (pbuh). the magicians threw rope and the rope turned into snakes by illusionary tricks of magic, but when prophet Mosa (pbuh) threw his stick by God's cammond, it turned into a huge snake that swollowed all the other snakes which was made by magic. When the magicians saw the sence they prostrated because they knew that what Mosa (pbuh) performed was not an act of magic. they were the smartest magician of the time and they confirmed that, what prophet Mosa (pbuh) performed is not magic. this was a miracle granted to him by his Almighty Lord.

the full story is in Quran, and it can be prooved that Quran is the word of Allah our lord, the same lord who sent Torah to Mosa (pbuh) and the same lord who sent Bible to Jesus (pbuh), and the same lord who created the whole univers out of nothingness from a single point by a big bang.

can you please watch the video i posted the link, it has 4 parts , keep an open mind please put all the prejudeice on one side and watch the all 4 parts. i would like to know how much you agree. cos what is said in the clip can prooved.

[phildee3]

there is huge difference between magic and mirracles.


...the magicians threw rope and the rope turned into snakes by illusionary tricks of magic,



Well, if you think that illusionism is magic then yes, there is a huge difference between that and miracles.

[marpat]

prophet Mosa (pbuh) never did the act of magic. it is great sin to link the act of magic to the great messengers of Allah. prophet Mosa was a mighty messenger of Allah and he was blissed with a mirracle. there is huge difference between magic and mirracles. when pheroun ( pherous) rejected the message of Allah which was sent to Pheroun and his people by prophet Mosa (pbuh). he also accused prophet Mosa (pbuh) of being a smart magician. then he gathered all the famouse magician of the time to perform magic against prophet Mosa (pbuh). the magicians threw rope and the rope turned into snakes by illusionary tricks of magic, but when prophet Mosa (pbuh) threw his stick by God's cammond, it turned into a huge snake that swollowed all the other snakes which was made by magic. When the magicians saw the sence they prostrated because they knew that what Mosa (pbuh) performed was not an act of magic. they were the smartest magician of the time and they confirmed that, what prophet Mosa (pbuh) performed is not magic. this was a miracle granted to him by his Almighty Lord.

the full story is in Quran, and it can be prooved that Quran is the word of Allah our lord, the same lord who sent Torah to Mosa (pbuh) and the same lord who sent Bible to Jesus (pbuh), and the same lord who created the whole univers out of nothingness from a single point by a big bang.

can you please watch the video i posted the link, it has 4 parts , keep an open mind please put all the prejudeice on one side and watch the all 4 parts. i would like to know how much you agree. cos what is said in the clip can prooved.

You see here, its the same old shit spun by people about their own religion and magic. When somebody from their religion does it (such as a prophet), it becomes a blessing from god but when an outsider does it (perhaps from another religion), it is some evil spirit. You are like a christian who cannot accept that the miracles of jesus were acts of magic, or that the mass is a magic ritual. Going on a pilgrimage to mecca is very much a magical ritual, you go through the motion and ritual to achieve a specific goal. How can you not see this?

You say islam can be proven but how do you prove beyond a doubt that gabriel appeared to mohammed and gave him this information? these are issues of faith. Not only that but not a single religion contains all truth, so to act like you religion is somehow superior to others is an illusion.

While I can admire your faith and dedication to your religion I think your attitude towards others on other spiritual paths smacks of ignorance and bigottry. Im sure you would think the same if a christian told you that you were fallowing a false religion and that theirs is superior because their god-man was risen from the dead, etc, etc. It is the spirit of man that bears witness to the spirit of god, and this is not limited to the contents of a book written a long time ago, which requires belief and not experience or knowledge

[j_cool2010]

You see here, its the same old shit spun by people about their own religion and magic. When somebody from their religion does it (such as a prophet), it becomes a blessing from god but when an outsider does it (perhaps from another religion), it is some evil spirit. You are like a christian who cannot accept that the miracles of jesus were acts of magic, or that the mass is a magic ritual. Going on a pilgrimage to mecca is very much a magical ritual, you go through the motion and ritual to achieve a specific goal. How can you not see this?
You say islam can be proven but how do you prove beyond a doubt that gabriel appeared to mohammed and gave him this information? these are issues of faith. Not only that but not a single religion contains all truth, so to act like you religion is somehow superior to others is an illusion.
While I can admire your faith and dedication to your religion I think your attitude towards others on other spiritual paths smacks of ignorance and bigottry. Im sure you would think the same if a christian told you that you were fallowing a false religion and that theirs is superior because their god-man was risen from the dead, etc, etc. It is the spirit of man that bears witness to the spirit of god, and this is not limited to the contents of a book written a long time ago, which requires belief and not experience or knowledge


If a christian tell me my rellgion is wrong, i will smile at him and ask him very nicely to debate with me and tell me why he thinks my relegion is wrong. and also i will ask for proof. then i will give him proof that my relegion is a true relegion. And will also proove that christanity is mixed with paganism, and so is the nature of Judaism.

anyone who follows a pagan relegion actually follows the path to hell.

an example of the Miracles of Qura'n

The origin of the universe is described in the Qur'an in the following verse:

”He is the Originator of the heavens and the earth.„
(The Qura'n, 6:101)

also
“Do not the Unbelievers see that the heavens and the earth were joined together (as one unit of Creation), before We clove them asunder?”
[The Qura'n, 21:30]
This information given in the Qur'an is in full agreement with the findings of contemporary science. The conclusion that astrophysics has reached today is that the entire universe, together with the dimensions of matter and time, came into existence as a result of a great explosion that occurred in no time. This event, known as "The Big Bang" proved that the universe was created from nothingness as the result of the explosion of a single point. Modern scientific circles are in agreement that the Big Bang is the only rational and provable explanation of the beginning of the universe and of how the universe came into being.
Before the Big Bang, there was no such thing as matter. From a condition of non-existence in which neither matter, nor energy, nor even time existed, and which can only be described metaphysically, matter, energy, and time were all created. This fact that only recently discovered by modern physics, was announced to us in the Qur'an 1,400 years ago.

although Qura'n is NOT a book of science but a book of SIGNES. yet there are more than 1000 verses that talks about science. 80% of holy Qura'n is pooved to be a 100% correct by today's science. but on the rest of 20% science is not yet advanced enough to comment. logic says the rest 20% is also 100% correct. but as muslims we have faith in Qura'n no doubt it is the word of Allah (swt)

[marpat]

If a christian tell me my rellgion is wrong, i will smile at him and ask him very nicely to debate with me and tell me why he thinks my relegion is wrong. and also i will ask for proof. then i will give him proof that my relegion is a true relegion. And will also proove that christanity is mixed with paganism, and so is the nature of Judaism.

anyone who follows a pagan relegion actually follows the path to hell.

an example of the Miracles of Qura'n

The origin of the universe is described in the Qur'an in the following verse:

”He is the Originator of the heavens and the earth.„
(The Qura'n, 6:101)

also
“Do not the Unbelievers see that the heavens and the earth were joined together (as one unit of Creation), before We clove them asunder?”
[The Qura'n, 21:30]
This information given in the Qur'an is in full agreement with the findings of contemporary science. The conclusion that astrophysics has reached today is that the entire universe, together with the dimensions of matter and time, came into existence as a result of a great explosion that occurred in no time. This event, known as "The Big Bang" proved that the universe was created from nothingness as the result of the explosion of a single point. Modern scientific circles are in agreement that the Big Bang is the only rational and provable explanation of the beginning of the universe and of how the universe came into being.
Before the Big Bang, there was no such thing as matter. From a condition of non-existence in which neither matter, nor energy, nor even time existed, and which can only be described metaphysically, matter, energy, and time were all created. This fact that only recently discovered by modern physics, was announced to us in the Qur'an 1,400 years ago.

although Qura'n is NOT a book of science but a book of SIGNES. yet there are more than 1000 verses that talks about science. 80% of holy Qura'n is pooved to be a 100% correct by today's science. but on the rest of 20% science is not yet advanced enough to comment. logic says the rest 20% is also 100% correct. but as muslims we have faith in Qura'n no doubt it is the word of Allah (swt)

You will ask for proof? can you prove Gabriel appeared to mohammed and if so then prove it to me

You might find, if you bother to research other religions (which I doubt you will), that others do have references which relate to scientific subject. Islam has nothing unique or new. As it says in Ecclesaisticals, 'There is nothing new under the sun'

[j_cool2010]

you will ask for proof? Can you prove gabriel appeared to mohammed and if so then prove it to me

you might find, if you bother to research other religions (which i doubt you will), that others do have references which relate to scientific subject. Islam has nothing unique or new. As it says in ecclesaisticals, 'there is nothing new under the sun'

the proof is the holly qura'n. A very solid proof that stands out in its unique form and has got no likeness from 1400 years up to now. and it was revealed to prophet Mohammad (pbuh) by Gabriel, and angel of Allah.

[ufochick]

magic is a cross dimesional travel, that a humans make a jinn to help them out. the jinns that gets involved in this act is a bad jinns not a good one. because a good jinns knows that cross dimensional travel and comunication is forbidden by Allah (God). the bad jinns are all the slaves of their master (satan). satan is an enemy of mankind allways want human to commit sin. so magic hasn't got a purer form. it is an evil act.


Jins have nothing to do with magic. Magic uses the energy/power that we are given or simply have at birth. Nothing needs to be channeled through to use this energy. WE just have it! Like we have skin.

I have spent over 25 years working with energy manipulation. It involves no other entitites in my case. Some people think they have to use other entities, but it's not needed at all. It has nothing to do with positive or negative or the devil or scripture, it simply IS.. we can use it or not. Intent does not weaken or strengthen it but the intent does effect our own vibrational rate.
In dealing with attaching entitites anything that raises the vibrational rate can effect this. Raise the person's vibrational rate with love (again energy manipulation on purpose or not) and the entity may no longer be compatable with the human hosts energy.

[ufochick]

Its an absolute fact that many masons have no capacity for magic at all.

We all have the potential for energy manipulation/magic if we have a soul. We all use it every day if we realize it or not.

[ufochick]

DEAR ufochick

i dono what to say. no offences but i think you are lost in delusion, you are far from the truth, well i am not saying your expeirences are not true, i actualy beleive them and are true and realy are happening to you, but you fail to grasp the true meaning. why it is happening. i visited your website and i read most of your statements etc. i saw the pic of that alien looking creature. check this link and most of your questions will be answered i guess

please check them with open mind and without prejudice

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DAzq89TP_JY&feature=related

also check this link and see what you thinking
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svz82zfPYyk&feature=related

ou can check these serries from the beguning if you like it is a total of 51 series each series is 10 minutes.

cheers

Sorry I didn't watch the videos. FEAR puts us in a place where we can be harmed and are harming ourselves. Other entities do not have all the control. WE choose who we are and what we do with our energy. Saying all energy to anything beyond the mundane comes from other Beings is so wrong...

Please stop being afraid of who you are. You are something wonderful, not something to be afraid of.

[phildee3]

Sorry I didn't watch the videos.



Really? Why not?
There are only eight and a half hours worth.

[marpat]

the proof is the holly qura'n. A very solid proof that stands out in its unique form and has got no likeness from 1400 years up to now. and it was revealed to prophet Mohammad (pbuh) by Gabriel, and angel of Allah.

So you say you can prove that Islam is true, then you tell me that you can prove it because its written in a book?

Personally I am happy to study other peoples religions but what annoys me is when people try to push that their way is the only way, because Im quite sure that its a load of bollocks.

For people like you everybody else will be wrong unless they believe what you believe, although they will say their holy books are full of proof, etc.

I have no time for arrogant biggots like yourself

[marpat]

We all have the potential for energy manipulation/magic if we have a soul. We all use it every day if we realize it or not.

I know that but many masons have no interest in doing magic, although they do actually perform a version of it in the lodge. Im sure that many of them would deny it as much as christians would deny the mass is a magic ritual.

[j_cool2010]

So you say you can prove that Islam is true, then you tell me that you can prove it because its written in a book?

Personally I am happy to study other peoples religions but what annoys me is when people try to push that their way is the only way, because Im quite sure that its a load of bollocks.

For people like you everybody else will be wrong unless they believe what you believe, although they will say their holy books are full of proof, etc.

I have no time for arrogant biggots like yourself

My dear sister or brother, you are taking me all wrong, i never asked you to beleife what i beliefe. you are missunderestanding. i am just expressing the truth of my relegion thats all. beleive whaever you like to beleive you have got the will power and it is your responsability.
Allah does not need me or you or anyone to beleive in him or to follow his cammondements. our worship and obeydience doesn't increase anything to his kingdome nor our disbelief and disobeydiance and rejection of him dicrease anything in his kingdom. it dose not make any difference at all because Allah is beyond any needs and he owns everything in the univers and beyond. there is no like him he is the obsolute and eternal. everything in the univers depend on him.

if we chose the action of the people of paradise Allah may give us the paradise and if we choose the actions of the people of hellfire then we will enter hellfire, it is as simple as that.
and Allah has given us commandment to follow. if we follow his commandment we will benefit from it and if reject his commandment then we will suffer.
if i was arroagant as and when i saw people of wrong beliefs i would just say, i don't care. but i realy do care and i feel very sorry when i see people follow the path of satan instead of their creator. so many peopl astrayed by the whispers of satan and follow their lower self. people are so attached to their desires and worldly affairs and ignoring the hereafter as if they never die. and if they see a sign from their lord they radicule it and reject it. these people are subject to a great regret in hearafter. those people who leade their life apart from relegiouse in this world will regret every monment of their lives in hearafter on the day of resurrection. but their regret will be of no use because they were warned before and had been given enough time to contemplate and embrace the right way, yet they did not listen when they were warned. they will regret and will say only if we are sent back to correct our mistakes, but there will be no sending back. in the Quran their regretfull expressions are as follows : If only you could see they are standing before the fire saying, ohh if only we could be send back again we would not deny the signs of our lord and we would be among the beleivers. (Quran chapter 6- vers 27)

[purplepebble]

I have spent over 25 years working with energy manipulation. It involves no other entitites in my case. Some people think they have to use other entities, but it's not needed at all. It has nothing to do with positive or negative or the devil or scripture, it simply IS.. we can use it or not. Intent does not weaken or strengthen it but the intent does effect our own vibrational rate.
In dealing with attaching entitites anything that raises the vibrational rate can effect this. Raise the person's vibrational rate with love (again energy manipulation on purpose or not) and the entity may no longer be compatable with the human hosts energy.

If it involves no other entities what are the aliens all about then?

[j_cool2010]

Sorry I didn't watch the videos. FEAR puts us in a place where we can be harmed and are harming ourselves. Other entities do not have all the control. WE choose who we are and what we do with our energy. Saying all energy to anything beyond the mundane comes from other Beings is so wrong...

Please stop being afraid of who you are. You are something wonderful, not something to be afraid of.

you are advicing me not be afraid and you are afraid yourself. jinns cannot harm humans without motive, and also jinns are much weaker than humans. we humans should feer no one but our almighty God who created us. and i think your expeirences are psycological rather than real.

[j_cool2010]

Jins have nothing to do with magic. Magic uses the energy/power that we are given or simply have at birth. Nothing needs to be channeled through to use this energy. WE just have it! Like we have skin.

I have spent over 25 years working with energy manipulation. It involves no other entitites in my case. Some people think they have to use other entities, but it's not needed at all. It has nothing to do with positive or negative or the devil or scripture, it simply IS.. we can use it or not. Intent does not weaken or strengthen it but the intent does effect our own vibrational rate.
In dealing with attaching entitites anything that raises the vibrational rate can effect this. Raise the person's vibrational rate with love (again energy manipulation on purpose or not) and the entity may no longer be compatable with the human hosts energy.

i think you don't know the concept of jinns.

[marpat]

My dear sister or brother, you are taking me all wrong, i never asked you to beleife what i beliefe. you are missunderestanding. i am just expressing the truth of my relegion thats all. beleive whaever you like to beleive you have got the will power and it is your responsability.
Allah does not need me or you or anyone to beleive in him or to follow his cammondements. our worship and obeydience doesn't increase anything to his kingdome nor our disbelief and disobeydiance and rejection of him dicrease anything in his kingdom. it dose not make any difference at all because Allah is beyond any needs and he owns everything in the univers and beyond. there is no like him he is the obsolute and eternal. everything in the univers depend on him.

if we chose the action of the people of paradise Allah may give us the paradise and if we choose the actions of the people of hellfire then we will enter hellfire, it is as simple as that.
and Allah has given us commandment to follow. if we follow his commandment we will benefit from it and if reject his commandment then we will suffer.
if i was arroagant as and when i saw people of wrong beliefs i would just say, i don't care. but i realy do care and i feel very sorry when i see people follow the path of satan instead of their creator. so many peopl astrayed by the whispers of satan and follow their lower self. people are so attached to their desires and worldly affairs and ignoring the hereafter as if they never die. and if they see a sign from their lord they radicule it and reject it. these people are subject to a great regret in hearafter. those people who leade their life apart from relegiouse in this world will regret every monment of their lives in hearafter on the day of resurrection. but their regret will be of no use because they were warned before and had been given enough time to contemplate and embrace the right way, yet they did not listen when they were warned. they will regret and will say only if we are sent back to correct our mistakes, but there will be no sending back. in the Quran their regretfull expressions are as follows : If only you could see they are standing before the fire saying, ohh if only we could be send back again we would not deny the signs of our lord and we would be among the beleivers. (Quran chapter 6- vers 27)

I take it that you cant prove the the koran then as you claimed before

What you write about is no different from a christian defending their religion and beliefs. Like I said before, if that is your way then follow it but stop pushing it onto others.

Dont you think this is getting off topic as well?

[j_cool2010]

I take it that you cant prove the the koran then as you claimed before

What you write about is no different from a christian defending their religion and beliefs. Like I said before, if that is your way then follow it but stop pushing it onto others.

Dont you think this is getting off topic as well?

for you to underestand that Quran is the word of Allah, you should understand that 1400 ago in the desert of arabia no one knew anything about science. and this devine book the holly Qura'n was revealed 1400 years ago to a man prophet Mohammad (pbuh) who could not read and write and his people were all pagans. people were so deviated from the truth that they would burry thier females alive, and worshipped idols. although Qura'n is not a book of science yet this devine book reveals scientific facts regarding Astronomy, Physics, Geography, Geology , Oceanology, Biology, Botany, Zoology , Medicine , Physiology, and Embryology.
now you tell me in which feild of the above subjects do have knowledge so i produce the proof from the Holly Quran.

consider this example:

THE HONY BEE

“And thy Lord taught the Bee To build its cells in hills, On trees, and in (men’s) habitations; Then to eat of all The produce (of the earth), And find with skill the spacious Paths of its Lord.” [Al-Qur’aan 16:68-69]
Von-Frisch received the Nobel Prize in 1973 for his research on the behaviour and communication of the bees. The bee, after discovering any new garden or flower, goes back and tells its fellow bees the exact direction and map to get there, which is known as ‘bee dance’. The meanings of this insect’s movements that are intended to transmit information between worker bees have been discovered scientifically using photography and other methods. The Qur’aan mentions in the above verse how the bee finds with skill the spacious paths of its Lord. the gender used for the bee is the female gender
(fa’slukî and kulî),indicating that the bee that leaves its home for gathering food is a female bee. In other words the soldier or worker bee is a female bee. In fact, in Shakespeare’s play, “Henry the Fourth”, some of the characters speak about bees and mention that the bees are soldiers and that they have a king. That is what people thought in Shakespearean times. They thought that the worker bees are male bees and they go home and are answerable to a king bee. This, however, is not true. The worker bees are females and they do not report to a king bee but to a queen bee. But it took modern investigations in the last 300 years to discover this.

The scientific evidences of the Qur’aan clearly prove its Divine Origin. No human could have produced a book, fourteen hundred years ago, that would contain profound scientific facts, to be discovered by humankind centuries later. The Qur’aan, however, is not a book of Science but a book of ‘Signs’. These signs invite Man to realize the purpose of his existence on earth, and to live in harmony with Nature. The Qur’aan is truly a message from Allah, the Creator and Sustainer of the universe. It contains the same message of the Oneness of God, that was preached by all prophets, right from Adam, Moses, Jesus to Muhammad (peace be upon them).

[j_cool2010]

How the Bible Led Me to Islam: The Story of a Former Christian Youth Minister - Joshua Evans

How the Bible Led Me to Islam: The Story of a Former Christian Youth Minister - Joshua Evans - YouTube
How the Bible Led Me to Islam: The Story of a Former Christian Youth Minister - Joshua Evans - YouTube

[marpat]

Dont you think its time you stopped boring people about the koran and get back on topic?

[j_cool2010]

Dont you think its time you stopped boring people about the koran and get back on topic?

so you should accepy you are wrong then, it can be prooved that Quran is a word of God.

[marpat]

so you should accepy you are wrong then, it can be prooved that Quran is a word of God.

You cant prove it and thats the point. You are wrong for saying the koran can be 100% prove. If this were so then you could prove to me that Gabriel visited mohammed but all you can do is quote a book. That is not proof, that is matter of belief. Again I have to remind you that you are off topic. If you really want to prove the koran to people make a thread on it rather than boring us to death with your personal beliefs. I bet you are the sort of brainwashed person that hangs around Finsbury mosque

[j_cool2010]

You cant prove it and thats the point. You are wrong for saying the koran can be 100% prove. If this were so then you could prove to me that Gabriel visited mohammed but all you can do is quote a book. That is not proof, that is matter of belief. Again I have to remind you that you are off topic. If you really want to prove the koran to people make a thread on it rather than boring us to death with your personal beliefs. I bet you are the sort of brainwashed person that hangs around Finsbury mosque

that is fine, i tried to show you the truth, you rejected it. that is your loss.
you think you are following the lucifer make you cool? pretend to be as cool as possible then. it is blasphemy. and will never be forgiven by God.

[marpat]

that is fine, i tried to show you the truth, you rejected it. that is your loss.
you think you are following the lucifer make you cool? pretend to be as cool as possible then. it is blasphemy. and will never be forgiven by God.

I guess that means you are a total failure at proving what you said could be proven.

And who made you my judge anyway? foolish man. You lack faith in god and that is why you depend on the pages of a book. A true believer does not need written but they can depend on their spiritual closeness to god to guide them. You lack this an try to hide your spiritual lack by quoting a book. Did abhraham or moses need a book? no they didnt, so why do you? its a sign of your lack of faith that you need it.

[purplepebble]

The masons/magicians topic is probably my favorite subject.

Freemasonry has been around for quite some time, however, sorcerers and the like have been around much longer. Certain aspects/factions of Freemasonry = just one outlet for these sorcerers. This is a spiritual battle at the end of the day.

Most people wouldn't know what to do of they were on the receiving end of dark magic. Sorcerers are adepts at mimicking the light or whatever name you want to call it. The dark arts have been practiced for thousands of years by certain sects. Hitler and his fascination with the Occult, his quest to Tibet is one example. He wasn't interested in anything but the dark arts, the manipulation and harnessing of universal energy to wield and produce harmful psychic energy and was pretty successful. He knew what to look for and where to look. Otherwise he wouldn't have wasted the time or the money.

So with this in mind I do not put it past certain players in Freemasonry. Especially the Masons who are involved in controlling and manipulating the people on this planet.

[trauma]

Not all Masons are into that shit. Only mutha fuckas high up on the Ladders are corrupted & into that shit. I don't think it's really Magick at all though, just Mind Control. The ones close to the Top participate in some of the most disturbing activities ever. Now on the subject of Mind Control who knows, maybe they're under some "Spell" as well.

See they let people join but they treat them the say way they treat Us. The Masons not in the know, are there so the ones performing the Luciferian Rituals, Etc. can hide behind them whenever someone makes accusations or confronts them (the higher ups). The same strategy is used with all the time in Religion, Politics, & all kinds of other Organization affiliated with these Luciferian secret societies. The Sheep following the shepherd(s) are also used to protect the shepherd(s).

The only thing "Magical" about these people, is the work is that they send messages to others in the know, & they do it in our faces through Symbols (that we've grown "accustom" to over the years), & not enough People know what's going on.

It's not just Freemasons either (which I'm sure most of you are aware of).
This criminal Cabal has worked for a long time, in the dark, in silence, to see that they have total control over the Land, it's Natural Resources, & it's People.

But don't think I'm blowing things out of proportion though, simply Look Around You.

[purplepebble]

So in saying all that, who and what is the source for their ceremonies and initiations?

The ones who have been practicing these rites for a very long time.

They were around long before any masonic organization ever existed.

In the grand scheme of things, mind control is very simple, people can do that to that to each other quite easily. On a mass scale it takes a bit more footwork.

The ability to capture/steal, harness, reproduce and cast energy is not so simple. As you said, the ones at the top are involved in certain sick stuff - that is because the energy produced is worth more to them than anything else. It is beyond some pissy criminal cabal.

[j_cool2010]

I guess that means you are a total failure at proving what you said could be proven.

And who made you my judge anyway? foolish man. You lack faith in god and that is why you depend on the pages of a book. A true believer does not need written but they can depend on their spiritual closeness to god to guide them. You lack this an try to hide your spiritual lack by quoting a book. Did abhraham or moses need a book? no they didnt, so why do you? its a sign of your lack of faith that you need it.

your guess is wrong. I am not judging you. God may forgive whoever he wishes, but in the scriptures God has revealed that apart from blasphemy and polytheism, any other sins maybe forgiven if one repents and never repeats that sin. but as far as blasphemy and plytheism is concerned it will never be forgiven. magic is a bigtime blasphemy ok. it is not me making the judgements. it is God's word. i am just passing it. don't accuse me please.

do you follow any relegion at all? if you don't mind.

[marpat]

Not all Masons are into that shit. Only mutha fuckas high up on the Ladders are corrupted & into that shit. I don't think it's really Magick at all though, just Mind Control. The ones close to the Top participate in some of the most disturbing activities ever. Now on the subject of Mind Control who knows, maybe they're under some "Spell" as well.

See they let people join but they treat them the say way they treat Us. The Masons not in the know, are there so the ones performing the Luciferian Rituals, Etc. can hide behind them whenever someone makes accusations or confronts them (the higher ups). The same strategy is used with all the time in Religion, Politics, & all kinds of other Organization affiliated with these Luciferian secret societies. The Sheep following the shepherd(s) are also used to protect the shepherd(s).

The only thing "Magical" about these people, is the work is that they send messages to others in the know, & they do it in our faces through Symbols (that we've grown "accustom" to over the years), & not enough People know what's going on.

It's not just Freemasons either (which I'm sure most of you are aware of).
This criminal Cabal has worked for a long time, in the dark, in silence, to see that they have total control over the Land, it's Natural Resources, & it's People.

But don't think I'm blowing things out of proportion though, simply Look Around You.

I always find it hard to take this sort of message seriously. It looks like a repetition of standard conspiracy paranoia. For one thing, why would they need to communicate with each other in front of us by using symbols, cant they just pick up a phone? there are a lot of masonic symbols that most people have not seen so to say that we are accustomed to them is false.

If a freemason is involved with all sorts of evil things then they are not true freemasons, much the same as if a person calls themself a christian but goes on the rampage killing people, they are not true to their cause. They are an abomination to it in truth. I have seen a lot of the anti masonic stuff in here and know some of it is false, but people dont want clarification on facts I find

[marpat]

your guess is wrong. do you follow any relegion?

No, Im just a believer. I dont need a book like you. Mine is written within

[j_cool2010]

No, Im just a believer. I dont need a book like you. Mine is written within

please can you give me some sample of your scriptures which is written within , so i read it and would like to learn from it.

I realised something. as a muslim i have no right to hurt yours or anyone's feelings by what i say or write. so i hope i did not hurt your feelings, even if i did then i do appologise ok.

[marpat]

your guess is wrong. I am not judging you. God may forgive whoever he wishes, but in the scriptures God has revealed that apart from blasphemy and polytheism, any other sins maybe forgiven if one repents and never repeats that sin. but as far as blasphemy and plytheism is concerned it will never be forgiven. magic is a bigtime blasphemy ok. it is not me making the judgements. it is God's word. i am just passing it. don't accuse me please.

do you follow any relegion at all? if you don't mind.

But you dont really know if God has said that, you are just believing a book. If god wants to tell me I am doing wrong then what is stopping him? if god is a truly beneficient, all powerful, loving and benign father then why should he expect us to put our trust in a book written centuries ago? people like you are trapped in the past, whereas a living spirit will adapt to the needs of people at different places and times. I think you are the sinner, which is why you are so keen to push your religion onto others, to shift your guilt.

[j_cool2010]

But you dont really know if God has said that, you are just believing a book. If god wants to tell me I am doing wrong then what is stopping him? if god is a truly beneficient, all powerful, loving and benign father then why should he expect us to put our trust in a book written centuries ago? people like you are trapped in the past, whereas a living spirit will adapt to the needs of people at different places and times. I think you are the sinner, which is why you are so keen to push your religion onto others, to shift your guilt.

look God doesn't need to come down to tell you or me or any one that here i am worship me. God is beyond all that. God is beyond our imaggination.

to me God's revelations are rock solid proofs cos they make sense.
you are right God is beneficient thats why he sent his revelations and his prophets to guild us. we should use Gods revelations as our guild and live according to its morals and values. God's revelation is a compelete way of life to all humanity. and it is an obligation of every beleiver to pass the message of the truth to people. and it is totally up to the people to beleive or reject. whoever accepts will benefit and whoever rejects whill be among the loosers in hearafter.
God has warned us against the spirites, jins. there is a whole chapter regarding the jinns in Qura'n.
a spirite never offers his help to humans for free. satan is their master and satan is indeed the biggest enemy of mankind. when adam's statue was made from clay by angels, God gave him soul and commanded all his angels, iblis (satan) was among the angels, to prostrate to adam. they all prostrated to adam except the Iblis (satan). God asked Iblis why he did not do what he commanded him. iblis replied you made me from fire and adam from clay. why should i prostrate to him. he showed arrogance and God said to him to decend from heven, you donnot belong here. since then satan sweared that he will astray every soul of human and will make them burn in hell with him. and God said if they donnot follow my commands and follow you instead then they will burn with you in hell. and since then the test started for humans. the story is much detailed and long but i made it short of course. i can talk about this hourse but if you are interested. satan has so many evill plans and is so decieving, he pose as a good friend as spirite and offers his hellp but his realm plans are hidden and is evil. i got so much information regarding satan that gose back to some 3000 years back even more. but if you are interested, i can pass it to you.

[j_cool2010]

people like you are trapped in the past, whereas a living spirit will adapt to the needs of people at different places and times. I think you are the sinner, which is why you are so keen to push your religion onto others, to shift your guilt.

hey i came across a very interesting issue about jinns on the youtube. it is by Bilal philip, the start of the clip migh be abit boring for you, but don't be put off skip abit if you like. check it please and if possible give me an openion of what u think
The Empire Of Deceit - Bilal Philips {Part 1} - YouTube

[marpat]

hey i came across a very interesting issue about jinns on the youtube. it is by Bilal philip, the start of the clip migh be abit boring for you, but don't be put off skip abit if you like. check it please and if possible give me an openion of what u think
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qE_TqrQ1Dyg

This really isnt thre thread for this stuff. You need to make another thread.

I have a question for you though, even though it is off topic. In the Koran it says that there is only one god, yet the Koran testifies to the truth in the torah. In genesis the Elohim (a hebrew word for gods, being the plural of God) say, lets us make man in OUR image. So if God was alone then why does genesis specifically mention that man was made by Gods? also, in the Torah the Hewbrew God says that they shall have no gods BEFORE him, implying that they could follow other gods, just not before their main god. So what is true then? the torah states there are gods yet the koran says their is only one, and yet the koran testitifes the truth of the torah.

Why is it that in the book of Job that the sons of God sit before him and satan sits with them? this is long after that fall of man. God rmoves his protection from job at satans request so that he can be tempted. Hardly bitter enemies are they. Try reading the book of Job and you will see yourself.

Did you not realise that the various names of Allah are just a subtle variation of pantheism? do you not realise that the God of the Hebrews was nothing new and that monotheistic religion actually appeared in Egypt for a short period, hence where the Israelites acquired it from.

[marpat]

look God doesn't need to come down to tell you or me or any one that here i am worship me. God is beyond all that. God is beyond our imaggination.


Yet he managed to get messages to plenty of other people according to the sacred texts. Are our souls not worth a vision of salvation or do we need to trust in a book, with all the potential faults and failings of a writing system.

I am a believer anyway but I dont agree with you stance that the koran is the only true way. I have seen plenty of other people make the same claims about their beliefs and I think it is more to do with them needing to feel right about themselves and their beliefs rather than anything objective. Personally I doubt any one religion has all the truth

[j_cool2010]

This really isnt thre thread for this stuff. You need to make another thread.

I have a question for you though, even though it is off topic. In the Koran it says that there is only one god, yet the Koran testifies to the truth in the torah. In genesis the Elohim (a hebrew word for gods, being the plural of God) say, lets us make man in OUR image. So if God was alone then why does genesis specifically mention that man was made by Gods? also, in the Torah the Hewbrew God says that they shall have no gods BEFORE him, implying that they could follow other gods, just not before their main god. So what is true then? the torah states there are gods yet the koran says their is only one, and yet the koran testitifes the truth of the torah.

Why is it that in the book of Job that the sons of God sit before him and satan sits with them? this is long after that fall of man. God rmoves his protection from job at satans request so that he can be tempted. Hardly bitter enemies are they. Try reading the book of Job and you will see yourself.

Did you not realise that the various names of Allah are just a subtle variation of pantheism? do you not realise that the God of the Hebrews was nothing new and that monotheistic religion actually appeared in Egypt for a short period, hence where the Israelites acquired it from.

you asked a very good question. even though i am not a relegiuos expert but i think anyone with commen sense and general relegiouse knowlege should be able to answer it. here is my answer.
No daubt there is only one God and Mohammad, Jesus, David, Salamon, Moses, Yusuf, Yaqoub, Isac, Ismail, Abraham etc peace and blissing of God be upon them all, are the messangers of God. and all of these messangers preached monotheism and oness of the Almighty Allah. in Qura'n each prophet is mention in great detail.

you mentioned in torah it is refered to God as Ellohim, as plural form. No wonder in many languages including arabic and hebrew the plural form can also be used to indicate grace and respect, so that Ellohim is a plural of respect, not a plural of number ok. there are lots of misinterpretation similar to this. ( they shal have no gods before him) this verse refers to the idols that people took them as their gods, the verse is accusing that people why they took the false gods.

there is not such a thing as pantheism ok. the names of Allah represents the attributes that Allah posess. each of those attributes represents a unique quality that only Allah posess. Allah is only one and alone. and only Allah is worthy of worship.

[j_cool2010]

Yet he managed to get messages to plenty of other people according to the sacred texts. Are our souls not worth a vision of salvation or do we need to trust in a book, with all the potential faults and failings of a writing system.

I am a believer anyway but I dont agree with you stance that the koran is the only true way. I have seen plenty of other people make the same claims about their beliefs and I think it is more to do with them needing to feel right about themselves and their beliefs rather than anything objective. Personally I doubt any one religion has all the truth


my beleife in Allah is strong enough and don't need confirmation from people to strenghten my faith. if one dosen't beleive by heart then no mather how many large number of people he gets to agree with him, his faith remains week. as i mentioned previousely as well, if it was not a matter of obligation to pass on the truth, i would never bother. cos everyone is reponsible for his/her own action.

[j_cool2010]

i came across a very interesting video, you might want to watch it.

3 Faiths ( Islam, Christianity, Judaism), One God
http://www.markazislam.com/view/tc25izk64/3-faiths-islam-christianity-judaism-one-god/

[marpat]

you asked a very good question. even though i am not a relegiuos expert but i think anyone with commen sense and general relegiouse knowlege should be able to answer it. here is my answer.
No daubt there is only one God and Mohammad, Jesus, David, Salamon, Moses, Yusuf, Yaqoub, Isac, Ismail, Abraham etc peace and blissing of God be upon them all, are the messangers of God. and all of these messangers preached monotheism and oness of the Almighty Allah. in Qura'n each prophet is mention in great detail.

you mentioned in torah it is refered to God as Ellohim, as plural form. No wonder in many languages including arabic and hebrew the plural form can also be used to indicate grace and respect, so that Ellohim is a plural of respect, not a plural of number ok. there are lots of misinterpretation similar to this. ( they shal have no gods before him) this verse refers to the idols that people took them as their gods, the verse is accusing that people why they took the false gods.

there is not such a thing as pantheism ok. the names of Allah represents the attributes that Allah posess. each of those attributes represents a unique quality that only Allah posess. Allah is only one and alone. and only Allah is worthy of worship.

Which is exactly what I was saying. The only difference is that pantheism uss different gods to represent these aspects of one god, whereas a judaism and islam use various names of god. It is purely a matter of perspective.

Well it is clear from the genesis that it says man is made in OUR image.

[marpat]

my beleife in Allah is strong enough and don't need confirmation from people to strenghten my faith. if one dosen't beleive by heart then no mather how many large number of people he gets to agree with him, his faith remains week. as i mentioned previousely as well, if it was not a matter of obligation to pass on the truth, i would never bother. cos everyone is reponsible for his/her own action.

While i can appreciate and respect your faith I dont have any time for those who push that their way is the only way, or think they are somehow superior to others.

[j_cool2010]

While i can appreciate and respect your faith I dont have any time for those who push that their way is the only way, or think they are somehow superior to others.

It is not a mater of superiority. it is about the truth. I can proove that Moses and Jesus (pbuth)they both preached Islam and were muslims.

[j_cool2010]

Which is exactly what I was saying. The only difference is that pantheism uss different gods to represent these aspects of one god, whereas a judaism and islam use various names of god. It is purely a matter of perspective.

Well it is clear from the genesis that it says man is made in OUR image.

what do you mean when you say pantheism uses gods? could explain abit more plz.

[marpat]

what do you mean when you say pantheism uses gods? could explain abit more plz.

Pantheism used various gods as expressions of one divine energy. If you look at a lot of the ancient religions you will find that all of their gods are expressions of one power, which is not much different from you saying there is only allah with lots of different names. When the koran was written it was meant for a wide variety of people, many simple and illiterate, so the concepts have to be simple for people to understand this. Most people who have some brains and experience know that in pantheism there is still only one god expressed through many forms. Even the Hebrews had a feminine aspect of god, known as the shekinah. Ideas and concepts have to be matched to teh ability of people receiving them. The more generally available you make the concept then the simpler it has to be expressed so that the wide variety of people can get an idea.

You might not like that explanation but this is how it is.

[j_cool2010]

Pantheism used various gods as expressions of one divine energy. If you look at a lot of the ancient religions you will find that all of their gods are expressions of one power, which is not much different from you saying there is only allah with lots of different names. When the koran was written it was meant for a wide variety of people, many simple and illiterate, so the concepts have to be simple for people to understand this. Most people who have some brains and experience know that in pantheism there is still only one god expressed through many forms. Even the Hebrews had a feminine aspect of god, known as the shekinah. Ideas and concepts have to be matched to teh ability of people receiving them. The more generally available you make the concept then the simpler it has to be expressed so that the wide variety of people can get an idea.

You might not like that explanation but this is how it is.

do you beleive in the existence of satan? and if you do what do you think is he like and originated from?

[marpat]

do you beleive in the existence of satan? and if you do what do you think is he like and originated from?

Have you read the book of Job? it clearly states that satan sits with the sons of god, and this is after the fall of man, a long time after

You dont seem to have any constructive comments about my definition of pantheism. I suppose you are going to just try the old line that its all satans work. Pretty lame really.

[marpat]

It is not a mater of superiority. it is about the truth. I can proove that Moses and Jesus (pbuth)they both preached Islam and were muslims.

No you cant, especially as you cant even prove they were real people. All you can do is to define what a muslim is then retrospectively apply that definition to people from history. Its not proof in any way, just re-labelling. Im sure you will say Enoch was one too

[j_cool2010]

No you cant, especially as you cant even prove they were real people. All you can do is to define what a muslim is then retrospectively apply that definition to people from history. Its not proof in any way, just re-labelling. Im sure you will say Enoch was one too

ok i take it from your words that you only beleive in matter, science, logic and testable evidence right?
what is your thaughts in regard to living beings, how they came to exist? and do you believe in theory of evolution?
i know it is off the topic but just want to see what you think.

[marpat]

ok i take it from your words that you only beleive in matter, science, logic and testable evidence right?
what is your thaughts in regard to living beings, how they came to exist? and do you believe in theory of evolution?
i know it is off the topic but just want to see what you think.

Why discuss anything with you? it seems clear that all you know about is the islamic version of things. Have you read the torah, and the book of Job? are you familiar with the concepts and ideas nehind other religions that you so freely condemn?

[j_cool2010]

Why discuss anything with you? it seems clear that all you know about is the islamic version of things. Have you read the torah, and the book of Job? are you familiar with the concepts and ideas nehind other religions that you so freely condemn?

i am familiar with torah as well as bible, but the problem is that you are not familiar with Quran.

Former Christian Jamal Zarabozo finds Quran fascinating

find out about Qura'n from former non muslims then

Former Christian Jamal Zarabozo finds Quran fascinating - YouTube

torah used to be a devine book but it was not preserved and changed so manytime by men that you no longer have the original book anymore. if we follow this socalled torah of today, it leads mankind to darkness cos it is full of contradictions. and so is the bible. you can find out what i said is a fact by investigating torah. not just by talking out of the blue.

[marpat]

i am familiar with torah as well as bible, but the problem is that you are not familiar with Quran.

Former Christian Jamal Zarabozo finds Quran fascinating

find out about Qura'n from former non muslims then

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sn_Sv2ifSbw&feature=related

torah used to be a devine book but it was not preserved and changed so manytime by men that you no longer have the original book anymore. if we follow this socalled torah of today, it leads mankind to darkness cos it is full of contradictions. and so is the bible. you can find out what i said is a fact by investigating torah. not just by talking out of the blue.

I do have a copy of it actually and have read it in the past

[fishonwheels]

Hey im just wondering whether the Freemasons are capable of doing magic. When i was a kid i had an encounter with a mason where i noticed his eyes changed colour from grey to blood red, they stayed red for around 2 seconds and then went back to grey. Could he have been trying to intimidate me? And no, it wasnt a trick of the light....

depends on what you call magic....

Just because some try to monopolize occult knowledge and techniques doesn't mean it's not available to all.

someone's first hand account:http://www.davidicke.com/forum/showthread.php?t=108728

think it goes much further than this story though and not all these "magicians" can be identified by formal affiliations.

[j_cool2010]

I do have a copy of it actually and have read it in the past

many non muslims read books about islam that are authored by non-muslims. those books materials produced by non-muslims abviously propgate and rais the misconceptions and lies about islam. they donnot reflect on the true nature of islam. it is commen sens, if one wants the correct and valid information about anything, one should chase material books which is authored by the scholors who are xpersts in the subjects.