Self-realisation, god and satan. [Archive] - David Icke's Official Forums

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rossus

09-10-2007, 04:14 PM

Very nice, but how can one know that one really knows the self?
When you recognize yourself as Awareness (that which is aware),
Then you see there is a difference between you and the body/the thoughts.

the body still is just like the thoughts still are.
but you are free of that.

You (the Self) are free of thought, free of pleasure, free of pain...
you have nothing and you are nothing...

basically when selfrealization happens,
"you" (ego) dies and when you have died,

you live with God in Heaven.
satan's job is, to prevent this from happening.

god = heaven = you = love = truth
satan = body = desire = fear = illusion

Lay not up for yourselves treasures upon earth, where moth and rust doth corrupt, and where thieves break through and steal:
But lay up for yourselves treasures in heaven, where neither moth nor rust doth corrupt, and where thieves do not break through nor steal:
The light of the body is the eye; if then your eye is true, all your body will be full of light.
But if your eye is evil, all your body will be dark. If then the light which is in you is dark, how dark it will be!
No man can serve two masters: for either he will hate the one, and love the other; or else he will hold to the one, and despise the other. Ye cannot serve God and mammon.
Therefore I say unto you, Take no thought for your life, what ye shall eat, or what ye shall drink; nor yet for your body, what ye shall put on. Is not the life more than meat, and the body than raiment?
For where your treasure is, there will your heart be also.
Blessed are those who Mourn, for they shall be comforted.
Blessed are those who Hunger and Thirst for righteousness, for they shall be satisfied

Ask, and it will be given you;
Seek, and you will find;
Knock, and it will be opened to you.
I don't like the Bible, because it's poisoned by those hungry for Power.
But some truth in it has not been altered and this is a portion of it. (it's about all i know to be honest)

So what it basically says is,
if you want happiness and truth... you will get it if you are willing to stop sinning.
The original sin is identification with the thoughts and the body.

Refuse satan's offer :)
Meditate for years on end they say, then maybe.
nah.

scientists, christians, buddhists, strangers on internet forums...
people talk a lot of lies.

self-realisation is not hard and it doesn't have to take years.
it can be days, weeks, months, years... it can be a couple of seconds.

when you are willing stop and give it all up, it happens.
but this doesn't mean u become "holy".

many people move back and forth between Awareness and Ignorance..
until they decide they have enough.

28th kingdom

09-10-2007, 04:22 PM

I don't like the God/Satan metaphors.. because of organized religion... those terms confuse people. It makes them think... there is a vengeful God who has the power to punish them.

Yes, you can compare the ego to the devil that tempts you into sin... but, again... this kind of implies that Satan is outside of you... when, as you know... everything is within us.

lenejento

09-10-2007, 05:16 PM

many people move back and forth between Awareness and Ignorance..
until they decide they have enough. Lol :rolleyes: hmm hmm hmmmm

auron

09-10-2007, 05:22 PM

When you recognize yourself as Awareness (that which is aware),
Then you see there is a difference between you and the body/the thoughts.

the body still is just like the thoughts still are.
but you are free of that.

You (the Self) are free of thought, free of pleasure, free of pain...
you have nothing and you are nothing...

basically when selfrealization happens,
"you" (ego) dies and when you have died,

you live with God in Heaven.
satan's job is, to prevent this from happening.

god = heaven = you = love = truth
satan = body = desire = fear = illusion

I don't like the Bible, because it's poisoned by those hungry for Power.
But some truth in it has not been altered and this is a portion of it. (it's about all i know to be honest)

So what it basically says is,
if you want happiness and truth... you will get it if you are willing to stop sinning.
The original sin is identification with the thoughts and the body.

Refuse satan's offer :)

nah.

scientists, christians, buddhists, strangers on internet forums...
people talk a lot of lies.

self-realisation is not hard and it doesn't have to take years.
it can be days, weeks, months, years... it can be a couple of seconds.

when you are willing stop and give it all up, it happens.
but this doesn't mean u become "holy".

many people move back and forth between Awareness and Ignorance..
until they decide they have enough.

http://aycu17.webshots.com/image/28136/2005804947326905231_rs.jpg

rossus

09-10-2007, 05:38 PM

^sup niggahttp://www.freewinks.net/moods/Smiley/Sweet/sweet-smiley-mood/ThumbnailSmall_10431.jpg
Lol :rolleyes: hmm hmm hmmmm
the reason i said that is because i think no-one is ever truly enlightened (or unenlightened :) )
as long as there is a body, there will be temptation..
so you cannot ever trust a "guru" one hundred percent.

Osho for example he was quite self-realized,
but when his egoless moment of doing a speech in the commune was over...
his ego came back to bitch at his secretary because the ashram was not generating enough money.

the only thing you can fully trust because it is 100% pure is love itself.
but "enlightened" people still have fases of unenlightenment (one more than the other)
and "unenlightened" people have fases of enlightenment (one more than the other)

lenejento

09-10-2007, 06:09 PM

^sup niggahttp://www.freewinks.net/moods/Smiley/Sweet/sweet-smiley-mood/ThumbnailSmall_10431.jpg

the reason i said that is because i think no-one is ever truly enlightened (or unenlightened :) )
as long as there is a body, there will be temptation..
so you cannot ever trust a "guru" one hundred percent.

Osho for example he was quite self-realized,
but when his egoless moment of doing a speech in the commune was over...
his ego came back to bitch at his secretary because the ashram was not generating enough money.

the only thing you can fully trust because it is 100% pure is love itself.
but "enlightened" people still have fases of unenlightenment (one more than the other)
and "unenlightened" people have fases of enlightenment (one more than the other)

Yes, my post was directed at myself :) I am going through a fase like that, where, I have true devotion to truth and experience incredible realization of my true nature, then turn away into ignorance again.

tejas

09-10-2007, 07:15 PM

When you recognize yourself as Awareness (that which is aware),
Then you see there is a difference between you and the body/the thoughts.

the body still is just like the thoughts still are.
but you are free of that.

You (the Self) are free of thought, free of pleasure, free of pain...
you have nothing and you are nothing...

basically when selfrealization happens,
"you" (ego) dies and when you have died,

you live with God in Heaven.
satan's job is, to prevent this from happening.

god = heaven = you = love = truth
satan = body = desire = fear = illusion

I don't like the Bible, because it's poisoned by those hungry for Power.
But some truth in it has not been altered and this is a portion of it. (it's about all i know to be honest)

So what it basically says is,
if you want happiness and truth... you will get it if you are willing to stop sinning.
The original sin is identification with the thoughts and the body.

Refuse satan's offer :)

nah.

scientists, christians, buddhists, strangers on internet forums...
people talk a lot of lies.

self-realisation is not hard and it doesn't have to take years.
it can be days, weeks, months, years... it can be a couple of seconds.

when you are willing stop and give it all up, it happens.
but this doesn't mean u become "holy".

many people move back and forth between Awareness and Ignorance..
until they decide they have enough.

Would you consider yourself enlightened? If so what did you do to become so.

Enlightenment is a funny word ....

tejas

09-10-2007, 07:21 PM

28th kingdom

09-10-2007, 07:27 PM

Note: Anyone who tells you they're enlightened... isn't enlightened.

joss classey

09-10-2007, 07:34 PM

Note: Anyone who tells you they're enlightened... isn't enlightened.

I'm enlightened

oh shit...

just unenlightened myself there didn't I

phoebe

09-10-2007, 07:39 PM

^sup niggahttp://www.freewinks.net/moods/Smiley/Sweet/sweet-smiley-mood/ThumbnailSmall_10431.jpg

the reason i said that is because i think no-one is ever truly enlightened (or unenlightened :) )
as long as there is a body, there will be temptation..
so you cannot ever trust a "guru" one hundred percent.

Osho for example he was quite self-realized,
but when his egoless moment of doing a speech in the commune was over...
his ego came back to bitch at his secretary because the ashram was not generating enough money.

the only thing you can fully trust because it is 100% pure is love itself.
but "enlightened" people still have fases of unenlightenment (one more than the other)
and "unenlightened" people have fases of enlightenment (one more than the other)

Before enlightenment: chop wood, carry water.
After enlightenment: chop wood, carry water.

strider

09-10-2007, 07:44 PM

I'm enlightened

oh shit...

just unenlightened myself there didn't I

Don't worry mate.. With 28th kingdom's train of thought, you were never enlightened because you wear a hat on your avatar...:D

28th kingdom

09-10-2007, 07:55 PM

Anyone who knows anything about enlightenment... and what it takes to achieve it... knows that, saying, "I am enlightened... " I mean... HAHAHAHA... OMG! I'm sure ross will get a laugh at that.

bigus_dickus

09-10-2007, 07:56 PM

Anyone who knows anything about enlightenment... and what it takes to achieve it... knows that, saying, "I am enlightened... " I mean... HAHAHAHA... OMG! I'm sure ross will get a laugh at that.

there are "enlightened" people who don't know anything about enlightenment.

razed1

09-10-2007, 07:59 PM

satan = ego

28th kingdom

09-10-2007, 08:00 PM

If someone asks an enlightened person, "Are you enlightened?" The enlightened person would NEVER answer this question. At best - he or she would say, "Mu."

bigus_dickus

09-10-2007, 08:01 PM

satan = ego

so, you are satan. (ego means "I")

bigus_dickus

09-10-2007, 08:01 PM

If someone asks an enlightened person, "Are you enlightened?" This enlightened person would NEVER answer this question. At best - he or she would say, "Mu."

he would be a cow?

razed1

09-10-2007, 08:04 PM

satan was the one who thought himself a god, rather than the universal creator right???

well that is what ego is, takes a separatist view on itself from the universe

ultimate truth of course , is that ego is NOT separate, but the ego can pretend and create a whole world where it thinks its separate, but of this has a finite life, and this whole 2k12 situation is the dissolving of the ego

so yea dick, you are a satan right now

bigus_dickus

09-10-2007, 08:07 PM

satan was the one who thought himself a god, rather than the universal creator right???

if you say so, yes.

well that is what ego is, takes a separatist view on itself from the universe

not necessarily. it can take a unified view with the universe as well.

ultimate truth of course , is that ego is NOT separate, but the ego can pretend and create a whole world where it thinks its separate, but of this has a finite life, and this whole 2k12 situation is the dissolving of the ego

the mind does that. the ego (self), which is you, identifies with it, or it doesn't.

so yea dick, you are a satan right now

:cool:

razed1

09-10-2007, 08:13 PM

its like explaining colour to a man who born blind

rossus

09-10-2007, 08:27 PM

Would you consider yourself enlightened? If so what did you do to become so.
i don't think that anyone is really "enlightened".
some of the more enlightened dudes that recently walked this planet have undoubtedly been Nisargadatta Maharaj & Ramana Maharshi.

I consider myself, not enlightened and not unenlightened.
What I am cannot be put into words, I can only put into words what I am not:
I am not the thoughts, I am not the body.

What I am I can only be and some words that try to define what I am do a pretty good job: True-Self.... Love... Light... Life.... God...
But none of those word is correct ofcourse.

When you realize that you are That which those words are pointing to,
then you become free of the problems that come when you believe you are something other than you are. (unhappiness, suffering, etc..)

You cannot become what you already are, you can only become aware of it.
How?

Step 1:
First you become aware of the thoughts.
You are no longer merged with them and acting them out like a robot.
Step 2:
Follow back where your awareness comes from
Step 3:
When you get to the source, you see that this awareness is you.

phoebe

09-10-2007, 08:41 PM

phoebe

09-10-2007, 08:46 PM

i don't think that anyone is really "enlightened".
some of the more enlightened dudes that recently walked this planet have undoubtedly been Nisargadatta Maharaj & Ramana Maharshi.

I consider myself, not enlightened and not unenlightened.
What I am cannot be put into words, I can only put into words what I am not:
I am not the thoughts, I am not the body.

What I am I can only be and some words that try to define what I am do a pretty good job: True-Self.... Love... Light... Life.... God...
But none of those word is correct ofcourse.

When you realize that you are That which those words are pointing to,
then you become free of the problems that come when you believe you are something other than you are. (unhappiness, suffering, etc..)

You cannot become what you already are, you can only become aware of it.
How?

Step 1:
First you become aware of the thoughts.
You are no longer merged with them and acting them out like a robot.
Step 2:
Follow back where your awareness comes from
Step 3:
When you get to the source, you see that this awareness is you.

Forgive me rossus but you are apparently
Contradicting yourself in the highlighted parts.
(Or I am misunderstanding you).
I agree that we ARE enlightenment itself and
As you said - you cannot become
What you already are.
But you can come to realise what you are.

bigus_dickus

09-10-2007, 08:50 PM

its like explaining colour to a man who born blind

like you can explain color to a man who sees? i'd like to see you try that. :D

synergy777

09-10-2007, 09:56 PM

i'd rather be empowered than enlightened. with power you can change things, help. with enlightenment, you just see how fucked it is really is and how powerless you are in the face of evil..

lenejento

10-10-2007, 10:44 AM

i'd rather be empowered than enlightened. with power you can change things, help. with enlightenment, you just see how fucked it is really is and how powerless you are in the face of evil..

Being "enlightened" is realizing you are the source of all powers. I know what you mean though, I also sometimes doubt enlightenment, and feel like empowerment would be more effective, there has to be a certain amount of trust involved for enlightenment. You'd think consciousness itself, the source, would know how to solve everything, but how do you KNOW that for sure, you can't. Gangaji says being enlightened is not about enquiring any special powers, however it might awaken latent powers in you. Adyashanti says the measurement of truth is effectiveness. An example, I don't think anything else would bring the sexes together in unity and harmony more than humans knowing and being the truth of their being.

albie

10-10-2007, 11:09 AM

Being enlightened means wanting death. All stimuli is a possible route to the downward spiral.

The only way to avoid temptation is to not exist.

So lets all just die.

lenejento

10-10-2007, 11:13 AM

Being enlightened means wanting death. All stimuli is a possible route to the downward spiral.

The only way to avoid temptation is to not exist.

So lets all just die.
Lol, where did you get this from?

tejas

10-10-2007, 12:10 PM

If someone asks an enlightened person, "Are you enlightened?" The enlightened person would NEVER answer this question. At best - he or she would say, "Mu."

EXACTLY NO ONE IS ENLIGHTENED!!!!!!!!!!!

tejas

10-10-2007, 12:13 PM

Being "enlightened" is realizing you are the source of all powers. I know what you mean though, I also sometimes doubt enlightenment, and feel like empowerment would be more effective, there has to be a certain amount of trust involved for enlightenment. You'd think consciousness itself, the source, would know how to solve everything, but how do you KNOW that for sure, you can't. Gangaji says being enlightened is not about enquiring any special powers, however it might awaken latent powers in you. Adyashanti says the measurement of truth is effectiveness. An example, I don't think anything else would bring the sexes together in unity and harmony more than humans knowing and being the truth of their being.

Agreed, how the bugger do you know anything.

albie

10-10-2007, 12:40 PM

Lol, where did you get this from?

It's logic.

We fell because we wanted to float around feeling lovely and that. It was bound to come to an end when we got bored.
We had to get our fix. But we had reached the zenith.

The answer was to fall. Make our minds smaller so we could always have a greater height to climb to.

Either that or die.

We did both.

HAHAHAHAHAHHAH!

The Matrix is your servant. The genie who tricks you.

" you never said you wanted a full size woman."

What do you think the dying and rising god is?

rossus

10-10-2007, 01:19 PM

EXACTLY NO ONE IS ENLIGHTENED!!!!!!!!!!!
god is enlightenment is love is truth.

if you choose love, you are enlightened with truth.
if you choose fear, you are darkened with illusion.

we are all enlightened and unenlightened to some extent,
no-one is enlightenment except enlightenment itself.

no-one is the whole except the whole itself.
we can recognize ourself as part of the whole through love.
we can illusion our self as seperate from the whole through fear.

spacegurl

10-10-2007, 01:23 PM

I love Star Trek so I must be a goddess.

tejas

11-10-2007, 12:42 AM

god is enlightenment is love is truth.

if you choose love, you are enlightened with truth.
if you choose fear, you are darkened with illusion.

we are all enlightened and unenlightened to some extent,
no-one is enlightenment except enlightenment itself.

no-one is the whole except the whole itself.
we can recognize ourself as part of the whole through love.
we can illusion our self as seperate from the whole through fear.

Love an fear are both human emotions.

How can you talk of enlightenment and yet use dualistic terms such as love and fear?

What I am saying is that our human mind cannot comprehend true enlightenment. It does not have the neural circuitry.

de_shit

11-10-2007, 01:04 AM

' What I am saying is that our human mind cannot comprehend true enlightenment. It does not have the neural circuitry.'

Isnt that dualistic?

synergy777

11-10-2007, 01:09 AM

a chick that likes star trek, awesome.

i like picard, the next genration is the best. spock was the best in the original. although data is cool.

tejas

11-10-2007, 01:18 AM

' What I am saying is that our human mind cannot comprehend true enlightenment. It does not have the neural circuitry.'

Isnt that dualistic?

Nope, Its science.

In my experience of awareness I found myself realizing that both LOVE and FEAR controlled me. It was only when I was desireless, without passions that I could sense myself as I truly was.

Our true essence in my opinion is beyond love and fear.

Love like fear is just a chemical reaction between neurotransmitters in your brain hitting the activation sites or receptors in other locations in your brain. Just like a computer program.

Awareness is beyond that.

razed1

11-10-2007, 05:00 AM

im probably preaching to the choir,

but for this subject matter, i can think of no better introduction than tsarion '2012 future of mankind' video, its on google